Why do my wines always stop fermenting as soon as I transfer them to secondary?

[abefroman]

As others have mentioned you could let it ferment completely in the bucket. If you want to transfer to the carboy, do it when the SG is around 1.010 when the yeast is a little more active rather than down around 1.000. Also, don't be afraid to bring over some sediment to the carboy from the bucket.

Thanks, good tips there.

 

[Lurker]

As others have mentioned you could let it ferment completely in the bucket. If you want to transfer to the carboy, do it when the SG is around 1.010 when the yeast is a little more active rather than down around 1.000. Also, don't be afraid to bring over some sediment to the carboy from the bucket.

What is the downside of allowing it to ferment out in the primary on top of the sediment? b

 

[abefroman]

What is the downside of allowing it to ferment out in the primary on top of the sediment? b

It can oxidize due to the large amount of air contact, which is what I'm trying to avoid. I had a batch oxidize already, but that was due to low acid. It still drinkable and most people don't notice it oxidized a little, if you drink wine a lot you can tell though.

 

[AlFulchino]

i dont mean to disagree...but you should never see a wine oxidize if you let it ferment to dry whilst in the primary.....once it is dry however, that is all it should remain in the primary...co2 levels will have decreased and that is what is protecting the wine...so get it under airlock and resume whatever it is you intend..oak/stabilize etc

but fermenting to dry is not enough time to oxidize

in fact as a test last yr i left 1.5 gallons of wine in a three gallon carboy for over 6 mos..it was a white wine...my la prima frutta...it was the excess from a larger tank...i properly stabilized AFTER fermenting to dry.....left it under airlock for all that time...no oxidation...zero, none, nada...i am not advising you to do this...just making the point that if you handle the wine right and stabilize then wine is very forgiving

 

[abefroman]

i dont mean to disagree...but you should never see a wine oxidize if you let it ferment to dry whilst in the primary.....once it is dry however, that is all it should remain in the primary...co2 levels will have decreased and that is what is protecting the wine...so get it under airlock and resume whatever it is you intend..oak/stabilize etc

but fermenting to dry is not enough time to oxidize

Thanks! Make sense.

 

[abefroman]

For the 2 that I have in secondary now, should I go ahead an stabalize them?

 

[AlFulchino]

what i personally do w my harvest is ferment to dry outside or earlier if i am trying to retain some sweetness......so now we have two groups

the dry will be racked into the winery and i let settle for another 1-1.5 mos....at this point it is decision time..some i rack off into another thank and apply oak and some k meta and argon if needed.....others i let remain on lees but apply oak, stabilize and argon if needed...now its aging time

if it retains some sweetness then once in teh winery it is immediately stabilized, oaked and gassed if there is headspace......i wont rack this again until i am satisfied w oaking or i bottle months down the road.....

each particular wine has its own nuance and needs...but thats a quicky....and always monitor sulfite level

 

[Dugger]

What is the downside of allowing it to ferment out in the primary on top of the sediment? b

None that I know of - I quite often do this, although I start out under a loose lid until a SG of about 1.010 and then put it under a tight lid and airlock to finish. My point was that if you are going to transfer to the carboy to complete fermentation then I would do it at about 1.010 rather than 1.000 - keep in mind I do mostly kits.

 

[Dugger]

For the 2 that I have in secondary now, should I go ahead an stabalize them?

Once they have completed fermentation and the SG doesn't change over a couple of days, then yes, you should stabilize them. I would think you should get down to around 0.996 for the Cab Franc and Merlot.

 

[cpfan]

For the 2 that I have in secondary now, should I go ahead an stabalize them?

abe:

I am surprised that I don't see a comment here from someone saying...
"follow the three P's" Patience Patience Patience.

It seems to me that you are rushing your wines. Give them time, and they will be much better.

According to your initial post, you have 3 in secondary. Warm them all up, and then wait at least a week (10-14 days or more even better). Take some more sg readings over 2-3 days. Then decide if it is time to stabilize.

BTW the Merlot and Cab Franc are apparently kits. Why aren't you following the instructions? I know that sg is more important than time, but time is also important, as is temperature. I don't even think about stabilizing a kit until day 20-30.

Steve

 

[abefroman]

abe:

According to your initial post, you have 3 in secondary. Warm them all up, and then wait at least a week (10-14 days or more even better). Take some more sg readings over 2-3 days. Then decide if it is time to stabilize.

BTW the Merlot and Cab Franc are apparently kits. Why aren't you following the instructions? I know that sg is more important than time, but time is also important, as is temperature. I don't even think about stabilizing a kit until day 20-30.

Steve

Will I have to worry about oxidation, if no/little C02 is being produced when I haven't sulphated?

 

[ajhughes]

Yes, I actually keep the lid on the whole time and just open it daily and stir or punch down depending on what Im fermenting. I have a cat that will get right into the wine if I dont snap the lid down.

Do you find when you stir kits every day or so that they have a tendency to ferment more quickly? I've taken a similar approach and all of my kits have fermented to below 1.000 days early than the kit instructions suggest. Is that to be expected?

 

[wvbrewer]

Will fermenting to dry in the primary cause any off flavors or will aging in a secondary take care of that issue? I know that a few people will let finnish out in the primary.

 

[cpfan]

Will I have to worry about oxidation, if no/little C02 is being produced when I haven't sulphated?

I don't think so. The wine contains a lot of CO2 because you haven't degassed yet. BTW, the 64F wines will hold even more CO2 than the 72F wine.

Steve

 

[abefroman]

I don't think so. The wine contains a lot of CO2 because you haven't degassed yet. BTW, the 64F wines will hold even more CO2 than the 72F wine.

Steve

Cool, thx!!

 

[Midwest Vintner]

IMHO, i wouldn't let it ferment completely dry. I mean, 1.005 or so and i feel it's necessary to start protecting it from O2. it also depends on the wine. An apple, pear or similar has a much faster oxidation rate than red wine would. I would just error on the side of caution. if it stops early and it then sits in open air for 10 hours, that's not good. if you are around it most of the day and check it often (maybe twice a day), than it probably will be fine.

also, nobody has asked about the yeast. how are you storing the yeast and how old is it? what type or brand is being used? are you testing the acid? gotta keep your little workers happy or sometimes they'll slack on you! lol. some yeasts don't do bad in 60F temps. we've been keeping our winery in the low 60's and using lalvin 1116 for some wines without any issue. in fact wine temps usually gets up to 75-80F, so it's probably better in that case to keep it a bit cooler.

also, are you stirring enough? sometimes that can really help.

although, what others have said is probably right, i thought i'd put some other ideas out there. everyone does their own thing with wine and that's the BEST thing about it.

 

[abefroman]

IMHO, i wouldn't let it ferment completely dry. I mean, 1.005 or so and i feel it's necessary to start protecting it from O2. it also depends on the wine. An apple, pear or similar has a much faster oxidation rate than red wine would. I would just error on the side of caution. if it stops early and it then sits in open air for 10 hours, that's not good. if you are around it most of the day and check it often (maybe twice a day), than it probably will be fine.

also, nobody has asked about the yeast. how are you storing the yeast and how old is it? what type or brand is being used? are you testing the acid? gotta keep your little workers happy or sometimes they'll slack on you! lol. some yeasts don't do bad in 60F temps. we've been keeping our winery in the low 60's and using lalvin 1116 for some wines without any issue. in fact wine temps usually gets up to 75-80F, so it's probably better in that case to keep it a bit cooler.

also, are you stirring enough? sometimes that can really help.

although, what others have said is probably right, i thought i'd put some other ideas out there. everyone does their own thing with wine and that's the BEST thing about it.

Its from a kit, Lalvin EC-1118, I used it as soon as the kit came. Should I switch to 1116?

I didn't stir too much except to break up the cap, should I stir the bottom up daily as well?

I didn't test the acid, I assume the kit make did that for the juice and will test once I start bulk ageing.

 

[abefroman]

After shaking the tube to degas my reds are both at 0.999 and the jalapeno is at 1.000.

The reds have some bubble action in the carboy, but the airlock isn't really moving.