# Wine testing equipment - help please!



## Siwash (Sep 4, 2016)

I have read a few recent posts on the subject. Currently I only have the cheap TA test strips and of course a hydrometer.

I want to add the following:

-PH meter
-So2 meter
-Malolactic Fermentation Tester (chromatography)

Is this overkill? I also don't want to spend too much. I understand the Hana 5 is the PH meter to go with. They get pricey. Where I live (Canada) they cost $140. Any suggestions for must have testers and brands to go with?

Much appreciated!!


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## Johnd (Sep 4, 2016)

Siwash said:


> I have read a few recent posts on the subject. Currently I only have the cheap TA test strips and of course a hydrometer.
> 
> I want to add the following:
> 
> ...



You could also check out the Vinmetrica line, I use one for pH, TA, and SO2, and paper chromo for MLF testing.


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## Johny99 (Sep 4, 2016)

Siwash said:


> I have read a few recent posts on the subject. Currently I only have the cheap TA test strips and of course a hydrometer.
> 
> I want to add the following:
> 
> ...



Your list is good. Buy the best pH meter you can find. .01 accuracy is a must. It gets used all the time from harvest to bottling. There are lots of surplus ones on eBay. Just make sure you get a good probe. I have a Corning from an old university lab. New probe and it is wonderful. Auto temperature correction is a plus. 

I have an Sc-100 for so2. I love it. I'm sure the new models are great. Malo is easy with a paper chromatography kit. Cheap and heck I only use it once or twice a year.


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## Johny99 (Sep 4, 2016)

Oh, buy a good titration setup for TA. With the pH meter it becomes a piece of cake. Again nice buretts on eBay are an option. You can make a stir plate from an old hard drive, and computer fan.


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## vacuumpumpman (Sep 4, 2016)

@Siwash

How much quantity of wine do you produce year - If you do not mind me asking ? 
This is a big factor on how much money typically you want to invest in a hobby or a business -


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## Siwash (Sep 5, 2016)

vacuumpumpman said:


> @Siwash
> 
> How much quantity of wine do you produce year - If you do not mind me asking ?
> This is a big factor on how much money typically you want to invest in a hobby or a business -



Anywhere from 20 to 25 lugs per year... roughly 60 gal...


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## Siwash (Sep 5, 2016)

Johny99 said:


> Oh, buy a good titration setup for TA. With the pH meter it becomes a piece of cake. Again nice buretts on eBay are an option. You can make a stir plate from an old hard drive, and computer fan.



i bought the cheap $12 TA kit... is that not accurate?


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## Siwash (Sep 5, 2016)

Johny99 said:


> Your list is good. Buy the best pH meter you can find. .01 accuracy is a must. It gets used all the time from harvest to bottling. There are lots of surplus ones on eBay. Just make sure you get a good probe. I have a Corning from an old university lab. New probe and it is wonderful. Auto temperature correction is a plus.
> 
> I have an Sc-100 for so2. I love it. I'm sure the new models are great. Malo is easy with a paper chromatography kit. Cheap and heck I only use it once or twice a year.



As for PH, seems like the consensus is Milwaukee 102


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## ibglowin (Sep 5, 2016)

The kit comes with everything you need to test TA but you will want to use a pH meter to determine the endpoint. Much more accurate than your eye.



Siwash said:


> i bought the cheap $12 TA kit... is that not accurate?


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## NorCal (Sep 5, 2016)

Haven't seen a cheap means to measure free so2. I but the bullet and bought a vinemetrica


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## Siwash (Sep 5, 2016)

NorCal said:


> Haven't seen a cheap means to measure free so2. I but the bullet and bought a vinemetrica




Does the vinemetrica measure free So2, PH and TA?


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## Johnd (Sep 5, 2016)

Siwash said:


> Does the vinemetrica measure free So2, PH and TA?



Yes, if you buy the 300 series kit. If you get the pro kit, it has a lab stand, stirrer, and some additional lab equipment. I use everything it came with


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## codeman (Sep 5, 2016)

I have the SC300 and love it! Best money I've spent. No more guessing how much S02 is in a batch. I had been adding k meta every 3-4 months before buying the SC300, but my batches weren't using that much. Now I only add when needed.


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## Siwash (Sep 5, 2016)

Holy cow, just checked their website... $450+ and I am in Canada so that's $600++ when I exchange currency... I love my wine but I won't be dropping that kind of cash this year for a wine instrument... i still have to buy my grapes!


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## Siwash (Sep 5, 2016)

For a guy on a budget, how's this for So2 testing?

https://morewinemaking.com/products/sulphite-test-kit.html

or 

https://morewinemaking.com/products/economy-aerationoxidation-free-so2-test-kit.html


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## Siwash (Sep 5, 2016)

This gets good reviews on Amazon and I can get it in Canada for $55 plus tax. It's what I can afford for this year... Anyone try it?

http://ecom.bosagrape.com/product.php?productid=18497&cat=806&page=1


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## ibglowin (Sep 5, 2016)

I used Accuvin the first year but I found them difficult to see much difference in color and thus not very accurate. I ended up purchasing the $99 Morewine A/O Rig. A/O is pretty much a good as it gets as far as Free SO2 testing. Very accurate it takes a little bit to come up to speed on how to setup and do the analysis. They have great videos that show you exactly how to set up and perform the test. If you can't afford the Vinemetrica this guy is cheaper and more accurate IMHO. The only thing is it uses phosphoric acid which is expensive to ship due to hazard concern (strong acid) If you can find it locally from a hardware store or pool supply store it will save you $$$ in shipping. The rest of the reagents are dirt cheap. The kit will come with enough phosphoric acid to do 4 test IIRC.


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## Siwash (Sep 5, 2016)

Thank you, ibglowin! Will look into that...


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## Siwash (Sep 5, 2016)

ibglowin said:


> I used Accuvin the first year but I found them difficult to see much difference in color and thus not very accurate. I ended up purchasing the $99 Morewine A/O Rig. A/O is pretty much a good as it gets as far as Free SO2 testing. Very accurate it takes a little bit to come up to speed on how to setup and do the analysis. They have great videos that show you exactly how to set up and perform the test. If you can't afford the Vinemetrica this guy is cheaper and more accurate IMHO. The only thing is it uses phosphoric acid which is expensive to ship due to hazard concern (strong acid) If you can find it locally from a hardware store or pool supply store it will save you $$$ in shipping. The rest of the reagents are dirt cheap. The kit will come with enough phosphoric acid to do 4 test IIRC.



Read the 4 reviews on their site. A couple of guys said it's slow. How long does it take to get a result? I am mostly concerned about the first test bc I a co-inoculating. Don't want it to take a whole day..

thanks again


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## ibglowin (Sep 5, 2016)

It takes 10 mins per test. 

Do you want a fast(er) but meaningless number or an accurate one?

Look at the disclaimer on the Titrets test. *" Please keep in mind that due to some chemical interference, this kit is only accurate to within +/- 30ppm when used to test red wines." *

What a complete joke that is.


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## Siwash (Sep 5, 2016)

I am glad that, as you claim from experience, it is even more accurate than the much more costly products... hopefully I will be able to access phosphoric acid. I am a high school teacher so perhaps I can ask my science department colleagues where to get it!

But I believe it comes with enough for few initial tests...

thanks


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## jburtner (Sep 6, 2016)

How accurate is the Vinemetrica SO2 probe / system?

Thx!
-j


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## Johnd (Sep 6, 2016)

jburtner said:


> How accurate is the Vinemetrica SO2 probe / system?
> 
> Thx!
> -j



SO2: better than 2 ppm 
TA: better than 0.2 g/L 
pH: 0.02 pH units

According to their product data


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## fafrd (Feb 25, 2017)

ibglowin said:


> I used Accuvin the first year but I found them difficult to see much difference in color and thus not very accurate. I ended up purchasing the *$99 Morewine A/O Rig*. A/O is pretty much a good as it gets as far as Free SO2 testing. Very accurate it takes a little bit to come up to speed on how to setup and do the analysis. They have great videos that show you exactly how to set up and perform the test. If you can't afford the Vinemetrica *this guy is cheaper and more accurate IMHO*. The only thing is it uses phosphoric acid which is expensive to ship due to hazard concern (strong acid) If you can find it locally from a hardware store or pool supply store it will save you $$$ in shipping. The rest of the reagents are dirt cheap. The kit will come with enough phosphoric acid to do 4 test IIRC.



I'm debating between the Accuvin strips, MoreWine $100 A/O test rig, and Vinmetrica SC-100A as well.

These are for my first 2 wines (half-barrel of Merlot, full barrel of Bordeaux) so I'm hesitant to invest too much on test equipment before knowing how long I'll be into winemaking.

I've used the Accuvin strips for MLF, so I'm familiar with them and the difficulty of judging color, but in the case of MLF, pretty much any color other than white indicates MLF is not yet complete, so it's pretty much a binary test.

If these first two wines come out half-decent (meaning not screwed up by oxidation at this stage), we'll be buying more equipment and taking it from there, but for this first vintage, I'm looking for the most economical way to maintain SO2 levels within a safe range over a maturation period of 6-18mos.

Are the Accuvin strips so lousy they'spd be a bad idea? Can they be 'calibrated' by investig in a professional analysis one time and then used to maintain SO2 levels through maturation?

Or would MoreWines AO rig be a better option (I'm in the Bay Area and so should be able to pick up Phosphoric Acid pretty easily).

I recognize this board is dominated by very experienced winemakers but I'm asking your help to harken back to the days when you were just beginning, didn't yet know how big of a part of your lives winemaking would become, and were in the steep part of the learning curve: what's your advice for the most cost-effective way to get a good red wine safely through 6-18 months of maturation as far as monitoring SO2 levels? (Will be aging the Merlot in a Flex Tank and the Bordeaux in VCSS).


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## Tnuscan (Feb 25, 2017)

fafrd said:


> I'm debating between the Accuvin strips, MoreWine $100 A/O test rig, and Vinmetrica SC-100A as well.
> 
> These are for my first 2 wines (half-barrel of Merlot, full barrel of Bordeaux) so I'm hesitant to invest too much on test equipment before knowing how long I'll be into winemaking.
> 
> ...



The strips are not as accurate as one would want but can get you close in the red wines.

Do you want consistant accuracy, the A/O is the way to go. No electronics to give troubles.

If you are not sure if your going to stay in this hobby, common sense would be the strips.(if 1 packet is all you need).

Even if you bought the A/O you should still be able to recoup at least 50% of your cost, which would still be the cost of the strips. What I mean is you could sell the A/O kit half price and only be out what the Accuvin strips cost , plus shipping.


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## ibglowin (Feb 25, 2017)

Boy for somebody who is not sure if your gonna stay in this hobby your sure made a lot of wine! LOL 

FWIW, we are seeing 85% Phosphoric acid an Amazon for really cheap prices even with shipping these days. Way less than what Morewine is asking for it on their website. The 85% will last a long time as you only need 25% for the test so a simple dilution with distilled water and you can make up enough for 6mo worth of testing. It doesn't go bad either like standardized NaOH does as it is not used as a titrant but rather as an oxidation agent.


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## fafrd (Feb 25, 2017)

Tnuscan said:


> The strips are not as accurate as one would want but can get you close in the red wines.
> 
> Do you want consistant accuracy, the A/O is the way to go. No electronics to give troubles.
> 
> ...



Thanks. I had a long discussion with MoreWine and was coming to that very same conclusion. The chemicals apparently expire after 6 months, but MoreWine indicated that the per-test cost of their A/O is lower than even the Vinmetrica. So looks like I'll be investing $100 in a chemistry set .

If the A/O route is reliable and just not as fast and easy as Vinmetrica, I think that's the right way to start.

Thanks again for the advice.


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## Tnuscan (Feb 25, 2017)

fafrd said:


> Thanks. I had a long discussion with MoreWine and was coming to that very same conclusion. The chemicals apparently expire after 6 months, but MoreWine indicated that the per-test cost of their A/O is lower than even the Vinmetrica. So looks like I'll be investing $100 in a chemistry set .
> 
> If the A/O route is reliable and just not as fast and easy as Vinmetrica, I think that's the right way to start.
> 
> Thanks again for the advice.



If you go with A/O probably wouldn't hurt to get a extra flask in case you break one. lol


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## fafrd (Feb 25, 2017)

Tnuscan said:


> If you go with A/O probably wouldn't hurt to get a extra flask in case you break one. lol



Sounds as though you have been there and done that .

I have a TA test kit that came with a flask, so not sure how much each of these kits can act as a backup for another.

Haven't had to think about chemistry since high-school, but looks like 'here we go' .


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## Boatboy24 (Feb 25, 2017)

fafrd said:


> Thanks. I had a long discussion with MoreWine and was coming to that very same conclusion. The chemicals apparently expire after 6 months, but MoreWine indicated that the per-test cost of their A/O is lower than even the Vinmetrica. So looks like I'll be investing $100 in a chemistry set .
> 
> If the A/O route is reliable and just not as fast and easy as Vinmetrica, I think that's the right way to start.
> 
> Thanks again for the advice.



I'm jumping in late, but with that quantity of wine, you don't want to leave too much to chance. I think the A/O rig is the right call. Strips won't do much for you, but the Vinmetrica may be overkill for someone new to the hobby.


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## fafrd (Feb 25, 2017)

Boatboy24 said:


> I'm jumping in late, but with that quantity of wine, you don't want to leave too much to chance. I think the A/O rig is the right call. Strips won't do much for you, but the Vinmetrica may be overkill for someone new to the hobby.



Thanks for the advice - that's the way I'm leaning.


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