Pruning Questions

[mattyc]

Hi Folks -

Marquette vines, about 5 years old now. I pruned a couple months ago here in MN, and buds are really starting to push and open up now.

The books and pictures and slide decks I read about pruning make it sound so simple, but when I'm standing face to face with a vine, it feels confusing!

Some of these spurs have 5 or 6 buds pushing out right now. I'm sure I'm doing something wrong... Can you provide some feedback on which buds I should keep? should I be pruning these spurs back further?

I've attached a couple example pictures, any commentary on how you'd approach these would be appreciated!

Thanks!

 

[grapeman]

First picture Keep A & B. C is a secondary so can be removed after danger of frost. D is a basal bud and should be left this year (will not have grapes on it) to provide the spur for next year by cutting off the old spur above D.

The second picture get rid of the secondary (smaller bud) on B/C D/E and cut A off above B/C. Optionally make it like picture 1 by flicking off D&E and let the basal bud grow.

 

[mattyc]

Thanks Rich. So you're suggesting letting two fruiting canes grow out of each spur? (And letting a third basal bud grow to provide a new spur for next year)
...and that makes 3 cands for each spur? I thought the idea was to have one cane per spur?

Obviously I'm learning here... but if my spurs are spaced every 4-6", won't that make things pretty dense (too dense?) in there?

FYI, I'm growing on a modified GDC per some of the work you've shared on these forums.

Thank you... education in progress!

 

[grapeman]

You need to take into account the average weight of the clusters of the variety grape you are working with. Obviously if you grow a large sized cluster say 3/4 pound to a pound apiece you would want to limit the shoots more or you would overload the vine. Marquette however has small quarter pound (or even smaller) clusters. If you only have one shoot per spur you would have 1/2 pound per spur or a pound per foot of vine. If the vine is even 8 feet long then you are only getting 8 pounds per vine (about half desired amount). These figures would be for a single fruiting wire. In your case if you are doing a GDC with two fruiting wires you could get double that and it might be all you want. Since you have young vines and are still learning you could drop the number of shoots per spur down to one fruiting shoot. I would still keep that basal bud and let it grow so you can keep the spurs shorter. Remember you can always drop shoots later as they grow but it is very hard to increase them if the vine gets too vigorous because there isn't enough crop load.

 

[BlueStimulator]

Good stuff, thanks to you both for sharing. I my go one more year on my spurs then keep the basal buds on next spring

 

[mgmarty]

Very educational. Thank you.

 

[mattyc]

Thanks Rich - so helpful!

 

[montanarick]

Helpful info

Thanks for posting this as there's not a lot of useful information out there on management of Marquettes.

As a general comment, recently took a trip to Yakima Valley (first week in May) and noticed all vines (no Marquettes) were pruned anywhere from 3-5 buds per spur

 

[balatonwine]

As a general comment, recently took a trip to Yakima Valley (first week in May) and noticed all vines (no Marquettes) were pruned anywhere from 3-5 buds per spur

Five buds is unusual, but of course there are many reasons why a vineyard might final prune a certain way.

Side note: the first pass from a pruning machine will often leave quite a few nodes:

However, by early may the field hands normally would have trimmed them down further.

 

[srcorndog]

I would like to see a machine pruner work.

 

[srcorndog]

You need to take into account the average weight of the clusters of the variety grape you are working with. Obviously if you grow a large sized cluster say 3/4 pound to a pound apiece you would want to limit the shoots more or you would overload the vine. Marquette however has small quarter pound (or even smaller) clusters. If you only have one shoot per spur you would have 1/2 pound per spur or a pound per foot of vine. If the vine is even 8 feet long then you are only getting 8 pounds per vine (about half desired amount). These figures would be for a single fruiting wire. In your case if you are doing a GDC with two fruiting wires you could get double that and it might be all you want. Since you have young vines and are still learning you could drop the number of shoots per spur down to one fruiting shoot. I would still keep that basal bud and let it grow so you can keep the spurs shorter. Remember you can always drop shoots later as they grow but it is very hard to increase them if the vine gets too vigorous because there isn't enough crop load.

I like the thumb fist rule for my spurs and my cordons wrist to elbow with 5 to eight vertical spurs and renew my canes in a 5 year process this keep my spurs spaced without gaps.