# Speaking of Alexander’s...



## summersolstice (Feb 20, 2006)

I too use Alexander's with fruit to make very tasty wines. I also use them, as well as canned fruit concentrates,in my meads. I've seen Alexander's belittled on other boards as outdated with the successes and ease of use of current kits. Theargument is that kits contain everything (ingredients, additives, clearing agent,step-by-step instructions, etc)needed to produce a product superior to what Alexander's is capable of producing.


I believe the truetest of home winemaking is in fruit wines and meads. As far as I'm concerned, why would I go to all the trouble and timeof making a kit that tastes like a relativelyinexpensive commercial product that I can buy and enjoy immediately? 


There are no suitable commercial alternatives to my fruit wines and meads. Besides, and not to disparage kit makers at all (I've made wine from kits too!), I feel it's more challenging to create a successful wine that requires a little more effort to produce something that's truly unique.*Edited by: Rule G *


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## Curt (Feb 20, 2006)

Rule G,


Couldn't agree with you more. In my many years of winemaking I have done a total of 3 kits. One I liked quite well, one I was dissapointed in and one is still in the works. I just like the fruit wines better anymore.


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## OldWino1 (Feb 27, 2006)

I have found that i can take the Alexanders always with at least 2 cans. The I add my bentonite up front. Then after all fermeting is done I come back with the stablizer and bisulphate and isennglass. it will speed up the can stuff for fruit and grape alexanders. I have gotten good reviews from my alexanders fruit and grape cans. The batches are 5 gal which i have 3 of them. I use 6 gals needless to say for the kits. I but. So you can make alexanders into a kit if you like does not seem to have any negative effect on it.


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## Funky Fish (Feb 27, 2006)

I think they have their place. For those who are beginning winemakers,I think that the kits are a great way to get started and to become familiar with the typical winemaking steps.(NOTE: I do realize that plenty of people start off _not_ making wine kits, and that's fine.)


I think both wine kits and Alexanders concentrates (and Vintner's Harvest as well) provide folks an opportunity to make types of wine they normally don't have access to. I may not ever make an ice wine unless it comes from a kit; likewise with a rioja. But, I do think that Alexander's &amp; VH gives you the opportunity to make adjustments (SG &amp;TA adjustments) that you typically don't do in a WE or RJS kit.




Rule G said:


> I believe the truetest of home winemaking is in fruit wines and meads. As far as I'm concerned, why would I go to all the trouble and timeof making a kit that tastes like a relativelyinexpensive commercial product that I can buy and enjoy immediately?




I think this ispretty narrow-minded. How many people have you seen say that their kits turn out better than commercial wines? To them, their wine is better than the "relatively inexpensive commercail product" and, last time I figured out the math, it is pretty cheap.


And what's to say fruit wines &amp; meads are the true test of winemaking? If you want to impress me with a "true test," I want to see you make a madeira...and have it be drinkable when you are finished.




*Edited by: Funky Fish *


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## MedPretzel (Feb 27, 2006)

Funky Fish said:


> And what's to say fruit wines &amp; meads are the true test of winemaking? If you want to impress me with a "true test," I want to see you make a madeira...and have it be drinkable when you are finished.




You haven't tasted my mum wine, Funky.






Stiill trying to get Tim V to make it into a kit wine.


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## Funky Fish (Feb 27, 2006)

That's true...although once it becomes a kit....


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## summersolstice (Feb 27, 2006)

As I said, I'm not trying to disparage anyone's kit wines. My point is thatI prefer to make and drink home crafted wines that have no commercial equivalent. I'd guess that I couldn't find anything like Martina's mum wine, and I know I couldn't find my raspberry/blackberry/mulberry wine,in a commercial product but, on the other hand, I can buy a bottle of Blandy's 5 Year Old Malmsey Madeira for $20 this afternoon and drink it after dinner tonight if I choose. So many of the wines produced by home winemakers are either not popular enough or are too expensive to produce commercially and we fill that gap.


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## pkcook (Feb 27, 2006)

I would never down anyone for starting witha kit, because I plan on trying my first one very soon. I've made 10 batches in the last 8 months, 8 all fruit, and 2 concords all from scratch. I love fruit wines, but I also appreciate a good Shiraz or Cab. I'm glad I started with scratch wines do to the low cost I invested. I would have been very upset ruining a $100 kit wine due to my inexperience



. I started with 1 gallon batches and progressed to 6 gallon on the wines I liked. 


I feel that with the experienceI've gained and the help I've recieved right here on this forum, I'm ready to invest in a nice kit wine that I know I'll enjoy. Especially now that I have "ready to drink wine" available while the kit wine ages



.


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## earl (Feb 27, 2006)

Rule G


I made a batch of Beaujalois and IT IS NOTHING LIKE STORE BOUGHT!! IT IS 100 TIME *WORSE!!!! *Oh no Sir, I dare say the true test of home wine making is ruining a kit...Now that takes skill!


earl


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## summersolstice (Feb 28, 2006)

Earl, I resemble that remark!


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## pkcook (Feb 28, 2006)

Winemaking is never "certain," but always enjoyable



. I ruined a 5 gallon batch of watermelon wine (still don't know how)andhad a hard time watching it disappear down the drain, but after the putrid smell filled the kitchen, I was very happyto see it gone!



Funny, the raspberry that followed that batch was the best wine I have made



.


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## MedPretzel (Feb 28, 2006)

Watermelon goes bad very easily. It wasn't you.


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## Funky Fish (Feb 28, 2006)

Rule G said:


> As I said, I'm not trying to disparage anyone's kit wines. My point is thatI prefer to make and drink home crafted wines that have no commercial equivalent. I'd guess that I couldn't find anything like Martina's mum wine, and I know I couldn't find my raspberry/blackberry/mulberry wine,in a commercial product but, on the other hand, I can buy a bottle of Blandy's 5 Year Old Malmsey Madeira for $20 this afternoon and drink it after dinner tonight if I choose. So many of the wines produced by home winemakers are either not popular enough or are too expensive to produce commercially and we fill that gap.




Okay - my bad....you're saying that it's a true test in winemaking only if you can make a wine that isn't readily available commercially. So even if you make a wine from grapes, it's not the same as making wine from hemlock.



And if you took the time to make a true madeira (with the hot box and the whole nine yards), you certainly can't have it by dinner tonight, but when it is ready, it's _yours_, not Malmsey's, not Yellow Tails, not E&amp;Gs.


I know you're not trying to disparage other wines, but that's what it sounds like you are doing. Actually, it sounds like you are now going above and beyond kits to pretty much any homemade wine that you can buy the equivalent in the store. And you don't want to become that kind of wine snob.






Personally, I find the Spanish Rioja that I have made to be a wonderful wine...from a kit! And yes - I can go and buy a decent rioja for around $10, but I don't think it quite compares to mine. I also have a batch of lemon wine going. In two years will I find the lemon better than the rioja? I don't know - maybe, maybe not. Do I think the lemon was harder to make than the kit? Not at all. Did it have more steps in putting it together than the kit? Yes, but was it _harder?_ - no.*Edited by: Funky Fish *


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## PolishWineP (Feb 28, 2006)

So many different ways to make wine, aren't there! And we can all have our favorites.



We've made some wonderful kit wines and some scratch wines that I can't believe came out that darned good! We've (Read Bert here



) also made a few stinkers that included wheat. The great thing about this place is that we have variety here, always someone to answer a question. We inspire each other to try new things just by talking about our successes and we hope to save people troubles by sharing our failures. 


Cheers to beers! Here's to variety,the spice of life and what turns mead into metheglin!






Now, what should we sample tonight?


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## MedPretzel (Mar 1, 2006)

Rule G, and everyone else,


I technically agree with both of you. I prefer to *make* wines that you cannot buy in the store. Every now and then I throw in a kit here and there to make sure people don't think I'm totally off the wall. Now, if that _works_, is another story.






I still love a bottle of merlot, store-bought or home-made (home-made a little more, because I made it). But I also love my mums-in-a-bottle.









PWP, you're toasting to yeast?


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## PolishWineP (Mar 1, 2006)

I'll toast just about anything!


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## Curt (Mar 1, 2006)

One very positive point to kit wines is that they give you something that is ready to drink in short order and that makes it more relaxed when tinkering with my fruit wines and keeps me out of the carboys. Well, sort of. A little.


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## pkcook (Mar 1, 2006)

I'm with Martina on this one. I love making and drinking my country wines, but I stilllove a glass of Cab Sav or Shiraz. Too date, I haven't made a kit, but I planto try my hand at a kitwine of a commercial varietyI enjoy andcompare the two.


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## OldWino1 (Mar 5, 2006)

well as with all things there has to be oppositet I like to make the wines i can buy in the store for 2 to 4 dollars a bottle that would cost from 9 to 20 dollars a bottle. I even will buy a bottleto see how close mine is in taste and smell. Hey the only thing about kits is if you have 3 going they can keep you busy . Thats a lot of bottles in 4 to 6 weeks. 29 x 3 =9 97 bottles in six weeks. You can build up quite a cellar. I like kits so i can get it to the bottle and let it age as much as possible before I get into it. I am doing pretty good with 3 batches. No tasting for 1 yeer in the bottle Barlo Merlot and Chardonay. So far have resitted the urge to taste and the closer it gets the harder it is to not pop a cork.


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## grapeman (Mar 18, 2006)

Well I just got done racking off my Alexander's Merlot to secondary. I added four ounces of my own lightly toasted white American Oak. Naturally I had to taste it! WOWWWW! Even after only a week in the primary and full of Lalvin RC-212 yeast, it is one of my best tasting wines so far! Full berry flavor, with a generous splash of vanilla, courtesy of the oak. I look forward to this one finishing off and aging a little. I really think this one will be a big winner!


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## PolishWineP (Mar 18, 2006)

I love to see excitement for one's own work! Way to go!


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## Bert (Mar 19, 2006)

Sounds like a good one....Way to go


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## OldWino1 (Mar 21, 2006)

Wonder how long those bottles will last? Bet they dont make it a year.


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## grapeman (May 23, 2006)

Update on Alexander's Sun Merlot,


Well I bottled the Merlot I made from Alexander's Sun concentrate this last weekend. I had added my own toasted oak to it, uses RC-212 yeast and topped up with a bottle of my own COncord grape wine. While handling it earlier, it was really good. Now it's even better. I had part of a bottle left after bottling, so I offered my boss(spelled Cindy) and a brother-in-law a small glass sample. They were floored at the taste and asking for more. Last night at dinner I had what was left of the part bottle-only about 2 ounces. As I was finishing it off CIndy asked if there was more. I told her she would have to wait at least another month before we have another bottle to let it age just a little.


To me, that is a pretty good stamp of approval when she asks for more.


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