Cellar Craft CC Showcase Yakima Valley Syrah

[ibglowin]

First batch of straight Syrah and looking forward to it as the juice is from Yakima Valley. Started on 7/8/11. Added the 2oz French Oak sawdust. Big Oak will come from (about 3 mo) time in the Vadai barrel down the road.

Fermented on the grape pack for a full 7 days until the SG was 1.000. Transferred to glass on 7/15/11. Looking good an smelling good as usual!

 

[tonyt]

Funny, started the same kit on the 4th. Racked on Saturday, 16th. Sitting in secondary right now, going to rack and clarify next weekend. Where's the grape pack in the primary picture?

 

[ibglowin]

Sitting under the juice where it should be!

That pic was taken at ~24hrs post yeast pitch so you can just barely see it starting to poke its head up out of the cap. I punch down 3-4X a day for the first 5 days then 3X for the last 2 days.

I have a small punch down tool that I bought for punching down a "real" cap made by 100lbs of grape skins. Works very well on the 2lb of grape skins in a kit as you might expect.

 

[v1rotate]

That pic was taken at ~24hrs post yeast pitch

Man, that started in a hurry, Mike. I love Syrahs and have this kit on my wish list. I will have to decide between the Showcase and Winery Series versions though...

 

[v1rotate]

It just occurred to me, Showcase instructions for red wine kits w/ grape packs call for 10-12 days in primary, don't they?

 

[RickC]

Jim, yes they do. The last 2 red kits I made in this series both called for 10-12 days.

 

[ibglowin]

Yea, no way in heck I'm leaving it in primary for that long. I know what they are trying to do and I have other ways to accomplish that.

 

[v1rotate]

Yea, no way heck I'm leaving it in primary for that long. I know what they are trying to do and I have other ways to accomplish that.

I've been reluctantly, and with my fingers crossed, leaving the must in primary for 11 days or so for these kits lately. So far the results seem fine, but it does make me a little nervous. I know a lot of people routinely ferment to dry in the primary, but I am used to racking at 1.01 SG and letting it finish under airlock.

 

[ibglowin]

I might try that during the Winter when the Winery is 58 degrees and I need a brew belt to keep it warm but this time of year the Winery is 68 and the ferment temp on the Primary was 80 degrees for 4 days then dropped down to 78, then 74. They changed the instructions to allow for maximum contact time with the skins. The grape pack supposedly has 12lbs worth of grapes in each which after pressing is only 2lbs weight approx.

I am pretty confident that you have at lest 95% extraction rate after 7 days and allowing 4 extra days in the bucket may get you that last 5% but I don't think it will add any more detectible improvement in the wine and you have a higher risk of O2 exposure even sealed (thats a large headspace).

While this is currently "state of the art" for kit winemaking. Its still a long ways from fermenting 100lbs of grapes used for 6 gallons of wine made from fresh grapes.

The end product while still very good IMHO needs a good dose of this to bring up the finish and mouthfeel to something closer to a commercial product. YMMV as they say.

 

[v1rotate]

A good dose of MMAJ Merlot? I hadn't thought of trying that.

 

[ibglowin]

Woops. Forgot about that bug. Link now works properly.

 

[robie]

Link didn't work for me. I assume it is a link to Tan Cor Grand Cru. Am I right?

Hey Mike, I noticed you went ahead and added the 2 oz. of french oak sawdust, which came with the kit. Don't know why, but I just assumed that since you are going to use a barrel, you wouldn't add it.

Is it because you are wanting some French oak flavor, along with the Hungarian oak of your barrel? Actually that does sound pretty good.

Do you generally like extra oak?

 

[v1rotate]

I believe oak dust/shavings/chips are added during fermentation to reduce harshness of the finished product, not to actually add oak flavor. Oak cubes added after stabilizing do that. (Or spending time in a fairly new barrel.)

 

[v1rotate]

Mike, speaking of oak extraction in a new barrel, my 2nd 40L Vadai barrel is only 10 months old and 3 months of aging a big red in it doesn't result in a good level of oaking already! I am going to a 6 month rotation now to see how that works, but I suspect I will still have to add spirals towards the end to get the oak level up high enough.

 

[ibglowin]

OK, I just tried for the third time to make the link work and it seems to be working on my end....... Anyways yes its Tancor Grand Cru BTW.

As for why I added the French Sawdust, I had been leaving it out for the last few kits and then I read an article on "layering" of flavors including oak, sorta like the thread by Joeswine only not quite as radical (LOL)....

Anyway the french oak will add another dimension to the wine and it will be in the background of the main Oak coming from the Vadai.

Jim: I am actually glad to hear about your oaking times on the 40L Barrel. I want to get one for this years crush since a 40L is only $20 more than a 23L and I will have enough Cab Sauv and Merlot to do at least 2 rotations and perhaps 3. My concern was could I keep it full for a year by rotating the 3 batches I had planned for it keeping it full until next years crush without over oaking them. Sounds like it is doable with 3 batches eh in one year? I could always do a double batch of Kit wine but am hoping to make this one just for fresh grape wine. I could rotate the first batch back in at the end I guess right before crush the following year. After that It should be a piece o cake to keep it full.

Jim: Correct me if I am wrong but you really like your wines a bit heavy on the oak right?

 

[v1rotate]

Jim: I am actually glad to hear about your oaking times on the 40L Barrel. I want to get one for this years crush since a 40L is only $20 more than a 23L and I will have enough Cab Sauv and Merlot to do at least 2 rotations and perhaps 3. My concern was could I keep it full for a year by rotating the 3 batches I had planned for it keeping it full until next years crush without over oaking them. Sounds like it is doable with 3 batches eh in one year? I could always do a double batch of Kit wine but am hoping to make this one just for fresh grape wine. I could rotate the first batch back in at the end I guess right before crush the following year. After that It should be a piece o cake to keep it full.



Jim: Correct me if I am wrong but you really like your wines a bit heavy on the oak right?

"A bit heavy" is probably a perfect description of my taste in oak. As far as the rotation schedule for a new Vadai, I suspect you could get away with 3 batches the first year without overoaking any. 4 batches would be no problem at all. You'll have a pretty good idea after the first 2 fills. In my case, after fermenting a chardonnay in each barrel, I left the first red in for 6 to 8 weeks and the second red for twice the time period of the first. If you are able to leave the first one in for 2 months, then 4 months for the second and 6 to 8 for the third would work. But if the first batch needs to come out at 6 weeks, second at 12 weeks and the third would be going in in the 5th month. That would be cutting it close for next year's harvest, so you could start a double batch of kit wine to fill the gap at that point in time.

 

[ibglowin]

Yep, I was hoping to do a 2mo, 4mo, 6mo schedule would work for the 3 batches, as that would put me right back to crush time the following year. Perhaps a little extra day or two on the initial water soak would take a bit more edge off the oak and allow for longer time in barrel up front.

 

[v1rotate]

I'll look forward to the full report!

 

[patc]

Hey Soo nice to see the tancor gran crubeing used it's a great product but i will say Imho leaving the wine fermenting on the skins as long as you can will result in a superior wine and substantially has been my experience, as long as you have an air lock on it and it's bubbling away when you close it up it is saturated with gas and no worries, remember kit wines put out waaaaay more gasthan fresh grapes that's why we have to thoroughly degass or if you let it go to dry maybe not that much.A perfect example is the showcase washington merlot i made fermented it in primary to dry yes to dry with an airlock put on at day 5if i remember correctly and transfered on day 13 SG was .996 at that time kept it in secondary and stabilized on the 21st andthe fruit is explosive! Have been doing that ever since and i do believe it is superior than just transfering early if you will.i too was a little worried but as long as it is sealed you are O.K. Remember kit manufacturers have full proof instructions but if you have done a few and know how to seal it up don't be afraid

You will be rewarded

 

[tonyt]

When you (we) use the term "ferment to dry in primary" what do we really mean? Does that mean you rack at less than 1.000? Or rack when fermentation actually stops, say .998 or so for several days? Does that mean skipping secondary completely? No waiting before clearing so that if it was a quick 7-9 day warm fermentation then clear on day 10?

Myself, if the fermentation goes very quickly I usually rack to secondary for another 10 to 15 days before clearing. If the fermentation takes say two weeks I usually go to clearing from primary. If I remove grape pack after 10 days I usually move to secondary at that time. Seems different every time but would love to hear what y'all consider "ferment to dry in primary".