WineXpert Degassing

[Wild Duk]

So, Ive hit the step to degass my SE Cab, sauv. merlot blend, its been in secondary for about 14 days. There really doesn't seems to be much co2 release when I hit it with my fizz stir or whatever its called. I then tried the technique of the wine bottle saver, pumped it up and there seems to be some co2 coming out of solution...


Does this seem normal....Do some wines just not have that much co2 dissolved...I don't want to screw up this wine...and how long do I keep this up...


Thanks...

 

[Wade E]

The lower the sg when transferred from primary, the less gas is typically retained in wine for the most part and that is why RJS kits have you ferment to dry on some of their kits. Ive had trouble in the past getting all the gas out with a mix stir and that is why I added to that with the brake bleeder vacuum pump. Also, having the gauge on the pump really takes the guess work out of the equation.

 

[PeterZ]

I have pretty much given up on the wine whip and mix stir for degassing. I bulk age with periodic rackings, so I just wait until I am ready to filter and use the brake bleeder a couple of days before.

 

[dfwwino]

I also don't rely on the fizz-x alone. While I still stir for the recommended time, I have been using a vacuum pump to get out most of the gas. I tossed aside my Vacuvin and bought a brake bleeder that Joseph recommended to me from Harbor Freight:


http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/displayitem.taf?Itemnumber=92474


The bleeder is working great. Now I've decided there is no reason for me to buy an expensive vacuum pump.

 

[Tom]

You have 2 good methods to degas. Wade and DFW also have other methods. And of course the longer you age the less there will be.
At any rate you are on the right track degassing is a part of winemaking that needs to be done

 

[montyfox]

I use both the stir method and finish off with the brake bleeder vacuum pump. It's amazing just how well that hand pump really works. I love mine, and my forearms are HUGE!

 

[AlFulchino]

for those of you doing kits,,,,when applying a brake bleeder...
how long ( on average) are you using this tool....


what pressure readings do you run when it is active.......


what length of time do you hold it after you feel you have extracted all the gas...


what visual signs are you seeing at each of the stages...do you feel you get 100% of the gas out?

 

[GrantLee63]

I'm no expert, but I do use a Mity-Vac to degas my wines and here is the schedule I've found to work pretty well.


<UL>
<LI>Day 1 - Pump it down to between 15-20" hg when you come home from work in the afternoon / early evening</LI>
<LI>About every hour you'll have to pump it to pull the vacuum down as it will 'bleed' as the CO2 is being drawn.</LI>
<LI>Pump it down to 20"before going to bed.</LI>
<LI>Day 2 - Pump it back down to 20" before leaving to go back to work the next morning.</LI>
<LI>When you come home it will be fully degassed.</LI>[/list]


Stabilize per the instuctions that came with your kit. And yes, I feel that 100% of the CO2 (or close to it) is released during this sequence.
- GL63

 

[Wade E]

Grant has pretty much nailed on te money what I would have written! I will ad that it should hold a vacuum of at least 15"- 20" and have found at those #'s I have never experienced any gas in my wines and I have a good sence of noticing wen a wine is gassy an dont like it unless it is a sparkling wine.

 

[GrantLee63]

Oh and one other thing ...... try to get the temp ofyour wine up to about 75 degrees if possible as it will more easily release CO2 at that temp. Iputa Brew-Belt on my carboy in the morning of the day I start my degassing, so that it is at - or near - 75 when I get home in the afternoon.
- GL63

 

[AlFulchino]

thank you Grant and Wade.......i usually do grapes but an occasionaly akit


and i have them in the wine cellar which is 57-59 degrees...ok so i can improve on that.....


also i did not leave it on overnight...i will do that on one of them this evening


i was getting a lot of action depending on the carboy when i would go to 20 but occasionally up to 24 inches to see activity and then these would go down to12, 13 or 15 where it would hold itselfand i would ramp it back up and repeat this for 3-4 hours...


so i will look at this as a day and a half operation w the last 8 or so hours having it hold at 15"-20"...that is my understanding of what yoru answers are....thank you so much...correct me if i am wrong on anything

 

[Wade E]

Looks right to me. Mine may be easier to degas as I do mainly RJS kits and ferment to dry in the primary bucket which lets it degas much easier. As far as grape wine making, what is the practice of racking? Do you rack at say 1.010 to an air locked vessel? Just trying to figure out what it is that makes these not need degassing as I see on most forums that grape wine makers tell us that we do not need to degas a wine and thats been proven wrong in my basement at least. I had 3 wines bulk age over 1 year, 2 being fruit wines and 1 a kit and all 3 of them needed degassing but none of them fermented to dry in a primary bucket like I do when foolowing the instructions on a RJS kit!

 

[AlFulchino]

that is interesting Wade...in all my years of wine making with grapes, i have never racked more than once or twice after primary and i usually ferment to dry and as high as 1.02 to an airlocked vessel ...same w the kits, but the kits always say stir to degas whether it be dry or other, so that is an extra step that is new to me,


i have never even stirred wine made from grapes and i have had wine such as a zin ready to drink in as little as75-85 days after destem/crush and that was in my wine cellar, so reading how you guys de-gas the kits and now trying it myself w the brake bleeder is all new to me....it sort of seems we are trying to fast-track a wine by doing this degassing


how cool is your basement? the wine cellars in ca seem to feel that the warmer spring temps finish the wine off for malo and i wonder if this is some of the issue with cellars in the northeast, that they stay too cool

 

[Wade E]

I keep my wine making room at around 69º during the winter and around 75º during the summer. My wine cellar stays pretty much 55º all year except for extreme summer time when the de-humidifier has to go on and that raises it to around 64º.

 

[Jack on Rainy]

The lower the sg when transferred from primary, the less gas is typically retained in wine ....

Wade, I don't understand this or why it should be true. Please explain this to a newbie!

 

[PeterZ]

Jack, the larger surface area in a primary makes it easier for the CO2 to escape as it is created by the yeast. When fermentation takes place in a carboy there is less surface area for the CO2 to escape through.


I think grape wines also get seriously degassed during the pressing of the grapes to extract the wine after fermentation.

 

[AlFulchino]

Peter, Jack and Wade....ok, i can go along w the larger surface area being a factor for release of co2 and the need to ferment to as dry as possible that is a great point...And Peter I think you have likely hit on the reason grapes could have less co2 going into the secondary....the only other factor that I still see as possible (not being a scientist) is that there are other compounds in the grape pulp and skins and seedsthat made their way into the secondary that bond with or help release co2.....


anyway, i am going to start on the brake bleeder procedure as outline by Grant and Wade starting today.....i meant to start last evening but fell asleep on the couch and no it was not from the wine

 

[dfwwino]

I use both the stir method and finish off with the brake bleeder vacuum pump. It's amazing just how well that hand pump really works. I love mine, and my forearms are HUGE!

I know what you mean. The first time I used the brake bleeder, it brought back memories of my father giving me my first exercise equipment, hand grippers. These were not the cheap plastic ones, but a pair of wooden and stainless steel ones made in the 40's. We'll all be able to tell which of us use brake bleeders by our Popeye forearms.

 

[grapeman]

Al I don't have any good explanation for it either, but do definitely notice that grapes- especially reds have less gas in them that needs degassing. Kits always seem to have some gas in them. Wine from grapes doesn't have anwhere near as much. I attribute it to the pressing process, especially the reds. They are fermented almost to dry and then pressed. That would tend to force most of the gas out. Even the whites don't seem to have as much as the kits get.


Did you get your bottles in yet?

 

[AlFulchino]

i got the bottles...all 1344 of them!...the same as the picture i think i put in another topic...i start bottling *maybe* tonite for one variety