# Exoskeleton Plastic Carboy...



## bkisel (Nov 7, 2016)

Would one of you younger folk get on this... I'm thinking that an Exoskeleton Plastic Carboy would be better than both today's heavy and dangerous glass carboys and the plastic ones that don't allow you to put a vacuum on them. Having an exoskeleton would allow for easy cleaning. Wouldn't it be nice to use the AIO with a plastic carboy? What do you think? Get a patent on this and you'll, for sure, be inducted into the Home Winemakers Hall of Fame!


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## dcbrown73 (Nov 7, 2016)

Interesting. Though I think it would need to be an internal skeleton rather than an exoskeleton.

Like a plastic carboy with some type of rebar in it. Obviously, rebar is too heavy. Chicken wire wouldn't be strong enough, but possibly a good gauge of livestock wire, but that would get expensive quick when making them.

Can carbon fiber be made food grade? You wouldn't be able to see the wine inside, but on the plus side, it would block out all light!


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## bkisel (Nov 7, 2016)

The idea behind the exoskeleton vs. endoskeleton is to allow for easier, I dare say much easier, cleaning of the carboy. Shape, less the skeleton, would likely be globe/sphere. Skeleton would be part of the whole molding, not separately attached.


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## vacuumpumpman (Nov 7, 2016)

bkisel said:


> Would one of you younger folk get on this... I'm thinking that an Exoskeleton Plastic Carboy would be better than both today's heavy and dangerous glass carboys and the plastic ones that don't allow you put a vacuum on them. Having an exoskeleton would allow for easy cleaning. Wouldn't it be nice to use the AIO with a plastic carboy? What do you think? Get a patent on this and you'll, for sure, be inducted into the Home Winemakers Hall of Fame!



Bill - 

You gave me an idea ! 

I will work on a possible prototype - hopefully by the end of the year, if I can get some free time.


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## bkisel (Nov 7, 2016)

vacuumpumpman said:


> Bill -
> 
> You gave me an idea !
> 
> I will work on a possible prototype - hopefully by the end of the year, if I can get some free time.



Great! Go for it!


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## orto (Nov 7, 2016)

I've been wondering since I got the all in one, and just did a quick test with a 20 liter Speidel. I pumped it until the top bent in a little bit then stopped and let the air in. It really held a lot of vacuum I don't have a gauge, so I can't quantify it, but it was a lot. I might try a transfer with it (with water of course) this weekend.


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## vacuumpumpman (Nov 7, 2016)

orto said:


> I've been wondering since I got the all in one, and just did a quick test with a 20 liter Speidel. I pumped it until the top bent in a little bit then stopped and let the air in. It really held a lot of vacuum I don't have a gauge, so I can't quantify it, but it was a lot. I might try a transfer with it (with water of course) this weekend.



Not recommended ! 
When the plastic walls go inward it could force all the liquid into the reservoir which would overflow straight into the vacuum pump. That entire process could be as little as seconds !


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## stickman (Nov 7, 2016)

It's already been done, but the cost is a bit high for the mass market.


http://www.catalyst-manufacturing.com/collections/tanks/products/intellitank-58


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## bkisel (Nov 7, 2016)

stickman said:


> It's already been done, but the cost is a bit high for the mass market.
> 
> 
> http://www.catalyst-manufacturing.com/collections/tanks/products/intellitank-58



I'm thinking half the capacity and no steel. Wouldn't shape of sphere vs. cylinder allow for for less plastic to be used resulting in less cost and less weight?

I'm not an engineer so just guessing.


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## orto (Nov 7, 2016)

Wouldn't the container be at the highest risk of collapse when its empty? As it fills the risk of collapse should decrease. 



vacuumpumpman said:


> Not recommended !
> When the plastic walls go inward it could force all the liquid into the reservoir which would overflow straight into the vacuum pump. That entire process could be as little as seconds !


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## vacuumpumpman (Nov 7, 2016)

orto said:


> Wouldn't the container be at the highest risk of collapse when its empty? As it fills the risk of collapse should decrease.



The less volume of air the more vacuum pressure - 

If I was going to do any experiment - I would make sure that I have a large enough reservoir to handle any situation.


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## stickman (Nov 7, 2016)

They have a 23L or 6gal version, but still a bit high in cost. Very nice as you can use vacuum or pressure if needed.

http://www.catalyst-manufacturing.com/collections/tanks/products/intellitank-24


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## vacuumpumpman (Nov 7, 2016)

stickman said:


> They have a 23L or 6gal version, but still a bit high in cost. Very nice as you can use vacuum or pressure if needed.
> 
> http://www.catalyst-manufacturing.com/collections/tanks/products/intellitank-24



They are very nice - I just added shipping to IL. and it comes just under 140.00 dollars without any accessories at all.


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## Boatboy24 (Nov 8, 2016)

vacuumpumpman said:


> They are very nice - I just added shipping to IL. and it comes just under 140.00 dollars without any accessories at all.



I looked at those a while back. There are 2 deterrents, as I see it: 1) price and 2) you can't see through it.

Under edit: Just looked at them again and the 23L version weighs 10lbs. Don't know that it is any better than glass in that regard.


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## rhattin (Dec 2, 2016)

This has already been done and in operation in a local Ferment on Premises shop. It has a non commercial variant. A couple of advantages is that the concentration of CO2 can now be controlled in the final bottling process, it can be used merely to transfer and rack, no lifting of full carboys since all work is done at ground level and the process is viewable. A lot like AIO but on steriods. The exoskeleton is the smart part and requires some ingenuity. Ric


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