# New Wine Room Design



## Raptor99 (Dec 7, 2021)

I am in the process of designing a new wine room and I thought I'd ask for your suggestions. We have a space at the back of the garage that is set up as an exercise room, which we don't really need. We plan to move in interior wall to make it a bit wider and will end up with a space that is about 12' x 8'. Our house has a heat pump, and according to the former owners it is capable of supporting another head. So I think we can put a heat pump head in the wine room for heating and cooling. Of course we will need to add insulation.

What I know I need:

Large sink with hot and cold water
Lots of counter space (probably at least 12')
Shelves for supplies, empty bottles and carboys
Wine bottle rack
Exhaust fan
Refrigerator and small microwave
Plenty of electrical outlets and lights
I'm interested in hearing your thoughts on what you would include (if possible) when setting up a wine room. If you have a wine room or would like to have one, what would be the most important features?


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## ChuckD (Dec 8, 2021)

I have been planning a home addition for years and should be pulling the trigger next year. Being in a northern climate, it comes with a basement. I hunt and fish a lot so I had originally planned to add an outside entry to the basement with a restaurant sink and some counter space for game processing, fish cleaning, and canning produce from the garden. Since being bitten by the wine-making bug It will now be used for wine making as well. 

I plan on picking up a used stainless restaurant sink with two or three large basins and a drain board on at least one side... preferably both. I plan on putting it in a corner with plenty of counter space and a rolling stainless steel table that I can position where I want it. The basement will have poured concrete walls and floors. I plan on painting/coating the walls, putting dairy board on the ceiling, and installing a floor drain near the sink. A refrigerator is a must, and a cooktop would be nice as well. I have an existing underground cellar that I have been outfitting for wine storage/aging and in my fevered dreams I'm considering putting an access from the new basement to the cellar since there will only be about three feet of earth between them.

Right now my wine making is confined to a seldom used basement bathroom so if I can manage half of this it will be a major improvement.

ETA: Oh yeah, and an exhaust fan


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## ratflinger (Dec 8, 2021)

Double sink, I am always glad I went with that. High shelves, especially if you have Better Bottles. It's no issue to store (empty) them high. I also have mid-high shelves for the small stuff. Got small wire baskets to hold the small stuff. Don't get a small bathroom exhaust fan, get a high CFM fan. If you have a vac or wine pump, I put mine on a cart so I can roll it out of the way. Don't forget the high quality water filter unless you like lugging bottles.

BTW - you want more counter space, my wine room is 8x10 and I managed to cram 17 feet of counter space in, wish I had room for more. 10' on one side, 7' on the other, with the double sink in between. I don't have to move too far to reach any of my supplies or equipment. My cart sits at the end of the 7' side, which lets the door open maybe 3/4 of the way. If you get the SS tables like I have, you can store bottles on the bottom. If you want full carboys on the bottom then you need to brace the shelf. Carboys are below the max weight, but the lower shelf will still bend. Oh yeah, paint the walls burgundy - the mess won't be so apparent.


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## ChuckD (Dec 8, 2021)

I found some commercial shelving two years ago that a store was throwing out and snagged that. I also found the perfect commercial sink last year on Craigs list but I had no where to store it . I do see them listed fairly regular when I look though.


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## winemaker81 (Dec 8, 2021)

I also vote for a double sink. I installed the deepest stainless steel sink and tallest faucet I could get so I could fit buckets into the sink. A used restaurant sink would be better, as it's probably larger.

I installed a faucet in our kitchen that has the sprayer built into the normal faucet. If I replace the one in the wine area, that's what I'll install.

Build a section of your counter at a slant so sediment can fall to the lowest part of the carboy. This can save wine when racking off the lees.


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## Raptor99 (Dec 8, 2021)

ratflinger said:


> Double sink, I am always glad I went with that. High shelves, especially if you have Better Bottles. It's no issue to store (empty) them high. I also have mid-high shelves for the small stuff. Got small wire baskets to hold the small stuff. Don't get a small bathroom exhaust fan, get a high CFM fan. If you have a vac or wine pump, I put mine on a cart so I can roll it out of the way. Don't forget the high quality water filter unless you like lugging bottles.
> 
> BTW - you want more counter space, my wine room is 8x10 and I managed to cram 17 feet of counter space in, wish I had room for more. 10' on one side, 7' on the other, with the double sink in between. I don't have to move too far to reach any of my supplies or equipment. My cart sits at the end of the 7' side, which lets the door open maybe 3/4 of the way. If you get the SS tables like I have, you can store bottles on the bottom. If you want full carboys on the bottom then you need to brace the shelf. Carboys are below the max weight, but the lower shelf will still bend. Oh yeah, paint the walls burgundy - the mess won't be so apparent.



It sounds great. Please post some pictures!


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## Raptor99 (Dec 8, 2021)

@ratflinger and @winemaker81 you both mentioned a double sink. Some people on this forum mentioned that they are using a large laundry sink. Do you think that a double sink has significant advantages over that? Either way, I need a sink large enough for 5 gal buckets and carboys.

I will keep watch on Craig's list for a commercial sink.


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## winemaker81 (Dec 8, 2021)

Raptor99 said:


> @ratflinger and @winemaker81 you both mentioned a double sink. Some people on this forum mentioned that they are using a large laundry sink. Do you think that a double sink has significant advantages over that? Either way, I need a sink large enough for 5 gal buckets and carboys.


Mine is large enough to drain a 7.9 gallon primary upside down, and easily fits a carboy, and can soak 8 bottles in one side of the sink. The advantage of a double sink is you can do 2 different things at the same time.

On the flip side, laundry sinks tend to be deeper, so you can completely submerge larger objects.

Unfortunately, fiberglass laundry sinks can't handle abuse the way stainless steel can. Circa 1990, an acquaintance dropped a full carboy in a laundry sink -- the carboy went through the sink and shattered on a cement floor. This turned me off the idea of a laundry sink, as if I lose grip on a full carboy, I'll be replacing the carboy and wine, not the sink as well, and cleaning up less mess. [It's entirely possible that today's laundry sinks are sturdier, but I have not researched it.]

YMMV


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## Raptor99 (Dec 8, 2021)

@winemaker81 Good point. If I go with a laundry sink I will get a stainless steel one.


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## Rocky (Dec 8, 2021)

I am not trying to debate the merits of a laundry sink vs. stainless steel. I have a double thermo plastic laundry sink which I installed in place of the single sink provided by our builder. We did some remodeling on our kitchen and I kept the "goose neck" faucet and installed it on the laundry sink. I can easily fit a 6-gallon carboy in the sink for cleaning or even a fermenting bucket. Works great for me and it is likely a less expensive alternative. The sink in the picture is about 10 years old. It cleans up nicely and I don't worry about banging glass against it.

I bought the sink at Home Depot: MUSTEE Utilatub 40 in. x 24 in. x 33 in. Thermoplastic Floor Mount Utility Tub in White-27F - The Home Depot


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## winemaker81 (Dec 8, 2021)

Rocky said:


> I have a double thermo plastic laundry sink which I installed in place of the single sink provided by our builder.


That looks sturdier than the laundry sinks I'm familiar with, although I can't recall seeing one that has been built in the last 15 years, so my knowledge is out of date.

This raises a design consideration -- what space will the sink be placed in? I built an 8' counter and mounted the SS sink it, while Rocky has a free standing space. The situation will drive which type of sink to get, regardless of material.


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## sour_grapes (Dec 8, 2021)

And here I thought that ALL laundry tubs were concrete!


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## Raptor99 (Dec 8, 2021)

winemaker81 said:


> This raises a design consideration -- what space will the sink be placed in? I built an 8' counter and mounted the SS sink it, while Rocky has a free standing space. The situation will drive which type of sink to get, regardless of material.



My goal is to build the sink into the counter.


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## ratflinger (Dec 8, 2021)

I'll get some pics of my room loaded, but yeah, I think double sinks almost a 'must have'. Really makes bottling simpler for me. I have a bottle washer in the 1st sink, 2nd sink has EasyClean in it, then to a manual sprayer with no-rinse chlorine sanitizer, and onto the bottle tree. My sink is one of those thermoplastic units, but I have moved to a no handling full carboys routine. The only time I manually move carboys is when they are empty, and then just to clean.


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## winemaker81 (Dec 8, 2021)

Raptor99 said:


> My goal is to build the sink into the counter.


I tried homedepot.com, looking at utility and double sinks. The price on some of these made me cough up a lung.

Try your local home improvement stores, and check if Habitat for Humanity has one of their stores local to you. Get the biggest one you can, as you'll be using it for a long time.


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## ratflinger (Dec 8, 2021)




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## ChuckD (Dec 9, 2021)

A group I belong to runs a food stand at the Lambeau Field and they have a stainless steel three-basin sink labeled wash/sanitize/rinse with a three-foot drain board on each end. This is my ideal sink for the wine room. I would settle for a two-basin model. Take it from someone who worked as a dishwasher in a restaurant when young... tall back splashes, an overhead spray nozzle, and drain boards are the bomb.


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## Rocky (Dec 9, 2021)

Raptor99 said:


> My goal is to build the sink into the counter.


You might consider using legs on the sink even if you build it into the counter. Belt and suspenders!

Also, a drain board is very helpful as others have stated above. I just use a crude rubber kitchen drain board that has a slant to it and the excess water runs into the sink. You can see it on the right of the first picture above.


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## Vino Ventures (Dec 9, 2021)

ratflinger said:


> I'll get some pics of my room loaded, but yeah, I think double sinks almost a 'must have'. Really makes bottling simpler for me. I have a bottle washer in the 1st sink, 2nd sink has EasyClean in it, then to a manual sprayer with no-rinse chlorine sanitizer, and onto the bottle tree. My sink is one of those thermoplastic units, but I have moved to a no handling full carboys routine. The only time I manually move carboys is when they are empty, and then just to clean.


Can you describe your handling full carboys routine? Thanks


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## ratflinger (Dec 9, 2021)

Yes, I don't handle full carboys, period. Explanation is not short, but you asked ..... 

Please refer to pictures 2 & 4 above. My carboys are lined up in the order I use them. By the sink are my 2 Speidel fermenters, then the two 6.5gal kill jugs (for the k-meta & settling agents). I can spin those up with my battery drill without overflowing. There is plenty of CO2 left to protect the headspace. Moving further to the right are my two 6gal carboys, these are for secondary settling. In these two carboys I will either top with wine or I will fill with clear, US made marbles. I make 2 batches at a time, so everything is doubled up. Up to this point each batch will sit in each fermenter/carboy for at least a month. So now we move to the Better Bottles(BB), this is where I do my bulk aging, min of 3 months. I usually make table wine and a few long-terms for Sunday use. In my BB I only use wine for topping up, if needed. Either the BB are slightly undersized or the 6 gal carboys are slightly large, as I usualy have a little leftover, doesn't matter as I fill my wife's cooking wine bottle with the leftovers. Now for not handling full carboys, in the 4th pic you will see my pump cart. On it is a Pentair food grade fluid pump, a vacuum pump, and a whole house water filter. I won't really speak of the vacuum pump as I don't use it much. All racking is done via the Pentair pump, with a prefilter in the hose between the racking cane and the pump. The large filter only comes into play when moving from the 6gal carboy to my 6gal BB. I use a 1 micron filter and the end result is that after 3 mo in the BB there is only a little color left at the bottom of the BB. I push through the filter, thus I don't have an issue with the air release on the filter case since I am pushing through instead of pulling through. The pump will pump air, so I can easily empty the filter. For cleaning I just drop the racking cane in EasyClean and the discharge hose in the sink. When the wine is ready (3 mo or so), depending upon taste, I either rack it into the kegs or I bottle it. The only time I move a carboy is when it is empty and I need to clean it. Empty BB sit on the upper shelf (pic 4), but usually there is only the two 3 gal BB I use for port. Otherwise I keep everything full and just adjust my start times to regulate the amount of finished wine I have on hand. I usually use 2 kegs for ready wine and I have 2 more that I store in, if I've gotten ahead of myself. It's the linear cabinet/tabletops that I have that allow this. There's 10 feet on the side where all this happens. If I had more room I can guarantee there'd be more BB lined up.


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## Old Corker (Dec 9, 2021)

@ratflinger Very slick setup and process. I hope to be there some day. Nowhere near there yet.


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## Raptor99 (Dec 9, 2021)

My goal is to never need to handle full carboys. If I have enough counter space, I can use my AIO wine pump to move wine between carboys and for bottling. If I have a shelf below the counter, I can rack wine into a carboy there for bulk aging, and then use the pump to rack it out for bottling. The only time I need to handle carboys in the sink is when I am washing them.


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## ratflinger (Dec 9, 2021)

I'm 66, handling full carboys is asking for disaster. I can handle them, but I'd rather not. I'd rather think harder and act smarter.


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## ratflinger (Dec 9, 2021)

Old Corker said:


> @ratflinger Very slick setup and process. I hope to be there some day. Nowhere near there yet.



Thank you. I didn't get here overnight either. This process works for me, but you may come up with a process that works better for you. That's the nice thing about this, someone else's process does not negate what you feel works well for you. The best process you can have is a fluid one. If someone else is doing something that also works for you then you fold it in. Most of what I've learned has come from reading and studying this forum. There are many people here much smarter than myself.


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## mainshipfred (Dec 9, 2021)

sour_grapes said:


> And here I thought that ALL laundry tubs were concrete!



My son recently bought a 1920's house in Cleveland. It has a 3 compartment concrete laundry sink. Other than that, except for a commercial floor sink, I haven't seem a concrete one in forever.


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## winemaker81 (Dec 9, 2021)

ratflinger said:


> I'm 66, handling full carboys is asking for disaster. I can handle them, but I'd rather not. I'd rather think harder and act smarter.


I'm a few years behind you and can still handle full carboys, but the handwriting is on the wall. Regardless of age, the best way to prevent a problem is to completely circumvent it. Using a pump is a wise choice.



ratflinger said:


> There are many people here much smarter than myself.


You're living vicariously through the mistakes of others -- that's wisdom! Don't sell yourself short!

I'll cheerfully post a description of my mistakes -- if I prevent one person from making the same mistake I did? The post was worth the time.


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## Rice_Guy (Dec 9, 2021)

I find it interesting no one has said a floor drain yet.
Number one is storage area, *you will never have enough *as for full carboys/ empty glass/ pumps/ filtration/ fruit press/ cases of bottles. Storage can be lesser grade as formica or wire racks. #2 is a wet process area which is smaller than storage, I like stainless but the key is being able to clean it, yup I have cleaned both walls and floor. A lot of my transfers are gravity with vacuum assistance so I have milk crates and metal stands to adjust height.


#3 is a dry chemical/ sugar/ weighing/ lab test area. My Chemical bench is the smallest section. Some club folks keep a desk with the chromatography or Hacch meter


#4 some club members have a display area for ribbons.

A lot of what you need is based on your style. One club member has a chest freezer to precipitate tartrates from northern hybrid grapes. I do a lot of country wines so I wind up having a freezer with five gallons of rhubarb juice or grape or fresh gooseberry or raspberry etc. If you make the same wines every year you can lock in your benches & the tools you always use, I change the country wines every season so flexibility is a key.


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## ratflinger (Dec 9, 2021)

Ah, a basement, yes that is nice. I live in South Texas, basements are in commercial buildings, none in homes. The house contractors wouldn't know how.  We have no freeze lines so the ground doesn't get dug out to set a foundation. A floor drain certainly would be handy.


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## Rice_Guy (Dec 9, 2021)

ratflinger said:


> a basement, I live in South Texas, basements are in commercial buildings, none in homes.


south Texas, HUM,
when I lived in Houston Heights a few houses had them, and then again ones close to the bayou would flood every hurricane.

AND Houston had surface water so the winery and food lab would have carbon filtered water.


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## Raptor99 (Dec 9, 2021)

Thank you everyone for your input. I am building my wish list, and then I will see what is possible.


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## Bossbaby (Dec 9, 2021)

Raptor99 said:


> @ratflinger and @winemaker81 you both mentioned a double sink. Some people on this forum mentioned that they are using a large laundry sink. Do you think that a double sink has significant advantages over that? Either way, I need a sink large enough for 5 gal buckets and carboys.
> 
> I will keep watch on Craig's list for a commercial sink.




installing a comercial sink was a game changer for me for sure. You will not regret being able to fit a carboy under the faucet and the overhead sprayer is sweet.


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## MisterEd (Dec 9, 2021)

winemaker81 said:


> Mine is large enough to drain a 7.9 gallon primary upside down, and easily fits a carboy, and can soak 8 bottles in one side of the sink. The advantage of a double sink is you can do 2 different things at the same time.
> 
> On the flip side, laundry sinks tend to be deeper, so you can completely submerge larger objects.
> 
> ...


I use the same sink outside in my vineyard/garden area to clean carboys, etc. If you use treated support posts for the legs the thing is good for almost forever. A frost free hydrant comes up the back for the water so it works out well.


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## Rocky (Dec 10, 2021)

Old Corker said:


> @ratflinger Very slick setup and process. I hope to be there some day. Nowhere near there yet.


"Romania wasn't built in a day." _Archie Bunker_


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## ChuckD (Dec 10, 2021)

Rice_Guy said:


> I find it interesting no one has said a floor drain yet.
> Number one is storage area, *you will never have enough *as for full carboys/ empty glass/ pumps/ filtration/ fruit press/ cases of bottles. Storage can be lesser grade as formica or wire racks. #2 is a wet process area which is smaller than storage, I like stainless but the key is being able to clean it, yup I have cleaned both walls and floor. A lot of my transfers are gravity with vacuum assistance so I have milk crates and metal stands to adjust height.
> View attachment 81984
> 
> ...



That is one wicked mad scientist setup you have there!! I don’t see ever getting that technical with my wine production but very cool nonetheless.


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## jpdflyboy (Dec 10, 2021)

This is a transmission jack from Harbor Freight. I raise and lower with a drill.


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## Rocky (Dec 10, 2021)

jpdflyboy said:


> This is a transmission jack from Harbor Freight. I raise and lower with a drill.


Brilliant! Looks like you removed the casters and bolted the jack to a wooden platform. Did you build the platform from 2 by lumber? Can't tell from the picture but did you re-mount the casters on the bottom of the platform so that you could move it around your space? What type of drill is required to raise and lower the unit? I see what appears to be a DeWalt drill on the bench. Could you post some more close up pictures of the stand? That is ingenious! 

Is this the jack in question? 

450 lb. Low Lift Transmission Jack (harborfreight.com)


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## jpdflyboy (Dec 10, 2021)

Rocky said:


> Brilliant! Looks like you removed the casters and bolted the jack to a wooden platform. Did you build the platform from 2 by lumber? Can't tell from the picture but did you re-mount the casters on the bottom of the platform so that you could move it around your space? What type of drill is required to raise and lower the unit? I see what appears to be a DeWalt drill on the bench. Could you post some more close up pictures of the stand? That is ingenious!
> 
> Is this the jack in question?
> 
> 450 lb. Low Lift Transmission Jack (harborfreight.com)


Yes That is the jack. 
The drill is a 3/8 battery powered but 1/2 would be better. Going up with a full carboy/fermenter sometimes get wobbly so I steady the carboy/fermenter with my left hand while raising. 
I did not use the casters but that's not a bad ideal. I'll have to look for them.
2x12 base, plywood and 2x4. My highest counter top is 36" so everything was figured to get to that height.
Like a lot of us young guys in our 7th decade, lifting full carboys/fermenters is not going to happen.


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## mainshipfred (Dec 10, 2021)

I'm a bit luckier than most since I make wine in my warehouse and space is not an issue. The only advice I can recommend is no space is too small.


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## MarcOlivetti (Dec 30, 2021)

I started with the traditional laundry sink which had a fixed water spout too low for a Carboy to fit. I was lucky to find a commercial 2 large bowl sink w/ sides of all places, at my local brew shop. The owner had one sitting in his garage unused for years  I started with this:


and now have this to work with


I had to place the sink on blocks to have proper drainage when tying into the existing drain. The side benefit is much easier on my back!

As for work space, the cabinets were repurposed to the basement when the kitchen was remodeled, so I’m using slat wall for hanging storage along with the cabinets. I have a large table in the center of the work area which I keep working & aging Carboys with empties below in milk crates.


I also installed a wire grid above the work table using bungee cords to help manage the AIO pump hoses and to keep things organized.


this is a long way from my first batch in the kitchen & dining room


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## ChuckD (Dec 30, 2021)

Now that’s what I’m talking about! Someday I’ll have my wine room.


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## Raptor99 (Dec 30, 2021)

MarcOlivetti said:


> I started with the traditional laundry sink which had a fixed water spout too low for a Carboy to fit. I was lucky to find a commercial 2 large bowl sink w/ sides of all places, at my local brew shop. The owner had one sitting in his garage unused for year.



Very nice! I'm going to watch for a two-basin commercial sink.


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## Raptor99 (Feb 1, 2022)

I'm working on my design again. Right now I have 19' of counter space planned, but the sink will take up some of that space. I am looking at a stand alone commercial stainless steel sink, and am watching Craig's List for a deal.

I see the benefit of a two-basin sink, but for washing large carboys it is helpful to be able to turn them on the site. That would require a sink basin at least 24" wide. It's difficult and expensive to find a two-basin model with basins that large, but I found a good size with one basin: https://www.webstaurantstore.com/re...rainboards-24-x-24-x-14-bowl/600S124242G.html I'm not necessarily going to buy that one, but it is an example.

The problem is fitting everything in. The sink I linked above is 72" wide, which would take out 6' of counter space (I would still have 13' of counter space.)

Question: If your sink basin(s) is (are) smaller than 24" wide, how do you wash 5 and 6.5 gal carboys? I have back pain issues, so I can't really pick them up and shake them. I appreciate your input.


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## ChuckD (Feb 2, 2022)

I have been thinking about my ideal wine room and was envisioning some racks on the back wall above the drain boards where you could set carboys upside down to drain out. That or some free standing holders to set on the drain boards. If you have a small diameter wand type sprayer you could spray up inside them to clean them out.


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## MarcOlivetti (Feb 2, 2022)

Raptor99 - I started with the FastWasher from Midwest Supply which was under $60 (less than the components to build the bucket version) which work great! You can use for Carboys, buckets, and Kegs. They can sit in a tray/tote that can sit on a counter and is portable. No lifting or shaking required (FastWasher Rack)
They also have a bottle version too. Be careful though, this brand is addictive and worth it, and a must have like Steve’s All in One!


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## Rice_Guy (Feb 2, 2022)

The sink in your photo is designed to take a lot of water in the side wings. If you carried the concept of wings one step farther you could ignore the sink, ,, just install a shower floor and do all your washing with a hose.
With the company pilot plant the floor drain collects any water. ALL washing was close to where the work happened and into the floor drain. Looking at this old house there is a style of shower drain that is a long/ narrow U, have you thought of having a plumber create a tiled shower pan?
to your question I wash in a standard kitchen sink since my carboys fit inside a 12” milk crate, the main wash tool is the sprayer hose (sometimes throttled down to minimize splashing). _HUMM _You could have 19 feet of counter built with a shower water collection floor.


Raptor99 said:


> The sink I linked above is 72" wide, which would take out 6' of counter space (I would still have 13' of counter space.), , , , , Question: If your sink basin(s) is (are) smaller than 24" wide, how do you wash 5 and 6.5 gal carboys?


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## winemaker81 (Feb 2, 2022)

Raptor99 said:


> I see the benefit of a two-basin sink, but for washing large carboys it is helpful to be able to turn them on the site. That would require a sink basin at least 24" wide. It's difficult and expensive to find a two-basin model with basins that large, but I found a good size with one basin: *https://www.webstaurantstore.com/regency-72-16-gauge-stainless-steel-one-compartment-commercial-sink-with-galvanized-steel-legs-and-2-drainboards-24-x-24-x-14-bowl/600S124242G.html* I'm not necessarily going to buy that one, but it is an example.


The faucet displayed in the above link is as valuable as the sink is. My sink is the deepest stainless steel double basin kitchen sink I could find, and the faucet is the tallest gooseneck I could find, with a separate sprayer. I put a carboy in the sink and maneuver the sprayer to ensure the entire inside of the carboy is rinsed. Each also gets a treatment with a carboy brush -- elbow grease works! Then rinse again. I rarely have to put more than 1/2 gallon in the carboy at a time during cleaning.

I'm thinking about purchasing a new faucet, one with a removable head that acts as a sprayer. The one in our kitchen is as tall as the one in my wine area, and I've seen taller.


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## winemaker81 (Feb 2, 2022)

I'm considering a model like *this one**:*


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## mainshipfred (Feb 2, 2022)

winemaker81 said:


> I'm considering a model like *this one**:*
> 
> View attachment 84144



Mine is real similar


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## ChuckD (Feb 2, 2022)

When I worked in a restaurant as a kid the dish washing station had a sprayer that hung from the ceiling with some sort of retracting device and you could pull it down at least three feet and maneuver it around almost anywhere. Something like that would rock!


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## winemaker81 (Feb 2, 2022)

ChuckD said:


> When I worked in a restaurant as a kid the dish washing station had a sprayer that hung from the ceiling with some sort of retracting device and you could pull it down at least three feet and maneuver it around almost anywhere. Something like that would rock!


That's why I'm interested in the faucet I listed, it's the next best thing for a regular sink. Click the link in @Raptor99's post #42 -- I was looking at the sprayer, not the sink itself


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## mainshipfred (Feb 2, 2022)

I only have 7" of counter space plus the sink. The wine is either on rolling barrel carriers or furniture dollies which I roll to the lab as needed.


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## wood1954 (Feb 2, 2022)

Plenty of good lighting especially for when bottling.


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## wood1954 (Feb 2, 2022)

ChuckD said:


> A group I belong to runs a food stand at the Lambeau Field and they have a stainless steel three-basin sink labeled wash/sanitize/rinse with a three-foot drain board on each end. This is my ideal sink for the wine room. I would settle for a two-basin model. Take it from someone who worked as a dishwasher in a restaurant when young... tall back splashes, an overhead spray nozzle, and drain boards are the bomb.


I picked up a used sink like this for cheap, always look for used first.


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## Raptor99 (Feb 2, 2022)

winemaker81 said:


> That's why I'm interested in the faucet I listed, it's the next best thing for a regular sink. Click the link in @Raptor99's post #42 -- I was looking at the sprayer, not the sink itself



A good faucet with a sprayer sounds really useful. That would work great for rinsing with plain water. For cleaning solutions I will consider the Fastrack Washer recommended by @MarcOlivetti


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## Raptor99 (Feb 2, 2022)

wood1954 said:


> I picked up a used sink like this for cheap, always look for used first.



I have been watching Craig's List.


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## ChuckD (Feb 2, 2022)

wood1954 said:


> I picked up a used sink like this for cheap, always look for used first.


I actually found one for cheap last year but was too slow on the draw. I’m keeping my eyes open.


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## winemaker81 (Feb 2, 2022)

Raptor99 said:


> A good faucet with a sprayer sounds really useful.


Our kitchen faucet is a detachable regular/sprayer head model. At first I resisted it, as funky hardware typically breaks sooner. Then I investigated and discovered the water control mechanism is below the counter, and the "funky" part is just a hose and a sprayer head, both of which are easy to replace. Since having that for a few years, I don't want a regular faucet. Spraying the sink or objects is grab, point, and squeeze.


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## hounddawg (Feb 3, 2022)

I DID a chocolate Kadivar ,, chocolates, they sent me a new 3 basin with drain boards ,, i called their coaptate office, to tell him that they had one that was only 6 months old, he told me to throw the new on in the dumpster and cover with trash, they crew and I christened my truck the big Bertha dumpster, so still in the crate, i hauled it from the east coast, ,, i thought free was a good price, i told him what i had done, he said you ever mention that sink again, that i would be having sex with the big end of a ball bat, ,   i still believe he woulda tried doing it,,,
Dawg


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## hounddawg (Feb 3, 2022)

if you go to home depot. get the sink adapter, for a portable washing machine, i use marine food grade water hose, 
Dawg


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## David Violante (Feb 3, 2022)

MarcOlivetti said:


> Raptor99 - I started with the FastWasher from Midwest Supply which was under $60 (less than the components to build the bucket version) which work great! You can use for Carboys, buckets, and Kegs. They can sit in a tray/tote that can sit on a counter and is portable. No lifting or shaking required (FastWasher Rack)
> They also have a bottle version too. Be careful though, this brand is addictive and worth it, and a must have like Steve’s All in One!


I just bought the FastWasher12 and extra racks for the same reason. Just came yesterday. I first tried (twice) to buy it on Amazon but it came in a plain box and without the legs or hardware. MoreWine sent one all complete in the original box (their PA warehouse is closer to me). They suggested using SaniClean over StarSan because it foams less when sanitizing. 

I did DIY a carboy washer with a 5 gallon bucket and sump pump on clearance. Works amazingly.

I’m also curious now at the idea of a large surface area shower type basin at a height that reduces bending and lifting. That’s a very intriguing idea…


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## crushday (Feb 3, 2022)

ratflinger said:


> I have a bottle washer in the 1st sink, 2nd sink has EasyClean in it, then to a manual sprayer with no-rinse chlorine sanitizer, and onto the bottle tree.


Isn’t chlorine the last chemical you want in a wine space?


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## Khristyjeff (Feb 3, 2022)

winemaker81 said:


> I'm considering a model like *this one**:*
> 
> View attachment 84144


We have this one in our kitchen since 2018. We really like it and the price was very reasonable. They probably have other color options. https://smile.amazon.com/gp/product/B078Q5QFKQ/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&th=1


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## winemaker81 (Feb 3, 2022)

Khristyjeff said:


> We have this one in our kitchen since 2018. We really like it and the price was very reasonable. They probably have other color options. https://smile.amazon.com/gp/product/B078Q5QFKQ/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&th=1


I'm happy you like it! I'm looking for plain 'ole stainless steel, as it's for my wine area.


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## ratflinger (Feb 3, 2022)

crushday said:


> Isn’t chlorine the last chemical you want in a wine space?



Actually, the trade name is BeerClean, it's a no-rinse sanitizer and the go to final rinse in bars. My wife, who has a chef's grade palate, can not distinguish any taste difference before or after the BeerClean is used.

Now, with that said, it seems I was mistaken about the ingredients. I am posting the MSDS ingredients list for clarification.


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## Ohio Bob (Feb 3, 2022)

crushday said:


> Isn’t chlorine the last chemical you want in a wine space?


Bleach is what you absolutely want to avoid.


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## Raptor99 (Jul 9, 2022)

After many delays, work has started on my wine room. The new room is framed in. I will have 91 sq.ft. of floor space. Electrical will go in next week. This room is built in a space at the back of my extra deep garage. If anyone is curious, the little cut out you can see in one corner is because I don't want the electrical panel in the wineroom, and I don't want to try to move it.

There are a few things to resolve, e.g. the ceiling is at two different heights, and flooring needs to be added on one site.


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## acallan921 (Nov 21, 2022)

Raptor99 said:


> I am in the process of designing a new wine room and I thought I'd ask for your suggestions. We have a space at the back of the garage that is set up as an exercise room, which we don't really need. We plan to move in interior wall to make it a bit wider and will end up with a space that is about 12' x 8'. Our house has a heat pump, and according to the former owners it is capable of supporting another head. So I think we can put a heat pump head in the wine room for heating and cooling. Of course we will need to add insulation.
> 
> What I know I need:
> 
> ...


Raptor99,
Thanks so much for asking this! someone directed me to this thread, as I am currently in the planning stages. SO MUCH GOOD INFORMATION!! Thank you thank you


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