cork confusion

[Huba Huba]

A couple of years ago, as a beginner I just bought some corks, then I read that standard corks are not good for long term aging of wine. Then I bought some synthetic (nomacorc), now I have read that synthetics don't allow wine to age properly. I don't need 10+ year corks but I would like to have the option of aging some wines 6-8 years.


Synthetics; On one site it said synthetics do not allow oxygen to pass thus stopping/slowing aging, another says they allow too much, shortening the life of the wine. You don't have to store the wine on its side, but may crease when compressing and cause the loss of the wine.

Natural Disk Top Cork; seems to be a good alternative but I have read that they often come apart when trying to remove.

agglomerated cork; only for short to medium storage and can disintegrate into the bottle during extraction.

So what do y'all recommend for 2-6 years aging. Honestly most of my meads/wines will be consumed prior to 2-3 years but I would prefer to use only one cork type for everything.

 

[ratflinger]

Nomacorc synthetic - to many trashy 'natural' corks out there anymore. So far I've no had issues with my Portuguese corker & the synthetics.

 

[Sailor323]

I have used standard corks (not agglomerated) that have lasted 10+ years. Beware that even the best cork corks will get crumbly after a while (15-20 years maybe less). Agglomerated corks will crumble after a couple of years. The corks that have a solid surface at each end are reputed to last 5 or 6 years.

 

[winemaker81]

A couple of years ago, as a beginner I just bought some corks, then I read that standard corks are not good for long term aging of wine.

Stop reading?

I'm saying that tongue-in-cheek, but in all seriousness, vetting of sources is necessary. Just 'cuz someone wrote something doesn't mean it's true, or even makes sense. I got that lesson in 7th grade history class -- our instructor pointed out that our text listed Nathan Hale (US Revolutionary War hero) as died in 1776 ... but born in 1784. The instructor's advice was to question sources.

Corks have been commonly used as wine closures since the 1600's, and modern corks are known to last 20+ years. That article appears out of step with facts.

Decent quality corks have a good lifespan. However, as @ratflinger pointed out, there are poor quality corks on the market. The hard part is figuring out which is which. I can't offer advice regarding natural corks.

I use Nomacorc Select 900's, which are the ones commonly sold without a part #, e.g., just called "Nomacorc". These are rated at 5 years by the vendor, and IMO they're probably good for 7 years (vendor will undersell to avoid legal liabilities). Some retailers claim 10 years.

Nomacorcs have the advantage that the corks don't dry out and the bottles don't require laying on their sides to keep the corks moist.

 

[Rocky]

Along the way, I have probably used every type of cork available; natural, agglomerated, three-piece, i.e., agglomerated with natural caps on the ends and Nomacorc. I have had trouble with every type except the Nomacorc, so that is what I am using presently and have used for the last 1500 bottles I made.

I had great success with the 3-piece for a period of time and then they went to crap. I got a batch that were difficult to insert and difficult to remove without tearing up the cork. That is when I switched to Nomacorc, and I have been very pleased since.

 

[Huba Huba]

Sounds like nomacorc is good way to go! And I already have some! If I cork a few bottles(6-12) , then immediately pull the corks and look for creases/scores should I be good if none show up or is it more random? I use a floor corker but I can't remember where I got it, I think it was from my LHBS. I don't see a brand name anywhere.

 

[winemaker81]

Sounds like nomacorc is good way to go! And I already have some! If I cork a few bottles(6-12) , then immediately pull the corks and look for creases/scores should I be good if none show up or is it more random? I use a floor corker but I can't remember where I got it, I think it was from my LHBS. I don't see a brand name anywhere.

I have an Italian floor corker (blue, 3' tall, brass jaws) and have no problem putting any cork in any bottle. The Portuguese corker (red, smaller in height, plastic jaws) produced some reports of creasing the corks. My niece recently purchased a Portuguese and loves it.

Yes -- test it. Also search the forum as there are several threads regarding adjusting and/or replacing the jaws on the Portuguese corkers.

Regarding my comment above regarding Nomacorcs being good for more than 5 years -- corks and closures is big business. Cayuse Vineyards was purchasing corks from Lafitte Cork & Capsule at $1.50 each (wow!) for Cayuse's premium wines. They got a bad batch (paraffin and oil on corks contaminated wine), and lost almost the entire year's production. Lloyds of London (insurer) paid Cayuse and immediately filed suite against Lafitte.

While Nomacorc doesn't appear to care about the home winemaker market (I tried contacting them twice, received no response), they do big business in the commercial market, so their reputation is critical to their success. Especially since the Cayuse/Lafitte debacle, I expect all the commercial cork vendors are paying attention.

 

[Bmd2k1]

I have an Italian floor corker (blue, 3' tall, brass jaws) and have no problem putting any cork in any bottle. The Portuguese corker (red, smaller in height, plastic jaws) produced some reports of creasing the corks. My niece recently purchased a Portuguese and loves it.

Yes -- test it. Also search the forum as there are several threads regarding adjusting and/or replacing the jaws on the Portuguese corkers.

Regarding my comment above regarding Nomacorcs being good for more than 5 years -- corks and closures is big business. Cayuse Vineyards was purchasing corks from Lafitte Cork & Capsule at $1.50 each (wow!) for Cayuse's premium wines. They got a bad batch (paraffin and oil on corks contaminated wine), and lost almost the entire year's production. Lloyds of London (insurer) paid Cayuse and immediately filed suite against Lafitte.

While Nomacorc doesn't appear to care about the home winemaker market (I tried contacting them twice, received no response), they do big business in the commercial market, so their reputation is critical to their success. Especially since the Cayuse/Lafitte debacle, I expect all the commercial cork vendors are paying attention.

Do you store any of your normacorc'd bottles vertically? Any issues?

 

[winemaker81]

Do you store any of your normacorc'd bottles vertically? Any issues?

I left a case vertical for 6 months, then laid them down. Wine appears to be fine.

 

[Bmd2k1]

I left a case vertical for 6 months, then laid them down. Wine appears to be fine.

just curious (as I haven't done the research myself yet) - does the manufacturer claim Normacorc'd bottles can be stored vertically "indefinitely" without issues? (I use the term "indefinitely" -- in the sense of - for the amount of time one would normally store that same wine horizontally with a natural cork).

Cheers!

 

[winemaker81]

does the manufacturer claim Normacorc'd bottles can be stored vertically "indefinitely" without issues?

"Indefinitely"? Not using that word. I searched for their statement on standing the bottles up, but didn't find it.

The vendor has crappy web sites that are not necessarily up to date nor easy to find things in. From data sheets on CorkSupply, following are the vendor claims for Nomacorcs:

3 years - Smart Green
5 years - Classic Green AKA Select 900
8 years - Select 500
10 years - Select 300
15 years - Select 100
25 years - Reserva

AFAIK, the Nomacorcs that are sold without a name or part number are Select 900.

From research I did last year, CorkSupply is a partner, not the vendor, which is Vinventions. Their web site doesn't contain detailed info that I could find, but there are links at the bottom of the individual paints that link to datasheets on a different site. The text of the links is nearly the same color as the background, so I spotted it simply because it was blank space where I expected to find text.


According to industry reports, they sell billions of corks per year, so the home winemaker audience is not in the same universe as their radar, hence their failure to reply when I contacted them.

 

[Bmd2k1]

"Indefinitely"? Not using that word. I searched for their statement on standing the bottles up, but didn't find it.

The vendor has crappy web sites that are not necessarily up to date nor easy to find things in. From data sheets on CorkSupply, following are the vendor claims for Nomacorcs:

3 years - Smart Green
5 years - Classic Green AKA Select 900
8 years - Select 500
10 years - Select 300
15 years - Select 100
25 years - Reserva

AFAIK, the Nomacorcs that are sold without a name or part number are Select 900.

From research I did last year, CorkSupply is a partner, not the vendor, which is Vinventions. Their web site doesn't contain detailed info that I could find, but there are links at the bottom of the individual paints that link to datasheets on a different site. The text of the links is nearly the same color as the background, so I spotted it simply because it was blank space where I expected to find text.


According to industry reports, they sell billions of corks per year, so the home winemaker audience is not in the same universe as their radar, Thanks!

hence their failure to reply when I contacted them.

Thanks!

any idea if those timeframes are regardless of the storage orientation of the bottle?

 

[winemaker81]

any idea if those timeframes are regardless of the storage orientation of the bottle?

Nope, it just lists the overall time frame, which is based upon O2 ingress.

 

[cmason1957]

A link to a discussion of cork issues was posted over on Facebook. This has more to do with should bottles be on their side or upright. The original link was to a German article, which google was kind enough to translate and here is a link to it:

https://www-griffkorken-com.transla...l=auto&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=en&_x_tr_pto=wapp

 

[winemaker81]

I read the article, and a section near the end caught my attention:

Traditionally, the wine bottles are stored horizontally. However, numerous studies in recent years have shown that vertical storage has clear advantages. For example, the loss of wine during storage is much lower and the bottles are cleaner.​

​

The cork does not dry out. On the contrary, even when bottles are standing, the cork absorbs wine during storage. The saturated atmosphere in the void makes this possible.​

​

In sensory comparisons of upright and horizontally stored wines, the upright stored wines were often preferred as purer.​

​

Investigations of the content of sulphurous acid showed that the corks sealed just as well when stored upright as when stored horizontally. A difference in the consumption of sulphurous acid, which would have to be measured with increased gas permeability, was not found in the comparative tests.​

Emphasis mine. Corks DO dry out -- I've seen it myself in wines stored upright for a couple of years.​

 

[Bmd2k1]

I'm curious, for the wineries that use Normacorcs and bottle age for 6months or more, are they storing those bottles horizontally or vertically? Hmmmmm.....

 

[Rocky]

I'm curious, for the wineries that use Normacorcs and bottle age for 6months or more, are they storing those bottles horizontally or vertically? Hmmmmm.....

My guess would be vertically because they bottle, case and stack the cases. I can't see them stacking cases on their sides.

 

[CDrew]

I use Normacorcs exclusively. I keep them upright for a week after corking. Then I turn them upside down to look for leaks. I've never had one ever. So I don't think it matters.

 

[Bmd2k1]

I use Normacorcs exclusively. I keep them upright for a week after corking. Then I turn them upside down to look for leaks. I've never had one ever. So I don't think it matters.

Do u store ur bottles vertically for an extended period of time?

 

[Raptor99]

I collected a few empty wine boxes from the grocery store. From the information printed on one of them, I discovered that the wine bottles were placed upside down in the box for shipping and storage.

Has anyone else heard of storing bottles upside down in the box? That would certainly prevent the cork from drying out!