# Clay



## LittleBearGameFarm (Dec 16, 2014)

I've read that vines can grow well in substandard soils, but what about clay? I have a hillside north of our house that I would like to plant something on to hide the eyesore. It is a mix of mostly clay and some veins of sand. Worthless to even try here?

Thanks!


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## GreginND (Dec 16, 2014)

The main issue with clay is the propensity to hold water. Grapes don't like their roots submerged in water. But since you are on a hillside, I would expect that not to be so much of a problem.


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## mgmarty (Dec 16, 2014)

Baco Noir loves clay.


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## grapeman (Dec 17, 2014)

I think I would avoid planting too many vines on clay. A small planting will be fun but not require a huge investment if it fails. If they do well, then plant more if you want.


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## grapezilla (Dec 26, 2014)

Clay is a great soil full of nutrients and also holds water well thus your plants should grow quite vigorously in it. As GreginND mentioned the hillside location should cancel out potential water logging problems so you should go for it.


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## oregondabbler (Dec 26, 2014)

I doubt that your soil is 100% clay, which would be difficult for farming. You can pull up a map of soil surveys for your area. the following link contains an article on the USDA soil survey system and a link to their website: http://groworganic.com/organic-gardening/articles/use-the-usda-web-soil-survey-for-free-information-about-your-soil 

The following is my experience: My vineyard in Oregon is on what is called silty clay loam and is about 45% clay. It is on a slight slope. The grapes grow OK but the soil gets rock hard during the summer which can be very dry and the roots have a hard time extracting water. Clay might hold water well but as it dries out, the plant must expend more and more energy to extract it. I don't think the vine's roots get as deep in clay as they do in sandy soil but that's just a hunch. Even though we get plenty of rain for most of the year, I find that I need to drip irrigate for a few weeks during the summer or the vines get water stressed. The vineyard is about 20 years old and the root system isn't going to get any larger.

Otherwise, my high clay soil holds water and nutrients well. 

Clay isn't the greatest soil for vines but grapes can do well in it.


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## Crazy_Guggenheim (Dec 28, 2014)

You could certainly amend your soil to create a more forgiving environ. Having previously fought that battle on the western side of the Chesapeake Bay (before moving to the giant sandbox which is the Delmarva peninsula) I speak from experience. I had a market garden of about two acres that was amended with many tons of sand, compost, bio char, various minerals, and gypsum, over the years. I finally managed to get it juuuust right... about two years before we moved.  

Living and working with the equivalent of a giant hydroponic bed presently, I now pine for the fertile clay soils that I spent the last several decades cursing. At least with clay you are starting with some good existing fertility. Your challenge is to find the correct compliment of soil amendments to help make that fertility available to your plants. It all starts with a series of soil tests. You may want to visit the Rodale Institute web site or check out one of their many books. There are plenty of resources available on the subject but their guide to organic gardening has probably one of the simplest to use guides that explains the effects and application rates of many of the available amendments. Not much mention there of bio char, or some of the latest work with basaltic rock dust, but the bulk of organic standards are pretty well covered. 

The bio char potential is I feel one of the greatest of all, whether dealing with clay or my now ubiquitous sand. There are limits to just how much you can use, but I've experimented with as much as 10% by volume in raised beds with fantastic results. Helps hold nutrients that would otherwise simply drain away, while also working as a host for all sorts of wonderful humates and beneficial microbes. Haven't been able to find any specific targeted research as yet but there also appears to be a positive relationship between its presence and the incidence of pink pigmented-bacteria, amongst others.

Other than that, we previously had a fairly close neighboring commercial vineyard that shared our caliginous soils, and they explained that there vines had taken decades to establish, but now their deep rooted vines had pretty well drilled and spread to a point where all but the very worst of droughts would ever cause them to have to irrigate again. Beyond that their regular reapplications of organic compost as a mulch was also keeping moisture in while replacing spent fertility. The effect of regularly reapplying compost is especially helpful in creating good soil tilth.


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