The Spaniards

[salernovic]

I'm pretty impressed with his stuff thus far, they're getting some age on them, but still haven't gotten the Temp. into a barrel yet, Merlot has been in for a bit. I have similar tasting recollections of the Temp. and Merlot, good fruity flavors, but still a little tight and tannic. I'm suspecting that when I can get them through the barrel(s) that they will really come around. None of my wines have had an finings added to them, just fermented and aged....

Yea I agree , the tannin is there. I recall tasting the Tempranillo right after it went dry and remember detecting a metallic taste in my mouth. I’m guessing it was the tannin . That flavour is gone now but there is no comparison between glass wine and barreled wine. I did a side by side with my Syrah and it’s just crazy how sharp the carboy syrah tastes compare to the barrel one. I forgot to mention that my Syrah is in a 30 gallon flextank now and it has a ph of 3.6. Little lower than the Tempranillo but a lot smoother .

 

[Johnd]

Update: Had a Tempranillo / Merlot 50/50 blended at pressing (mentioned in post 40). It’s been in 6 gallon glass since pressing, racked a couple of times, and has been sitting with 2 M+ French Wine Stix for many months, never seen a barrel. It has a nice aroma, good oak, flavors that really haven’t developed yet, and it’s still real tight and tannic. Monkeyed around with the acid in some samples a bit, ultimately ended up bottling it without changing the batch. I’ll be able to compare this wine to the Tempranillo and Merlot which did go through the barrels, just to see how the development differs, though I already know that the Merlot in the barrel is substantially more developed. Probably will not get this blend into the drinking rotation for several years.

 

[cgallamo]

Great idea! My guess is it will take longer to integrate and mellow without the micro-oxygenation etc. But there is nothing like experience. What kind of corks? Will you be able to let it sit for 5 or 10 years?

 

[Johnd]

Great idea! My guess is it will take longer to integrate and mellow without the micro-oxygenation etc. But there is nothing like experience. What kind of corks? Will you be able to let it sit for 5 or 10 years?

#9 x 1-3/4” corks from Lafitte, not the highest quality they offer, but a couple grades down from there. Don’t suspect they’ll have any issues with aging time, bottles stored on their sides in the cellar at 55F and 70% RH, they should last longer than the wine.

I work pretty hard at extraction with my reds, these got cold soaked, LallzymeEX, fermentation temps in the upper 80’s for a day, multiple vigorous punch downs per day, didn’t press til nearly dry, pretty good pressing effort. My reds all seem to be well extracted, maybe too much so, particularly with respect to tannins. Went a little lighter on the 17’s, they’re already more approachable. Considering ratcheting back even more on the 18’s, maybe experimenting with some cooler fermentation temps and some whole berry fermentation. What a sport, once you think you understand how the game is played, the more you realize how flexible the rules are.......

 

[cgallamo]

View attachment 46820
I work pretty hard at extraction with my reds.....

I know you do John - I pretty much learned from you and this thread how to get the extraction going for my Rattlesnake Hills Cab blend. I've also been going with longer cooler ferments to get more fruit. I really liked the fruit flavors in the Grenache I just did and The ferment never got over 80 degrees. The aromas are amazing. Your last sentence is so true. The more experience I get, the more I feel like there is more I don't know. But that's helps keep my interest.

Why do you think the wine won't last? Or maybe I misunderstand?

 

[gitmo234]

I'm dying for some Tempranillo. Not available anywhere yet. I'm in that space after putting a wine into MLF and having nothing to do. So I'm antsy. Ordered some Mourvedre from wine grapes direct

 

[cgallamo]

I'm dying for some Tempranillo. Not available anywhere yet. I'm in that space after putting a wine into MLF and having nothing to do. So I'm antsy. Ordered some Mourvedre from wine grapes direct

I have done that exact Mourvedre a couple of times. I actually purchased the tote (pictured) - which I drained about 12 gallons from for a Rose, and left the skins on for a bigger red. I'm hoping it blends well with the Syrah and Grenache in a Chateau du Beaucastle style (GSM heavy on the M). let me know how it turns out.

 

[gitmo234]

Will do. It should be arriving saturday. I was just emailed an hour or so ago.

 

[Johnd]

Why do you think the wine won't last? Or maybe I misunderstand?

LOL, think I’ll drink it for sure in less time than the cork will last!!

 

[cgallamo]

LOL, think I’ll drink it for sure in less time than the cork will last!!

I always think the wine will last longer than it does. Had people over last weekend and knocked out a case of chenin blanc/viogner. I guess that's the best way for it to go.

 

[Johnd]

Update: Had a Tempranillo / Merlot 50/50 blended at pressing (mentioned in post 40). It’s been in 6 gallon glass since pressing, racked a couple of times, and has been sitting with 2 M+ French Wine Stix for many months, never seen a barrel. It has a nice aroma, good oak, flavors that really haven’t developed yet, and it’s still real tight and tannic. Monkeyed around with the acid in some samples a bit, ultimately ended up bottling it without changing the batch. I’ll be able to compare this wine to the Tempranillo and Merlot which did go through the barrels, just to see how the development differs, though I already know that the Merlot in the barrel is substantially more developed. Probably will not get this blend into the drinking rotation for several years.

Been almost two months since bottling, had a scheduled tasting of this blend last night just to get an idea of where it's starting from. It was pretty darn good, we drank the whole bottle. It'll definitely be a while before it mellows, kinda kicking myself for not running it through a barrel to round and smooth it our a bit before bottling, but was very please with it, all things considered. The fruit has really started to come together, nice jammy flavors and a bit of black pepper spice, tannins are still a little on the noticeable side and a smidge of bitterness in the finish, but that'll dissipate over time. We'll give it another whirl in October.........

 

[stickman]

@Johnd based on your description, it sounds like you'll be in for a nice ride, some of these wines with a bit of tannin can take time, but often end up better than wines that are completely supple right out of the gate. You'll be rediscovering this wine for years to come, that is if you don't drink it before then.

 

[ceeaton]

@Johnd based on your description, it sounds like you'll be in for a nice ride, some of these wines with a bit of tannin can take time, but often end up better than wines that are completely supple right out of the gate. You'll be rediscovering this wine for years to come, that is if you don't drink it before then.

Or if he doesn't send me a case of it !

 

[johndghost]

@Johnd based on your description, it sounds like you'll be in for a nice ride, some of these wines with a bit of tannin can take time, but often end up better than wines that are completely supple right out of the gate. You'll be rediscovering this wine for years to come, that is if you don't drink it before then.

I’m pretty solid on preservation, 31 bottles to start with, and still have 30 left. I’ve got plenty to keep me happy while the young stuff grows up.

 

[johndghost]

Or if he doesn't send me a case of it !

Stranger things have happened for sure! Maybe like a 6 pack??

 

[Johnd]

Racked one of the '16 cabs out of the 40 L Vadai yesterday and finally got the last of the 16 Spaniards in barrel, the Tempranillo. Even though it's just been in glass, it's starting to come around a bit and will stay in the barrel til winter this year. The barrel is pretty much neutral, so i dropped four Wine Stix in there, one M+ French, three M+ American along with a dose of sulfite. Have the extra wine from the two carboys in bottles to be used for topping during the barrel time. Feeling like things are finally catching up, don't have nearly so much wine sitting around waiting on barrels.

 

[Johnd]

7/14/18 is the 6 month “out of barrel” date on the Montsant Merlot in barrels 2 & 4. When I rack them out, I only have one carboy of wine waiting for barrel time, the ‘17 Cab press wine. I’m going to have an empty 6 gallon barrel, haven’t really decided what to do with it yet, but I’ve got two more due to get emptied in October, followed by the 12 gallon barrel. I’ll be down to just the 30 gallon French and the one 6 gallon I’ll put the Cab press in, which will come out in January. Been working toward this day for years!!

 

[Johnd]

Wrapping this thread up tonight, having bottled the partial carboy (27 bottles) a few days ago, bottled the remaining full carboy today (31 bottles), 58 bottles in all.

The GrapeMasters Tempranillo must arrived on 1/6/17, thawed, adjusted, and BM 4x4 was pitched on 1/8/17. BRIX was adjusted from 23 to 24 with sugar; pH from 3.95 to 3.56, and TA from 4.8 to 6.4 with 70g tartaric just prior to adding yeast. VP 41 added on 1/11/17, racked and pressed on 1/15/17, MLF completed shortly afterwards.

Carboys moved to the wine room at 55F on 2/11/17, where they stayed (with two additional rackings) until April of 2018. In April, the wine went into a neutral 11 +/- gallon Vadai with 4 Wine Stix, one French, three American. Final numbers on the wine, pH 3.70, and TA 7.0.

Wine tastes great, bright with lots of red and black fruit, hint of tobacco, and it has a really long finish. Didn’t do any bench trials, no desire to raise the TA above 7.0. It’s two years old now, bottles will get labeled soon and the wine will go into the drinking rotation after it settles down a bit.

And that’s a wrap!! I’ll definitely do some Grapemasters fruit again, it turned out great!

 

[CDrew]

I like Tempranillo generally and it's definitely on my short list for next year. Glad yours turned out so well. It would have been interesting to see how a no oak sample would taste compared to the barreled and oaked final version.

When you say the barrel was neutral, is that by your taste, or by time, or by volume of wine that has been through it? Just curious how this is determined.

 

[Johnd]

I like Tempranillo generally and it's definitely on my short list for next year. Glad yours turned out so well. It would have been interesting to see how a no oak sample would taste compared to the barreled and oaked final version.

When you say the barrel was neutral, is that by your taste, or by time, or by volume of wine that has been through it? Just curious how this is determined.

Pretty much by all of the above. Barrel was everal years old, saw many wines, and had ceased imparting ant oaky goodness.

I did have a gallon of Tempranillo that didn’t see the barrel, but it was blended back into the barrel wine when it came out of the barrel. Sadly, I didn’t even taste it.