Beginner Plum Wine

[winechef]

There are people that dry peach, nectarine, apricot and plum seeds and eat the insides, I personally wouldn't.

as for leaving them in during wine making, I definitely remove them, I've left cherry seeds in before and was a big difference in flavor from cherries I pitted.

using organic pesticide free, is definitely more important than pitting the fruit, as long as you aren't grinding the seeds shouldn't have huge impact on health, but even if there's a .001 percent chance of someone having a bad experience from drinking my wine.

 

[Rice_Guy]

Any cyanide from plum pits is unlikely to kill you. There is a lethal dose one has to consume.
There is another potential issue, at low level cherry pits are said to improve flavor. It provides an almond extract like flavor. My observation making cherry with pits in the primary is that at two years age bitter flavors like choke cherry appear.

All in all plum seeds are easy to remove so why let them in.

 

[DrGriz]

I don’t think a cyanide detector would work as the pits have amygdalin which metabolizes to cyanide. I think the yeast act as a poison detector, if the yeast die you might have cyanide as cyanide will kill yeast.

At fairly low concentrations, cyanide will prevent fermentation in yeast. That would be the first clue!

https://academic.oup.com/femsyr/article/15/8/fov083/2467692

 

[GreatNorthernLlama]

Ok, coming back to the plum wine lol. I hope to start my must this weekend. I wanted to share my game plan. This is open for comment/criticism (please, save me now instead of later).

1 Gallon starting attempt of plum wine
Day 1 (Initial Mix of Must)
SANITIZE ALL THE THINGS

Mix Ingredients
3.5 to 4 pounds fresh or frozen fruit put into mesh bag (mashed?)
1 Campden Tablets crushed (better to use k-meta?)
1/2 tsp yeast nutrient
1/2 tsp Acid Blend
1/2 tsp wine tannin
1/2 Tsp Pectic Enzyme

Boil (just shy of actually boiling) together 2 lbs Sugar to 4 cups water for Simple Syrup. Let cool and add to Primary Fermentation Bucket. (Why did he add extra water? How much water was added?)

Take initial SG reading, and add water to find potential alcohol between 10-15%


Day 2
Stir!
Add packet wine Yeast
Stir

Days 3 - end fermentation

Stir daily

The attached photos show my available kit. Both 5 and 6-gallon car boys / primary fermentation buckets, as well as single-gallon jugs. I'm wondering about the following questions:
1. From reading through the forums, it sounds like everyone universally prefers k-meta over Campden Tablets (assuming I can get k-meta at my local retailer)?
2. I've read mixed things on initial fermentation. I've seen a few comments mentioning a damp towel only over the fermentation buckets saying O2 is your friend, while the vast majority seal buckets.
3. I'm mixed between starting with a small single-gallon batch, but losing efficiency in racking, to just doing a full 5-gallon batch but risking wasting more fruit if it doesn't work out. Thoughts?
4. Is it better to mash my fruit once it's thawed out, or leave it cubed up?
5. As an absolute beginner, is bentonite or other clearing agents a good idea?

 

[DrGriz]

I vote MASH!

 

[Raptor99]

1. From reading through the forums, it sounds like everyone universally prefers k-meta over Campden Tablets (assuming I can get k-meta at my local retailer)?

Campden tablets are fine. Later on, when racking, Kmeta is helpful because you can measure out the exact amount that you want to add. I started with Campden tablets before I got a small gram scale.

2. I've read mixed things on initial fermentation. I've seen a few comments mentioning a damp towel only over the fermentation buckets saying O2 is your friend, while the vast majority seal buckets.

Many of us on this forum prefer a bucket for primary fermentation. No need to seal it. You need to stir and push down the fruit cap twice a day.

3. I'm mixed between starting with a small single-gallon batch, but losing efficiency in racking, to just doing a full 5-gallon batch but risking wasting more fruit if it doesn't work out. Thoughts?

I started with 1-gal. batches, but now I mostly do larger batches for the reasons you mention. You will lose some volume when racking, so if you want to end up with 1 gallon for some bulk aging, you need to start with at least 1.5 gals. in your primary bucket. Scale up the fruit accordingly. For 1.5 gallons you might want to use 7-8 lbs. of plums.

4. Is it better to mash my fruit once it's thawed out, or leave it cubed up?

Mash it!

5. As an absolute beginner, is bentonite or other clearing agents a good idea?

You don't need it at this point. If it doesn't clear after several months of bulk aging, you can add clearing agents then. I know that some on this forum add bentonite in the primary, but many of us do not. There's not just one way to do things.

 

[Ohio Bob]

The fruit should be frozen ahead of time. This breaks down the cell walls and extracts more juice. So mashing helps do the same thing, best to do both.

Kmeta is easier to work with, saves having to crush/grind individual tablets. Also easier to measure out, or weigh out if you want to be super precise, if you’re dosing 1g, 3g, or 5g. I don’t sweat over being more precise than my 1/8tsp can provide with an eyeball measurement.

On day 1, also make your yeast starter. Search for yeast starter on this site for advice, or see @winemaker81 for his site. A yeast starter greatly increases the yeast colony size and overwhelm any wild yeast or bacteria.

From your initial SG, down to SG of 1.020, the yeast needs oxygen, so a tightly snapped lid prevents oxygen from getting in. Below 1.020 CO2 is being generated, the yeast is no longer replicating, just grinding out that little bit more of alcohol. Oxygen is now your enemy, so snap the lid down at this point.

Bentonite, or any fining agent, aren’t usually needed if you let the wine clear on its own over time. However, fruit wines tend to be where they find usefulness due to the pectin haze common with fruits.

 

[winemaker81]

Campden is easier to work with in 1 US gallon / 4 liter batches, although it's necessary to grind each tablet to powder. Another method is to dissolve 1/4 tsp K-meta in 5 or 6 Tbsp water, and add 1 Tbsp to each jug. In the fall I have extra jugs of several grapes, and this method works well.

My description of making a yeast starter is here:

https://wine.bkfazekas.com/how-to-make-a-yeast-starter/

 

[GreatNorthernLlama]

Campden is easier to work with in 1 US gallon / 4 liter batches, although it's necessary to grind each tablet to powder. Another method is to dissolve 1/4 tsp K-meta in 5 or 6 Tbsp water, and add 1 Tbsp to each jug. In the fall I have extra jugs of several grapes, and this method works well.

My description of making a yeast starter is here:

https://wine.bkfazekas.com/how-to-make-a-yeast-starter/

Thanks for the tip. This actually reminds me that it was your beginner winemaking process on your site that was the first and possibly only time I've seen someone say to cover the primary fermentation bucket with a towel. Everywhere else I look has a lid with an airlock valve. In a short time I've come to really trust the advice on this forum, but it seems soooo counter to everything else I've seen or read. You keep a towel on throughout all of fermentation (up to 14 days)? How can I tell if fermentation is done if not for watching the "bubbles" in the airlock. Maybe I'm misunderstanding something here.

 

[Ohio Bob]

How can I tell if fermentation is done if not for watching the "bubbles" in the airlock. Maybe I'm misunderstanding something here.

This is where you really need a hydrometer to measure the specific gravity (SG). Juice buckets are adjusted by the vendor to be ready to go (example SG of 1.090). Everything else needs a hydrometer so you can adjust your must to your target.

Secondly, it is highly advisable to put in some yeast nutrient at 1/3 sugar depletion (example at SG of 1.060).

Thirdly, at SG of 1.020 ish, you should snap down the lid and put on an airlock. This keeps oxygen out and CO2 in, which protects the wine. This is where I add malolactic bacteria if I’m doing red wines.

Lastly, you should measure the SG when you think the wine has fermented dry (example SG of 0.998 to 1.000). This lets you know the wine has fully fermented and not stuck. A stuck fermentation is at risk for bacterial infection.

So knowing the SG and knowing how to use a hydrometer is essential for wine making.

 

[winemaker81]

Thanks for the tip. This actually reminds me that it was your beginner winemaking process on your site that was the first and possibly only time I've seen someone say to cover the primary fermentation bucket with a towel. Everywhere else I look has a lid with an airlock valve. In a short time I've come to really trust the advice on this forum, but it seems soooo counter to everything else I've seen or read. You keep a towel on throughout all of fermentation (up to 14 days)? How can I tell if fermentation is done if not for watching the "bubbles" in the airlock. Maybe I'm misunderstanding something here.

It seems that most blogs and videos parrot the major kit vendor instructions. Keep in mind that YOU are the target audience for those instructions -- people like Bob and me and the others who have responded are not.

Kit vendors have a vested interest in repeat business, so the instructions are as simple as possible, and geared towards a beginner who has no experienced help making a good wine on the first try -- and every try. In that light, it's typical for the instructions to say "snap down the lid" because that reduces or eliminates problems, even though it's not the best for the yeast. It's a trade-off, and I actually agree with the kit vendors on that.

But that's not exactly you. YOU have dozens of experienced winemakers on your side. For every person that responds, there are dozens who read the post and don't respond 'cuz someone else has addressed it.

Next topic -- bubbles in an airlock tell you nothing useful. The bubbles may be active fermentation, or degassing, or temperature/barometric changes, or something else. @Ohio Bob was spot on -- use your hydrometer.

And lastly -- I've been making wine for over 40 years, but my method is not static. I pay attention to ideas and developments, and I change things when it is to my advantage. I don't change quickly or easily -- I need to be sure a change is a good choice.

A bit over 3 years ago I made my first FWK, a Barbera. At that time the FWK instructions said to stir daily until the SG hits 1.020, then snap on the lid and leave the wine until Day 14 (from start). The idea is that the ferment will finish by Day 14, the gross lees will drop, and the wine is ready for racking.

I do this now, as it eliminates a racking. Prior to this, I pressed when fermentation was done, racked a week (or so later), and racked again in 3 weeks.

When anyone recommends a course of action, ask "why?". Understanding why someone does what they do will help you decided what you want to do.

 

[Codfish]

Ok, coming back to the plum wine lol. I hope to start my must this weekend. I wanted to share my game plan. This is open for comment/criticism (please, save me now instead of later).

1 Gallon starting attempt of plum wine
Day 1 (Initial Mix of Must)
SANITIZE ALL THE THINGS

Mix Ingredients
3.5 to 4 pounds fresh or frozen fruit put into mesh bag (mashed?)
1 Campden Tablets crushed (better to use k-meta?)
1/2 tsp yeast nutrient
1/2 tsp Acid Blend
1/2 tsp wine tannin
1/2 Tsp Pectic Enzyme

Boil (just shy of actually boiling) together 2 lbs Sugar to 4 cups water for Simple Syrup. Let cool and add to Primary Fermentation Bucket. (Why did he add extra water? How much water was added?)

Take initial SG reading, and add water to find potential alcohol between 10-15%


Day 2
Stir!
Add packet wine Yeast
Stir

Days 3 - end fermentation

Stir daily

The attached photos show my available kit. Both 5 and 6-gallon car boys / primary fermentation buckets, as well as single-gallon jugs. I'm wondering about the following questions:
1. From reading through the forums, it sounds like everyone universally prefers k-meta over Campden Tablets (assuming I can get k-meta at my local retailer)?
2. I've read mixed things on initial fermentation. I've seen a few comments mentioning a damp towel only over the fermentation buckets saying O2 is your friend, while the vast majority seal buckets.
3. I'm mixed between starting with a small single-gallon batch, but losing efficiency in racking, to just doing a full 5-gallon batch but risking wasting more fruit if it doesn't work out. Thoughts?
4. Is it better to mash my fruit once it's thawed out, or leave it cubed up?
5. As an absolute beginner, is bentonite or other clearing agents a good idea?

I noticed you have sodium metabisulfite, IMO potassium metabisulfite is better because you eliminate sodium which is salt.