How to Avoid Sucking up Sediment

[amorgan]

Working on my first Cabernet. It's dark so when I was racking it I couldn't see where my siphon tube tip is and I hit the bottom of the carboy a couple times. I suspect I picked up some sediment. Do you have some tricks you've learned as to how to avoid hitting the bottom when siphoning a dark red?

 

[winemaker81]

Are you using a racking cane?

Try reading this post for ideas:

https://wine.bkfazekas.com/reducing-wine-loss/

 

[Ohio Bob]

I use an auto siphon, if racking the primary I use the extra tip that comes with it. Later I’ll rack without the tip. It’s ok to suck up some lees, it’s not like this is the last time you’ll be racking.

 

[BigDaveK]

Working on my first Cabernet. It's dark so when I was racking it I couldn't see where my siphon tube tip is and I hit the bottom of the carboy a couple times. I suspect I picked up some sediment. Do you have some tricks you've learned as to how to avoid hitting the bottom when siphoning a dark red?

That darn sediment.
I marked my canes with a permanent marker. When the mark approaches the top of the carboy I know it's time to pay attention.

 

[amorgan]

Are you using a racking cane?

Try reading this post for ideas:

https://wine.bkfazekas.com/reducing-wine-loss/

Good tips in that post. I do have a racking cane, but at just six weeks out of primary fermentation I had a good half inch of sediment - just trying to minimize how much I suck up so I don't have to rack very often! Thanks.

 

[Snafflebit]

For the first and second rackings I do not worry much about sucking up some sediment, just so long as I get most of the wine.
Suppose, for argument's sake, you suck up 10% of the sediment on the first rack (which is a lot) leaving 90% behind. The second racking you would again suck up 10% of 10%, or 1%. By the third racking you have only 0.1% of the sediment remaining.

 

[David Violante]

Agree with all the above… I’ve also seen folks here store their carboys at a slight angle causing the sediment to be thicker on one side of the bottom, and lighter on the other. When racking, place the bottom of the cane in the spot with the least lees. As you get close to emptying the carboy you can gently tilt it back to an upright position to get the remaining wine out.

As @Snafflebit said, either way you will ultimately end up with a diminishing amount of lees/sediment to worry about.

 

[Rice_Guy]

* Like bigDave I have marks on the racking cane, some are marker and some are rings from colored silicone straws
* several of my racking canes are made out of PEX or 3/3 polyethylene (as in photo) which was bent after heating over a gas burner so that the shape is more of a “J” than traditional “L”. By being able to wedge the cane close to the side it becomes visible. The racking cane is made for that size carboy.
* there are wedge shape tools that will hold the racking cane where you put it. Almost as efficient is a spring clamp as in the photo that you can clip a racking cane to. Another alternative is hold the cane with a spring pinch clamp.
* I start all siphons with vacuum, this could even be a low vacuum as from a home vacuum cleaner (5” Hg)
* all racking is done on a slanted platform so the clear stuff is deeper

 

[BigDaveK]

Nice set up, @Rice_Guy !
In addition to tilting, I set up everything the day before racking. I have the worse luck - I hold a carboy for 2 seconds and you'd think I was dancing with it!

 

[winemaker81]

In addition to tilting, I set up everything the day before racking. I have the worse luck - I hold a carboy for 2 seconds and you'd think I was dancing with it!

I bobbled the primary at the end of the first racking the other night, badly enough that I stopped the siphon and poured the remainder into a jug:



It's in the fridge now, nicely cleared. About 20% sludge in the bottom. The general rule is, "it cleared once, it will clear again!" But it is irritating ....

 

[amorgan]

* Like bigDave I have marks on the racking cane, some are marker and some are rings from colored silicone straws
* several of my racking canes are made out of PEX or 3/3 polyethylene (as in photo) which was bent after heating over a gas burner so that the shape is more of a “J” than traditional “L”. By being able to wedge the cane close to the side it becomes visible.
* there are wedge shape tools that will hold the racking cane where you put it. Almost as efficient is a spring clamp as in the photo that you can clip a racking cane to. Another alternative is hold the cane with a spring pinch clamp.
* I start all siphons with vacuum, this could even be a low vacuum as from a home vacuum cleaner (5” Hg)
* all racking is done on a slanted platform so the clear stuff is deeper
View attachment 86289

Nice! Good ideas. Thanks.

 

[Scooter68]

Not a trick but a coping method I use. Before I start I run the syphon all the way to the bottom of the carboy, then bring it up to about 1-2 inches above the visible lees. I have a foam ring that keeps my syphon rod in place at the desired height and after that adjustment I start the pump action on the syphon and watch it. I also have a wooden sloped rack that I rest the carboy on the get the most out of the carboy. Of couse moving the carboy as little as possible helps too. BUT as someone already said some lees are going to get pulled up. Generally I watch the syphon hose and aa soon as I see the lees moving up, I pull the syphon out. You can then carefully pour out the remaining good wine and even let some lees into a temporary container. Thein I set that container into my fridge for a day or two. That tends to get some good separation and settling of the lees so you can get the last bit of good wine from that batch.
So many different methods to try to find what works for you.

 

[szap]

What type of carboy are you using? I use a bucket for the first racking and find the bentonite does a good job adhering much of the gunk to the bottom which helps in preventing drawing up sediment. I don't know what type of carboys you are using. After the bucket, I use the 6 gallon Better Bottle PET carboys.They have a raised area in the center of the carboy bottom which is above the sedimaent. I start my siphon well before reaching the bottom.and then lower it until it rests on the raised area. When the wine drops close to the bottom of the cane, I then carefully tilt the carboy and lower the cane into the deepest part of the liquid. From there I can watch he sediment drifting toward the cane and lift the cane out of the wine just before the sediment reaches it. Hard to describe a technique that could be demonstrated in a few minutes.

 

[Scooter68]

What type of carboy are you using? I use a bucket for the first racking and find the bentonite does a good job adhering much of the gunk to the bottom which helps in preventing drawing up sediment. I don't know what type of carboys you are using. After the bucket, I use the 6 gallon Better Bottle PET carboys.They have a raised area in the center of the carboy bottom which is above the sedimaent. I start my siphon well before reaching the bottom.and then lower it until it rests on the raised area. When the wine drops close to the bottom of the cane, I then carefully tilt the carboy and lower the cane into the deepest part of the liquid. From there I can watch he sediment drifting toward the cane and lift the cane out of the wine just before the sediment reaches it. Hard to describe a technique that could be demonstrated in a few minutes.

With some wines the sediment layer can be 3-4 inches deep or more, so sadly there is no perfect solution for every condition. BUT we keep working on trying to find one.
As for working the bucket for the first rack. I start maybe halfway down from the top of the level and watch for either lees to start up the tube or I see the tip of the syphon and then lower it an inch at a time until I see sediment appear. That first rack from a bucket is the most tedious since most times I can't see where the sediment starts.
Also with some wines the sediment on the first rack is not really settled at all so I resort to strainers, and/or cloth bags wring out the max amount of wine. The I go back to the refrigerator with the soupy stuff for a night to separate out the wine from the lees. This is especially true for peach wine. the pulpiest wine I make. BUT smelling it as I rack it and knowing what it will taste like makes it all worthwhile.

And Yes WInemaker81 again patience and persistence pays off. That fridge does wonders.

 

[Khristyjeff]

I believe it was @hounddawg that said he used the original pinch clamp to hold his siphon at the proper level.

 

[winemaker81]

This is what the elderberry looks like now.

 

[szap]

This is what the elderberry looks like now.

View attachment 86311

That is pretty amazing. What percent loss do you have?

 

[Scooter68]

I use a piece of that foam pipe insulation and tie a string to keep it tight. That way I can slide it up or down that tube. My auto-syphon tube is too big for a standard clothespin.

 

[winemaker81]

That is pretty amazing. What percent loss do you have?

It's hard to judge. I started with 7 gallons, and bobbled the primary after racking most of it. The wine & sludge got mix up enough that I kept it separate, so I'd not have to rack it all again, just this bit + most of a 750 ml bottle.

I estimate overall, the volume loss is about 1.5 liters.

Once I get this racked (probably tomorrow), I'll dose with kieselsol & chitosan, rack in 2 weeks, then bulk age for 6 months.

 

[amorgan]

What type of carboy are you using? I use a bucket for the first racking and find the bentonite does a good job adhering much of the gunk to the bottom which helps in preventing drawing up sediment. I don't know what type of carboys you are using. After the bucket, I use the 6 gallon Better Bottle PET carboys.They have a raised area in the center of the carboy bottom which is above the sedimaent. I start my siphon well before reaching the bottom.and then lower it until it rests on the raised area. When the wine drops close to the bottom of the cane, I then carefully tilt the carboy and lower the cane into the deepest part of the liquid. From there I can watch he sediment drifting toward the cane and lift the cane out of the wine just before the sediment reaches it. Hard to describe a technique that could be demonstrated in a few minutes.

This is second rack and I'm syphoning from 3 gal carboy to 3 gal carboy. That Better Bottle carboy sounds helpful - thanks for taking the time!