LONG night of winemaking!

[MedPretzel]

yep, mine sure ain't tangy. Maybe with time, but since I just bottled it, it's sort of hard to tell. How much tannin did you use?

 

[Waldo]

Did not use any Edited by: Waldo

 

[MedPretzel]

hmmm, I think it's the fresh ones. I don't think mine had peels on them. Maybe there's something in them that makes it tangy.

 

[jojo]

*stir stir stir*


*sniff*

 

[PolishWineP]

I would think the peels would add quite a bit. My parents always used home grown w/skins. The one thing I often don't like about plums as plums is the skin.

Toss them in!

 

[MedPretzel]

Hmmm, I am at a loss tonight. Today was the judging of wines at our county fair.........


I stayed all evening to witness the winetasting. I wanted to see how it is done, what the comments are (and luckily there was a judge-in-training, so they were talking about certain aspects that probably wouldn't arise otherwise), etc, etc.


Well, lo and behold, I got 3 3rd places from 126 wines entered.


Am I happy? Yes, sort of. Am I disappointed? Yes, sort of too.


Juniper was a last-minute change, due to the comments I received at another competition. It didn't receive any awards. In fact, the judge said, "It tastes like a pine tree!" (He didn't know it was mine)


My marigold (liquid sunshine) was deemed undrinkable due to too high sulfite levels. Can you believe it, they used that wine to tell the judge in training about how match-sticks taste. The guy drank like 3 glasses of water afterwards.

It's the same wine that got an honorable mention at another competition.


My Cab Franc (kit) received a 3rd place. Thank you Geo!!!! It was bought at the FineVineWines store online. Last year it didn't place. So, to all you kit winers, it really does make a difference to age.
My 1st place mum wine of 2 years ago didn't place at all. They thought it "tasted like someone's leftover herbs." Oh boy. I felt sick to my stomach after hearing that one!!!


My pumpkin wine won a 3rd. I didn't hear the comments on that one, but I will post it as soon as I know.


The daylily wine was thought of as mediocre. No placing.


The Niagara wine, which was mentioned at the other competitionas being "medicinal" won a 3rd place. Go figure. I almost took it out of the judging because of the comment. That one floored me, because I didn't think it tasted that great either. This is the wine that I freaked out aboutwhen I didcold stabilization last year.


My beer didn't place. Sorry Stinkie. I tried. My dad liked it, though, and that is more than enough for me. I loved it too. So did the better half.


Neither did my ancient orange mead. Out of the 4 wines, I didn't receive anything for it (only 1st, 2nd and 3rds were given).


No clue as to the rose-hip, but I doubt it won anything. I would have known. Which is a bummer. I LOVE that wine.

The last was the Chardonnay. I didn't win anything on that one either.


So, I guess my question is: How do I interpret the completely opposing results from the different judges from different competitions? If one says, "the best-balanced wine I tasted in the whole competition" and the other says, "Tastes like a pine tree," who or what do I believe? Is wine-judging that subjective? I thought it was more objective than most people think. THese totally conflicting comments on some of my wines is very puzzling and saddening. I don't know where I stand at all. Maybe "knowing less is better?" I did pH changes on the one, did sweetening on the other, etc, etc. The other one I'm puzzled about is the Niagara. Totally different opinions.... Medicinal to 3rd place. What a range. Okay, maybe we have exceptional wines here in Geauga county as compared to the national competition, but.......... What the heck?


I am quite confused at the moment, and a little down. However, I keep telling myself, 3 3rds out of 126 wines ain't bad.

You never stop learning.

M.

 

[Dean]

Martina, what were the qualifications of the judges? Were they certified? At the very least, did they have a Sommelier certificate? Seems to me from some of the comments that they were not qualified, nor certifed as wine tasters.

I would put much more stock into your peers from the previous judging!

 

[sangwitch]

Martina, don't sweat it. You did great! Don't let some opinions get you down. I would love to get three 3rd place finishes out of that many entries

 

[MedPretzel]

Well, the judges were from the Northern Ohio Wine Guild (or Northeastern Ohio Wine Guild.... I don't have th info here at the moment)....


The one lady I spoke to said that they have club meetings every 4th thursday of the month. And one of the judges is nationally known... But that's all I know.


I was pretty surprised. Tomorrow is my "fair day." I'm going to go there and maybe get some more info.


Thanks for the words of encouragement, I know it's not bad, it's just not as good as I wanted it to be or hoped it to be.

 

[Wade E]

Dont fret Martina, it just goes to show you how peoples tastes vary.
The next show you go to you will probably take 1st and 2nd. Not
everyone that tastes wine can taste wine.

 

[dfwwino]

Martina, did I read correctly that YOU entered 126 wines, or were 126 total wines entered by all participants? If its the former, you ought to get a medal for that.


My experience with county fair winecompetition judges is that the judging is very inconsistent, as opposed to national winemaking competitions. For example, the judges may be unfamiliar or have little experience with country wines. They may be solely used to vinefera grape wines. Many judges are just local celebrities or newspaper wine critics. The best I'd take from a competition is feedback on any flaws found in the wine, such as your Marigold. I'd probably pop open another bottle of Marigold and see what the free SO2 level is in the wine, smell it and see if you agree with the flaw detected. Other flaws include unbalanced wine. Aside from flaws, judging country wines can be very subjective. For example, some might like beet wine while others might find it disgusting. That has nothing to do with the quality of the wine. I thought it was very admirable of you to subject yourself to so much judging, and even listening to criticism of your wine. While I'm sure it probably left your ego battered and bruised, you probably gained a great deal of knowledge from watching the judging. In wine competitions, your wine has to stand out, be unique,without being too flashy to be inconsistent with the style. You can submit several high quality wines, but you are likely up against many that taste very similar for that style. Edited by: dfwwino

 

[Waldo]

I think dfwwino hit the nail on the head Martina..Be not discouraged my friend

 

[MedPretzel]

Wow, thanks Shyster, and Waldo!


I have gotten over the initial shock of the comments made, but I see the experience as both of you do. My premiums paid for everyday entrance to the fair, and then some. I gave my sister my entrance ticket (she lives about 2 minutes away), and she could go in everyday and enjoy her time off. That was reason enough to enter.


The judging was great, actually. I learned a lot, and will test my wines with a different "nose" now. However, I still feel, and everyone who tasted my juniper wine will agree: It does NOT taste like a pine tree. The Chard kit I entered in was lacking acid. I'll go with that. But the Rose-hip was hot, yet oxidized? Not at all. The wine was aged a year and smooth. The color was true to the initial color (see post on how I store my wines), and very leggy. The Cab Franc blew me away, though. I got "excellently stored and aged. Taste exquisite. More depth desired" and got a 3rd. Oh well. The mum wine I entered didn't place, but got a comment, "Lingering taste, slightly floral, needs more acid" Holy cow, I thought it was way acidic!


I learned a lot, and the comments made (written) are much less harmless than the verbal comments made at the actual wine-tasting.


The judges were from the Northeast Ohio Wine Guild, and were probably very well-adept in grape/vinifera wines, but in country wines, they were lacking. I believe next year I will stick to "establishment" non-grape wines, including peach, blueberry and probably something along the lines of "normal." Alhtough I feel that one should be exposed and enjoy and assess a good lilac or a good juniper wine. However, I know that my wines are quite unusual and not everyone's taste, I feel with proper testing and tasting techniques, it should be appreciated, and not mentioned as "drinking a pine tree."


That is my biggest problem with many of the judging categories on the whole. Although, I'm most certain that I am one of very few people who make "Chrysanthemum petal" or "Lilac flower" or "Rosemary-Nutmeg" or "Squash-Caraway" or "Marigold petal" or even "Lavender bloom" wine, but I think there should be a category for "Non-grape, non-fruit" wines. Although veggies and herbs/petals would be in this category, there would be a difference. Yes, Strawberry is a great wine, but so is Juniper. But if you would know it's juniper and not oh, let's say, apple, you might have a different feel for it. My wines went up against everything that is "non-grape." That means, strawberry, blueberry, peach, boysenberry, and so many other "normal" fruits, that I think it's almost an injustice to my wines that they were placed in the same category. It's like saying "Grape juice" versus "every other juice you could imagine."


I know I'm rambling on, but it's a little pet peeve I have. I was low on acid again this year (in general) but high on sulfite. The marigold was a burnt match, and the rest were I guess tolerable.


The mead (Ancient Orange) was "off" and did not place.


BTW, Stinkie, the beer DID place!!!! And a second at that!!! Woohoo! Maybe I should get into beer instead of wine.


Just an update. I'm still kind of down, but more puzzled than stunned now, and enjoy the benefits of having "award winning wines." However, I think I'll be more establishment next year and enter only boring, uh, "conventional"wines.


M.


BTW, the marigold did have the burnt match smell when I opened the beer-bottle of it. But now the question arises; Did I smell it because I heard the comment, or because it was really there?

 

[pkcook]

Martina,


Congrats on the awards! I think you did outstanding for the amount of wines entered.


I still believe the only real critic you have to please with your wine is yourself (or your spouse

). I know an award from a professional wine judge would be an honor, but if you like your wine, it is GOLD medal wine!

 

[dfwwino]

Martina,


Again, you area gutsy winemaker for submitting to so much analysis. I think you are catching onto the wine competition idea: nothing too flashy, present a peach, blueberry or other fruit wine, but juniper will be too outlandish for most judges unless you're in a country wine competition. For example, even if my celery wine turns out great, I'd never submit it because the scent of celery would be too unexpected for the average judge. As far as the sulfite question, you can resolve this by following my other post in response to your topic in General Winemaking Questions and test the free sulfites in the Marigold. I recommend Daniel Pambianchi's book, Techniques in Home Winemaking, which discusses sulfite testing at pp. 102-11. You want to keep your sulfite level between 25 and 50 mg/l.Then you'll know whether the power of suggestion has influenced you or whether you oversulfited the wine. While I am not a gadget geek, I think testing sulfites is a very important step because it is the most common flaw I see in homemade wines. Out of concern for spoilage, winemakers add too much sulfite. In my winemaking, I've had only one wine get acebater, which was due to letting the wine sit in a primary exposed to air for over a month while I was in trial. In contrast, I've had probably a half dozen wines oversulfited. If you don't have a PH meter and sufite tester, I'd err on adding less sulfite than recommended. Given that I lost my ph meter and sulfite test kit last year as part of my divorce collateral damage (tossed in the trash), I've only been adding the equivalent of 3 campden tablets per five gallonsas my odds of oversulfting versus contamination and instability are far greater. But I really need to buy another PH meter and sulfite test kit. By the way, the best way to obtain good feedback about your unusual country wines is to join a homewinemaker's group with country winemakers and let them blind test your wine along with others. Too bad George hasn't figured out a way for you to serve us all a taste of that juniper through this internet forum. Edited by: dfwwino

 

[dfwwino]

OK, now I'm on my third glass of wine. So please forgive my excess.My two cents is that as a winemaker, we should all listen to others (judges, friends, forum members, etc.), but not believe everything we hear. Take what you hear, and apply it to your winemaking. If it works, you have another tool in your tool chest. If it does not work, reject it and move on. I have read so much material and heard so much advice over the years that is not supported by my personal experiments. For example, we are told to drink a white wine within 1-3 years. I am sitting here right now drinking a 1997 Sauvignon Blanc that is still not over the hill.Commercial wineries don't want us consumers drinking any bad wine that could harm their image, so they are very conservative and give consumers general rules like this. When I first began winemaking, I obsessively worried about all sorts of general rules, like sanitation. I used to get angry when my kids let their cat come near my wine while I was racking. But really, even on the odd chance a cat hair or some dander fell in my wine, what are the odds contamination would occur? Just don't be a slob and clean and sanitize your winemaking vessels. When you make wine from fresh grapes harvested in the vineyard, look at all the ants, spiders, spider webs, wasps and other crud that become part of your must. In fact, when I'm pressing grapes, I'm usually stung by multiple wasps feasting on my grapes. Does the must spoil? No. Likepkcook said, you, the winemaker, are the only real critic. Don't be afraid to take what the rest of us say as mere poppycock unless your independent winemaking experience validates our suggestions. Edited by: dfwwino

 

[Waldo]

If it pleases you
It's passed the test
And as Wino said
"Poppycock"
On all the rest

 

[Pepere]

Martina:


Yield not to the mindless ramblings of critics.

You and you alone are the only person you need please in any endeavor. You have inspried a number of us here to try things like lilac wine and various other country wines and we are all the better for it.


Maybe the "pine tree" wine drinker will choke on one of those pine needles he is imagining and give up judging. I believe from the support you've received here so far you have many fans of your creative imagination in wine making. You go girl and we will gladly follow. "Grasshopper" has spoken.

 

[MedPretzel]

Well, I haven't updated this post recently: Let me let you in on what's going on with me. **Sigh**
I think I mentioned earlier I bottled the plum and the juniper. The others have to sit at least another week at least, and then I am somewhat free.


Why?

I'm applying to residency just about everywhere in the United States. I might wind (or wined???) up in your neck of the woods come July 1, 2007, if all goes well. Wish me luck.


I have applied in ND, SD, Idaho, KS, MO, WV, AL, (sorry, AR was not available) TX, OH, PA, MI, WV, MN, VA, CO, and probably a lot of other places. Even Puerto Rico are just some of the places I applied to (hey, if I'm going to be on the highway to hell, it might was well be in a place where they have beaches all year round).


So if anyone by chance happens to know a residency director, please tell them that I would give them about 300 gallons of bottled wine (for starters) if they took me. Some good, some not so good, some.... different!

Not only that, but I'm taking an exam next Tuesday and Wednesday. I have been studying for it all summer, and I just hope I'm ready for it. 2-day exam, 9 hours per day, sitting in front of the computer, clicking on A,B,C,D,E,F,G,H,I,J or K.... it has been known to go into the double letters too. My nerves are totally frazzled, but some yummy juniper wine helps now and then.


So, my presence here (and advice)has been meager lately, but I just wanted to let everyone know why. It's not that I have given up the forum, winemaking or anything else for that matter. Since medical school, I have learned how to have hobbies again, and it's wonderful. I wouldn't want to quit it for anything ever again.


Just have taken it down a notch for a while.


BTW, I've picked Chocolate Mint again at my sister's place, got plenty of rose-hips ready to go, and TONS to bottle. George, you'll be hearing from me hopefully soon.


Thanks everyone for the fun times and fun reading in this difficult time for me.




M.

 

[Waldo]

Martina I certainly wish you the best and whoever ends up with you will be very fortunate indeed. I just hate AR wasn't on the list of potential residencies