# Extended maceraction



## zadvocate (Oct 7, 2017)

I have a super Tuscan blend fermenting right now that I was planning on doing an extended maceration on. It's in a 20 gallon brute garbage can. I was going to cover the top of the cap with cling wrap daily to protect from oxygen. I've never done this before and was wondering does it require daily punch downs to?


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## pete1325 (Oct 7, 2017)

Just cover it loosely with a tarp and punch the cap two-three times a day. During fermentation it gives off gases so no need to worry about oxygen. What's your definition of extended?


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## stickman (Oct 7, 2017)

With extended maceration, you really need to keep oxygen off the top. The more you can approximate a variable capacity tank the better. I have run three batches in the past, 18 days, 28 days, and 39 days of total skin contact. I don't have a VC tank, so I used a piece of plastic on top of the skins, on top of that I had a board cut to the proper size circle, and on top of the stainless vat another piece of plastic. I used CO2 to gas the headspace daily. I opened just the top plastic and pushed down on the board to submerge the cap, then covered and re-gassed. The cap will eventually fall to the bottom if you go long enough. 

A few days ago I opened one of the 2002 Sonoma Cabs (39 days skins, 12months barrel), and it still has mouth filling tannins and fruit, it was undrinkable for at least 5yrs after bottling, that's part of the reason I still have bottles (magnums) in the cellar. A winemaker friend of mine told me I didn't leave it long enough; he routinely goes 60+ days running ML with the skins. 

It was interesting, but I'm not suggesting anything here, just relating my experience; I'm getting too old to wait 15yrs for a Cab to come around.


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## zadvocate (Oct 7, 2017)

I mean some amount of time following fermentation. I had planned to do this with some Cab I was going to get but it didn't work out. I think illl just press and skip it this year


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## jgareri (Oct 7, 2017)

This is very interesting. I'd be interested to try this year as I'm doing a cab/merlot/petit verdot blend. Not sure what the best method would be for me. I was thinking of maybe doing a batch in a fermonster or a wide mouth carboy with an air lock to avoid the oxygen issues after fermentation finished. Has anyone tried that?


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## stickman (Oct 7, 2017)

There is more information on this thread.
http://www.winemakingtalk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=55098


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## zadvocate (Oct 9, 2017)

Did you do a mlf on your em batches ? I had originally planned to do a co-inoculation but my bacteria froze solid and it was no good. So now my primary fermentation is done and I was going to add MLB today and do an EM. Any issue with doing it this way?


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## stickman (Oct 9, 2017)

Yes, I did do ML, but I didn't add the bacteria until after pressing. I'm not saying that's the best way to do it, that's just how I did it at the time. Do you think ML is going to complete during your expected EM? Just my opinion, but I subscribe to the rule of not allowing the ML to go past half completion without a way to adequately seal off oxygen.


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## zadvocate (Oct 9, 2017)

I have no idea. I didn't know what to do. Maybe I will hold off on the MLB until after I EM. I just have a 20 gl brute that it is sitting in right now. It has just finished (0 brix). I will cover the top with plastic and if I can find something to put on top of that I will along with another layer of plastic wrap. Just like you did. Problem is I do not have CO2. Do you think I can still do it?


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## zadvocate (Oct 9, 2017)

I added the plastic wrap and will try and see how this goes going to shoot for about three weeks


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## jgareri (Oct 9, 2017)

Out of curiosity, what are you guys aiming to achieve by doing the extended maceration? Smoother tannins and quicker drinkability? Anything else?


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## stickman (Oct 9, 2017)

More tannin, smooth , but greater texture, longer finish; that's if all of the conditions are right. Depending on the grapes, some wines may not benefit from extended skin contact. You have to have reactive tannins, good color, ripe grapes, not over or under ripe. When I did it, I was too nervous, 30gal batch of grapes from Sonoma, you keep tasting while the tannins build, 39 days and I said this is ridiculous, but if you panic and press before the structure smooths out, you'll be left with what I got, massive tannins requiring years to mature. Still fun to taste every once in a while. 

In 2003 I did a Syrah 28 days, I still have a few magnums of that, for several years it too was undrinkable and tasted like fruit with a cigar butt finish, it's quite an experience to taste now knowing what it has been through.


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## zadvocate (Oct 10, 2017)

I am doing this as an experiment with the hope of softening up the tannins. My understanding is that by leaving the wine in contact with the skins, the tannins will soften with time.


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## jgmillr1 (Oct 10, 2017)

I doubt your Brute trash can is food grade, so you may not want to let it be in contact for too long if you don't want it to leech unpleasant flavors into your wine. You can buy new or pick up food grade plastic bins fairly inexpensively. Years ago I got a couple 55gal bins with sealing lids from a beer making shop that used them for malt extract. Or you can buy them new from Uline:
https://www.uline.com/Product/Detai...Vyx-GCh22zw76EAQYASABEgL4P_D_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds


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## zadvocate (Oct 10, 2017)

The gray brute is supposed to be food safe. For the 3 or 4 weeks I think it will be ok. I recall a year or so ago I spoke with rubbermaid and they didn't t recommend long-term storage.


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