# Need stronger primary bucket



## tonyt (Dec 10, 2011)

I vacuum rack from glass carboy into my plastic 8gal primary for degassing and then again for bottling. Problem is that after doing this a couple times the buckets weaken and the sides of the bucket begin to suck in. It still works but I worry that one of these days the bucket will fail. I run the vacuum pump on as low as it will go and still transfer the wine. Does anyone know of a stronger plastic primary than the typical ones available for beer and wine?


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## ibglowin (Dec 10, 2011)

You shouldn't be vacuum racking into anything plastic as that is what is needed to seal/pull the vacuum Not even sure how you get a seal on a primary anyways..... Glass only!


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## djrockinsteve (Dec 11, 2011)

I use all of my juice buckets from Regina. They are sturdy and clean up easily.


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## ibglowin (Dec 11, 2011)

Again, how do you pull a vacuum on a primary bucket with a huge plastic lid?


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## Rocky (Dec 11, 2011)

Tony, pulling the vacuum on the plastic bucket could cause non-visible micro cracks in the plastic, particulary where surfaces join, e.g. the side and the bottom. In fermentation, with thermal expansion and contraction, and with handling, these cracks could worsen and then fracture when you have a full fermenter. What a mess that would be. I think it is risky to do this.


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## Runningwolf (Dec 11, 2011)

Rocky said:


> Tony, pulling the vacuum on the plastic bucket could cause non-visible micro cracks in the plastic, particulary where surfaces join, e.g. the side and the bottom. In fermentation, with thermal expansion and contraction, and with handling, these cracks could worsen and then fracture when you have a full fermenter. What a mess that would be. I think it is risky to do this.



In addition to what Rocky said above. These buckets have been known to get these cracks on the bottom all on there own without help. I had four buckets replaced last year that developed these cracks. Just a word of extreme caution with your pump and these buckets. I would not do it.


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## tonyt (Dec 11, 2011)

Runningwolf said:


> In addition to what Rocky said above. These buckets have been known to get these cracks on the bottom all on there own without help.



Yes I found out the hard way. Bad bucket AND vacuum stress ends bad. Have newer buckets now but need a solution.
This was several months ago.


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## Flem (Dec 11, 2011)

I'm just curious as to why you wouldn't just use an auto siphon? I do it all the time to transfer for degassing. I vacuum bottle from the glass carboy. It's just how I do it. Good luck, Tony!!


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## tonyt (Dec 11, 2011)

ibglowin said:


> Again, how do you pull a vacuum on a primary bucket with a huge plastic lid?



I drill an extra hole in the top of regular primary bucket and add grommet. Vacuum hose in one hole and racking hose in other hole. It works very well but after a few rackings the bucket sides begin to suck in. And yes I worry that it will weaken the bottom seam and am vigilant to inspect after every use.

I have serious lifting restriction from my Cousin/Neurosurgeon who treats my back every couple years when it goes out. So lifting a full carboy in order to rack into primary for degassing is out of the question. As you can see in the picture I even rack from the juice box into primary. I am thinking about making a pvc gadget (removable cross bar) to insert inside the primary to keep the sides ridged.


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## Runningwolf (Dec 11, 2011)

Mike, I think Tony missed out on the buy of the reverse auto siphons that worked off of anti gravity pull. Not evryone can siphon from the floor up to the bench. I bet I know a store in Florida though that would sell you one!


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## ibglowin (Dec 11, 2011)

For sure along with a few other questionable things.....


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## ibglowin (Dec 11, 2011)

Tony,

You need to keep a strong neighbor kid "on call" to lift that kit up and then just use the gravity siphon. You have already had one failure!


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## tonyt (Dec 11, 2011)

Flem said:


> I'm just curious as to why you wouldn't just use an auto siphon? I do it all the time to transfer for degassing.


I keep all my carboys on the floor and rack from floor level to floor level for degassing, no gravity. I bottle from bench level but have to vacuum rack up to that level, I usually bottle from a primary since I never have an empty glass carboy. I guess I need to keep a glass carboy just for bottling. But every time I have an empty one I start a new kit.


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## tonyt (Dec 11, 2011)

Runningwolf said:


> I bet I know a store in Florida though that would sell you one!


Thanks Dan, but I don't shop there.


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## Wade E (Dec 11, 2011)

"I guess I need to keep a glass carboy just for bottling. But every time I have an empty one I start a new kit." hehehehe, I used to have that problem a lot!!!!!


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