WineXpert Secondary (step 2) in primary?

[Elmer]

Making a WE selection Brunello.
My SG is down to 1.010.
Step 2 indicates to rack into carboy.

I know I usually follow the directions and on occasion I don't.

What is the con of just snapping the lid on and letting ferment out in the bucket?

My issue with racking to a carboy for step 2, is that some goop and sediment get left behind. Not to mention that is a few less days the must gets to spend with the grape skins.

But then again step 3 indicates to stir up the sediment before adding the clarifier. If I skip step 2, ferment to dry and then rack to a carboy there will be less sediment for step 3.

Of course if I can't get that lid to snap shut this whole post is pointless.

So should I or shouldn't I finish in the bucket?
What say you?


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[Brian55]

Get it out of the bucket as soon as it's done vigorously fermenting and/or you've reached the proper SG. The purpose of getting it out of the bucket is to eliminate introduction of too much oxygen by letting it sit in the plastic bucket too long.

 

[littlefootwines]

Hey Elmer i just finished a california red thats made by RJS i tryed the same thing your asking about. I must say its a cheaper kit i used only $35 here so i figured if i screwup not to much to lose so anyway the reason i did it was i wanted to use some cherrys i had in the freezer and added some oak chips.

I had been reading that reds were left in the primary years back so i said to myself self lets give it a try.

Now like i said mine was a cheap kit but doing what i did made it a much better wine lots of body wonderful taste very nice feel in the mouth i would and will do it again.


In fact i have a RJS grand cru syrah and thats the kit i am doing next

Hope this helps.
Shane

 

[DoctorCAD]

Rack everything you can fit through the siphon hose. That gives you longer time on the solids.

 

[tonyt]

I think the risk of oxygen is minimized by racking now. Squeeze everything you can out of the skins, they're done anyway. Then you and the wine can rest for a week or so. I actually top up at this point just to be safe

 

[bkisel]

The only con I see is that if for some reason the wine doesn't finish to your satisfaction - having nothing to do with your change in procedure - you shouldn't expect WE or the retailer to make good on the kit.

I've, at times, racked to "secondary" when instructions say not to and stayed in primary when instructions would have me rack but I've never done the same kit side by side in order to note what difference it might have made. Thankfully to date all my wines have finished just fine and most better than just fine by my standards.

I mostly do RJS kits and find that the low end kits keep you in the primary and the higher end kits have you rack to "secondary".

 

[richmke]

The Extended Instructions for Making Wine from Kits has it in the primary for 30 days.

 

[Elmer]

I know on one occasion I did not rack to "secondary" but I was limited on time and I believe everything worked out just fine. But my memory can get hazy with the addition of time.

I am just trying to keep from being lazy. My must will most likely be at 1.010 tonight and I can rack than, but I have a feeling those pesky grape skins still have something to give.
Not to mention I utterly hate having to check SG from a carboy. The thief, test tube etc....etc....
I have to admit that from a primary bucket, I just dropp the hydrometer in and it is a quick and easy read.

but like Tony said, it gives me an extra week and slows down the last leg of the fermentation.

For the record I do not top up at secondary, I wait until I clear and get all the goop out of the bottom and then top up.

Has anyone ever done the "The Extended Instructions for Making Wine from Kits"?
If so is there a noticeable difference from standard kit making?

Thanks for the advice.

 

[geek]

I usually let it go all the way dry in primary bucket.

 

[Putterrr]

I dont always follow the instructions especially when it says to leave it in the primary for 14 days. I rack at around 1.000 and let it sit there for 14 days give or take. I always rack again off the lees prior to clearing regardless of the instructiuons. Todate I have had no issues with clearing. Having not had 2 wines side by side for comparisons, i can't say if the kit would have been better if I followed instructions to a T.

There was one member on here, might have been wade, that always let his wine go dry in the bucket and never had any issues. To each their own way.

cheers

 

[Elmer]

Just checked the SG it was 1.000
At this point I snapped the kid shut an let it burn out.

I figure if I rack to a carboy and follow directions it will be there for 10 days before racking again and going to step 3.

However in the bucket I will most likely be done fermenting by weekends end or mid week.
I could then rack to a carboy and go to step 3, which is clarifying, which I always let sit a little longer (especially is there is little head space.




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[Elmer]

Well I skipped step 2 (secondary) and I am now at .996, 9 days after pitching yeast.

This is in comparison to the directions that "recommends" 5to 7 for primary 8 to 10 for secondary and an additional 10 days for clearing.
This means, for better or worse I have skipped 10 days.

But I am going to give the wine 2 days undisturbed in the carboy since it is .996, but my hydrometer is off by 0.020.

So the experiment continues!



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[KatyDinkle]

Update please?

So, how did it turn out? I've got a kit in primary and considering leaving it in the bucket instead of racking to carboy (for now).

Thanks!

 

[Elmer]

So, how did it turn out? I've got a kit in primary and considering leaving it in the bucket instead of racking to carboy (for now).

Thanks!

Fine,
I have done it twice since my last post and no issues.

 

[KatyDinkle]

Good to know. Thanks for the quick reply. I'll give it a try.

 

[sweed]

I just started my first kit least night and I was worried about racking it to a secondary on time (I won't be around this weekend). Coming from beer brewing, you just leave it in the primary for a few weeks to a month, then bottle, basically.
If I can skip a step then all the better. I figured, like in homebrewing, that the co2 blanket in the primary bucket would keep it from oxidation.

I still have more to look up. Like racking to the clearing carboy, and leaving as much 'sediment' on the bottom as possible? Only if your using a secondary fermentation vessel, should you rack a little bit of that?

Once you rack to the clearing carboy, degas it first, then as the finings? Then degas again?

I have a feeling, like homebrewing, it's tough to mess up a batch.

 

[tonyt]

If you are going to be back home Sunday night, you should be fine. I doubt the SG gets much lower than 1.040 but YMMV. Just to be safe I would snap down the lid and add an air lock.

I often ferment to dry (SG 1.000 or less) in primary bucket. Many on here do this regularly. Once the wine hits SG 1.020 or so I snap down the lid and add an air lock and let finish fermenting. Once the wine is finished fermenting and a consistent SG for at least two days you should proceed. I would not let the wine sit in primary bucket once it has finished fermenting.

If I know I will be unavailable for a few weeks I will rack to secondary anywhere between SG 1.020 and 1.000, top up, add air lock and let set for two or three weeks. I believe the racking at this point restarts any sluggish fermentation and insures the wine finishes well below SG 1.000. Plus being topped up with air lock I don't have to worry about oxidation.

 

[sweed]

If you are going to be back home Sunday night, you should be fine. I doubt the SG gets much lower than 1.040 but YMMV. Just to be safe I would snap down the lid and add an air lock.

I often ferment to dry (SG 1.000 or less) in primary bucket. Many on here do this regularly. Once the wine hits SG 1.020 or so I snap down the lid and add an air lock and let finish fermenting. Once the wine is finished fermenting and a consistent SG for at least two days you should proceed. I would not let the wine sit in primary bucket once it has finished fermenting.

If I know I will be unavailable for a few weeks I will rack to secondary anywhere between SG 1.020 and 1.000, top up, add air lock and let set for two or three weeks. I believe the racking at this point restarts any sluggish fermentation and insures the wine finishes well below SG 1.000. Plus being topped up with air lock I don't have to worry about oxidation.

Ok... I thought directions called to closed the lid shut and put on an aitlock, which I did last night. Is this wrong??
I think after some reading that I'll ferment it dry in the primary. I'll be back Monday night, I'll check the gravity then.

 

[tanddc]

You were not wrong. I always ferment my kits with the lid on.

I try to get mine off the gross lees a soon as I can because it seems (to me) to make the wine drinkable quicker. 5 days at 70 degrees does if for me. I still check to verify that it is below what the kit requires. In my case, it is usually below 1.000 by then. Past that, it really takes more than a few days for the yeast cell to start lysing.

 

[tonyt]

Ok... I thought directions called to closed the lid shut and put on an aitlock, which I did last night. Is this wrong??
I think after some reading that I'll ferment it dry in the primary. I'll be back Monday night, I'll check the gravity then.

You are not wrong. Some of us (myself included) do not snap the lid on but just set the lid on to allow a bit of air for the yeast to enjoy. Some simply cover the fermenter with cloth to keep bugs out.

As you are likely discovering, winemaking and winemakers have many methods and techniques. You will settle into your own in time. For now it is best to follow the instructions as closely as is possible.