Fining agent for coffee wine?

[BigDaveK]

My coffee wine was racked for the first time 2 weeks ago. Getting an accumulation of fine lees. Usually I don't care about fining agents - especially now that I have skeeter pee and 2 dragon blood available. Usually I'll see my wines noticeably clearer in 2 or 3 days on their own. Not the coffee wine. Still looks dark dark brown. In fact, with a flashlight it almost looks grainy!

So I'm beginning to think about a fining agent. I know they have different charges and some work better than others depending on the wine. I'm leaning toward a negatively charged fining agent like bentonite or kieselsol. All I have right now is sparkalloid...well, and egg whites.

I know 2 weeks isn't a long time but I think I should have seen something by now. I'm planning ahead. Any thoughts, please?

 

[FlamingoEmporium]

My coffee wine was racked for the first time 2 weeks ago. Getting an accumulation of fine lees. Usually I don't care about fining agents - especially now that I have skeeter pee and 2 dragon blood available. Usually I'll see my wines noticeably clearer in 2 or 3 days on their own. Not the coffee wine. Still looks dark dark brown. In fact, with a flashlight it almost looks grainy!

So I'm beginning to think about a fining agent. I know they have different charges and some work better than others depending on the wine. I'm leaning toward a negatively charged fining agent like bentonite or kieselsol. All I have right now is sparkalloid...well, and egg whites.

I know 2 weeks isn't a long time but I think I should have seen something by now. I'm planning ahead. Any thoughts, please?

Isn’t it still a little early on with the coffee wine ? did you move to secondary 2 weeks ago ? Or have you already racked once from secondary.. if you still have lots of fine lees maybe rack off one more time.

I’m going to have to consider doing something myself with the loquat wine, so I’ll bookmark this one, or just watch it or what ever else you do.

 

[David Violante]

Put a blanket over it so you don’t see it. If you’ve racked it once off the gross lees, just give it some time. It has only been two weeks. If you *need* it to clear faster you could add chitosan/kieselsol. I would just wait.

 

[BigDaveK]

Isn’t it still a little early on with the coffee wine ? did you move to secondary 2 weeks ago ? Or have you already racked once from secondary.. if you still have lots of fine lees maybe rack off one more time.

I’m going to have to consider doing something myself with the loquat wine, so I’ll bookmark this one, or just watch it or what ever else you do.

Yes, it's only been in secondary 2 weeks. Like I mentioned, everything - even the tomato "soup" - was visibly clearer in 2-3 days. Maybe it's "normal" for this kind of wine. Maybe not. Either way it's definitely part of my wine making education.

 

[TurkeyHollow]

How about.... a coffee filter??? Only half kidding. I know there are many reasons NOT to filter a wine but this may be a good candidate for filtering.

 

[BigDaveK]

How about.... a coffee filter??? Only half kidding. I know there are many reasons NOT to filter a wine but this may be a good candidate for filtering.

Possibly.
I guess I'm trying to plan ahead just in case. I'll rack in a couple weeks and see how things are going.

 

[winemaker81]

I know 2 weeks isn't a long time but I think I should have seen something by now. I'm planning ahead. Any thoughts, please?

Pour a glass of wine and consider David's advice:

Put a blanket over it so you don’t see it. If you’ve racked it once off the gross lees, just give it some time. It has only been two weeks. If you *need* it to clear faster you could add chitosan/kieselsol. I would just wait.

Seriously, cover the container and ignore it for at least 2 weeks. My guess is fine coffee grounds are in suspension, and they will settle out. Patience, Grasshopper!

Unless you are ramping up to bottle the wine, do not worry about it. If it's not mostly clear in a month, then consider a fining agent.

I admit part of my advice is learning how coffee wine acts. This is a good leaning experience.

My FWK are due this week, and I intend to start a gallon of coffee mead at the same time (Mrs WM81 hates the smell of fermentation, so I group things to limit the time). I'll document this with yet another "In Detail" blog.

 

[BigDaveK]

Pour a glass of wine and consider David's advice:

Seriously, cover the container and ignore it for at least 2 weeks. My guess is fine coffee grounds are in suspension, and they will settle out. Patience, Grasshopper!

Unless you are ramping up to bottle the wine, do not worry about it. If it's not mostly clear in a month, then consider a fining agent.

I admit part of my advice is learning how coffee wine acts. This is a good leaning experience.

Fortunately my novice wine maker lack of patience has been greatly tempered with the quick wines. No more stress. I'm also slowly getting rid of my commercial stock - to make room.

And "Pour a glass of wine" seems to be an excellent course of action for MANY life situations.

 

[FlamingoEmporium]

(Mrs WM81 hates the smell of fermentation, so I group things to limit the time).

time for the $30,000 home air filtration system

 

[winemaker81]

time for the $30,000 home air filtration system

Instead I'd LOVE to build an external fermentation building. Start with this:

https://www.lowes.com/pd/Heartland-...torage-Shed-Installation-Not-Included/3602264
Insulate the heck out of it, add a small heat pump, and electrical connections. Water is the only issue -- I can run a hose into the building, but no hot water ....

 

[FlamingoEmporium]

Instead I'd LOVE to build an external fermentation building. Start with this:

https://www.lowes.com/pd/Heartland-...torage-Shed-Installation-Not-Included/3602264
Insulate the heck out of it, add a small heat pump, and electrical connections. Water is the only issue -- I can run a hose into the building, but no hot water ....

Hey that’s actually not bad. Decent price.
i stick built one up north -not a fermentation shed but a tool shed.
all the comforts of home. Windows electric lights etc.

winter can get a little nippy up there. garden hose lasts a long time under the ground but 3/4 inch plastic pipe goes together easy and lasts longer.
240 electric service tankless water heater. and a small electric baseboard heater. Check into spray foam. Mice won’t build as many nests.

i keep looking at shows where people use solar panels to build a system that runs a lot of things like lights and even water heaters.

 

[sour_grapes]

Water is the only issue -- I can run a hose into the building, but no hot water ....

240 electric service tankless water heater. and a small electric baseboard heater. Check into spray foam. Mice won’t build as many nests.

Or even easier, you can get a tankless water heater that runs off of a propane tank with no electrical connection: https://www.amazon.com/GA5PORT-Portable-Propane-Tankless-Heater/dp/B005DROEZC

 

[BigDaveK]

Instead I'd LOVE to build an external fermentation building. Start with this:


Insulate the heck out of it, add a small heat pump, and electrical connections. Water is the only issue -- I can run a hose into the building, but no hot water ....

Very nice! Maybe some not-so-subtle hints to Mrs WM81 as an xmas or birthday present would work.

I've entertained the idea of buying a used shipping container and burying it. Could still use the surface real estate for other things.

 

[FlamingoEmporium]

I've entertained the idea of buying a used shipping container and burying it. Could still use the surface real estate for other things.

Weld two side by side. More room for bottle storage
Water table too high here to entertain anything like that. Especially in the summer. My house is 14 ft above sea level. I dig up seashells when I garden. (Seriously)

 

[BigDaveK]

Weld two side by side. More room for bottle storage
Water table too high here to entertain anything like that. Especially in the summer. My house is 14 ft above sea level. I dig up seashells when I garden. (Seriously)

My initial idea was to have a quick and easy root cellar. Part of my property is sloped so burying would be child's play. But now - a brew room AND bottle storage sounds fantastic! I realized just this past weekend that I'll have to address the bottle storage issue this year.

 

[sour_grapes]

Very nice! Maybe some not-so-subtle hints to Mrs WM81 as an xmas or birthday present would work.

I've entertained the idea of buying a used shipping container and burying it. Could still use the surface real estate for other things.

Here is a couple of threads to get you started:
Underground versus shed

Shipping Container Cellar

 

[Steve Wargo]

My coffee wine was racked for the first time 2 weeks ago. Getting an accumulation of fine lees. Usually I don't care about fining agents - especially now that I have skeeter pee and 2 dragon blood available. Usually I'll see my wines noticeably clearer in 2 or 3 days on their own. Not the coffee wine. Still looks dark dark brown. In fact, with a flashlight it almost looks grainy!

So I'm beginning to think about a fining agent. I know they have different charges and some work better than others depending on the wine. I'm leaning toward a negatively charged fining agent like bentonite or kieselsol. All I have right now is sparkalloid...well, and egg whites.

I know 2 weeks isn't a long time but I think I should have seen something by now. I'm planning ahead. Any thoughts, please?

Maybe adding milk will help.

Casein

50 - 250 mg/L of potassium caseinate or 1 - 10 ml/L of low fat milk

* Bitterness, browning and pinking reduction in white wine * Over-oakiness reduction in white wine

Here is the webpage that contains various finning techniques
https://www.winebusiness.com/calculator/winemaking/calc/51/

 

[BigDaveK]

Racked the coffee wine today at about the 1 month mark and it seems, yes, Father Time will eventually clear it. Looks like black coffee but no longer grainy. GREAT coffee flavor. To be honest, though, a VERY dry coffee wine is Phase 1. In other words, I wouldn't drink a glass at this point. Back sweetening and vanilla will make all the difference. Back on the shelf for 3 months and another taste.

The great thing about coffee wine is that you top up the carboy with more coffee.

 

[cmason1957]

You will want to go light on the vanilla, it can quickly overpower all other flavors.

 

[BigDaveK]

You will want to go light on the vanilla, it can quickly overpower all other flavors.

Thanks, I thought that was a possibility. If I wanted some kind of vanilla wine that's where I would have started - and a vanilla wine doesn't really appeal to me. At least not right now.

I have a 1 gallon and a 1/2 gallon batch to play with. I'm thinking possibly a tsp per gallon but adding it in increments. We'll see, that's months away.