RJ Spagnols OK who has started their Port and what kind did you get?

[TomK-B]

Thanks for expanding on your comments, Joe. I was wondering what you were getting at. But I was especially curious about how you might go about making one of these kits. Several of us are currently in process of making the new Black Forest kit from R.J.Spagnols. Here's the link to that thread: http://www.winemakingtalk.com/forum/f84/started-new-black-forest-port-40201/. That kit comes with two packs of EC 1118, which I understand has the highest alcohol tolerance of any winemaking yeast (up to 18% ABV). My plan is to chapitalize the kit during primary fermentation to bring the alcohol level up to that 18% mark. Then I plan to fortify with brandy to get it up to 20%. Having made several of these port style kits in the past, I believe the sweetness of the flavor reserve pack can definitely hold up to that level of alcohol. My concern about this kit is not the alcohol level, but the body and mouthfeel. And by that I mean it has no oak in it. I've been thinking of adding tannins as you suggest above. But it would be easier for me to add Tan Cor Grand Cru because that is what I already have. What are your thoughts on the use of the Tan Cor as well as possibly some oak for flavor later in the aging process?

 

[joeswine]

tannin powder

WINE TANNINS, you'll have to excuse me for ranting back there I think it was my meds, this is what I use if your on the same path as far as type of product used that's great, were did you by yours from? always follow the manufactures pathway, that's for certain, but as far as body goes, adding the tannins at different stages will add to the smoothness your looking for, both in the beginning of the process and at the end. Remember ,one of PORTS main ingredients is wood, unless it's a tawny port then it's oxygen.

AND, maybe this is the most important part of it all, it's a port style wine kit, have fun with it.

 

[eblasmn9]

CAUSE AND EFFECT, when you add the brandy you dilute the wine base and causes it to have more bite, less flavor and thinner at the same time.

CAUSE AND EFFECT, what I would do is add tannins to the secondary, this will add the texture you will need to add to the smoothness then to enhance the caramel flavor should it need it, see if you can by a product called,DaVicci gourmet caramel syrup,add to taste ,NOW you have the whole package without distorting the
structure,at least that's going to be my approach...think out side the box..

I will be doing all three of these kits in tandem very soon on line,,,yours jp

I added a bottle (750 ml of e &J VOSP) brandy to my coffee port and Joe is right. It thinned it as well as overpowering the coffee flavor and making it something I did not expect. I compared this to Joe's coffee port and know it to be true. It is more like a sweeter dessert liquor. It is not a port. I don't think I can get either grappa or everclear in ohio. How do I fortify without using brandy? With that said, I like it. It just isn't a port.

 

[TomK-B]

Joe, the Tan Cor is supposed to be a more highly refined version of what you are using. I got mine from George at Fine Vine Wines. Although I see that he has recently added the L.D. Carlson Wine Tannin Powder that you use.

Earl, I've only made four batches of these port style kits - two of the WE Chocolate Raspberry and two of the RJS Apple Tatin White. I beefed up the ABV in all of those kits as much as I could through capitalization, then fortified with 80 proof brandy. In all of those kits my final ABV was around 19%. I had a mixed experience with the final body on these kits. Both of the WE CRP kits came out thinner than I expected or wanted. The RJS ATWP, on the other hand, was really full bodied -- almost syrupy, in fact. I'm wondering if that has something to do with the content of the f-pack. The taste on all of them was wonderful. After a year of bulk aging for all of them the brandy was completely integrated without a hint of its presence.

 

[Simpsini]

Tom - When you made the kits, when did you put the F-Pack in? I have heard of people putting half the pack in during the primary and the rest in later. I have made a wine with an F-Pack once but didn't half it between primary & secondary. I thought it was way too sweet/syrupy for me. Any advice on this?

 

[TomK-B]

Simpsini, I did the f-pack by the instructions and added the whole thing after fermentation was complete. And, yes, all of mine have been VERY sweet. I've also heard of putting half the f-pack in primary, but haven't tried that in any of mine, yet.

 

[joeswine]

the key to balance

THE key to a better balanced specialty kit is to have enough alcohol in the beginning so that when you add the fpac it doesn't overwhelm the abv.it needs to be balanced.

 

[Tess]

Mine is here!!!!! Are you going to be using green bottles?

 

[JGottshall]

Mine is here!!!!! Are you going to be using green bottles?

Yep green bottles for me I have to buy a case of the 350s

 

[TomK-B]

Mine is here!!!!! Are you going to be using green bottles?

Yup, green bottles for me, too.

 

[Tess]

Thanks, Cant wait to see some of the labels

 

[vacuumpumpman]

I just picked 360 pounds of Frontenac grapes on Saturday- I will be making atleast 5 gallons of port from it. I will not be adding yeast for approx 5 days as I am still going thru cold maceration process.

 

[TheRooster]

Just started an rjs chocolate orange port kit last night. Long time beer brewer, brand new at winemaking. Super psyched!

 

[Boatboy24]

Welcome, Rooster!

 

[jamesngalveston]

I have been drinking port wines for along time, but only the very good ones.
mostly Taylor Fladgate, some reserves as well..

How Port is made

Essentially the grapes are fermented until the wine reaches the desired sugar level, at which point the fermentation is stopped and wine spirit is added. This leaves residual sugars in the wine and raises the alcohol level to between 15% and 20% Alcohol by Volume (ABV) resulting in a wonderfully full-bodied, succulent and sweet wine.
If its not fortified it is not a port, but a dessert wine with high abv.

I use Sandeman Port Founders Reserve to make my blackberry port.

 

[Simpsini]

James - Nice description on making port. When you say "Essentially the grapes are fermented until the wine reaches the desired sugar level, at which point the fermentation is stopped and wine spirit is added." what is wine spirit? I couldn't find it anywhere.

 

[Simpsini]

Rooster - Welcome to the forum

 

[Thig]

James - Nice description on making port. When you say "Essentially the grapes are fermented until the wine reaches the desired sugar level, at which point the fermentation is stopped and wine spirit is added." what is wine spirit? I couldn't find it anywhere.

I know you asked James here but I will add what I know. True port comes only from Portugal, what we make here is actually a port style wine although I am guilty of calling it port also. True port is made by adding aguardente. It is a distilled grape brandy, much higher in alcohol content than most brandy you could buy. Do a search of aguardente and you may be able to find some. Most of us just use a regular brandy realizing it takes more to reach the desired alcohol level. Some use grain alcohol like Everclear because it is higher in alcohol but I stick with the brandy.

 

[GaDawg]

James - Nice description on making port. When you say "Essentially the grapes are fermented until the wine reaches the desired sugar level, at which point the fermentation is stopped and wine spirit is added." what is wine spirit? I couldn't find it anywhere.

wine spirit is brandy (distilled grape juice)

 

[JGottshall]

Sampled my toasted Carmel port tonight clearing real good and taste is awesome no need to add brandy to this warms ya right up oh and did I mention taste awesome 2 weeks to bottle time