WineXpert Top Kits vs. $25 Commercial Wine

[Mharris335]

I have done 10 kits and all have been big kits. All of them have
been 16 lit or above. I started my fisrt kit 1 year ago.
The other ten kits have been made about a month apart. My
question is, "When will these be as good at Commercial Wine"?
First one was a WE New Zealand Marlborough Sauvignon Blanc (one year
old) It still is shut down with little of anything. Second
was CC Red mount Cab 11 months old. 3rd WE Washington Columbia
Valley Cabernet Franc/Merlot 10 months old, 4th WE Symphony 9 months
old. 5th CC Lodi Old Vines Zinfandel 8 months. 6th WE
Yamhill Pinot Gris 9 months old.



All the kits were so good at bottleing time 3 months old, with lots of
fruit. Now eveyone I open is shut down with little fruit, even
the white kits. I don't want to buy more kits if this is what I
get for the money. I know most are still young, but I what to
know when they will open up again. These whites should be close I
would hope, but how long for the reds. Everyone keeps saying that
the high end kits are as good as $25 commercial wines. I have not
seen it so far.

 

[Wade E]

I believe the bigger kits usually take more then 1 year and some could take more like almost 2. Thats just my opinion.

 

[smurfe]

I have found it has taken about a year and a half to two years for the reds for me. The whites have all been ready and as good as any commercial wine at a year or so. Most of my kits are the WE Selection, Estate Series, or Limited Edition kits.

 

[Mharris335]

Thank you both. I will keep waiting until the one year with whites and two with the reds.

 

[Jack on Rainy]

Mark,
I have about the same experience. I started 13 months ago and just started my 19th kit last night. I started with WE kits and havemade816L kits, 2 white and 6 red; then started to be interested in MM last summerwith 8All Juice, Masters Edition,or Meglioli kits, 3 whites and 5 reds; and the rest are RJS or CC kits - all 16-18 Liters. My hope was to be able to make a wine equal to a 10-12$ bottle of commercial.


Now, a year into this experiment, I find my whites with 8-13 months of time are better than I had hoped. I'm actually quite encouraged with them. The reds are another matter. The WE kits I started with - two are now 1 yr - are adisappointment. The Mosti's are another matter altogether. None of them have enough age yet but tastings periodically have me quite hopeful. And fruit has not been lacking in them. I think I will stay with the Mosti line for all wine makingthis year unless I find one of these WE kits coming around. We'll see.


One thing I think is very important in these red kit wines is that you give them much more time to breathe than commercial. Haven't tasted one that was drinkable immediately after opening.


Thanks for starting this thread. I hope others will sign on with their experiences too.Edited by: Jack on Rainy

 

[Mharris335]

Jack thank you so much. I just started a Mosti also. I was
thinking of getting the April special Mosti frozen and see how I like
them. I will not get another WE unless they get alot
better. My WE whites are still shut down even at 4-8 months
now. I did talk to WE corp. and they said that the WE New Zealand
Marlborough Sauvignon Blanc shuts down between 9-18 months, but will
come back after that. I do like this hobby, but also want some
good wine from it or my wife is going to say stop.



What whites did you make that you are drinking at 9 months?

Mark

 

[Jack on Rainy]

Mark,
1.WE IE French Chard 13 months is now almost gone. I'd make this again.
2. WE LE Verdeho 12 months is ready and is wine. I just don't care for that wine as much as Chard. Summer drinker.
3. MM AJ Chardillon. 9 months. Tastes in Jan indicate this is the best of the three. Not much of it will survive summer!


I've also got a Trebbiano and a Sav Blanc, both MM AJ, going. Both were recommended by George who has a sense of what I'd like. Both have promise for this summer or fall.


On the red side, The Chianti, Rojo Encnantando, and Gran Barolo, all MM AJ, show promise as they get some age.


As to frozen, I will wait until this fall as I have committments in May which will keep me from properly attending to that early, but I think it is a very appealing idea so will certainly do some.


Please keep us up on your progress. Sounds like we have similar tastes.

 

[TankCa]

Good thread, I'm very interested in hearing about others experiences. I too began this hobby about 13 months ago and have done8 kits and a 6 gal batchfrom fresh grapes (Merlot)out of my small backyard vineyard.


My first 2 kits were a WE Lodi Old Vine Zin and WE Crushendo SuperTuscan. In September I did 6 gals from fresh grapes and followed that with a WE Crushendo Shiriz, MM Bodega Port, MM Megloli Rojo Intensio, MM Meglioli Barolo, MM Meglioli Rojo Grande and have a WE Selection Viginior in secondary right now(my first white).


The WE Zin (myfirst batch)had a distinct jolly rancher taste and was ratherweak up until just recently. It'snow a year old and appearsto have lost some of the JR taste and has more structure but nothing close to a $15 zin. I'm hoping it will continue to improve. The WE SuperTuscan as very harsh with little characterlast time I tasted it but that was 3 months ago. It is only about8 months old now so I still holdout hope it will improve.


The Merlot from my fresh grapesis much different,very nice flavor but still needs more time. Needs more oak but that is easy to correct.


However, I just tasted the MM Port yesterday and it was fantastic and is only a couple months old (highly recommended if you like port). My wife couldn't believe I made it. The Meglioli's also have a completely different taste and aromaat such a young age. Very promising.


I hear the Viginior is an early drinker so I'm hoping that along with the Port will keep the wife happy and let me continue.


I really enjoy this hobby but will be disappointed if I can't make wine I really enjoy and compares favorably to mid priced commercial wine. I'm not expecting to make an Estate Chateau Montelena (love that wine) but hope I can make a decent Mondavi Oakville (or just under that).


Steve T.



Edited by: TankCa

 

[Mharris335]

STeve and Jack!! It's good to know that all of your wine taste
like mine at this stage, so I will keep going and just wait. I
will slow down on the amount of wine kits I buy until I know if I will
like the kits as much as commercial ones. I also think I will
stick to CC and Mosti to see if I like them better.

Mark

 

[Jack on Rainy]

Mark/steve,
I forgot to add one thing in my post about our successful whites. We used the battonage technique on the Chardillon (search this forum for battonage and you will find several interesting posts. PeterZ has an experiment going with that technique. His posts are particularly informative and it was with his guidanceI tried it on that kit. I'll do that again with a Chard.)
I also would like to know why you kept CC kitson your radarfor this year. I've got one going but don't know that it will be different than the WE.

 

[Mharris335]

Mark/steve,
I forgot to add one thing in my post about our successful whites.
We used the battonage technique on the Chardillon (search this forum
for battonage and you will find several interesting posts. PeterZ has
an experiment going with that technique. His posts are particularly
informative and it was with his guidanceI tried it on that kit.
I'll do that again with a Chard.)
I also would like to know why you kept CC kitson your
radarfor this year. I've got one going but don't know that it
will be different than the WE.

I have heard really good things about the CC kits. Plus
they have Washington wine kitst hat I want. They have both Red
Mountian Cab and Syrah. Other forum's have alot of
people that love the Cab from Red Mont and the Syrah is a LE this
year. Every commercial wine I taste from there is good to great.




Mark

 

[Mharris335]

Ok, I now like this hobby a lot more. I did the decant thing for
28 hours on my WE Yamhill Pinot Gris 9 months old. It was every
bit as good as any commercial Pinot Gris I had from Oregon in the
$10-$15 range. My wife was loving it and I could not believe how
good it was, just letting it sit over night. We even drank it warm,
which we never do with white wine. I need to try this with a red
and see how it taste.

 

[smurfe]

I decant all of my reds as well. Home made as well as store bought. makes a world of difference on any wine. I do notice that if I chill the whites too cool (refrigerator temps)it has a sulfury/bitter after taste.

 

[Wade E]

Chilling any wine will close up the bouquet.
Edited by: wade

 

[JimCook]

For a more detailed look at the relationship of temperature and wine and when to chill more or less depending on the characteristics of a wine, check out <a href="http://www.thewinemerchantinc.com/educational/temperature.html" target="_blank">http://www.thewinemerchantinc.com/educational/temperature.html


</A>It is one of several educational sources that describes the relationship of molecular weight, volatility, and individual wine traits in relation to temperature.


- Jim

 

[SmokinDawg]

This is a good thread and I learned two new things, thanks Jim for the link I have been serving my whites too cold for a long time, and a long standing arguement betwixt my brother and I about putting reds in the fridge for an hour will finally be settled

. Also thanks for the heads up about battonage, I will have to try that with my next white.

 

[unaFORDable]

"When will these be as good at Commercial Wine"? CC Lodi Old Vines Zinfandel 8 months.
Now eveyone I open is shut down with little fruit, but I what to know when they will open up again. but how long for the reds. Everyone keeps saying that the high end kits are as good as $25 commercial wines. I have not seen it so far.

I pulled up this older post because I'm making a CC Lodi Old Vine Zin and was wondering if you'd tasted your's lately or any new comments on how it was doing???


thanks, TinaLouise

 

[uavwmn]

Mark, I just bottled the CC Red Mountain Cab.

Looking forward to enjoying it next winter.

 

[Wade E]

I had a bottle of Jobes last year and it was delish!

 

[Jim M]

For a more detailed look at the relationship of temperature and wine and when to chill more or less depending on the characteristics of a wine, check out <a href="http://www.thewinemerchantinc.com/educational/temperature.html" target="_blank">http://www.thewinemerchantinc.com/educational/temperature.html
</a>http://www.thewinemerchantinc.com/educational/temperature.html
It is one of several educational sources that describes the relationship of molecular weight, volatility, and individual wine traits in relation to temperature.


- Jim

This link appears to be dead, does anyone have a copy of the article??

Thanks - Jim