# Zin, Cab, Petite Sirah blend



## pgentile (Sep 2, 2017)

Picked up 4 lugs of Zinfandel this morning, planning on doing a 50% zin, 25% cab 25% petite sirah. Supplier only had Zin in yet, Cab and PS will be in the next few days. Will be fermented separately and blended in 15 gl barrel. With a total of 8 lugs there won't be much excess for bench trial blending so essentially this will be a field blend.

These grapes were from a local supplier's premium list. Could't get more info on source and why are they premium other than they are from northern Cal and the vines they are from are cared for more than the regular list. From the label Lamanuzzi & Pantaleo and Google they appear to be the same source as Regina Juice. ??

Anyway, the grapes look and taste great.

Numbers after crushing:

Brix 24 (got to use my new refractometer)
pH 3.57
TA .6


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## Ajmassa (Sep 2, 2017)

Rock n roll! Great numbers too. No need to mess with it. 
Maybe you'll get lucky and get a high yield for some extra wine to play with. 

Great pics. I'll be there Saturday morning likely when they are mobbed. Hoping they will have everything I want in one shot. 
So the Pia grapes are the premium. The other skid of lugs in the pic looks like Regina lugs. I take it there are some Regina varietals in as well. OnIy criticism is the 1st come 1st serve system there.


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## pgentile (Sep 2, 2017)

Yes, off to a good start. Happy with the numbers. Will check again in the am.

I opened a bottle tonight of last years Zin, from the premium list, and it's one of my best wines to date.

Place was jumpin' today, Pia seems to be the premium grapes. Last years crates were labeled the same. All other lugs I saw were labeled Regina. 

Good luck next week.

One more shot of today's grapes.


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## Boatboy24 (Sep 3, 2017)

Numbers look good and I think you'll like that blend. I'm doing to end up w/ a similar one when my 2016's are done. (Zin, Syrah, Cab and Petite Sirah)


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## Ajmassa (Sep 5, 2017)

Procacci bros is unlike any other supplier. For better and worse. As old school as they get. Getting info is tricky and I somehow feel like a pest asking simple questions like availability of different varietals. My fam has been all juice for years and it's my 1st time buying grapes from Procacci myself, not just juice. 
But I just lucked out and spoke with Lenny over the phone for over 10 minutes today. He was awesome. He wrote down everything I needed (which is 6 dif types) and assured me all my grapes would be in, and would even set em aside if he had to. 
He just finished unloading 3 trailers full of both "premium" and "da wood grapes" as he calls them. Luckily I saw your pics and noticed the prem. lugs are in cardboard so I knew what he meant. Another 1 or 2 trailers are also coming tomorrow. 
I asked which trucks tomorrow and he said they will have both 'wood' grapes and the premium grapes in em. 
Before I mix everything up I'm curious at the difference in numbers. 6 TA tests is more of a *****, but at least Brix and ph. I decided on 3 varietals and splitting 1/2 reg 1/2 premium. (Sangio4/CS2/merlot2) Saturday is gonna be a big day!


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## pgentile (Sep 5, 2017)

Ajmassa5983 said:


> Before I mix everything up I'm curious at the difference in numbers. 6 TA tests is more of a *****, but at least Brix and ph. I decided on 3 varietals and splitting 1/2 reg 1/2 premium. (Sangio4/CS2/merlot2) Saturday is gonna be a big day!



That should have been 6.0 TA. It's fermenting solidly right now, the smell is delicious.

I like your blend. 

Good to know other stuff will be in the next few days. I'm picking up two lugs of Cab Sauv and two of Petite Sirah from premium list later this week. And couple buckets of something white, french colombard maybe.


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## pgentile (Sep 5, 2017)

Ajmassa5983 said:


> My fam has been all juice for years and it's my 1st time buying grapes from Procacci myself, not just juice.



By the way good luck with your first all grape batch. 

Last year Lenny was my buddy, even opened a personal bottle of wine and shared. This year I can't get his attention, but he's been extremely busy each time I was in. I think I'll stop in thursday am.

Also if you still wanted to trade a bottle. I'm 10 minutes away from Procacci, I could pop in for a quick trade on saturday.


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## pgentile (Sep 5, 2017)

Boatboy24 said:


> Numbers look good and I think you'll like that blend. I'm doing to end up w/ a similar one when my 2016's are done. (Zin, Syrah, Cab and Petite Sirah)



I just had a commercial blend like yours that was delicious. 

You are fermenting separately? Is your goal one blend?


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## Ajmassa (Sep 5, 2017)

pgentile said:


> By the way good luck with your first all grape batch.
> 
> 
> 
> ...





Perfect. Sounds like a plan. I will keep in touch. 
I'm picking up a bucket as well, probably petite sirah. 
I did a 3 gal Gino pinto grape trial run in May. 54 lbs. pretty much just to get a feel for it knowing I was going bigger in September. I'm glad I did. 
And even though my family did Procacci grapes for years, they did "old style winemaking" not really playing by any set of rules. I started with many bad habits. Imagine researching what a hydromter is after already making several seasonal buckets!


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## Ajmassa (Sep 5, 2017)

pgentile said:


> I just had a commercial blend like yours that was delicious.
> 
> 
> 
> You are fermenting separately? Is your goal one blend?





I've been buying similar blends for the last couple months to see what I liked the best. And that's how I settled on 50% sangio and 25% ea. Merlot CabSav. Though every variation imaginable can work for this style. 
I wanted to blend down the road, but decided not to for multiple reasons. Equipment/space/ extra time ya know. I also would likely be too indecisive and not trust my palate. Nope. Going to throw em all in my 44 gal brute, and let 'er ride. Making sure I feed the proper nutes along the way, and using both a strong & versatile yeast and ML. High hopes.

Edit: now I'm imagining all the different bottles. Full varietals, cab/merlot, sangio/cab every which way etc... Having variety would be great. But I'm sticking to the plan. Maybe next year ill play with blends.


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## Boatboy24 (Sep 6, 2017)

pgentile said:


> I just had a commercial blend like yours that was delicious.
> 
> You are fermenting separately? Is your goal one blend?



Fermented separately - 3 lugs of each. All 4 are very good on their own right now, but I'm looking forward to the blending trials in another month or so. @ibglowin gave me some details he found on the 2010 "Prisoner" blend and that will be my starting point for blending trials. One blend is the goal, but I'll enough leftover for some single varietal bottling (maybe with a little of something else mixed into each). Of the 24 gallons total, I will probably do 10-12 gallons of the blend.

44% Zinfandel
26% Cabernet Sauvignon
18% Petite Sirah
9% Syrah
2% Charbono
1% Grenache

I don't have the Charbono or Grenache, so I'll have to squeak by without 'em.


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## pgentile (Sep 6, 2017)

Boatboy24 said:


> Fermented separately - 3 lugs of each. All 4 are very good on their own right now, but I'm looking forward to the blending trials in another month or so. @ibglowin gave me some details he found on the 2010 "Prisoner" blend and that will be my starting point for blending trials. One blend is the goal, but I'll enough leftover for some single varietal bottling (maybe with a little of something else mixed into each). Of the 24 gallons total, I will probably do 10-12 gallons of the blend.
> 
> 44% Zinfandel
> 26% Cabernet Sauvignon
> ...



At 2 & 1% how much would they contribute anyway? Although both are tasty grapes. But your approach sounds good.


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## Kraffty (Sep 6, 2017)

@boatboy24, you can alway buy a bottle of Grenache and 2 bottles of Charbono varietal and use them in your blends.
Mike


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## ibglowin (Sep 6, 2017)

Where would you find a bottle of pure Charbono that wouldn't cost an arm and a leg though esp on the east Coast?



Kraffty said:


> @boatboy24, you can alway buy a bottle of Grenache and 2 bottles of Charbono varietal and use them in your blends.
> Mike


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## Kraffty (Sep 6, 2017)

Google only, I've never tasted this varietal.

http://www.shopwinedirect.com/summe...MIlpOy7fyQ1gIVnoKzCh3yUQBwEAkYAyABEgLkdfD_BwE


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## Boatboy24 (Sep 6, 2017)

ibglowin said:


> Where would you find a bottle of pure Charbono that wouldn't cost an arm and a leg though esp on the east Coast?



http://www.totalwine.com/wine/red-wine/bonarda/robert-foley-charbono/p/59937750?s=205&igrules=true

Not an arm and a leg, but not chicken feed either.


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## ibglowin (Sep 6, 2017)

You think your palate is good enough to discern that 1% Charbono? LOL

I don't think I could do it!



Boatboy24 said:


> http://www.totalwine.com/wine/red-wine/bonarda/robert-foley-charbono/p/59937750?s=205&igrules=true
> 
> Not an arm and a leg, but not chicken feed either.


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## Boatboy24 (Sep 6, 2017)

ibglowin said:


> You think your palate is good enough to discern that 1% Charbono? LOL
> 
> I don't think I could do it!



Why do you think I'm leaving it out?


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## pgentile (Sep 6, 2017)

Ended up getting the other lugs this afternoon. 2 Cab 2 Petite Sirah.

Brix
Cab Sauv 21
Petite Sirah 24

Will take other reading tomorrow am when it's warmer.

Not crazy about the Cab being 21, but the Zin and PS are 24. 6 lugs 24 brix + two lugs 21 = 23.25?


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## pgentile (Sep 9, 2017)

Pressed the 4 lugs of zin this afternoon. pH 3.37 and .998 didn't take any other measurements yet. Smell is very good.

Put the zin cake back into a fermentation tub added 2 pails sangiovese and 1 pail syrah I picked up yesterday.

All 3 Regina pails were pH 3.70 and 1.090 on the nose.


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## Ajmassa (Sep 9, 2017)

Well all the numbers are in and I've got no complaints. (Refractometer made a quick job of it. Glad I bought one)
My cab is just as you said. 
Prem- 21.3 Brix and 4.1 ph
Wood 20 Brix. 3.7 ph

Merlot
Prem 21 Brix 4.3 ph
Wood 21.2 Brix 3.6 ph

Sangiovese
Prem 27.2 Brix 3.7 ph
Wood 22.5 Brix 3.7 ph
All blended
23.5 Brix 4.0 ph. -- not too bad
Pope juice
1.090 SG 3.8 ph

It was a long day. I'll take some TA measurements tomorrow and see if any of the other numbers shifted. 
Ended up with 28 gallons of must from 8 lugs. Added lallzyme ex, stirred it up, broke my little plastic paddle in half and called it a night. 

There's noticeable differences in the numbers from premium to regular. Also the prem merlot and prem cab both were lesser yields. With a very large amount of raisin clusters and also how stubborn they were coming off the stems leaving a lot of guts. No complaints tho. And All the other grapes left the stems as cleanly as can be.


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## Boatboy24 (Sep 10, 2017)

Ajmassa5983 said:


> ...stirred it up, broke my little plastic paddle in half and called it a night.



You need one of these:


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## jgmann67 (Sep 10, 2017)

Boatboy24 said:


> You need one of these:





If there's a restaurant supply store anywhere near you, you can find one there too. Craig found one for me locally.


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## pgentile (Sep 10, 2017)

Ajmassa5983 said:


> There's noticeable differences in the numbers from premium to regular. Also the prem merlot and prem cab both were lesser yields. With a very large amount of raisin clusters and also how stubborn they were coming off the stems leaving a lot of guts. No complaints tho. And All the other grapes left the stems as cleanly as can be.



My cab was the same. Yield from zin and petite sirah were much better. Consistency with our numbers is reassuring. Not in the numbers themselves but that we were close in separate operations.

All is fermenting nicely and smells great.


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## pgentile (Sep 10, 2017)

Ajmassa5983 said:


> Ended up with 28 gallons of must from 8 lugs. Added lallzyme ex, stirred it up, broke my little plastic paddle in half and called it a night.



I replaced mine with a stainless paddle after breaking two plastic ones last year.

Restaurant Equippers Warehouse Store in Pennsauken and Fante's on 9th St in the Italian Market would have the utensil @Boatboy24 and @jgmann67 point out. I need to get one myself.


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## Ajmassa (Sep 10, 2017)

Well in the meantime until I pick up the proper tools I was gonna use something like this.


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## pgentile (Sep 10, 2017)

I actually use a 2 x 4. Crude but it works.


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## Ajmassa (Sep 10, 2017)

Good to know. I remember as a kid seeing my grandfather use the 2x4 too. 

Hey Jim and Jim, how long as that handle on the punchdown thing?


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## jgmann67 (Sep 10, 2017)

Ajmassa5983 said:


> Good to know. I remember as a kid seeing my grandfather use the 2x4 too.
> 
> Hey Jim and Jim, how long as that handle on the punchdown thing?





30-36". Works great with a brute primary fermenter.


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## pgentile (Sep 10, 2017)

Crusher/punchdown and destemmer:


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## Ajmassa (Sep 10, 2017)

Looks like a whole lotta work. I rented the crusher and worked great. I just fished out the majority of the stems by hand. 
When looking for something to stir and punch with in the shop I came across an old canoe oar. Cleaned it up proper. Nice and strong Works for me.

Before pitching yeast I added a couple large scoops of skins to the juice pail. Can't hurt right?


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## Ajmassa (Sep 10, 2017)

I'm very happy with all the numbers too. The varying lugs blended well. I ended up with ph 3.9 TA 7.25. SG 1.100. With no adjusting. 
I decided to leave the pH alone and let her go. I pitched yeast and will add the malo in a day or so. 
My pope juice started goin from native yeast. I added some new strain with zero h2s. Andante. Hoping that takes over. That was the only hiccup. 
Worked hard this weekend. But I truly do love it.


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## pgentile (Sep 10, 2017)

2 x 4, canoe oar, whatever it takes. Looks like you have enough space to step up to tonnage next year....a few more brutes a few more oars a few more lugs....

I've had pails from Gino's hissing away from native yeast or pre-inoculation on the way home from buying them, so2 and then new yeast, they have turned out fine.


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