# Cold box wine storage project



## NorCal

I' have a design, bought the initial supply of 2x4's and getting ready to frame it out. It is being designed as a cold box / work table / tasting table. It will house 2 barrels, 1 30 gallon flex tank and as many carboys and bottles as possible. I will be using a coolbot and window AC. I'll post progress and appreciate feedback as I proceed.


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## Kraffty

Sounds like a good project, looking forward to seeing how it goes.
Mike


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## Thig

NorCal said:


> I' have a design, bought the initial supply of 2x4's and getting ready to frame it out. It is being designed as a cold box / work table / tasting table. It will house 2 barrels, 1 30 gallon flex tank and as many carboys and bottles as possible. I will be using a coolbot and window AC. I'll post progress and appreciate feedback as I proceed.



Amazing, I just read about the Coolbot today and searched to see if anyone here had used one and I see this post. Might be the solution to my problem, I just want to cool my basement (which is now at 68 degrees) about 10 more degrees.

Do you have any experience with the Coolbot?


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## NorCal

Thig, I don't have any experience. It came with a garage full of stuff that I bought. The guy I bought it from used it for the same purpose. I'll let you know when I come to that point. I am buying own of the window AC units that they recommend, so I'm assuming it will work pretty easily.


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## NorCal

Basic frame coming together.


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## Rocky

NorCal, very interesting project. I just spent some time on line learning about the Coolbot unit and some of the designs that people have completed. From your pictures, it seems that you are constructing a "reach in" rather than a "walk in" cool room, correct? I saw some video and some time lapse photographs on-line. It would seem a very tidy solution for cooling a portion of my basement for a "wine cellar" that could be kept at or near 55 degrees F. I will be very interested in your progress. From what I have seen on-line, people are generally very pleased with the system.

Good luck.


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## Kraffty

How are you insulating the box, I would think thicker walls might help hold the cool.
Mike


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## mikewatkins727

*Cool box*

Yup, you're gonna need that cooler in Loomis, I should know; lived there for 35 years (on Craig Street).


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## NorCal

The cold box will have two three foot wide, seven foot tall doors that swing wide open, allowing full access. It will be fully sealed and be completely insulated with the insulation foam board with an R value of 13 and all the edges taped off. A little progress today.






Wood and screw cost so far $140

AC unit planned $120. http://www.walmart.com/ip/Haier-Mini-5-000-BTU-Mechanical-Window-Air-Conditioner-HWF05XCL-L/17477197

Insulation planned: $170. http://t.homedepot.com/p/Thermashea...Rigid-Foam-Insulation-Board-613010/100573703/

With the doors, hinges, peg board, some trim work to make it look nice, I may have another $200 in it, totaling $650 ( plus cost of coolbot that came with equipment I bought).


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## Rocky

looking good. Do you plan to put a floor in it? At the least, I would recommend tying the two side together at the bottom front to "complete the cube" and give you more structural integrity. Also, Is R-13 what is recommended or did you pick that number? Neat project and should be a real asset to your wine making.


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## Runningwolf

As far as a floor goes you could lay a 2-3" piece of foam cut to size on the floor.


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## NorCal

No plans to insulate the floor as I plan on having my barrels on rollers. I also figure the floor with the cement and earth will be my best insulated side. Nothing special about the R value I chose, just the best foam board R value, for what I wanted to spend. If the AC is constantly running, I will have the space to double up on it.


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## NorCal

Ceiling and top shelf completed. I'm using some old "barn wood" for the shelves and I will also be using it for the doors.


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## mikewatkins727

My curiosity - what is the tank in the corner of the coolbox going to be used for?


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## NorCal

mikewatkins727 said:


> My curiosity - what is the tank in the corner of the coolbox going to be used for?



Mike, it is a flextank, allowing long term wine storage with the benefit of micro-oxidation. I picked it up from a local winery. It is 30 gallons, the same as the two barrels I have coming. It may sit empty this year and I'll use it to hold the wine while I'm racking it. Or I'll use it to rotate wine in/out of the new barrels to control the oaking.


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## tshank

That is looking like a really neat and well thought out cold box, where are you going to mount the a/c? I've been wanting to build something like this to eliminate all the refrigerators I have.


Sent from my iPad using Wine Making


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## NorCal

tshank, the AC will be mounted up high on the left hand side of the box. The cascading of the shelving should allow good airflow to all levels.


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## NorCal

I calked the seams, added th rear insullation, installed the lower shelf and stained the outside. I got started on door number one.


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## NorCal

Finished the outside of the doors. Unfortunately, they weigh a lot. I'm starting yon think that I may need to add a wheel at the end of each of the doors to support the weight. My little operation will be named K & K Winery, thus the two Ks. I used some rustic cedar that I had left over. I do a lot better working with metal than wood. I'm going to make some large Ks out of metal to double as door handles.


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## 4score

What a fabulous addition to your wine hobby. Well done! Can't wait to see it completely finished and stocked!


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## francois_du_nord

Awesome work, and thanks for the tip on CoolBot. I'm doing some looking myself, wondering if I can use it in a new wine cellar I'm contemplating. 

Best, Fran


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## NorCal

Not much progress as of late. I did get three 4 inch heavy duty hinges for each door and I don't see any problems having that work just fine. I do need to figure out how to keep the door closed with a slide latch or something. I did get the K's mocked up, the name of our garage winery (Ken & Kathi) and serve as our door handle. I will fabricate the letters out of 2" steel and frame the archway in 1" steel. I went to pick up the AC unit at Wal Mart and with our heat wave, they were sold out. I ordered one on line, for store delivery in a week.


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## Extram

Be sure to insulate the edges where the foam board meets the 2x4's. Use some spray-in expanding foam (closed cell) and just trim off excess, but eliminate all gaps. Remember, a 2x4 is a terrible insulator - the problem is referred to as thermal bridging. I would prefer to see an insulated floor, off the concrete, but since the space is so small, the a/c unit will probably be sufficient to overcome some energy inefficiencies.


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## NorCal

Extram, thanks for the advice. My goal will be to have insulation join insulation where ever possible. I did calk all of the joints to avoid any direct paths to the open and very hot garage.


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## NorCal

Finally got done time to work on it. Got the bottle rack in and a rough install of the AC. I turned in on to try it out and it dropped the inside temp ten degrees in 15 minutes. Need to get the door sweeps on, insulate it, make the handles, figure out a latch and I think it will be ready to use.


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## NorCal

More work on the box. The punch list is getting small; calk the joints, door sweep and figuring out a latch.


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## 4score

Outstanding!


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## NorCal

*In use!*

An un intended benefit of the cold box is being able to reduce the temperature of fermentation. I simply have a dolly under the bin, which allowed me to roll it in. I've been running it during the day on 7/10 setting, with the fan on low. It has been keeping the ambient air at 64 degrees and must temps in the low 80's. Comparing this to a neighbor's fermentation, I think it has taken ten degrees off of the fermentation temps. I've yet to hook up the coolbot, I guess that would depend on if I wanted to drive the temps real low, like in the 40's. The Cab Franc has dropped from 26.8 to the current 15.6 in 33 hours. Seems rather quick, but this is my first fermentation on this scale.
Note that the door sweeps and the insulation around the doors are in place. Also note where I had to shave the door to eliminate the interference


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## seth8530

Great project, I temp control all of my ferments, but I am a bit of a geek if I do say so myself.


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## NorCal

I've had the box running for three weeks now. The AC without the coolbot will keep it at 65 degrees. Running it through a 100 degree day with it dialed back to 75%, it holds between 66-69 degrees. I then played with a timer, to hard shut the AC down for 45 min, the turn it on for 45 min. It also held between 66-69 degrees. I just received a programmable controller I picked up on bay for $10. I think this will be the final solution.


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## NorCal

I got a scrapped, server power supply (free) and took the insides out, leaving me a nice box and a power cord. I bought this 110v Fahrenheit controller on ebay for $10 delivered and another $6 for the power receptacle at Home Depot and I now have my Cold Storage controller. It is temperature controlled and you can chose the set point and the trigger point. I ran out of time tonight to fully test it out, but it looks like it is going to do the job nicely. With this set up, I will leave the AC on high and just turn it on and off using the controller.


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## seth8530

Impressive, will you be able to create a deadband so that the AC will not constantly cycle on and off?


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## NorCal

seth8530 said:


> Impressive, will you be able to create a deadband so that the AC will not constantly cycle on and off?



Yes. You program the target temp and then the variance you could live with. I'm going to set mine at 66 +3.


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## seth8530

Sounds nice, one thing you might want to try ( not sure if your AC unit can handle it) would be to have the temperature probe linked to the temperaure of the must you are fermenting. Thus, you could get good temperature control of the fermentation.


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## sour_grapes

I believe that control keyed to a variable that the apparatus does not _directly_ influence is one of the banes of feedback loops.


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## Runningwolf

I like the barrels. Are those 30 gallon?


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## NorCal

sour_grapes said:


> I believe that control keyed to a variable that the apparatus does not _directly_ influence is one of the banes of feedback loops.



It is a closed loop system with the AC providing the cooling, the controller sensing the temperature inside the box and turning the AC on and off based on the feedback of the temperature.

The controller is nice because it allows me to turn the AC completely off, including the fan. It allows me to control the temperature where I want, which is at the barrels. It also allows me to use a $90 AC unit and I think will do the job that I need it to do.

@Running, they are both 30 gallon barrels, one a American oak, the other a French Oak.


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## sour_grapes

Sorry, Norcal -- my comment was directed at Seth's suggestion of keying off the temperature of the must. I should have quoted him to make that clear. Your setup already sounded great to me!


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## seth8530

Ahh, I did not catch that either.


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## NorCal

Here in the Sacramento area, we have really hot summers, meaning 3-4 weeks of 95-105 degrees and there is a good chance it is during harvest time, as it was this year. Once fermentation started in earnest, I just rolled the must in the box and turned it on full blast and left it there. My ferment peaked at 90 degrees vs a neighbor's 100 degrees. Could be other factors, but I know it didn't hurt.


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## tshank

I've been following this thread for awhile and am really interested in building a similar cold box in my garage here in central Florida. Is there any reason that I can't use a ranco temp controller verses the coolbot for the ac control. My garage is usually in the 90's during the summer months. 



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## NorCal

Tshank, My intention was to use a coolbot, but I'm choosing not to. The benefit of a coolbot, is that it is a smart controller. The coolbot has a probe which heats the temperature probe of the AC, which allows you to use a low cost window AC to get the box down into the 30's.

A regular controller simply turns the AC on and off and will only get as cold as the AC will go, before freezing up.

I found the 5,000 btu AC unit would cool my box down to 65 degrees, even on a 100 degree day without the coolbot, which was good enough for me. If you wanted to obtain and maintain the 55-58 "cellar temps", I would use the coolbot. If mid to high 60's are acceptable, then you could get by without a controller at all, or if you like to really know and control the temperature, then any controller that you can turn on/off the 110v source should work fine. I'm cheap and like to tinker, so I built my $16 controller solution.


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## tshank

NorCal, thank you for the reply, I only want to use the cold box for fermentation to replace an aging chest freezer, so 65 degrees would be great. Not having to shell out cash for the coolbot is good, more cash for wine!


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## NorCal

Interesting note: I set my AC to turn on at 69.1, turn off at 64.9. I put a thermocouple in a full wine bottle to see what the temp change would be in the bottle. We had some 90 degree days, so the AC saw some cycling. After a week of monitoring, the high temp was 68.8, the low was 67.8, or 5X less fluctuation than the ambient air.


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## Kraffty

Thanks for sharing that bit of hands on test info. I just assumed the actual wine temps moved slowly and in smaller increments but not as dramatic as your numbers show.
Thanks, Mike


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## NorCal

To close this project out, the final thing I had to do is to figure out how to keep the doors closed. What I found was that if I could keep the left side door closed tight against the seal, the right door diets nice and snug by itself. Here is my solution, with parts found in the garage.


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## syncnite

Very nice. I'm considering a similar solution. Do you manage humidity?


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## NorCal

I monitor the humidity and put an open container in there for a while, but I can't say that it did much of anything. I plan on drinking or giving away the wine within a few years, so I think the uncontrolled humidity and my 60's degree storage profile will work for me.


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## NorCal

Here in the Sacramento area, the summers are brutal, the fall wonderful, the winters mild and the spring my favorite time. I've left the system on, but it hasn't cycled for a month. It will be interesting to see how cold it gets in the winter months and when the Box starts cycling again. It could be that the AC only runs a few months out of the year.


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## NorCal

Putting my thoughts together for the upcoming season. I have family and friends that want to go in on a barrel, enough interest to warrant a 60 gallon barrel. I borrowed a 60 gallon from a neighbor to test the fit with my two 30g barrels and 30g flextank, and looks like it will fit fine, without doing an "addition".


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## NorCal

I had some concern about the AC unit freezing up when it was stressed. There is a device you can buy "cool-bot" that prevents this, but my unit ran like a champ as it is, even when the garage temps hit 104 degrees.


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## NorCal

The editor for winemaker magazine saw my project and asked if I would write an article, which I did. It was published today in the Oct/Nov issue. There are a lot more details and data in the article than is here on this thread.


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## barbiek

Congratulations that's awesome!


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## sour_grapes

That is great, NorCal!  I am impressed.


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## vacuumpumpman

Great Job NorCal !!

We have a national celebrity on winemakingtalk !!

Looking forward to reading it


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## Boatboy24

Congrats! I guess I put my thread in the wrong place. 

http://www.winemakingtalk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=51157


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## bchilders

Great job NorCal and congratulations on the article. Can't wait to ready it.


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## Kraffty

Always nice to get a little recognition for a well thought out and executed project!
Congrats!
Mike


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## Steve_M

NorCal congratulations. Now maybe I can convince SWMBO if you let me just have this much space....

Steve


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## Busabill

That is a really great thought out and executed project! Well done! I have been making wine in our spare room (to my wife's dismay) and have been concerned about moving operations to the garage because of our hot Norcal summer. Love this!!


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## NorCal

Just a follow-up. Box is still doing its job. 99 degrees in the garage 66 degrees in the box.


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## NorCal

Probably worth revisiting once per year. This is season #4 on the wine box. It was 103 degrees in the garage and 65 degrees in the box. Still working like a champ. No changes since I first made it, besides adding a handle made from left over metal and a horseshoe.


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## Smok1

NorCal said:


> Probably worth revisiting once per year. This is season #4 on the wine box. It was 103 degrees in the garage and 65 degrees in the box. Still working like a champ. No changes since I first made it, besides adding a handle made from left over metal and a horseshoe.



Thats an awesome job on the cold box, inspiring me to try and build one. Whats that black threaded pipe in the back? Propane heater?


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## Smok1

Im curious about this.


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## Smok1

This picture, temp probe with some sort of piped in gas light?


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## AZMDTed

Norcal,

Thanks again for this thread as it's what gave me the ideas for the room I built last June. Like yours, mine is humming along like a champ. So simple and relatively inexpensive, but efficient and perfect for the task. Well done.


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## NorCal

@Smok1, it's me simply entertaining myself building stuff. Black pipe and parts out of the scrap bin at work, the gauges are working, and accurate thermometers and the Edison lights are functional.


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## Smok1

Very cool.


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## we5inelgr

Great project indeed NorCal.

I'm in the planning stages for something similar.

What are the dimensions of your cold box?


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## NorCal

80 x 49 x 84 inches high


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## NorCal

I'm so disappointed in photo-bucket for discontinuing their policy for linking pictures. I wish I had the time to to back and reload all the pictures in this thread, as I know more than a few have built their own box, with the help of this thread. 
We are having one heck of a hot summer. The garage temp is reaching 105 degrees, the little wine box is plugging away and is keeping my temps between 65-69 degrees.


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## Boatboy24

Is there an available link to the WineMaker Mag article? Not at detailed, but it might be helpful.


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## Ajmassa

Boatboy24 said:


> Is there an available link to the WineMaker Mag article? Not at detailed, but it might be helpful.




I tried looking for that article before as well. Was not able to pull it up. I pay for a subscription too. But I would have needed to actually purchase that specific back issue to view it. That goes for both hard copy and online.


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## NorCal

In fairness to Winemaker Magazine, I am not displaying the entire article, only the how-to parts, which is what most people that have contacted me from the forum wanted to know more about.


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## NorCal

It’s that time again, where the temperatures reach 100 degrees in the Sierra Foothills and the health of my wine is relying on my wine box, now on its 5th season. That $75 WalMart AC unit and the $10 eBay controller continues to deliver.


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## ibglowin

Can you fit inside there to cool off? LOL


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## balatonwine

NorCal said:


> That $75 WalMart AC unit and the $10 eBay controller continues to deliver.



Sounds like a far, far better investment than paying thousands to dig a wine cellar.  Kudos!


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## kevinlfifer

I got out the saws and nailers last week. I'm not building anything wine oriented but rather a roof over the grill area where I cook the food that requires wine consumption. There used to be 4 umbrellas covering that space. All of which bit the dust with one gust of wind. (plus 4 more in an other area of the deck). As you can see there is plenty of shade. The roof is to keep crap out of the food and drink. I got all the lumber except the posts for free from a deck demolition.The steel roof and lights go up this week.


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## Bprinc

Have you ever noticed an increase in your electric bill since building?


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## NorCal

Bprinc said:


> Have you ever noticed an increase in your electric bill since building?



Yes. I actually measured the power consumption. It runs 6 months out of the year and total cost for the year is under $100, so $15-$20 per month for the months that it is working.

Ken


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## kevinlfifer

Finished


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## M38A1

What a lovely project. Thanks for taking us along for the build.


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## NorCal

Hard to believe this summer marks 5 years since I made the wine box. It is operating unchanged and the Wal Mart AC is still doing its job like a champ. We had our first hot spell, so I went to take the annual picture.


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## ibglowin

Is there any room for you to crawl in there when it gets hot?


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## mainshipfred

ibglowin said:


> Is there any room for you to crawl in there when it gets hot?



There is a small private gym in the unit next to mine with no AC. One of the trainers comes in periodically and says he wants to see how the wine is coming along but I swear it's an excuse to step into the cooler.


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## NorCal

ibglowin said:


> Is there any room for you to crawl in there when it gets hot?



Not enough room to crawl, but there is standing room that is used frequently in the summer months.


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## mainshipfred

NorCal said:


> Hard to believe this summer marks 5 years since I made the wine box. It is operating unchanged and the Wal Mart AC is still doing its job like a champ. We had our first hot spell, so I went to take the annual picture.
> View attachment 54910



I hate to even bring this up but have you ever thought about a spare for just in case. I may just be paranoid having an old spare unit I keep on hand. It's smaller than the one I use but in a pinch it should work fine and I don't have quite the heat you are trying to control. I have 15 wines aging plus about 8 topping up jugs. If the temps would rise I think I would have a mess on my hands and I'm not sure what the bottles would do.


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## NorCal

mainshipfred said:


> I hate to even bring this up but have you ever thought about a spare for just in case. I may just be paranoid having an old spare unit I keep on hand. It's smaller than the one I use but in a pinch it should work fine and I don't have quite the heat you are trying to control. I have 15 wines aging plus about 8 topping up jugs. If the temps would rise I think I would have a mess on my hands and I'm not sure what the bottles would do.


Great point. I check the box every evening in the summer . If I did without AC for one day, I don't think the wine would get too warm (I guess on those very rare vacations, I'd be rolling the dice). A replacement AC is as close as my nearest Wal Mart and I have a number to choose from. I think my best solution would be to have two AC's on my box, so that one was there as a back-up at all times. With my controller, I am hard power cycling the AC, so I know it cannot be good for it. It stays off long enough in between cycles for the high pressure line to equalize, but still I think it would be naive to think there wasn't some risk there.


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## NorCal

Well, the original Wal Mart AC died. It froze up, I then defrosted to give another try and the same thing happened. I'm not willing to risk 500-600 bottles worth of wine that I have in the box, with the weather outlook, to see if I can get it to work, so it got sent to the recycler. Fortunately Wal Mart is opened 24 hours a day and a late night run solved my AC needs.

I got 5 seasons out of the original AC unit and it has seen some pretty hard duty. I think my hard on off power cycling may have shortened its life considerably, so I may rethink my approach. However, if I spread the cost of the AC unit over the number of bottles made in the box over that same time, it comes to less than a $.05 per bottle.


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## mainshipfred

NorCal said:


> Well, the original Wal Mart AC died. It froze up, I then defrosted to give another try and the same thing happened. I'm not willing to risk 500-600 bottles worth of wine that I have in the box, with the weather outlook, to see if I can get it to work, so it got sent to the recycler. Fortunately Wal Mart is opened 24 hours a day and a late night run solved my AC needs.
> 
> I got 5 seasons out of the original AC unit and it has seen some pretty hard duty. I think my hard on off power cycling may have shortened its life considerably, so I may rethink my approach. However, if I spread the cost of the AC unit over the number of bottles made in the box over that same time, it comes to less than a $.05 per bottle.
> 
> View attachment 55631



I feel like I'm responsible for this simply by bringing it up, sorry!


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## ibglowin

This made me stop and think about my unit in the winery. Not using any controller other than the built in thermostat. Purchased from Sams Club back in the Spring of 2010 and still chugging along nicely. Definitely have gotten my money out of it. Smallest GE unit with full shut off thermostat when set temp is reached.


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## NorCal

mainshipfred said:


> I feel like I'm responsible for this simply by bringing it up, sorry!



You just may be responsible. On the other hand, any prediction on the market direction the rest of the year?


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## ibglowin

NorCal said:


> On the other hand, any prediction on the market direction the rest of the year?


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## mainshipfred

NorCal said:


> You just may be responsible. On the other hand, any prediction on the market direction the rest of the year?



Sorry I don't, and you may not want it anyway seeing my predictions aren't always the most positive


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## Trevor7

So, what I'm gathering is that AC units are like Hydrometers... You need a spare one "just in case"!


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## mainshipfred

Trevor7 said:


> So, what I'm gathering is that AC units are like Hydrometers... You need a spare one "just in case"!



That's my philosophy


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## Johnd

@NorCal I'd say that you definitely got your money's worth out of that unit! Most likely when units start to freeze up, they're low on refrigerant, which means you may have developed a leak somewhere. Getting it located and fixed (unless you're equipped to do it yourself) probably costs more than the new unit. Inexpensive as they are, definitely a consumable.........


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## JoP

Hi all,
The CoolBot is a great innovation, but too expensive ($350).
If cost is not an issue, go for it, but here is a much cheaper solution you may want to consider:
Since most AC unit temperature sensors are thermistors you can simply change the value and fool the controller so that the temperature range is shifted downwards.
I did this for a portable room AC unit I'm currently using in my wine cellar.
The thermister is a 10K and I connected a 100K resister in parallel.
This trick brought down the minimum temperature setting from 62F to around 53F, 
This works for me.


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## Boatboy24

ibglowin said:


> This made me stop and think about my unit in the winery. Not using any controller other than the built in thermostat. Purchased from Sams Club back in the Spring of 2010 and still chugging along nicely. Definitely have gotten my money out of it. Smallest GE unit with full shut off thermostat when set temp is reached.
> 
> View attachment 55632
> View attachment 55633



So, Mike: 65 is the lowest setting on your AC unit? I'd be happy with that. And considering my basement is probably 67-70 year-round with our climate control running, an AC unit like that wouldn't have to run too hard with some halfway decent insulation.


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## ibglowin

Yea I added 12" attic blanket above the winery and its freezing in there in the summer time. We only have a couple months of heavy use then several months of light use then basically 6 months of no use so happy with the simplicity for sure.


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## mainshipfred

JoP said:


> Hi all,
> The CoolBot is a great innovation, but too expensive ($350).
> If cost is not an issue, go for it, but here is a much cheaper solution you may want to consider:
> Since most AC unit temperature sensors are thermistors you can simply change the value and fool the controller so that the temperature range is shifted downwards.
> I did this for a portable room AC unit I'm currently using in my wine cellar.
> The thermister is a 10K and I connected a 100K resister in parallel.
> This trick brought down the minimum temperature setting from 62F to around 53F,
> This works for me.



All I do is remove the sensor from the coil and re-position it to the outside of the unit. Pretty much does the same thing.


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## ibglowin

My GE unit pictured above stopped cooling properly a few years back. I googled the problem and cleaned the filter and sensor inside the unit. I saw that people were pulling the sensor and removing it from inside the unit and repositioning it to outside the unit and did just that. It cools the winery down another degree or two this way.


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## mainshipfred

ibglowin said:


> My GE unit pictured above stopped cooling properly a few years back. I googled the problem and cleaned the filter and sensor inside the unit. I saw that people were pulling the sensor and removing it from inside the unit and repositioning it to outside the unit and did just that. It cools the winery down another degree or two this way.



With mine I re-located it through the wall to outside of the cooler. With the Inkbird I have it set to 55. Haven't tried to get it any cooler.


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## ibglowin

Here is mine now.


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## mainshipfred

I see, so you're just letting the unit work with it's own controls. If you would get an Inkbird and put that sensor outside the room you could get it even cooler. That is if you care to.


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## ibglowin

Yes, Its cooling to 64F actual room temp now. I am pretty happy with that! My winter temps from ~October to ~April or so are ~55F in there so I am not worrying about a few months of ~64F.


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## Boatboy24

ibglowin said:


> Yea I added 12" attic blanket above the winery and its freezing in there in the summer time. We only have a couple months of heavy use then several months of light use then basically 6 months of no use so happy with the simplicity for sure.



You do anything about humidity, or just let it be what it will be?


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## NorCal

I actually had an Coolbot and sold it, because I didn’t see a need to keep the box any lower than 65 degrees.


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## ibglowin

No, assuming you mean lack of humidity where I live. Its 51% in there right now since we have monsoons going. Even when its really dry in May, June it ~30% in the winery. I have pulled many of my Lafitte 1+1 corks from as far back as 2011 and they are not brittle or crumbling at all. I have had some older commercial ($$) wines that were closed with 2" pure cork that broke when using my big stand opener. The wine was fine the cork just broke in two when it pulled it out. I use an "ah so" opener on those now (when I can remember) and that pulls them out perfectly. Much more gentle process of removal.


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## NorCal

Season 6 for the wine box and second season for this AC unit. We are having three days of 100 degrees, so nice to see the unit is doing its job.


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## JoP

mainshipfred said:


> All I do is remove the sensor from the coil and re-position it to the outside of the unit. Pretty much does the same thing.


That works too, if you don't mind that the unit runs all the time, some extra power consumption perhaps.
One limitation to consider is that when the outside temperature is lower then 62 F, the unit will not cool below that.
Mine cools down to 52 F.


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## koolmoto

NorCal said:


> Season 6 for the wine box and second season for this AC unit. We are having three days of 100 degrees, so nice to see the unit is doing its job.


This was an incredibly inspiring thread. I am going to try to build my own and will post a picture once it's done. Great job, NorCal.


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## NorCal

koolmoto said:


> This was an incredibly inspiring thread. I am going to try to build my own and will post a picture once it's done. Great job, NorCal.


Thanks @koolmoto Please do share your box. I know of a few others built as well, it would be nice to have other peoples design ideas shared as well.

One thing that I have found is the placement of thermocouple for the controller makes a huge difference. Finding a place where the unit will cycle on / off, and stay off for >5 minutes minimum to allow the high pressure side of the AC to discharge. If the thermocouple is too close to the AC unit or not shielded it will cycle on off in less than 5 min. If it is too far away and/or shielded, it will hit a cooling limit in the AC unit, where the fan will just blow all the time and never turn off.


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## mainshipfred

NorCal said:


> Thanks @koolmoto Please do share your box. I know of a few others built as well, it would be nice to have other peoples design ideas shared as well.
> 
> One thing that I have found is the placement of thermocouple for the controller makes a huge difference. Finding a place where the unit will cycle on / off, and stay off for >5 minutes minimum to allow the high pressure side of the AC to discharge. If the thermocouple is too close to the AC unit or not shielded it will cycle on off in less than 5 min. If it is too far away and/or shielded, it will hit a cooling limit in the AC unit, where the fan will just blow all the time and never turn off.



Good points, I'm not sure what you do for the controller, I believe it may be a CoolBot. I take the thermocouple outside of the cooler and use an InkBird to control it. Mine has a compressor delay setting. @koolmoto my biggest advice is whatever size you think you need, double it if you can. If nothing else make it expandable.


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## NorCal

mainshipfred said:


> Good points, I'm not sure what you do for the controller, I believe it may be a CoolBot. I take the thermocouple outside of the cooler and use an InkBird to control it. Mine has a compressor delay setting. @koolmoto my biggest advice is whatever size you think you need, double it if you can. If nothing else make it expandable.


 I had a coolbot that I got when I purchased all the equipment when I first started. Since I was good with keeping the wine in the "60's, I sold it to a local winery. I purchased a $10 controller (see post #31 on page 2) on ebay and has been working like a champ.


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## silverbullet07

@NorCal 

question about the ac in the garage. I thought all Window AC units drip water. Does it drip into the garage? I do not see a drain tube. Also how much heat does to put into the garage?


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## NorCal

The two I have bought are self evaporating, it has a pan, but I think the outgoing hot air blows over it and dries it up. It puts heat into the garage for sure, causing the AC to work harder. If you can vent to the outside, it would be much better.


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## silverbullet07

Thanks. I was wondering about that. I have a great room that is under ground and stays 68 in the summer. Two walls are concrete and the front wall leads to another room that is climate controlled. I will monitor what that room does in the winter. But it would be nice to keep it around 62.


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## NorCal

If you are going to drink your wine within 5 years, 68 degrees is fine. Mine turns on at 69, turns off at 65


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## DizzyIzzy

mainshipfred said:


> With mine I re-located it through the wall to outside of the cooler. With the Inkbird I have it set to 55. Haven't tried to get it any cooler.


What's an inkbird?...........................Dizzy


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## mainshipfred

DizzyIzzy said:


> What's an inkbird?...........................Dizzy



It's an external controller that allows the unit to cool at a lower temperature.


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## wood1954

Very cool. Ha, ,I use a 5000 btu ac in my 12x12 wine room on a timer as it doesn’t have a thermostat. Hardly uses any power and keeps the temp around 68, should work great for you.


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## NorCal

I did something I swore I would never do....expand the wine box. The size of the box was my self imposed constraint to limit the size of the hobby. The circumstances this year are that I am committed to having to store three 60 gallon barrels. There was not practical way to do this in the existing box. I added a 4 foot wide extension all the way around to give me more than enough space. We have been challenged with 100 plus degree weather all week and the AC has kept the expanded wine box in it's 65-69 degree range without struggle.

I still have to fill the cracks and foam seal on the door. I'll worry about the cosmetics after the grape season. On to the next chapter of the wine box...or perhaps now wine room : )


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## ibglowin

RESISTANCE IS FUTILE.........

You live in wine country now. Embrace it! LOL



NorCal said:


> I did something I swore I would never do....expand the wine box. The size of the box was my self imposed constraint to limit the size of the hobby. The circumstances this year are that I am committed to having to store three 60 gallon barrels. There was not practical way to do this in the existing box. I added a 4 foot wide extension all the way around to give me more than enough space. We have been challenged with 100 plus degree weather all week and the AC has kept the expanded wine box in it's 65-69 degree range without struggle.
> 
> I still have to fill the cracks and foam seal on the door. I'll worry about the cosmetics after the grape season. On to the next chapter of the wine box...or perhaps now wine room : )
> View attachment 91920
> 
> View attachment 91921


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## mainshipfred

I can just imagine the sentimental value the wine box has to you. Though I'm with Mike, your new digs should have a proper wine room.


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## NorCal

This wine box (room) is getting put to the test! As many are experiencing these record highs, my Walmart AC unit is putting in the work to keep my wine cool.


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## ibglowin

You have gotten your $$$ worth out of that unit. 

I got mine at Sam's back in June 2010 for about the same price so 12 years now. It cools the winery down to 64 in the heat of the Summer day after day. You win for high temps that's for sure!






NorCal said:


> This wine box (room) is getting put to the test! As many are experiencing these record highs, my Walmart AC unit is putting in the work to keep my wine cool.
> View attachment 92632
> 
> View attachment 92631


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## mikewatkins727

I feel for you, @NorCal. I lived in Loomis 1981 to 2005. Somehow I saw the handwriting on the wall. That and I was getting homesick. I came home November 2005, not regretting the move but leaving friends and acquaintances. My basement serves as my winery and tasting room, the weather here is totally different than Loomis.


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## NorCal

mikewatkins727 said:


> I feel for you, @NorCal. I lived in Loomis 1981 to 2005. Somehow I saw the handwriting on the wall. That and I was getting homesick. I came home November 2005, not regretting the move but leaving friends and acquaintances. My basement serves as my winery and tasting room, the weather here is totally different than Loomis.


I was just in Columbus OH a few weeks ago. Great downtown area.


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