How to Make HOMEMADE WINE Like Farmers in Italy

[Terryfirma]

Seeing a dairy farm you watched silage or hay ferment just by putting it in a silo. Grandma had sour kraut ferment by shredding a d adding some salt. It works, and is the technology level they had.

Another way to look at wine is that it is a progressive cleaning process: remove big stuff that a press can hold back >> remove sugars via yeast >> remove fine solids via gravity >> remove sharp tasting tannin via time

Exactly. Life is all about enzymes, SCOBY, growing, composting, consumption and elimination with pH, temperature and bugs thrown in! .. it happens on all levels. Haha.. that’s my very simple theory.
Heat, acids , salt, alcohol, oxygen, etc. We have to make certain the correct pieces are in place for safe preservation methods without killing off the beneficial enzymes, yeast, bacteria etc.that achieve the desired results. It has been happening for many ages.

 

[winemaker81]

I watched the video again, noting the wine seems very light colored. I was wondering if it had to do something with their process.

So I watched it a third time -- I feel oblivious as I missed it the first two times. Their wine is a field blend, mostly red but with white mixed in. My understanding is this is common in Europe, all grapes in a vineyard go in the same vat.

 

[balatonwine]

I had to chuckle a little bit by the comments concerned about how unsanitary the place looked. As I biologist that is. Because those cold, resource poor surfaces have a pretty low biodiversity of microbiological flora and fauna. Diversity often needs a nice warm media, with plenty to feed off of.

Now what could that be? Yes, indeed... The biggest input of microbiological nastiest in a winery is not necessarily the equipment, or the structure, but biological things that enter... Including yourself. Yep. No matter how much you shower, or think you are clean, simply walking in you are dripping all sorts of new microbiology into your wine. Some even maybe unique to you. So, in a way, and if you understand and think about it.... much more "icky" than those walls.

 

[balatonwine]

Their wine is a field blend, mostly red but with white mixed in. My understanding is this is common in Europe, all grapes in a vineyard go in the same vat.

Correct.

This is how our neighbor harvests their wine, all goes into one large hopper (mostly white of many different varietals, but some reds in there too):

 

[winemaker81]

This is how our neighbor harvests their wine, all goes into one large hopper (mostly white of many different varietals, but some reds in there too):

How much attention do your neighbors pay to which varietals they are growing? I'm wondering if when they have a vine die, do they replace it with whatever is convenient? I can see where the focus would be on having a vine instead of none, and also "this varietal is a big producer" and/or "this one makes fragrant wine", etc.

While in the USA we tend to think by varietal, a lot of the world does things differently. I like seeing what other folks are doing -- it helps me avoid narrowing my thinking to believe there's only one way to do things.

In reviewing my own practices, I tend to make whites as varietals and in recent years, blend the reds, and am leaning towards blending some (5%?) Vidal (white) into Chambourcin (red).

 

[balatonwine]

How much attention do your neighbors pay to which varietals they are growing? I'm wondering if when they have a vine die, do they replace it with whatever is convenient?

Specifically at my neighbor' property: I have never seen a vine replanted on this property in 20 years. This property is now under its forth owner in that time period. And all simply harvest. I actually managed this vineyard for two years, the first year I removed maybe 100 dead vines (some quite old and dead... nobody before me even bothered to remove them). The newest owner, about a year, did not even care about the vineyard it seems. Never saw them spray this year. The vines got rot and failed completely. They spent a lot on renovating the houses on the property however. I assume it will list soon on AirBnB.....

Generically, and historically: I think people simply planted what they could get locally and cheaply that year, which may have varied. My original vineyard was a complete mess. Often, every other vine was something else. Sometimes a table grape in the middle of a wine grape row.... As I was interested in varietals, took effort to ID every vine if I could, replanted rows based on the most "common" varietal and cut out the others. I guess that was the "American" in me. But, being an American, I am also considered "odd" here regarding small "home wineries" (I only have a hectare of land, not all in vineyards... larger wineries do plant thinking varietals)....

Regionally: In some regions here, there is actually rather traditional regulations on what percent one plants in a vineyard. The vineyards of Somló, near me, for example, have a very historically and traditional and famous field white wine blend, and so plant accordingly.

 

[winemaker81]

@balatonwine, thanks for the info.

I suspect that the amount and rigidity of rules depend very much upon how much commercial winemaking there is vs. personal consumption. The only over-arching rule is that there are no over-arching rules ...

 

[winemaker81]

I watched the video again. I love how the child is being taught the winemaking tradition without really understanding what he is learning.

 

[tjmeyer]

I love this so much! I know many of you are thinking, "oh, maybe a lot of this sanitization doesn't matter." Well let me make one thing very very clear coming from a family like this: this wine DOES NOT taste like you think it does! Hahaha

Italian family wine is as different as salt brined green olives are from lye-cured black olives.

Truly traditional wine is NOTHING like what you buy in the store, nor what you are likely striving to make.

Make no mistake, many folks prefer this style, but if you grew up in the US drinking from store-bought bottles, you are probably not even aware of the existence of these much more intense flavors that come from wine like this. Come on over and I'll set you down to the family wine that we don't sell, but the only stuff my Great Uncle and Grandfather will drink.

 

[winemaker81]

@tjmeyer, some of my early mentors were guys of Italian extraction in Rome/Utica NY. One guy was the most talented amateur winemaker I have met. Another chaptalized everything to at least 32 brix and judged a wine by how few glasses it took to knock him down. Some happily guzzled down swill that even my then-uneducated palate knew was swill. Most were closer to the first guy than the last, but it was a mix. In hindsight, it was excellent education.

Make no mistake, many folks prefer this style, but if you grew up in the US drinking from store-bought bottles, you are probably not even aware of the existence of these much more intense flavors that come from wine like this.

For some of the wines I tasted, "intense" is a good descriptor, but to paraphrase Inigo Montoya, that word doesn't mean what most people think it does. Well, at least in this context.

I'd hang out with and work with the folks in the video. Regardless of how the wine comes out, the camaraderie would be worthwhile.

 

[tjmeyer]

For some of the wines I tasted, "intense" is a good descriptor, but to paraphrase Inigo Montoya, that word doesn't mean what most people think it does. Well, at least in this context.

I knew someone here would know what I was talking about LOL

I'd hang out with and work with the folks in the video. Regardless of how the wine comes out, the camaraderie would be worthwhile.

100%! The variety of pallets is even greater than the variety of wine!

 

[winemaker81]

I knew someone here would know what I was talking about LOL

Good judgment comes from experience. Experience comes from bad judgment. Some of the wines I drank fall into this category.

I've watched the video a few times -- it's actually very instructive. I suspect the wine in the video is of higher quality that many of our members expect. Is it going to WOW the folks that rate wines for the Wine Spectator? Nope. But it is good wine for folks for whom wine is an every day beverage.

 

[joeswine]

I watched the video again, noting the wine seems very light colored. I was wondering if it had to do something with their process.

So I watched it a third time -- I feel oblivious as I missed it the first two times. Their wine is a field blend, mostly red but with white mixed in. My understanding is this is common in Europe, all grapes in a vineyard go in the same vat.

Especially In Spain

 

[bearpaw8491]

Good judgment comes from experience. Experience comes from bad judgment. Some of the wines I drank fall into this category.

I've watched the video a few times -- it's actually very instructive. I suspect the wine in the video is of higher quality that many of our members expect. Is it going to WOW the folks that rate wines for the Wine Spectator? Nope. But it is good wine for folks for whom wine is an every day beverage.

Since Dave is our resident research specialist, I suggest we all chip in, buy him a lug and let him have a go at it just like the video and then submit a report maybe even send a bottle to Bryan for tasting!

 

[winemaker81]

I watched the video again. One thing that struck me is that while some comments talk about things being dirty, I see most of it as old. The family has been using the same equipment for probably decades.

I also looked at the wine itself -- given that it's a red/white blend and according to the narrator, it's not fermented on the skins that long -- the color looks right for this. I looked for brown in the wine, and don't see it.

My take is that since the wine is drinkable in the spring, and given my experiences with traditional winemaker among folks of Italian extraction, each year's wine is used up by the time the new wine is available. This is a totally different take on the wine, as opposed to what a large percentage of our membership (including me) does.

 

[Rocky]

My take is that since the wine is drinkable in the spring, and given my experiences with traditional winemaker among folks of Italian extraction, each year's wine is used up by the time the new wine is available. This is a totally different take on the wine, as opposed to what a large percentage of our membership (including me) does.

That was my experience with wine making back in the day. The new wine was normally opened around Easter and many years we were getting really close to running out of last year's wine. We would make a lot of wine but it was shared by a number of families (Uncles) who would stop in at the house and pick up a few gallons at a time. No one kept score, it was "the family's wine." As Bryan points out, a "good wine" was drinkable wine. We weren't going for blue ribbons, rather a beverage to enjoy with meals and celebrations.

I suppose I am somewhere in between today. I have entered wines for judging and won a few ribbons, but then it occurred to me that I like the wine, my family likes the wine and my friends like the wine. It matters not at all if a judge that I do not know likes it or not.

 

[winemaker81]

@Rocky, you awakened memories.

I had just started a batch of cherry wine from concentrate, and one of my father's friends showed up at the house with empty gallon jug. He fully expected me to give him a gallon of wine, and was visibly irritated when I told him it would not be bottled for another 9 months.

In that same time frame I was waiting table at an Italian restaurant, and one of the prep cooks was saving bottles for me. After 2 weeks he wanted wine, and got very ticked with me when I told him I would not be bottling for another 9 months. He stopped saving bottles for me ... and never got anything from me.

One of the guys I knew (I was mid-20's, he was late 30's) complained about his cousins. When it was time to work on the wines, they were conspicuously missing. But they were there to get their share at bottling time. Actually, AFTER bottling time, as they didn't help with that, either. He opened a schism in the family when he laid down the law -- only those that helped got wine. I knew him, but not his extended family. Apparently it was one helluva brewhaha.

Entitlement is strong in some people.

Thankfully, I don't have such problems.

 

[QuiQuog]

I knew someone here would know what I was talking about LOL

Could someone describe the "intense flavor" for those of us without knowledge of the old ways?

 

[winemaker81]

Could someone describe the "intense flavor" for those of us without knowledge of the old ways?

@tjmeyer's comment was with respect to my statement.

My term "intense" was a tongue-in-cheek statement. Consider some of the bad wine you've had, with strong off-flavors. That is the "intense" I mean.

Some of the guys I knew made wine the "old fashioned" way. They had one or more 60 gallon barrels with one head knocked out. Most had a recipe, e.g., 12 boxes Zinfandel, 4 boxes Muscat, 2 boxes Alicante, etc. Crush the grapes and dump them in the barrels. Let 'em ferment with whatever yeast was on the skins and managed to dominate. Press and put into whole barrels. This was September(ish), and some of the guys were drinking the wine by December or January. Others made a second run wine, which was broached in Dec/Jan, and the main batch was hit in April(ish).

Most of the wines were drinkable, like any jug wine. Some developed some off aromas and flavors, but was typically consumed anyway. I ran a LHBS at the time and had guys bring in red wine that was brown. Badly oxidized, but they drank it anyway. Advice about headspace, use of sulfite, commercial yeast was ignored, 'cuz that wasn't what Grandpa did.

Note that this wasn't even a majority, maybe 1/4 to 1/3 of the overall collection of guys. They were not a group, except in the fact that they all purchased grapes brought in by train from CA.

Also note that two of the best home winemakers I've known were also in that collection. There was a lot of variety.

 

[distancerunner]

It’s a guess, but the two best probably followed rules about head space and sanitation. Probably aged the wine a little longer, too.

Again, just a guess.