Use of oak chips in making Cabernet Sauvignon

[vinny]

I personally wouldn't put too much thought into the oak. The last kit I did came with 2 oak chip bags which I added in Primary. I racked off of those and added a third bag which were cubes to secondary and the wine has been sitting on that oak for 6 months.

You are adding all 3 bags while fermentation is still underway and some of it is just to add tannin. The remainder is on the wine for such a short duration, I personally would just follow the instructions and question no further.

 

[Bill Pet]

Sorry

 

[wineview]

This is the most amusing part of the entire post. “I am just starting to do this and do not want to screw this up!”

Just starting? There will be plenty of screw ups along the way.

 

[Jim Welch]

This is the most amusing part of the entire post. “I am just starting to do this and do not want to screw this up!”

Just starting? There will be plenty of screw ups along the way.

Those mistakes will likely never be forgotten too!

 

[Daniel Moy]

Hi Guys, I racked to secondary fermenter about 4 days go but do not see much bubbling or form. Had to rack from 7.9 fermenter to two 3 gallon carboys. I took a gravity reading today and it is at 1.000. Does this mean that fermentation is done and that I can rack to another carboy or primary fermentor to clarify wine? I did add oak chips so was planning to keep in secondary for 2 weeks for the oak flavor. Is no forming or bublles in secondary fermentor normal?

 

[Ohio Bob]

Yes, fermentation is almost completely done, close enough. Any bubbles you see now might be CO2. 2 weeks seems like a very short time for the oak to release its flavor. At this point I would not use oak chips or shavings, use them in primary. Now I would use oak cubes and bulk age another 3 months. Then rack and decide on next steps, need more oak or not, etc.

 

[vinny]

Yes, fermentation is almost completely done, close enough. Any bubbles you see now might be CO2. 2 weeks seems like a very short time for the oak to release its flavor. At this point I would not use oak chips or shavings, use them in primary. Now I would use oak cubes and bulk age another 3 months. Then rack and decide on next steps, need more oak or not, etc.

The kit has odd instructions. It was the point of this thread. He has 3 packs of oak chips and the instructions are to add them to secondary, then rack off them in 2 weeks.

 

[Daniel Moy]

thx guys..I did get advice from Master Vintners person who said to add all the chips to the secondary since they provided this in the kit..i am guessing that second fermentation of two weeks using all the chips will be enough given the amount of chips i am using..i tasted the wine today after 4 days of second fermentation and it does tasted expectedly dry but young. I was more concerned that there were very few bubbles and when I rack to the primary to degas the wine, there may not be any gas..am i worried unnecessarily?

 

[vinny]

thx guys..I did get advice from Master Vintners person who said to add all the chips to the secondary since they provided this in the kit..i am guessing that second fermentation of two weeks using all the chips will be enough given the amount of chips i am using..i tasted the wine today after 4 days of second fermentation and it does tasted expectedly dry but young. I was more concerned that there were very few bubbles and when I rack to the primary to degas the wine, there may not be any gas..am i worried unnecessarily?

Yes, no trouble. The fermentation is at a very low rate at this point, if any. I just racked 3 juice pails to carboy and often bubbles will run up the carboy as the gas escapes, but these ones were about 10 days in primary and the bulk of the gas had dissipated. It was calm and I didn't see any signs of activity from any of them.

I have another wine that has been in secondary for months and it still has little bubbles running up the side. Different batches will behave differently no matter how consistent we are in our procedures.

 

[Daniel Moy]

Yes, no trouble. The fermentation is at a very low rate at this point, if any. I just racked 3 juice pails to carboy and often bubbles will run up the carboy as the gas escapes, but these ones were about 10 days in primary and the bulk of the gas had dissipated. It was calm and I didn't see any signs of activity from any of them.

I have another wine that has been in secondary for months and it still has little bubbles running up the side. Different batches will behave differently no matter how consistent we are in our procedures.

Thanks Dave..this is helpful. Dan

 

[user 52843]

Hi, my name is Dan and I am new to making wine in kits. I just purchased a Master Vintner Sommelier Select Old Vine Cabernet Sauvignon wine kit. It contains three bags of oak chips so I am assuming that they are American, French, and Hungarian oak. Question: Does anyone know if I am supposed to add all the chips from all three bags to make my 6 gallons of wine? Or..am I only supposed to add one type or another in certain quantities? Any advise you can provide would be very much appreciated. I am just starting to do this and do not want to screw this up! Thx

The instructions in my kit specified when to add the oak chips. I had to read the entire instructions to find it.

 

[user 52843]

Thanks Bryan for your feedback. I have three bags of oak chips that they provided to me. Am I supposed to add all three bags or just one or a blend? How much should I add to the wine in second fermentation? Another question I have is..do i throw away all the juice that came with the wine skins and just use the skins in a bag that i put in the fermentor? seems like a lot of good juice to just throw away but not sure what i should do..pls advise..thx.

Daniel,

I am not experienced enough to really help you, but no, do not discard the juice. You have chosen to start with a kit that includes skins. The process and equipment is somewhat different than using a juice only kit which is what I started with.

The difference is that with skins you will need to press the skins whereas that step is not necessary using just juice. Blichmann Engineering has a system called the WineEasy that will show you what you need for skins.

You can obtain the components to do the job manually, the Blichmann system makes it a bit easier.



https://www.blichmannengineering.com/wineeasy-landing

 

[Jusatele]

Wine making is an art of patience and trusting processes long established. Primary fermentation can be 7 to 28 days depending on the style, and secondary can be 2 weeks to how much you want to do. You will learn that different wines have different times. When oaking a wine contact time is what leaves the flavors you want. Experiment, break the 3 gallon into 3 1 gallon and secondary for different timesfor your taste. and keep notes. This hobby allows you to perfect the wine for your taste.

 

[rocks99]

Yes, fermentation is almost completely done, close enough. Any bubbles you see now might be CO2. 2 weeks seems like a very short time for the oak to release its flavor. At this point I would not use oak chips or shavings, use them in primary. Now I would use oak cubes and bulk age another 3 months. Then rack and decide on next steps, need more oak or not, etc.

I'm kind of new to wine making. I'm glad I came across this website. Lots of insightful information.
I'm going to try oak cubes. I have access to oak cutoffs. I will be making the cubes myself and then toasting them.

Are the cubes reusable?

 

[Ohio Bob]

I'm kind of new to wine making. I'm glad I came across this website. Lots of insightful information.
I'm going to try oak cubes. I have access to oak cutoffs. I will be making the cubes myself and then toasting them.

Are the cubes reusable?

Folklore says cubes exhaust themselves after 3 months, but you can leave them in much longer.

So cubes are not reusable. People have suggested soaking them in whiskey for a year, then using them in wine to get an effect. I give mine to the neighbor for his smoker.

 

[winemaker81]

I'm kind of new to wine making. I'm glad I came across this website. Lots of insightful information.
I'm going to try oak cubes. I have access to oak cutoffs. I will be making the cubes myself and then toasting them.

Are the cubes reusable?

Welcome to WMT!

Oak for winemaking is typically aged at least 1.5 years. Pay attention to what type of oak it is -- it's not all the same, e.g., red oak will impart unpleasant aroma and flavor. White oak is the common oak type used.

I conducted an experiment a couple of years ago, testing a commercial oak product vs. oak cubes, and published my notes:

https://wine.bkfazekas.com/oak-stix-experiment/
I and several others have noted that leaving the cubes in longer "smooths" the wine -- IME taking the cubes out before 3 months leaves a harshness to the wine, while leaving them after the 3-4 month period results in a smoother oak taste and aroma. This is anecdotal evidence -- the effect has been noted but no one (to my knowledge) has done a comparison.

My barrels are neutral so I add cubes for flavoring, leaving them in for 12 months. For carboys I age reds 6 to 12 months, and also leave the cubes in for the duration.

When removed, I rinse the cubes and dry on paper towels. I have a bag of cubes that will be going in the smoker during Christmas week.

 

[rocks99]

Welcome to WMT!

Oak for winemaking is typically aged at least 1.5 years. Pay attention to what type of oak it is -- it's not all the same, e.g., red oak will impart unpleasant aroma and flavor. White oak is the common oak type used.

I conducted an experiment a couple of years ago, testing a commercial oak product vs. oak cubes, and published my notes:

https://wine.bkfazekas.com/oak-stix-experiment/
I and several others have noted that leaving the cubes in longer "smooths" the wine -- IME taking the cubes out before 3 months leaves a harshness to the wine, while leaving them after the 3-4 month period results in a smoother oak taste and aroma. This is anecdotal evidence -- the effect has been noted but no one (to my knowledge) has done a comparison.

My barrels are neutral so I add cubes for flavoring, leaving them in for 12 months. For carboys I age reds 6 to 12 months, and also leave the cubes in for the duration.

When removed, I rinse the cubes and dry on paper towels. I have a bag of cubes that will be going in the smoker during Christmas week.

Thanks for sharing your results. I hope I'll have enough will power to let the wine age in the carboy for 12 months, but I doubt it.
I'm 6 weeks into the wine making process. I started with a 23 litre bucket of Cabernet Sauvignon juice.
This site has loads of info. Reading the experiences and tips shared by members is of great help, and greatly appreciated.

 

[winemaker81]

I hope I'll have enough will power to let the wine age in the carboy for 12 months, but I doubt it.

It's easy -- make more wine than you drink.

 

[Shurt1073]

Thanks for sharing your results. I hope I'll have enough will power to let the wine age in the carboy for 12 months, but I doubt it.
I'm 6 weeks into the wine making process. I started with a 23 litre bucket of Cabernet Sauvignon juice.
This site has loads of info. Reading the experiences and tips shared by members is of great help, and greatly appreciated.

I am learning patience myself. On my first 6 gallon red wine, I was able to let it sit in bulk aging for about 8 months before racking half into a 3 gallon glass carboy to finish aging and bottling the remaining giving me 15 bottles to drink. My PN with no skins seemed ready at eight months. Just a thought.

 

[Ohio Bob]

My PN with no skins seemed ready at eight months. Just a thought.

I would agree that for whites, roses, and Pinot that is usually a good practice. Assuming it cleared in a reasonable time. For heavier reds, especially with skin contact time, that would really be pushing the envelope to do it that quickly.