I have made wine of several sorts of fruits, pears, mango, peaches. All have been drinkable, but they never taste like the fruit that have been used. The tast is awesome during early ferment, but it disappears as the ferment progresses. What can I do to get the wine taste like the used fruit?
Tasteless wine
- Thread starter Morten
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You could back-sweeten (after adding k-meta and k-sorbate or you can add more fruit to your batches.
FlamingoEmporium
Senior Member
Backsweetening helps a little. But you will never get a full fruit taste because now it’s wine (alcohol) as opposed to fruit (sugar)
I do backsweeten my wines, but I don’t think that helps on the taste, it just sweetens the wine. Is there a yeast that is better than others at “keeping the taste”? So far I have been using the EC1118.
I'd switch to Lalvin ICV D47.
* a lot of what we identify as taste actually is aroma. Low temp and such as used on white wines helps.
* there is a ranking on how dominant a flavor is, if you have H2S which turns into meaty flavor mercaptans the fruity notes are covered up and if you are lucky can be uncovered by removing the H2S. Oxidized ethyl alcohol is another, at 100 ppm it starts becoming obvious. Free SO2 number?
* sugar is magic! I can take the flavor profile as in a peach and push it from “green store peaches” into tree ripe peaches by increasing the sugar.
* how much water? the best peach or rhubarb or apple you can smell and know what it is. Water dilutes the solids available to volatilize into aromatics. I like to do no water added wines. The negative is that soluble solids frequently carry acid which balances with more sugar
* acid level? a lot of fruits go along with high TA, ,,, “fresh” flavor, ,,, wine judges always have acid blend to sprinkle in a sample to see how “thin” the flavor is
* are you some place where you can have someone taste it. A good cook who plays with flavors? They may not know the chemistry but having names to put on dominant flavors helps. Again some flavors in ppm levels will cover ppm levels of fruity notes
* yeast flavors dominate early after primary
* there is a ranking on how dominant a flavor is, if you have H2S which turns into meaty flavor mercaptans the fruity notes are covered up and if you are lucky can be uncovered by removing the H2S. Oxidized ethyl alcohol is another, at 100 ppm it starts becoming obvious. Free SO2 number?
* sugar is magic! I can take the flavor profile as in a peach and push it from “green store peaches” into tree ripe peaches by increasing the sugar.
* how much water? the best peach or rhubarb or apple you can smell and know what it is. Water dilutes the solids available to volatilize into aromatics. I like to do no water added wines. The negative is that soluble solids frequently carry acid which balances with more sugar
* acid level? a lot of fruits go along with high TA, ,,, “fresh” flavor, ,,, wine judges always have acid blend to sprinkle in a sample to see how “thin” the flavor is
* are you some place where you can have someone taste it. A good cook who plays with flavors? They may not know the chemistry but having names to put on dominant flavors helps. Again some flavors in ppm levels will cover ppm levels of fruity notes
* yeast flavors dominate early after primary
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How much fruit per gallon did you use? For peaches you need at least 5 lbs. per gallon. For pears it is better if you use at least 10 lbs. per gallon. Some people use only fruit, and add little or no water. Some of the recipes online use 3 lbs./gallon. The fruit flavor is weak because the wine is mainly made of water.
The yeasts that others have recommended are great. EC1118 is easy to use, but it tends to drive off the fruit flavor. My favorites are 71B and K1-V1116. For mead and some of my wines I use D47. But D47 is a bit temperamental, so it takes practice to use it without producing off flavors.
Another factor is the speed of fermentation. Warmer temps and faster fermentation tends to drive off the fruit flavors.
You can look up the manufacturer datasheet for each yeast. Here is the one for K1-V1116: Lalvin ICV K1-V1116™ | Lallemand Brewing It can be used at temperatures down to 50 degrees F. From the datasheet:
The yeasts that others have recommended are great. EC1118 is easy to use, but it tends to drive off the fruit flavor. My favorites are 71B and K1-V1116. For mead and some of my wines I use D47. But D47 is a bit temperamental, so it takes practice to use it without producing off flavors.
Another factor is the speed of fermentation. Warmer temps and faster fermentation tends to drive off the fruit flavors.
You can look up the manufacturer datasheet for each yeast. Here is the one for K1-V1116: Lalvin ICV K1-V1116™ | Lallemand Brewing It can be used at temperatures down to 50 degrees F. From the datasheet:
The floral esters are flavors added by the yeast. Different types of yeast add different flavor notes to the wine. Experiment to see what you like best!
I've made a number of fruit wines that I've been very happy with but like everyone here I want to make them better.
Using ripe, flavorful, exciting fruit is important. Crappy fruit crappy wine.
I generally use 25-50% more fruit than a recipe calls for. Like others have said, reduce water when/if possible.
I've been using 71B. Happy with the result, no reason for me to experiment.
Do you top up with water? Try juice.
Fermentation changes the flavor of everything.
Using ripe, flavorful, exciting fruit is important. Crappy fruit crappy wine.
I generally use 25-50% more fruit than a recipe calls for. Like others have said, reduce water when/if possible.
I've been using 71B. Happy with the result, no reason for me to experiment.
Do you top up with water? Try juice.
Fermentation changes the flavor of everything.
use 71b it maintain aroma which is half of taste. also try adding some of the fruit to the wine post fermentation. add some sorbate to keep from additional fermentation. the taste of the fruit may be infused into the wine.
I too was told by my mentor to use 20% more fruit to every recipe and we've been much happier with the results.
We like dry wines, so we do sweeten a little (I mean very little) to bring the fruit forward, but I understand not wanting to add too much sugar because ultimately you can bring those flavors forward but create a wine that you don't enjoy drinking because its too sweet.
I also use Lavlin 71B and Red Star Premier Rouge and Cotes des Blancs as my yeasts of choice. Good luck!
We like dry wines, so we do sweeten a little (I mean very little) to bring the fruit forward, but I understand not wanting to add too much sugar because ultimately you can bring those flavors forward but create a wine that you don't enjoy drinking because its too sweet.
I also use Lavlin 71B and Red Star Premier Rouge and Cotes des Blancs as my yeasts of choice. Good luck!
HillPeople
Senior Member
I make a lot of fruit wines and I agree with 71B and K1-V1116
Wine is 84% water 13% alcohol and 3% everything else. The trick is increasing that 3% or making that 3% the best it can be my intensifying the flavor. With grapes, the best way I found was using the saignee method.
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EC 1118 has been known to strip flavor.
Fruit wines really need sugar, but not a lot. You may find that 1/2 to 3/4 cup sugar in 6 gallons is sufficient to bring out the fruit while maintaining a wine that is barely off-dry.
When I make iced tea, I add 1/4 cup sugar to 2 quarts tea. A friend of mine starts with 2 cups of sugar and sweetens to taste. As you may have guessed, we don't serve each other tea ....
Yes, that's what we do!Fruit wines really need sugar, but not a lot. You may find that 1/2 to 3/4 cup sugar in 6 gallons is sufficient to bring out the fruit while maintaining a wine that is barely off-dry.
When I make iced tea, I add 1/4 cup sugar to 2 quarts tea. A friend of mine starts with 2 cups of sugar and sweetens to taste. As you may have guessed, we don't serve each other tea ....
You have all been so kind! 
So, how would you proceed to make let’s say a 1 gallon rhubarb wine that actually tastes like ruhbarb?
Yeast 71b
How much rhubarb and water?
Would you put more ruhbarb in secondary, if so, how much?
You people are awesome!
So, how would you proceed to make let’s say a 1 gallon rhubarb wine that actually tastes like ruhbarb?
Yeast 71b
How much rhubarb and water?
Would you put more ruhbarb in secondary, if so, how much?
You people are awesome!
There’s a ton of great info people have posted here from their experiences. Use good fruit, and 6-9 pounds per gallon is a good starting point. Freezing the fruit and then thawing it before fermentation can help to break down the cells in the fruit and give your fermentation better access to everything. Pectic enzyme also helps.
Do you have a hydrometer? Add sugar to achieve a specific specific gravity where you want it. That relates to the potential alcohol content after fermentation. I personally like to be around 1.080-1.090. Using a hydrometer takes the guess work out of how much sugar to add (chapatization) based on other ingredients, volume, etc… try not to add water unless you have to...
There’s science and art with all the above. Here’s some more… different yeasts impart different characteristics and also have different requirements and nutritional needs. Know what those are before you use them so that you know how to be most effective and give them what they need to do their work. For example, 71b will eat up some of the acid and may be best for a higher acid fruit. There are a lot of choices. Try some different smaller size ferments of the same fruit with different yeasts to see what happens and what you like. Be sure to add nutrients for them.
Try to have the end in mind before you begin so you know what you need to do to get there. And have fun! And make it the way YOU want it. You’re drinking it! There’s a lot of information in many areas of the forum. Search around to get some answers and different perspectives and experiences. They will help to guide your decision making process. And ask! Looking forward to how your rhubarb progresses!
Do you have a hydrometer? Add sugar to achieve a specific specific gravity where you want it. That relates to the potential alcohol content after fermentation. I personally like to be around 1.080-1.090. Using a hydrometer takes the guess work out of how much sugar to add (chapatization) based on other ingredients, volume, etc… try not to add water unless you have to...
There’s science and art with all the above. Here’s some more… different yeasts impart different characteristics and also have different requirements and nutritional needs. Know what those are before you use them so that you know how to be most effective and give them what they need to do their work. For example, 71b will eat up some of the acid and may be best for a higher acid fruit. There are a lot of choices. Try some different smaller size ferments of the same fruit with different yeasts to see what happens and what you like. Be sure to add nutrients for them.
Try to have the end in mind before you begin so you know what you need to do to get there. And have fun! And make it the way YOU want it. You’re drinking it! There’s a lot of information in many areas of the forum. Search around to get some answers and different perspectives and experiences. They will help to guide your decision making process. And ask! Looking forward to how your rhubarb progresses!
Here's my recipe. I'm sure there will be others with more experience than me that will chime in, but we have had good success with this. The volume of rhubarb is 20% more than the original recipe. The color is fantastic and the aromas and flavor are strong. It is tart and needs sweetening, but there's no doubt what it is:
3.7 lbs Rhubarb (cubed & frozen)
1 Gallon (4 quarts) Water
2.5 lb Sugar
1/8 tsp. Tannin
1 tsp. Yeast Nutrient
1 Campden Tablet (crushed)
1/2 tsp. Pectic Enzyme
For this one I used Red Star Yeast Cotes des Blancs, but I'm sure 71B would be great too.
3.7 lbs Rhubarb (cubed & frozen)
1 Gallon (4 quarts) Water
2.5 lb Sugar
1/8 tsp. Tannin
1 tsp. Yeast Nutrient
1 Campden Tablet (crushed)
1/2 tsp. Pectic Enzyme
For this one I used Red Star Yeast Cotes des Blancs, but I'm sure 71B would be great too.
