RJ Spagnols Super Tuscan with grape pack

[Rocky]

I have had a Super Tuscan with grape pack on since Wednesday, 4-27. For the first time, I used the bag for the grape pack rather than putting the skins right into the must. A couple times a day I push it down and try to get the gasses out of it. It will definitely be easier to rack with the bag, but I wonder if I am sacrificing anything in the wine. I am a traditionalist in many ways and think I may have made a mistake. I have made several wines with grape packs. When I am ready to rack, I do not push down the skins but I scoop them out with a strainer. There are a couple skins that I miss, but I get most of them.


What do you guys think of bag vs. no bag? Other than the ease in racking, is there any other benefit from using the bag? Off hand, I can't think of any but I am sure there must be more than that.


Thanks.

 

[Tom]

Did you get the skins from george? I did the same last fall with FVW's grape skins (still aging). The bag IMHO is just as good as loose. Just make sure you punch it down 2X a day. I treat just like i'm doing a fruit wine. Fruit in a bag. makes it much easier to remove.

 

[Rocky]

Hi Tepe,


The grape pack came in the kit (Spagnol Cellar Classic Winery Series). I do punch it down a couple times a day and even try to get some of the gasses out of the bag or else it shoots right back to the top. Thanks for the input.

 

[Tom]

The gas is the CO2 just punch it 2-3X a day. I usually remove @ 1.015. What does the kit say?

 

[Rocky]

That is consistent with the kit. They say when the SG is 1.020 or less, rack into a carboy, squeezing the grape skins in to the transferring wine. It also says to leave the lees behind. I have that scheduled for 5/3 to 5/5 depending on the SG. The wine has a great taste.

 

[v1rotate]

I did 2 kits of Red Mountain Cab recently. I had the GP loose with a 5G paint strainer bag in one, the other I used a muslin bag. At 40 days, I could tell no difference in flavor between the 2. Would have been interesting to see how they compared at 2 years of age, but I had to combine the 2 batches to age in one of my 11G barrels.

 

[Tom]

Super tuscan had deep rich taste

 

[Flem]

+1 to what the guys said above. Keeping it in the bag makes it so much easier. I did it with a RJS Winery Series Merlot and it worked great.

 

[Rocky]

I am getting the strong impression that the consensus is that the bag is better than leaving them loose! I now agree with that position and this morning I spent a lot more time keeping the bag below the surface of the wine and getting the gas out of it. I can see already that it will be much easier to rack. The only thing I have in there beside the sediment is the oak chips that came in the kit. I have two more wines on the way, a Cabernet Sauvignon and Zinfandel, both with grape packs and I will again use the bags. Thanks for the input.

 

[Wade E]

Ive done a whole bunch of these and have done them both ways and couldnt tell the difference. I use the old RJS regimen though and ferment to dry in bucket.

 

[RickC]

I use the bag but I trap it below the surface with the plastic spoon instead of punching it down.I stir 1-2 times per day whichalso moves the bag around at the same time. This process seems to work for me. I do like Wade and ferment to dry in the primaryso the skins are in the must for 12-14 days.

 

[Rocky]

Thanks Wade and Rick, that is a good idea to leave the skins in until dry. The directions call for removing them when you first rack the wine at or below 1.020 SG. Leaving the wine on the skins longer should not hurt anything.

 

[vcasey]

I ferment to dry in the bucket as well and I never put the skins in a bag but when I rack I put the siphon in a bag. My understanding is there is not a lot of difference bagging the skins or not just ease of racking. In my case bagging it in advance is frustrating and racking around the loose skins is very simple for me.

 

[Rocky]

This is great! There are so many alternatives and I will try most of them just for the experience. I like the idea that vcasey had to put the siphon inside the bag. I have a spigot on my fermenter, but I could also use the siphon. So many great ways to do this. Good work guys!

 

[Wade E]

That poor cat is getting skinned again!!! LOL
By the way, I am pretty much making wine from grapes these days but this one is so good I put 1 in the Georges basket the other day if you kn ow what I mean!!!

 

[vcasey]

That poor cat is getting skinned again!!! LOL

This topic does get brought up often. You'll hear everyone swear by what ever way works for them and that's the key - find the way that works best for you and that's the best way.

 

[Wade E]

Agreed!! Its all about whats easier for you!!!

 

[Rocky]

I am through the clarifying step with this wine and all I can say is "WOW!" This is going to be one really great wine. I don't know if I can hold out for a year. I racked it into a 5 gallon and a 1/2 gallon and I had about 200 ml left over which I have been using for "quality control" purposes. It is a beautiful color, has a great taste even as young as it is. I would like to hear from anyone who has made this and how it tastes after a year.

 

[Wade E]

Probably the best kit Ive ever made with maybe the RJS EP Amarone beating it!

 

[v1rotate]

I made a double batch 8 months ago. Ran them through a new barrel briefly and bottled on day 73. I haven't tasted it yet, but I have high hopes. That is the only Winery Series kit I have made so far, may have to try a few more.