Black Vs Tart Cherry Juice

[Dave_W]

Did a search, but couldn’t really find this info.

Any quick info on how black cherry vs tart cherry juice does in wine making?

I made a 1 gallon batch of cherry using RW Knudsen “Just Black Cherry” juice and it was great. Now I’ve got another 1 gallon cherry batch going but it’s the tart cherry juice. I’m sure the flavor will be slightly different, but anything else I may expect?

I did notice the juice pH was lower for the tart cherry juice, and the starting SG was also slightly lower. The pH was 3.2 so I did not make any further adjustment in case it would already have adequate bitterness after fermentation.

 

[Hazelemere]

Did a search, but couldn’t really find this info.

Any quick info on how black cherry vs tart cherry juice does in wine making?

I made a 1 gallon batch of cherry using RW Knudsen “Just Black Cherry” juice and it was great. Now I’ve got another 1 gallon cherry batch going but it’s the tart cherry juice. I’m sure the flavor will be slightly different, but anything else I may expect?

I did notice the juice pH was lower for the tart cherry juice, and the starting SG was also slightly lower. The pH was 3.2 so I did not make any further adjustment in case it would already have adequate bitterness after fermentation.

you may need to back sweeten the tart cherry juice with dextrose and then sorbate it.

 

[Dave_W]

you may need to back sweeten the tart cherry juice with dextrose and then sorbate it.

Thank you, so it may take a little more back sweetening to balance the acid compared to black cherry?

 

[Hazelemere]

Thank you, so it may take a little more back sweetening to balance the acid compared to black cherry?

yes

 

[Rice_Guy]

A black cherry:
pH 3.93, 4.38, 4.60; TA 1.06%, ?, 0.52%
Commercial as Bing cherry is primarily citric acid

A pie cherry is primarily malic acid therefore it has sharper flavor notes:
pH 3.24, 3.66, 3.33, 3.64 TA 1.72%, 1.82%, 1.71%
One can shift the numbers by picking after birds have started harvesting

A wild cherry
pH 3.77, 4.71 4.60. TA ?, 1.27%, 1.54%

How it does? Depends on your goal. A pie cherry has a sharp malic flavor. With two years the astringent notes start to show themselves. To me this is traditional cherry as when I was a kid. If I kill the malic as with MLF it doesn’t taste like cherry. A Bing cherry is lower acid and the flavor notes aren’t as crisp. A choke cherry is dominant astringent from day one till about year five. The acid notes are milder, haven’t run any tests to say what the dominant acid is.

 

[Dave_W]

A black cherry:
pH 3.93, 4.38, 4.60; TA 1.06%, ?, 0.52%
Commercial as Bing cherry is primarily citric acid

A pie cherry is primarily malic acid therefore it has sharper flavor notes:
pH 3.24, 3.66, 3.33, 3.64 TA 1.72%, 1.82%, 1.71%
One can shift the numbers by picking after birds have started harvesting

A wild cherry
pH 3.77, 4.71 4.60. TA ?, 1.27%, 1.54%

How it does? Depends on your goal. A pie cherry has a sharp malic flavor. With two years the astringent notes start to show themselves. To me this is traditional cherry as when I was a kid. If I kill the malic as with MLF it doesn’t taste like cherry. A Bing cherry is lower acid and the flavor notes aren’t as crisp. A choke cherry is dominant astringent from day one till about year five. The acid notes are milder, haven’t run any tests to say what the dominant acid is.

Am I interpreting this as tart cherry juice is likely closer to pie cherries?

 

[Rice_Guy]

Yes the common pie cherry is Montmercy, I also have tested Supermont and North Star pie varieties. They grow differently but numbers are similar
The Ranier variety is closer to a Bing ~ ie sweet variety.

 

[Dave_W]

Yes the common pie cherry is Montmercy, I also have tested Supermont and North Star pie varieties. They grow differently but numbers are similar
The Ranier variety is closer to a Bing ~ ie sweet variety.

Thank you, it amazes me how much information is on this forum!

 

[Raptor99]

I think that tart cherries (aka pie cherries) make better wine. Sweet cherries (aka Black Cherries) are cultivated for fresh eating, like table apple or grapes. The tart varieties have more complex flavors and make better wine (or cider in the case of apples).

Some people have complained that wine made with sweet cherries has a "cough syrup" flavor. I have tried combining tart cherry juice with some frozen sweet cherries from Costco. That turned out great! So you could try blending the two.

You will need to add an appropriate amount of sugar to hit your target ABV, and then stabilize and back sweeten. After two years of aging, my tart cherry wine is very nice.

 

[Dave_W]

I think that tart cherries (aka pie cherries) make better wine. Sweet cherries (aka Black Cherries) are cultivated for fresh eating, like table apple or grapes. The tart varieties have more complex flavors and make better wine (or cider in the case of apples).

Some people have complained that wine made with sweet cherries has a "cough syrup" flavor. I have tried combining tart cherry juice with some frozen sweet cherries from Costco. That turned out great! So you could try blending the two.

You will need to add an appropriate amount of sugar to hit your target ABV, and then stabilize and back sweeten. After two years of aging, my tart cherry wine is very nice.

Got it fermenting now. Raised SG to 1.075 and it’s doing fine. I still have some of the black cherry wine so it will be interesting to see the taste difference!

 

[Retired teacher]

it amazes me how much information is on this forum!

Ain’t that the truth! I hardly ever post, but I’m on here every single day! Learning all the time.