# Should I plan on MLF?



## Boatboy24 (Mar 27, 2013)

I'm getting a couple Chilean buckets and will be "enhancing" each with a lug of grapes. One Malbec, one Carmenere. Should I plan on doing MLF?


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## mjrisenhoover (Mar 28, 2013)

I know many wineries put their Malbec through MLF and from a quick internet search it appears that Carmenere is a good candidate for MLF as well.


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## shoebiedoo (Mar 29, 2013)

I'm under the impression most of the juice buckets are balanced and not good candidates for MLF. I would check with your source to see


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## Boatboy24 (Mar 29, 2013)

shoebiedoo said:


> I'm under the impression most of the juice buckets are balanced and not good candidates for MLF. I would check with your source to see



I wonder if throwing in a lug of grapes would throw it off by much...


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## shoebiedoo (Mar 29, 2013)

That's a good question. I'm adding 18lbs per 6 gallon bucket to mine. I wouldn't think it would throw it off by that much


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## ibglowin (Mar 29, 2013)

I don't see an issue. Most buckets receive little or no manipulation compared to say a kit which is made to sit on a shelf for as long as a year. If anything is done on a bucket it would be a bump in the Brix or a hit of Tartaric in case acid was low. Neither of these would affect MLF and MLF would round out the flavor profile nicely.


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## harleydmn (Mar 29, 2013)

ibglowin said:


> I don't see an issue. Most buckets receive little or no manipulation compared to say a kit which is made to sit on a shelf for as long as a year. If anything is done on a bucket it would be a bump in the Brix or a hit of Tartaric in case acid was low. Neither of these would affect MLF and MLF would round out the flavor profile nicely.



Mike,
I am getting 2 buckets of Sauvignon blanc, would you recommend doing MLB on these?


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## ibglowin (Mar 29, 2013)

Nooooooooo!

Definitley not!



harleydmn said:


> Mike,
> I am getting 2 buckets of Sauvignon blanc, would you recommend doing MLB on these?


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## Boatboy24 (Mar 29, 2013)

OK. I'm now comfortable with the fact that I need to get comfortable with MLF. So I'm off to morewine to by some bugs and a chromatography kit. How do I know which bugs to buy? They carry several.


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## wineman2013 (Mar 29, 2013)

For a small amount baccus is good , the vp41 and vp31 strains are both very reliable if a bit pricy. 

Enoferm Alfa takes longer but is also a favorite.


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## ibglowin (Mar 29, 2013)

You need to look at your pH (especially if its low) some MLB are more tolerant of lower pH, as well as the ABV of the wine when finished, then of course price can play a factor.


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## Inferno (Mar 31, 2013)

I have used vp31 on very low ph Frontenac , when 2 other inoculations failed.


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## Boatboy24 (Apr 1, 2013)

MoreWine has Enoferm Alpha in a 2.5g pack and claims that is enough for 66 gallons. I'll have approximately 14 total, so I'm expecting that single pack will be enough. I guess I should go ahead and grab some Optimalo while I'm ordering, and a chromatography test kit. Anything else? From what I've read, it looks like I'd pitch the MLB when I move to secondary. Is that about right?


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## ibglowin (Apr 1, 2013)

Sounds like you will be good to go!


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## jimmyjames23 (Apr 1, 2013)

Cheapest Chroma kits are here in Ontario at $47

Here's the link....

http://www.watsons.ca/index.php?id=16


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## jimmyjames23 (Apr 1, 2013)

Boatboy24 said:


> MoreWine has Enoferm Alpha in a 2.5g pack and claims that is enough for 66 gallons. I'll have approximately 14 total, so I'm expecting that single pack will be enough. I guess I should go ahead and grab some Optimalo while I'm ordering, and a chromatography test kit. Anything else? From what I've read, it looks like I'd pitch the MLB when I move to secondary. Is that about right?



Pitch the ML bacteria when your fermentation is done. Between 0.996 and 0.992. 
Active yeast will compete with the bacteria causing the bacteria to fail or move very slowly. 
Rack it..then pitch it.


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## ibglowin (Apr 1, 2013)

That is not true, in fact I just sat in on a wine making seminar last month by ScottLabs/Lallemand who talked about all the *BENEFITS* of co-inoculation of MLB with Yeast.

*Experiments conducted by the Lallemand research group have confirmed that low acetic acid is produced during growth of MLB and active MLF. Trials conducted using simultaneous bacterial and yeast inoculation versus bacterial inoculation upon completion of alcohol fermentation have shown no significant difference in the final acetic acid concentration. In addition, the co-inoculation of wine with yeast and bacteria will result in fewer lactic and buttery flavours, resulting in a fruit-driven wine style.*

http://www.lallemandwine.com/IMG/pdf_WUP_2005_3_-_USA.pdf



jimmyjames23 said:


> Pitch the ML bacteria when your fermentation is done. Between 0.996 and 0.992.
> Active yeast will compete with the bacteria causing the bacteria to fail or move very slowly.
> Rack it..then pitch it.


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## jimmyjames23 (Apr 1, 2013)

Well you learn something new everyday. 
I use Bacchus from Lalvin...just following the instructions as per the Lalvin website

http://www.lalvinyeast.com/bacteria.asp

Note the part where is states "For best results in volumes up to 23 L, add Bacchus immediately after the alcoholic fermentation is complete and the wine temperature is 18°-24°C (64°-75°F). "

Maybe someone should tell Lalvin about your link. 
Lol. 


What is your recommended hydrometer reading for pitching the ML Bacteria?


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## ibglowin (Apr 1, 2013)

Co-inoculation is a stylistic choice. The two can coexist together quite well. The benefits are as posted above along with the MLB has the chance to acclimate to the alcohol as it builds up instead of being tossed into an alcoholic "cold water bath" of sorts.


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## jimmyjames23 (Apr 1, 2013)

Well the cab Sauv it started on the last full moon is at 1.070. (OG was 1.083) I have the original chromograph from when I purchased the juice. Should I draw another capillary for testing and inoculate now?
Maybe draw a new cap every 3 weeks for conclusive comparable results?


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## ibglowin (Apr 1, 2013)

I usually press around 1.000 and inoculate while on the gross lees. Either way will work just fine (finish to dry then inoculate). Mainly wanted to point out that co-inoculation is not a bad thing but it is probably best left to a more experienced winemaker as you have more things to keep an eye on.



jimmyjames23 said:


> What is your recommended hydrometer reading for pitching the ML Bacteria?


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## jimmyjames23 (Apr 1, 2013)

I usually rack at just under 1 and propagate the ML Bacchus for 4 to 7 days with a little wine, juice and malic acid. 
When I hit 0.994 ish I inoculate. 
I'm supposed to get a 10 fold count by using the ML starter. I've done MLF completion in as little as 1 month and as many as 4.


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