The idea: Banana pudding sparkling

[alurpal]

So I'm a new wine maker and previous beer maker. Lot of things running through my head and one of them led me to an interesting thought experiment.

The idea: Banana pudding sparkling

So I was thinking, a banana wine with a subtle bread characteristic and lactose. That then led me to think, what if I used a hefeweizen mash as part of my must (75% wheat, 25% barley malt), bring up to required Brix with sugar, then start fermenting with a hefeweizen yeast. Once that gets to around 8% abv, rack then pitch a champagne yeast to finish fermenting.

Two questions:
1. Is it a bad idea to try different yeasts in one batch to bring out different esters?
2. Is using malt a no-no in wine making?

 

[sour_grapes]

My opinion (worth the price I am charging! ): (Please note that I know very little about beer yeasts.)
1. No, no problem with mixing yeasts in general. Some yeasts do excrete a "killer factor" that will suppress other yeasts that are sensitive to this factor. A common champagne yeast EC1118 does produce the toxin. Uncle Google tells me that brewer's yeasts are likely to be sensitive to this. So if you start with heifeweizen, and finish with EC1118, it should be fine (but the second yeast will kill the first.)

2. I am not a brewer, so I don't know how to predict the results. However, there can't really be a "no-no" in homebrewing. Make whatever the hell you want!

And welcome to WMT.

 

[winemaker81]

Welcome to WMT!

That's an interesting idea. It's common to use multiple yeast strain, especially EC-1118 to finish a ferment where the original yeast can't complete the job due to lower alcohol tolerance.

There are no rules in winemaking. You can literally do anything you want. However, there are good idea, neutral idea, and bad ideas. Which is which depends mostly on whether you like the result.

When experimenting, ask yourself if you want 2 cases of the result? If you think yes, then make 5 gallons. If unsure, start with 1 gallon.

 

[Ohio Bob]

Two questions:
1. Is it a bad idea to try different yeasts in one batch to bring out different esters?
2. Is using malt a no-no in wine making?

1. No, not a bad idea. You can do it two ways, start one yeast then add the killer yeast later. This approach gives you no control over the finished product and also no way to replicate it. Second option is to split your juice into two buckets and use a different yeast in each. If you really like one over the other, that may help you decide how to blend them back together.
2. I use light malt in my blackberry ports. “Thickens” the flavor in my opinion. Not a good description I know.

 

[vinny]

I've made a malted lemonade using light malt, it was good.

Your idea seems sound. I made a banana wine, which is still in secondary. It started as the sweetest, richest banana flavor I had ever tasted. It hardly came through after fermentation. I haven't tasted it since to update, but when I mentioned it in a post, I'm pretty sure it was suggested to use 13lbs of banana's per gallon.

I used 5 ish.

The other option would be infusion or concentrate in secondary.

 

[alurpal]

Welcome to WMT!

That's an interesting idea. It's common to use multiple yeast strain, especially EC-1118 to finish a ferment where the original yeast can't complete the job due to lower alcohol tolerance.

There are no rules in winemaking. You can literally do anything you want. However, there are good idea, neutral idea, and bad ideas. Which is which depends mostly on whether you like the result.

When experimenting, ask yourself if you want 2 cases of the result? If you think yes, then make 5 gallons. If unsure, start with 1 gallon.

Definitely doing a one gallon batch. I was thinking ec-1118, so I’m happy to see you mention it.

 

[alurpal]

1. No, not a bad idea. You can do it two ways, start one yeast then add the killer yeast later. This approach gives you no control over the finished product and also no way to replicate it. Second option is to split your juice into two buckets and use a different yeast in each. If you really like one over the other, that may help you decide how to blend them back together.
2. I use light malt in my blackberry ports. “Thickens” the flavor in my opinion. Not a good description I know.

Interesting idea to blend the two. Thanks!

 

[alurpal]

I've made a malted lemonade using light malt, it was good.

Your idea seems sound. I made a banana wine, which is still in secondary. It started as the sweetest, richest banana flavor I had ever tasted. It hardly came through after fermentation. I haven't tasted it since to update, but when I mentioned it in a post, I'm pretty sure it was suggested to use 13lbs of banana's per gallon.

I used 5 ish.

The other option would be infusion or concentrate in secondary.

That’s a big difference in amount of bananas used. Thanks for the advice!

 

[winemaker81]

Definitely doing a one gallon batch. I was thinking ec-1118, so I’m happy to see you mention it.

EC-1118 is the workhorse of the industry -- it will ferment a rock, if given half a chance. This is among the reasons wine kits typically include it, as it's as foolproof a yeast as you can get, and its alcohol tolerance is around 18%.

What is your target ABV? The hefeweizen yeast I saw max at 8-10%, so if you're going above that, the idea of using EC-1118 and hefeweizen in separate buckets won't get the result you want. It makes more sense to let the hefeweizen go to completion, then inoculate with EC-1118. Besides, splitting a 1 gallon batch doesn't make sense. If it was 6 gallons, I'd consider going with 2 different yeasts, let them go to completion, blend, then inoculate with EC-1118.