# Cider



## Kittycat (Sep 6, 2017)

My local brew shop has fresh cider to make hard cedar out of. $8 a gallon. They have later and an early one. I and going to grab one of each, do I need to do anything differnt then with wine/mead? 

Don't know the variety. My brother want me to make hard cider. I am not quite sure what to add besides yeast. They be a viable end of thing month and then later is at the end of october.

What yeast would be the best?
Additives?
Please help and thanks if u do awsner my questions.


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## BernardSmith (Sep 6, 2017)

Hi Kittycat. Brewers seem to like to use yeasts such as Nottingham but wine makers tend to prefer 71B. 71B has an affinity for the malic acid in apples and can convert about 40% of this acid to lactic - Lactic, being less harsh than malic, although many vote for 47D. 

That said, and this may be tricky if not impossible depending on how the pressed juice has been treated, but you may want to set a gallon or so aside and see if you can use wild yeasts from the apples to make a "scrumpy" (a cider made using natural yeasts). Wild yeast fermentation can take a while to take off... 

What to add? I might add pectic enzyme to break down the pectins in the fruit juice. This would help make the cider very bright and clear at bottling time. You should add pectic enzyme about 12 hours before you pitch the yeast as alcohol can denature this enzyme. 

Apple juice prepared for hard cider should have enough sugar, tannin and the right amount of acidity for a dry cider but you might want to ask the LHBS if they can advice you the apples pressed for the juice, the pH of the juice and the SG of the juice.


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## Kittycat (Sep 6, 2017)

Actualy the apple will a ready be pressed for the cider. I figure $8 a gallon was a good price to pay for not having to press it my self. Thanks your for your help


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## Runningwolf (Sep 7, 2017)

Yikes, that sounds like a lot of $$ for cider. How much are you going to purchase? If you're getting like 12 gallons ask if you can get a discount. I say that sounds like a lot of money but location has a lot to do with it also. Just a suggestion for what's it's worth. If you doing 6 gallons consider make it about 12% alcohol. Once it is finished and you're ready to sweeten it, go back and buy another gallon. Stabilize the fermented wine and backsweeten with the newly purchased cider. This will drop your alcohol% down but will add lots of flavor back to it. 

Once apple juice is fermented much of that great flavor is gone.


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## bkisel (Sep 7, 2017)

I've been using fresh pressed apple cider for making wine. I paid $5.00 US in 2015 and then $5.50 US this past year per per gallon. As of last Sunday local mill wasn't yet open for the season.


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## BernardSmith (Sep 7, 2017)

Runningwolf said:


> If you doing 6 gallons consider make it about 12% alcohol. .



But at 12% ABV isn't that is a wine, Runningwolf. Cider is more like 5 or 6% alcohol. You drink it like beer, not sip it like a Riesling. Of course tastes are personal but a dry cider can be drunk all day. A sweet cider is like ... um.. a soda and how much soda can anyone drink?


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## Kittycat (Sep 7, 2017)

Thanks for the advice


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## jburtner (Sep 8, 2017)

I did a cider mead last year that's in a barrell now... Will be bottling soon for consumption this fall  This stuff tastes great at this point and I put in just a couple cinnamon sticks for a very subtle spice - not overpowering at all. My estimate is around 16-18% ABV and used 6gallons premium apple cider which was expensive plus a bunch of honey step fed until the yeasties died..... I'd like to do more for less this year 

Cheers!
-johann


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## Runningwolf (Sep 10, 2017)

BernardSmith said:


> But at 12% ABV isn't that is a wine, Runningwolf. Cider is more like 5 or 6% alcohol. You drink it like beer, not sip it like a Riesling. Of course tastes are personal but a dry cider can be drunk all day. A sweet cider is like ... um.. a soda and how much soda can anyone drink?



I agree and you would have to do bench trials based off your taste. I am thinking adding fresh cider in would add more flavor in that you lose and cut the % alcohol down.


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## ThunderFred (Sep 11, 2017)

KC- When I make hard cider I buy 6 gallons and put one in the freezer. (Unpasteurized and untreated cider will not hold up for months in the fridge) Then I ferment the other 5 gallons, clear and add K-Meta and Sorbate to stabilize then back sweeten with the gallon from the freezer. Gives a great fresh taste. Sure it waters it down a bit but it's cider you're after not necessarily rocket fuel. If you want a higher alcohol content you can add some sugar to the juice before you pitch the yeast. 

In my experience back sweetening with juice makes a much more satisfying final product then just adding back sugar.

BTW, I pay $7 per gallon at my local orchard.


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## BernardSmith (Sep 11, 2017)

If you assume that the SG of apple juice is about 1.050 (more or less) you could water it down less (if that is indeed an issue) by taking the frozen gallon and allowing it to gently thaw such that you collect the "first runnings" up to say 1/3 or 1/2 a gallon. This will contain virtually all the sugar and flavor and only half (or 1/3) of the water. The gravity of the first runnings could be as high as 1.090 or higher so while you are not adding more sugar and/or more flavor than you would by adding the whole gallon you are adding substantially less additional water...


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