# First Barrel



## joea132 (Sep 20, 2011)

I'm seriously entertaining the idea of getting my first barrel this year. I'm making Zinfandel with a friend and I want to go to the next level. I am not really versed in this am I'm apprehensive about getting into it. I understand the angels' share and needing to keep it full, etc. 

My friend is worried about over-oaking or ruining this year's wine, and I'm a little more adventurous. He suggests that we ferment dry and keep it in steel and bulk age in a used barrel later in the wine's life before bottling. With each year that a wine is aged in a barrel, how much time does it take to get the oak taste into the wine? At what point in each year would you be concerned about over-oaking? I want to concentrate the wine down and get that micro-oxygenation that matures and enhances a wine. Any suggestions are appreciated.


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## ibglowin (Sep 20, 2011)

How much wine are we talking about making this year?


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## xanxer82 (Sep 20, 2011)

If you're using a new barrell you'll only want the wine in it for a very short time as it can get over oaked.


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## joea132 (Sep 21, 2011)

Well assuming a barrel is about 59 gallons, and taking angels' share into account I figured I needed at least 66 gallons. I am thinking about getting a barrel that has been used for two seasons to start out with so I don't over-oak.


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## ibglowin (Sep 21, 2011)

You know you can purchase smaller barrels that are much easier to work with right? Thats a lot of volume for sure but getting a used one that is in good condition is a good idea as it would be harder to over oak it. Barrels are best kept full year round, less chance for leakage or spoilage organisms to get in.


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## robie (Sep 21, 2011)

joea132 said:


> Well assuming a barrel is about 59 gallons, and taking angels' share into account I figured I needed at least 66 gallons. I am thinking about getting a barrel that has been used for two seasons to start out with so I don't over-oak.



Two seasons? Does that mean it has had wine in it for 2 years? The entire two years?

That large of a barrel, two years in use, it likely doesn't have a lot of oaking capability left; getting pretty close to neutral status. At least its spped of adding oakiness has slowed. It will not impart oak flavor very fast, but it will accomplish your micro-oxygenation and concentration very well, if you can find a barrel that is in good condition.

The idea would be to taste the wine periodically to judge the level of oak in the wine.

As already mentioned, if you use a small barrel, like a 6 gallon one, if brand new it is possible it can over oak some wines in only a few weeks. As it is used, it will impart oakiness slower and slower until it finally becomes neutral.

Personally. I like neutral barrels. I can add oakiness via oak cubes or spirals at my own rate and use the neutral barrel for micro-oxygenation and concentration.


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## joea132 (Sep 21, 2011)

robie said:


> Two seasons? Does that mean it has had wine in it for 2 years? The entire two years?
> 
> That large of a barrel, two years in use, it likely doesn't have a lot of oaking capability left; getting pretty close to neutral status. At least its spped of adding oakiness has slowed. It will not impart oak flavor very fast, but it will accomplish your micro-oxygenation and concentration very well, if you can find a barrel that is in good condition.
> 
> ...




I know they sell used barrels that have had one batch of wine through and they have barrels that have multiple batches through. I'm not sure exactly how they're sold. I know for sure that I don't want to get a new barrel. I tend to agree with you about having a neutral barrel and being able to finely control the amount of oak with beans or cubes. 

I figure if I get a neutral or close to neutral one, I can keep wine in it until it's ready to bottle and rotate my next batch from my stainless steel tank through.


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## robie (Sep 21, 2011)

joea132 said:


> I know they sell used barrels that have had one batch of wine through and they have barrels that have multiple batches through. I'm not sure exactly how they're sold. I know for sure that I don't want to get a new barrel. I tend to agree with you about having a neutral barrel and being able to finely control the amount of oak with beans or cubes.
> 
> I figure if I get a neutral or close to neutral one, I can keep wine in it until it's ready to bottle and rotate my next batch from my stainless steel tank through.



Exactly. If it is not neutral, just be sure to taste test it periodically. 

One thing I have read several times is to leave the wine on the oak, NOT until it just seems about right, but until it just starts tasting as though you have left it on the oak a tiny bit too long, then remove the oak source. This is because after it has set for awhile, the oak will back off some. Experiment with it!!!


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## joea132 (Sep 21, 2011)

robie said:


> Exactly. If it is not neutral, just be sure to taste test it periodically.
> 
> One thing I have read several times is to leave the wine on the oak, NOT until it just seems about right, but until it just starts tasting as though you have left it on the oak a tiny bit too long, then remove the oak source. This is because after it has set for awhile, the oak will back off some. Experiment with it!!!



Good information, I seems to remember reading something similar to that as well. I appreciate the info.


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## Rock (Sep 25, 2011)

Joe,Re-coop barrels are best for this.I had a recoop giving oak flavors for 3-4 years now i use them as neutral and add oak to them.New barrels are best i just tossed a 6 year old barrel out.Keep them full as you know and when you rack,keep them cleaned right.I could have keep this other barrel going but had to sacrifice room for a new 30 gallon barrel.


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