Final SG never as low as the kit instructions say

[dmulligan]

I am trying to figure out why my wines rarely finish with the right specific gravity. If a kit's instructions indicate a finishing sg of 0.992 to 0.996 my wines usually finish at 0.998 to 1.000. I did find out that my temperature was too low. WE instructions say use 18-24*C and the place I was fermenting in was 17-20*C so I thought that was okay. After many conversations with LHBS staff and a KR sales rep I know that warmer is better and that 23-24 is the target temp for fermentation. Now I keep my must at 23-24*C. Since then 2 out of 4 kits have finished low enough.

What might I be doing wrong? Of those remaining 2 kits one came out of the primary low enough and the other did not. I should state that one of the 2 remaining kits is the notorious WE Chocolate Raspberry Port. The other is the Ken Ridge Showcase Amarone. So the CRP is known for stuck fermentations and the Amarone had about 1-1.5L too much water in it. The excess is in a 1G just at about 1/3 full, lots of O2 but it was the only place to put it.

The CRP is expected to go to 1.010 but is stuck at 1.020 after chapitalization. The Amarone is expected to go below 0.997 but it appears to be finished at 1.000.

Now that I've explained my situation I am wondering if the two kits that have not worked out well are explainable in that the CRP is a known hard kit and the Amarone is diluted a little and that is reflected in the SG reading.

Thoughts?

 

[cpfan]

I haven't made the Choc Rasp Port, and it's quite a while since I've done the KRS Amarone. I'm not sure what extra water will do to the sg. Should lower the starting sg. Not sure about the final sg.

Regardless, here's the results of that KRS Amarone...
20June2007 - started - sg not written down - would guess about 1.092
27June2007 - sg .996
20July2007 - sg .992

The above numbers are very typical of my experiences with Ken Ridge Showcase kits.

Steve

 

[mmadmikes1]

Not all Hydometers are created equal. I have one that always reads low and one that is 1 with disstilled water. I use it. It might not be the wine, it might be the test

 

[wvbrewer]

If they are good enjoy them. It is hard to control everything espeacially when you are busy.

 

[Wade E]

Have you ever checked to see that your hydrometer is calibrated? Test it in some distilled water at the temp that a hydrometer usually states or the pce. of paper it cames with. Most are 68* but some are 60* It should read exactly 1.000, if not then adjust all sg's you have been getting accordingly. Have you been adjusting for the temp also?

 

[dmulligan]

Have you ever checked to see that your hydrometer is calibrated? Test it in some distilled water at the temp that a hydrometer usually states or the pce. of paper it cames with. Most are 68* but some are 60* It should read exactly 1.000, if not then adjust all sg's you have been getting accordingly. Have you been adjusting for the temp also?

I just checked my hydrometer in tap water with an unknown temperature and the reading was 1.002. My hydrometer is calibrated to 60* and I tried to make the tap water cool but not cold. In short it may be off but it would not be by much. I should do it again after measuring the temp of the water and adjusting for that.

 

[Wade E]

Most kits dont do as they are stated in the instructions. Keeping it warmer and stirring it near the end helps though as some of the viable yeatrs can get buried under some sediment thus not letting them do their job. I always let it finish in primary and that also helps as you dont rack leaving any good yeast bej=hind as miniscule as that might be.

 

[phermenter]

I have two hydrometers. One says everything has too low a starting gravity; the other says everything has too high a final gravity. As another guy said, think of hydrometers as sundials, not Swiss watches. They're kind of ball-parky. Just make sure your wine is finished fermenting by seeing that the reading doesn't change over a 2 or 3 day period at the end of secondary.

Just make sure you're fermenting warm enough. If it's not at least 65-70 (for a kit) you should find some way to bring up your temperature (brew belt, warmer room, whatever).

Jim

 

[dmulligan]

Is it possible that I am leaving my wine in the primary too long? Does transferring to the primary have a chance of stalling fermentation? When I think about most of my wines have finished very close to the SG they were at when they left the primary. For instance the KenRidge Amarone left the primary, after the instructed number of days in the primary, at 1.000. The instructions said that the expected SG was 1.010. Would the wine have a better chance of continuing to ferment at 1.010 (or whatever the recommended SG) than at 1.000? Am I making a mistake by not checking the SG before the instructed time has passed?

 

[cpfan]

Regardless, here's the results of that KRS Amarone...
20June2007 - started - sg not written down - would guess about 1.092
27June2007 - sg .996
20July2007 - sg .992

In my example, I transferred to carboy on June 27th because the sg was below 1.005. I had not checked before that. The wine was kept at about 74F in primary and in carboy. No problem with the fermentation finishing.

I have made a LOT of kits. I ran a small Ferment on Premises for 6 years. Anybody who has made more kits is either Tim V or runs an FoP. I have not had problems with kits fermenting down. This is primarily Vineco and RJ Spagnols kits, but also lesser numbers of some other brands (including a few Winexperts and one Cellar Classic).

The secrets of my success? Well I mostly ignore the wines. But temperature is important. I stir them vigourously before pitching the yeast (some people use their drill mounted stirrer). I use large primaries (about 11.5 US gallons for 6 USG kits) with a loose fitting lid. Unless there is something floating (grape skins, oak tea bags), I ignore them in the primary till day 7.

BTW, the Amarone above was made in the store. It was one of the last kits bottled in the store.

Steve

 

[dmulligan]

The secrets of my success? Well I mostly ignore the wines. But temperature is important. I stir them vigourously before pitching the yeast (some people use their drill mounted stirrer). I use large primaries (about 11.5 US gallons for 6 USG kits) with a loose fitting lid. Unless there is something floating (grape skins, oak tea bags), I ignore them in the primary till day 7.

Until now I've been forgetting about my wine for at least 7 days. Sometimes a little longer. I've put a stop to letting it go in the primary for more than 10 days. I also tend to leave the wine in the secondary much longer than instructed and lately I've been making sure that I am keeping my wine at 23C. The way I see it there are two big differences between how you and I do it.

1) You use a loose fitting lid. Perhaps I am not letting enough air in. With my next kit I am thinking of trying stirring on day 3. I read that as a tip on a winemakermag blog post. The idea is to allow air in and get some of the yeast suspended in the wine again.

2) I make my wine about 2800ft above sea level higher than you. I wonder if that matters for this. It certainly matters for degassing and the amount of time the yeast takes to do it's job.

 

[cpfan]

The height above sea level is an interesting point. Where are you located?

BTW, current location is 585 feet. The FoP was at 1724 feet. I learned to make wine at 1895 feet. These elevations are for the local airports from Wiki.

Steve

 

[dmulligan]

Ahh you are higher up than I thought. I am in Calgary at 3000ft. Did you notice any difference at higher altitudes?

 

[cpfan]

Ahh you are higher up than I thought. I am in Calgary at 3000ft. Did you notice any difference at higher altitudes?

I haven't noticed any discernible differences. My brother lives in Calgary, and has made wine, and has never mentioned a problem gettng the ferment to complete.

Are you getting your Vineco kits from Wine Warehouse? I've only dealt with Steve a couple of times but he seemed knowledgable, so maybe you should be asking him about his experiences. Unless Alberta has a new Vineco rep, I believe he used to work for Winexpert.

Steve

 

[Smartdog]

Don't forget to correct for temperature! Standard specific gravity (water = 1.000 is at 4 deg celsius (60 deg F)). Use this table to convert.At 74 deg you need to subtract about 0.002 units.

You can also correct for density and altitude or recalibrate using exactly 60 deg F (4 C) water. Also besure you are reading the hydrometer correctly accounting for the miniscus.

 

[Wade E]

Some hydrometers are calibrated for 60* and some are 68* so be sure of the one you are using as that would make a difference also.

 

[dmulligan]

Some hydrometers are calibrated for 60* and some are 68* so be sure of the one you are using as that would make a difference also.

Mine is calibrated to 60*F. I will check the instructions to see how much I should be correcting for. I've been figuring that uncorrected it is all relative but I am not using relative numbers for my final gravity expectations.

Wade, you spoke of stirring near the end. Do you mean the end of the wine's time in the primary?

Do you all rack to the secondary by date or by SG reading?

I was at my LHBS recently, when they talked me into the WE Blackberry Port kit, and another possibility for stuck fermentations is that I may have been too diligent about not racking any of the sediment from the primary into the secondary. I've also may have been too diligent about not shaking the wine which would allow sediment to become suspended again. It is possible that I've been needing some of the yeast that has settled. I feel that racking some of the settled yeast coupled with stirring on day 3, more for a WE port kit, may solve my problem. My approach will be more about getting every drop of wine rather than intentionally racking sediment along with being a little less careful about moving the primary bucket when propping it up to tilt it before racking.

Thanks,
David