Back Sweetening process and dosages

[reeflections]

I'm ready to do a little back sweetening for the 1st time. From what I have read here, I believe I have the basics but not the details.

My plan is to pull off about a half bottle or so and my wife and I will taste test from dry to a few varying degrees of simple syrup added with the understanding that it will probably taste a tad sweeter with age.

If we like the dry best, we will go ahead and bottle as is. If we choose a level of back sweetened, I will dose with K-meta and K-sorbate, then multiply up to the right amount of syrup for the sweetening, then bottle.

My questions:

1) What is the proper dose of K-meta and K- sorbate per gallon to prevent fermentation?
2) What kind of time should pass between dosing - sweetening - bottling?
3) Am I missing something in the process?

Thanks in advance for any advice.

 

[salcoco]

for some detail I use 1/4 cup=60ml samples. I use sugar syrup which is 2 cups sugar in one cup hot water mix in a blender let cool. set up three or four samples. using a 1/4 tsp add one to first, two to second, three to third etc. do taste test. if you wine finer divisions use 1/8 tsp. find the ratio you like make a 500ml batch. add a little sorbate let sit for a week return and taste test see if as desired.

for final batch 1/4 tsp of k-meta for 5 gallons, 1/2 tsp per gallon for sorbate make sure sorbate is less than six months old very short shelf life.
Sweeten add k-meta and sorbate and bottle immediately.
everything else looks good,.

please note that this process can be used to balance a wine that may have an imbalance of alcohol, tannin or acid. under these circumstance sweetening doe not occur but balancing does.

 

[reeflections]

for some detail I use 1/4 cup=60ml samples. I use sugar syrup which is 2 cups sugar in one cup hot water mix in a blender let cool. set up three or four samples. using a 1/4 tsp add one to first, two to second, three to third etc. do taste test. if you wine finer divisions use 1/8 tsp. find the ratio you like make a 500ml batch. add a little sorbate let sit for a week return and taste test see if as desired.

for final batch 1/4 tsp of k-meta for 5 gallons, 1/2 tsp per gallon for sorbate make sure sorbate is less than six months old very short shelf life.
Sweeten add k-meta and sorbate and bottle immediately.
everything else looks good,.

please note that this process can be used to balance a wine that may have an imbalance of alcohol, tannin or acid. under these circumstance sweetening doe not occur but balancing does.

Exactly the details I was looking for.

Many thanks!!

 

[Rice_Guy]

.. it is typical that the ideal hedonic sweetness changes based on what was recently eaten, it is worth while tasting several times with hours between
.. if you know what the TA is you can guess where to put the back sweetening
.. grams (or ounces) of sugar is linear against Specific gravity

View attachment 64995
... the key is TA is a tool which is useful in producing a commercial quality product

 

[wineview]

for some detail I use 1/4 cup=60ml samples. I use sugar syrup which is 2 cups sugar in one cup hot water mix in a blender let cool. set up three or four samples. using a 1/4 tsp add one to first, two to second, three to third etc. do taste test. if you wine finer divisions use 1/8 tsp. find the ratio you like make a 500ml batch. add a little sorbate let sit for a week return and taste test see if as desired.

for final batch 1/4 tsp of k-meta for 5 gallons, 1/2 tsp per gallon for sorbate make sure sorbate is less than six months old very short shelf life.
Sweeten add k-meta and sorbate and bottle immediately.
everything else looks good,.

please note that this process can be used to balance a wine that may have an imbalance of alcohol, tannin or acid. under these circumstance sweetening doe not occur but balancing does.

A couple of observations. I have always been under the impression that it’s best to wait one week to bottle after adding the syrup, kmeta and sorbate. The directions on my bottle of Potassium Sorbate says to use 1/4 tsp per gallon and there is no expiration date listed. I was not aware of a short shelf life. Can you comment please.
Thank you.

 

[jvbutter]

Here's another tip... sweeten the wine to just little dryer then you like, let it set and come back tomorrow or just back in carboy and sit for few weeks/months. the flavor changes a bit from what I remember so I let it sit. I would advise against bottling right away. At times if the sugars have not blended completely you can get the sugars to drop out. What you end up with is crystals in bottom of wine bottle. Another tip, when you make your sugar water, let it completely dry before adding to the wine. I typically have 2 or 3 pans of sugar water going. 1 is cooling and 1 is blending.

 

[wineview]

Here's another tip... sweeten the wine to just little dryer then you like, let it set and come back tomorrow or just back in carboy and sit for few weeks/months. the flavor changes a bit from what I remember so I let it sit. I would advise against bottling right away. At times if the sugars have not blended completely you can get the sugars to drop out. What you end up with is crystals in bottom of wine bottle. Another tip, when you make your sugar water, let it completely dry before adding to the wine. I typically have 2 or 3 pans of sugar water going. 1 is cooling and 1 is blending.

Can you explain what you mean by drying out the sugar water.

Thanks

 

[salcoco]

according to the instructions I have the 1/4 tsp dosage if back sweetening is not employed , the 1/2 tsp for back sweetening. though experience as well as other testimonials the sorbate shelf life is about six months. observe the sorbate if it has a gray cast to it rather than pure white it is no longer viable. bottling time is certainly your option

 

[wineview]

according to the instructions I have the 1/4 tsp dosage if back sweetening is not employed , the 1/2 tsp for back sweetening. though experience as well as other testimonials the sorbate shelf life is about six months. observe the sorbate if it has a gray cast to it rather than pure white it is no longer viable. bottling time is certainly your option

Thanks. The visual inspection is a good tip. Just checked. Still white. So the 1/4 dose would be used if you suspect any residual sugar in the wine after fermentation. Correct? How much PS is too much throughout the process in a six gallon carboy?

 

[clusterbuster75]

In my experiences, it tastes sweeter in the sample glass than it does in the bottle once you are done. I backsweeten one to two days before sterile filtering and bottling. Sugar is spoilage food.....

 

[salcoco]

actually if I am not back sweetening I do not use sorbate at all. some people can actually taste the sorbate, somewhat similar to bubble bum, and I expect some define it as "kit taste". my recommendation is if sweetening add 1/2 tsp per gallon if not sweetening do not use at all.

 

[mikewatkins727]

actually if I am not back sweetening I do not use sorbate at all. some people can actually taste the sorbate, somewhat similar to bubble bum, and I expect some define it as "kit taste". my recommendation is if sweetening add 1/2 tsp per gallon if not sweetening do not use at all.

If you taste bubble gum you used too much.

 

[jvbutter]

Can you explain what you mean by drying out the sugar water.

woups... I meant completed cool. I have found if i add the hot sweet mix the the wine, it has dropped out sugars after time. I have better sucess when the mixture cools to room temp then add to the wine.

 

[DizzyIzzy]

according to the instructions I have the 1/4 tsp dosage if back sweetening is not employed , the 1/2 tsp for back sweetening. though experience as well as other testimonials the sorbate shelf life is about six months. observe the sorbate if it has a gray cast to it rather than pure white it is no longer viable. bottling time is certainly your option

Would that be 1/4 tsp. per gallon?...............................................Dizzy

 

[DizzyIzzy]

for some detail I use 1/4 cup=60ml samples. I use sugar syrup which is 2 cups sugar in one cup hot water mix in a blender let cool. set up three or four samples. using a 1/4 tsp add one to first, two to second, three to third etc. do taste test. if you wine finer divisions use 1/8 tsp. find the ratio you like make a 500ml batch. add a little sorbate let sit for a week return and taste test see if as desired.

for final batch 1/4 tsp of k-meta for 5 gallons, 1/2 tsp per gallon for sorbate make sure sorbate is less than six months old very short shelf life.
Sweeten add k-meta and sorbate and bottle immediately.
everything else looks good,.

please note that this process can be used to balance a wine that may have an imbalance of alcohol, tannin or acid. under these circumstance sweetening doe not occur but balancing does.

Do I understand correctly on the K-Meta............1/4 tsp for 5 gallons, NOT per gallon?.........................................Dizzy

 

[salcoco]

if not back sweetening 1/4 tsp

1/2 tsp of sorbate if back sweetening

1/4 tsp per 5 gallons for k-meta

 

[DizzyIzzy]

if not back sweetening 1/4 tsp

1/2 tsp of sorbate if back sweetening

1/4 tsp per 5 gallons for k-meta

Sal, thankyou for the clarification.......................................Dizzy

 

[KCCam]

Sal, thankyou for the clarification.......................................Dizzy

@DizzyIzzy, most chemical doses are given per gallon so they can be applied to any size batch. One exception is k-meta, since the per gallon dose is so small (1/16 tsp) that it is often rounded to 1/4 tsp per 5 gallons (or 4 or 6). You can remember it’s the exception because that’s why they make it into tablets (Campden). 1 tablet is 1/16 tsp, so tablets are used at a dose of 1 tablet per gallon.

And just to repeat and confirm, Sorbate is 1/2 tsp per gallon, so 2 1/2 tsp per 5 gallon (I would likely round up to 1 Tbsp).

 

[my wine]

So that's where that weird bubble gum flavor comes from. Thanks Salcoco! Another improvement for my wine!

 

[DizzyIzzy]

@DizzyIzzy, most chemical doses are given per gallon so they can be applied to any size batch. One exception is k-meta, since the per gallon dose is so small (1/16 tsp) that it is often rounded to 1/4 tsp per 5 gallons (or 4 or 6). You can remember it’s the exception because that’s why they make it into tablets (Campden). 1 tablet is 1/16 tsp, so tablets are used at a dose of 1 tablet per gallon.

And just to repeat and confirm, Sorbate is 1/2 tsp per gallon, so 2 1/2 tsp per 5 gallon (I would likely round up to 1 Tbsp).

Thankyou Kerry for dotting the "i's", and crossing the "t's"..........................................Dizzy