# Retirement VS working



## JohnT

It struck me this morning that once I retired, my appreciation for the simple things has drastically increased.

For example, 

When I was working, my head was filled with worry. Worry about driving through snow, worry about getting to work on time, worry on how the traffic will be going home, and worry about getting my project done on time. 

In short, my life was constantly about time pressure and worry.

This morning, i woke up to this.. 




It was like the sky was on fire.

To think that I never noticed the splendor of things like this. I was always too busy.

Smell the roses folks!


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## Rembee

Very well said @JohnT !


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## cmason1957

The roses can be there, even when you are a working bum, like me. But you have to remember that taking the time to play with the grandkids, appreciating the things around you is time very well spent. I even recommend taking five or ten minutes a day to sit in quiet reflection, with just your thoughts. Some call it prayer, some call it meditation, I call it time to remember who you are.


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## Vern

JohnT said:


> It struck me this morning that once I retired, my appreciation for the simple things has drastically increased.
> 
> For example,
> 
> When I was working, my head was filled with worry. Worry about driving through snow, worry about getting to work on time, worry on how the traffic will be going home, and worry about getting my project done on time.
> 
> In short, my life was constantly about time pressure and worry.
> 
> This morning, i woke up to this..
> 
> View attachment 71262
> 
> 
> It was like the sky was on fire.
> 
> To think that I never noticed the splendor of things like this. I was always too busy.
> 
> Smell the roses folks!


I retired 10 months ago and feel as you do.


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## jswordy

@JohnT, working from home for the last 11 months because of the pandemic has done that for me. It has been a wonderful experience and I am going to really HATE going back to the office. My BP numbers are 20-25 points lower than they were when I was commuting and working at the office, since I am much less pressurized to get everything done outside office hours.

Since I am in control of my workflow here, I can do things as they best suit me, not for someone else who just popped in my office to ruin my entire day. I'm actually more efficient for my employer this way, too. But they are pressing hard for everyone to get vaccinated and get back to the grind.

I'm locked in for 18 months and 25 days in order to pick up a second small pension. I said that to a retired friend, and he said, "That sounds like a prison sentence" Yes sir, it sure does. 

My favorite Chris Rea song...


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## JohnT

I put in 31 years. To think that murderers get out of prison in 20. lol


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## Rembee

JohnT said:


> I put in 31 years. To think that murderers get out of prison in 20. lol


I put in 39 years lol


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## Robert R

I have an Excel file on my personal drive at work titled Days To Retirement. I just checked, it's at 794 days. I am SO ready to tend my small orchard / berry patch, beehives, chicken flock, make wine, practice my photography again, etc, etc.


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## JohnT

Robert R said:


> I have an Excel file on my personal drive at work titled Days To Retirement. I just checked, it's at 794 days. I am SO ready to tend my small orchard / berry patch, beehives, chicken flock, make wine, practice my photography again, etc, etc.


Unless something unexpected happens, like a pandemic......


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## silverbullet07

Robert R said:


> I have an Excel file on my personal drive at work titled Days To Retirement.


They have nice little retirement countdown clock apps to install on our phone now.

I’ll have a nice pension in 2 years with 30 years of service. I’ll only be 55. We have no debt and we have saved well for retirement. I feel like I should work past my retirement a few years at least being so young. LOL.


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## bstnh1

I retired the first time in 1996; got bored in 3 months and picked up a part time job for the next 10 years. Retired the second time in 2007. I highly recommend it. But make sure you have something to do other than lounging around. That gets old real fast!


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## WillM

I retired a little over a year ago. After 47 years, last 25 in a fast pace, moderate to high pressure environment. Within one week of retiring, my wife said, "you seem so different"! I've never looked back! I've learned to slow down and enjoy the moment. The hardest lesson learned was that I wasn't in a rush anymore. I could take my time, I didn't have to multitask if I didn't want to! Life is good!


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## wood1954

I agree being retired probably extends our life span, no more pressure or worry. I’m as busy or not as I want to be now.


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## Robert R

Stress from a previous job contributed to my mild heart attack and blocked arteries in 2017. A year ago was diagnosed with Parkinson's Disease. As soon as I get Medicare, I'm out of the work force to enjoy what time I have left.


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## Johnd

JohnT said:


> It struck me this morning that once I retired, my appreciation for the simple things has drastically increased.
> 
> For example,
> 
> When I was working, my head was filled with worry. Worry about driving through snow, worry about getting to work on time, worry on how the traffic will be going home, and worry about getting my project done on time.
> 
> In short, my life was constantly about time pressure and worry.
> 
> This morning, i woke up to this..
> 
> View attachment 71262
> 
> 
> It was like the sky was on fire.
> 
> To think that I never noticed the splendor of things like this. I was always too busy.
> 
> Smell the roses folks!


Red skies in morning, sailors take warning!!!!!!!!!!!!!


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## wood1954

Robert R said:


> Stress from a previous job contributed to my mild heart attack and blocked arteries in 2017. A year ago was diagnosed with Parkinson's Disease. As soon as I get Medicare, I'm out of the work force to enjoy what time I have left.


Good luck with the Parkinson’s, it seems that it’s a lot worse disease than I thought, sad that as we retire we get all these age related diseases.


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## Riledup5

I am envious of you guys, but I do see the light at the end of the tunnel. I have been diligently saving for 28 years so that I could retire early (currently 50 y/o). My goal when I started was to retire at 55, but a divorce delayed that timeline, but I think I am on track to retire at 60. I have a golf buddy who is now 74 and he told me about 5 years ago, "Spend some of that money now before you won't be physically able to do the things you plan on doing in retirement". I took that advice and my new wife and I have been travelling and I have taken the time to golf more than I ever have. My buddies and I are doing a golf trip at the end of February. But with a good financial planner and budgeting, I believe I can still retire at 60. We are going to move somewhere warm, still undecide as to where exactly, though. Any suggestions? Doesn't necessarily have to be in the US


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## crushday

Riledup5 said:


> We are going to move somewhere warm, still undecide as to where exactly, though. Any suggestions?


I'm headed to Port Isabel/South Padre Island (Texas Gulf Coast) in a few weeks to look for a winter home. You should check it out. Weather there is great. There have been a few hurricanes, however. But, no sense living in fear!


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## Riledup5

crushday said:


> I'm headed to Port Isabel/South Padre Island (Texas Gulf Coast) in a few weeks to look for a winter home. You should check it out. Weather there is great. There have been a few hurricanes, however. But, no sense living in fear!


I have not been there yet, but know many people that have. Each one of them said it is a great place. Definitely will check it out!


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## sour_grapes

Riledup5 said:


> But with a good financial planner and budgeting, I believe I can still retire at 60.



Probably you could get there faster WITHOUT the financial planner (to siphon off your gains). Check into Bogleheads: Bogleheads.org - Index page
or Getting started - Bogleheads


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## Robert R

wood1954 said:


> Good luck with the Parkinson’s, it seems that it’s a lot worse disease than I thought, sad that as we retire we get all these age related diseases.


So far, my symptoms are on the mild side. Meds and regular exercise are helping, so I'm trying to stay optimistic and keep doing things I like to do.


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## sour_grapes

I was going to hold off, but this seems like as good an opportunity to announce as I will get. I put in my notice; I will be retiring in May.


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## balatonwine

One does not need to retire to experience similar. There are other ways.

For example, get a dog. And religiously walk them each morning and evening (or even at 2:00 AM if they have to "go"). That will help "slow you down", emotionally and psychologically if you approach such walks as a healthy action for your dog (and for you).

I once saw a very rare glow worm on a 4:00 AM walk with my dog. Seeing that was a real treasure. And that was not the only treasure he showed me on our walks.


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## NoQuarter

I did my first 20 for the USA., have 3 more years with the railroad.
Then the real work begins. Got a lifetime of work left on my farm.


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## Riledup5

sour_grapes said:


> WITHOUT the financial planner (to siphon off your gains)


I used to do that Grapes, BUT he has gotten me into investments that I could not have gotten in myself. He has gotten me much better returns (including subtracting his fees) that I ever could have gotten. On this one I am "staying in my lane"


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## Obbnw

Retirement has been on my mind a lot recently. A few years back I was skiing alone, riding up the lift the 3 strangers, one asked where I was from.

I said "I'm a local, will be at work by one."
He said "Retired and visiting from...".
I said "Can't retire yet, run out of money too quick."
The guy on the far side of the chair leans forward, looks at me and says "I've got friends who ran out of health." 

The comment has resonated with me, then this year my brother, 59, was diagnosed with terminal brain cancer. I've got 4 siblings and if you asked any of us who would live the longest, we all would said it's the one who is now dying.

Work or play? can I enjoy the free time or feel guilty for not working? Will I stay healthy? Unknowns abound. But I think I'm moving that target date up 5 to 7 years.


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## ibglowin

Except that its...... TX. LOL Was born and raised in San Antonio.

Hope you like heat and humidity!



crushday said:


> I'm headed to Port Isabel/South Padre Island (Texas Gulf Coast) in a few weeks to look for a winter home. You should check it out. Weather there is great. There have been a few hurricanes, however. But, no sense living in fear!


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## crushday

sour_grapes said:


> I was going to hold off, but this seems like as good an opportunity to announce as I will get. I put in my notice; I will be retiring in May.


Very Nice, sour-grapes!! Congratulations...


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## ibglowin

Retired at 60 (pension, 401K, Roth) and have never looked back. Don't miss it at all (except for the cooler talk maybe). 2020 sucked as we were stuck at home (like everyone else) but now that things are looking better in 2021 we can't wait to travel again. Doesn't suck to live in a place with 350 days of sunshine, blue skies and zero humidity either!


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## ibglowin

Way to go Paul! 





sour_grapes said:


> I was going to hold off, but this seems like as good an opportunity to announce as I will get. I put in my notice; I will be retiring in May.


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## Tipsy

I have been retired for 7 years. My husband retired a few years later. We had a couple of years travelling and having a wonderful time. In 2018 he got cancer. He was previously never sick, very healthy. He passed away in 2019. My advise to any of you are thinking on retiring is do it as soon as you can. 

I am healthy and hoping to travel again as well as soon as covid is under control again. This time with friends rather than my hubby. I found when I first retired I was always wondering what I was forgetting. It took me a year to finally relax into it, but I love the leisure now. I also find I appreciate the small things like a nice day or sunset more than I used to. Love it.


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## Sage

Retired and had a great life. Enjoyed my time. Got some relaxing time!

Then...............my wife retired


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## sour_grapes

Tipsy said:


> I have been retired for 7 years. My husband retired a few years later. We had a couple of years travelling and having a wonderful time. In 2018 he got cancer. He was previously never sick, very healthy. He passed away in 2019. My advise to any of you are thinking on retiring is do it as soon as you can.
> 
> I am healthy and hoping to travel again as well as soon as covid is under control again. This time with friends rather than my hubby. I found when I first retired I was always wondering what I was forgetting. It took me a year to finally relax into it, but I love the leisure now. I also find I appreciate the small things like a nice day or sunset more than I used to. Love it.



I am sorry for your loss, Tipsy. I endorse your sentiment.


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## sour_grapes

Obbnw said:


> The comment has resonated with me, then this year my brother, 59, was diagnosed with terminal brain cancer. I've got 4 siblings and if you asked any of us who would live the longest, we all would said it's the one who is now dying.



I will admit that my sister dying of cancer at 58 got my attention! I am 57 now...


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## sour_grapes

Sage said:


> Retired and had a great life. Enjoyed my time. Got some relaxing time!
> 
> Then...............my wife retired



One description of retirement that I have heard is: "Half the money, twice the spouse!"


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## Boatboy24

sour_grapes said:


> I was going to hold off, but this seems like as good an opportunity to announce as I will get. I put in my notice; I will be retiring in May.



Congrats, Paul!


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## Rice_Guy

Robert R said:


> Stress from a previous job contributed to my mild heart attack and blocked arteries in 2017. A year ago was diagnosed with Parkinson's Disease. As soon as I get Medicare, I'm out of the work force to enjoy what time I have left.


* one can apply for Medicare at 64 1/2 so that there is no lag time.
* if health is influencing work there is SSI-D which includes health care.

_health is , , , well you are not the first I met who work because of insurance, , , , I have been a single parent for someone who qualified for SSI-D , , , , this part of America needs to be fixed

May God be gentle on you_


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## sour_grapes

Okay, further update: After some debate, Mrs. Sour_Grapes put her notice in, too!


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## ibglowin

Congrats on another fantastic decision!



sour_grapes said:


> Okay, further update: After some debate, Mrs. Sour_Grapes put her notice in, too!
> 
> View attachment 71330


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## Venatorscribe

Rembee said:


> I put in 39 years lol


37 years for me then my health packed up from the stress of it all. Retirement has been a godsend and extended an endless array of life supporting possibilities...


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## Robert R

Rice_Guy said:


> * one can apply for Medicare at 64 1/2 so that there is no lag time.
> * if health is influencing work there is SSI-D which includes health care.[/I]


Oh, I'll apply for it as soon as possible. If I have my way, I will retire effective my 65th birthday, if not sooner. My health is not affecting my work, but I'm rapidly getting tired of the whole routine of getting up to go sit in an office all day, rinse and repeat.


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## GeoffMcG

I started to retire about 5 years ago by cutting back to 3 days per week, I'm 67 now. Initially all time was in the office but after about year or so I built a house in the country on a a few acres and started working mostly from home, only going into the office for a day once every couple of weeks. Then I reduced to 10 hours per week but still went to the office occasionally. Covid stopped that. So now fully from home on my own schedule. I'm very appreciative to the company I work for, so lucky.
I've have planted a small vineyard (160 vines) and a built wine room in the shed. We subdivided our property so now our daughter and grand kids live next door.
When I first reduced to 10 hours I found myself rushing for no reason, just a habit learnt over the years. I look back on my full-time work life and realise I must have been stressed and rushing most of the time.
Anyway, loving it!!


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## JohnT

@Riledup5

I had this dear friend. On day I got a call from his wife. He had struck a utility truck rolled his SUV into a ditch. He was DOA at age 58.

It really brought "here today and gone tomorrow" home. You just never know.

Congrats @sour_grapes !


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## Old Corker

Good for you @sour_grapes! Enjoy!
I’ve been thinking a lot about retirement recently too. Still have a few years to go. Love my work but it is demanding and pressure packed. One thing I learned about myself during the lockdown is that I will be OK with retirement.


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## Old Corker

crushday said:


> I'm headed to Port Isabel/South Padre Island (Texas Gulf Coast) in a few weeks to look for a winter home. You should check it out. Weather there is great. There have been a few hurricanes, however. But, no sense living in fear!


We moved to Texas from N. CA 13 years ago. My wife is born and raised Californian. Two things about the Texas Gulf Coast. The sun sets on the wrong side and the beaches sometimes have oil on them. We don’t go to the coast much now.


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## Kraffty

I somehow missed this thread until this morning, busy busy busy you know. I agree with everyone's sentiments and plan on getting much better at this whole retirement thing over the next few decades. Congratulations to you and your wife Paul, the additional time you'll have to explore any and everything that interests you is amazing. We've been fortunate enough to kind of slide into retirement, I still put in a few hours each month if needed and Lori is available as customers need her. I started taking my SS a little over a year ago and it just goes straight to savings. We never really had a long term plan in place other than get debt free, put some money away and as Lori is fond of saying, "just keep your head down and work". 
Enjoy all the time you now have, you're all earned it, and them some!


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## mbrssmd

Like other threads on this forum, this one has delivered a lot of worthwhile and good-humored wisdom especially by the ‘regulars’ whom I’ve come to appreciate reading these past years.

I’m 66 and retired now 10 years, after 30 years in a government job that in its final years consisted of too many airports and unhealthful amounts of pressure (my saintly wife had far less polite words).

I always remembered that on the day my dad retired, back in the 1980s, he pointedly never again put on a watch, just leaving it out on a counter as a reminder.

A year or two into my own retirement, one evening I was sitting on the porch as a gloriously majestic thunderstorm was sliding by way off in the distance to the north, lit up by the setting sun. And I had this sudden revelation that I was completely missing the moment because, as usual, I was fiddling around with my smartphone, looking at radar and whatnot, probably trying to get the exact location of the storm.

The very next day I traded the smartphone away for a dumb flip phone – good for calls and texts but nothing else. I’ve never regretted it. I think it may have been the equivalent of my dad never putting his wristwatch back on.


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## Mc vintner

Retired 4 years ago and went from being a pharmacist to a farmacist on 10 acres with 230 vine vineyard, small orchard, and large veggie garden on the mid coast region of Maine. Eased into retirement by stepping down from management then 2 years later cutting down to 3 days a week for 2 years before calling it quits after 38 years. Now really enjoying the good life developing the art of growing our grapes and making our own wine (four different varieties). If at all possible, I recommend retirement as early as possible and enjoy life while you can.


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## Kraffty

@mbrssmd I like that thought. My wife took my watch from me years ago saying simply if you're in a situation where you need to know the time, it's available. There are clocks in your car, on your computer, on your stoves, night stand, radio, TV and outside many buildings.


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## Kraffty

I meant to mention that the sentiment being expressed here is a reflection of what many Americans are feeling in the wake of the pandemic. At least according to TV news and internet and we know they're always 100% accurate.


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## Robert R

Kraffty said:


> @mbrssmd I like that thought. My wife took my watch from me years ago saying simply if you're in a situation where you need to know the time, it's available. There are clocks in your car, on your computer, on your stoves, night stand, radio, TV and outside many buildings.


I quit wearing an actual watch after surgery for a fractured left wrist in 2007 left a scar right where the watch sat, and the watch irritated the scar. I've worn a Fitbit since recovering from heart surgery in 2017, more for the activity tracking than keeping time.


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## ibglowin

I still wear a watch. Not for time telling so much as time telling to get up off my arse and move it, move it! It also keeps track of my blood O2 levels (nice during this pandemic), tells me if I am in need of hearing protection (loud noise for too long), tells me if I am in A-Fib or sinus rhythm and if I should fall down and can't get up it will call 911 as well.......


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## Boatboy24

ibglowin said:


> I still wear a watch. Not for time telling so much as time telling to get up off my arse and move it, move it! It also keeps track of my blood O2 levels (nice during this pandemic), tells me if I am in need of hearing protection (loud noise for too long), tells me if I am in A-Fib or sinus rhythm and if I should fall down and can't get up it will call 911 as well.......



I like my Apple Watch for all of those reasons. And though I haven't been running much in the last several months, it was great to have on runs. Hoping to get back to it soon. Also liked that if I ever fall on an early morning run, I'm not totally out there on my own. My 87 year old mother in law got one a few months ago for the fall sensing/notifications. She lives alone, and that's a huge piece of peace of mind for me and my wife.


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## ibglowin

I slipped on the ice about a month or so ago putting out the trash on the side of the house. Didn't hurt myself but it was enough of a jolt that it activated the fall protection and asked me if I was OK or in need of help. I think I had 30 seconds to respond/cancel or it was going to call 911!



Boatboy24 said:


> I like my Apple Watch for all of those reasons. And though I haven't been running much in the last several months, it was great to have on runs. Hoping to get back to it soon. Also liked that if I ever fall on an early morning run, I'm not totally out there on my own. My 87 year old mother in law got one a few months ago for the fall sensing/notifications. She lives alone, and that's a huge piece of peace of mind for me and my wife.


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## Boatboy24

ibglowin said:


> I slipped on the ice about a month or so ago putting out the trash on the side of the house. Didn't hurt myself but it was enough of a jolt that it activated the fall protection and asked me if I was OK or in need of help. I think I had 30 seconds to respond/cancel or it was going to call 911!



I have 13 and 11 year old boys. We end up wrestling frequently.  My watch has asked me on more than one occasion if I'm OK.


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## VillaVino

Will retire in 2 years. House will be paid off. That is the only debt. Doing double payments to make this work. 38 years of stress will be enough. Been all over the world and enjoyed it all. 1600 vine vineyard will keep me occupado until I can’t get on the tractor anymore. Will always wear a watch. Retirement job will hopefully be working in a local winery for dirt cheap and responsible for nobody but my familia.


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## Rocky

Great thread here!

I retired from my professional career at age 57 (I will be 79 in May), moved to the Columbus, Ohio area and worked in a few "after retirement" jobs to make some additional cash and until SS would kick in for me. Tried the "great elephant graveyard of all professions," Real Estate, for about 5 years and then really hung up my spurs. I have had mixed emotions about retiring at 57 and, on balance, I would count it a mistake. I had a nice job in Corporate Purchasing and could have worked there a few more years, assuming I did not get "tagged" by the essentially annual "right-sizings" that occurred. But, hey, a card laid is a card played.

I had worked at _something_ every year since I was 11 when I had a paper route. I enjoyed the independence it gave me in doing and buying whatever I wanted without having to "grovel" before my parents. (I am overstating here, but you get the idea.) I always had some type of job at least part of the year (golf caddy, nursery worker, delivering beer, delivering groceries, construction, etc.) and I enjoyed working. My bride was the same and began working when she was 14 in a pharmacy at the soda fountain. She eventually became a pharmacist and worked at that profession until she was almost 70, because she loved that profession so much.

Lastly, I would like to point out that virtually every company that I worked for in my professional career either failed or was significantly reduced _after_ I left its employ. (Westinghouse, Digital Equipment Corporation, NCR, Kodak) Not drawing any conclusions, just sayin'...


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## sour_grapes

ibglowin said:


> Retired at 60 (pension, 401K, Roth) and have never looked back. Don't miss it at all (except for the cooler talk maybe). 2020 sucked as we were stuck at home (like everyone else) but now that things are looking better in 2021 we can't wait to travel again. Doesn't suck to live in a place with 350 days of sunshine, blue skies and zero humidity either!



Hey Mike, just a few years to go until you don't have to pay state income tax!  

https://www.freetaxusa.com/help/dis...s and credits available for low income filers


> *Do I qualify to deduct income if I'm 100 years old or older?*
> The income of a person 100 years old or older is exempt from New Mexico income tax if both of the following apply to that person:
> 
> 
> 
> They cannot be claimed as a dependent by someone else.
> They must be 100 years or older at the end of the tax year for which they claim the exemption.


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## ibglowin

So for all you folks retiring or thinking about retiring in a few years. Will you stay put or relocate? Is your home state "retirement friendly"?

New Mexico is not terribly retirement friendly. They have a state income tax but its fairly low in comparison to other states. They also tax all forms of retirement income including SSI (except for very low income persons) Of course all pension payments, IRA, 401K distributions are taxed.

We have thought of moving a little further West to AZ to be closer to our grandkids out in CA but have not decided either way to make that jump. No state tax in AZ but it seems the state will get there $$$ one way or another. Those states that have no income tax seem to have much much higher property taxes compared to what we pay. 

Seems to me its a wash for the most part.

We really love where we live now and have lots of friends we have made over the years who retired and stayed here.

What are people thinking of doing?


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## Robert R

I'm not moving again, except to the crematorium, and if I can convince my wife to plant me under the muscadines, not even to the crematorium.


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## sour_grapes

We have struggled with this. I have been literally/figuratively, _all over the map_ on this! 

We don't have family tying us to WI, and I would like to avoid spending all winter in WI once I am done working. We therefore have thought about moving to many other warmer places, but nothing quite feels right and/or is affordable. Also, I won't go into details, but it will be much cheaper to get our healthcare in WI than elsewhere. Enough cheaper to offset state income taxes, even though WI has a fairly high income tax. 

Sooo, for the short-term at least, we are roughly planning on doing some snow-birding. Haven't worked out any detailed plans yet. I would say that our plan is to sample some possible new locations by snow-birding, and look to possibly move only after identifying the right place later. (I have threatened to bother Mike @Kraffty in the Verde Valley, for example!)

If you recall, the guy who started this thread up and left for Georgia on short notice!


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## ibglowin

Anyone looking to potentially move down the road at some point will appreciate this.........


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## Boatboy24

The DC area is crazy expensive, but offers a lot. Both my wife and I have lived here since the late 70's or early 80's, so it's pretty much home for us and we like it. But unless both our kids end up settling here, I just don't see us staying. Too advantageous to move. We have a lot of choices that would offer lower cost of living.


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## Rocky

We are in the process of preparing for a move to "God's Waiting Room," Florida. Our plan is to put the house on the market in early April, hope for a reasonably quick sale and be in Florida in the June-July timeframe. We know where we want to move, a small golf community in Bonita Springs, but there is nothing for sale at this time. However, properties come and go fairly regularly because of the age of the residents so we plan to rent until something is available. There are a number of things motivating us: this house is too big and the yard is too much work, the real estate taxes in this area, state income tax, the winters. We are just looking to enjoy the last few years restfully.


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## Obbnw

Robert R said:


> I'm not moving again, except to the crematorium, and if I can convince my wife to plant me under the muscadines, not even to the crematorium.


 Ditto, except I want to be in the Malbecs. 

I've spent the last 25 years transforming my house to exactly what I want - well not there yet, you know "continuous improvement" - but seriously hardly anything in the house or yard matches what is was when we moved in., and I'm not just talking paint color. 

Plus I am really looking forward to being 80 with 25 yo vines looking glorious. You know trophy vines


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## VillaVino

Rocky said:


> Great thread here!
> 
> I retired from my professional career at age 57 (I will be 79 in May), moved to the Columbus, Ohio area and worked in a few "after retirement" jobs to make some additional cash and until SS would kick in for me. Tried the "great elephant graveyard of all professions," Real Estate, for about 5 years and then really hung up my spurs. I have had mixed emotions about retiring at 57 and, on balance, I would count it a mistake. I had a nice job in Corporate Purchasing and could have worked there a few more years, assuming I did not get "tagged" by the essentially annual "right-sizings" that occurred. But, hey, a card laid is a card played.
> 
> I had worked at _something_ every year since I was 11 when I had a paper route. I enjoyed the independence it gave me in doing and buying whatever I wanted without having to "grovel" before my parents. (I am overstating here, but you get the idea.) I always had some type of job at least part of the year (golf caddy, nursery worker, delivering beer, delivering groceries, construction, etc.) and I enjoyed working. My bride was the same and began working when she was 14 in a pharmacy at the soda fountain. She eventually became a pharmacist and worked at that profession until she was almost 70, because she loved that profession so much.
> 
> Lastly, I would like to point out that virtually every company that I worked for in my professional career either failed or was significantly reduced _after_ I left its employ. (Westinghouse, Digital Equipment Corporation, NCR, Kodak) Not drawing any conclusions, just sayin'...


Rocky, 
We had some similar jobs. I started working in a nursery hoeing acres of rows of trees and shrubs, (where I got the experience for my vineyard ) learned how to landscape, worked in grocery stores stocking shelves, mopping the whole thing and checkout, then when old enough, worked at a local brewery on the bottling line and delivered cases of beer to northern Wisconsin and the Milwaukee areas. Joined the Air Force, flew combat aircraft, retired after 20 years and picked up a job in a National window making company. We supply the windows for Marvin Pella Anderson and more. I’m on final for retirement. As for staying put or moving, it will be hard to leave the vineyard. I’ll make a go of it as long as I can. Automating as much as possible will keep me around longer. Snow birding will probably be in the future. As much as I like the SW states, it will be Texas or LA. We’ll see.


----------



## glennwing

I retired from my job as a mechanic in an iron mine did 30 years and left at 48. My wife and I did a second career for 15 years. Foster care for teen girls for 15 years. Retired from that in 2016. Second career a lot more rewarding than first also didn’t miss the grind of going to the mine and working on heavy equipment day after day. 
got started on winemaking after tasting my niece’s bottle of angry orchard on a cruise. Thought it was ok and looked into making it. We have countless abandoned apple trees around us. They are not good for eating but make decent cider. After a while I drifted into wine using whatever I can pick in my area. Make apple, rhubarb, blueberry, blackberry, plum, and chokecherry wines. Have made some kits but mostly make wine from fruit that I can get for free. 
this year I am trading some wine for 6 gallons of maple sap. It will be concentrated to about 1.080 SG and part of the deal is I will spend the day helping to boil it down. See what kind of wine that makes.


----------



## joeswine

I petty my much mirror Rock, in my life travels,we must have been born under the same moon. ha.
What I have descovered is driving in my van. On the same highways and by ways I finally took the time to really notice road signs . It was like a bulb turned on all around me.
Remember that old saying take time to smell the Rose's. That's what happen to me.


----------



## RickD

balatonwine said:


> For example, get a dog. And religiously walk them each morning and evening (or even at 2:00 AM if they have to "go"). That will help "slow you down", emotionally and psychologically if you approach such walks as a healthy action for your dog (and for you).



Heck get TWO dogs!


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## Old Corker

We bought what we hope to be our retirement home two years ago. Barn is built, horses are settled in, goat herd is started, bought a small tractor to help with the chores. A five year plan to get it all paid off so we can slow life down. We've not taken a straight line to where we are but we're here now.


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## JohnT

New Jersey hates retirees.

Crushing property taxes and a state income tax that defies fixed incomes.

In the process of moving to North Georgia.


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## FTC Wines

How did I have time to work? Retired at 60 ( self employed) now 74 and never looked back. You can always use a few more bucks, but you always don’t get more time! Roy


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## joeswine

The property taxes here in NJ are hard to bare at times it seems they hate old people.
The question I have for you johnt is how or did you move all the wine you've made ?
Doctors are another subject.


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## FTC Wines

joeswine said:


> The property taxes here in NJ are hard to bare at times it seems they hate old people.
> The question I have for you johnt is how or did you move all the wine you've made ?
> Doctors are another subject.


Not John, but I moved 800 +- bottles of wine to Florida 8 yrs ago. Including 10 full carboys. Carboys were in Milk crates stuffed stuff around them so as not to rattle. Bottled wine was in 18 gallon totes. No issues at all. I was nervous about Ag inspection stations etc, but all was moved in a Grand Cherokee with a trap over them, mostly to keep the sun off them. I drove the U Haul thru the stations, she drove the Cherokee around them. Good luck with the move, it’s not hard. Roy


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## BMarNJ

My father said of retirement “Every night is Friday night and there are no Monday mornings”! That convinced me to retire at 57 and do a PT consulting gig for 5 years. Now fully retired and I am never bored. Too many books, too many places to walk or hike, too many places I need to see, too many foods I need to cook, a few more wines I need to make.


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## bstnh1

I moved about 20 cases 5 years ago about 20 miles in an SUV. That was simple enough. But I had to store them in the garage for a couple of weeks and temps went well into the 90s. I thought for sure that would ruin all of it. But, it didn't seem to have any effect at all. In fact I still have a few bottles left that were in that move and they're still perfectly good.


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## joeswine

How about interstates?


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## JohnT

joeswine said:


> The property taxes here in NJ are hard to bare at times it seems they hate old people.
> The question I have for you johnt is how or did you move all the wine you've made ?
> Doctors are another subject.


I haven't. That's why I am "in the process".

The hard bit was moving all of my winery equipment.

@FTC Wines .. did you simply stack them in the totes on their sides? Did they rattle while on the road?


----------



## FTC Wines

John, I l


JohnT said:


> I haven't. That's why I am "in the process".
> 
> The hard bit was moving all of my winery equipment.
> 
> @FTC Wines .. did you simply stack them in the totes on their sides? Did they rattle while on the road?


We laid them on their sides. With a piece of cardboard, towel etc between the layers In the totes We had no rattling issues. Had to keep the whole lot of them in a climate controlled storage unit for 4 months. A suggestion, some of our carboys were still in active fermentation so I used packaging tape to hold the air locks in place. We also taped the solid bungs down, no spills wanted in the Cherokee! Roy


----------



## wood1954

I’m not moving anywhere. The cold weather really only impacts us once or twice where it’s too cold to go for walks. Otherwise the weather is very conducive to outdoor activities . Wisconsin real estate taxes are high but income taxes are low. The people of Wisconsin are great and we have great fish fries on Fridays.


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## sour_grapes

wood1954 said:


> I’m not moving anywhere. The cold weather really only impacts us once or twice where it’s too cold to go for walks. Otherwise the weather is very conducive to outdoor activities . Wisconsin real estate taxes are high but income taxes are low. The people of Wisconsin are great and we have great fish fries on Fridays.



I largely agree with you. However, two possible differences of opinion coming:

-I don't mind how cold it gets here. I do mind how LONG it gets cold!  
-I don't think Wisconsin income taxes are low. I would actually pay less in state income taxes if I lived in California than here. (Their top marginal rates are very high, but their taxation is quite progressive.) Obviously, it depends on your income, but I think WI state income tax is about the 15th highest.


----------



## hounddawg

sour_grapes said:


> I largely agree with you. However, two possible differences of opinion coming:
> 
> -I don't mind how cold it gets here. I do mind how LONG it gets cold!
> -I don't think Wisconsin income taxes are low. I would actually pay less in state income taxes if I lived in California than here. (Their top marginal rates are very high, but their taxation is quite progressive.) Obviously, it depends on your income, but I think WI state income tax is about the 15th highest.


what do you expect from the land of 10,000 post holes  
Dawg,,, lol


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## Hokapsig

ok guys, I'm coming up on 59 and a half. Kids are out of the house, the house and all debts are paid off. When the market crashed in March last year, we emptied out the winery fund and sunk it into the market. I'm ready to just retire and do the winery, which will make us more money than me working full time at a job that i don't want to do anymore. The Yadkin Valley, NC or western MD is looking good. Should i pull the trigger in May (when i am 59 and a half and can access the 401Ks, SEPs and IRAs without penalty)? Or sell the house, downsize and get more property and relocate the winery there?


----------



## sour_grapes

Well, if you relocated to MD, at least you wouldn't have to rename all of your wines, like you would if you moved to NC!


----------



## wood1954

sour_grapes said:


> I largely agree with you. However, two possible differences of opinion coming:
> 
> -I don't mind how cold it gets here. I do mind how LONG it gets cold!
> -I don't think Wisconsin income taxes are low. I would actually pay less in state income taxes if I lived in California than here. (Their top marginal rates are very high, but their taxation is quite progressive.) Obviously, it depends on your income, but I think WI state income tax is about the 15th highest.


I agree six months of cold weather stinks


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## hounddawg

wood1954 said:


> I agree six months of cold weather stinks


yup yawl get real cold for a real long time, but such beautiful country,,,,
Dawg


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## Rice_Guy

The heating/cooling bill in Houston was about the same as it is in wisconsin, lots of indoor folks there. , , , not to mention the occasional copper head.


wood1954 said:


> I agree six months of cold weather stinks


----------



## Obbnw

wood1954 said:


> I’m not moving anywhere. The cold weather really only impacts us once or twice where it’s too cold to go for walks. Otherwise the weather is very conducive to outdoor activities . Wisconsin real estate taxes are high but income taxes are low. The people of Wisconsin are great and we have great fish fries on Fridays.


My wife grew up on a farm in Door County - she still reminisces about the fish fries.

Utah is great - we get cold in the winter and hot in the summer, "best" of both worlds. Yesterday I even got to shovel 10" of snow!


----------



## sour_grapes

Obbnw said:


> My wife grew up on a farm in Door County - she still reminisces about the fish fries.
> 
> Utah is great - we get cold in the winter and hot in the summer, "best" of both worlds. Yesterday I even got to shovel 10" of snow!



If she is from Door County, she may even fondly remember fish boils in addition to fish fries!


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## ArizonaWiner

Hokapsig said:


> ok guys, I'm coming up on 59 and a half. Kids are out of the house, the house and all debts are paid off. When the market crashed in March last year, we emptied out the winery fund and sunk it into the market. I'm ready to just retire and do the winery, which will make us more money than me working full time at a job that i don't want to do anymore. The Yadkin Valley, NC or western MD is looking good. Should i pull the trigger in May (when i am 59 and a half and can access the 401Ks, SEPs and IRAs without penalty)? Or sell the house, downsize and get more property and relocate the winery there?


As a person that retired three years ago, I highly recommend pulling the plug and following your dreams as soon as your finances allow.


----------



## heatherd

Rocky said:


> Great thread here!
> 
> I retired from my professional career at age 57 (I will be 79 in May), moved to the Columbus, Ohio area and worked in a few "after retirement" jobs to make some additional cash and until SS would kick in for me. Tried the "great elephant graveyard of all professions," Real Estate, for about 5 years and then really hung up my spurs. I have had mixed emotions about retiring at 57 and, on balance, I would count it a mistake. I had a nice job in Corporate Purchasing and could have worked there a few more years, assuming I did not get "tagged" by the essentially annual "right-sizings" that occurred. But, hey, a card laid is a card played.
> 
> I had worked at _something_ every year since I was 11 when I had a paper route. I enjoyed the independence it gave me in doing and buying whatever I wanted without having to "grovel" before my parents. (I am overstating here, but you get the idea.) I always had some type of job at least part of the year (golf caddy, nursery worker, delivering beer, delivering groceries, construction, etc.) and I enjoyed working. My bride was the same and began working when she was 14 in a pharmacy at the soda fountain. She eventually became a pharmacist and worked at that profession until she was almost 70, because she loved that profession so much.
> 
> Lastly, I would like to point out that virtually every company that I worked for in my professional career either failed or was significantly reduced _after_ I left its employ. (Westinghouse, Digital Equipment Corporation, NCR, Kodak) Not drawing any conclusions, just sayin'...


@Rocky As a Columbus-born girl who has lived in Cincy, Texas, and now in Maryland I can say that "a card laid is a card played" is both good advice and a very Ohio saying used in playing euchre. Nice to hear it here.


----------



## Obbnw

sour_grapes said:


> If she is from Door County, she may even fondly remember fish boils in addition to fish fries!


She said "Fish fries are for Perch, fish boils are for Whitefish. Fish boils pale in comparison, literally and figuratively...." The discussion did continue and now I know more about it than I need to know.

Her brother just retired, he is near Stevens Point, he is packing up and moving to......


Door County : )


----------



## jswordy

Hokapsig said:


> ok guys, I'm coming up on 59 and a half. Kids are out of the house, the house and all debts are paid off. When the market crashed in March last year, we emptied out the winery fund and sunk it into the market. I'm ready to just retire and do the winery, which will make us more money than me working full time at a job that i don't want to do anymore. The Yadkin Valley, NC or western MD is looking good. Should i pull the trigger in May (when i am 59 and a half and can access the 401Ks, SEPs and IRAs without penalty)? Or sell the house, downsize and get more property and relocate the winery there?



-- Wait to retire until you can access your money without penalty. If at all possible, do not touch your Social Security money until age 70 unless you are pretty sure you will die sooner than that. You gain 8% for every year of eligibility that you defer past your SS retirement age. Likewise, budget so that you do not take SS early. You can lose a chunk that way.

-- Prepare your finances to mitigate downside risk. 60% stocks/40% fixed income is an oft-recommended ratio to buffer market turns in retirement. Presently, many retirees are overextended in stocks. Be sure to rebalance each year to maintain your ratio.

-- Check if a ~ 4% withdrawal rate will fund your retirement budget needs derived from investments..

-- If you move, be sure you budget for the impact withdrawing the expenses of your move will have on your future investment earnings. If it were me, I would stay put, since you are free and clear on that property so it would be less risky in a retirement scenario. Could you stay put yet market your wines at events being held in areas where you really like to be?

-- If you decide to move after you retire, experts recommend that you try to rent a place for a month or so and live in the location to which you wish to move. Many retirees have moved only to find they gave up a paid-off property in a place that was acceptable to live in a place that's not as nice as they thought it would be. I have a number of neighbors who moved to Florida, hated it, and then moved to Tennessee, for example. That can be hard on finances.

-- If you move away from family, take into account the effect that severing those close connections might have as you age. When scouting new locations, look for places that will support the future you - close and good healthcare, a network of support, etc.

-- One of the hardest parts of early retirement is the chunk it will cost you to fund health insurance until you are Medicare eligible. (That is what keeps me going to work, the $12,500 a year it would cost my wife and I to do that in Tennessee.) Many use an Affordable Care Act enrollment to bridge the gap. If you plan to use ACA, note that if you move to North Carolina, that state has not expanded Medicaid (and neither has Tennessee). So, your insurance expense may be higher in North Carolina than Maryland, which has traditionally expanded Medicaid. Where you move matters to your insurance costs, and health insurance will be your #1 non-housing expense in your gap years.


----------



## jackl

I ramped down to 48 hours a month at 65 and retired completely last October. I have so many hobbies and items on my to do list that I wonder how I ever got things done when I worked. Plus we now have 3 grandchildren under 3 that we love to spend time with.

Between my house with 5 acres that include a small vineyard, apple orchard and garden, our summer home on the St. Lawrence River, helping to remodel my children’s houses and traveling we are always on the go. 

I‘m trying to hone my grape growing and wine making skills so I’m spending more time enjoying the forum discussions!


----------



## wood1954

jackl said:


> I ramped down to 48 hours a month at 65 and retired completely last October. I have so many hobbies and items on my to do list that I wonder how I ever got things done when I worked. Plus we now have 3 grandchildren under 3 that we love to spend time with.
> 
> Between my house with 5 acres that include a small vineyard, apple orchard and garden, our summer home on the St. Lawrence River, helping to remodel my children’s houses and traveling we are always on the go.
> 
> I‘m trying to hone my grape growing and wine making skills so I’m spending more time enjoying the forum discussions!


Amazing how busy we can be when retired


----------



## winemanden

All this about retiring. Don't worry about it, life is too short, a lot of people never make it that far. As it says in the Bible 'make provision for tomorrow and live for today'. Every day is different, enjoy them while you can. Sometimes when you've retired you wish you were back at work. Crazy, but that's life.


----------



## Riledup5

winemanden said:


> make provision for tomorrow and live for today


Love this!


----------



## Rice_Guy

_VERY WELL SAID _


jswordy said:


> -- Wait to retire until you can access your money without penalty. If at all possible, do not touch your Social Security money until age 70 unless you are pretty sure you will die sooner than that. You gain 8% for every year of eligibility that you defer past your SS retirement age. Likewise, budget so that you do not take SS early. You can lose a chunk that way.
> 
> -- Prepare your finances to mitigate downside risk. 60% stocks/40% fixed income is an oft-recommended ratio to buffer market turns in retirement. Presently, many retirees are overextended in stocks. Be sure to rebalance each year to maintain your ratio.
> 
> -- Check if a ~ 4% withdrawal rate will fund your retirement budget needs derived from investments..
> 
> -- If you move, be sure you budget for the impact withdrawing the expenses of your move will have on your future investment earnings. If it were me, I would stay put, since you are free and clear on that property so it would be less risky in a retirement scenario. Could you stay put yet market your wines at events being held in areas where you really like to be?
> 
> -- If you decide to move after you retire, experts recommend that you try to rent a place for a month or so and live in the location to which you wish to move. Many retirees have moved only to find they gave up a paid-off property in a place that was acceptable to live in a place that's not as nice as they thought it would be. I have a number of neighbors who moved to Florida, hated it, and then moved to Tennessee, for example. That can be hard on finances.
> 
> -- If you move away from family, take into account the effect that severing those close connections might have as you age. When scouting new locations, look for places that will support the future you - close and good healthcare, a network of support, etc.
> 
> -- One of the hardest parts of early retirement is the chunk it will cost you to fund health insurance until you are Medicare eligible. (That is what keeps me going to work, the $12,500 a year it would cost my wife and I to do that in Tennessee.) Many use an Affordable Care Act enrollment to bridge the gap. If you plan to use ACA, note that if you move to North Carolina, that state has not expanded Medicaid (and neither has Tennessee). So, your insurance expense may be higher in North Carolina than Maryland, which has traditionally expanded Medicaid. Where you move matters to your insurance costs, and health insurance will be your #1 non-housing expense in your gap years.





winemanden said:


> Don't worry about it, life is too short, . . As it says in the Bible 'make provision for tomorrow and live for today'. . . . enjoy them while you can. Sometimes when you've retired you wish you were back at work.


_AGAIN WELL SAID, to winemanden I would add ,,,, if it is worth doing it is worth doing today! . . . . being part of the acid reflux generation I’m having ice cream with breakfast. _


----------



## ibglowin

I am curious as to what people are paying as far as State taxes % wise? We live in NM and have a State income tax (no personal property tax). Between the State income tax and property tax the combined total is ~5% of our gross income.

How do others compare? I am curious if you don't pay any State income tax are your property taxes making up for a State income tax? This is what seems to be happening in TX. They boast all day and night about no State income tax but their property taxes have skyrocketed over the last 10 years or so.

My conclusion is the State government gets their $$$ one way or another.


----------



## jswordy

Rice_Guy said:


> _VERY WELL SAID
> 
> 
> AGAIN WELL SAID, to winemanden I would add ,,,, if it is worth doing it is worth doing today! . . . . being part of the acid reflux generation I’m having ice cream with breakfast. _



My post is the result of 20+ years of reading personal finance magazines and 30+ years investing. IMO, far too many Americans are living for today, never stopping to think that they could easily live 25 or 30 years after they retire, and WTH are they gonna live on? 

I'm working now because of the high price of gap health insurance, the fact that I pick up another pension plus subsidized health insurance coverage in addition to Medicare if I last another 18 months, and the fact that my salary covers current expenses plus adding to investments, so my investments can grow (which is good to know on market days like today has been so far). 

Thankfully, I started investing in 1990 so I am not working because I cannot do without the paycheck. For the past 10 years, it has been really great to know my boss can fire me tomorrow and I'm fine for life. Achieving that feeling of financial independence was why I started investing in the first place. 

It's good to enjoy the acorns today as they fall from the tree. But be sure to save and invest a few for winter. It'll come.


----------



## BMarNJ

I think you can find inexpensive places to live in any state. I’m in NJ and pay pretty high real estate taxes, but in the rural lower part of the state, homes are less expensive. Gas is cheap (and we don’t have self service), there’s no sales tax on food or clothing and things are generally less expensive here than in north Jersey. Yet I am close to the beach, Philadelphia, good hospitals, entertainment and of course Gino Pintos wine supplies.
At our retirement income level, state income taxes are not that bad.


----------



## jswordy

ibglowin said:


> I am curious as to what people are paying as far as State taxes % wise? We live in NM and have a State income tax (no personal property tax). Between the State income tax and property tax the combined total is ~5% of our gross income.
> 
> How do others compare? I am curious if you don't pay any State income tax are your property taxes making up for a State income tax? This is what seems to be happening in TX. They boast all day and night about no State income tax but their property taxes have skyrocketed over the last 10 years or so.
> 
> My conclusion is the State government gets their $$$ one way or another.



There is no state income tax in Tennessee. I pay 4.15% income tax to Alabama because I work there. Yet as a practical matter, though, I have retail investment losses and other business losses that offset federal and state taxes. Sales taxes in both states are high. TN combined sales tax (state and local) averages 9.5%, highest in the US, and it is one of just a few states that taxes groceries. Alabama's sales tax is a tick lower at 9%, and the state taxes groceries. County property taxes in both states are very low. My farm property tax in TN is $700 a year.

Part of Texas's property tax rise is due to the property values rising so fast. They are rising fast here, too, but I live in a very rural county and commute to a city to work.


----------



## sour_grapes

ibglowin said:


> I am curious as to what people are paying as far as State taxes % wise? We live in NM and have a State income tax (no personal property tax). Between the State income tax and property tax the combined total is ~5% of our gross income.
> 
> How do others compare? I am curious if you don't pay any State income tax are your property taxes making up for a State income tax? This is what seems to be happening in TX. They boast all day and night about no State income tax but their property taxes have skyrocketed over the last 10 years or so.
> 
> My conclusion is the State government gets their $$$ one way or another.



I agree with your essential point. There are a few exceptions, where states have "exogenous" sources of income (AK, FL...), but the rest have to get their money somewhere. And you neglected to mention sales taxes, which tend to be high for no-income-tax states.

My state taxes are ~5.5% of gross income (and that is close to true across the income spectrum, as our brackets are not very progressive). But I don't think we can make easy comparisons here regarding property taxes. There is a state component, but it will be dominated by local taxes.


----------



## Kraffty

I agree the money has and will come from somewhere somehow. AZ tends to be lower in income, property and gas taxes but makes up for it in sales taxes. Generally around 10% once you combine state and county taxes. You can always shop around different counties or states for large purchases but not the others.


----------



## Boatboy24

ibglowin said:


> My conclusion is the State government gets their $$$ one way or another.



Virginia has sales tax, income tax AND (county) property tax. They certainly get their $$.


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## bstnh1

Getting old may not be a bowl of cherries. But the alternative is soooo much worse!!!


----------



## Robert R

ibglowin said:


> I am curious as to what people are paying as far as State taxes % wise? We live in NM and have a State income tax (no personal property tax). Between the State income tax and property tax the combined total is ~5% of our gross income.
> 
> How do others compare? I am curious if you don't pay any State income tax are your property taxes making up for a State income tax? This is what seems to be happening in TX. They boast all day and night about no State income tax but their property taxes have skyrocketed over the last 10 years or so.
> 
> My conclusion is the State government gets their $$$ one way or another.


Oklahoma has income tax, sales tax (state rate is 4.5%, county and localities can bump the rate to 10% or more, and property taxes.


----------



## glennwing

I retired with a pension and took my social security at 62. I constantly see advice to not take it early but when I ran the numbers it didn’t make sense. I calculated the amount I collected from 62 until full SS at 65+ and how much a month I would get if I waited. The break even point for me was almost 80. I would much rather have the money in my 60s than more after 80. 
this calculation did not take in to account the current vs future value of money which, if included, would probably move the break even point a couple years higher. 
my pension and SS cover my living costs and we have not had to touch our IRAs at all in the 5 years since turning 62.


----------



## wood1954

glennwing said:


> I retired with a pension and took my social security at 62. I constantly see advice to not take it early but when I ran the numbers it didn’t make sense. I calculated the amount I collected from 62 until full SS at 65+ and how much a month I would get if I waited. The break even point for me was almost 80. I would much rather have the money in my 60s than more after 80.
> this calculation did not take in to account the current vs future value of money which, if included, would probably move the break even point a couple years higher.
> my pension and SS cover my living costs and we have not had to touch our IRAs at all in the 5 years since turning 62.


I agree, I did the same thing, I’d rather have cash when I’m young enough to enjoy it.


----------



## CDrew

Social Security is actuarially going to pay the same life time benefits regardless of when you start receiving it. You start receiving it late, you get it fewer years. It's not like you beat the system either way. It's a bit more complicated than that but not much. My take on it, assuming you have other income, is to start getting it at 62 and invest all of it. Then by say 70 or 75 when you really need it, you have 10 years of invested SSI and compound interest.

Plus, I think you can argue that the current madness of the feds giving away cash like there's no tomorrow will likely accelerate the time when the system becomes insolvent. So the earlier you get it the better.

I'm not 62 yet, so have not gone through the process, but looking at the numbers, that's how it looks to me.


----------



## sour_grapes

To my mind, the point of delaying SS is that it is the cheapest longevity insurance you can buy. If you die young, then, yeah, you would have been better off claiming early, but who cares? You are dead! But if you live a long time, you may really need those dollars late in life.

Also, the calculus changes for a couple. In most scenarios, it is optimal for the higher earner to wait to 70, and the lower earner to file earlier. You can play with the calculations on this nice site: Open Social Security: Free, Open-Source Social Security Calculator . You can specify different actuarial tables, which could be more or less appropriate depending on your personal circumstances (i.e., health). Also, you can enable some advanced options by ticking a checkbox in the first line.


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## ibglowin

We (Mrs IB and myself) attended multiple retirement seminars hosted by the Lab before retiring. They always had a speaker from SSA at some point and they discussed the pros and cons and all permutations. Too bad they took away the old "file and suspend" trick that was really the only way to game the system a bit but back to topic.

I plan to wait it out to full benefits. Mrs IB will file early. Right now we are living quite comfortably on just pension funds. No need to touch any 401K and IRA for the foreseeable future. 




sour_grapes said:


> To my mind, the point of delaying SS is that it is the cheapest longevity insurance you can buy. If you die young, then, yeah, you would have been better off claiming early, but who cares? You are dead! But if you live a long time, you may really need those dollars late in life.
> 
> Also, the calculus changes for a couple. In most scenarios, it is optimal for the higher earner to wait to 70, and the lower earner to file earlier. You can play with the calculations on this nice site: Open Social Security: Free, Open-Source Social Security Calculator . You can specify different actuarial tables, which could be more or less appropriate depending on your personal circumstances (i.e., health). Also, you can enable some advanced options by ticking a checkbox in the first line.


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## Rice_Guy

There is another calculation,, many of us in the states have three pots, 1) SSI which is sometimes taxed and sometimes only part, 2) always taxed income as the compound interest CDrew gets, and 3) sheltered IRA/ 401K which is only taxed when we collect it.


CDrew said:


> Social Security is actuarially going to pay the same life time benefits regardless of when you start receiving it. You start receiving it late, you get it fewer years. It's not like you beat the system either way. It's a bit more complicated than that but not much. My take on it, assuming you have other income, is to start getting it at 62 and invest all of it. Then by say 70 or 75 when you really need it, you have 10 years of invested SSI and compound interest.
> 
> Plus, I think you can argue that the current madness of the feds giving away cash like there's no tomorrow will likely accelerate the time when the system becomes insolvent. So the earlier you get it the better.
> 
> I'm not 62 yet, so have not gone through the process, but looking at the numbers, that's how it looks to me.


You are smart to have done estimates of several scenarios and I agree debt will change the current tax assumptions. ,,, however in theory the SSI trust fund sits out there all buy itself and WILL be paid back.


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## sour_grapes

Here is another consideration: If one delays SS, that gives one a window of relatively lower income, during which he or she can do any desired Roth conversions of pre-tax dollars in a lower tax bracket. (This likely makes sense only if your post-SS income will put you into a higher tax bracket.)


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## Rice_Guy

sour_grapes said:


> Here is another consideration: If one delays SS, that gives one a window of relatively lower income, during which he or she can do any desired Roth conversions of pre-tax dollars in a lower tax bracket. (This likely makes sense only if your post-SS income will put you into a higher tax bracket.)


Wis does not tax SS, ,, fed varies but plan on 85% taxable.


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## sour_grapes

Rice_Guy said:


> Wis does not tax SS, ,, fed varies but plan on 85% taxable.



I think you missed my point. Prior to drawing SS, one could use up more of the "headroom" in one's Federal tax brackets by executing conversions of tIRA/401k monies to a Roth IRA. Using those funds later, i.e., after drawing SS, would not kick you up further in the tax brackets. Judicious Roth conversions of tIRA/401k funds before drawing SS could keep your later distributions from tIRA/401k accounts (including RMDs) in a lower bracket.

My comment had little to do with taxability of SS itself.


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## bstnh1

I suspect that $50,000 (or any extra amount) is of more benefit to you in your 60s and 70s than it would be when you're 92. My mother lived to 95. At that age, she did not run around and spend money like she did 20 years earlier.


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## glennwing

I retired and took my pension at 48. My wife and I had a second career that was close to our hearts. Foster care. For 14 years we were a therapeutic treatment home for teen girls. Not a job for the faint of heart. There are some tax advantages to foster care. The daily reimbursement is not reportable income and our daily rate was higher than normal because the girls were considered high risk. Also if the child is with you more than 6 months you can claim them as a dependent. We usually had 4-6 girls in the house and claiming them as dependents allowed us to convert our 401k’s into Roth IRAs and still get a refund each year. We converted them over a period of 5 years.


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## BirdieErnie

I thought you might find this interesting. I believe where you live is more about the quality of life than the taxes. The clearer the state the higher the tax rates.


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## jswordy

Boatboy24 said:


> Virginia has sales tax, income tax AND (county) property tax. They certainly get their $$.



I loved living in Williamsburg, and sometimes wish we had never moved. I sometimes get in discussions with folks here about that and they say, "Well, Virginia is a very high tax state." To which I reply, "Virginia is also a very high median income state." I think people who focus just on the tax side of things miss out on the true equation. Yes, taxes are lower in TN or AL, but the median income is also lower.

Interestingly, because Huntsville, AL (nearby me) has a large federal presence, it is well-known among Virginians working for the federal government. They often retire here, where their house sale in Virginia can fund a similar size or bigger house with a BIG chunk of change left over. That's the best of both worlds – earn the big bucks there, then move here where it is cheap to live for retirement. It's one reason this area is exploding with growth.

We moved here in 1990. The sale of our 1,100 SF Williamsburg house on a quarter-acre lot funded the purchase of the small farm we live on here.


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## Boatboy24

jswordy said:


> I loved living in Williamsburg, and sometimes wish we had never moved. I sometimes get in discussions with folks here about that and they say, "Well, Virginia is a very high tax state." To which I reply, "Virginia is also a very high median income state." I think people who focus just on the tax side of things miss out on the true equation. Yes, taxes are lower in TN or AL, but the median income is also lower.
> 
> Interestingly, because Huntsville, AL (nearby me) has a large federal presence, it is well-known among Virginians working for the federal government. They often retire here, where their house sale in Virginia can fund a similar size or bigger house with a BIG chunk of change left over. That's the best of both worlds – earn the big bucks there, then move here where it is cheap to live for retirement. It's one reason this area is exploding with growth.
> 
> We moved here in 1990. The sale of our 1,100 SF Williamsburg house on a quarter-acre lot funded the purchase of the small farm we live on here.



I've worked with more than a few people over the years who retired in/near Huntsville and paid cash for their new homes with the proceeds from their Metro DC homes.


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## VinesnBines

Boatboy24 said:


> Virginia has sales tax, income tax AND (county) property tax. They certainly get their $$.



Each county in Virginia sets the property tax rates. On our County real estate is taxed at 63 cents per $100 however since we have a land use tax rate on the farm land and vineyard we pay 6.3 cents per $100. Our farm is 19.12 acres and the annual property tax is $47.88.

Location, location, location.


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## ibglowin

How you feeling about that aborted move to FL now? Especially in light that Ian basically hit Naples/Bonita Springs dead on.......



Rocky said:


> We are in the process of preparing for a move to "God's Waiting Room," Florida. Our plan is to put the house on the market in early April, hope for a reasonably quick sale and be in Florida in the June-July timeframe. We know where we want to move, a small golf community in Bonita Springs, but there is nothing for sale at this time. However, properties come and go fairly regularly because of the age of the residents so we plan to rent until something is available. There are a number of things motivating us: this house is too big and the yard is too much work, the real estate taxes in this area, state income tax, the winters. We are just looking to enjoy the last few years restfully.


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## Rocky

ibglowin said:


> How you feeling about that aborted move to FL now? Especially in light that Ian basically hit Naples/Bonita Springs dead on.......


Mike, every day we say to each other, "I love it here in boring old Ohio!" Very few things happen out of the ordinary and at our ages, we like it that way. We dodged a bullet for sure.


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## bstnh1

Rocky said:


> Mike, every day we say to each other, "I love it here in boring old Ohio!" Very few things happen out of the ordinary and at our ages, we like it that way. We dodged a bullet for sure.


I only went to Florida once - years ago for a work-related meeting. About 6 am I walked out onto the balcony of my second floor room. I stood there in my pants and undershirt thinking what a great morning - it was sunny and a very pleasant 68 degrees. I looked down at the sidewalk and people were walking by with heavy coats and gloves on!!


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## Rocky

bstnh1 said:


> I only went to Florida once - years ago for a work-related meeting. About 6 am I walked out onto the balcony of my second floor room. I stood there in my pants and undershirt thinking what a great morning - it was sunny and a very pleasant 68 degrees. I looked down at the sidewalk and people were walking by with heavy coats and gloves on!!
> View attachment 93488


I know just what you mean, Brian. We occasionally go to Bonita Springs from just after Christmas to the end of February. The place we stay is in a gated golf course community and it has lots of safe walkways. I used to walk every morning and I had a 4- and a 5-mile course mapped out. I would wear shorts and a tee shirt and be walking past "eskimos" in parkas, gloves, hats, sweats. They would look at me like I was from Mars and the temperature was a very comfortable 65-70 degrees. I guess it is all what one is used to doing and what temperature tolerance one has.


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## winemaker81

bstnh1 said:


> I only went to Florida once - years ago for a work-related meeting. About 6 am I walked out onto the balcony of my second floor room. I stood there in my pants and undershirt thinking what a great morning - it was sunny and a very pleasant 68 degrees. I looked down at the sidewalk and people were walking by with heavy coats and gloves on!!


When I lived in Rome NY, we had a co-worker who was from GA. We nicknamed him "Snowman", as his tolerance to cold was not good. He would wear a parka when temps dropped below 50 F. Another coworker would go outside in just a shirt at 0 F to smoke ...

I've lived in central NC for 30 years, and while my blood has thinned out, I'm still cold tolerance. In what passes for winter here, I'll go out wearing shorts and a t-shirt, while others are wearing long pants and jackets. OTOH, summers still get me, but I got really good at sweating!


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## joeswine

And so the World Turns


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## jswordy

winemaker81 said:


> When I lived in Rome NY, we had a co-worker who was from GA. We nicknamed him "Snowman", as his tolerance to cold was not good. He would wear a parka when temps dropped below 50 F. Another coworker would go outside in just a shirt at 0 F to smoke ...
> 
> I've lived in central NC for 30 years, and while my blood has thinned out, I'm still cold tolerance. In what passes for winter here, I'll go out wearing shorts and a t-shirt, while others are wearing long pants and jackets. OTOH, summers still get me, but I got really good at sweating!



Same here in south TN/north AL. People will be walking past me on the sidewalk here grumbling about the cold with heavy coats and gloves on, I am in a long-sleeved dress shirt, going, "What? It's 60 degrees!"

But when I go back to northern Illinois in January, I am like, "Oh my GAWD, even my LUNGS are frozen!"


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## winemaker81

jswordy said:


> But when I go back to northern Illinois in January, I am like, "Oh my GAWD, even my LUNGS are frozen!"


I went to college in Potsdam NY. Growing up in the foothills of the Adirondack Mountains of NY, I thought I knew what cold was, until I got to Potsdam. It was the wind -- there was a constant, biting wind. Walking between campuses, I wore my father's 1950's police coat (wool, ankle length, buttoned up to the ears) and a heavy hat.

When walking into the wind, I kept my nose and mouth inside the jacket, breathing not-frozen air, as the wind-whipped air burned. I haven't thought of this is years. Thanks!


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## jswordy

winemaker81 said:


> I went to college in Potsdam NY. Growing up in the foothills of the Adirondack Mountains of NY, I thought I knew what cold was, until I got to Potsdam. It was the wind -- there was a constant, biting wind. Walking between campuses, I wore my father's 1950's police coat (wool, ankle length, buttoned up to the ears) and a heavy hat.
> 
> When walking into the wind, I kept my nose and mouth inside the jacket, breathing not-frozen air, as the wind-whipped air burned. I haven't thought of this is years. Thanks!



Our last year in north-central Illinois, there was 4 feet of snow on the ground, and we were sitting in our little living room in the house we rented. The thermometer read -40 and the wind chill was -90, and my wife looked at me and said, "We ain't staying here another year!" By March, she had found a job in Newport News, Va., and we were on our way in a loaded U-Haul.

That day, I got out to walk to a convenience store for smokes (I smoked back then). I had on two pairs of jeans, a sweatshirt, a sweater, a jacket and a heavy Army coat. The wind cut right through it all. I could feel the cold. It was so strange, walking downtown and no one was out at ALL. The hardware store sign was creaking in the wind. When I got back my face was frozen. There were about 2 cars and 1 wrecker running in the lil town of 5,000 where we were. Oil was just congealed, and the starters wouldn't turn them over fast enough to catch without a big boost. The only ones running were lucky enough to be in heated garages. I had an engine heater on both of ours, and neither one would turn fast enough to start.

The wind is constant in central Illinois, that's why they have so many windmill farms there.

Even though temps now are a lot warmer there than they were back then, I don't miss the winter, nor do I miss the blizzard drives for 25 miles to nearby towns we had to make to do our work. 50-degree Tennessee Christmases suit me just fine!


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## joeswine

jswordy said:


> Our last year in north-central Illinois, there was 4 feet of snow on the ground, and we were sitting in our little living room in the house we rented. The thermometer read -40 and the wind chill was -90, and my wife looked at me and said, "We ain't staying here another year!" By March, she had found a job in Newport News, Va., and we were on our way in a loaded U-Haul.
> 
> That day, I got out to walk to a convenience store for smokes (I smoked back then). I had on two pairs of jeans, a sweatshirt, a sweater, a jacket and a heavy Army coat. The wind cut right through it all. I could feel the cold. It was so strange, walking downtown and no one was out at ALL. The hardware store sign was creaking in the wind. When I got back my face was frozen. There were about 2 cars and 1 wrecker running in the lil town of 5,000 where we were. Oil was just congealed, and the starters wouldn't turn them over fast enough to catch without a big boost. The only ones running were lucky enough to be in heated garages. I had an engine heater on both of ours, and neither one would turn fast enough to start.
> 
> The wind is constant in central Illinois, that's why they have so many windmill farms there.
> 
> Even though temps now are a lot warmer there than they were back then, I don't miss the winter, nor do I miss the blizzard drives for 25 miles to nearby towns we had to make to do our work. 50-degree Tennessee Christmases suit me just fine!


Amen


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## joeswine

WillM said:


> I retired a little over a year ago. After 47 years, last 25 in a fast pace, moderate to high pressure environment. Within one week of retiring, my wife said, "you seem so different"! I've never looked back! I've learned to slow down and enjoy the moment. The hardest lesson learned was that I wasn't in a rush anymore. I could take my time, I didn't have to multitask if I didn't want to! Life is good!


Yes the timing changes and if your smart enough to notice it , your retired


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## joeswine

For you who are retired , while driving your vehicle to and from work you never took notice of what the road billboards actually read , once your retirement sets in you start to notice things that were always there as the really are , timing changes and you finally see around you .


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## jswordy

joeswine said:


> For you who are retired , while driving your vehicle to and from work you never took notice of what the road billboards actually read , once your retirement sets in you start to notice things that were always there as the really are , timing changes and you finally see around you .



Now counting the weeks to that easier pace. There remains the outside possibility of a big work promotion, very highly unlikely, that would keep me around another 3 years. Otherwise, I have exactly 48 days. Either way, I win.


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## sour_grapes

I certainly wouldn't be sitting in Bordeaux, sipping a glass of Haut-Medoc at 4 pm, if I were still working!


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## crushday

sour_grapes said:


> I certainly wouldn't be sitting in Bordeaux, sipping a glass of Haut-Medox at 4 pm, if I were still working!


Today, Paul, nothing makes more happy. Congratulations!


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## Shurt1073

I retired just before my 55th birthday after 33 yrs as a Sergeant on the police department. Its been over 4 yrs of retirement now and retirement is the best job I've ever had! I would not go back for all the money in the world. The first couple of retired years I was still on point and very vigilant but life has slowed down. I'm learning how to relax and be more easy going ..... I really enjoy making wine and we didn't start drinking wine until 2016 so we opt for the sweet or semi sweet wines still. I do like the dryer reds if I can get past the first glass. lol. Congrats to all who have put in their time and retired!


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## jswordy

Shurt1073 said:


> I retired just before my 55th birthday after 33 yrs as a Sergeant on the police department. Its been over 4 yrs of retirement now and retirement is the best job I've ever had! I would not go back for all the money in the world. The first couple of retired years I was still on point and very vigilant but life has slowed down. I'm learning how to relax and be more easy going ..... I really enjoy making wine and we didn't start drinking wine until 2016 so we opt for the sweet or semi sweet wines still. I do like the dryer reds if I can get past the first glass. lol. Congrats to all who have put in their time and retired!


 My Dad retired at 50. 
I said, "Dad, why do you want to retire so young?" 
He said, "Son, when you finally figure out how it all REALLY works, you realize you'd rather be doing something else."  
It took me an additional 30 years or so before I understood what he was telling me! 

Enjoy your retirement.


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## sour_grapes

crushday said:


> Today, Paul, nothing makes more happy. Congratulations!



Vous etes tres gentil!


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## Boatboy24

sour_grapes said:


> Vous etes tres gentil!



And your trees are very gentle as well!


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## Rotundifolia

My husband and I moved around for work every so often. We made friends and then moved away. We bought a retirement home during the last housing crisis and then work remotely from there before it became popular with covid. We retired the year before covid. During covid we realized how precious local friends were. We have made friends with people who have lived here thier entire lives and have many more friends. Very rich lives. We are fortunate to have landed in a place with good people, but for those of you are looking to move for retirement, keep in mind all of the people you are leaving behind. Is it worth the lower cost of housing? Perhaps so. Just saying people make a life rich and retirement is about living a rich life (not monetary).


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## FlamingoEmporium

I did my time. Upstate NY by @winemaker81. Foothills of the Adirondacks. School in Syracuse NY. Very snowy. Drive 40 minutes to work every morning. Worst part is when it was -26° and you sit on your car seat to start the car hopefully and the seat was hard as a rock. Foam rubber didn’t do well in cold.
shovel driveway (later could afford snowblower) so I could get out of driveway, come home from work and do the driveway again so I could get in the garage.

moved to Cape Coral Florida 12 years ago and never regretted it. Even after Irma in 2017 and now Ian which actually passed over our house with 140 mph wind.
and now this week the weather is finally turning to beautiful low 80’s and low humidity and window weather at night for sleeping. And the new roof is going on right now, the trees are putting out new leaves and flowers and I would not want to be anywhere else. Bonita is right down the road. A few trailers (manufactured housing for snowbirds) got scraped off the pad but still going strong. Two weeks ago at 3:30 am as I was out getting ready to start the generator I looked up at the stars, it was wonderful, no lights anywhere, beautiful.


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## jswordy

Rotundifolia said:


> My husband and I moved around for work every so often. We made friends and then moved away. We bought a retirement home during the last housing crisis and then work remotely from there before it became popular with covid. We retired the year before covid. During covid we realized how precious local friends were. We have made friends with people who have lived here thier entire lives and have many more friends. Very rich lives. We are fortunate to have landed in a place with good people, but for those of you are looking to move for retirement, keep in mind all of the people you are leaving behind. Is it worth the lower cost of housing? Perhaps so. Just saying people make a life rich and retirement is about living a rich life (not monetary).



You hit on the key when moving. Always check out whether the place you are moving to is friendly to you or not before you move. Ask me how I know, lol... It is amazing how moving just 50 miles can change everything.


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## cmullin

I retired about 3 years ago from the University of California in Los Angeles. Every vacation from the past 15 years my wife and I would see if this was a place we wanted to retire and could afford. We looked all over California(especially the central coast) , Arizona, New Mexico and southern Oregon. Most we didn't like (Santa Fe NM was great , but really dry and cold) Then we did a vacation in the Willamette Valley, just loved it. I was somewhat familiar with Oregon, went to grad school here 25 years ago. My wife had never been here. It was great, we moved here. Now we have a hobby farm near Corvallis. Gardening, fermenting(both foods and drinks), and rockhounding plus other things. Setting up a place for wine and cider, and planting more fruit and grapes. Its been hard to meet friends locally because of covid, but we are managing. We don't miss work or LA at all. If you can retire you should, as soon as possible. At least for us worked just sucked, and the commute sucked too.


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## ibglowin

cmullin said:


> I retired about 3 years ago from the University of California in Los Angeles. Every vacation from the past 15 years my wife and I would see if this was a place we wanted to retire and could afford. We looked all over California(especially the central coast) , Arizona, New Mexico and southern Oregon. Most we didn't like (Santa Fe NM was great , but really dry and cold) Then we did a vacation in the Willamette Valley, just loved it. I was somewhat familiar with Oregon, went to grad school here 25 years ago. My wife had never been here. It was great, we moved here. Now we have a hobby farm near Corvallis. Gardening, fermenting(both foods and drinks), and rockhounding plus other things. Setting up a place for wine and cider, and planting more fruit and grapes. Its been hard to meet friends locally because of covid, but we are managing. We don't miss work or LA at all. If you can retire you should, as soon as possible. At least for us worked just sucked, and the commute sucked too.


UC Pensions are the best!


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## cmullin

Anymore I 


ibglowin said:


> UC Pensions are the best!


Anymore it feels like they are the only pensions.


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## jswordy

@ibglowin and @cmullin: Gotta remember, any U.S. citizen who can claim the word "pension" is a rare bird in the USA these days, I don't care what the pension benefit is. The percentage of workers in the private sector whose only retirement account is a defined benefit pension plan is now 4%, down from 60% in the early 1980s. Overall, 15% of American private sector workers have pensions. Meanwhile in Canada, for women, the 2021 pension coverage rate rose 3.3 percentage points to 43.3%, while for men it increased 2.0 percentage points to 36.5%.

My wife and I are fortunate to have 4 pensions of varying sizes between us, plus a lifetime worth of gains from investment portfolios – and still, she is full of angst that when I retire, we will not have enough money. Sigh...

Which brings me to a question: *For those on Medicare who are on prescriptions, too, how the heck are you handling these high Part D drug prices and deductibles? *I have been shocked about that.

I'm thinking I'll just buy the cheapest Part D plan and then not use it, buying my drugs instead directly from Mark Cuban's Cost Plus Drug Company. *What do you do?*


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## wood1954

With soc security and our pension my wife and I make half of what we did when we were working and some in our 401k and we seem to have more free cash now. Medicare advantage plans pick up a lot of costs for my wife’s drugs. For some really expensive drugs there are orgs that give grants to cover the cost. Her weekly injections cost around $8k and the insurance paid for it. Her cancer pill that cost around $21000 a month was also covered by a grant and insurance. The so called donut hole is around $4600 or so. Her cancer treatment has cost close a million so far and our out of pocket cost is less than $10k. Get a good advantage plan and you should be fine. Get any large expenses out of the way before retirement and you’ll be fine.


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## ibglowin

You must have come in the Winter or early Spring. We live very close to Santa fe and visit our daughter, SIL and grandkids (Burbank) very often now that we are retired. When we go to socal I can't believe how HUMID it seems compared to home. It is pretty nice in the Winter (socal) I have to admit compared to living in the southern tip of the Rockies at 7000ft EL. But the sunshine 350 days plus combined EL make the Winters very tolerable. As we age and our blood thins we will probably be spending more time out there in the Winter (best of both worlds).



cmullin said:


> Most we didn't like (Santa Fe NM was great , but really dry and cold)


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## jswordy

wood1954 said:


> With soc security and our pension my wife and I make half of what we did when we were working and some in our 401k and we seem to have more free cash now. Medicare advantage plans pick up a lot of costs for my wife’s drugs. For some really expensive drugs there are orgs that give grants to cover the cost. Her weekly injections cost around $8k and the insurance paid for it. Her cancer pill that cost around $21000 a month was also covered by a grant and insurance. The so called donut hole is around $4600 or so. Her cancer treatment has cost close a million so far and our out of pocket cost is less than $10k. Get a good advantage plan and you should be fine. Get any large expenses out of the way before retirement and you’ll be fine.



After over a year of research about Medigap vs. Medicare Advantage, we are going Medigap. I'll be Plan G. My wife qualifies for F, which is a better deal than I can get. I would rather pay a higher monthly rate than a large deductible expense plus copays for a serious illness that is assuredly in my future as I age, and Medicare Advantage folks often try to change to Medigap after they get seriously ill at advanced age – only to find that they can't. The Part D drug part of it is the only part that I am still messing with.


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## jswordy

It's pretty interesting when I check my maintenance drugs on Mark Cuban's Cost Plus Drugs and see how much I can save by just buying them outright there instead of going through the copay/deductible route. I think that's the direction I will be going, with a cheap Part D just in case I do happen to need some super-expensive drug in the future, but buying my daily meds from CPD. I shared the addy with a cardiologist friend, who was amazed and is recommending it to patients. Others may want to check it out, too, so here ya go. Knowledge is power.





__





Homepage of Mark Cuban Cost Plus Drugs


Mark Cuban Cost Plus Drug homepage. Provides safe, affordable medicine or medication with transparent low prices.




costplusdrugs.com


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## jswordy

For anyone peeking in here who is approaching retirement, one of the first things you'll find with your Medicare is that it is very difficult to be advised by anyone impartial who does NOT have "skin in the game." Anybody who will make money off your decision is not the best advisor. I have even heard stories of people who had their friends advise them to get into plans not to their best interest simply in order to collect a commission.

Fortunately, there is help! A federally-administered program called the State Health Insurance Assistance Program (SHIP) is staffed by well-trained volunteers who are backed by computer programs designed to help you find the best fit, least-cost options for you. We ran all our Medicare plans past a SHIP advisor in our town, and we learned three things that we did not know, even after studying up on it for over a year in our planning.

To find out more about SHIP in your state, start here: Home


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## winemanden

Since I retired I worry about whether I worry too much


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## jswordy

winemanden said:


> Since I retired I worry about whether I worry too much



That's a nice problem to have!


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## sour_grapes

That is great, thanks. I did not know such a thing existed. (Although I have a number of years left to figure it out!  )


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## jswordy

sour_grapes said:


> That is great, thanks. I did not know such a thing existed. (Although I have a number of years left to figure it out!  )



You're welcome. They are a cadre of volunteers vs. well-funded insurance corporations, which is why more people don't know about them. Believe me, once you get close to age 65, you will be INUNDATED with Medicare pitches. SHIP is a valuable free resource.


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