Barrel questions

[codeman]

Several questions.

1. You can use a barrel to evaporate water (and alcohol) out of the wine, is this good for whites too?
Ex. If there was a heavy rain just before harvest or you added too much to a concentrate.

2. If you use a barrel for reds first then once it's neutral you decide to do whites (viognier for example), how many batches will the lingering red 'stain' the white? (No MLF in said barrel)

3. How long is a barrel 'good' for? Not specifically oak flavoring but good just to use as a concentrator.

4. Are the only ways of storing a non used barrel to fill it with kmeta water or burn sulfur inside? How often does the sulfur need to be redone? (A barrel that has been used in the past but not at the moment)

5. Buying neutral wine barrels: if MLF has been done before, would high sulfite levels be enough to keep it at bay? And likely using lyzosym (spelling?)

 

[stickman]

These are all loaded questions as many factors will influence the answers.

1. White wine will evaporate just like red, though I'm not sure how much water evaporation you are considering or how much oxidation your white wine can take. Most of the published data on evaporation from wine barrels is for standard 225L barrels, so the results would be different depending on barrel size; I would expect greater evaporation from smaller barrels, but also more oxidation. Results also are affected by the humidity and air movement in the barrel room. One PWV article indicated an alcohol level increase from 12.95% to 13.06 during 50 weeks of barrel storage at 74% humidity.

2. I can't make much comment here as I have never been comfortable putting a white wine into a barrel after being used for reds, by the time the barrel is neutral you have to assume MLF is in the wood whether you ran one or not. How many batches the red color will last depends on the length of time the white wine is in contact with the wood as well as how the barrel was stored between batches. Maybe others can provide more comment.

3. Barrels can be used for many years if maintained properly. I have used both American and French oak 30gal barrels for 9 years, adding cubes and staves for flavor and oxygen, before deciding to switch to Flex Tanks. In my experience evaporation didn't stop with barrel age. There is some data that suggests oxygen permeability is reduced with barrel age, but the addition of oak alternatives adds oxygen.

4. There are several detailed procedures published by barrel suppliers etc., most indicate burning sulfur every couple of months. Some wineries use pure so2 gas from a cylinder, but this is not typical for home winemakers.

5. I currently use Lysozyme in red wine after MLF is complete, I then rack and add sulfite as usual. Lysozyme activity is reduced over time, so depending on aging time, you still need so2. It is possible to minimize MLF with so2 based on PH and regular racking maintaining so2. Problems occur when aging on unstirred lees as these provide microbial nutrients and protection from sulfite.

 

[codeman]

Can you prevent a white from browning by using very high sulfite levels?

 

[stickman]

What do you mean by very high sulfite levels?

 

[codeman]

So2 levels around 100 ppm. Only while in the barrel.
I have an SC300 so I can test for this.

 

[stickman]

Without knowing what your objective is, the type of wine, the PH, conditions of fermentation, was sulfite used pre fermentation, the age of the wine going into the barrel, are transfers conducted with inert gas or with air exposure, the size of the barrel, will lees be present, are you stirring periodically, how long you intend to age in barrel and at what temperature, without this type of information it is difficult to provide much input. Winemaking decisions at any stage have to be based on an understanding of the complete process from start to finish.

If you have a measurement device then you probably already understand that the amount you use is generally based on PH. 100ppm free sounds high for the typical white wine PH and I would be thinking about how to eliminate the root cause for such sulfite requirements. I typically try to adapt the winemaking procedures to use the least amount of sulfite necessary to get the job done.

 

[codeman]

So are you saying whites will brown in a barrel even if they have veru high sulfite levels?

(The high sulfite levels are ONLY to prevent browning during barrel aging.)

 

[stickman]

I didn't say anything about browning, but at the end of the day the goal is for the wine to be pleasant to drink.