# Wild Plum Wine



## koolmoto (Jul 23, 2020)

Free wine = happy wine. Came up on 100lbs+ of wild plums. Figured I would make wine out of it, naturally. Any words of wisdom before I set forth into the ferm?
I only have EC1118 yeast right now. Saw another thread with a link to some recipes. Might do the first or second recipe.


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## Rice_Guy (Jul 23, 2020)

* use lots of pectase to help clear it
* I pit my plum and then freeze to help juice it
* I would look at what you have for carboys, ,,, you could scale four pounds per gallon making a thin wine or do ten pounds per gallon making a best of contest, knock your Sox off wine, ,,, ie how many five gallon (or sixes) do you have empty, ,,,, I used to work where the accounting folks wanted low cost of goods, so I always vote for make a contest winner


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## koolmoto (Jul 23, 2020)

Rice_Guy said:


> * use lots of pectase to help clear it
> * I pit my plum and then freeze to help juice it
> * I would look at what you have for carboys, ,,, you could scale four pounds per gallon making a thin wine or do ten pounds per gallon making a best of contest, knock your Sox off wine, ,,, ie how many five gallon (or sixes) do you have empty, ,,,, I used to work where the accounting folks wanted low cost of goods, so I always vote for make a contest winner


Hey, I'm im it to win it as well. Go big or go home. 10lbs per gallon sounds good to me. I think right now I have an empty 5 gallon and 2 three gallon carboys but might go pick up a couple more 5 or 6 gallon carboys for this tomorrow. My 6 gal and other 5 gal are in use right now.


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## wood1954 (Jul 23, 2020)

Pay attention to the ph wild plums can be pretty harsh.


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## koolmoto (Jul 24, 2020)

wood1954 said:


> Pay attention to the ph wild plums can be pretty harsh.


10.5 gallons of must. It tastes amazing- sweet and sour, but not too sour. 

After I added 1.5 gallons of water and 15lbs of sugar, the PH is 3.42 with a TA of 10g/L. The PH seems good, but is the TA too high and I should do something about it? I heard in another thread that PH is important for fermentation and I can adjust the TA later. The specific gravity is dialed in at 1.090. Must is too thick to use my hydrometer so I used the refractometer. Added 2.5Tbsp of pectic enzyme, 1Tbsp DAP and 35ppm of sulfite.

Tomorrow morning I will add 1tsp chestnut wine tannin and tomorrow night I will add an EC1118 yeast starter with goferm.


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## Chuck E (Jul 24, 2020)

I would leave the TA as it is. pH is pretty close to perfect.


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## Rice_Guy (Jul 24, 2020)

pH is a measure of how fast chemical reactions run, or in microbiology IF a family even grows.
TA is like being a kid and riding with your hand out the window, wind is fun/ enjoyable but an insect splat can hurt.
I have seen good cranberry wine with a TA of 18g/liter, many of my acid fruits are built to be 10g/liter and then back sweeten to 1.015. Running to 20g/liter has given problems, it doesn’t wash off the taste buds fast enough and would be like an insect splat on your hand you remember the impact, ,,,, and it becomes hard to finish a full glass.


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## Scooter68 (Jul 24, 2020)

All the numbers sound great! The "pudding" must issue is not uncommon. You might try the hydrometer once more just before you are ready to add the yeast. I've had to play games with peach wine 'pudding' must. Doing the twist with testing tube. Push the hydrometer down do the rapid twist of the tube keep that twisting action until the hydrometer stops rising.*** Raise the hydrometer, release it and repeat the twisting action and find that normally the two methods will end up with an SG reading pretty close to each other. I figure if I split the difference and it's in the range I'm looking for all is good. 

** *I put the testing tube on a flat surface and spin it back and forth between my hands like a kid rolling out some clay. with the hydrometer in it. Just be careful not to tip it all over. Seems to do the trick - especially after the must has had about 24-36 hours to begin to break down the fruit.


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## winemanden (Jul 24, 2020)

koolmoto said:


> Free wine = happy wine. Came up on 100lbs+ of wild plums. Figured I would make wine out of it, naturally. Any words of wisdom before I set forth into the ferm?
> I only have EC1118 yeast right now. Saw another thread with a link to some recipes. Might do the first or second recipe.
> View attachment 63853


Lucky you Moto. We had a chap in our wine making club who used to make a wonderful wine from wild plums (called Bullaces in UK). He wouldn't tell anyone where he got them and unfortunately he died without revealing his secret. Enjoy!


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## koolmoto (Jul 24, 2020)

@Chuck E @Rice_Guy Ah, that's awesome to hear about the numbers. Glad I have so much room with TA, I had no idea. Thanks! 

Great technique with the rolling, @Scooter68 I'll definitely try that. 

@winemanden Ah, too bad. This tree I picked from was no secret at all- it is next to a side walk on a busy suburb street. However, it had the most plums I have ever seen on a tree before. The 100lbs I picked were probably only 1/3 of the fruit on the tree and that was after the neighborhood had already taken their share!


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## koolmoto (Jul 25, 2020)

Scooter68 said:


> All the numbers sound great! The "pudding" must issue is not uncommon. You might try the hydrometer once more just before you are ready to add the yeast. I've had to play games with peach wine 'pudding' must. Doing the twist with testing tube. Push the hydrometer down do the rapid twist of the tube keep that twisting action until the hydrometer stops rising.*** Raise the hydrometer, release it and repeat the twisting action and find that normally the two methods will end up with an SG reading pretty close to each other. I figure if I split the difference and it's in the range I'm looking for all is good.
> 
> ** *I put the testing tube on a flat surface and spin it back and forth between my hands like a kid rolling out some clay. with the hydrometer in it. Just be careful not to tip it all over. Seems to do the trick - especially after the must has had about 24-36 hours to begin to break down the fruit.


Used your hydrometer method and found the SG was actually .01 lower than the refractometer. That made me remember I didn't calibrate the refractometer, so I calibrated it with some plain sugar water to the hydrometer's reading of the same stuff. Found that I needed to add some sugar to my must. Added 3.5lb sugar and the newly calibrated refractometer reading was 1.09 while the hydrometer read 1.086. I am fine with this range, so I think I'm definitely good now. Thanks for saving my wine - might have come out a little wimpy if it wasn't for you! 

Added my yeast starter after, so it's off to the races!
update: a nice 12 hour yeast ball


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## koolmoto (Jul 29, 2020)

Fermentation is complete @ .992 SG & about 12.6%ABV. That went fast because it was such a large container and I couldn't keep the temps low in this summer heat. It fermented around 80-85 degrees the whole time. I just strained a glass, tasted it and WOW. It tastes fantastic to me (though I have no experience). Quite tart, but not overwhelmingly so. It has a beautiful plum nose despite the hot ferm temps - perhaps because of my rich plum to water ratio. Now I will press it, add a small bit of sulfite and put it into some carboys to clear and age.


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## Rice_Guy (Jul 29, 2020)

* it will be less tart after degassing 
* did you try a pinch of sugar as a guess about finished flavor?


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## koolmoto (Jul 29, 2020)

Rice_Guy said:


> * it will be less tart after degassing
> * did you try a pinch of sugar as a guess about finished flavor?


Ah, good to know. I haven't degassed yet.

Yes! I just did a taste test with 0%, 1%, 2%, 3%, 5%, 8%, 10% of 1:1 (sugar to water) simple syrup mixed in. Anything 5% or above ruined the flavor, so I decided that I will back sweeten to at least 1%, possibly 2%. The slight sweetness improved the mouth feel and reduced the tartness, though I expect the tartness to reduce with aging as well.


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## hounddawg (Jul 30, 2020)

koolmoto said:


> Fermentation is complete @ .992 SG & about 12.6%ABV. That went fast because it was such a large container and I couldn't keep the temps low in this summer heat. It fermented around 80-85 degrees the whole time. I just strained a glass, tasted it and WOW. It tastes fantastic to me (though I have no experience). Quite tart, but not overwhelmingly so. It has a beautiful plum nose despite the hot ferm temps - perhaps because of my rich plum to water ratio. Now I will press it, add a small bit of sulfite and put it into some carboys to clear and age.
> View attachment 64135


not a clue where your from, i got better then 30 wild plum trees i have scattered for the horses, mules, dexter cattle, deer and the rest of gods critters, but mine are tiny, purple and way over 80% stone, they are tasty, 
but, well come deer season, they deliver some very good, burger, stew meat, and chili meat,,,
Dawg


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## koolmoto (Jul 30, 2020)

hounddawg said:


> not a clue where your from, i got better then 30 wild plum trees i have scattered for the horses, mules, dexter cattle, deer and the rest of gods critters, but mine are tiny, purple and way over 80% stone, they are tasty,
> but, well come deer season, they deliver some very good, burger, stew meat, and chili meat,,,
> Dawg


These ones were bigger for being wild plums - probably only 20% stone. Seeing as it was on a sidewalk from a busy street in California, they didn't come with any venison though that sounds like it might have made a good pairing...


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## koolmoto (Aug 2, 2020)

After fermentation was complete, I transferred to carboys and let it sit for 4 days. Today, I racked into new carboys and left the thick lees/sediment. I then degassed the freshly transferred wine with a power drill.

The wine is still very cloudy and does not look as though it will want to clear easily. Is kieselsol and chitosan or bentonite recommended for this type of wine or is time and further rackings going to be sufficient? I tasted it again and it was much less tart and tasted smoother/better. I think I'll hold off on back sweetening for now.


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## hounddawg (Aug 2, 2020)

kieselsol/chitonite = dualfin or super kleer, they work good, but time and patience is better,,, just my 2 cents,,, you did use plenty of pectic enzyme ? 
Dawg


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## Chuck E (Aug 2, 2020)

I'm a "let time take its course" kind of guy.


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## koolmoto (Aug 2, 2020)

hounddawg said:


> kieselsol/chitonite = dualfin or super kleer, they work good, but time and patience is better,,, just my 2 cents,,, you did use plenty of pectic enzyme ?
> Dawg


Ok cool. Perfectly happy to let time do its thing. Yes I did use plenty of pectic enzyme.


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## Scooter68 (Aug 2, 2020)

Remember - It's unlikely that you really got rid of all the gas. Certainly you got rid of a lot but it doesn't take much to keep that sediment suspended. Time is the best and safest answer now. Every 'chemical' or fining agent has some degree or risk but time will only improve the wine as well as clear it.


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## koolmoto (Aug 3, 2020)

Scooter68 said:


> Remember - It's unlikely that you really got rid of all the gas. Certainly you got rid of a lot but it doesn't take much to keep that sediment suspended. Time is the best and safest answer now. Every 'chemical' or fining agent has some degree or risk but time will only improve the wine as well as clear it.


Words of wisdom! I'm starting to understand the difference in mindset between a kit wine and a home made wine.


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## Scooter68 (Aug 3, 2020)

koolmoto said:


> Words of wisdom! I'm starting to understand the difference in mindset between a kit wine and a home made wine.


In reality even if a kit wine includes fining agents and specific instructions, they generally are more interested in getting you to put that wine into bottles as soon as possible so you can buy another kit. AND in reality their instructions regarding the time to clear and age a wine are also done with the focus again on having you 'finish' that kit so you can buy an start another. 
They don't want you to make bad wine, they just want you to buy more.


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## Rice_Guy (Aug 3, 2020)

Interesting observation, if I read you correctly CO2 in a year old peach would delay clarification and it would settle faster in just a month in a bottle since I vacuum. Next I wonder what else this impacts ex cloudy mead?


Scooter68 said:


> Remember - It's unlikely that you really got rid of all the gas. Certainly you got rid of a lot but it doesn't take much to keep that sediment suspended. Time is the best and safest answer now. Every 'chemical' or fining agent has some degree or risk but time will only improve the wine as well as clear it.


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## Dkrmwiz (Aug 3, 2020)

I let my wild plum wine clear on its own. I post pic of bottles wine from 2017 in a minute.


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## Dkrmwiz (Aug 3, 2020)

Wild plum wine, 2017


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## Scooter68 (Aug 3, 2020)

Rice_Guy said:


> Interesting observation, if I read you correctly CO2 in a year old peach would delay clarification and it would settle faster in just a month in a bottle since I vacuum. Next I wonder what else this impacts ex cloudy mead?


Certainly not likely a year down the road and that's not what I was suggesting to OP - His wine has just recently finished fermentation and in that case the CO2 could certainly hang around a while. Even whipping it isn't a guarantee that the gas is gone. I personally don't whip my wines but just let them de-gas naturally as I age most all my wines for not less than 6-12 months (6 months is a rare occasion - only if completely cleared and a taste sample reveals no sharp edge to it) 
IF I was going to whip a wine I would wait until I'm not seeing a measurable layer of sediment on the bottom of the carboy. I normally rack initially into a carboy at 1.010 or lower (mostly lower/finished these days) then, if the racking was done after ferment is completed, I wait about 2-4 weeks and rack again off that sediment which is normally somewhere between 1/4 to 1 inch and compacted a bit. Only after that racking would I consider whipping the wine. Keep in mind that I'm working exclusively with non-grape wines and many times there are no skins present to benefit from a sur lie aging. With skins and sur lie aging that's a different ball game - Like Rugby vs American Football.


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## koolmoto (Sep 6, 2020)

Wow, this wine is already smoothing out beautifully. Cleared up well and label looks great too.


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