RJ Spagnols experimenting

[barneyfife]

Hi all,

I have a winery series cab sav that i am going put on shortly, and i was wondering if anyone has every saved the lees/sediment and grape sack, and dumped a cheaper kit of the same wine on top of the leftover sediment in the primary?

Any chance this would enhance the cheaper kit, or forget it. I also saved a grape pack from a previous winery series kit, and kept in freezer, and could maybe use that also.

Thanks
barney

PS. Before I get called a cheap *** or just use the yeast pack that comes with the kit, or any other colorful terms, this is just an experiment, and just wondering if anyone else has tried this.

 

[roger80465]

I have done this several times and love the results. I am careful about the kits I use - mostly Italian style wines. I've used the gross lees from a Showcase Amarone and started a vinifera noble amarone. It turned out great, maybe more like a valpolacella ripassa but good. Did the same with inexpensive Chianti and an inexpensive barolo, with good success. I like the concept and, to me, the results are worth the effort. It seems to elevate a lesser kit to the next level.

 

[barneyfife]

I have done this several times and love the results. I am careful about the kits I use - mostly Italian style wines. I've used the gross lees from a Showcase Amarone and started a vinifera noble amarone. It turned out great, maybe more like a valpolacella ripassa but good. Did the same with inexpensive Chianti and an inexpensive barolo, with good success. I like the concept and, to me, the results are worth the effort. It seems to elevate a lesser kit to the next level.

Thank you for taking the time to answer. Sounds like it is worth doing.

Thanks
Barney

 

[barneyfife]

I have done this several times and love the results. I am careful about the kits I use - mostly Italian style wines. I've used the gross lees from a Showcase Amarone and started a vinifera noble amarone. It turned out great, maybe more like a valpolacella ripassa but good. Did the same with inexpensive Chianti and an inexpensive barolo, with good success. I like the concept and, to me, the results are worth the effort. It seems to elevate a lesser kit to the next level.

Hello Roger,

I have just put on my Winery Series Cab/sav, and have purchased a 4 week Kenridge Classic Cab/sav. Not exactly a cheap kit. Original cost was $90 CAD, but was on sale for $72 CAD less another 10% .

Should I just dump the 4 week kit onto the gross lees after racking the winery series into a carboy, and let the old yeast do its thing (like i do with beer making)?, or should i also add the new yeast pack.

Also, should i add the oak pack that came with the 4 week kit, because the 8 week kit had 3 large packs of oak added.

Can i also lighten up on the volume of the 4 week kit, to say, 22 liters, instead of 23 liters, to maybe help with a little more body?

The winery series cab/sav i plan on aging for 3+ years, so not really sure how long i would age the 4 week kit. I need a quick drinker, but am willing to wait.

Thanks
Barney

 

[roger80465]

Hello Roger,

I have just put on my Winery Series Cab/sav, and have purchased a 4 week Kenridge Classic Cab/sav. Not exactly a cheap kit. Original cost was $90 CAD, but was on sale for $72 CAD less another 10% .

Should I just dump the 4 week kit onto the gross lees after racking the winery series into a carboy, and let the old yeast do its thing (like i do with beer making)?, or should i also add the new yeast pack.

Also, should i add the oak pack that came with the 4 week kit, because the 8 week kit had 3 large packs of oak added.

Can i also lighten up on the volume of the 4 week kit, to say, 22 liters, instead of 23 liters, to maybe help with a little more body?

The winery series cab/sav i plan on aging for 3+ years, so not really sure how long i would age the 4 week kit. I need a quick drinker, but am willing to wait.

Thanks
Barney

Let me take the questions one at a time.

Yes, just dump the 4 week kit on the gross lees. But also, add the yeast that came with the kit. Don't take the chance the yeast from your Cab Sauv is getting tired, which could lead to some off flavors. The lees, grape skins and oak from the Winery Series kit will go a long way toward elevating the 4 week kit.

Yes, add the oak pack along with the remaining skins. It may not add huge flavor but it certainly won't hurt. If there is anything left in the original oak pack, it can act as sacrificial tannin for the 4 week kit. Tannins are often lacking in those kits so any additional tannin will help. I would also add the oak that comes with the 4 week kit according to the instructions that come with it. Think of the leftovers from the Winery Series kit as a 'flavor enhancer'. Follow the instructions that come with the 4 week kit but just add the flavors from the Winery Series kit.

As far as aging, I have a Vinifera Noble Amarone approaching 2 years that I started on CC Showcase Amarone lees and it is incredible. I'm down to my last bottle of that and I wish I had another case. I also have a Chianti 'Ripasso" (also a Vinifera Noble from the lees of a CC Sterling Amarone) and a Barolo "Ripasso" (Grand Cru International from another CC Showcase Amarone) that are 6-8 months old and are quite nice. They are a bit tannic yet but are mellowing out nicely. They just need a few months more.

Don't reduce the volume of the 4 week kit. That can mess up the balance and, I would suspect, give a less than preferred outcome. I consider this technique to be 1 'adjustment'. By making one at a time, you are in a better position to judge the outcome.

Good luck with your experiment! Keep us posted with your progress and I will be interested to hear your impressions. If you like bold wines, you won't be disappointed.

 

[barneyfife]

Roger,
Thank you so much for your quick and encouraging response.I will keep updating this as time goes by. I am a huge fan of big bold reds. My local winery store has monthly sales, so I am hoping a Winery Series/KenRidge Amarone, goes on sale. The Winery Cab/sav was $109 CAD, which makes me think i should have gotten a couple.

I had company for 3 days a few weeks ago, and "they/we" decimated my 3.5 year old Rosso Fortissimo, down to 8 bottles left. Hence, I would like a quicker red because they have "threatened/promised" to come back next year because they enjoyed the wine/food, and of course the hospitality.

Thanks again, and will keep things updated
Barney