RJ Spagnols WS Italian Super Tuscan at Bottling

[Thomas]

Hi All,

My Spagnols WS Italian Super Tuscan is a week away from scheduled bottling. I was curious to see how it was changing from when I started so I took a nip from the Carboy last week (2 weeks from bottling).

The wine went from tasting fruity and pleasant during secondary fermentation to being harsh, acidic, and high alcohol during clarification. All of the numbers appeared to be where they should be throughout the process.

I understand that a young wine can be very astringent and harsh due to tannin, and this would make sense here due to the grape skins that were added to the must.

Anyone else notice these qualities early on? How long does this wine take to mellow out? I've read on other posts here that the wine was tasty at bottling, but I'm not getting that impression.

Any insight would be greatly appreciated!! Thanks in advance.

 

[bkisel]

Welcome to the forum!

I've made the same wine according to RJS instructions and without any tweaks. When the instructions would have had me bottle I bulk aged for three months and then bottled aged for three months. Upon tasting after the 6 months I was very pleased with the results. So... My thinking is you just need to allow the wine to age some.

BTW, the WS Super Tuscan seems to have gotten very good reviews on this forum. It is a favorite wine for many of us who mostly do kits.

Oh, did you check the date on the box? With a higher end kit like the Winery Series I would not buy any that were on the shelf for over a year.

 

[joeswine]

Time in a bottle

yes by all means let it rest and start to be all it can be with out to much disturbance,just be patient this wine will change any number of times before it's matured,just be patient and let it sit.

 

[jsiddall]

I too was perplexed by people who said it was great at bottling. I couldn't drink mine. It is now 9 months old and getting to the point where I can stomach it. Still far from nice. I am hoping another year or two will turn it into something enjoyable. Sorry to be the bearer of bad news but hopefully that reset your expectations a bit.

 

[the_rayway]

Just wondering (as I'm hoping to make this kit sometime soon myself): when you say it was fruity and pleasant during secondary fermentation - was that after most of the sugar had fermented out? Or before?

Sounds like a silly question I know, but my brother made a batch of red wine from a kit and after going through all the steps, he complained that there was 'no buzz' when he drank the wine. I asked if it was sweet and he said yes. Turns out he didn't realize that it hadn't fermented out fully.

Short story long: was it fruity and pleasant with sweetness? Or dry, but fruity and pleasant?

 

[Thomas]

Update: The harsh qualities of the wine I described above were experienced last week a few days after stabilization.

I tried another sample today (one week following stabilization and one week prior to bottling) and there was substantial improvement. I noticed a hint of sweetness on the palate even though the wine fermented to dry - this was something noticed by others who have made this kit. The wine is returning to its fruit forward quality that I have read in other Super Tuscan posts. It's amazing what one week will do to a young wine. I'm really looking forward to seeing how this one evolves.

This small experiment has given me a glimer of an appreciation of what aging a wine can do. Here's to bottling!

 

[Thomas]

Just wondering (as I'm hoping to make this kit sometime soon myself): when you say it was fruity and pleasant during secondary fermentation - was that after most of the sugar had fermented out? Or before?

Sounds like a silly question I know, but my brother made a batch of red wine from a kit and after going through all the steps, he complained that there was 'no buzz' when he drank the wine. I asked if it was sweet and he said yes. Turns out he didn't realize that it hadn't fermented out fully.

Short story long: was it fruity and pleasant with sweetness? Or dry, but fruity and pleasant?

Hi the_rayway,

I noticed a few things: after fermenting, the wine was placed into secondary and at that time there was residual sugar left to ferment, and so naturally the wine was still sweet and very fruit forward. Once secondary was complete, and the wine was dry, there was no sweetness but there was a nice residual coating of fruit on the palate with a long aftertaste. This went away after stabilization and the wine was harsh, bitter, sour, and very unpleasant. Today, one week prior to bottling, the fruit flavour is coming back and almost a hint of sweetness is detected even though the wine is dry.

Compared to my Grand Cru Washington Merlot, this kit is already ahead in many ways. I'd say it's worth a go!

 

[Boatboy24]

Glad its already come back around for you. Mine was fruit forward for 6+ months (and I was a little disappointed by that, based on the style), but still good. Once it hit about 14 months, the fruit fell back, dryness and tannin came forward. It's over 18 months now and is fantastic. I need to make another, because I'm down to about 8 bottles.

 

[heatherd]

It is a really good kit, mine was tasty at about the six month mark and obviously more so beyond.
Heather

 

[TheGoodLife]

I've made this kit quite a few times as well as the Rosso Grande and recently really like the Valpolicella. It's one of our favorites.

My wife and I now call the "Super Tuscan" the "Super Drunk"... One time after drinking a couple bottles on a cold snowy winter day we decided go online and order some symphony tickets. We splurged and bought the most expensive tickets available... that's not like us.

 

[bkisel]

I've made this kit quite a few times as well as the Rosso Grande and recently really like the Valpolicella. It's one of our favorites.

My wife and I now call the "Super Tuscan" the "Super Drunk"... One time after drinking a couple bottles on a cold snowy winter day we decided go online and order some symphony tickets. We splurged and bought the most expensive tickets available... that's not like us.

Fits your user name... "TheGoodLife"

 

[Geronimo]

One thing I've noticed.... I have to be careful what's going on with my palate when I do a tasting. You need to do whatever it takes to neutralize your palate first, because tasting is usually a small amount and we're all set to be very critical of that tiny sample.