Clear versus green/brown wine bottles

[hounddawg]

I expect you can get a lot of shelf life, far more than is typical for fruit wines. Of course, that assumes you don't drink it all .....

um, how did you know, lol
Dawg

 

[winemaker81]

um, how did you know, lol

I'm psychic.

Or psycho. One of those?

 

[balatonwine]

use what you got and don't worry about it.

This has been a fun discussion. But, fundamentally I agree with the above.

Yes, I have a large dark, dank and cold cellar. But I am special. Not typical.

So for everyone else---- A corner of your closet. And a good blanket. Good enough....As long as temps are cool. And these days...... with concerns about heating costs.... so you may not be heating as much..... the temps may be okay.

But check every 4 to 6 month. Open a bottle and see where you are.

Hope this helps.

 

[BigDaveK]

Brown?

Yes!
But for different reasons. The white has to do with oxidation and the red with the anthocyanins and tannin.

Hopefully I'll be around long enough to confirm this. Forgetting about a few bottles for a couple decades will be child's play judging by my track record with keys and wallet.

 

[Huba Huba]

thanks everyone. I, like many, usually scrounge my bottles from friends and a restaurant. Most are green/brown and I use these for the darker wines and clear ones for light colored wines which seems to be the recommended way. But maybe it doesn't matter as much as i thought.
I just moved the RJS Coffee dessert kit to secondary and plan on bottling most of it in 375ml bottles, these will have to be purchased. That's what prompted my question. Most will be drank or given away after aging a year so which bottle doesn't seem to matter that much. I'll probably buy green bottles since I can use these for any wine I make and they will probably be used multiple times

 

[Raptor99]

Back to the OP:

Is there an advantage in using colored bottles and lightly pigmented wines? Some wines sure look pretty in clear bottles.

The answer to your question is "No." As others have explained, as long as your wine is not exposed to UV light, use whatever colored bottles you want.

I agree that many fruit wines look beautiful in clear bottles. But clear bottles are more difficult to come by cheaply, so use what you have. I keep a lookout on Craig's List for clear wine bottles. I got 2 cases from someone who used them one time to serve water at a wedding reception and was selling them cheap.

 

[balatonwine]

Yes!
But for different reasons. The white has to do with oxidation and the red with the anthocyanins and tannin.

Hopefully I'll be around long enough to confirm this. Forgetting about a few bottles for a couple decades will be child's play judging by my track record with keys and wallet.

Well, given I have had a vineyard for over two decades, and have some experience over two decades of wine quality over time, I might be able to cut short your confirmation wait time....

Most white wines will oxidize to the point of not drinkable easily in less than one decade. There are a few wines that can defy this. Such as high quality Reiner Rieslings or Hungarian Tokaji. All else are often worthless after even a few years.

Sorry to burst your bubble, but that is basic wine knowledge. Look it up if you do not believe me. And show proof I am wrong if otherwise....

The issue here is really in Europe people know these things. Because they learned this from their father, who learned it from their father, etc. etc. etc. backwards in time.

But in the USA, few have any such history. So think they all know better.... (cough .. arrogance... cough) Yeah. Sure.... Whatever. You may actually not..... Just saying.

Edit: Not to say that new views can not produce new ways of making wine, and new ideas I approve of.... But there are still some fundamentals that are silly to think one knows better than centuries of experience till proven otherwise.

Hope this helps.

 

[hounddawg]

Well, given I have had a vineyard for over two decades, and have some experience over two decades of wine quality over time, I might be able to cut short your confirmation wait time....

Most white wines will oxidize to the point of not drinkable easily in less than one decade. There are a few wines that can defy this. Such as high quality Reiner Rieslings or Hungarian Tokaji. All else are often worthless after even a few years.

Sorry to burst your bubble, but that is basic wine knowledge. Look it up if you do not believe me. And show proof I am wrong if otherwise....

The issue here is really in Europe people know these things. Because they learned this from their father, who learned it from their father, etc. etc. etc. backwards in time.

But in the USA, few have any such history. So think they all know better.... (cough .. arrogance... cough) Yeah. Sure.... Whatever. You may actually not..... Just saying.

Edit: Not to say that new views can not produce new ways of making wine, and new ideas I approve of.... But there are still some fundamentals that are silly to think one knows better than centuries of experience till proven otherwise.

Hope this helps.

still boils down to a higher ABV% and sweeter to hide the alcohol taste, or so my country wines seem to,,, been in and around country wines for close to 5 decades now,,, can't say about grapes beings I have yet to make one,,,
Dawg

 

[balatonwine]

still boils down to a higher ABV% and sweeter to hide the alcohol taste

Ummm.... Well. No.

That is, it is far, far more complicated than simply ABV and sweetness of the wine.

Yes, ABV and high sugar can improve longevity. But... It is not only that simple.

A low ABV, and not so sweet Riesling can outlast many red wines.

Acidity also comes into play. A sweet Tokaji can last a decade or more. A dry acidic Riesling can last a long time. But still.... few will last as long as a very high quality red wine.

So, again, it is complicated.

 

[Raptor99]

That is, it is far, far more complicated than simply ABV and sweetness of the wine.

There was a thread a while back on which types of wines age well. Acidity, tannins, SO2, bottle closure type, and cellar conditions are all factors as well. It also makes a difference if you have long vs. short chain tannins, and the type and amounts of polyphenols present in the wine.

Red wines generally age better than whites because they have more tannins and polyphenols. But there are exceptions. I would guess that an oaked chardonnay might age better than some other white wines.

Based on what I have read, wines that benefit from aging 5 years or longer are the exception rather than the rule.

 

[winemaker81]

Based on what I have read, wines that benefit from aging 5 years or longer are the exception rather than the rule.

Numerous sources state that 90% of the world's wine production is intended for consumption within 3 years. This makes sense, since how many people are willing to wait years to enjoy their product? Folks on this forum are generally outside that part of the bell curve.

 

[BigDaveK]

Well, given I have had a vineyard for over two decades, and have some experience over two decades of wine quality over time, I might be able to cut short your confirmation wait time....

Most white wines will oxidize to the point of not drinkable easily in less than one decade. There are a few wines that can defy this. Such as high quality Reiner Rieslings or Hungarian Tokaji. All else are often worthless after even a few years.

Sorry to burst your bubble, but that is basic wine knowledge. Look it up if you do not believe me. And show proof I am wrong if otherwise....

The issue here is really in Europe people know these things. Because they learned this from their father, who learned it from their father, etc. etc. etc. backwards in time.

But in the USA, few have any such history. So think they all know better.... (cough .. arrogance... cough) Yeah. Sure.... Whatever. You may actually not..... Just saying.

Edit: Not to say that new views can not produce new ways of making wine, and new ideas I approve of.... But there are still some fundamentals that are silly to think one knows better than centuries of experience till proven otherwise.

Hope this helps.

Cool your jets, buckaroo! With me it has nothing to do with "arrogance" or "know better" or some kind of hubris. I'm familiar with the traditional and quite legitimate thoughts on aging. I just want to personally experience the good and the bad. I want to taste heaven and I also want to spit something out and wonder if I've been poisoned.

 

[hounddawg]

Ummm.... Well. No.

That is, it is far, far more complicated than simply ABV and sweetness of the wine.

Yes, ABV and high sugar can improve longevity. But... It is not only that simple.

A low ABV, and not so sweet Riesling can outlast many red wines.

Acidity also comes into play. A sweet Tokaji can last a decade or more. A dry acidic Riesling can last a long time. But still.... few will last as long as a very high quality red wine.

So, again, it is complicated.

Yup, PH is a factor in aging for sure, but if it was much more complicated i'd be lost,,, lol
Dawg

 

[hounddawg]

Ummm.... Well. No.

That is, it is far, far more complicated than simply ABV and sweetness of the wine.

Yes, ABV and high sugar can improve longevity. But... It is not only that simple.

A low ABV, and not so sweet Riesling can outlast many red wines.

Acidity also comes into play. A sweet Tokaji can last a decade or more. A dry acidic Riesling can last a long time. But still.... few will last as long as a very high quality red wine.

So, again, it is complicated.

do you tend to make traditional wines from grapes, traditional wines are extremely complicated, at least to me, (MILF's) lol. and so on, I've noticed traditional wine makers work super hard to recreate a wine over and over, and that is great, but i make my wines to taste like the fruit straight off the tree, or berry straight off the briar patch, or bush/tree. and i agree although my whites last a long time, my reds ( blackberry/elderberry etc.. ) last way longer, no doubt about it, but skeeter pee is my quickest drinker of which i bulk from 1 to 2 years, ,,, AND BEFORE THE REST UNLOAD ON ME, YES I KNOW I AM NOT SUPPOSED TO DO THAT, BUT YAWL ARE THE ONES THAT TOLD ME I ONLY HAD TO PLEASE MYSELF,,, lol... i like my wines,, all my wines mature, i guess i have carried patience a little far, as i have no problem waiting a few years to drink, but easier now that i have a stash in my magic secret closet ,, hehe
BTW map to secret closet at @Arne BASEMENT, snicker,, BAHWAAA sorry big A,,,
Dawg

 

[mikewatkins727]

@hounddawg Just for your edification, I too age my DD wine 1+ yrs before bottling. Currently have a cherry blend in carboy that I started July 2022. Normally this stuff would have been bottled two months ago.

 

[Noontime]

Dark bottles offer protection from UV while light or clear bottles don't. To protect the wine for aging, a dark bottle is always better. The only reason to use a clear or lighter colored bottle is for presentation purposes. That's not a bad thing, a saturated red fruit wine looks spectacular in a clear bottle (and a label! ).

 

[balatonwine]

do you tend to make traditional wines from grapes,

Yes.

But my* traditional wines are varietal vintage wines. Every year can be different. Some years are great. Others are not so great. That is the nature of traditional vintage wine making -- not possible to always make a world class wine year in and year out. Some years simply are less stellar. And some of my wines in some years were awful... large learning curve in traditional wine making.

Hope this helps.

*Edit: Added "my" as I realized after posting, while thinking I was replying only about my personal wine making, I had actually made a generic declarative statement, which is false in the declarative. There are some very traditional and ancient non-varietal Cuvée wines.

 

[balatonwine]

Cool your jets, buckaroo! With me it has nothing to do with "arrogance" or "know better" or some kind of hubris. I'm familiar with the traditional and quite legitimate thoughts on aging. I just want to personally experience the good and the bad. I want to taste heaven and I also want to spit something out and wonder if I've been poisoned.

I was pontificating generically. No direct personal association implied. Sorry if you thought so. My error for not being explicit.

And I appreciate your experimental nature. Believe I have said that before. Keep up the personal experiments.

Hope this helps.

 

[winemaker81]

I want to taste heaven and I also want to spit something out and wonder if I've been poisoned.

Open a LHBS. You'll certainly get your chance at the latter!!!

I've made the comment to Look, Sniff, then Taste -- always in that order. When a test fails, STOP! Go no further!

You won't die from it, but you might wish to do so! Yes, I learned the hard way. Ya know how people will say that having seen something, you can't unsee it? Tastebuds work the same way ........

 

[Shurt1073]

My Mom (82 yr young) keeps a very large refrigerator outside in her garage and last year she asked family over to drink some wine she had stored in her refrigerator. We discovered white / brown / green bottles with various amounts of wine, with some screw caps or corks stuck back into the bottle. She also had some wines laying down unopened but had been in the refrigerator for 7+ years. (actually probably in and out and in again). I'm guessing 13-15 bottles total just in the refrig. Boy was this a learning experience because most all of her wines were not tolerable at all but I did end up with some cool empty white / brown / green bottles. Guessing it doesn't matter what color the bottles are if you don't store them correctly.