# What are your "Top 10" including equipment/tips/tricks pertaining to Kit Wine Making?



## ithink2020 (Jul 31, 2020)

What would your Top 10 list include when it comes to kit winemaking? This could include tips, tricks, or products you can't live without.


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## Brian55 (Aug 1, 2020)

#1 Aging, whether bulk or bottle. There is nothing more important. 
#2 EM for at least a month on kits with skins
#3 Oak, glass carboys and plastic buckets don't replicate barrel aging. If you don't have barrels, over oak it, it will fade with time.
#4 Short the water addition, especially on cheaper kits.
#5 Ad at least half the f-pac to primary. Unless you enjoy sweet wines.
#6 Skip the bentonite, sorbate(unless back sweetened), and shellfish goop, racking and time will clear your wine.
#7 Buy the best kit you can afford, life is too short to drink cheap wine.
#8 Host wine tastings with friends and family. Blind is best. Include a commercial bottle or two in the mix.
#9 LE's and RQ's can be, and often are the best kit wines you will have the option of making and enjoying. 
#10 Have fun and be patient, wine takes time. If you're concerned that your wine may outlive you if you actually age it properly, no worries, friends and family will enjoy the fruits of your labor for years to come.


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## Val-the-Brew-Gal (Aug 1, 2020)

I love making fruit wines and 4-6 week kits so my suggestions are quite different from Brian55's. As you can tell from my choices, I'm not a patient winemaker but I love my wines sweeter so these are well suited for someone who wants to be drinking their wines in a matter of weeks, not months or years.

1. The All in One pump is the best thing I've ever purchased as far as equipment. In fact, if it weren't for this one product and the way it makes racking, degassing and bottling so easy, I might have given up on pursuing this hobby an long while ago.

2. Always have an extra hydrometer on hand.

3. Always have extra of your favorite kind of yeast on hand.

4. If you decide to make a fruit wine or a
quick drinking one and don't want to wait for it to clear naturally, my favorite fining agent is SuperKleer (Dualfine). It usually produces crystal clear wine in just a few days.

5. I like my wines to not only be pleasing to the palate but I want the whole product to be appealing. To that end, I always use some type of label, whether the ones that come in a kit or something I design myself. When I share with my friends, I like the entire presentation to be special...but that's probably just my vanity coming through  So, make your whole bottle special in some way...it will give you even more pride in your wine.

6. Don't cheap out on corks. I'm not saying that you have to buy the most expensive ones but make sure they are good quality. It will save a lot of frustration not only on bottling day but when you go to open your wine as well.

7. Share with your friends! It's important to make wine that you love but it's also fun to make some that you know your friends will enjoy even more than you do. 

8. Don't stress too much if you think you did something a little "wrong" during the process. I've made tons of small mistakes but my wine has turned out fine in the end anyway. 

9. I prefer to call my taste testing quality control inspections and it's one of the the most important jobs as a winemaker...regardless of the time of day 

10. Have fun! This is the best hobby you'll ever have!


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## ithink2020 (Aug 1, 2020)

@Brian55 How do you do EM? That is where you keep the grapes on the juice for an extended, correct?


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## Brian55 (Aug 2, 2020)

ithink2020 said:


> @Brian55 How do you do EM? That is where you keep the grapes on the juice for an extended, correct?







__





WineXpert - Eclipse Stag Leap Merlot Extended Maceration


Finally got around to starting this one. My initial sg after letting sit on the skin pack overnight was 1.094, just where I want it. @jgmann67 did you do your shortened EM? I am also considering not messing with a good thing, and doing it more or less by the book. Does this one benefit from...




www.winemakingtalk.com


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## skyfire322 (Aug 2, 2020)

Brian's and Val's points are great and I definitely agree with them 
_*(Please note: I'll be throwing in some silliness in my answers)*_:

*1. *You don't necessarily need to follow the instructions. While they're decent guidelines, factors can come into play. 

*2.* I concur with Brian... Over oak and let it age. Which kind of ties into #3.

*3*. Instead of using the included oak powder, try getting your hands on oak spirals, chips, or cubes. I personally think the powder really doesn't do much.

*4. *Make sure you're using a good sized funnel when pouring the kit juice into your fermenter, and for the love that all that is holy, make sure you're pouring on a hardwood or laminate floor. I learned that the hard way and my landlord wasn't too pleased with what looked like a murder scene.

*5.* If you make a mistake, don't panic because some stuff can be fixed! Whenever I thought I made a mistake with a kit, WMT helped tremendously. 

*6. *If you think you have enough hydrometers, you don't. Have you seen the show Hoarders? Yeah, like that but with hydrometers 

*7. *Three letters: A.I.O. Not only does it help racking, degassing, bottling easier, your back will thank you to the ends of the earth.

*8. *Take notes every time you touch the wine, no matter how trivial it may be. The exception being "I longingly looked at the carboy, just waiting for the day that first bottle is opened." while listening to the Monster Ballads compilation album. What happens in the cellar, stays in the cellar.

*9. *Have a blind tasting! I like to have my friends and family do an A/B on which one they prefer, and also how much they thought the bottle was. Who ever guesses the wines correctly and/or the closest dollar amount wins a bottle. Now, if someone says it tastes like the $1 BP gas station special, then I'll say no one was correct. In the words of Willy Wonka: "You Lose. Good day Sir."

*10. *Like Val said, get creative and make the wine personalized. As silly as it may sound, it's one of my favorite things to do. Heck, I make wine in my music studio but I label it as "Ancient Oak Cellars", design the labels, and give them unique names. People know that I don't own a vineyard or anything, but in a silly way, I feel like it gives me "street cred"  

*BONUS:*
Set some aside and open them on a special occasion a few years from the time you bottled them.


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## Val-the-Brew-Gal (Aug 2, 2020)

I thought of one more! Buy yourself some tubs to set your carboys in. I've had one break on two different occasions. The first time, I had 6 gallons of wine all over my floor. Thankfully, I had purchased the tubs before it happened again. I just bought laundry tubs and cut them down so I can better see when my wine is clear. Photo attached...


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## Val-the-Brew-Gal (Aug 2, 2020)

skyfire322 said:


> Like Val said, get creative and make the wine personalized. As silly as it may sound, it's one of my favorite things to do. Heck, I make wine in my music studio but I label it as "Ancient Oak Cellars", design the labels, and give them unique names. People know that I don't own a vineyard or anything, but in a silly way, I feel like it gives me "street cred"



Designing my labels is one of my favorite things too! Here's one of mine...


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## GaDawg (Aug 3, 2020)

Val-the-Brew-Gal said:


> I love making fruit wines and 4-6 week kits so my suggestions are quite different from Brian55's. As you can tell from my choices, I'm not a patient winemaker but I love my wines sweeter so these are well suited for someone who wants to be drinking their wines in a matter of weeks, not months or years.


I make the fruit wines and 4-6 week kits. I also make premium kits, so I alternate. That way I always have wine ready to drink. It's a lot easier to age wine if you have drinkable wine.


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## akron (Aug 3, 2020)

I haven’t been doing this very long, but I think the AIO pump is going to be my number 1 on any list would make. I just got it so am learning different ways to use it. A pH meter is also important for what I make.
Thanks to all for your good ideas.


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## GaDawg (Aug 3, 2020)

akron said:


> I haven’t been doing this very long, but I think the AIO pump is going to be my number 1 on any list would make. I just got it so am learning different ways to use it. A pH meter is also important for what I make.
> Thanks to all for your good ideas.


I would not be making wine without my AIO pump!


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## BernardSmith (Aug 3, 2020)

Val-the-Brew-Gal said:


> I thought of one more! Buy yourself some tubs to set your carboys in. I've had one break on two different occasions. The first time, I had 6 gallons of wine all over my floor. Thankfully, I had purchased the tubs before it happened again. I just bought laundry tubs and cut them down so I can better see when my wine is clear. Photo attached...View attachment 64345


Better than a tub, in my opinion are crates. Tubs don't often have any grips for your hands but crates do so they are easier to move around AND they protect the carboy far better. Any carboy larger than 2 gallons I fill in a crate.


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## GaDawg (Aug 3, 2020)

Val-the-Brew-Gal said:


> I thought of one more! Buy yourself some tubs to set your carboys in. I've had one break on two different occasions. The first time, I had 6 gallons of wine all over my floor. Thankfully, I had purchased the tubs before it happened again. I just bought laundry tubs and cut them down so I can better see when my wine is clear. Photo attached...View attachment 64345


I have also used a tub with ice water to slow fermentation.


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## Chuck E (Aug 3, 2020)

“Drink no wine before its time.” Have patience. Age for a minimum of one year. 
Be obsessive with sanitation. More problems are eliminated by cleanliness. 
Only make kits with skins or learn how to make fruit-packs. 
Write down everything you do… Everything! 
Science is your friend, but wine is art. Trust your taste buds. 
Wine is not finished until it is in a bottle with a label & a cap. Be creative. 
Bench testing is where you find the sweet spot in all additions. 
The All-In-One pump is indispensable. 
A floor corker is a must have. 
The FastWash system with the FastRack system makes bottling easy.


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## KCCam (Aug 3, 2020)

skyfire322 said:


> I learned that the hard way and my landlord wasn't too pleased with what looked like a murder scene.


 Hahaha, not funny then, for sure, but makes a great story now, right?


skyfire322 said:


> don't panic because some stuff can be fixed!


I might even say *most stuff *can be fixed.


skyfire322 said:


> *7. *Three letters: A.I.O. Not only does it help racking, degassing, bottling easier, your back will thank you to the ends of the earth.


Amen.


skyfire322 said:


> The exception being "I longingly looked at the carboy, just waiting for the day that first bottle is opened."


What's wrong with that? Am I the only one? 


skyfire322 said:


> Set some aside and open them on a special occasion a few years from the time you bottled them.


Agreed, and having nice labels on them makes it even more special.

Good advice, @skyfire322


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## familynerone (Aug 3, 2020)

I've only done kits thus far, and not a ton of them at that. But here's what I can contribute to this thread:
(1) Increase S.G. right out of the gate, particularly for sweeter fruit wine varietals, by adding in a portion of the F-pack before pitching the yeast. Add a bit of sugar too if not at the original S.G. you need for the final ABV you hope for. Save the rest of the F-pack for backsweetening.
(2) Keep a backup supply of a good all-around yeast (like EC-1118 for the fruity kits), yeast energizer, clearing agents. In a pinch this could mean breaking into an unopened kit, sure, but having a few extra packets of stuff will help you if something gets spilled.
(3) Get some smaller bottles (375mL) for small one-gallon wine kits; 10 small size versus 5 large size bottles for the yield, and, you can then open one a month to learn how aging affects the final product. I just bottled a small batch Cab this way that was delicious at bottling, can't wait to start opening my mini bottles in a few months to see how it matures over the course of a year. 
(4) There's no such thing as too many hydrometers... for roughly ten bucks it is really a no-brainer to have several around. Calibrate them often in plain water to ensure they are accurate.
(5) Get the floor corker! Totally worth it! 
(6) Invest in some carboy straps/carrier gadgets. There are always steps where lifting a full carboy is likely to be needed, and a slippery, full, glass 6.5-gallon carboy is just begging to be dropped. The straps help. A lot.
(7) Fermentation wraps are essential if you are making your wine in a basement room like we are... they increase the temp about 10 degrees F for us, which is perfect (room temp around 64 steadily so 74 is what we get with the wrap).
(8) Keep a record of every little step you take or thing you do. You might have a phenomenal result with a kit and not remember some of the things you tried when tweaking it - so it would be hard to replicate without notes. I have an Excel spreadsheet going where I capture that type of stuff.
(9) Find removable labels... or print on paper and use a glue stick. As your gifted wine is consumed and bottles returned to you, you'll be glad you did, as label removing is the bane of my existence right now. (If you also have friends collect wine bottles for you, remind them to only give you cork style or you'll be the neighborhood recycling pro with screw-top bottles filling up your trash).
(10) Have a steady table or cart a level lower than your primary work surface. This lets you rack to a lower level without being directly on the floor.
Have fun... and don't let people tell you that kit wine making is not "real" wine making (I've heard this more than once). The process may seem inauthentic to some, but, it is a great way to learn. And, it is also one of the only ways to make a wide variety of wines with ingredients sourced from all over the world. There are only so many varieties of fruits, veggies, and grapes, you can grow or purchase nearby! A kit wine will still give you a unique end product based on your process and environment.


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## KCCam (Aug 3, 2020)

Val-the-Brew-Gal said:


> I love making fruit wines and 4-6 week kits so my suggestions are quite different from Brian55's. As you can tell from my choices, I'm not a patient winemaker but I love my wines sweeter so these are well suited for someone who wants to be drinking their wines in a matter of weeks, not months or years.
> 
> 1. The All in One pump is the best thing I've ever purchased as far as equipment. In fact, if it weren't for this one product and the way it makes racking, degassing and bottling so easy, I might have given up on pursuing this hobby an long while ago.
> 
> ...


Right on the mark, every one. I must say, I need to work on #6, the corks, but I don't make enough to have any sitting around long enough to warrant it. The few that have made it 3 or 4 years were fine, but I knows I takes my chances! I also need to work on #7. None of my friends are really wine drinkers, but my Dad and oldest daughter are. I originally got into wine-making as a way to spend more time with my Dad. After COVID, I'll definitely be spending more time with them both.


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## KCCam (Aug 3, 2020)

Val-the-Brew-Gal said:


> I thought of one more! Buy yourself some tubs to set your carboys in. I've had one break on two different occasions. The first time, I had 6 gallons of wine all over my floor. Thankfully, I had purchased the tubs before it happened again. I just bought laundry tubs and cut them down so I can better see when my wine is clear. Photo attached...View attachment 64345


I like the white inside the tub. I wouldn't have thought of that when buying one, but very important, I can see. And with the AIO, they don't need handles, 'cause you never have to move them! Well, almost never. Haha.


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## KCCam (Aug 3, 2020)

Val-the-Brew-Gal said:


> Designing my labels is one of my favorite things too! Here's one of mine...
> 
> View attachment 64349
> View attachment 64350


Ahhh, @Val-the-Brew-Gal, I sooo envy your creative and artistic ability. After your 10 tips, I thought maybe we were twins separated at birth, but then this example of your labels, and I know that we definitely are not. I have been trying to make something for my Saskatoon and my Cherry/Blueberry batches of Dragon Blood, but I am hopeless. Oh well, something to work on. You are an inspiration.


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## DizzyIzzy (Aug 3, 2020)

Brian55 said:


> #1 Aging, whether bulk or bottle. There is nothing more important.
> #2 EM for at least a month on kits with skins
> #3 Oak, glass carboys and plastic buckets don't replicate barrel aging. If you don't have barrels, over oak it, it will fade with time.
> #4 Short the water addition, especially on cheaper kits.
> ...


Brian, in #2, what is EM? Also, in #9, what is LE? Thanks..................................Dizzy


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## DizzyIzzy (Aug 3, 2020)

Val-the-Brew-Gal said:


> Designing my labels is one of my favorite things too! Here's one of mine...
> 
> View attachment 64349
> View attachment 64350


Val, I just love your labels.....................I am so envious. Wish I knew how to do that........................Dizzy


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## Old Corker (Aug 4, 2020)

I've only been doing this for 2 years so am probably not qualified to make such a list. My list will be more newby oriented. Also, my list is in no particular order and will shamelessly steal from other people's lists.

I love my AIO as much as anyone here. Makes so many tasks easier and not frustrating.
That said, the first "optional" tool I bought was the floor stand corker. I took one look at the corker that came with my beginner's kit and said no way. I have chronic tendon issues with my thumbs and can't see using one of those 30 times.
Like others have said, make some that will be ready more quickly along with those you will want to age. Not only will it keep you out of the good stuff, it will help hone your skills.
Unlike some, I have grown almost anti-label. I will use the easy-off ones that come with some kits but really don't enjoy pealing labels. Mostly I just write on the bottles with a glass marker or even dry erase markers. Batch number, what it is and bottling date is about all that goes on the bottle. All other information is in the notes.
Read this forum often. I am trying at least 7 things from Brian55's list and all of them I learned about by reading this forum.
So I was only able to come up with 5 but will refer you to skyfire322 Item 1 


skyfire322 said:


> *1. *You don't necessarily need to follow the instructions.


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## pillswoj (Aug 4, 2020)

DizzyIzzy said:


> Brian, in #2, what is EM? Also, in #9, what is LE? Thanks..................................Dizzy


Dizzy,

EM is extended Maceration see Stag Leap EM

LE is WinExperts Limited Edition - 4 wine unique wines Available from December to March each year - generally need to be preordered. RJS has the same type of thing called RQ (restricted quantity)


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## Lukaswine (Aug 4, 2020)

BernardSmith said:


> Better than a tub, in my opinion are crates. Tubs don't often have any grips for your hands but crates do so they are easier to move around AND they protect the carboy far better. Any carboy larger than 2 gallons I fill in a crate.


What kind of crate? Plastic?


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## Chuck E (Aug 4, 2020)

Lukaswine said:


> What kind of crate? Plastic?



Plastic milk crates


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## Lukaswine (Aug 4, 2020)

Chuck E said:


> Plastic milk crates


Thanks.


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## KCCam (Aug 4, 2020)

Chuck E said:


> Plastic milk crates


They won't hold 6 gallons of wine if your carboy breaks though. At least the ones I've seen.


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## joeswine (Aug 4, 2020)

always think of "*tweaking cheap wine kits* as a _good guide_" and always *think outside the box*.


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## crushday (Aug 5, 2020)

DizzyIzzy said:


> Brian, in #2, what is EM? Also, in #9, what is LE? Thanks..................................Dizzy


EM = Extended Maceration. This is when you leave the included grape skins on the must for a month or more. The directions on most kits say to remove the skins after primary. I've left the skins on up to 10 weeks with excellent results. Google Tim Vandergrift and look for his video series on the subject. Excellent...

LE = Limited Edition. This is Winexpert's annual offerings of their high end kits. Like RJS RQ kits (restricted quantities) they are excellent most of the time.


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## GaDawg (Aug 5, 2020)

KCCam said:


> They won't hold 6 gallons of wine if your carboy breaks though. At least the ones I've seen.


The milk crate is not insurance if the carboy breakage, it’s protection to prevent the carboy from breaking.


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## ZebraB (Aug 5, 2020)

The lessons that I have learned the hard way from making white wine kits the past year.

Goldilocks of sulfide management is hard: The sulfide provided in the kit is to high and strips flavors and potentially overdose with sulfide if you store in carboy and put 1/4 tsp every 3 month. After trial and errors, my current regiment is 1/4 tsp of effervescent SO2 regardless of the PH and current SO2 levels and check every 2 months. (white wine change quickly when the CO2 dissipates). I do not rack when adding SO2. The effervescent will do the mixing. (Note when the wine is young and has CO2 it does volcano so add very slowly). I also try to bottle shortly after natural clearing to reduce sulfide adds. (Note: the remaining drip from sanitation with potassium sulfide + acid in a bottle did make a difference in one batch.)
Stirring and air during primary fermentation seems to produce bland white wines for me. I now keep open and room temp first 24 hours and then close off and put in an old refrigerator with ink bird to control temp about 65F. I do put in Ferm K at 1.05 - 1.04 (I know some even go lower with temp).
I add Options-white, Booster blanc during fermentation. This provide a fruitier flavor for me. I also use FT soft blanc but have learned to taste before adding after fermentation. It does soften/smooth some of the harshness of young wine. However, one time blinding adding it made it wine a little too sweet for my liking.


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## winemaker81 (Aug 5, 2020)

1. Listen to what the more experienced wine makers do, and more importantly, why they do it. Do your own research. Make your own informed decisions.

2. Use a hydrometer consistently at every step in the process. It is your friend.

3. Read the kit instructions and understand what is happening at each step.

4. Understand what the additives are and why they are in the kit.

5. Keep good notes. Write it down, and save your notes from previous batches.

6. The kit instructions do not tell you when fermentation is complete -- the hydrometer does.

7. Post-fermentation time frames in kit instructions are not rules, they are minimum values. You can always age the wine longer at each step.

8. Fight your own impatience. Wine making requires patience and rushing is almost always a mistake.

9. Cleanliness is critical to success.

10. The most expensive kits do not necessarily make the best wine, and cheapest kits do not necessarily make the worst wine.


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## DizzyIzzy (Aug 5, 2020)

pillswoj said:


> Dizzy,
> 
> EM is extended Maceration see Stag Leap EM
> 
> LE is WinExperts Limited Edition - 4 wine unique wines Available from December to March each year - generally need to be preordered. RJS has the same type of thing called RQ (restricted quantity)


Thanks for the info: always good to know.........................Dizzy


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## DizzyIzzy (Aug 5, 2020)

crushday said:


> EM = Extended Maceration. This is when you leave the included grape skins on the must for a month or more. The directions on most kits say to remove the skins after primary. I've left the skins on up to 10 weeks with excellent results. Google Tim Vandergrift and look for his video series on the subject. Excellent...
> 
> LE = Limited Edition. This is Winexpert's annual offerings of their high end kits. Like RJS RQ kits (restricted quantities) they are excellent most of the time.


Thankyou for the enlightenment......................Dizzy


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## DizzyIzzy (Aug 5, 2020)

ZebraB said:


> The lessons that I have learned the hard way from making white wine kits the past year.
> 
> Goldilocks of sulfide management is hard: The sulfide provided in the kit is to high and strips flavors and potentially overdose with sulfide if you store in carboy and put 1/4 tsp every 3 month. After trial and errors, my current regiment is 1/4 tsp of effervescent SO2 regardless of the PH and current SO2 levels and check every 2 months. (white wine change quickly when the CO2 dissipates). I do not rack when adding SO2. The effervescent will do the mixing. (Note when the wine is young and has CO2 it does volcano so add very slowly). I also try to bottle shortly after natural clearing to reduce sulfide adds. (Note: the remaining drip from sanitation with potassium sulfide + acid in a bottle did make a difference in one batch.)
> Stirring and air during primary fermentation seems to produce bland white wines for me. I now keep open and room temp first 24 hours and then close off and put in an old refrigerator with ink bird to control temp about 65F. I do put in Ferm K at 1.05 - 1.04 (I know some even go lower with temp).
> I add Options-white, Booster blanc during fermentation. This provide a fruitier flavor for me. I also use FT soft blanc but have learned to taste before adding after fermentation. It does soften/smooth some of the harshness of young wine. However, one time blinding adding it made it wine a little too sweet for my liking.


What's an "ink bird"?............Dizzy


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## DizzyIzzy (Aug 5, 2020)

I am new to this hobby, but here are a few of my must-haves:
1. AIO
2. Floor corker
3. Amoretti fruit purees , 8 oz. from Label Peelers (to enhance the fruit flavor of a fruit wine.......they are terrific!)
4. Fun and attractive labels
5. "Slant Rim"crystal wine glasses by Craftware (because of the slant, the nose is closer to the bouquet given off by the wine, thus one can "smell the bouquet"
at the same time as tasting the wine. Makes the whole experience enhanced.
6. Different size bottles/jugs/carboys with appropriate bungs for use in aging
7, Patience and attention to details and sanitation
That's ll I can think of right now...........................................................Dizzy


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## jorgensk (Aug 6, 2020)

DizzyIzzy said:


> What's an "ink bird"?............Dizzy



It's a temperature controller.
They do produce other things as well, but is best known for their temperature controllers.





Temperature Controller | INKBIRD


Inkbird temperature controller has w/ Dual Time Cycle Temperature Controller ITC-306T, Outlet Thermostat Temperature Controller ITC-308, Programmable Temperature Controller ITC-310T, All-Purpose Temperature Controller ITC-1000F, Alarm & Relay Ouput Temperature ITC-2000.




www.ink-bird.com


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## winemaker81 (Aug 6, 2020)

Equipment? Here's an area for argume--, err, discussion!

*Must Have?* This list is the equipment to start wine making. I started with less, and some folks do not have the resources or availability to get more.

food grade bucket or ceramic crock for primary fermentation
glass secondary containers of appropriate size + closure of some kind
smaller bottles for topup
plain racking tube
screw caps bottles
long handle spoon for stirring
My first batch of wine was made in a used beer ball (5 gallon plastic sphere, mini-keg) that acted as the primary and secondary fermenter. I lacked a siphon (racking) hose so I poured it off the sediment and later into plastic screwcap whiskey bottles. Yes, the result was wine ... but above list helps in making _good_ wine. 

*Should Have! *However, I don't recommend anyone start making wine without a hydrometer.

hydrometer
8+ gallon food grade primary fermenter
drilled stoppers + air locks for all containers
cheap corker
corkable glass wine bottles
Screw cap bottles work, but with repeated usage the seal will eventually fail, so they are not generally recommended. Don't try to cork them -- the necks are weaker than corkable bottles and can shatter during corking.

*Getting Serious?* If ya think yer gonna do it more than once, pick up a few helpful toys.

self-priming racking tube
filler tube (for bottling)
good corker, preferably a floor cooker
stainless steel stirring rod or spoon
For a beginner, IMO the best choice is to purchase a hardware kit, something like *this one*. Note, I'm not pimping my local shop, this is for illustration.

_Buy locally when you can -- support them when they need you so they will be there when you need them._

*Dang! This is fun!* Yes, as ya get more into the hobby, get more useful toys.

Several extra carboys
Several extra primary fermenters
Fermtech wine thief *
yet more bottles of all sizes for topup
drilled stoppers + air locks for all containers, better too many than too few
vented bungs
drill mounted stirring rod
thermometer
* The Fermtech wine thief is (I think) the only brand name product I’m attached to. It makes checking SG in the carboy or barrel easier with minimal air contact.

*Other Stuff ....*

Test kits, including pH and Total Acid (TA)
I have pH paper and a TA kit. Like most people, I suck at performing TA titration so I use it sporadically. The only test equipment I use consistently is the hydrometer.

One toy I don't have but gets glowing reviews ... I may get one, as it should speed up racking a barrel by a LOT.

Vacuum pump


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## ZebraB (Aug 6, 2020)

DizzyIzzy said:


> What's an "ink bird"?............Dizzy


Below is the link for what I have. There are other brands of controllers that are similar. I attach the probe to the outside of my fermentation vessel by HVAC tape.

I got an old apartment size refridge off Craigs list for $100. We put a think piece of plywood for a flat bottom and it *jus*t fits a Speidel 30L fermentor with airlock, So I would be mindful of the measurements.




https://www.amazon.com/Inkbird-Thermostat-Temperature-Controller-Fermentation/dp/B015E2UFGM/ref=sr_1_2_sspa?crid=3SDYJA0KBTR10&dchild=1&keywords=temp+controller+brewing&qid=1596724435&sprefix=temp+controller%2Caps%2C219&sr=8-2-spons&psc=1&spLa=ZW5jcnlwdGVkUXVhbGlmaWVyPUEyTEpLODhMNEhaSE1SJmVuY3J5cHRlZElkPUEwOTM0NTc1M1BYVEVaM09RTk4wJmVuY3J5cHRlZEFkSWQ9QTA1MDI1OTEzRDZLM0kzT1hVQTM1JndpZGdldE5hbWU9c3BfYXRmJmFjdGlvbj1jbGlja1JlZGlyZWN0JmRvTm90TG9nQ2xpY2s9dHJ1ZQ==


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## akron (Aug 6, 2020)

DizzyIzzy said:


> I am new to this hobby, but here are a few of my must-haves:
> 1. AIO
> 2. Floor corker
> 3. Amoretti fruit purees , 8 oz. from Label Peelers (to enhance the fruit flavor of a fruit wine.......they are terrific!)
> ...


Tell us more about #3, fruit purees. How do you use them? When in the process? How much usually?


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## szap (Aug 6, 2020)

I have found this gadget for filling bottles to be one of my best purchases.




https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0064OKYFC/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_apa_i_LrflFb6S3QBGD


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## winemaker81 (Aug 6, 2020)

szap said:


> I have found this gadget for filling bottles to be one of my best purchases.
> 
> 
> https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0064OKYFC/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_apa_i_LrflFb6S3QBGD


Q&A on Amazon says it leaks. Do you have that problem, and if so, how severe is it?


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## vineyarddog (Aug 6, 2020)

winemaker81 said:


> Q&A on Amazon says it leaks. Do you have that problem, and if so, how severe is it?



I’ve had a terrible time with leaks.. It worked well for a while but eventually just started leaking every time.. makes quite a mess!


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## Val-the-Brew-Gal (Aug 6, 2020)

BernardSmith said:


> Better than a tub, in my opinion are crates. Tubs don't often have any grips for your hands but crates do so they are easier to move around AND they protect the carboy far better. Any carboy larger than 2 gallons I fill in a crate.



I have the AIO so seldom have to move a full carboy but I can see the appeal of a crate if you do.


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## knockabout (Aug 9, 2020)

Great question and you’ve gotten a lot of good answers! Here’s mine...
1. AIO - love it gotta have it! I can’t lift a full 23l carboy.
2 I have never overoaked a wine. I’ve tried and tried even with my barrel but they all fall back into a nice smooth blend after a year or so... I love oak and think it is magical so I’ll keep trying.
3. Extra tannins - I add extra tannins to all kits buckets and grapes. Early sacrificial tannins ageing tannins and finishing/cellaring tannins.... again magic! (Somewhere there was an excellent article on tannins written here - I can no longer locate this)
4. Yeast swap.... just did same wine with 3 different yeasts.... wow . I will never use e1118 again. Flavor profile is so different.
5. Buy a decent kit to start with. 
6. Yep...aging!
7. Made the great oak experiment - 18 gallons of wine with 17 different oak combinations and one without.... now I know which oak and level of toast will add what to my wine....,this was one of the smartest experiments I’ve ever done - come visit San Antonio I’ll share some!
8. Ask and Listen listen... I’ve learned so much from the kindness of others in this forum! They’ve helped saved fixed And shown me new ideas THat have helped me improve or save my wine!
9. Friends and family to taste and offer feedback - or a competition just to get some written feedback from a learned taster.
10. A tolerant hubby that has expanded our wine cellar (old linen closet)and agreed no one really needs a linen closet/spare sheets and towels when You have enough wine.


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## Ceibal (Aug 12, 2020)

knockabout said:


> Great question and you’ve gotten a lot of good answers! Here’s mine...
> 1. AIO - love it gotta have it! I can’t lift a full 23l carboy.
> 2 I have never overoaked a wine. I’ve tried and tried even with my barrel but they all fall back into a nice smooth blend after a year or so... I love oak and think it is magical so I’ll keep trying.
> 3. Extra tannins - I add extra tannins to all kits buckets and grapes. Early sacrificial tannins ageing tannins and finishing/cellaring tannins.... again magic! (Somewhere there was an excellent article on tannins written here - I can no longer locate this)
> ...


What yeast did you use instead of the e1118? I am looking at doing a few of the new Wine Expert Kits and was thinking about swapping out the yeast.


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## knockabout (Aug 12, 2020)

Ceibal said:


> What yeast did you use instead of the e1118? I am looking at doing a few of the new Wine Expert Kits and was thinking about swapping out the yeast.


I’ve used a bunch. I go to the morewinemaking yeast description page and find one suitable for the wine that matches my taste. I’ve used rp-15, clos, d80, d254, d21, bm45, assmanhausen, rc212, e1118 - I’m not the most experienced with these but seems to me e1118gets the Job done without enhancing much. Some of the others enhance the fruit or aromas or even complexity. I don’t care for rp15, assmanhausen needs to be babied lots of nutrients slow fermentation... but mostly a matter of preference. I prefer spice and leather and tobaccos in my red I can enhance this with certain varietal and yeast choices. 
The actual Choosing THE yeast is a long conversation with hubby over a couple of days where we go back and forth we till We agree - huge part of the fun for us!


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## Ceibal (Aug 13, 2020)

knockabout said:


> I’ve used a bunch. I go to the morewinemaking yeast description page and find one suitable for the wine that matches my taste. I’ve used rp-15, clos, d80, d254, d21, bm45, assmanhausen, rc212, e1118 - I’m not the most experienced with these but seems to me e1118gets the Job done without enhancing much. Some of the others enhance the fruit or aromas or even complexity. I don’t care for rp15, assmanhausen needs to be babied lots of nutrients slow fermentation... but mostly a matter of preference. I prefer spice and leather and tobaccos in my red I can enhance this with certain varietal and yeast choices.
> The actual Choosing THE yeast is a long conversation with hubby over a couple of days where we go back and forth we till We agree - huge part of the fun for us!


Have you used the BDX wine yeast for reds? Morewinemaking's description says they use it in all of their reds. I believe I used rc212 on my fresh grapes I did almost two years ago, still aging. I am looking at enhancing the flavor and complexity more than anything.


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## szap (Aug 13, 2020)

vineyarddog said:


> I’ve had a terrible time with leaks.. It worked well for a while but eventually just started leaking every time.. makes quite a mess!


I clamped the line coming into the filler and just leave it on there. I can have some overflow after it shuts itself off. When filling I set the bottles in the plastic container that came with my bottle drying racks but any kind of small tub will do. It catches any leaks. When bottling a batch, I might lose 1/3 of a bottle which is a fair tradeoff for the time it saves and the auto shutoff. I will try to remember to take a video next time I use it.


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## vineyarddog (Aug 13, 2020)

szap said:


> I clamped the line coming into the filler and just leave it on there. I can have some overflow after it shuts itself off. When filling I set the bottles in the plastic container that came with my bottle drying racks but any kind of small tub will do. It catches any leaks. When bottling a batch, I might lose 1/3 of a bottle which is a fair tradeoff for the time it saves and the auto shutoff. I will try to remember to take a video next time I use it.


Mine leaks through the stop of the “button” that you push to allow wine flow. No need to post a video for my benefit, I threw it away.


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## niko13 (Aug 13, 2020)

mine leaks too but I dont complain about it because I bought the AIO shortly afterwards about 2 years ago.


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## winemaker81 (Aug 14, 2020)

knockabout said:


> 2 I have never overoaked a wine. I’ve tried and tried even with my barrel but they all fall back into a nice smooth blend after a year or so... I love oak and think it is magical so I’ll keep trying.


Actually, it is possible, but ya gotta work at it. My brother-in-law REALLY overdid oak chips in a carboy of chardonnay. Five years later it still taste liked the bar we were sitting at.


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## knockabout (Aug 14, 2020)

Ceibal said:


> Have you used the BDX wine yeast for reds? Morewinemaking's description says they use it in all of their reds. I believe I used rc212 on my fresh grapes I did almost two years ago, still aging. I am looking at enhancing the flavor and complexity more than anything.


Nope but sounds great! Please report back


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## knockabout (Aug 15, 2020)

Ceibal said:


> Have you used the BDX wine yeast for reds? Morewinemaking's description says they use it in all of their reds. I believe I used rc212 on my fresh grapes I did almost two years ago, still aging. I am looking at enhancing the flavor and complexity more than anything.


Wanted to direct you to the ‘Yeast topic forum’ here. Lots of info on different yeasts preferences inc BDX


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## ithink2020 (Dec 1, 2020)

I just wanted to say think you to everyone that posted. I'd been off the site a bit and really enjoyed reading through all these!


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## joeswine (Dec 26, 2020)

I never use fruit purees in wine ,either fresh fruit , zest or extracts.
Purees are unpredictable in quality and content.


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