the "best" water for starting fermentation (for wine)?

[wine newbee]

Does anybody have a preference for what water they use? I'm thinking City water (from the tap; with chloramines) is a no-go. That said, would distilled be better than deionized? If so, any reason? Would it make sense to maybe boil the water (and cool it) before adding it to the ingredients?

I'd be obliged for any comments, suggestions and/or anecdotes ....

Mitch

 

[franc1969]

I have purchased 4 gallon disposable spring water bottles from Wegmans, other stores have them or alternatives. I used this for winemaking, and sanitizer. Keep refilling those bottles and Better Bottles I have bought, because they are plastic. My grocery has a drinking water dispenser-fill your own or several sizes of bottle to buy and fill. I would be fine with my home water as I filter everything, but don't want to filter multi-gallons. I am on a well, I only use it for small batches. Sanitizer (starsan) is clearer and lasts longer making with commercial filtered water though, so I always use that. I make a 5 gallon bucket at a time anyway.

 

[franc1969]

Oh, by the way, distilled water is only for my pH meter,and deionized I haven't needed since I worked in a lab. Minerals are important for yeast, I wouldn't use either for wine. I would hesitate to use water with heavy chlorine, though. If that's what you have at home, get water at the store.

 

[bstnh1]

Spring water - it's cheap enough and why take a chance of what comes out of your tap?

 

[bkisel]

I've been using spring water...

 

[KCCam]

Opinions seem to vary, although it is certain that distilled is for sure a “no”. I would say no need to boil. It doesn’t remove chloramine, and it won’t likely kill anything the chloramine and k-meta haven’t already killed. I read that a quarter dose of k-meta will remove chloramine, but never looked into it any further. I also would be interested to hear people’s opinions.

 

[KCCam]

Spring water - it's cheap enough and why take a chance of what comes out of your tap?

Maybe I’m a conspiracy theorist, but my personal opinion is that what comes out of your tap is far more regulated and controlled (and cheaper) than what comes in a bottle. If you don’t drink your tap water, don’t make wine with it. If you do drink your tap water, make a batch with it, and make one with spring water. If you can tell the difference, use the one you like the best.

 

[bstnh1]

Maybe I’m a conspiracy theorist, but my personal opinion is that what comes out of your tap is far more regulated and controlled (and cheaper) than what comes in a bottle. If you don’t drink your tap water, don’t make wine with it. If you do drink your tap water, make a batch with it, and make one with spring water. If you can tell the difference, use the one you like the best.

We have well water. The water is good - tests out fine. But iron is high and that's not good for wine making. Sure, wine needs minerals in the water. But what types and how much is always a question with well water.

 

[Rice_Guy]

The water that I prefer for making wine is whatever squeezes out of the berry or apple or grape, ie rain water filtered through dirt. The water I use for washing goes away so I don’t worry about it.

If I was looking at concentrates which the company made, the water which was pulled out in the vacuum evaporator is similar to distilled water. ie kits have a juice concentrate and if important to get back to original, then use distilled or reverse osmosis (RO).

The factory water which you purchase with processed foods is the locally sourced water, ie the instant rice line pulls surface water that comes out of the Mississippi River and the parboil plant sources well water and the beer plant where I grew up sourced out of Lake Michigan. @KCCam is correct that the city water is regulated and usually will taste good, ,,,, ie don’t use your city water if you wouldn’t drink it.

Foods have minerals which do what is called buffering, so unless you are doing chemical tests the mineral content should not matter on how it works. Yeast like minerals unless the concentration is salty (high osmotic pressure) , and yeast will not grow in distilled with only sugar added ,,, so for the purpose of fermentation build a system which is close to what is in natural juice.

 

[wine newbee]

Spring water - it's cheap enough and why take a chance of what comes out of your tap?

Thx -- that's what I'm using today (not sure the pH of 9.5 is necessarily a good thing, but .... that's what the btls say) ....

Mitch

 

[KCCam]

We have well water.

Ahh, “well,” obviously my comment does not apply to you. Sorry. I assumed “Tap water” meant “city water.”

 

[KCCam]

The water that I prefer for making wine is whatever squeezes out of the berry or apple or grape, ie rain water filtered through dirt. The water I use for washing goes away so I don’t worry about it.

If I was looking at concentrates which the company made, the water which was pulled out in the vacuum evaporator is similar to distilled water. ie kits have a juice concentrate and if important to get back to original, then use distilled or reverse osmosis (RO).

The factory water which you purchase with processed foods is the locally sourced water, ie the instant rice line pulls surface water that comes out of the Mississippi River and the parboil plant sources well water and the beer plant where I grew up sourced out of Lake Michigan. @KCCam is correct that the city water is regulated and usually will taste good, ,,,, ie don’t use your city water if you wouldn’t drink it.

Foods have minerals which do what is called buffering, so unless you are doing chemical tests the mineral content should not matter on how it works. Yeast like minerals unless the concentration is salty (high osmotic pressure) , and yeast will not grow in distilled with only sugar added ,,, so for the purpose of fermentation build a system which is close to what is in natural juice.

VERY nicely said @Rice_Guy! That’s what I meant.

 

[bstnh1]

Thx -- that's what I'm using today (not sure the pH of 9.5 is necessarily a good thing, but .... that's what the btls say) ....

Mitch

That seems unusually high for bottled spring water. But, according to Tim Vandergrift, the pH of the water used is inconsequential.

'So it’s not just the amount of acid in the wine kit that affects the pH, it’s a bunch of other junk in solution as well. This is sometimes referred to as buffering. Kit wines tend to be heavily buffered, partly because they contain very high levels of solid material and partly because the effects of concentration and pasteurization include some bonding of acids and sugars and some release of ions.

And water isn’t. And that’s why the pH of tap water is pretty much inconsequential – there’s almost nothing there to release hydrogen ions. When chemists calculate the pH of a weakly acidic solution, they usually assume that the water does not provide any hydrogen ions. Add the wimpy tap water to highly acidic, heavily buffered kit wine and POWIE! the water will meekly do as it’s told, and get swamped in a tsunami of acids and dissolved solids from the kit."

Here's a link to the whole article:

http://www.creativeconnoisseur.com/... of 3.4 is a pretty sweet spot for most wines

 

[wine newbee]

Per the 2 1-gal btls of water I used to start: "spring water, ionized, with natural electrolytes and minerals". I feel better about it now. I was thinking I had bought deionized water. No memory ....

Mitch

 

[Rice_Guy]

water with very little mineral has little buffering, therefore it can have wide swings in pH with little change of chemistry. . ,,,
ex we drink cola with a pH of 2 and think this is good, tart yes but quickly washes out of the mouth so refreshing, ,,, in good part since the TA (buffering) is low. Vinegar is in the same pH range but more buffered so if you taste it you want to spit it out.
Tooth paste in contrast is highly buffered BUT since the pH is close to what your mouth is 7ish it holds its own against saliva and isn’t objectionable, salty yes, ,,, but OK

If your spring water had LOTs of mineral it would shift the pH of your must and increase the risk of spoilage, so,,, if it isn’t highly buffered (low mineral content) it doesn’t matter. ,,,,, any idea what the relativeTA is?

Thx -- that's what I'm using today (not sure the pH of 9.5 is necessarily a good thing, but .... that's what the btls say) ... Mitch

 

[wine newbee]

water with very little mineral has little buffering, therefore it can have wide swings in pH with little change of chemistry. . ,,,
ex we drink cola with a pH of 2 and think this is good, tart yes but quickly washes out of the mouth so refreshing, ,,, in good part since the TA (buffering) is low. Vinegar is in the same pH range but more buffered so if you taste it you want to spit it out.
Tooth paste in contrast is highly buffered BUT since the pH is close to what your mouth is 7ish it holds its own against saliva and isn’t objectionable, salty yes, ,,, but OK

If your spring water had LOTs of mineral it would shift the pH of your must and increase the risk of spoilage, so,,, if it isn’t highly buffered (low mineral content) it doesn’t matter. ,,,,, any idea what the relativeTA is?

Wish I knew, Rice ..... I was kinda amazed that the btl itself even cited the pH at all.

 

[Snafflebit]

I have heard that tap water that has sat for a day in an open container will be fine for blooming yeast. Now that does not imply that the rest of the water content is good for the WINE.

 

[KCCam]

I have heard that tap water that has sat for a day in an open container will be fine for blooming yeast. Now that does not say the rest of the water content is good for the WINE.

I think that "sitting for a day" refers to how water treated with Chorine (not Chloramine), will off-gas the chlorine within 24 hours. I remember doing this for our fish tank as a kid. However, those of us that now have their water treated with Choramine need more than a day in an open container. I think it takes years, so chemical intervention is needed. As I mentioned above, I read that a quarter dose of k-meta will do the trick, but don't quote me on that. I did do that on my last batch of Dragon Blood, however, and the yeast did just fine (EC-1118).

 

[Steve Wargo]

We have well water. The water is good - tests out fine. But iron is high and that's not good for wine making. Sure, wine needs minerals in the water. But what types and how much is always a question with well water.

Try using a filter for RV's that are good for trapping most of the iron, and other junk at RV parks. You said your well water was good water. I would just filter it. I have well water, filter it, and have made lots of beer. The beer made with the filtered well water tastes loads better than store-bought

 

[Rice_Guy]

An amine is a nitrogen compound. To remove this family I would start with a charcoal filter.
Interesting, I will have to ask what the city is currently using for treatment. I have felt the odor has a higher free Cl smell for about two years. (or else my sense of smell is wacky from covid for the last two years)

I think that "sitting for a day" refers to how water treated with Chorine (not Chloramine), will off-gas the chlorine within 24 hours. I remember doing this for our fish tank as a kid. However, those of us that now have their water treated with Choramine need more than a day in an open container. I think it takes years, so chemical intervention is needed. As I mentioned above, I read that a quarter dose of k-meta will do the trick, but don't quote me on that. I did do that on my last batch of Dragon Blood, however, and the yeast did just fine (EC-1118).