WineXpert Fwk verse winexpert

[Vlabruz]

I was looking at the FWK but I see the juice volume is lower than the classic kit from winexpert.
Does anyone have input on this? What make one better than the other?
Thanks!

 

[cmason1957]

The biggest difference between FWK and other wine kit manufacturers is that FWK kits aren't heat pasteurized. In the two I have have made and as reported by several others the FWK don't have what many call kit taste. Other kits are shelf stable while FWK must be kept cold prior to use.

 

[Vlabruz]

The biggest difference between FWK and other wine kit manufacturers is that FWK kits aren't heat pasteurized. In the two I have have made and as reported by several others the FWK don't have what many call kit taste. Other kits are shelf stable while FWK must be kept cold prior to use.

Interesting. I havent come across that term yet, kit taste. I do see that as an advantage. I just don't get the juice volume. Its very little, 1.6 gallons for a 6 gallon kit.

 

[She’sgonnakillme]

It’s night and day difference!!! After making 30 + premium kits, I will never make another red wine kit other than an FWK!!!! Not even close! I predict that WE and RJS will fight over the lower end kit market and FWK will own the premium kit market..

 

[Vlabruz]

It’s night and day difference!!! After making 30 + premium kits, I will never make another red wine kit other than an FWK!!!! Not even close! I predict that WE and RJS will fight over the lower end kit market and FWK will own the premium kit market..

I'm definitely going to try one. I still don't get the juice thing. Maybe its that much better not being pasteurized

 

[Swedeman]

I predict that WE and RJS will fight over the lower end kit market and FWK will own the premium kit market..

Not worldwide, there are kit buyers outside US.

 

[She’sgonnakillme]

Not worldwide, there are kit buyers outside US.

True, I just assume that FWK will eventually be worldwide as well

 

[winemaker81]

Interesting. I havent come across that term yet, kit taste. I do see that as an advantage. I just don't get the juice volume. Its very little, 1.6 gallons for a 6 gallon kit.

I've not come up with a good explanation of "kit taste", but it's a harsh flavor that override's the wine's normal flavor. IME, all wines with kit taste have the same off-flavor.

When eliminating all other possible causes, kit wine taste appears to be connected to the concentrate production. @Matteo_Lahm states the problem is solved by not pasteurizing the concentrate -- while I lack the knowledge to say that is correct, the fact is that FWK's process works to prevent kit taste. I'm not worried about the "why", just the "what", so I accept his statement as correct.

The concentrate process used by FWK is better, in my limited experience, than that used by the other reputable vendors. FWK is apparently all concentrate, like the low end kits, but the quality of the concentrate puts it on par with the premium kits that include a relatively large amount of juice.

It will be interesting to see how this plays out -- WE's reformulation of their kits a few years ago is (again in my limited experience) a real win. However, my FWK have not aged enough for a real comparison, although I already believe they will be better. This may produce an "arms race" among kit vendors, which is a win for consumers.

 

[katmike57]

Tha last 2 kits I purchased were FWK and still too young, but I'm very optimistic. Also hopeful that additional FWK varietals are forthcoming

 

[Gilmango]

I'm still new to winemaking but I totally understand the weirdness of how a more concentrated kit can make better wine. In the past the more premium kits were always the ones with the most volume and least amount of water. And many people were concerned when first WE then RJS each lowered the volumes on their premium kits from 18L to 14L. In fact, as a new winemaker a year ago I sought out 3 of the old 18L RJS EP kits, fearing the 14L kits (just being released from RJS then) would not be so good.

So against that backdrop, it did take a bit of a leap of faith to accept that a 6L kit might actually be better. But having done 4 RJS kits (2 bottled) and 5 Finer kits (2 bottled) in the past year, I agree with what others are saying the Finer kits are better. No 'kit taste' and also more transparency, as in the non-blended Finer kits are 100% of the varietal stated. Also all the grapes are sourced from California, concentrated in Lodi without ultra pasteurization so they are shipped cold and need to be either fermented right away or kept frozen or fridged at 40F or lower.

I did still buy my first WE kit just as it was a varietal I'd never seen available before, Marselan. And I hope it turns out OK but mainly I plan to do Finer kits and fresh grapes going forward, perhaps I'll try a frozen must bucket too at some point.

 

[bstnh1]

I just bottled a FWK Chardonnay that I started in late October and two WE kits, Viognier and Pinot Grigio, that I started a couple of month before that. The Viognier and Pinot are good - you could actually drink them now. The FWK Chard is rough, as it has been all along. It might mellow out in a year or so, but I wouldn't bet on it. It still remains the roughest, harshest tasting wine I ever tasted at any stage of the game. I made a FWK Merlot with one skin pack close to a year ago that's still in the carboy. That one is tasting pretty good. But in view of some of the other comments on the FWK whites and my own experience with the Chardonnay, I'm gonna stick with WE whites until I hear things have greatly improved with the FWK whites. Something is just not right with them!

 

[Vlabruz]

Does anyone have a picture of an ingredient label from fwk red?

 

[She’sgonnakillme]

Does anyone have a picture of an ingredient label from fwk red?

You know, that’s one of the negatives and my biggest concern about the FWK products. They have no UPC label, ingredient or nutritional statement that you find with other consumable items that come packaged. If I’m wrong, I stand corrected but I don’t recall ever seeing them. I would need to pull one bag out of my freezer but not sure they even have a “use by” or “best by” date on them (a bit concerning).

 

[cmason1957]

You know, that’s one of the negatives and my biggest concern about the FWK products. They have no UPC label, ingredient or nutritional statement that you find with other consumable items that come packaged. If I’m wrong, I stand corrected but I don’t recall ever seeing them. I would need to pull one bag out of my freezer but not sure they even have a “use by” or “best by” date on them (a bit concerning).

I don't belive I have seen those on any kit wines, no matter the manufacturer. Just a code as to when it was made.

 

[Vlabruz]

I don't belive I have seen those on any kit wines, no matter the manufacturer. Just a code as to when it was made.

Winexpert has them

 

[Swedeman]

They have no UPC label, ingredient or nutritional statement that you find with other consumable items that come packaged.

I thought that was a requirement by FDA? Surely there has to be a label on FWK box.

Winexpert has them

I believe they have everything on the label (ingredients, nutritional, allergy etc) but the "best by"-date.

 

[bstnh1]

Winexpert has the ingredients and nutrition on the box. The FDA requires the label and FWK should have it on each kit, but I don't remember seeing one. I have two empty FWK boxes, but there's no required label on them. At one point, FDA did not require the label on raw fruit juices, but that changed in 1998.

 

[Brian55]

Let's keep this amongst ourselves and hopefully avoid a completely unnecessary and likely costly step for FWK.

 

[She’sgonnakillme]

Before I get hate mail thrown at me, let me just say I am a huge fan of FWK!! However, as a proponent and supporter of our Truth In Labeling laws in the US, the lack of transparency and labeling does raise a few questions for me. Especially since the bags are now coming without any vacuum seal or other protective seal under the caps. I am just saying I would like to have confidence that the product has been USDA approved, and would like to see an ingredient statement to ensure what I am consuming has no byproduct, extenders, preservatives or enhancers, at least something that tells me that I am not just drinking a “flavored Merlot fruit compote slurry” lol

 

[Brian55]

Getting the government involved always helps. History has shown us this many times over.