Started some mead and a batch of Agave wine

[rhodesengr]

Over the last week or so, I started two batches of wine. One is a true, simple mead. My son-in-law's father has some bee hives and he kindly supplied a few kilograms of his honey. It made about 3 gallons of must with a starting brix of about 26.

But I am into tequila so I though I would also try making Agave wine. It is basically just like mead but I used Agave nectar instead of honey. Costco sells 1 kg bottles of Agave nectar. I figured I would need about 8kg to make enough to fill a 5 gallon carboy and that worked out just about right. My starting Brix is about 27. Fermentation started today with EC 1118. I added some potassium carbonate and then acid blend to end up with a pH of 3.9. I also added some tannin as that shows up on many mead recipes. Other than that, I just added K-meta. I used some Go-Ferm to start the yeast and I will be adding Fermaid O later today.

 

[rhodesengr]

Some interesting observations... The honey must and the agave must were set up just about the same except with the honey must I added 1.5 grams/gallon of Fermaid O at the start and with the agave, I only added half of that with the idea I would add the second half after a few days. Judging by the amount of foam on the surface, it looks like the honey must fermentation really took off. We say "going like gangbusters". The agave must is clearly fermenting but no big foam layer like I see with the honey; i.e. not going like gangbusters.

I did some reading yesterday about the make up of honey vs agave. I think the agave has a higher percentage of fructose vs glucose. So maybe that is why the fermentation seems slower. I read that yeasts like EC 1118 have a harder time with fructose than glucose. In fact, I found a study comparing a bunch of the yeast types for their ability to handle fructose. EC1118 is about in the middle of the performance table.
https://www.lallemandwine.com/wp-co...rmentation-of-Fructose-in-winemaking-2013.pdf
I was also thinking that maybe the honey has more natural nitrogen and/or other nutrients that help the yeast. The Agave was a commercial product from Costco. So maybe it is more refined. The honey I used was pretty raw. My daughter did the comb extraction from the actual combs. It certainly wasn't as "refined" as honey bought from a store.

I am also seeing that mead calculators use ALOT more nutrient (Fermaid O) than the 1.5gram/gal that I see specified for grape wines. This one is saying 4.9 gram/gal if just using Fermaid O
https://www.meadmakr.com/batch-buildr/
So maybe the Agave just needs more nutrient. I added a second dose this morning which brings me up only 1.5g.gal total so far. I'll see if that appears to increase the fermentation rate. The honey must seems to be doing fine with 1.5g/gal added on day 1.

 

[BernardSmith]

Typically, honey has no nutrients that yeast can use. Agave, I can't say, but although I may be very wrong, strikes me that in the first week or so of primary fermentation before there is about 9% alcohol by volume in the fermenter, you cannot add too much nutrients. Before the yeast are active and after they have produced that 9% you can, because other volunteer organisms will make use of the minerals, the compounds and the organic material that the yeast are unable to assimilate.

 

[rhodesengr]

Typically, honey has no nutrients that yeast can use. Agave, I can't say, but although I may be very wrong, strikes me that in the first week or so of primary fermentation before there is about 9% alcohol by volume in the fermenter, you cannot add too much nutrients. Before the yeast are active and after they have produced that 9% you can, because other volunteer organisms will make use of the minerals, the compounds and the organic material that the yeast are unable to assimilate.

This is kind of confusing to me. My understanding, at least with fruit wines, is that all the nutrients are added before the 1/3 break point. The things I have read about mead say the same but suggest much higher amounts of Fermaid O or inorganic N.

Both my honey must and Agave must are progressing but taking much longer than the five days needed for my plum wine last july. Adding more nutrient did seems to accelerate the fermentation. Its just that the SG is coming down a lot slower than my plum must did. I can post some numbers later.

 

[winemaker81]

This is kind of confusing to me. My understanding, at least with fruit wines, is that all the nutrients are added before the 1/3 break point. The things I have read about mead say the same but suggest much higher amounts of Fermaid O or inorganic N.

Both my honey must and Agave must are progressing but taking much longer than the five days needed for my plum wine last july. Adding more nutrient did seems to accelerate the fermentation. Its just that the SG is coming down a lot slower than my plum must did. I can post some numbers later.

Honey has no nutrients so yeast needs the extra boost. I go about 50% higher than recommended for meads.

Lack of nutrients will slow down the yeast, and if grape wines low nutrient can result in H2S. I haven't heard of H2S in mead, but that doesn't mean it doesn't happen.

 

[rhodesengr]

My mead has been going for 14 days. It is making consistent progress albeit slower than what I saw with my plum wine. I stated with a brix of 26 and yesterday it was down to 9. I think in 4 or 5 days it may be ready to rack. As of this morning there was quite a layer of foam on top so not ready for a narrow neck carboy. My Agave is making similar progress. My starting Brix was also around 26 and yesterday after 7 days it is down to 16.

 

[winemaker81]

My mead has been going for 14 days. It is making consistent progress albeit slower than what I saw with my plum wine. I stated with a brix of 26 and yesterday it was down to 9. I think in 4 or 5 days it may be ready to rack. As of this morning there was quite a layer of foam on top so not ready for a narrow neck carboy. My Agave is making similar progress. My starting Brix was also around 26 and yesterday after 7 days it is down to 16.

Are you using a hydrometer or refractometer. If the latter, the reading requires translation once the fermentation starts. Alcohol skews the reading.

 

[rhodesengr]

Are you using a hydrometer or refractometer. If the latter, the reading requires translation once the fermentation starts. Alcohol skews the reading.

I used both when I did the initial setup. I knew about the alcohol skewing from before. You probably mentioned it in my plum thread So the numbers quoted above for progress are just the SG. I found the refractometer seems more accurate when doing the setup so I have been going by that when I set the must up. Then the floaty hydrometer to check progress.

 

[winemaker81]

I used both when I did the initial setup. I knew about the alcohol skewing from before. You probably mentioned it in my plum thread So the numbers quoted above for progress are just the SG. I found the refractometer seems more accurate when doing the setup so I have been going by that when I set the must up. Then the floaty hydrometer to check progress.

I read so many posts I lose track of details, and we do have a regular occurrence of folks that use a refractometer without understand the pitfall.

Generally speaking, the situation is clearer if SG is used to report details, as there's no question if the reading needs translating or not. That's among the reasons I try to work in metric, although I'm not there yet in terms of thinking in metric. Gotta do the mental translation thing.