jeff

[cosmyccowboy]

my name is Jeff. i have never made wine before and i have a yard full of grapes. i was making jelly but i still have lots left from last year. if i order the master vintner kit i see online will that be all i need to get started? i've watched a video series on youtube about winemaking and from what i saw there it could be months before i need bottles?

 

[Old Corker]

Hi Jeff. Welcome to WMT. The master vintner equipment kit is all you need to make wine from kits or juice buckets. Making wine from grapes is a different animal. If I were in your situation I would start be doing a bunch of reading about how to make wine from grapes. I only make wine from kits but there are many on here who do what you are thinking about.

 

[cosmyccowboy]

thanks. so if i have my own grapes i don't need the recipe i see? back to youtube i guess!

 

[Joel]

Best advise is make sure your tools you use to make the wine is clean, i use star san when cleaning. If you want a recipe or ideas there are quite a few on this site.

 

[cosmyccowboy]

thanks, where do you get your supplies from? i have been on a website called midwest supplies

 

[Joel]

I have used them in the past, I have also used www.homebrewery.com/Wine when i lived over in Illinois, If you are lucky enough there may be a supplier near you, I am sure there are other on here that have additional places to try.

Hope it help some.

 

[BernardSmith]

Hi Jeff - and welcome. There are grapes and there are grapes. What kind/s of grapes do you have? Are they eating grapes (not very sweet, not very acidic and with little tannin) or are they wine grapes? And if wine grapes what sorts of varietal grapes do you have. Wine from table grapes will not make a wine that you will view as delightful. You will, as I suggest need to add sugar to up the potential ABV (alcohol by volume) - perhaps as much as 1 lb for every gallon of juice you extract. You will almost certainly need to add some tartaric acid and some tannin. If the grapes are concord or the like... (American wine grapes) then (in my opinion) that may be an acquired taste. Concord wines tend to taste a lot like the grape juice you find on supermarket shelves although there are varieties of grapes found in Southern states (Muscadine) I hear can make a delightful wine (though, again, a wine which most wine drinkers are unfamiliar). European -type grapes (now found in Australia and South America) are generally the kinds of grapes we associate with wine making.

 

[Jovimaple]

thanks, where do you get your supplies from? i have been on a website called midwest supplies

Midwest Supplies is my local store. I have also had stuff delivered from them and their sister store, Northern Brewer (which also has a location in the Minneapolis/St.Paul area but it's a bit further for me than MS's location). MS is generally a bit cheaper but NB has a lower threshold for free shipping (although I have seen MS lower their threshold for free shipping at times).

I have also ordered from Home Brew Ohio via Amazon.

 

[cosmyccowboy]

Hi Jeff - and welcome. There are grapes and there are grapes. What kind/s of grapes do you have? Are they eating grapes (not very sweet, not very acidic and with little tannin) or are they wine grapes? And if wine grapes what sorts of varietal grapes do you have. Wine from table grapes will not make a wine that you will view as delightful. You will, as I suggest need to add sugar to up the potential ABV (alcohol by volume) - perhaps as much as 1 lb for every gallon of juice you extract. You will almost certainly need to add some tartaric acid and some tannin. If the grapes are concord or the like... (American wine grapes) then (in my opinion) that may be an acquired taste. Concord wines tend to taste a lot like the grape juice you find on supermarket shelves although there are varieties of grapes found in Southern states (Muscadine) I hear can make a delightful wine (though, again, a wine which most wine drinkers are unfamiliar). European -type grapes (now found in Australia and South America) are generally the kinds of grapes we associate with wine making.

thanks Bernard, i am 30 miles north of Tallahassee Florida. i have some muscadine and a scupernog but the vast majority of what i have is a bunch grape called black munakka and black spanish, this is a very profuse dark purple/black sour grape with small seeds. https://www.willisorchards.com/product/black-monukka-bunch-grape-vine

 

[BernardSmith]

aha! so folks on this forum who live in the southern states and who make wine from these grapes may be able to offer some thoughts.

 

[JustJoe]

Welcome to WMTI would suggest that you come here for advice as often as you need it as you get through your learning experiences.. There are lots of good, experienced folks here who are happy to help. Youtube, however, has so much junk mixed in with the useful information that getting good guidance there is very difficult.

 

[WinoDave]

I’ve made Muscadine wine from Florida grapes, came out pretty good, took a honorable mention from the state fair.
I just crushed the grapes, added a little tannin and acid blend, sugar to get the OG up to 1.090 and pitched the yeast. Sorry I can’t give specifics, it was 3 years ago but it was a easy process, maybe I was just lucky. Made a good wine though.
You can buy something called “Super Kleer” it helps in the clearing of wine so you don’t have to let it sit 3-4 months for all the sediment to fall out

 

[mainshipfred]

Welcome to WMTI would suggest that you come here for advice as often as you need it as you get through your learning experiences.. There are lots of good, experienced folks here who are happy to help. Youtube, however, has so much junk mixed in with the useful information that getting good guidance there is very difficult.

So true!

 

[heatherd]

thanks. so if i have my own grapes i don't need the recipe i see? back to youtube i guess!

Take a look at what I posted in your ask about grapes. The Morewine Red winemaking guide is really your recipe (and I don't recommend youtube for that).

I also posted a response about what other equipment you'll need, including chemicals and yeast.

 

[winemaker81]

@cosmyccowboy, welcome to WMT!

I agree regarding YouTube -- ANYONE with a webcam can post a video. While there are great videos on winemaking, some are so ill-conceived that it exceeds belief.

The advantage of this forum is that dozens of experienced winemakers from around the world participate, and everyone wants everyone else to succeed. On a regular basis people are posting about new (or new to us) techniques and research, and debunking outdated "stuff".

One point that will confuse you -- there is often more than 1 way to do things. You may receive what is conflicting advice. Everything you're told may be different but all work. In situations like this, pay attention to "why" people do what they do, and make your decision. The time of the first racking is a great example -- ask 10 winemakers, you'll get 11 answers, all of which are valid. If you are in doubt, ask more questions!

Read the first few pages of the Beginner's forum -- not everything, but the topics that catch your eye. As suggested, kits are a great way to get your feet wet, so look at the Kit Wines forum. The General Winemaking forum is always good, and since you have fresh grapes ... Wine Making From Grapes forum.

My best suggestion is research before you start. You'll get a better result if we can guide you on the path instead of fixing something that didn't go right.

 

[cosmyccowboy]

Thanks everyone! The pdf on red wine making is great and thanks for the homebrewey link! I found a great series on YouTube the home wine making channel. He responded to me that he didn’t think I needed a kit. From what I have read and seen it could be 8 or 9 months before I need any bottling equipment. I have a large storage container, so I would need a milk crate to bust the grapes up in. Several food grade 5 gallon buckets. His advice is that 100 pounds of grapes should fill up the 6.5 gallon fermenter carboy. So I would need a large mouth carboy, 2 of the 6.5 gallon fermentation carboys, a racking device, star San, yeast, refractometer or a hydrometer, efferbaktol or Camden tablets? What else? Can I use my strainer that fits on the 5 gallon bucket (that’s how I did the jelly) instead of a press? We used cheese cloth to put the grapes in and squeeze all the juice out. I don’t have a press and have done enough investigation to see that would cost me anywhere from 600 to 1500 dollars! Thanks again!

 

[winemaker81]

A refractometer is great for checking the brix of the grapes, before fermentation. After that you need a hydrometer. If you have to make a choice, get the hydrometer. Once fermentation, alcohol skews the refractometer reading.

The lbs of grapes / gallons of finished wine is not a hard rule, it varies by grape variety and other factors. 100 lbs of grapes filling a 6.5 gallon carboy may be a stretch. It's safer to plan for 6 gallons.

You need a few smaller containers. I have 4 liter jugs + 1.5 liter, 750 ml, 375 ml, 175 ml, & 125 ml bottles for excess.

I have no idea what a fermentation carboy is. Ferment in open food-grade buckets with a towel over the top to keep "stuff" out. During initial fermentation yeast needs O2 to reproduce. I have 7 or 8 gallon buckets for small batches and 32 gallon Rubbermaid Brutes for large. IMO smaller mouth carboys are better for aging as their is less room at the top, so the headspace is smaller.

Purchase potassium metabisulfite powder (K-meta) instead of Campden. Campden is great for small batches as each tablet is a dose for 1 gallon of wine. K-meta is cheaper and it saves crushing a lot of tablets to powder. In general, 1/4 tsp K-meta is a dose for 5 to 6 gallons of wine, added at each racking.

For pressing, you need a tool that can exert significant pressure on the grapes, else you'll be leaving a lot of wine behind. For instance, using a basket press I pressed 15 gallons of wine from a must, turning the handle until it was difficult. From there we cranked it until it literally wouldn't turn, and extracted another 7 gallons.

In your other thread @heatherd posted a link for a homebuilt press using a hydraulic jack. That should be inexpensive and (IMO) fairly easy to construct.

I purchased my press, used, from Facebook Marketplace and got a good price.

 

[cosmyccowboy]

Thanks for all the info! Sorry about the lingo difficulty! Every time you get into something new there is a language problem even though we were both speaking English! It’s the small mouth aging carboy I was thinking of, I would need at least 2 of them... correct? From watching a YouTube video i saw where he racked from one bottle to another after letting the “stuff “ settle (I forgot the correct term) he also had a smaller jar he had saved of the press to top off with! Thanks for sharing your knowledge

 

[winemaker81]

To make things fun, on this forum we have American, Canadian, British, and Australian English, plus a few other version AND folks for whom English is not a first language. It keeps things interesting!

How many pounds of grapes do you have? Plan for 1 gallon of must from 10 pounds of grapes. This is overestimating, but it ensures your fermenter is large enough to handle it when the cap rises during fermentation. FAR better to have too big a primary fermenter than too small. Take that advice on faith!

Following is a generic procedure:

Ferment the grapes to an SG between 1.000 and "done". Fermentation typically finishes between SG 0.990 and 0.996. I'm leaving out advanced techniques as this is your first wine. KISS is a necessary to help ensure you have a successful finish.

Press the pomace and put the wine into carboys. If the SG is 0.998 or higher, leave several inches of extra headspace as the wine is not done fermenting.

Let the wine set 7 to 14 days. Fermentation will complete and gross lees (sediment that is mostly grape solids) will drop. Wait until the gross lees starts to compact (level grows higher, then drops as the lees settle). Rack the wine, leaving the sediment behind. Note that 5% to 10% of your volume may be gross lees, so after racking the volume will be less.

I tilt the carboy and don't worry if I suck up a bit of sediment in this racking. One goal here is to not throw out good wine. The sediment (gross lees) will settle and you'll eliminate it later. I pour the loose sludge into a bottle and refrigerate for a week -- if Dionysus is with you, you might recover half the bottle in clear wine. Carefully pour the wine off the sludge and preserve it.

At this point I degas by stirring the wine for 3 minutes, changing direction every 30 seconds. This causes the wine to emit a lot of dissolved CO2 -- the wine clears faster with the CO2 gone. Degasssing is not necessary, but IMO the wine clearing faster is good.

At this point you want less headspace, 1" to 2" from the stopper. Put the remaining wine in containers small enough to eliminate excess headspace.

I add 1/4 tsp K-meta for each 5 to 6 gallons of wine at each racking.

The next racking is a judgment call. After 3 or 4 weeks, look at the sediment. If it's a dusting, do nothing. If it's more than a dusting, rack the wine. Tilt the carboy so you toss less wine out. The "dusting" is fine lees, which is mostly yeast cells. It's ok to leave in and remove it later.

As before, I pour the remaining loose sludge into a bottle and refrigerate. The sludge will settle and you can pour the wine off the top -- if there is enough to do so.

After that, add K-meta every 3 months. Rack the wine only if there is visible heavy sediment.

This is an abbreviated set of instructions -- for a beginner, information overload is a real thing so I'm trying to keep this as simple as possible. While there are other choices, this will get you through the first wine with a satisfactory result.

The following picture is current carboys:



For small bottles, I have a variety:



I use a screwcap ONLY if fermentation is 100% done, and turn the bottle upside down to detect leaks. If it leaks, I move the wine to a different bottle and recycle the leaking one.

 

[cosmyccowboy]

than

To make things fun, on this forum we have American, Canadian, British, and Australian English, plus a few other version AND folks for whom English is not a first language. It keeps things interesting!

How many pounds of grapes do you have? Plan for 1 gallon of must from 10 pounds of grapes. This is overestimating, but it ensures your fermenter is large enough to handle it when the cap rises during fermentation. FAR better to have too big a primary fermenter than too small. Take that advice on faith!

Following is a generic procedure:

Ferment the grapes to an SG between 1.000 and "done". Fermentation typically finishes between SG 0.990 and 0.996. I'm leaving out advanced techniques as this is your first wine. KISS is a necessary to help ensure you have a successful finish.

Press the pomace and put the wine into carboys. If the SG is 0.998 or higher, leave several inches of extra headspace as the wine is not done fermenting.

Let the wine set 7 to 14 days. Fermentation will complete and gross lees (sediment that is mostly grape solids) will drop. Wait until the gross lees starts to compact (level grows higher, then drops as the lees settle). Rack the wine, leaving the sediment behind. Note that 5% to 10% of your volume may be gross lees, so after racking the volume will be less.

I tilt the carboy and don't worry if I suck up a bit of sediment in this racking. One goal here is to not throw out good wine. The sediment (gross lees) will settle and you'll eliminate it later. I pour the loose sludge into a bottle and refrigerate for a week -- if Dionysus is with you, you might recover half the bottle in clear wine. Carefully pour the wine off the sludge and preserve it.

At this point I degas by stirring the wine for 3 minutes, changing direction every 30 seconds. This causes the wine to emit a lot of dissolved CO2 -- the wine clears faster with the CO2 gone. Degasssing is not necessary, but IMO the wine clearing faster is good.

At this point you want less headspace, 1" to 2" from the stopper. Put the remaining wine in containers small enough to eliminate excess headspace.

I add 1/4 tsp K-meta for each 5 to 6 gallons of wine at each racking.

The next racking is a judgment call. After 3 or 4 weeks, look at the sediment. If it's a dusting, do nothing. If it's more than a dusting, rack the wine. Tilt the carboy so you toss less wine out. The "dusting" is fine lees, which is mostly yeast cells. It's ok to leave in and remove it later.

As before, I pour the remaining loose sludge into a bottle and refrigerate. The sludge will settle and you can pour the wine off the top -- if there is enough to do so.

After that, add K-meta every 3 months. Rack the wine only if there is visible heavy sediment.

This is an abbreviated set of instructions -- for a beginner, information overload is a real thing so I'm trying to keep this as simple as possible. While there are other choices, this will get you through the first wine with a satisfactory result.

The following picture is current carboys:

View attachment 76525

For small bottles, I have a variety:

View attachment 76526

I use a screwcap ONLY if fermentation is 100% done, and turn the bottle upside down to detect leaks. If it leaks, I move the wine to a different bottle and recycle the leaking one.

thanks man! i have a question.. you said..
Let the wine set 7 to 14 days. Fermentation will complete and gross lees (sediment that is mostly grape solids) will drop. Wait until the gross lees starts to compact (level grows higher, then drops as the lees settle). Rack the wine, leaving the sediment behind. Note that 5% to 10% of your volume may be gross lees, so after racking the volume will be less.
is the top left open on the carboy so it can breathe? i can't seal until after the fermentation process is over correct? else i get some exploding carboy's!?