Mosti Mondiale 1st MM kit - Barolo - Confused Instructions?

[CandJ]

I've complete 5 kits of the Selection series, and this is my first MM kit - Barolo - which we selected after having a blind kit taste of 17 Barolos in Austin in January from the 2007 series, and one bottle from george in the 06 vintage.
The kit has a large instruction sheet which details the addition of raisins on day 2 of primary - today - and then measure SG until dropping to 1.040 - 1.050 range, then rack at that time to secondary with oak additions. There is no mention of raisin removal in the primary instructions.


The kit included a separate instruction 1/2 sheet with the raisin pack that instructs the addition of the raisins after the addition of the yeast. Then stir once a day, gently, until the juice has dropped to 1.020 SG. When at 1.020 SG, place raisins in clean, sterilized cheese cloth and squeeze out juice. Finally, transfer the juice to the carboy and follow the standard fermentation instructions at step #2 (apprx. Day 6) -- Of course, their is no step 2, nor day 6 in the instructions.


So I'm thinking about following the combined instructions as follows:


1. Raisins in at 24hrs
2. stir daily until 1.020 SG (do nothing at 1.040 other than stir daily)
3. extract raisins into cheeseclothand squeeze juice
4. Mix must and sediment back together thoroughly to resuspend sediment
5. Place oak chips in carboy
6. Mix yeast nutrient in separate 50ml water to dissolve
7. Add yeast nutrient to primary and stir well
8. Transfer all liquid and sediment to secondary (normally not done on a selection kit)


Thoughts?

 

[JimCook]

CandJ,

I spoke to Matteo at Winestock about this very issue and he noted that if the raisins are fully plump, taste one to see if the sugar is gone. If it's gone, squeeze and rack.

Your yeast nutrient should be added around the 1.040-1.050 regardless of the raisins or racking. The nutrient will provide nitrogen to the must (now depleted) and let those yeasties stay strong until the end. Adding the yeast nutrient too late can cause weakened yeast cells as well as a potential lack of uptake.

The oak chips should also be included with fermentation as there are differences in tannins that are extracted from oak during fermentation compared to post-fermentation.

So, I'd add the yeast nutrient, check the raisins tomorrow (stir them down into the mixture a couple of times a day if at all possible to help aid the process) and if they are sugar free, then rack onto the provided oak and let it ride.

- Jim

 

[CandJ]

I like your thoughts on the Yeast nutrient being added at 1.040 which is more in line with the primary instructions.


I'm wondering if the oak chips are placed in the secondary and not the primary so that the raisins and oak chips don't get intermixed. George told me we could sterilizea strainer and cheesecloth bag, then scoop out the raisins when time -- then in the bag and squeeze liquid out. Since this is the final part of the primary - prior to the secondary - there wouldn't be oak chips in the must and therefore easy to scoop and squeeze.


Do raisins / yeast / and oak intermix somehow? Or is oak more standalone and can be in most any part of the process to add flavor --- that would help determine if I can separate the two for ease of process


PS - what should raisins taste like with the sugar gone? bitter? neutral?


Good thoughts, any others? Thanks!

 

[JimCook]

CandJ,


The raisins are added to the kit to provide additional sugar as well as some 'grape-like skin contact.' Based on the information provided at Winestock, it appears that raisins in the kit will be modified for future kits toward the end of the year. The larger interaction is the tannin from the oak chips present during fermentation that provide a chemically different tannin molecule compared to already fermented wine stored in oak. While both may add different flavors, there is something about having the oak present during fermentation that rounds out the flavors/mouthfeel a bit.


The oak will sink and the raisins will float for the most part, so separation shouldn't be too bad. However, if your raisins are sugar-less already, then you can squeeze them and rack onto the oak and not have to worry about separation. If you sanitize your fingers and take a raisin out, squeezing any juice into the primary, and then taste it, it will start to taste like a normal raisin and then will turn your mouth inside out as you experience sugarless tannin, essentially. If it's sweet at all, you'll taste it. So, bitter would be one way to describe it, I suppose.


- Jim

 

[PeterZ]

Joseph showed me a pre-production pack of the crushed grapes that Mosti will be going to in the future (Matteo and Nino talked about this at Winestock). The bag of crushed grapes was about a gallon in size.


I can't wait. Yum!

 

[vcasey]

With the large grape pack are they still recommending you bottle with out bulk aging? Part of the reason for bulk aging the grape pack kits is because the sediment continues to drop out of the wine for a while. A gallons worth of crushed grapes - I can't wait either!
VPC

 

[fiat84]

Curious CandJ which Mosti barolo kit did you end up making? And of the 17 taste tested do you have a top five list that you could share your tasting notes? What made you choose one kit over any other kit?

We just bottled a Mosti Renaissance Barolo and followed George's Newsletter instructions to bulk age for three months before adding the clarifers. At bottling being the first barolo we ever tasted it will be a bold wine with nice potential being so young.

 

[vcasey]

We just bottled a Mosti Renaissance Barolo and followed George's Newsletter instructions to bulk age for three months before adding the clarifers. At bottling being the first barolo we ever tasted it will be a bold wine with nice potential being so young.

Of all the things you can do, if you can do just that to all your wines & meads I think it can make all the difference in the world.
VPC

 

[CandJ]

This kit is the special Mosti Mondiale Meglioli Barolo. I did have some tasting notes and saw this kit and I think an All juice kit came out on top - Unfortunately, it was my second club meeting and I don't have the notes anymore. I'm also going to bulk age for three months as well on this one.

 

[CandJ]

Jim, thanks.
The raisins were put in yesterday -- I think I'm going to add them at 1.020 when I rack to secondary and remove raisins. I also think the oak in the carboy is going to be a pain in the ... to get out after the racking to the final stage.


So my revised process looks like this:

1. Raisins in at 24hrs (DONE - 1.100 SG)
2. stir daily until 1.050 - 1.040 SG - Add Nutrient pack
3. AT 1.020, extract raisins into cheeseclothand squeeze juice
4. Mix must, raisin juice,and sediment back together thoroughly
5. Place oak chips in carboy
6.Transfer all liquid and sediment to secondary
7. Stir daily with oak chips as instructed
8. Around day 9 or so, verify stable SG less than 0.996 for two days
9. Rack to next carboy, et wine splash in to help degas, leaving sediment and oak chips behind
?will i lose a lot of juice like this?
10. Stir wine vigorously to degas
11. Use vacuvin to depressure carboy, allowing co2 to escape wine until no more to extract.
12. add K=meta pack as instructed
? will this be enough for a 3 month bulk age or should i add 1/4 tsp?
13. bulk age 3 months
14. add siligel/liquigel to clarfy
15. 7 -10 days wait
16. rack again
17. add K-sorbate as instructed and mix well
18. bottle

 

[JimCook]

CandJ,


The oak chips that are provided with the kit come out with the rest of the lees = yeast sludge. I used to stop my auto-siphon before I hit any of the lees, however after talking with George originally and then running tests myself, I now suck up what I can get. The key here seems to be the addition of the 5g of K-Meta provided with the kit to help convince the yeast cells not to keep trying to eat what little food they can't find and get stressed in the process. After a week or so, any of the remaining sediment should compact down pretty well and you can rack off of that, degas, and top up as needed. This cut my top-up volume down from the two+ bottle range into the 0.5-1.5 bottle range depending on the carboy I was using (Italian carboys seem to take an extra bottle or so compared to Mexican carboys).


At Winestock, Matteo noted that a good schedule for adding K-Meta was 1/4 tsp. every two months. So after you add that 5g initial blast of K-Meta, add another 1/4 tsp at the two month mark and again at bottling if you are planning to let this sit in the bottle for a bit (recommended). He also noted that you should not even attempt to drink the wine for at least a month if not more just for the sake of an increased concentration of SO2. Regardless, it will take that long for bottle shock to wear off. I personally wait 9-12 months before opening a bottle and have noticed good aging effects in my wines at the 18 month mark.


- Jim