Is Barrel Topping Really Necessary? Test started today...

[crushday]

Today I started a topping up test in response to @jsbeckton and his post titled, “Forgo Topping Up?”

I filled two barrels with identical wine, a 2018 Merlot from Master Sommelier fermented at the same time under similar conditions. Both have been bulk aging in an undisturbed carboy since March 18th, 2019 - so they‘re well aged already.

Upon filling, I added a 1/2 teaspoon of KMeta. One will be topped up monthly and more KMeta added as needed (I’ll use my Vinmetrica SC300) to keep the free SO2 ppm within acceptable ranges.

The other barrel will remain untouched for six months until it is either bottled as brilliance or discarded as a failure.

Too bad it’s going to take six months to come to a conclusion but my hope is to finally answer the topping up question. More on or around November 1, 2020!

 

[FTC Wines]

We have 3 barrels so will be watching your study closely. What size barrels are you using? We top off 2X a month now. Roy

 

[crushday]

What size barrels are you using?

Roy, these are six gallon Hungarian oak barrels. In the picture, it’s the two on the far right, #4 and #5. #5 will be untouched until bottling time. I power washed and steam cleaned (325 degrees) before filling.

 

[FTC Wines]

Ok, thanks. We two 40 liter and one 23 liter Vadai barrels.

 

[Mike - Next Level Oak]

I'm curious how this will go as well. Is the main concern oxygen/headspace in the barrel from not topping up?

 

[salcoco]

the wine will oxidize keep tasting the not topped barrel once taste start to go bad start topping up seems a waste to go all out on the experiment

 

[winemaker81]

This is an interesting topic. In theory, there should be no oxidation in the barrel. Evaporation from the barrel produces a vacuum -- after 3 weeks I have to fight to pull the bung from my barrel, and it comes out with a loud POP.

I recall a post a few months ago regarding a South American winery that seals a barrel for 18 months (IIRC) and the result resembles Sherry.

The results of this experiment should be interesting.

EDIT: fixed typos

 

[Ajmassa]

This is an interesting topic. In theory, there should be no oxidation it the barrel. Evaporation from the barrel produces a vacuum -- after 3 weeks I have to fight to pull the bung from my barrel, and it comes out with a loud POP.

I recall a post a few months ago regarding a South American winery that seals a barrel for 18 months (IIRC) and the result resembles Sherry.

The results of this experiment should be interesting.

i had that same thought as well, however I don’t actually know anything for sure. Just that the natural vacuum created can be quite strong.

I sorta did this experiment in an indirect way. I have a 3 year old wine that I just keep discarding. It needs some tweaking. And even with troubleshooting I’m doubtful it will ever be good enough to wanna drink or stamp my name on, but don’t have it in me to dump...yet.

I ended up with an empty barrel and used a portion of that wine to keep it filled. Filled the 30L barrel in January. Dosed with so2 maybe 3 or 4x since then.
When I needed to top it up I really didn’t want to mess with the other carboy’s setup since it was exactly (x2) 5gal carboys and all my 3’s and jugs were filled. Nor did I want to waste good wine on it so I just kept putting it off. Eventually I said screw it- no topping up at all! Since I didn’t care much about the wine it was easy to let it go.

it’s now over 7 months later. The angels share is very noticeable. I will rotate the barrel’s position every so often so nothing dries out. And every time I pop the bung to dose so2 the vacuum seal is very strong. Haven’t done a proper taste test or comparison to the carboys. But it smells good. And no surface spots or anything from what I could tell.
Will be removing soon enough. Curious if my results will end up similar to @crushday’s results.

 

[crushday]

I'll be bottling my test barrel in about 3 weeks. I'll run the appropriate tests, take color difference pics and post the results. We'll know soon. From the time I filled barrel #5 I have not touched it. However, barrel #4 has the same wine and I've treated it normally throughout by topping up and adding kMeta every other month.

Should be interesting...

 

[pete1325]

Not much to add cause I bulk age in glass Carboys, but want to follow this thread for future reference. I have a 25 L Barrel coming soon and want to be prepared when the time comes to age in barrels. Thanks for starting this one.

 

[jsbeckton]

Should be interesting as I’m lazy and always looking for an excuse to do less!

 

[Aiserock]

@crushday, Any update on the test results? Thanks for taking the time to do this.

Anthony

 

[crushday]

@crushday, Any update on the test results? Thanks for taking the time to do this.

Anthony

Anthony, without a doubt topping up is necessary. The wine that I didn't top off was/is drinkable but comparatively akin to a half a bottle left open overnight from last night's dinner - drinkable but displaying the effects of oxygen. The topped off wine was/is fresh, fruity and worth the extra effort to top off every month. Lesson learned: TOP OFF EVERY MONTH!

I have the exact numbers in my office to show how it changed throughout the six months. I'll pull those and get them to you.

Let me know if you need anything else.

 

[hounddawg]

what is your average ABV%, ,,, I only do country wines, but i double to triple my fruits/berries so i can make my wines still be very smooth with higher ABV% which give a opened bottle a lot longer life, of course from what i read, grapes is a totally different animal to tame,,,, so i figure the rules are apples to oranges type deal,
Dawg

 

[crushday]

what is your average ABV%?

Dawg, I'm usually in the 13-15 range. On the wines in question, the starting gravity was 1.105 and the finished gravity was .990 - estimated ABV is 15.04. Both wines were Merlot.

I have 50 pounds of frozen pears I need to thaw and start wine with. I've been lazy as of late...

 

[hounddawg]

i like to read grape threads to see the difference, and i have learnt that grapes are way more intensive than country wines, your ABV's are pretty close to what i like to run, i think grapes are harder to keep in line,
thanks
Dawg

 

[Handy Andy]

Interesting! I have a some fruit wines, and have noticed they don't appear to oxidize, when we only drink part of a bottle. Where as with grape wine it oxidizes over night. Do citrus fruits lack some chemical makeup that grapes have allowing them to oxidize?

 

[winemaker81]

Do citrus fruits lack some chemical makeup that grapes have allowing them to oxidize?

For citrus wines, I suspect the acid has something to do with it.

 

[FTC Wines]

Just saying, we had a 10 year old Apple wine over the weekend. The color was a tad darker than usHal but did not taste oxidized at all. ABV 12%. We made this wine WAY before our Vinmetric 300, so don’t have a lot of stats. BTW the wine was Awesome! Roy

 

[Handy Andy]

I had a excess of oranges growing so I made some orange wine, to see what it would be like. It does not taste acidic.
It was bitter due to me fermenting it on the skins, so I sweetened it for my wife. She has now claimed as her own! The following batch I fermented off the skins, and am waiting for it to finish its fermentation. I do not know which breed of oranges are growing on my property, but they are small and very sweet.

Edit My Orange wine is reading a PH of 3.6