New Winexpert Kits

[StreetGlide]

Very glad I prefer RJS over WE at every level. It was like that 10 years ago and even more like that now.

 

[kuziwk]

The upside is I would expect we'll see some nice clearance pricing on the old inventory coming up soon.

Highly doubt it, A little birdy spilled the beans and the price points are going to be the same. VineCo did the same thing. VineCo... They are dropping many of the original grapes/kits, and replacing them with others. Some will get replaced others won’t. It’s effectively reducing many of the varieties though overall. For those that don’t know, VineCo and Winexpert are owned by the same entity, Peller Estates....Andrew Peller among several other ventures. This appears to be a mass amalgamation of all the kit manufacturer’s owned by Peller estates, just look at Vineco’s website which looks identical to winexpert’s. I’m not 100% sure if the varieties will be different or the same. Furthermore, it’s disconcerting about the mid range dropping 6L of volume and the top and bottom end lines dropping 2 litres, not to mention some of my favourites are now gone. I guess we will have to wait and see if these are any good. If not I guess I’m switching to RJS for the high end kits.

 

[sremick]

I don't know how to feel since I'm new to this so none of my WE kits have aged long enough to drink, but I've always heard that they're really good and 3 of my kits are LEs.

I've also heard lots of good things about RJS En Primeur (one of my batches is from them) so if they're now king I guess that simplifies my shopping going forward.

 

[kuziwk]

I don't know how to feel since I'm new to this so none of my WE kits have aged long enough to drink, but I've always heard that they're really good and 3 of my kits are LEs.

I've also heard lots of good things about RJS En Primeur (one of my batches is from them) so if they're now king I guess that simplifies my shopping going forward.

It’s too early to tell without trying the new lineup. The cellar craft showcase kits blew me away after 1 to 1.5 years of aging, we lost some volume in these new kits however without the manufacturer dropping the price its hard to assume that they are catering to the masses which is what the new marketing strategy would suggest. Perhaps they are buying better quality grapes with the money saved from less processing and shipping costs, as well as the increased shelf life.

 

[Kayts]

I have made many of the WE kits and had very good outcomes. Used both expensive Eclipse and the cheaper. I have also used RJS and find more of the local suppliers are keeping
them in stock now. But I am glad summer is coming and I can make more from scratch now.

 

[Putterrr]

The issue as I have with the new and improved and lets not forget smaller kits is the unknown. I usually have my top line kits sit for 2 years before I drink them. I make about a dozen kits a year and 75% are from Vineco or WE. So am I going to invest in 18 kits @ $120-150 per kit over the next 2 years just to see if I like the new wine I will be drinking in 2022-23. If I don't, then I have another 2 years of disappointing wine to consume. On my wine making journey, I always found that the more juice supplied, the better the end result. I'm not about to spend my $2,300 to see if the hype measures up. Too bad as some of the current kits are my favorites. I will pass and let others be their guinea pigs. See you in 2023.

cheers

 

[bstnh1]

It’s too early to tell without trying the new lineup. The cellar craft showcase kits blew me away after 1 to 1.5 years of aging, we lost some volume in these new kits however without the manufacturer dropping the price its hard to assume that they are catering to the masses which is what the new marketing strategy would suggest. Perhaps they are buying better quality grapes with the money saved from less processing and shipping costs, as well as the increased shelf life.

Or perhaps, they have found a way to squeeze more profit from their products by supplying kits that contain less juice, require less packaging and cost less to ship.

 

[bstnh1]

Very glad I prefer RJS over WE at every level. It was like that 10 years ago and even more like that now.

I wouldn't be surprised to see RJS make a similar switch to small kits with less juice.

 

[Brian55]

I wouldn't be surprised to see RJS make a similar switch to small kits with less juice.

Let's hope not, that would leave Mosti as the only decent option.

 

[pillswoj]

I wouldn't be surprised to see RJS make a similar switch to small kits with less juice.

I plan to let my local RJS dealer know they will be getting more of my business because of this move by Vineco and that they should send word up the chain not to mess with reducing volumes on the high end kits.

 

[StreetGlide]

I wouldn't be surprised to see RJS make a similar switch to small kits with less juice.

I hope RJS sees this as their way to move ahead in their industry then fall behind. Hopefully the change nothing and people start moving to them.

 

[sremick]

I just emailed Winexpert to let them know my thoughts and that I would no longer be buying any of their kits.

 

[jbo_c]

I, for one, am willing to give them a try if I can find them for the right price. Having spent a fair amount of time corresponding with one of their technical advisors some time back, I can see the logic of what they’re trying to do. I’m skeptical, but I’ll try it. They are in this to make money, so they must truly believe it will make better wine.

That said, my shop of choice doesn’t carry WE except by special order, so I don’t think pricing is likely to be such that I would try it outright.

Jbo

 

[joeswine]

the wine industry is in trouble from France were the beer drinkers are rising in popularity and the influx of Spanish wines being labeled product of France, to the global fires and droughts the wine industry is taking a betting. So its know wonder that something else we can't understand is happing to the kits. They are a hybrid to the industry and are not the norm, but like I've' always said sometimes less is more. Work with what your given and be a better wine maker for it .
I have always thought that the pricing was getting out of control, I have know control over that and that's why I've learned to make the best out of every kit no matter what the price line.
and always think outside the box.

 

[sremick]

In case anyone is interested in WineXpert's response to my email to them. Basically this is their PR position:

I hope you won’t rush to judge us. Our kits still make 23L of excellent quality wine.
We posed the question to ourselves, ‘If we were starting this business again, what would we do differently?’ Our products have been completely reformulated with a focus on improved flavor, color, and aromatics. It was also important to reduce our carbon footprint by using less plastic, paper and energy in the process.
If you would like any further detail or have other questions or concerns please, do not hesitate to contact me.

 

[kuziwk]

In case anyone is interested in WineXpert's response to my email to them. Basically this is their PR position:

Haha well maybe we should give them the benefit of the doubt, worth trying one or two and letting them age out. We should really be able to tell pretty soon whether or not it’s going to be a good wine or not...it shouldn’t take a full year or two. Obviously after a year or two it will be a fair comparison though.

 

[joeswine]

I'm not do sure what carbon footprint has to do with it???????
I do know that reducing the total volume will increase the ABV. Overall if not controlled.
As far as increasing the over all nose,and taste maybe or maybe not.
I think you'll have to handle it kit but kit.
But Don't be afraid to try just do like always, no your wines taste profile and take it from there,nothing's really changed just the starting volume.

 

[jsbeckton]

I'm not do sure what carbon footprint has to do with it???????

But of course this is the new “get out of jail free” phrase for companies to justify reducing costs via reducing quality or something inherent expense.

The fact that they even said this signals to me that an already flawed product (IMO) will become even worse. So so so glad I had already moved on from kits.

 

[joeswine]

I'll put my kit wine up against any pressed grape,or raw juice anytime in a blind tasting , anytime any where.
Grapes aren't for everyone one, nither is bucket juice or kits.its all about the process and the winemakers skills and know how.
I've done them all and kits give you the speed and the ability to have fun in this craft,it allows you to make your personal size wines your own.
By thinking outside the box.

 

[jsbeckton]

I'll put my kit wine up against any pressed grape,or raw juice anytime in a blind tasting , anytime any where.
Grapes aren't for everyone one, nither is bucket juice or kits.its all about the process and the winemakers skills and know how.
I've done them all and kits give you the speed and the ability to have fun in this craft,it allows you to make your personal size wines your own.
By thinking outside the box.

I commend you if you are able to beat out quality AG wines in a blind taste test, and mean no disrespect to kit makers...but all I can offer are my own experiences.

I’ve now made 15-20 kits, from all of the major manufactures and from all of the concentration levels. I have bulk aged these wines in a temperature controlled cellar for several years with little to no improvement. I’d also like to think that I have “thought outside the box” by trying many things like extended maceration, fermentation and finishing tannins, different yeast, currants extra oak (to name a few). None of these wines have been anything other than “decent” and all have a characteristic that I can only describe as “jammy” that I can’t get used to. I’ve also tried fellow kit wine makers wines and come to the same conclusion so I don’t think “my process” is to blame.

My first all grape wine is not even a year old and I think it’s head and shoulders better than my best kit ever was. So for me at least, the evidence is clear that kit wines are just not for me.

Again, these are just my experiences. Believe me, I’ve got several hundred bottles of kit wine still so I have no reason not want to believe kit wine can be just as good.