WineXpert Trying something new with Aussie Chard.

shoebiedoo · Oct 31, 2011

After a nice conversation with Winexperts' Tim Vandergrift, I thought I’d give a technique called ‘battonage’ a try (http://www.finevinewines.com/Buttery-Chardonnay.htm)
I thought keep everyone up to date on my progress.

I’m using Selections, International Australian Chardonnay kit for this experiment (if you want to call it that). That happens to be my wife’s favorite kit so the pressure’s on <grin>. Following the kit instructions, I started the wine on 10/24. The initial SG was 1.086.

Racked to secondary yesterday (10/30) when the sg was down to 1.002 using a vacuum pump. Tried to get as much of the leis as I could, I need them for the ‘battonage’ later. The residual oak and bentonite was left behind.

That’s it for now. Hope you enjoy following along!

robie · Oct 31, 2011

That's a pretty BIG chard for surlies/batonnage. Aussie Chards are richer, darker, bolder, generally darker in color. It should give you good, maybe great results, but it tends to work much better on a lighter, softer chard, like a Washington State or a cool climate California chard. (Not all California chardonnays are from cool climate. Ex: a hot Lodi Chard)

Make sure you regularly taste and smell the wine just before you stir it. If it gets any off smell, rack and fine immediately.

Keep us informed about how it goes. It is an interesting process.

shoebiedoo · Nov 9, 2011

After sitting in Secondary for 10 days the SG was stable at .0995. I added 1/4 tsp k-metta, topped it off and stirred. As expected, it smelled normal. I used the drill attachment I have for degassing to stir it as the spoon would not reach the bottom, I wantd to stir EVERYTHING up. I'll keep an eye on it but I plan on stirring again is 3 or 4 day. Here how it looked after stirring.

robie · Nov 9, 2011

Looks good. The longer you do the lees aging and stirring, the more the process will change the taste of the wine. I would suggest next time the wine settles, take one bottle of clear wine off the top and continue processing that bottle the way the original instructions say. Top off the carboy again with a commercial bottle of decent chardonnay. Allow your carboy of wine to continue the surlies/bantonnage process for several more months. In the end, because you saved off a normal bottle, you can compare the taste of the same batch made two different ways. Without saving off that bottle, you won't be able to appreciate the differences.

Just make sure you keep the wine sealed and don't stir in any air (stir gently but thoroughly). A chardonnay (white wine) can oxidize quickly if you don't take care of it.

Understand that the lees aging and stirring will dramatically change the taste of the wine. It will slowly become much softer, as though it had gone through an mlf; it will take on a yeasty-biscuity, nutty, buttery taste as well. Each time you get ready to stir the carboy again, always taste and smell a small sample and make sure it is headed where you want it to go. If you decide you don't like that champagne taste (it will taste like a champagne without the fizz), go ahead and stop the process, rack, clear, bottle.

Tell us how it ends up.

Rocky · Nov 9, 2011

Shoebiedoo. This sounds really interesting. Please keep us up to date on what you are doing. I think I will process my next white this way.

Good advice from Robie, as always. Keep a "standard" to compare.

shoebiedoo · Nov 10, 2011

What was I thinking :slp

During the last step I was SO focused on the Batonnage I didn't even dissolve the Sulfate in water before adding it. IS this going to be a problem? do I need to add more or can I assume it will desolve into to wine anyway.

Steve

Rocky · Nov 10, 2011

I don't think that is a problem, Steve. I have seen it suggested both ways; add directly to the wine or dissolve in water and then add. It is very soluable and with the stirring you are doing, you will have no issue.

shoebiedoo · Nov 10, 2011

Thant's probably why I just added it straight. Im my mind I knew I was going to be stirring It. I've just never done it

robie · Nov 10, 2011

shoebiedoo said:
Thant's probably why I just added it straight. Im my mind I knew I was going to be stirring It. I've just never done it

Yes, next time you stir it, really stir it. It should be fine. In your future, I would not suggest adding Kmeta directly to the wine without first dissolving it completely, then stirring it into the wine really well. As (I believe it was) runningwolf can attest, the dissolved Kmeta can go straight to the bottom and stay there if not stirred in well.

shoebiedoo · Dec 9, 2011

Update

It has been a month since I started the "Batonnage" project and in the last week I've really started noticing a change. I wish I had a better education (on wine tasting) so I could better describe the changes but I don't so you're going to have to put up with Lehman's terms. The initial nose hasn't changed too much but the flavor has definitely taken a turn for the better. It's starting to take on more of a creamy flavor. Bitzen comes to mind! I'm starting to taste the flavors you would find in a "Simi" or (dare I say) even "cakeBread" . at any rate, My wife (the Chardonnay lover" thought another couple weeks and it will be prefect. That would make a Month and a half project. I'll let you guys know when I stabilize it.

Steve

ibglowin · Dec 9, 2011

Looking good!

Looking forward to the updates as well.

hobbyiswine · Jan 11, 2012

Real excited to hear how the stirring treatment works out for this wine. In two weeks my buddy is going to make this chard for his first kit. He is huge fan of big, creamy, buttery chards. Not that I would expect to get Kendall Jackson Chard from a kit but we would like to try. We will have to look into this method. Glad the experiment seems to be going well. Now if only I could find a technique that takes time away from instead of adding to the process!

robie · Jan 12, 2012

It should turn out nice.

Lees aging and stirring will give the chard a nutty, yeasty, biscuity, slight buttery flavor like you get with a dry champagne. With this process, the chard will loose much of its fruitiness, though. Seriously, if you like champagne, you most likely will enjoy such a wine. However, if you don't like champagne, the opposite is totally true.

Once bottled, the chard should be allowed to age 9 months to a year. If it is allowed, it will really smooth out.

Let your buddy give it a try and let us know how it turns out.

shoebiedoo · Jan 13, 2012

Well it's been clearing for 20 days now, I think it's time to rack. The flavor is real nice, smooth, nutty initial flavor with a typical "Chardonnay" finish. The wine is crystal clear right now

. My biggest problem will be keeping wy wife away from it to let it mature. :dg

I'm planning this on another Chardonnay I picked up. The WE Estate Series Sonoma Dry Creek Valley.

robie · Jan 13, 2012

shoebiedoo said:
Well it's been clearing for 20 days now, I think it's time to rack. The flavor is real nice, smooth, nutty initial flavor with a typical "Chardonnay" finish. The wine is crystal clear right now . My biggest problem will be keeping wy wife away from it to let it mature.

I'm planning this on another Chardonnay I picked up. The WE Estate Series Sonoma Dry Creek Valley.

That WE kit is going to produce a lighter chard than the Aussie style you just finished. Many say lees aging and stirring works better on the lighter chardonnays.

You might try lees aging and stirring for a little longer this time. The last one it looks like you did for about 2 months. On this next kit, you might try 4 to 6 months.

One thing to think about is that even if you don't stir and do only lees aging, the process will tend to take the bite out of the chard and really smooth it out. What you won't get is the yeasty, nutty, biscuity flavor. I have let the wine set on the lees without ever stirring it. I did this for several months. The wine was still very fruity, but very soft.

You might try 3 months lees aging and stirring, then just let it set for another 3 months or so on the lees. Maybe split the batch into two parts and do each part a little different. Experiment!!! But let us know how it turns out.

Good luck!

hobbyiswine · Jan 13, 2012

Hmmmmm......sounds like an experiment may be in the works. Sonoma and Aussie chard split into 3 gal carboys to try for 4 different styles? would need to have some people to help me finish off the 5 cases of chard. Luckily my buddy loves the stuff!

shoebiedoo · Jan 15, 2012

Hey Robie, Can I assume it's too late to let it sit on it's lees (added clearing agents) or can I let it sit for a few month? It IS crystal clear right now. I AM, however going to try what you were talking about with the Sonoma.

Thanks

Steve

shoebiedoo · Feb 24, 2012

Well the Chards been bottle for a while now. The flavor is excellent! It has a real nice mouth feel and an equally nice finish and the wife is now MAD at me because I won't let her drink anymore, I want to age it a little more. But I’s convicted that this is a nice technique to add some nice flavor to Chards, and other appropriate whites. I’m getting 18 gallons of Chilean Chard and will put it through MLF and batonnage. I think the “Chateau Des Trois Chien” 2012 chardonnay will be most excellent. :try

robie · Feb 24, 2012

Hi Steve,

Sorry I did not respond to your previous question. Sometimes, when I haven't been on the forum for a few days, I loose track.

The belated answer is no, it won't do anything positive to clear the wine, then leave the wine on the sediment. After clearing, the sediment becomes so compacted it won't help any.

robie · Feb 24, 2012

shoebiedoo said:
Well the Chards been bottle for a while now. The flavor is excellent! It has a real nice mouth feel and an equally nice finish and the wife is now MAD at me because I won't let her drink anymore, I want to age it a little more. But I’s convicted that this is a nice technique to add some nice flavor to Chards, and other appropriate whites. I’m getting 18 gallons of Chilean Chard and will put it through MLF and batonnage. I think the “Chateau Des Trois Chien” 2012 chardonnay will be most excellent.

If you plan to do lees aging and stirring on fresh Chard grapes, you will need to start out with as clean a must as possible. For about 24 hours, let it set covered and keep it cool enough (in the 40's F) that it won't start fermenting. Then, rack the clean must off the sediment, and ferment that.

The reason for this is you are not going to rack off the lees again until lees aging/stirring are completed, so you don't want much more than dead yeast in the bottom of the fermenter.

Just a suggestion:
Not everyone will like the characteristics of the lees aged and stirred Chardonnay. Split fermented wine into 2 carboys. Lees age and stir one carboy; lees age but DON'T STIR the other carboy. Both will end up very smooth; the lees aged/stirred one will have the special characteristics you are looking for.

Or, you can vary this by doing lees aging and stirring on both. Leaving one on lees aging and stirring longer than the other, then compare.

WineXpert Trying something new with Aussie Chard.

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