Bitter wine?

[DirtyJersey]

Hi all, first post on this forum. and had a question

This is my third year of making wine, and each year has given me the ability to learn from what Ive done the previous year.

This year, I did 6 gallons of the following:
petit Sirah, Sangiovese, CaB and Zin. I have a merlot and malbec, still in the carboys.

I did my usual rackings (3 in total) and bottled. From mead to Bottle was exactly 4 months.

I fear this year I may have been too excited to bottle as it is done fermenting, it does have a dominant bitter after taste in all 4 reds.

The only thing I changed from last year was:
1. I added potasium sulfites, just a pinch at each rack ( I battled oxidation last year).
2. I used french oak chips, about 3 oz for a 6 gallon and let it sit for about two months.

So, here is my question:
1. could the oak have increased tannins to make it bitter?
2. Will the "green" wine, settle down in the bottle in a few months and lose the bitterness a bit?

Appreciate any input or suggestions, as I still have to bottle the other 12 of merlot and Malbec that I got two weeks after the others.
__________________

 

[DirtyJersey]

Bitter Wine problem

Hi all, first post on this forum. and had a question

This is my third year of making wine, and each year has given me the ability to learn from what Ive done the previous year.

This year, I did 6 gallons of the following:
petit Sirah, Sangiovese, CaB and Zin. I have a merlot and malbec, still in the carboys.

I did my usual rackings (3 in total) and bottled. From mead to Bottle was exactly 4 months.

I fear this year I may have been too excited to bottle as it is done fermenting, it does have a dominant bitter after taste in all 4 reds.

The only thing I changed from last year was:
1. I added potasium sulfites, just a pinch at each rack ( I battled oxidation last year).
2. I used french oak chips, about 3 oz for a 6 gallon and let it sit for about two months.

So, here is my question:
1. could the oak have increased tannins to make it bitter?
2. Will the "green" wine, settle down in the bottle in a few months and lose the bitterness a bit?

Appreciate any input or suggestions, as I still have to bottle the other 12 of merlot and Malbec that I got two weeks after the others.
__________________

 

[olusteebus]

I don't understand how old the wine is but it sounds like it needs to age a good many months more. Many age their wine in the bottles so you should be ok to let it sit for a few more months and then try it. I oaked a white burgundy once and it was very bitter. It took several months before it smoothed out.

 

[DirtyJersey]

I don't understand how old the wine is but it sounds like it needs to age a good many months more. Many age their wine in the bottles so you should be ok to let it sit for a few more months and then try it. I oaked a white burgundy once and it was very bitter. It took several months before it smoothed out.

Hi, sorry, It was a total of about 4 months in bulk to bottle.

Ive bottled in about the same time before and it turned out great, but was a bit concerned about the bitterness this time.

Depends on what you read, but agree, that bottle aging is ok, vs bulk...hoping the bitterness is just the oak chips that need to settle the tannins down a few more months in bottle.

 

[saddlebronze]

My Syrah is much more bitter this year than last. I haven't even oaked it yet. If it was sour it would be too much acid, but bitterness is tannic acid which is the oak combined with the stems. Time is the only remedy to let the tannic acid crystallize on the cork.

 

[heatherd]

Welcome to the forum.

Now that your wine is bottled, you have maybe two options:
-Give it time to age
-Blend with a non-bitter wine

That's the best I can think of....

Heather

 

[djrockinsteve]

What is the final specific gravity?
You may need to back sweeten a bit.

 

[grapeman]

You provided a few clues to your process, but more would help with getting to the problem. Since you mention bitter and not sour, it is probably tannin related. I would say it may be the oak that is the cause. 3 ounces of chips for two months was probably too much. Chips will give up their tannins much more quickly than cubes would have. Two weeks would have probably been better. When using chips, taste test them often and when you have enough tannin extraction to your taste, rack off them. The bitterness should lessen with time but will take months to do so.

Track sulfites better. You should not be adding "pinches". Get a cheap gram scale and then you know how much you add after determining how much is needed.

This is not meant to be a cure for your wine, but simply a couple thoughts and comments. Keep learning, but record everything so you know what you have done so you can continue to improve.

 

[salcoco]

I believe the bitterness is tannin. if you want to test take a bottle and add gelatin. You can buy unflavored gelatin in the grocery store. this is Knox's gelatin. add about 1-2 grams to 100ml of distilled water before adding to wine.add to warm water slowly and stir often. add to one gallon wine while still warm. pro rate for one bottle. rack off after a few days and taste.

 

[DirtyJersey]

My Syrah is much more bitter this year than last. I haven't even oaked it yet. If it was sour it would be too much acid, but bitterness is tannic acid which is the oak combined with the stems. Time is the only remedy to let the tannic acid crystallize on the cork.

Thanks for the input, and good point, I am bad at laying them on the side to wet the cork, and as you say crystallize on the cork, since it is probably the only porous thing in there.

 

[DirtyJersey]

What is the final specific gravity?
You may need to back sweeten a bit.

Im not sure, to be honest. I did check sugars to assure Fermentation was done, and the are at 0. So, no secondary fermenting should occur.

 

[DirtyJersey]

I believe the bitterness is tannin. if you want to test take a bottle and add gelatin. You can buy unflavored gelatin in the grocery store. this is Knox's gelatin. add about 1-2 grams to 100ml of distilled water before adding to wine.add to warm water slowly and stir often. add to one gallon wine while still warm. pro rate for one bottle. rack off after a few days and taste.

Hi, thanks for the advice, unfortunately, ive already bottled them. I am hoping if it is high tannins, it will settle down after aging a bit in the bottle?

 

[DirtyJersey]

You provided a few clues to your process, but more would help with getting to the problem. Since you mention bitter and not sour, it is probably tannin related. I would say it may be the oak that is the cause. 3 ounces of chips for two months was probably too much. Chips will give up their tannins much more quickly than cubes would have. Two weeks would have probably been better. When using chips, taste test them often and when you have enough tannin extraction to your taste, rack off them. The bitterness should lessen with time but will take months to do so.

Track sulfites better. You should not be adding "pinches". Get a cheap gram scale and then you know how much you add after determining how much is needed.

This is not meant to be a cure for your wine, but simply a couple thoughts and comments. Keep learning, but record everything so you know what you have done so you can continue to improve.

Great advice, and I appreciate it.

A couple follow ups.
1. What is a good way to Taste test while it is in the carboy? Ive been burned in the past with oxidation, and am hesitant to open it up and pull anything out for fear of introducing oxygen and increasing more void between wine and airlock.

2. What would you recommend for sulfites for 5G and 6Gallon car boys? Should this be done every time you rack? Ive gone from never doing it, to possibly doing it too much now.


Thanks again...Im glad I found this forum!

 

[grapeman]

For tasting small amounts of wine while it is in the carboy a wine thief works well. Just rinse it with a bit of k-meta solution if worried about germs on it - shake the thief dry and draw out a small sample. You can replace the wine with a similar wine or just keep some marble in a ziplock bag with some sulfite solution in it. Just add enough marbles to replace the used up volume.

Your best bet would be to test pH of the wine, get a current free S02 reading (via some test) and figure out the volume needed to give the protection level you need. Alternatively and what most small winemakers do would be to add the k-meta after fermentation is complete and then every so often during a racking procedure. A common amount is one quarter teaspoon full (2 grams) per 5-6 gallon batch. Once every 2 to 3 months is normally enough. Remember the more acid in the wine the less k-meta (S02) that is needed to protect the wine.