# Rooting Grape Cuttings Again...



## RedSun (Apr 8, 2015)

I received some wine grape cuttings from a nice fellow about 18 days ago. Then I put the cuttings in a 15 gallon deep pot with outdoor potting mix. The pot is stored in basement. The basement is relative dark and the temperature is about 55 to 60F.

Now I see the buds have start to swell. I do not know why the buds swell this early. I remember the last time I planted cuttings in December and it took more than 2 months to grow.

My concern is that, I do not think the cuttings have roots yet. So I do not want the top growth to exhaust the energy in the cuttings. The cuttings are very long, with at least three nodes. This is why I kept the cuttings in colder basement to slow down the top growth.

Anything I should change, or just keep it as is?


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## barbiek (Apr 8, 2015)

It's not uncommon for bud break or even leaves on them before roots develop I would pinch off the buds. And leave them in the cool dark basement but maybe someone with more experience will reply


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## RedSun (Apr 9, 2015)

I think the season makes the difference. The cuttings I collected in late fall were very dormant. But the ones collected in early spring are ready to bud out. So the difference.

I can't pinch off all the buds. With the bud swell, the cuttings should try to grow the roots are the same time. I'll just have to wait and see.


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## GreginND (Apr 9, 2015)

Typically you would apply bottom heat about 80 degrees or so to the root ends for a few weeks while the tops remained cold. This results in callousing and better root formation.


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## RedSun (Apr 9, 2015)

GreginND said:


> Typically you would apply bottom heat about 80 degrees or so to the root ends for a few weeks while the tops remained cold. This results in callousing and better root formation.



Some says that. But with a pot about 20" tall, it is almost impossible to heat it to 80 degree... Unless this is in a nursery sand bed, heated with the heat cables....


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## drumlinridgewinery (Apr 9, 2015)

I dont know if I do it right or wrong but have always had good luck. I take cuttings and soak in a bucket of water for several days in the basement. Then dip in rooting hormone and then stick them in a pot of soil. The several I started several weeks back also have budded out. I will leave mine alone and see what happens. I have a couple holes that need to be filled. Good luck

On Wisconsin


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## GreginND (Apr 10, 2015)

RedSun said:


> Some says that. But with a pot about 20" tall, it is almost impossible to heat it to 80 degree... Unless this is in a nursery sand bed, heated with the heat cables....



Maybe I'm off base here but it seems that you are not interested in using any advice offered by folks on this forum. 

You were advised to pinch off the buds but you refuse and say you can't.

You were advised to use bottom heat. But you refuse and say you can't.

I'm not sure why you bother asking us? By your own admission, your way is not working. But you don't seem to want to change how you are doing it.

For those who want to know about rooting - you don't have to use a large 20" pot. A $10 heating mat and a flat seed-starting tray works well. Use some seed-starting potting mix and stick the cuttings in that. Keep it moist. Place it on a heat mat in a cool room. The bottom will be heated and the top will stay cool.


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## RedSun (Apr 10, 2015)

Do not take it hard. We are all just learning to grow the best we can. Even some of the expert advise may not apply to everyone.

What you said was exactly what I did. Last early winter, I cut the dormant cuttings, put some in the seed starting flat, just like what you said, and put on heat mat to give it 82 degree heat. Not a single cutting took root.

Just for experiment, I also put some in a large 15 gallon pot and put it in basement without any heat. Then most of them took roots and have sent out 4" long shoots.

The standard size cuttings have at least two buds. So they are about 1' to 2' long. They just can't stay in a seed starting flat, which is 2" tall at most. I've tried it and it failed.

Now this is my first time trying to root cuttings in spring. It is a different experience. I'm sure green wood and semi green wood cuttings will be different again. I'll try those methods when I get some time....


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## GreginND (Apr 18, 2015)

I checked my cuttings today. They have been in a seed starting flat on a heat pad in a cool room for about 4 weeks now. They are callousing nicely. You can see the root buds starting to grow. I will plant these in pots soon and move them to a warm place to start growing. They buds are not swelling yet because the tops have been about 45 degrees.


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## GreginND (Apr 27, 2015)

And the buds are starting to swell.


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## RedSun (May 5, 2015)

How long do you plan to keep them in individual pots? I think the next stage is to grow full roots, then get the new shoots harden before you can put them out in the field. It gets hotter and the sun can be hot....


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## GreginND (May 6, 2015)

They are sprouting out and growing roots now. I potted them up yesterday. If they grow well I will try to put them out in the vineyard in early June. But I might wait until next year. I don't have a greenhouse to give them some good warmth.

Incidentally I am seeming massive bud injury in my vineyard this year due to cold and drought and many of my cuttings are struggling because those buds were damaged too. I should have took cuttings earlier than march. Of the 70 or so cuttings I took, about 20 are budding out. Some from the very bottom shoot only where the roots are developing.

FYI - I visited a vineyard over the weekend. They had thousands of cuttings leafing out. They had greenhouses that were getting up to about 110°F during the day. They find that taking the cuttings in December helps with success. Less chance for bud damage. They cold store the cuttings until march or so. Then they simply pot them in peat with rooting hormone and leave them in a very humid and very warm greenhouse. They have >90% success.


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## RedSun (May 6, 2015)

For the purpose of propagation, the best time to take cutting is early winter. Then store and root in early spring, for early summer planting.

I believe the cuttings taken during late winter/early spring are still very good, even better than early winter ones. Some growth hormone has started flowing. Bud injury is a separate consideration.

I started some cuttings in 3.5" tall trays and they took roots in about 2-3 weeks. Still some do not take roots and no bud growth. I figure the wood is wither too old or buds damaged.


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## grapeman (May 6, 2015)

GreginND said:


> They are sprouting out and growing roots now. I potted them up yesterday. If they grow well I will try to put them out in the vineyard in early June. But I might wait until next year. I don't have a greenhouse to give them some good warmth.
> 
> Incidentally I am seeming massive bud injury in my vineyard this year due to cold and drought and many of my cuttings are struggling because those buds were damaged too. I should have took cuttings earlier than march. Of the 70 or so cuttings I took, about 20 are budding out. Some from the very bottom shoot only where the roots are developing.
> 
> FYI - I visited a vineyard over the weekend. They had thousands of cuttings leafing out. They had greenhouses that were getting up to about 110°F during the day. They find that taking the cuttings in December helps with success. Less chance for bud damage. They cold store the cuttings until march or so. Then they simply pot them in peat with rooting hormone and leave them in a very humid and very warm greenhouse. They have >90% success.


 
The problem with taking cuttings in the late winter is that they are most likely to have suffered cold damage from extreme weather. I find my best sucess comes from taking cuttings in a narrow window of time from Thanksgiving until it gets too cold to stand to take cuttings and the ground freezes. Without cold storage, I just dig a hole in sand next to a building and place bundled cuttings upside down for the winter. The ground thaws out in spring and I then callous and root them without getting any bud damage.


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