# If you did it again?



## Ct Winemaker (Nov 2, 2018)

Hello, I'm in the process of prepping soil for spring planting in north east Connecticut. My question is to others that are growing in this or a similar climate (zone 6). We are going to start with about 60 vines (30 red/ 30 white), and have room for significantly more in the future. 

If you had to do it again, what type of grapes would you grow, both red and white, and why? 

We have been to several local vineyards and have tasted the wines from their local grapes, but have not yet found something we are really satisfied with. So if you had a second chance, what would you plant this time around?

Thank you very much


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## sour_grapes (Nov 2, 2018)

I have no helpful information for you, but I would like to know (just out of curiosity) what grapes the local vineyards grow?


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## CK55 (Nov 2, 2018)

Ct Winemaker said:


> Hello, I'm in the process of prepping soil for spring planting in north east Connecticut. My question is to others that are growing in this or a similar climate (zone 6). We are going to start with about 60 vines (30 red/ 30 white), and have room for significantly more in the future.
> 
> If you had to do it again, what type of grapes would you grow, both red and white, and why?
> 
> ...


Sour grapes is right visit some local wineries if you have any and see what they have planted, you could also look up a chart that lists what grapes grow in your zone and then spend some time researching them for the ones that you think you might like. 

I know can franc for example will grow well In that zone.


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## Ct Winemaker (Nov 2, 2018)

The local vineyards in our area this summer are offering; 

Whites - Traminette, Cayuga, Prairie Star
Reds - St. Croix, Marquette, Marechal Foch.

In Connecticut we have a system of "Farm Vineyards". It is apparently the only way to make wine to sell at a small scale / local level (kind of like a brew pub). We do not intend to do this, and are only planting and wine making for our own use (and of course family, friends, holidays, etc). 

The reason for the question is that these would be vines that they planted several years ago, so the question is "If they were to plant today, what would they plant?". Are they happy with what they have or is there something new / better they would consider next time around (same question for Hobby growers). The vineyards don't seem very willing to talk about the type of vines and wine making in general when you visit them (for wine tasting, purchasing). We've asked to see the wine making with negative response. 

We are looking for a "solid" red (as are all growers in colder regions). If we had to pick from what we have tasted at the local vineyards, it would be Marquette, however the wine hasn't been great, OK, but not great.
In regards to white, we would like a good basic white, no funky or unusual flavors. The Traminette seems to produce a "honey" effect that after a glass or so kind of gets overwhelming. Cayuga - thin, marginal. 

So again, trying to learn from others experience before we plant and wait 3-5 years to find out if we made a good choice of vines! 

I believe we can grow Riesling in this area, but don't see the vines offered from any New England nurseries.


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## CK55 (Nov 2, 2018)

Ct Winemaker said:


> The local vineyards in our area this summer are offering;
> 
> Whites - Traminette, Cayuga, Prairie Star
> Reds - St. Croix, Marquette, Marechal Foch.
> ...


If you are okay with ordering from California you can get vines shipped anywhere In the US from Novavine. The shipping is a flat fee no matter how many vines you order.

Just a idea, as I said Cabernet franc is cold resistant, Riesling would probably also grow. I don't know of you will easily find some vines I haven't seen them on Novavine's list.


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## CTDrew (Nov 2, 2018)

A few thoughts on varieties I like as I am growing in your neck of the woods ( Coventry and Enfield) I have done well and been happy with Cayuga as it performs very consistently and can make a wide variety of styles. I have also had good luck with Aromella. It is an aromatic white and handles disease pressure well. For reds Marquette performs well but breaks early so late frosts can be a problem some years but on the good years it makes a good red. Southern CT vineyards have done a lot with Cab Franc. I don’t grow many reds but I have 8 different whites.


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## CK55 (Nov 2, 2018)

CTDrew said:


> A few thoughts on varieties I like as I am growing in your neck of the woods ( Coventry and Enfield) I have done well and been happy with Cayuga as it performs very consistently and can make a wide variety of styles. I have also had good luck with Aromella. It is an aromatic white and handles disease pressure well. For reds Marquette performs well but breaks early so late frosts can be a problem some years but on the good years it makes a good red. Southern CT vineyards have done a lot with Cab Franc. I don’t grow many reds but I have 8 different whites.


Thanks for confirming that Cab Franc will grow well. But yeah, really he just needs to look at what grows in the zone hes in and then research them and go with the ones that make wines similar to what he likes.


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## Masbustelo (Nov 2, 2018)

For a red take a look at Verona.


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## Dennis Griffith (Nov 3, 2018)

I'm in Ohio, but also in Zone 6. Niagara will do well in Zone 6 and make an ok semi sweet white wine. I grow America, Buffalo, and Sheridan for reds (I like ports). I'm also planting Cab Franc in the spring, which should do ok here. Also check out Double A vineyards in NY as they are acquainted with your area and can provide vines and they have a lot of info online as well as provide advice.


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## Ct Winemaker (Nov 3, 2018)

Thanks everyone. Really appreciate the recommendations and suggestions. Please keep them coming!


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## bstnh1 (Nov 4, 2018)

I'm in zone 5, a little colder, but we have a local winery that grows French hybrids DeChaunac, Marechal Foch and Vignoles, as well as American hybrids Cayuga White and La Crescent.


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## KevinL (Nov 5, 2018)

Itasca came out in 2017, so not much out there on it. My experience with it (in the vineyard, not for winemaking) has been great thus far.


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## Dennis Griffith (Nov 6, 2018)

KevinL said:


> Itasca came out in 2017, so not much out there on it. My experience with it (in the vineyard, not for winemaking) has been great thus far.



Double A also carries these.


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## Newine (Nov 6, 2018)

I'm in zone 5. I enjoy the Seyval Blanc I have but am adding Itasca next year for purported improved numbers, closer to vinifera in the whites. Added Chardonel this year as I read good things about it and since it's parents are Seyval Blanc and Chardonnay figured it would be good. My favorite red I have in is Noiret but I am adding Petite Pearl next year, again for the numbers. Growing in the Midwest we end up fighting very high acids so anything I am adding is based on improved varieties/numbers.


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## RonObvious (Nov 7, 2018)

We're not too far from you here in central MA. I would second the suggestion of Aromella. As was mentioned above, it is highly aromatic, starting with powerful grapefruit aromas, then the grapefruit fades after a few months of aging and you get more honey, apricot, and other flavors. I really like it because it seems to live up to its reputation of being truly disease resistant. All my Aromella vines looked perfect this year - not a blemish on them.


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## tjgaul (Nov 7, 2018)

I would second Double A as a source. As long as you get your order in early they have a great selection. You might consider Leon Millot for a cold hardy red. I only have a couple vines, but they are growing as vigorously as the Marquette and this grape makes a good fresh wine with aging capabilities as well.


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## JimInNJ (Nov 9, 2018)

Dornfelder might work for you. That is a bunch in my avatar picture.


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## Ct Winemaker (Nov 9, 2018)

Thanks again for all the great help and suggestions. Will be reviewing them all in detail this weekend. Please keep them coming sincerely appreciated!


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## Ct Winemaker (Dec 22, 2018)

Decisions made and order placed for this spring. 

39 Marquette
39 St. Vincent
39 Chardonel 

The small vineyard is plowed and the soil is tested. We had nearly non stop rain and then immediately frozen ground so we couldn’t get the trellis and watering system in yet so will get it done as soon as the ground thaws! 

Thanks again for the help and suggestions, very much appreciated.


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## Dennis Griffith (Dec 22, 2018)

This is the point where we wish you good luck and fair weather..

especially the fair weather....


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## Ct Winemaker (Dec 22, 2018)

Haha! Thanks, this is Connecticut so we will see what happens. Can always keep buying grapes!


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## Masbustelo (Dec 22, 2018)

Your small vineyard is ten times larger than mine.


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## Ct Winemaker (Dec 22, 2018)

Well, we see how it goes. Will be challenging, but we are looking forward to it.


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## Ct Winemaker (Dec 22, 2018)

Here’s the first piece of vital equipment Ford tractor and bush hog 
This is the now frozen solid south slope where the vineyard will be. About 85 by 85 feet. Will have 9 rows of 13 vines at 8 foot row spacing and 6 ft vine spacing.


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## Dennis Griffith (Dec 22, 2018)

I don't mean to be a killjoy, but that looks like a 6 foot bush hog, and if it is, it may be a tad much for the 1700. You'd need about a 40 horse model to drive it. I have Kubotas and one of them is a B7510 (about the same HP as the 1700) and I only use a 4 foot deck.


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## Sage (Dec 23, 2018)

I easily run a 6ft mower with my 25 hp JD.

Might be a little late, but I planted what I like to drink. What do you like??


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## Dennis Griffith (Dec 23, 2018)

Bush hogs take a little more power cause you usually mow taller stuff. And yes, a 25 hp can drive a 6 foot finish mower. I use a 54 inch finish mower (rear discharge) for between rows. Works well.


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## Ct Winemaker (Dec 23, 2018)

It’s actually a 5 ft bush hog. I used it to clear heavy brush, bitter sweet, wild roses and willows with 2-1/2 inch diameter trunks from the vineyard area (and another 1 acre area - behind the old chicken coop you can see in the pic - future additional vineyard if all goes well) with no problem at all. Then single point plowed several times, followed by York raking to get the planting area as shown in pic. Tractor handled the bush hog very well. I don’t plan to use it for mowing between rows, will use a zero turn mower for that.


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## Ct Winemaker (Dec 23, 2018)

Sage said:


> I easily run a 6ft mower with my 25 hp JD.
> 
> Might be a little late, but I planted what I like to drink. What do you like??



Hello Sage,
Choices were based on what we like and what we can grow here in North East Connecticut. Chardonel for white that gives us options including Oak and Malo - closest varietal to Chardonnay that we can grow. St. Vincent - Chianti like, one of our favorites. Marquette because the local vineyards have good luck with it and it makes a reasonably good solid red. We also felt the Marquette and St Vincent might give us some good blending options.


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## KevinL (Dec 26, 2018)

Awesome. Good luck on your adventure! (and fair weather )


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## CTDrew (Dec 26, 2018)

Good luck with the planting this spring and I second the wish for nice weather come spring!


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## Ct Winemaker (Dec 28, 2018)

Thanks or the well wishes CT Drew and Kevin L. I’m just hoping I can get the trellis and watering system in before the vines arrive!


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