2015 Chokecherry

[wyogal]

It's been so cool & sunny here that the chokecherries have ripened "all at once." The birds are feasting so we have to work fast. Have been out for the last 3 days and now have about 40 lbs in the freezer. I'll be using these not only for wine but also jelly/jam/syrup and vinegar.

I still have not opened a bottle of 2014. Some of you may remember I put most of that creation into an oak cask, and bottled the rest plain. The flavor coming out of the cask was wonderful, and we bottled it last December. The un-oaked tasted raw when we bottled it.

I've been meaning to taste both of them but the price of beef has been so high we have been eating just about anything else. I guess I'll have to make an elk meatloaf to try it--

Who else is picking/planning to pick chokecherries?

 

[HarvestWine]

My batch is fermenting right now. Trying to figure out how sweet I want it. I like dry wines but all of the chokecherry wines I've tasted have been so sweet and high in alcohol. Mine should come out at about 13%.

Also, has anyone ever added almond flavoring to their wines? I add a little with my syrup. Chokecherry syrup is my absolute favorite on pancakes!

 

[Arne]

We had a late frost here. Most of our fruit plants have had some fruit on them, but not very much. Makes it hard to pick enough to use. Hopefully next year. Arne.

 

[lorenae]

We usually pick about 100 pounds of them, just for wine (we don't eat jelly or jam). This year had some late cool days, and we'll be lucky to get 45 pounds or so.

I always finish mine dry, and oak about half of mine.

 

[fabrictodyefor]

I'm feeling a little left out. No choke cherries for me this year. Where I usually pick them, they got hail in the spring, and it hit the blossoms. I've just bottled mine from last year, the choke cherry apple and the choke cherry grape. They are both wonderful, but not going to give any of that away as I'll have to wait 2 years to get any more wine! Hopefully next year's crop of choke cherries will be better!

 

[montanaWineGuy]

Last year was incredible for choke cherries. This year a disaster. Because of the poor choke cherries, the bears are traveling further and becoming a problem.

 

[dorfie]

We had some wet and cold weather during almost the entire bloom time this year, so i only got about a gallon of chokes picked
Since i don't have enough this year to make my normal chokecherry wine i mixed it with some other leftover fruit, blackberries and blueberries and some mulberry juice to make a mixed berry cherry wine! i think it will turn out good!

My batch is fermenting right now. Trying to figure out how sweet I want it. I like dry wines but all of the chokecherry wines I've tasted have been so sweet and high in alcohol. Mine should come out at about 13%.

Also, has anyone ever added almond flavoring to their wines? I add a little with my syrup. Chokecherry syrup is my absolute favorite on pancakes!

HarvestWine, I have added almond extract to my chokecherry before, and it was pretty good! i have only done that one year and it was because the wine was very cherry and tart the almond toned it down some. if you add any i would be very cautious on the amount added, add very small amounts at a time and test between, almond could b very overpowering if there is too much.

 

[wyogal]

We managed to get another 10 lbs or so this last week, but the birds have been ravenous. They went straight into the freezer as we have a business trip in in about 2 wks and I just can't manage the timing I know I'd screw it up.
Sorry to hear most of you won't be brewing chokecherry this year.

Harvestwine re sweetness: my first attempt last year is quite dry. I was under the impression from the resources I consulted that chokecherries will usually produce a dry red table wine, and the style you refer to has been fortified and back-sweetened.

Lorenae re oaking: I'd love to hear more about your oaking method. I don't have the new cask this year, so I bought some medium oak cubes, but I'm trying to research the amount and time for cubes.

Dorfie: Your mixed berry/cherry wine sounds like it could be great. Please keep exact records so you can share your results!

 

[wyogal]

bulk vs bottle

Fabrictodyefor, do I understand correctly that you left last summers' chokecherry ferment in carboys for some months? Is there a difference in taste? Is it just a matter of convenience, or do you plan this on purpose?

Since a wild fruit like chokecherry is impacted by weather, every year's cherries taste different.

I think I need to be keeping much better records with lots of notes about tastings and such. There doesn't seem to be a lot of guidance in print about how to identify a characteristic and modify it.

 

[fabrictodyefor]

Fabrictodyefor, do I understand correctly that you left last summers' chokecherry ferment in carboys for some months? Is there a difference in taste? Is it just a matter of convenience, or do you plan this on purpose?

Since a wild fruit like chokecherry is impacted by weather, every year's cherries taste different.

I think I need to be keeping much better records with lots of notes about tastings and such. There doesn't seem to be a lot of guidance in print about how to identify a characteristic and modify it.

I'm so glad for you that you have some choke cherries, and I always freeze any fruit before it goes into wine, so the freezing part is good! Freezing helps to break down the fruit. Although I simmer my choke cherries, the one batch in apple juice, the other in grape juice. And making notes is very important! And sometimes I am not very good at that. I think I am, until I go back to look something up and find out I didn't write it down. Yes I bulk aged both in a car boys. Started the cc/a on 8/21/14, bottled 7/2/15. The cc/g is not bottled yet. Every couple of months I would rack to a clean car boy and taste test. It wasn't until a few weeks ago when I racked the cc/g that it was ready! It was started 2/14/14. I thought this was the one I would toss down the drain. You know how a choke cherry sucks the moisture out of your mouth? That is what this wine did! So I just left it. The recipe I followed was http://www.winemakingtalk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=8316 So this one has been bulk aging for 18 months. I just didn't want to bottle it if it was not going to taste good! As soon as I have some time I'll get it bottled. I back sweetened the cc/a, basically amounting to 2 TBS of simple syrup to a bottle of wine. The cc/g I will back sweeten with 1 TBS of simple syrup to a bottle. This is just what I have come up with in my taste testing. It is never a given whether I back sweeten or not. My sister and I taste test a half cup of wine at a time, each back sweetened differently and one not back sweetened. It seems like we always pick the same glass, our taste buds must be the same. But we can usually tell when it is back sweetened too much, just doesn't taste right! So there is really no method, except personal taste to back sweetening! But it is always fun!!!

 

[dorfie]

My chokecherry almost always sits for a year. it's one of our favorites so i want it to be very good when i bottle it! in my opinion it allows me to insure that it is fully clear and gives me the opportunity to adjust things if i feel the need to.
I leave mine completely dry, but i prefer dry reds to sweet, just personal. i think it could make a nice sweet red too.
and wygirl, ALL fruits used to make wine are impacted by weather! that includes grapes!
chokecherries i have noted less flavor changes, and more size and harvest changes. say if it is a year with nice amounts of rain near fruit development they are larger etc. i guess i would assume warmer days with enough rain would produce a sweeter cherry.
I have been trying to select for a larger and more balanced chokecherry, also trying to work with yellow ones, but with no fruit this year, nothing to work with! can't wait for next year!

 

[fabrictodyefor]

Yes, Wygal, I have to agree with dorfie. If you want to tweak the wine at all, maybe it needs a little tannin....or you want to let it sit on vanilla beans....or you want a little oakness, you can do that if it is in a car boy, but not if it is already bottled.

 

[wyogal]

bulk vs bottle Chokecherry

FTDF--that is amazing info, thank you so much for your report. You have convinced me to bulk age my 2015 batch for far longer than the 2014. I'm going to have to get more carboys.

Last night we had a beef roast so I finally cracked open a bottle of the oak-barrel-aged chokecherry. My impressions:
1) Very intense cherry odor and taste. Good color, but a little murky. Also a big rose fragrance. Very flowery, who knew?
2) Nice dry flavor with body, what I would call medium-dry, about like a natural red zinfandel in terms of tannins & body. I'm assuming the oak cask helped with the body.
3) I did nothing to adjust the tannins, as CC's are so naturally astringent. It is fine as is.

I was aiming for a general purpose red table wine. I think the nose is very flowery for a red table wine, although it is dry. The second glass wasn't so "startling" of course.

I would love to have some other input on this: may I send you a bottle?

Laurel

PS: To others reading this: Yes I will send you a bottle too, for shipping only PLUS the promise of a critical evaluation WITH suggestions for tweaking. I am not selling this wine. If you are interested please email me privately. I will not respond to requests on this thread, OK?

 

[wyogal]

dorfie

Thanks for your comments, I appreciate them greatly. The CC I am talking about from last year was in a carboy for about 2 months and then in a new toasted oak cask for about 5 weeks, then bottled. I'm thinking this year I will let it sit in the carboy for much longer.

 

[dorfie]

I would love to have an oak cask...I have to settle for cubes and spirals. I have always wondered how the flavor compares, if the "micro-oxidation" that casks are supposed to give is actually noticeable.
I love chokecherries for their natural tannins. i have been trying to set the amounts of fruit used in my wines from otherwise acid level, or tannin level. That way i can try to get the most fruit and flavor in my wine as possible!

 

[TasunkaWitko]

I just put my first batch of chokecherry wine (actually, my first batch of any wine) into secondary. It was supposed to be made in 2015, but life happened and I didn't get it started until the end of February. I believe it is off to a great start, and am looking forward to trying it.

My batch is a one-gallon batch (don't judge me!) made with what looks to be a fairly standard recipe that Yooper (at the HomeBrewTalk Forum) helped me put together, along with some recollections of my dad from when his dad would make wild chokecherry wine. This recipe included 2.9 pounds of chokecherries, 2.25 pounds of sugar and Montrachet yeast at about 72 degrees. I didn't add any grape tannin at the time, but plan to do so in my next batch for comparison. I don't plan to put it on oak or anything like that at this time, but I may back-sweeten a little.

Like most others on this thread, I also had a hard time finding chokecherries here in north-central Montana this last year (2015). My son and I finally found some in one small mountain meadow, surrounded on all sides with barren chokecherry bushes for miles. I don't know how it happened, perhaps some sort of temperature inversion or simple luck of nature, but it provided enough for us to get some syrup made, as well as a small amount that I used to brew a chokecherry-wheat beer that I really liked. The rest went for this wine, and I have enough for a couple more batches.

I was going to open a separate thread on this, outlining my research and learning process during this first batch. I'll try to get it put together by this weekend.

 

[dorfie]

I just put my first batch of chokecherry wine (actually, my first batch of any wine) into secondary. It was supposed to be made in 2015, but life happened and I didn't get it started until the end of February. I believe it is off to a great start, and am looking forward to trying it.

My batch is a one-gallon batch (don't judge me!) made with what looks to be a fairly standard recipe that Yooper (at the HomeBrewTalk Forum) helped me put together, along with some recollections of my dad from when his dad would make wild chokecherry wine. This recipe included 2.9 pounds of chokecherries, 2.25 pounds of sugar and Montrachet yeast at about 72 degrees. I didn't add any grape tannin at the time, but plan to do so in my next batch for comparison. I don't plan to put it on oak or anything like that at this time, but I may back-sweeten a little.

Like most others on this thread, I also had a hard time finding chokecherries here in north-central Montana this last year (2015). My son and I finally found some in one small mountain meadow, surrounded on all sides with barren chokecherry bushes for miles. I don't know how it happened, perhaps some sort of temperature inversion or simple luck of nature, but it provided enough for us to get some syrup made, as well as a small amount that I used to brew a chokecherry-wheat beer that I really liked. The rest went for this wine, and I have enough for a couple more batches.

I was going to open a separate thread on this, outlining my research and learning process during this first batch. I'll try to get it put together by this weekend.

Never would dream of judging! sounds like it is a good start!
the lack of fruit (in my area at least) was mostly caused by cold wet temperatures during the bloom period. pollinators don't like to be out in that weather!

 

[fabrictodyefor]

I am hording my bottles of choke cherry from the 2014 crop, knowing I won't bottle any this year. For me too, it takes about a year before the choke cherry is ready, but I did have a choke cherry grape that took 18 months before I bottled it. I was beginning to think this was the batch that would have to go down the drain. I am so glad I waited and waited. This ended up being a superb wine. I am concerned that we are having too much warm weather now that things will start to bloom too early, then we'll have a spring blizzard and ruin it! Good Luck Tusunka.

 

[TasunkaWitko]

Many thanks - and same to you!

Hopefully we'll be able to get a few this year. I've also got my eyes on trying a batch or two from another Montana/Dakota favourite, the buffaloberry (also known as the bullberry).

 

[wyogal]

Well I've been keeping an eye on our chokecherry crop, and this year it does not look good. We had a low temp night in May when the blossoms were open, so I think the fertilization was only 10-20%.
They are just now starting to turn to red, & I hope there won't be a "flash" ripening. Our weather has been scalding hot, 90F plus a piercing sun, forest fires all around too. This might very well be the worst chokecherry year since we moved here in 2011.
We'll see