White Niagara (experiment)

[Elmer]

So I am trying my hand at a white Niagara. While I dont drink white, I have plenty of friends who do, and figure it would be ready for next summer. However as all my expieriments go, I never quite stay within the confines of what I am intending to make.

My receipe was as follows:

192 OZ (1.5 Gal) generic white Niagara grape juice.
1 tsp yeast nut
2 cups white sugar
13.6 oz of Frontenac & Marquette ( picked from what was left in my back yard)
SG 1.090
Lavlin D-47

I stirred the heck out of the mixture and squeezed the grapes, stirred again and let sit for an hour. Took SG reading, and stirred again.
Poured Yeast onto must and covered lightly.

Like all my experiments I kept it under 2 gallons and the cost was under $10 ($7.50 for grape juice $1.5 for yeast, everything I already had).

And best of all even if I dont like it, I have a friend and MIL who will!

Now the question is, do you oak this stuff? lightly?

 

[wineforfun]

Elmer,
First question I have is why are you putting Frontenac and Marquette grapes in with the white?
Also, are you trying to make a dry wine or a sweet wine? I have made a sweet wine using Welchs White Niagara concentrate. It is based off the "Awesome White" recipe in the recipe section of the forum.

 

[codeman]

Maybe he's making a rosé. In any case if it were me id shoot for 1.006-1.010 SG with Niagara.

 

[Elmer]

Elmer,
First question I have is why are you putting Frontenac and Marquette grapes in with the white?
Also, are you trying to make a dry wine or a sweet wine? I have made a sweet wine using Welchs White Niagara concentrate. It is based off the "Awesome White" recipe in the recipe section of the forum.

I had the intention of making a white, but just prior to preparing the must I was picking what was left from my grape vines.
I had 13 oz, which is a small bowl. there was little I could do with them beside eat them, but then for the heck of it, I decided to use it in my wine and see how it turns out.

I figured why not?
As I referenced in my OP the batch cost me $10 and experimenting is half the fun.

RE: Dry/sweet
I have no idea, I am a dry red drinker. But I am making it, and I figured I would sweeting just a touch with either some white sugar or white grape juice!

 

[wineforfun]

I figured that was why you were throwing the "reds" in there.

Curious to see how you like it. It was not for me being dry, and I, like you are a dry red drinker.
My wife likes it since I sweetened it up. Finished it off around 1.014 for her.

 

[kevinlfifer]

I made a Niagara using concentrate from

http://homewinery.com/cgi-bin/concen.cgi

I added about 3 lbs of Niagara grapes from the only grapevine I have. Back sweetened with generic frozen white grape juice from the store plus some sugar.

 

[Turock]

We never oak our Niagara because the fruity flavor shines thru better. Of course, you made this FAR different than what we do, and with the other grapes in there, it won't be a true Niagara. It might be able to take some oak.

I'm sure your wife would love the Niagara we make, and since you live in NY, you could source some Niagara grapes, altho NOW it's getting a little late for them. We pick them when they are still green--they lose flavor when allowed to ripen to yellow. If you ever want to try it, I'll help you with how to work with these grapes. We like the fruity flavor of this grape and it's our favorite white because of the big flavor this wine has.

 

[Elmer]

We never oak our Niagara because the fruity flavor shines thru better. Of course, you made this FAR different than what we do, and with the other grapes in there, it won't be a true Niagara. It might be able to take some oak.

I'm sure your wife would love the Niagara we make, and since you live in NY, you could source some Niagara grapes, altho NOW it's getting a little late for them. We pick them when they are still green--they lose flavor when allowed to ripen to yellow. If you ever want to try it, I'll help you with how to work with these grapes. We like the fruity flavor of this grape and it's our favorite white because of the big flavor this wine has.

Maybe once this batch is done brewing, I will make an attempt at a true "Niagara" and I will try not to deviate from the recipe!

I know I am putting horse before cart, but will cold storage clear a white?
or will I have to resort to Sparkalloid?

 

[cintipam]

Hi Elmer. Niagara is not the same as most white wines. It is a bear to clear. Double up on pectic enzyme (don't add at same day as Kmeta or during active fermentation tho) and maybe, just maybe, it will clear on its own.

Pam in cinti

 

[Elmer]

Out of curiosity, if white niagara a slow fermt?
Or d47 not a very frothy yeast?
2 days in and I am only down to 1.070, which is not an issue because there is audio and visual confirmation of action.
But I lost the froth after 2 days.

I have never used d 47 before or white niagara for that matter


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[Turock]

Your ferment might be slow due to the need for nutrient. You should always step-feed it. Lack of nutrient will give you a sluggish finish. Get a dose of nutrient in it. Speed of ferment depends on the culture and your nutrient protocol.

We like Montrachet on Niagara because it enhances the fruity profile of this grape.

Elmer---when you do a Niagara ferment from grapes, let me walk you thru how we do it. So many people comment that no one's Niagara tastes like ours does. I KNOW your wife would love it.

 

[cintipam]

Turock, I'd love to hear your procedure for Niagara. It is easy to find and very versatile.

Elmer, IMHO D47 is slow and not too foamy. But that is a good thing with white wines. Do step feed like Turock said tho. That is always good yeast management. I read a post long long ago about someone using D47 for the first time and pitching the batch when it was done because it had an "unusual" smell. Later tried it again, smell the same but he let it age and it turned out to be the best ever made. So unless the smell is BAD you are doing fine. D47 is the main yeast recommended for Sur Lie and Battonage treatments. I just threw D47 yeast on a double batch of Chard that I plan to split and do 1/2 regular and 1/2 battonage just to see how it changes things up.

Pam in cinti

 

[Elmer]

I fed the must some nutrient and it foamed up, a lot.
It settled down, so I hope I am on the right track!


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[Turock]

Pam--D47 is THE yeast for Chard. I'm impressed with how you've progressed in knowledge since you first started on this forum!! You must be doing alot of studying. Doing battonage will impress you--it definitely influences flavor and gets the wine ready for drinking earlier than usual. Not sure that's so important on a white, but it's a good experiment if you've never done it. Doing it on a red lessens the time for the flavor to come forward.

When we do Niagara, we ferment on the skins and pulp. We did a head-to-head comparison of our Niagara, done on pulp and skins, against a Niagara done by pressing and using the juice only. Ours had much more fruity flavor than using just the juice. So if you're a fan of that fruity flavor, ferment on the pulp and skins. We like to set the PH at 3.2, use a good dose of pectic enzyme or Lallyzme C-Max. I recommend the Lallzyme because Niagara can be hard to clear at times.

We like to pick this grape when it has a brix of 14 and it's still green. They lose much flavor when they begin to turn yellow, altho you can add SOME clusters of the yellow ones. Just be sure most of them are green.

On the 2nd or 3rd day of the ferment, add a dose of bentonite to the primary. Bentonite really helps clear the wine,espcially if you set the PH at 3.2.

Ferment the whole way on the skins and pulp. Use Montrachet culture--it's fruity profile really enhances the flavor of this grape. Do a cool ferment to retain the volatiles. Set the vat in a wash tub or similar container and add water and ice as needed to keep the ferment around 68-72 degrees. The cool ferment will extend the entire ferment to 7 or 8 days instead of the usual 5. Press the grapes at the end.

If you end up doing quite a few gallons of this wine, take 5 gallons of it when it's ready to bottle and add 2 cans of frozen limeaide from the freezer case. Add some more sugar to it--we like an SG of about 1.020 because it takes that much sweetness to balance the acid of the wine and the acid of the lime. The wine will be dirty--quite cloudy. But don't strain the lime pieces out because the lime flavor will not be as good. This is a really great drink--especially in summer. MANY of our friends LOVE this wine!! Be sure to shake the bottle up before opening to distribute the limeaide. Only do 5 gallons at a time and drink within 6 months because the limeaide doesn't age too well--loses that great lime flavor.

 

[Elmer]

MY SG is not down to 1.010.
tonight I am going to squeeze the bag, give it a stir, snapp the lid shut and let it ferment out?

Is it not advisable to give nutrient at this point, or just let it be until it hits under 1.000?

 

[wineforfun]

No nutrient now, not enough sugar left. Let it be.

 

[Elmer]

SG has been at .996 for a few days. So I racked, k meta , saving sorbate for later.

I am now going to let it clear on its own. Might throw in fridge after degassing or might wait till garage drops below 30.

Either way I don't plan on having tips to drink until next summer & that might be too soon!






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[Turock]

Having it too cool will prevent it from clearing. Why do you want to cold stabilize if the acid is fine on it? We never CS Niagara because we use no carbonate on it unless we have a bad ripening year where the acid is too high. And with the use of calcium carb, the tartarteric crystals drop out at room temp.

I would keep it in a slightly warm area--70 degrees or so to encourage it to clear. Niagara can present clearing problems some time so if it's not clearing in 6 months, add a double dose of pectic enzyme to it, keep it in a warmer area and it should clear out for you.

 

[Elmer]

Having it too cool will prevent it from clearing. Why do you want to cold stabilize if the acid is fine on it? We never CS Niagara because we use no carbonate on it unless we have a bad ripening year where the acid is too high. And with the use of calcium carb, the tartarteric crystals drop out at room temp.

I would keep it in a slightly warm area--70 degrees or so to encourage it to clear. Niagara can present clearing problems some time so if it's not clearing in 6 months, add a double dose of pectic enzyme to it, keep it in a warmer area and it should clear out for you.

I have found that with my reds when I have odd sizes after racking (32 or 16 oz, or even 1/2 gallon.)
I stuck in the fridge and this stuff cleared in days.

I guess in my noodness, I still approaching whites like reds


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[Elmer]

SG has been at .996 for a few days. So I racked, k meta , saving sorbate for later.

I am now going to let it clear on its own. Might throw in fridge after degassing or might wait till garage drops below 30.

Either way I don't plan on having tips to drink until next summer & that might be too soon!


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The oaked version is tasty the unoaked has a grape skin flavor to it. Which makes it a little harsh. Might need a tough of sugar to balance it out.
But It cleared nicely. And not really all that blush considering the use of non white grapes