Blackberry suggestions or ideas, please!

[BigDaveK]

i use sergeants crabapples (both red & yellow) as a tanning in my fruit wines especially, banana, peach, apple and so forth,
Dawg

You and @Rice_Guy love the crab apples. I was late to the party and next year I'll use them more.

 

[Hazelemere]

Here's the situation:
I have approximately 16 lbs of thornless and 15 lbs of wild blackberries in the freezer. I'm still learning and exploring and figuring out what I like so I was thinking about two 1-gallon batches of each. 7-8 lbs of fruit per batch should be nice. I was thinking about oaking one (probably a thornless) and adding tannin to one (probably the wild). And before anyone says anything (you know who you are) without thinking I used ALL my crab apples for a 3-gallon batch. Also, 71B is my first choice.

And then on the flip side I'm hoping to combine ALL the pulp for a 1-gallon step fed dessert wine.

So, is there another yeast strain that will give excellent results? Any other tweaks or suggestions? You should know by now that I'll try anything.

Thanks all!

don't add tannin or acid. you aleady have lots' Get the seeds out after 6 day ferment

 

[Rice_Guy]

You and @Rice_Guy love the crab apples. I was late to the party and next year I'll use them more.

Tannin is a family, one of the cider makers I know has looked at the market and said buy fresh cider made from table apples since that is available, then add one or several of the commercial tannins. It works, they have balanced tannic notes. In the practical world if you are using tannic crabs next august it is worth while to scout trees out now. It will take time to find ones you like.
Again my bet is that your blackberry will feel low at a year, then overly astringent and again at a few years back to a pleasing taste. Humm I will be driving through Columbus this week and as an example could pack my version of black raspberry which was overly astringent when bottled. PM if interested.

 

[hounddawg]

@Rice_Guy is right @BigDaveK blackberry don't reach heavenly till it has aged awhile, I don't even bottle no blackberry till a minimum of 2 years bulk aging, hardest thing about blackberry is keeping it once your so called friends and family find out you got it,,,, lol ,,, I use crabapples beings that was the way I learned when I was young,, I live very rural and the old timers of back then had to make do with what they had, shoot I was in my 30's before I seen a homemade wine in anything other than a thumbhole gallon jug.
Dawg

 

[Piccyman]

Do you have numbers on the batches? I have one 2019 crop which had 1.049: TA. 0.70%; pH 3.91. you may find the domestic berries needing a bit acid.
I would expect that this wine has high polyphenols and goes on a roller coaster of flavor. Pretty good > on the astringent side so you wouldn’t want to have tannin > at five years enough complexing so that it is good again. ie NO tannin!
If I was splitting the batch I have been wondering what a gelatin treatment would do to pull some polyphenols out? Would it stay off the roller coaster?

I add elderberries to my blackberry wine for a bit of a different flavour and tannin, also bananas and raisins.

 

[hounddawg]

I add elderberries to my blackberry wine for a bit of a different flavour and tannin, also bananas and raisins.

I'VE mixed blackberries and elderberries for years, makes a great wine
Dawg

 

[Huba Huba]

I'VE mixed blackberries and elderberries for years, makes a great wine
Dawg

Would you say how many pounds of each per gallon you use? I have searched and found several threads where you say to use 1/2 elderberry and 1/2 blackberry, but can't fine the amount. I found a couple of threads that say you use 5 lbs elderberry/gal when used alone, does this mean you use 2.5 lbs of each elderberry and blackberry or 5 lbs of each or ?/?. Was planning a pure elderberry but I'm to old to wait 5-10 years.
I dried my elderberries this year to save space, have about 6 lbs (the equivalent of about 25-30 lbs) but only have about 8 lbs of frozen blackberries left.
I read that you are in NE Arkansas, while not a neighbor, I am from your neck of the woods since I am in SE Missouri

 

[Hazelemere]

Here's the situation:
I have approximately 16 lbs of thornless and 15 lbs of wild blackberries in the freezer. I'm still learning and exploring and figuring out what I like so I was thinking about two 1-gallon batches of each. 7-8 lbs of fruit per batch should be nice. I was thinking about oaking one (probably a thornless) and adding tannin to one (probably the wild). And before anyone says anything (you know who you are) without thinking I used ALL my crab apples for a 3-gallon batch. Also, 71B is my first choice.

And then on the flip side I'm hoping to combine ALL the pulp for a 1-gallon step fed dessert wine.

So, is there another yeast strain that will give excellent results? Any other tweaks or suggestions? You should know by now that I'll try anything.

Thanks all!

rc212

 

[hounddawg]

Would you say how many pounds of each per gallon you use? I have searched and found several threads where you say to use 1/2 elderberry and 1/2 blackberry, but can't fine the amount. I found a couple of threads that say you use 5 lbs elderberry/gal when used alone, does this mean you use 2.5 lbs of each elderberry and blackberry or 5 lbs of each or ?/?. Was planning a pure elderberry but I'm to old to wait 5-10 years.
I dried my elderberries this year to save space, have about 6 lbs (the equivalent of about 25-30 lbs) but only have about 8 lbs of frozen blackberries left.
I read that you are in NE Arkansas, while not a neighbor, I am from your neck of the woods since I am in SE Missouri

both elderberry and blackberry are strong flavors, so yes 5 to 6 lbs, and i do mine 1/2 & 1/2, i really like that wine, not much if any ever see's other peoples glasses, lol,,,
Skoal
Dawg

 

[Hazelemere]

both elderberry and blackberry are strong flavors, so yes 5 to 6 lbs, and i do mine 1/2 & 1/2, i really like that wine, not much if any ever see's other peoples glasses, lol,,,
Skoal
Dawg

I use 1lb dried elderberries for every 27 lbs blackberries. Elderberries still come through. As long as you get the seeds out after 5-6 day ferment to eliminate alcohol extraction of seed tannin almost any combo of blackberries and elederberries should work. Elderberries give the wine a really nice smokey flavour especially if you add medium toast American oak chips e.g. 5/gallon for 90-120 days. but too much may overpower the blackberries. I use 6 lbs blackberries for 3 lbs sugar and one Imperial gallon of water with pectic enzyme and nutrient from frozen if using RC212 yeast. EC 1118 is fine also.

 

[Huba Huba]

both elderberry and blackberry are strong flavors, so yes 5 to 6 lbs, and i do mine 1/2 & 1/2, i really like that wine, not much if any ever see's other peoples glasses, lol,,,
Skoal
Dawg

I think I got this but still not sure, 5-6 lbs each or 5-6 lbs combined (that is 2 1/2 - 3 lbs of elderberry and 2 1/2 - 3 lbs blackberries)

I use 1lb dried elderberries for every 27 lbs blackberries. Elderberries still come through. As long as you get the seeds out after 5-6 day ferment to eliminate alcohol extraction of seed tannin almost any combo of blackberries and elederberries should work. Elderberries give the wine a really nice smokey flavour especially if you add medium toast American oak chips e.g. 5/gallon for 90-120 days. but too much may overpower the blackberries. I use 6 lbs blackberries for 3 lbs sugar and one Imperial gallon of water with pectic enzyme and nutrient from frozen if using RC212 yeast. EC 1118 is fine also.

I have no experience , but it's interesting that the elderberry would be noticeable. that would be about the equivalent of 5 lbs fresh elderberries, or less than a 1:5 ratio of elderberrylackberry. Is that 5 oz of oak chips per gallon? Again, I am very inexperienced but that seems like a lot

 

[Hazelemere]

I think I got this but still not sure, 5-6 lbs each or 5-6 lbs combined (that is 2 1/2 - 3 lbs of elderberry and 2 1/2 - 3 lbs blackberries)

I have no experience , but it's interesting that the elderberry would be noticeable. that would be about the equivalent of 5 lbs fresh elderberries, or less than a 1:5 ratio of elderberrylackberry. Is that 5 oz of oak chips per gallon? Again, I am very inexperienced but that seems like a lot

5 oak cubes per gallon. They are each about 1/4 inch across Oak - Cubes, American, Medium Plus Toast, 8oz to 10lbs

 

[winemaker81]

Is that 5 oz of oak chips per gallon

Generally, the dosage of chips or cubes is 1/2 to 2 oz per 5 or 6 US gallons (19-23 liters) of wine. @Hazelemere's count is spot on.

 

[hounddawg]

I think I got this but still not sure, 5-6 lbs each or 5-6 lbs combined (that is 2 1/2 - 3 lbs of elderberry and 2 1/2 - 3 lbs blackberries)

I have no experience , but it's interesting that the elderberry would be noticeable. that would be about the equivalent of 5 lbs fresh elderberries, or less than a 1:5 ratio of elderberrylackberry. Is that 5 oz of oak chips per gallon? Again, I am very inexperienced but that seems like a lot

everybody has their own ways, i use 3 lb frozen blackberry and 3 lb frozen elderberry, i use no oak, i grow lots of black elderberry and 2 types wild black berry, i know no types, they just grow wild on my land, all my fruits and berries i freeze, and i have no clue as to amount of sugar mentioned by others, my Hydrometer tells all from SSG to FSG to bottling SG,
hope this helps,
Dawg

 

[Huba Huba]

Thank you Dawg, that helps a lot.