Leaf identification vinifera vs. labrusca

[Court Campbell]

Can you tell the difference between a vinifera and a hybrid vine by looking at the leaves? The reason that I ask is that there is a yard backing on to our townhouse complex that has some kind of neglected-looking grapevine growing over the fence. I live in Toronto, and I have planted a lot of different kinds of grapevines this year. Unfortunately I don't have room to plant them at my townhouse in Toronto, and the infestation of racoons there means that I wouldn't have a hope of actually producing any fruit anyway. My grapevines are all at my mom and dad's house, which is further north in (Canadian) climate zone 4a. When I saw this vine growing over the fence, I thought for what it's worth I might try rooting some cuttings next spring to plant in Bancroft. I know that the chances of them being hardy enough for two zones further north are slim. Can somebody here look at the pictures of the leaf that I sent, though, and at least tell me if this is a vinifera variety and a total waste of time to try and plant further north? There is fuzz on the bottom of the leaf, but I don't have enough mature vines to be able to compare it with them.

I bought these kinds of vines to plant in Bancroft -- one, two or three of each, depending on how much they cost and how risky I judged them to be in that climate zone. The Trollhaugen and Somerset particularly I think are a gamble, but I wanted to try growing a seedless grape.

FRONTENAC BLANC
FRONTENAC GRIS
LA CRESCENT
MARQUETTE
ST-CROIX
St. Pepin
PETITE PEARL
Swenson Red
Fredonia
Bluebell
Trollhaugen
Somerset

 

[salcoco]

the probability of a vinifera vine living through your winters is not high. I would guess that it is a wild grape. why not wait until it make grapes, then taste and if satisfactory make the cutting when vine is dormant?

 

[BigH]

My vote is that the leaf in your pics is wild vitis riparia.

H

 

[KevinL]

Looks like a Riparia leaf to me. I've got Riparia everywhere, and they all have the leaves shaped like those.

There are a lot of MN hybrids with Riparia in them that have similarly shaped leaves. Itasca and Frontenac have leaves that are almost indistinguishable from Riparia.

It's definitely not Labrusca, which doesn't have the pointy ends on the leaves. They tend to be more rounded.

 

[Court Campbell]

I guess I will need to do what salcoco suggested and see what grapes it produces. I just have to be patient. I'll have to find some fruit bags somewhere to keep fruit on it until it has a chance to mature. The reason I thought it wasn't a wild grape is that the leaf in the picture is probably six or seven inches (not including the stem). All the wild grapes I've seen have leaves that are only a couple inches long. Hopefully as KevinL inferred it might be one of the MN hybrids. I suppose wild grapes might have bigger leaves if they are healthier plants?

Does anybody have any ideas for DIY fruit bags to protect grapes?

 

[KevinL]

I guess I will need to do what salcoco suggested and see what grapes it produces. I just have to be patient. I'll have to find some fruit bags somewhere to keep fruit on it until it has a chance to mature. The reason I thought it wasn't a wild grape is that the leaf in the picture is probably six or seven inches (not including the stem). All the wild grapes I've seen have leaves that are only a couple inches long. Hopefully as KevinL inferred it might be one of the MN hybrids. I suppose wild grapes might have bigger leaves if they are healthier plants?

Does anybody have any ideas for DIY fruit bags to protect grapes?

My Riparia vines are in varying health. The ones that are healthier tend to have larger leaves.

I've heard that the waxed bakery paper bags work to protect grapes, but I've not tried these myself.

For reference, I went out and took pictures of the different varieties I have in my vineyard for leaf identification. I was wrong on the count of the Itasca, it has some of the characteristics of Riparia but has a distinct feature. Here are the leaves and you can see for yourself.

Concord (Labrusca)


Frontenac:


Vitis Riparia:



Petite Pearl:



Vidal Blanc:



Itasca:

 

[Court Campbell]

Thank you for the pictures. I can see how it doesn't resemble the concord leaf. Labrusca is very different. It does look sort of like the riparia leaf except that the three points are longer.

The Itasca leaf is very distinctive from the others.

Court