Water?

[Scooter68]

Filtered, Spring or Tap all fine. If using tap and you are really concerned put it in a bucket covered overnight to reduce city addted chemicals (OR filteri it yourself) The only water I would not use is water you would not normally drink yourself. Do you commonly drink distilled water? MOST folks don't so that would be the guidance I would give.

 

[Gilmango]

I always used tap water, till I started doing Finer Wine Kits, which emphasized using distilled water. Trouble was the local store I went to only had spring water, so I bought that for my first few FWKs. Spring water was mentioned as the 'next best thing' in a FWK video I think.

But lately I have just gone back to tap on all wine kits (nearly all of which are FWKs). However, I always add enough kmeta (about a 1/4 of a campden tablets worth will do 5 gallons, needs at least 15 minutes) to the tap water, and give it some time to work, to remove the chloramines. I've been doing it in my beer for years now, but had neglected it in my first wine kits. Most tap water has those nasties so please pay attention, it is not something you can taste.

citation (you can find others):
Campden tablets are very effective in removing chlorine and chloramine. This is a well understood chemical reaction that is frequently used in wastewater treatment. As mentioned, dosing at a rate of about 1 tablet per 20 gallons will result in consuming up to 3 ppm chlorine or chloramine.

https://www.homebrewersassociation.org/forum/index.php?topic=11392.15

 

[David Violante]

I just use straight tap water but it comes from a well. We put a whole house sediment filter on years ago, and a UV system too. There is quite a bit of iron in the water and when we first bought the house it came with a water softener. When it gave up a few years later we never replaced it and haven’t really looked back either.

I’m super young at this and am only at about 50 gallons in but the wine I’m making tastes pretty good using well water. It has progressively improved, but I attribute that to help from this forum and not the water... LOL

Hmmm… I’ve always loved the water from my parent’s home, it’s well water also. It has always tasted ‘sweeter’ to me. I just received a FWK Zin, I think I’ll make it with their water and see if I can tell a difference.

 

[BigDaveK]

Well, lucky me I have a gallon of distilled water. And I tasted it. It tastes..."off"...like it's missing something. It would be my absolute last choice to drink on a hot summer day.

So my vote goes to use whatever tastes good to you.

 

[VinesnBines]

Water makes a huge difference in the taste of coffee, beer and distilled spirts so I assume it would with wine as well. The only reason there are not articles that address the difference in wine is that most commercial wineries don't add water to the grapes for processing.

My homebrew beer tastes different depending on the tap water I use (hard vs soft). A certain spirit facility in Scotland is the only one to use water from a peaty burn and they tout that in advertising.

A lot to say I'm so darn cheap, I only use tap water. Though I would not use the water from my sister's well in the OBX. I got to see it unfiltered and untreated. Good Lord!

Since rain water waters my grapes, the water does make a difference in terroir.

 

[bstnh1]

The FWK instruction books says to use distilled water. That's the only place I have seen that recommendation. I use bottled water and have been satisfied with the results. We have well water with a good amount of iron and manganese in it that's taken care of with a softener. It tastes fine, but I just don't trust it for making wine.

 

[Rocky]

The only water I would not use is water you would not normally drink yourself. Do you commonly drink distilled water? MOST folks don't so that would be the guidance I would give.

Do most folks "normally drink" sour milk? Probably not on purpose, but many use it in cooking and baking.

Again, and for the last time, we are not talking about the water we drink; we are discussing the water we use in making wine. These are two distinct issues and only very loosely related because there is a general belief that if the water one uses to make wine is "drinkable," it is "usable" (not preferrable, recommended, desired, required, etc.). Personally, I consider this a minimum criterion. If I were talking about what water I would like to drink, I would likely choose spring water, first, purified water, second and tap water (assuming it is a good quality such as we enjoy here in central Ohio), third.

Lastly, the idea that distilled water does not have all that yeast desires is a new one on me. I agree that it does not contain sugar, if that is what is meant. As far as I know, that is all that the yeast cells need, other than an acceptable temperature in which to work.

In any case, no one has offered a scientifically supported reason to me as to why I should not use distilled water and I will continue to do so. I recommend that others follow whatever path they deem to be correct.

 

[bstnh1]

Do most folks "normally drink" sour milk? Probably not on purpose, but many use it in cooking and baking.

Again, and for the last time, we are not talking about the water we drink; we are discussing the water we use in making wine. These are two distinct issues and only very loosely related because there is a general belief that if the water one uses to make wine is "drinkable," it is "usable" (not preferrable, recommended, desired, required, etc.). Personally, I consider this a minimum criterion. If I were talking about what water I would like to drink, I would likely choose spring water, first, purified water, second and tap water (assuming it is a good quality such as we enjoy here in central Ohio), third.

Lastly, the idea that distilled water does not have all that yeast desires is a new one on me. I agree that it does not contain sugar, if that is what is meant. As far as I know, that is all that the yeast cells need, other than an acceptable temperature in which to work.

In any case, no one has offered a scientifically supported reason to me as to why I should not use distilled water and I will continue to do so.

Do most folks "normally drink" sour milk? Probably not on purpose, but many use it in cooking and baking.

Again, and for the last time, we are not talking about the water we drink; we are discussing the water we use in making wine. These are two distinct issues and only very loosely related because there is a general belief that if the water one uses to make wine is "drinkable," it is "usable" (not preferrable, recommended, desired, required, etc.). Personally, I consider this a minimum criterion. If I were talking about what water I would like to drink, I would likely choose spring water, first, purified water, second and tap water (assuming it is a good quality such as we enjoy here in central Ohio), third.

Lastly, the idea that distilled water does not have all that yeast desires is a new one on me. I agree that it does not contain sugar, if that is what is meant. As far as I know, that is all that the yeast cells need, other than an acceptable temperature in which to work.

In any case, no one has offered a scientifically supported reason to me as to why I should not use distilled water and I will continue to do so. I recommend that others follow whatever path they deem to be correct.

There are lots of discussions about this on the net. Here's a sample.

The first being distilled water has had all of the excess or "free" oxygen removed from it. The second reason is that distilled water has no minerals either. Both of these conditions are direct results of the distilling process and both conditions have inhibiting effects on a fermentation.

 

[Rocky]

There are lots of discussions about this on the net. Here's a sample.

The first being distilled water has had all of the excess or "free" oxygen removed from it. The second reason is that distilled water has no minerals either. Both of these conditions are direct results of the distilling process and both conditions have inhibiting effects on a fermentation.

Brian, first may I say that to me, there is no less reliable source of reliable scientific information than the internet. Virtually anyone can post anything they please without scrutiny.

Secondly, if distilled water inhibits fermentation, how then have I been able to ferment virtually every batch I make to an SG of 0.992-0.994 when all I use is distilled water and no additives e.g., DAP? I should add that I was making 125 to 150 gallons per year between 2010 and 2020. Am I just lucky?

 

[Scooter68]

Brian, first may I say that to me, there is no less reliable source of reliable scientific information than the internet. Virtually anyone can post anything they please without scrutiny.

This site is on "the internet" therefore is it unreliable by your definition.

Certainly use what you want but before you use a broad general comment like you did, you might want to think about the millions of pretty well researched scientific document posted on the internet. Perhaps that was not your intent but it was what you said.

There have been numerous discussions on this site and others about the use of distilled water and a number of the people posting comments have done some pretty decent research.

 

[Raptor99]

The internet has lots of false and misguided information, as well as first class scientific papers. It is important to evaluate the content of each article and consider the qualifications of the writer.

Here is an article discussing the various types of water used for making wine: Great Wine: It's All About the Water

I don't completely agree, because in some cases tap water or well water might be very good for making wine. It depends on the quality of the water.

I have seen several arguments against using distilled water:

1. The distilled water has all the oxygen driven out.
This is easily remedied by vigorous stirring.

2. Distilled water increases the osmotic pressure on the yeast cells, potentially causing damage.
This makes sense. Here is a scientific study on this question: Sequence of occurring damages in yeast plasma membrane during dehydration and rehydration: Mechanisms of cell death But when making wine, there are lots of things dissolved in the water, including sugar, so I don't think that the osmotic pressure would be much different with distilled vs. tap water.

3. Distilled water by definition does not contain the minerals necessary for healthy yeast growth.
This is true. Yeast need potassium and magnesium, along with other minerals. How significant this is depends on what percentage of your wine is distilled water and what other ingredients you add. The fruit juice will contribute some minerals. Depending on what sort of yeast nutrient you use, it might contribute necessary minerals. (DAP or "yeast nutrient" probably does not provide the necessary minerals.). Yeast need far more than just sugar and nitrogen to reproduce.

Expert mead makers pay attention to the minerals present in the water. Here is an article by highly respected mead maker Dr. Bray Denard: Denard Brewing Here is an article about a mead experiment that includes minerals present in the water: Session Mead Recipes

 

[G259]

I get 1/2 gallons from the $ store, or I use bottled spring if needed.

 

[Scooter68]

....3. Distilled water by definition does not contain the minerals necessary for healthy yeast growth.....

Not part of the topic but - While we certainly can survive drinking distilled water, but not only is the taste often considered by people as "off" but it's also missing minerals our body needs. For our wine, as mentioned yeast may work with just the normal yeast additives many people use, the end taste may be changed as well.

 

[Old Corker]

Not part of the topic but

@Scooter68 I can’t believe you went off topic on this. Back on topic. I’m pretty much aligned with @Rocky on this. At least the what water to use part of the thread. I use distilled because my other choice is tap where I’d have to do something about the chlorine. Or some other purchased product. FWK recommends distilled so it’s not a rule of thumb but rather a recommendation from the kit maker. Good enough for me.

 

[Rocky]

Clearly, I am not going to change anyone's mind on the use of distilled water in reconstituting wine kits and such. That was not my intent in the first place. I was just stating what (and why) I do, have done (for 15 years and just less than 2000 gallons) and will continue to do unless and until someone can convince me otherwise.

I am about to start a quadruple batch of a Zinfandel/Muscat blend (4 Finer Wine Kits) and I have already purchase 15 gallons of distilled water for the effort.

 

[bstnh1]

Clearly, I am not going to change anyone's mind on the use of distilled water in reconstituting wine kits and such. That was not my intent in the first place. I was just stating what (and why) I do, have done (for 15 years and just less than 2000 gallons) and will continue to do unless and until someone can convince me otherwise.

I am about to start a quadruple batch of a Zinfandel/Muscat blend (4 Finer Wine Kits) and I have already purchase 15 gallons of distilled water for the effort.

Just out of curiosity ..... have you ever done two identical batches, one using spring water and the other using distilled water and compared the results?

 

[stickman]

There shouldn't be anything wrong with reconstituting a kit with distilled water, plenty of minerals and nutrients will be present, and even more will be present with kits that have nutrient packs to be added. I think the main argument against distilled water is when re-hydrating yeast, so if using distilled water for re-hydrating yeast, it would be best to use some type of re-hydration nutrient/protection such as Goferm.

 

[CSkyhawk72]

I use bottled spring water. Tap water in my neck of the woods is treated with fluoride, which I read somewhere is bad for winemaking.

 

[Scooter68]

I use bottled spring water. Tap water in my neck of the woods is treated with fluoride, which I read somewhere is bad for winemaking.

Depending on how much water you use you might looking into a home water filter that can remove the fluoride. My wife won't drink or cook with ANY tap water for the same reason so we invested in a home gravity run filter that has the ability to remove chlorine and fluoride. I figured the cost of our buying spring water from Wally World over buying the filter and in less than a year it paid for itself and the filters. After the initial purchase the savings leaped as we just buy the filters. I'll list the brand only for comparison sake. BUT be sure to buy the real deal as there are apparently people selling look alike filters for this brand an d those copycat replacement filters are not lasting near as long. Berkey is the name and they have several sizes - we bought directly and got the 2 1/2 gallon unit, stand, stainless steal valve and the fluoride filter upgrades. Thad's been almost two years now and we have had no problems. You do have to rinse/prime the filters and brush clean the carbon filters periodically. Again this is just one brand and I imagine there are others out there and I'm n ot "endorsing" them.. We didn't want a whole house filter system.