# Using a wine conditioner



## WildSeedGrrrl (Jun 6, 2009)

I bought a bottle of wine conditioner to give a few of my less-bodied fruit wines a bit of 'help'. So far I've added it to a 3gallon batch of cranberry-raspberry I made and will be bottling soon. I then added two teaspoons to a bottle of a blueberry spice that I opened (oh that one will have to age for at least 9months before I'll chance tasting it again, UGH!) and recorked and set it aside. It had an overpowering cinnamon flavor that was pretty awful.

If any of you use conditioner, do you use it as a 'last resort' to ease your wine into drinkability? I figure I'd only use it to wine that is bulk aging, and only before I bottle, because I wouldn't want to tamper with a wine that is just too 'new' rather than harsh tasting.

WSG


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## smurfe (Jun 7, 2009)

I am not sure what brand you have but I have used the Wine Expert brand wine conditioner and did not like it at all. It has a detectable after taste that is just plain nasty on my palate.


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## Wade E (Jun 7, 2009)

I too was not fond of the conditioner taste for some reason even though its just supposed to be inverted sugar.


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## Boozehag (Jun 7, 2009)

Conditioner, thought you just used that on your hair!

Doesnt sound very nice, will give it a miss I think!


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## Chateau Joe (Jun 8, 2009)

Wade E said:


> I too was not fond of the conditioner taste for some reason even though its just supposed to be inverted sugar.




Conditioner is used to sweeten and stabilize a wine because it has sorbate in it. It has A LOT of sorbate and that is usually what people taste in the wine and dislike it. I too switched to sugar to sweeten up wine.

Now you said "too ease your wine into drinkabilty". New wines will taste like new wine. The best way to get your wine to "drinkability" is time.


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## WildSeedGrrrl (Jun 20, 2009)

*wine conditioned cranberry-raspberry*

So I had added wine conditioner to the cranberry-raspberry about a month ago (maybe 3 weeks) and it settled out and was sparkling and clear. This morning I bottled it, 3 gallons yielded about 14 bottles. I had enough to pour into a glass and let it settle out and tasted it. 

It's really young tasting but the backsweetening and conditioner made the difference. I figure with a good six months aging in the basement I'll crack open a bottle and see how it's coming. Still has a strong alcohol taste, but it's about 13% so that's understandable.

Thanks all for the input on the conditioner. I like it but sparingly might be the way to go. 

WSG


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## manku007 (Jun 20, 2009)

Boozehag said:


> Conditioner, thought you just used that on your hair!
> 
> Doesnt sound very nice, will give it a miss I think!



I also thought the same ..... how silly I m as I m new to all this.

I was thinking that wildseedgrrrl brought it to dry the wet bottles .... hahahaha


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## Ceegar (Jun 20, 2009)

Have any of you tried the natural fruit flavorings? I've seen them on this site 

http://www.stompthemgrapes.com/Build_a_Beer-Natural_Fruit_Flavorings.html

and wondered if they are any good - was thinking of trying something from that line sometime.


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## Madriver Wines (Jun 20, 2009)

We just tried a Plum flavoring from one of the popular web sites and 4oz to 5 gallon was too much. It has a very strong plum smell and taste. I am hoping it will mellow out in a few weeks.


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## Tom (Jun 20, 2009)

I have used the WE Conditioner and got a cough medicine taste. If you want to add sweetness then backsweeten with 2 parts sugar to 1 part water and add to taste.
You can also try Glycerine for body and to add "smoothness".


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## Sacalait (Jun 21, 2009)

Ceegar said:


> Have any of you tried the natural fruit flavorings? I've seen them on this site
> 
> http://www.stompthemgrapes.com/Build_a_Beer-Natural_Fruit_Flavorings.html
> 
> and wondered if they are any good - was thinking of trying something from that line sometime.



Not all flavorings are the same, careful of what and how much you use. Start by adding just a little to the batch, like a tsp. and taste along the way. A flavoring is highly concentrated so a little goes a long way. I use those that are produced by Bickford Flavorings.


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## Wade E (Jun 21, 2009)

Those beer additives are nasty!!!!!!!!!! I tried a few over the years and dont recommend them to anyone!!!!!!!!!!!! The 1's I tried got thrown away luckily before I mixed them with any of my wines or beers besides a glass just to try it!


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## Tom (Jun 21, 2009)

Wade E said:


> Those beer additives are nasty!!!!!!!!!! I tried a few over the years and dont recommend them to anyone!!!!!!!!!!!! The 1's I tried got thrown away luckily before I mixed them with any of my wines or beers besides a glass just to try it!



I agree they do little in wine. Yes I also make beer (still don't use them in beer). 
If you want FLAVOR in wine make a f-pac


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## Ceegar (Jun 21, 2009)

Tom said:


> I agree they do little in wine. Yes I also make beer (still don't use them in beer).
> If you want FLAVOR in wine make a f-pac



How's that done Tom? I was thinking this fall when I'm working with grape juice that I want to hold back some unfermented juice to add back to a dry wine to give it some sweetening and to also add some umff to the wine. Would this be something that's advisable? Isn't this how they do it when using an f-pac in some of the kits?


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## Tom (Jun 22, 2009)

Ceegar said:


> How's that done Tom? I was thinking this fall when I'm working with grape juice that I want to hold back some unfermented juice to add back to a dry wine to give it some sweetening and to also add some umff to the wine. Would this be something that's advisable? Isn't this how they do it when using an f-pac in some of the kits?


Back sweetening is the act of adding sweetness to a finished wine if you dont like dry wines(ones with very little or no residual sugar) You do this by making a simple syrup which consists of 1 part boiling water and 2 parts sugar added to that water to dissolve and then let it cool. Once cool you can add it to your wine if you have added both sulfites and sorbate to prevent re newed fermentation and add the syrup slowly and taste very frequently as to not over sweeten your wine. The F-pac is what some of us do to sweeten a wine and add lots of flavor that fermentation can strip a wine of or just because we want an intense flavor profile. What you do is take approximately 1/3 the amount of fruit you used to make your wine and freeze it and then thaw it and simmer in a pot with very minimal water to extract all the juices and add a little sugar to enhance the flavor and sweetness. Once cool strain the fruit and very gently squeeze out fruit and add to your wine till taste is where you want it, it really makes a medal winning wine.


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## Ceegar (Jun 22, 2009)

Tom said:


> Back sweetening is the act of adding sweetness to a finished wine if you dont like dry wines(ones with very little or no residual sugar) You do this by making a simple syrup which consists of 1 part boiling water and 2 parts sugar added to that water to dissolve and then let it cool. Once cool you can add it to your wine if you have added both sulfites and sorbate to prevent re newed fermentation and add the syrup slowly and taste very frequently as to not over sweeten your wine. The F-pac is what some of us do to sweeten a wine and add lots of flavor that fermentation can strip a wine of or just because we want an intense flavor profile. What you do is take approximately 1/3 the amount of fruit you used to make your wine and freeze it and then thaw it and simmer in a pot with very minimal water to extract all the juices and add a little sugar to enhance the flavor and sweetness. Once cool strain the fruit and very gently squeeze out fruit and add to your wine till taste is where you want it, it really makes a medal winning wine.



Thanks Tom - I've done quite a bit with simple syrups but I wondered what the f-pacs consisted of and if it was possible to make your own. I thought it could be done but wanted to hear from someone who has actually done it. 

_"Once cool strain the fruit and very gently squeeze out fruit "_ 

Are you talking about putting it in a straining bag so you use just the juice?


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## Tom (Jun 22, 2009)

CEEGAR,
Thats what we are here for. Keep us posted..


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## Ceegar (Jun 22, 2009)

Ceegar said:


> I was thinking this fall when I'm working with grape juice that I want to hold back some unfermented juice to add back to a dry wine to give it some sweetening and to also add some umff to the wine.



So Tom - does this sound like it would work out OK by doing this? If I followed your advice and used 1/3 and I'm doing a 3 gal batch I would have to use 1 gallon of unfermented juice - sounds like a lot (as you see I'm good with math). Maybe by shooting for a slightly higher abv to start, after diluting with a gallon f-pac I would be at a desirable abv, what do you think?


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## Tom (Jun 22, 2009)

You don't want to much alcohol as it will mask the fruit. Shoot for starting gravity 1.085- 1.090.
Make sure if making a f-pac OR back sweetening that you add the K-meta AND Sorbate. After adding the f-pac wait a week then add clarifier's.


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## Ceegar (Jun 22, 2009)

Tom said:


> You don't want to much alcohol as it will mask the fruit. Shoot for starting gravity 1.085- 1.090.
> Make sure if making a f-pac OR back sweetening that you add the K-meta AND Sorbate. After adding the f-pac wait a week then add clarifier's.



Tom - just to be sure, you know I'm talking about wine from grapes, not non-grape fruits correct? 

If I were making a wine from grapes, say a Riesling, and I have a 3 gal batch and I use 1 gal of unfermented Riesling grape juice as an f-pac along with any simple syrup, would this work OK? If I use 1 gal and dilute 3 gals by that then I've lost a lot of abv.

I understand all that stuff about stabilizing first with k-meta and sorbate.

Thanks and sorry if I'm not being clear.


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