# watering systems



## wzazdzez (Jun 30, 2011)

Anyone have any advice for watering systems for new vineyards?


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## ibglowin (Jun 30, 2011)

Drip.

Put the water only where it needs to be. At the base of each vine.


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## mwestern (Aug 13, 2011)

*Our watering system*

We have buried 5/8" soaker hose at the base of all our plants and water 2hrs every other day in these 100* days in Missouri and it has worked great for the last 6 yrs. Mike


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## deboard (Aug 14, 2011)

Not sure this would be cost effective for a large vineyard, but I created my own drip system.

I found the absolute cheapest water hose I could find (50 ft for 9 dollars, you might even get it cheaper). This is the kind of hose that kinks up if you look at it sideways. Very frustrating to use regularly, but I only had to deal with it once

I ended up needing 2 of these hoses to get to all the 9 spots I need to water. 

I just snaked this around my plants loosely, and then buried it where I would need to mow. I used metal landscape stakes to keep it secure, but now that I'm done I'm not sure that I needed them. It helped to keep things in place while I positioned everything. 

Once it was where I wanted it, I took a nail and made a hole in the hose at the base of each plant. Then I capped the end and voila! a drip system. Works great so far. I just have to hook another hose up to it and turn the water on just a bit. 

Soaker hose would work as well, but they are generally more expensive and I felt like I would be watering things I didn't want to water as well.


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## mwestern (Aug 14, 2011)

*Sounds good*

That sounds like a great solution to the problem,I'm a big Ebay watcher and we actually found 300' of 5/8" soaker hose with free shipping for $55 and it did our 5 rows completely just had to get a couple multi splitters and water everything at the same time. What ever works right ?


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## vinividivici (Aug 22, 2011)

Here's what I'm thinking of doing:

Installing a 350 gallon barrel attached to my rain gutter downspout,
then attaching a 1" PVC pipe to it, and
running it underground out to the high point at the end of the four rows.
It will then come up to the top of a 100 gallon barrel that will be on a wooden 
support stand. The water will be pumped up to that.

Then, install a 4-way manifold that will have four drip irrigation lines to each of the rows. Each vine (32 total) will have it's own drip. The irrigation will be gravity fed at this point. The pump from the source barrel is just to fill the 100 gallon barrel.

I've priced a kit that includes the 350 barrel, electric pump, and downspout attachment for ~ $1,000.

Might sound crazy, but we are on well water and my concern is with periods of drought. Capturing the rain gutter water will provide the vines with "free" water (pump not running, no electricity and no draining of the well if the hose is accidentally left on).


Bob


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## mwestern (Aug 22, 2011)

*Good Idea*

Bob, Sounds like a good idea and will definitely save your well water during the drought season only there's not alot of rain to capture during the dry times. I not being a smart alleck just my first thought.;-) I would cover your plant bases with weed blocking cover and mulch them,it really seems to help keep our plants wetter longer. Keep us posted ......... Mike


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## garymc (Sep 13, 2011)

Bob, if I understand, every drop of water that gets to them in this system gets pumped from 350 to 100? This doesn't sound like "free." I'd consider mulch and a timer if you really think you might leave the water on. Another thought would be a second well if you're thinking it would run your well dry.


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## vinividivici (Sep 13, 2011)

garymc said:


> Bob, if I understand, every drop of water that gets to them in this system gets pumped from 350 to 100? This doesn't sound like "free." I'd consider mulch and a timer if you really think you might leave the water on. Another thought would be a second well if you're thinking it would run your well dry.



Well, free water not electricity! You'd have to see the layout of the ground and the house location. I don't think it would take much to pump 100 gallons to fill the gravity feed tank. Then I'd still have 250 gallons in the catchment tank as a reserve. I'd only use the system if we didn't have rain for a number of days.

Re another well, we are drilled down to 175 feet on our house well. Couldn't afford another well - my homemade wine bottles would equate to $500 each!

Cheers,

Bob


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## AUwiner (Sep 19, 2011)

I've always had plugging issues with drip systems so I tried something a little different and it turns out a whole lot cheaper. I buried 3/4 in. PVC pipe parallel and about 12in. to one side to my newly planted vines. Near each vine, I installed a tee in the PVC then ran a short piece from the tee to over near the plant. A 90 was then added and about a 12 in upright, then I capped the upright with an irrigation bubbler ($1 each from Lowes). This was repeated at each vine. I plugged one end of the trunk line and installed a garden hose coupling on a short upright on the other end. I just connect my regular garden hose when I want to water. The bubblers are adjustable and most of the water falls in about a 1ft. circle right by the vines. The whole thing was less than $15. All that is exposed are the uprights so its easy to get around everything.


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## winemaker_3352 (Sep 19, 2011)

mwestern said:


> We have buried 5/8" soaker hose at the base of all our plants and water 2hrs every other day in these 100* days in Missouri and it has worked great for the last 6 yrs. Mike



What part of MO are you from? Just curious as I am from the STL area.


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## mwestern (Sep 19, 2011)

*Location*

We are located 50 miles NW of St.Louis in Foley,Mo..


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## vinividivici (Mar 4, 2012)

garymc said:


> Bob, if I understand, every drop of water that gets to them in this system gets pumped from 350 to 100? This doesn't sound like "free." I'd consider mulch and a timer if you really think you might leave the water on. Another thought would be a second well if you're thinking it would run your well dry.



I've backed off on the 350 gallon idea. Will be buying a 50 gallon rain barrel for the gutter downspout and a 125 gallon cistern for the gravity feed. 

Still have to research the drip line end of it. I like AUwiner's idea and might go in that direction. Just not sure how fast the water comes out of his bubblers?


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## TxBrew (Mar 5, 2012)

mwestern said:


> We have buried 5/8" soaker hose at the base of all our plants and water 2hrs every other day in these 100* days in Missouri and it has worked great for the last 6 yrs. Mike



How many inches of rain do you guys get a year?


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## JohnnyRico (Mar 5, 2012)

I too am building a rain/drip system. Last year I never ran out of water and I only have a 60 gallon container.

My plan is to get a few 20 gallon food grade barrels to attach to my 60 gallon tank and run PVC down hill to my rows under ground. The PVC will come out of the ground at the front of each row, and run across the entire line of vines. I will then drill a small hole in the PVC above each trunk.


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## vinividivici (Mar 5, 2012)

Johnny, what diameter PVC pipe are you going to be running?

Will you have a manifold that separates each row pipe?

I'm now changing my mind on all this and will not put a large cistern near the rows. Will use a large rain barrel and small pump right at the gutter downspout. Then attach a 4-spigot manifold with the four pipes running underground to the beginning of each row as you will do.

It would be great to see pictures of your system when you put it in. 

Bob


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## TxBrew (Mar 5, 2012)

vinividivici do you have a metal roof?


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## vinividivici (Mar 5, 2012)

TxBrew said:


> vinividivici do you have a metal roof?



No, regular roof shingles.


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## TxBrew (Mar 5, 2012)

I read that using shingle roof collected water was not advised to irrigate because of the chemicals in the roofing that gets leached out.


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## JohnnyRico (Mar 5, 2012)

vinividivici said:


> Johnny, what diameter PVC pipe are you going to be running?
> 
> Will you have a manifold that separates each row pipe?
> 
> ...



Im going with 3/4 pipe, each row will have its own line from one manifold. The trick for me is building a tall platform for which the water barrels will sit on. I want to create a set up where I can either turn open a valve to let water travel into the manifold and to the vines, or release water from a spout so I can fill up water buckets, attach a hose, etc.

Heck, I would build an outdoor shower while Im at it, but it probably wouldnt be as clean or hot as I would like it.


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## JohnnyRico (Mar 5, 2012)

TxBrew said:


> I read that using shingle roof collected water was not advised to irrigate because of the chemicals in the roofing that gets leached out.



Tastes fine to me.


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## vinividivici (Mar 5, 2012)

TxBrew said:


> I read that using shingle roof collected water was not advised to irrigate because of the chemicals in the roofing that gets leached out.



I did some reading on this and it's a bucket of worms. A load of conflicting theories, opinions and speculation.

What I did find was one site that separated the rain water into drinking and irrigation. Not good for drinking unless treated and purified.

For gardening, it was deemed okay with asphalt roofs, if: you don't live near a manufacturing plant, mining operation, large city, etc., that would deposit soot and particulate matter on the roof. Also not good to have trees that overhang the roof.

Otherwise, it's okay to water your plants with rain water.


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## SLOweather (Mar 5, 2012)

garymc said:


> Another thought would be a second well if you're thinking it would run your well dry.



Depending on the formation he's drilled into, another well may not help, it will just drain the formation faster. We have 6 wells and a spare for our water company, and all but 2 are drilled into different hard-rock formations. Drilling a second well into one of those is like sticking a second straw into your milk shake. Two of you can suck it out faster, but if it's not getting replenished faster than you are sucking, you're draining the aquifer or formation.

As far as the well/drought is concerned, if you are that concerned, or have a record of running dry, I highly recommend that you start a regular routine of measuring and tracking your depth to water. 

I started doing so weekly for all of our wells after one went dry. After 3 years of data, recorded along with weekly rainfall, I can see the effect that rain has on water depth, as well as how we fare during the summer when we have no rain. I can also see the effect one well in the common formation has on the other.

FWIW, I think something happened to the formation that problem well is drilled into as a result of the San Simeon Earthquake in Dec 2009.


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## wjdonahue (Mar 5, 2012)

Take your soil to the local ag extension and have them test it before you start a watering schedule. Don't know what your clay levels are in the eastern part of the state, but in Western MO we have a very high clay level in the soil. Although it holds the water pretty well, requiring less frequent watering, it still can feel very dry at the surface, and be quite wet in the root zone. It's very easy to over water on this side of the state, and most of the wineries only water about 3-4 times a year, depending on the rainfall. At lest watch the leaves very carefully, any drop of health green leaves might mean a problem with overwatering and drowning the roots. 
If you are growing hybrids or labrusca it isn't as much of a problem. I have all vinifera, so it is a real problem for me.
Also..too much water will give a lower brix and incresed swelling of the fruit after veraison, with pretty bland flavor.


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## vinividivici (Mar 7, 2012)

Just to clarify, I want to add the rain collection system not to prevent my well from going dry, but to avoid roiling up sediment in the well from running the water too long. I would use the rain barrel water as the primary as long as we get normal precipitation. If the forecast looks like no rain for a week or two, I'd save the barrel water until needed.

Obviously very weather dependent with a lot of variables.

Re my soil, it has a lot of clay and the ground is fairly moist. I always check the root level with a moisture meter probe and never water unless it's on the very dry side.

I've got 32 Marquette vines and am adding more next month: 12 Corot Noir and 10 Frontenac. If you go back in this thread, I've got some pics posted.

Bob


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## TJsBasement (Jul 10, 2012)

vinividivici said:


> Just to clarify, I want to add the rain collection system not to prevent my well from going dry.....
> Bob



Did you ever get that drum, I just now put one in and looking for any little pieces of first knowledge you may have acquired. I picked up a 325 gallon. 










Nice and snug, I'll have to pump it up to a more elevated tank higher in the yard and use from that one. Still reading about small solar pumps to slowly chug away moving water any time its getting enough light, may not be cost worthy, still looking.


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## vinividivici (Jul 11, 2012)

*Irrigation System Took a Different Direction...*

from a drum to this: (when it's filled with water!)

It was excavated yesterday, ~ 30' x 40'. I've got two flex drains coming off the rain gutters, going into a PVC "Y" connector and then into a 50' pipe to a small waterfall into the pond. Also had the contractor dig another trench that will connect to the french drain in the front foundation of the house. That's in the photo to the right of the buried line. Of course, my timing was terrible as we are in a drought condition. Hopefully it will be filled by summer's end.

I then plan on getting a gas-powered pump to transfer the water to the vineyard which is just to the left of the photo. Haven't decided on how I'll set up the lines. I may still, after all, put up that large plastic cistern
and transfer the pond water to that and let it gravity feed the rows.

TJ: are you filling your cistern with rain water? 

Cheers,
Bob


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## TJsBasement (Jul 11, 2012)

My man dug a pond, thats freakin awesome, will you line it with EPDM or similar pond lining?

Yeah I'm going to connect half my down spouts to this drum and the easiest way is just install a second probably bigger drum to the other half. I like the elevated "use" drum idea.


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