Where's all this sediment coming from?

[Fedoradude]

I'm making a Winexpert Cab Sauv kit.

I've racked it twice now (one more than per directions).

The pics below are:

1) After the first racking and 3 weeks in the carboy, and
2) After the 2nd racking and 5 days in the carboy.

I can hardly tell any difference. My question is, where is all this sediment coming from?

 

[ceeaton]

Most of it is from the yeast settling out now that it's job is complete. Some of it is dead, some of it is in the process of going dormant, to reawaken if put into a sugar rich environment.

Some could be from a grape skin pack if it had one.

Some could be from clarifiers if you added them after the last racking (and from the Bentonite added at the beginning).

 

[Fedoradude]

So... this is normal then? What's interesting is the Winexpert directions only called for the initial racking then bottling after it "cleared." Seems to me that this needs racked yet again and who knows how many more times until I won't see any sediment.

 

[cmason1957]

I would wait at least three or four more weeks and maybe even 2 months besides ranking again. That sediment isn't going to cause any off flavors.

 

[Kraffty]

You can also rack over sediment if you get a little too greedy or move the carboy just before racking. Better to have it fall here than in your bottles. You're good being patient. Mike

 

[Fedoradude]

So ya'll are thinking another month in the carboy before racking it again?

We had to move the carboy up off the floor and onto the counter to rack it. We made sure the sediment layer was still apparently undisturbed when we got it up there. And we siphoned down to just above the sediment layer.

 

[ceeaton]

Yes, at least another month would be good. No rushing it unless you are in a rush to drink it. I've been there (and sometimes still am there), you'll just have to live with some sediment later down the road, nothing a bit of decanting can't solve.

Do you have an end on your racking cane that sorta looks like an inverted Hershey's kiss? If not you might want to look into one of those, keeps a lot of the compacted sediment out of your rackings.

Have fun!

 

[Fedoradude]

Not in a rush. I've heard that Cab Sauvs take a year to smooth out the taste (though I thought the sample I thiefed during the last racking tasted pretty good).

Here's the tip of my racking cane. I think it has a fitting like you're referring to.

 

[sampvt]

Have you considered the fact that the temp you fermented at was a little low and the racking's were premature. Ive noticed that these kits need to be done at the right temp, otherwise they can take a lot longer. It might be the yeast they are using but ive allways done mine on belts and warming plates and I am leaving them, cleared, in demijons before 2 weeks for bulk aging. Just a thought.

 

[Fedoradude]

Have you considered the fact that the temp you fermented at was a little low and the racking's were premature. Ive noticed that these kits need to be done at the right temp, otherwise they can take a lot longer.

That's something to consider.

I was pretty observant of temperature during the fermentation process etc and even went down and bought a belt at my local brewing/oenology shop. They said temps weren't as critical in wine making though compared to beer.

And I racked it on schedule per the directions in the kit - which only called for one racking. Now I've done two, the 2nd done when there was about an inch of sediment on the bottom that didn't seem to be increasing.....

 

[sampvt]

That's something to consider.

I was pretty observant of temperature during the fermentation process etc and even went down and bought a belt at my local brewing/oenology shop. They said temps weren't as critical in wine making though compared to beer.

And I racked it on schedule per the directions in the kit - which only called for one racking. Now I've done two, the 2nd done when there was about an inch of sediment on the bottom that didn't seem to be increasing.....

After this has been considered, your next move is to your trusty Hydrometer. Drop it in tap water at a normal room temp and check it reads '0'. Also check that you racked at 1000 and not too early. Ive got a hydrometer that reads 30 too much so ive rectified it with a rubber band to make it heavier. If your stopping the fermentation or racking early, you will get excessive sediment when the fermentation is over. The only other thing is an over active yeast amount. Most of the kits have 10 or 14 day yeasts which can go for longer, especially if the temps are right but the hydrometer should tell you when the fructose has been converted and its time to rack or stop.

 

[knifemaker]

Did you use a clarifier in this kit? In the second pic, the sediment is a lot lighter, when you use the chitosan clarifier the sediment drops out in a nice tight layer like that. I'm thinking that's what it is. But either way, just relax and let it sit for a few more weeks before you rack again. Dale.

 

[Fedoradude]

Thanks, Sampvt and Knifemaker.

I did cal the hydrometer before the first racking and it checked out right on the $. Yes, the kit did include some of that shellfish based gel stuff and I put it in when the batch went into the carboy as the directions said to do. I also put another batch of it in the carboy this time when we racked it back into the CB.

I'm cool with letting it sit another couple weeks before doing anything else. I'm assuming though that I'll have to still rack it again before bottling or risk getting all this sediment in the bottle??

 

[Tnuscan]

Thanks, Sampvt and Knifemaker.

I did cal the hydrometer before the first racking and it checked out right on the $. Yes, the kit did include some of that shellfish based gel stuff and I put it in when the batch went into the carboy as the directions said to do. I also put another batch of it in the carboy this time when we racked it back into the CB.

I'm cool with letting it sit another couple weeks before doing anything else. I'm assuming though that I'll have to still rack it again before bottling or risk getting all this sediment in the bottle??

I have made this same kit many times. So you should have made your must, as per directions and pitched your yeast, waited 5 to 7 days sg. being @ 1.010 or less. Racked into carboy leaving sediment behind in primary. While finishing the fermentation in carboy (around) 10 days, instructions say to check sg again you should be @ 0.996 or less. Do not rack but stir sediment back into suspension, then add packets #3 and #4 and de-gas then add #5 and degass again.

Some people get confused at this step and rack at the 10 day period. That would be 2 rackings before stabilizing. If this is what you have done, therein may be your problem. If not forgive the interruption.

 

[Arne]

When you get done racking, pour what is left in a botttle or jug, whatever it fits in. Set it in the fridge for a week or two. Now you can pour the wine off the top and get a couple of glasses of tasting wine. Pour careful, tho. Leave most of the sediment in the bottle. Stops you from wasting some of the wine. Arne.

 

[JohnT]

There are two schools of thought here..

One school is that one should rack just as soon as a large layer of sediment forms and then rack the wine again later if need be. This "rack it now" opinion stems from the belief that dead yeast is not desirable.

Another school is of the opinion that you can wait a month until most of the sediment had dropped and is settled at the bottom. This "rack it later" opinion stems from the desire to minimize the exposure of your wine to air and potential "top-off" issues when additional rackings are considered.

Since I use variable capacity SS tanks, top off is not an issue. I also notice that (when I rack a thick layer of dead yeast) it, quite frankly, stinks and not really something that I want my wine exposed to over a long period of time. In short, I am of the school that one should rack as soon as a defined layer of dead yeast forms. Most of my wines are very tannic, so additional aeration is actually beneficial.

My method of racking works for me within my situation. Your situation may be different.

 

[Tnuscan]

There are two schools of thought here..

One school is that one should rack just as soon as a large layer of sediment forms and then rack the wine again later if need be. This "rack it now" opinion stems from the belief that dead yeast is not desirable.

Another school is of the opinion that you can wait a month until most of the sediment had dropped and is settled at the bottom. This "rack it later" opinion stems from the desire to minimize the exposure of your wine to air and potential "top-off" issues when additional rackings are considered.

Since I use variable capacity SS tanks, top off is not an issue. I also notice that (when I rack a thick layer of dead yeast) it, quite frankly, stinks and not really something that I want my wine exposed to over a long period of time. In short, I am of the school that one should rack as soon as a defined layer of dead yeast forms. Most of my wines are very tannic, so additional aeration is actually beneficial.

My method of racking works for me within my situation. Your situation may be different.

JohnT,
What are your thoughts on where WE States not to rack but stir sediment back into solution then add packets. Would you rack and not stir back into solution? I don't understand why they do this when the bentonite is added on start, and racked at day 5 @ 1.010.
Kit instructions @ 0.996= Note: "Do Not rack the wine before stabilising and finning. This kit requires that you stir the sediment back into suspension. Racking the wine off the sediment prior to fining may permanently prevent clearing". I 've always done this as instructed. And only stir back into suspension with the WE Kits.

 

[sampvt]

In the beginning I never used to rack due to equipment issues and Ive never had a bad wine. These days I do it because I can but there isn't much, if any difference. The lees or sediment wont effect the wine when left for a month or less so why rack is a weird one. The secret lies in the degassing. If that's doen properly, the vacated co2 wont hold particles and your wine will clear beautifully.

 

[heatherd]

JohnT,
What are your thoughts on where WE States not to rack but stir sediment back into solution then add packets. Would you rack and not stir back into solution? I don't understand why they do this when the bentonite is added on start, and racked at day 5 @ 1.010.
Kit instructions @ 0.996= Note: "Do Not rack the wine before stabilising and finning. This kit requires that you stir the sediment back into suspension. Racking the wine off the sediment prior to fining may permanently prevent clearing". I 've always done this as instructed. And only stir back into suspension with the WE Kits.

I follow the instructions in that case.

 

[Tnuscan]

I follow the instructions in that case.

Yes. Thank you.