# 50 lbs Scuppernong whats the recipe



## pwrose (Sep 14, 2011)

*50 lbs Scuppernog whats the recipe*

I have read a couple of post but there was no real recipe.
How much should I be looking at gallon wise with 50 lbs of grapes?
Should I ferment on the skin or off?
If I have no press what is the best way to press that many grapes?
What yeast should I use or should I go with the wild yeast on the grapes?

Any other suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

Oh I pick them up Friday so I have a day or so to get all the info on them so post away all the help you can afford, remember its only words so it dont cost much.


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## AUwiner (Sep 14, 2011)

Freeze the muscadines for a couple of weeks. It makes them much easier to crush after they are thawed. Go to the ECKraus website. They have basic mucadine and scuppernong recipes that have worked well for me. It only calls for 30# of fruit in a 5 gallon batch. I just crush them by hand. It takes a while but is not too difficult. You do need a bag for the skins and pulp. Also you may consider not leaving the skins in as long as the recipe states doing.


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## mxsteve625 (Sep 15, 2011)

PW

I didn't freeze my grapes. I pressed them right after harvesting.
Here are my notes from a 10 gallon batch I made. After primary I divided up into 2 - 5 gallon batches each with a different amount of backsweeting. Hence the Nobel 1 and 2. 

View attachment Muscadine-Noble Number 01.pdf


View attachment Muscadine-Noble Number 02.pdf


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## Sirs (Sep 15, 2011)

On scupps I'd freeze but you don't need to. I'd just crush if you got a small drill you can get a 5 gallon bucket paint stirrer (not a stick)or a drywall mixer either will do and just do them that way works really good. you can crush up about 4 gallon in a few minutes. I myself have always let the wild yeast go they work really good and have never stalled on me. I'd leave skins on for a day or you can go till dry slickly up to you. I've done both seems when I left on for only a day then pressed it seemed to make wine a lot lighter color and not near as much flavor. Muscadines are always full of flavor so even strained early they still got a lot. I'd put in pectic enzyme first thing and let her go either way you won't be sorry. As far as pressing them I always put mine in a 5 gallon paint strainer bag you can get them at lowes or homedepot normally 3 in a pack they work good just mash the fool out of them.


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## Sirs (Sep 15, 2011)

this is what they look like at lowes the thnig on top comes off lol at about $6 you can't beat it oh and it don't bust up the seeds and such


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## pwrose (Sep 15, 2011)

Thanks for the replys, heres a couple questions on the responses.

How many gallons should 50 lbs make?
I will probably freeze them first due to time, when should I add the PE? With fruit I normally add it after I put them in the strainer bag but before I pitch the yeast. If I am not pitching yeast and using the wild yeast when do I use the PE?
If the acid levels are too high should I just add water to bring it down?
If the SG is not at ????? should I add a simple syrup to bring it up or boil some of the must down to concentrate the sugars?

As you can tell I am not used to using grapes, I tried to make a muscadine wine last year and it is way to acidic and the starting SG only gave me about a 7% ABV. Fruits are my thing and I can make some good fruit wine, grapes however are my nightmare. So all help will be appreciated.


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## Sirs (Sep 15, 2011)

what I normally do and it gets acid about right is I add a gallon of water for every 3 gallon of must and add the PE soon as you can it don't hurt. Least get your sg up to 12 to 14 % range and if they came from a good established vineyard I'd go with wild yeast you'll not be disappointed.
If your grapes aren't real ripe they will be more acidy so you'll need to go with abit more water. with muscadines if the skins tight they're not fully ripe, they gotta feel almost mushy if you know what I mean. Either way they'll do good.


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## Sirs (Sep 15, 2011)

I tried to get you to come get some of these down here last year lol


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## AUwiner (Sep 16, 2011)

I certainly don't have the experience of many here, but why would you want to take a chance with yet another variable such as wild yeast? With a purchased product you know exactly what you are getting for a relatively insignificant cost.


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## GTS (Sep 16, 2011)

I too lack the experience of the regulars on this forum, but that never stops me from adding my 2 cents worth.
I usually use one of several commercially available yeasts, but have gone with the natural yeasts on occasion, and with good results.
I have a friend that works for one of the larger wineries here in Arkansas, and found out last year that they been using a fairly robust naturally occuring yeast to ferment their muscadine wine for several years. They found that the natural yeast was far superior to commercial yeast, and produced a more flavorful product, at least it did with regard to their red muscadine wine, not sure about the white. To me, that certainly speaks well of some natural yeasts.


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## Sirs (Sep 16, 2011)

AUwiner said:


> I certainly don't have the experience of many here, but why would you want to take a chance with yet another variable such as wild yeast? With a purchased product you know exactly what you are getting for a relatively insignificant cost.



I've always used wild yeast or as I like to call them the natural yeast for the product, it's the yeast on it naturally. Yes wine makers have used specific yeast for certain wines for years but with fruits and wild grapes they used what they thought would be best for the product they're using. Yes you do know what your getting when you buy a certain store bought yeast but even they go wrong at times otherwise you wouldn't see post of stalled fermentation and such. I've never had a wild yeast stop on the first ferment, give off awful odors, or get stressed. I've also never had to feed them nutrients or energizers. Back before I used a hydrometer
I know I've had to have started out batches where I added 10 pounds of sugar to naturally sweet juice and not even be 2 gallon, but it fermented right on anyway. I don't knock using store bought yeast like I used to but I do think when its a wild grape or fruit other than wine grapes then use of the wild yeast to me is better. That's just my opinion from making homemade wine for over 30 somewhat years.


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## Sirs (Sep 16, 2011)

hey pwrose if you mess up your wine cause of something I've told you let me know I'll get you enough grapes to make you another batch. on the muscadines only lol


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## PCharles (Sep 17, 2011)

*Scuppernong Recipe*

I will be picking up 6 gallons of scuppernongs Tusday. Sorry the procedure doesn't provide more detail. 

Scuppernong 30 lbs. 
Sugar 9 lbs. 
Yeast Nutrient 5 tsp. 
Yeast Energizer N/A 
Pectic Enzyme 3/4 tsp. 
Acid Blend N/A 
Whine Tanin 1 tsp. 
Yeast K1V-1116 

Here is my reference for the details above.
http://www.eckraus.com/wine-recipes/?gclid=COCwttO4o6sCFYEj7Aodej7Uzg


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## Julie (Sep 17, 2011)

PCharles said:


> I will be picking up 6 gallons of scuppernongs Tusday. Sorry the procedure doesn't provide more detail.
> 
> Scuppernong 30 lbs.
> Sugar 9 lbs.
> ...



PCharles, don't just add 9 lbs of sugar, add enough sugar to get the reading you are looking for, I would suggest around 1.080 - 1.090. It may be 9#s or it may be more or less. Remember always use your hydrometer thru all stages of your wine.


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## pwrose (Sep 18, 2011)

I dont have but a min. to type out something on this borrowed internet. My internet is down until tuesday evening (hopefully). I will be back to follow up on this, I picked the grapes up Friday afternoon and put them in the freezer until I could get back on here. So as Arnold would say "I'LL BE BACK"


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## mxsteve625 (Sep 18, 2011)

PW, IMO I think 50 lbs would give you a good 6.25 gallons depending on the quality of the grapes. I used 80 #'s for ten gallons.


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## pwrose (Sep 22, 2011)

Well I am finally back online.
So here is what I got so far.

1. 50 lbs should make around 6 gallons
2. might need to add some water based on acid readings
3. should not ferment on the skins after the first two days
4. the wild yeast on the grapes is not a bad choice but a wine yeast would be a better option.
5. will probably need to add sugar to get to 1.090 SG
6. should freeze them first then press
7. if I use sirs advise and it screws up he will replace the grapes with black ones. really should have gone out to western nc and pick some last year with ya. maybe next year or this year if i get a break in time.

Here is what has been done
1. frozen
2. nothing
3. plans are to start this saturday

Here is what I plan to do
1. thaw (duh)
2. crush grapes in an 18 gallon tote
3. add PE leave to sit over night
4. take a SG reading and acid reading and add sugar and water if needed to get to 1.090 SG and a correct acid reading. (what would be a good acid reading on scuppernog wine)
5. add yeast nutrient
6. add tannins on the half scale (me and tanins dont get along)
7. give until day three (monday afternoon) to see a start of fermentation, if it doesn't start then I will add a wine yeast. This still might happen at the start not real sure yet.
8. shooting for 6+ gallons and will be using 2x 3 gallon carboys.

If you see something I should do different let me know.


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## PCharles (Sep 23, 2011)

*Scuppernong*

I picked up 6 gallons of scupernong grapes Monday. The six gallons crushed down to 3.5 gallons. I added about a gallon of water and sugar to bring SG to 1.093. Yeast was added Tuesday AM and strong fermentation was noted on Wednesday eve. SG this AM is 1.057. The yeast I used is 71B-1122.


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## pwrose (Sep 24, 2011)

Started the thawing of the grapes this morning. Tonight they are still thawing out, lol.
You can follow along in this blog. Post your commits here because I disabled all commits in my blog entries.

http://www.winemakingtalk.com/forum/blog.php?b=72


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## Sirs (Sep 25, 2011)

ok if your going to go with wild let it go without nutrient
and you won't need to add tannins
this stuff will take off like a bat out of hades 
trust me unless you've added k-meta or something to stall fermentation.......


also you can get bronze here also 2 varieties to be exact, plus big reds and nobles really nice ones so what you got to lose its a win win either way, if it screws up you can come get as much as you want not just a bucket or 2 ask julie there's a few here


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## Sirs (Sep 25, 2011)

only thing it'll cost you is gas to get all you want.


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## pwrose (Sep 25, 2011)

Sirs how long do we have before all the grapes are gone or are they already gone for this year?

So if you are following along with my blog I started working with the grapes yesterday. It took until this morning before they were all thawed out. This morning I poured them all into a 6 gallon primary fermenter lined with a straining bag. I did have to take some of the hulls out so that it would have room to ferment. I was expecting more juice from 50 lbs but it is looking like I will end up with barely 5 gallons, but we shall see. The TA was .65% and the SG was 1.060 so I added enough simple syrup to bring the SG up to 1.096. I was shooting for 1.090 but over did it just a tad. I didn't do anything with the TA because I think that .65% should be about right or am I wrong? It is still a little cold for the yeast to get going but I think by tomorrow it should be rolling along. Oh yeah I did add yeast nutrient, 5 tsp one per gallon before I read your post Sirs. Hopefully it wont hurt anything. If it don't start by Tuesday morning I will be pitching some EC-1118 yeast.


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## Sirs (Sep 25, 2011)

they are just starting to get ripe and if they do like last year will be there till at least 2 good frost


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## Sirs (Sep 25, 2011)

ask julie how many there is


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## Julie (Sep 25, 2011)

Lol a crap load. Almost home and I'll post a couple pictures


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## Julie (Sep 25, 2011)

Ok here are some pics of the muscadines that Eddie, Mike and I picked yesterday. The first pic is of Muscadine Red, the second it to give you an idea on how big they are, the third pic is of nobles and as you can see there are still a lot that needs to ripen, the fourth pic shows another row of nobles. There are rows and rows of grapes. My only dissapointment was there was no Petit Verdot. 

We had a great time, even thou Eddie had to get wet,


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## Sirs (Sep 27, 2011)

Here are a few pics of the bronze....


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## Sirs (Sep 27, 2011)

there's probly about 2 or more acres like this think there is enough lol


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## Sirs (Sep 29, 2011)

Another pic of big reds






A pic of the nobles not to many is there??


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## SarahRides (Sep 29, 2011)

Beautiful grapes Eddie!


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## Sirs (Sep 29, 2011)

oh steve took those pics


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## pwrose (Sep 30, 2011)

Sirs I will let ya know something this afternoon about comming out that way tomorrow or Sunday. It is about a 4.5 to 5 hour drive for me, so I will have to leave pretty early to try and make a day of it. Not to mention I still don't know where I am going to put them yet, LOL. Everything is full every carboy and primary is full, the freezer only has one shelf left and if I take that the wife will have a fit. What to do What to do, the brain is turning and new rubbermaid totes are on the horizon I think.


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## Julie (Sep 30, 2011)

pwrose said:


> Sirs I will let ya know something this afternoon about comming out that way tomorrow or Sunday. It is about a 4.5 to 5 hour drive for me, so I will have to leave pretty early to try and make a day of it. Not to mention I still don't know where I am going to put them yet, LOL. Everything is full every carboy and primary is full, the freezer only has one shelf left and if I take that the wife will have a fit. What to do What to do, the brain is turning and new rubbermaid totes are on the horizon I think.



Boy can I relate, you better start bottling. You know if you would make wine to her liking she would clean out the freezer so you could have the whole thing.


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## pwrose (Sep 30, 2011)

I have only made one wine that she really likes, a few that she will drink but one that she actually asked me to open a bottle of, and that was this years strawberry. Now if she would clean it out so that we could fill it with strawberries that would work, because I could hide other things behind them, lol.


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## mxsteve625 (Oct 1, 2011)

You guys are makining me sic (home sick) As I have taking this job in Wheeling, WV, I am missing all the muscadine picking. Last years wine is GONE.


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## Julie (Oct 1, 2011)

mxsteve625 said:


> You guys are makining me sic (home sick) As I have taking this job in Wheeling, WV, I am missing all the muscadine picking. Last years wine is GONE.



Sorry Steve, don't mean to make you homesick but then again we in the north don't get this opportunity often, so all I can say is come visit me, I'll share a bottle or two with you and feed you as well,


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## Sirs (Oct 2, 2011)

well if he screws up his wine on my account he's got plenty now to make up for it


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## pwrose (Oct 2, 2011)

This is correct Sirs
Now I just hope I dont screw up these, lol.
I did stop and buy a paint mixer to put on my drill, and that worked ok but didn't crush all of the grapes. I figure I will give them the night to sit and hit them again tomorrow with it and maybe it will atleast bust the skins enough to let the yeasties in.

Here is the run down
5 x 5 gallon buckets
1 bronze
2 big red muscadines
2 noble muscadines
The bronze readings came in as 1.046 SG and .65% TA
I added 1 gallon of water and 1300 grams of sugar to bring the final SG reading up to 1.082.
The big reds readings came in as
(bucket# 1) 1.040 SG and .70% TA
Added 1 gallon of water and 1300 grams of sugar to bring the final SG up to 1.080
(bucket# 2) 1.052 SG and .60% TA
Added 1 gallon of water and 1200 grams of sugar to bring the final SG up to 1.086

The 2 buckets of Nobles were put in a friends fridge until I can get some more sugar, I thought I had another 25 lb bag but didn't. I will get it tomorrow and finish the nobles up and post those readings.

I will be doing all of these the Eddie way, lol, using natural yeast. Partly because he says these do good with the natural yeast and partly because I dont have but 2 sackets left, lol. I will be making a blog about these and posting the couple of pics I took while I was there.

Eddie Thanks Again
I will be waiting to hear about the other vineyard after they run the pickers. I will make another trip to help you get yours if I can get some merlot. If I cant I would still make the trip just to help ya. The only thing is the next trip I will be staying the night somewhere. 9 hours of round trip driving is exhausting even if your used to alot of driving.


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## mxsteve625 (Oct 4, 2011)

Julie said:


> Sorry Steve, don't mean to make you homesick but then again we in the north don't get this opportunity often, so all I can say is come visit me, I'll share a bottle or two with you and feed you as well,



I may just do that Julie. They have moved me up to Jefferson County, Ohio and I may move accomadations up to Stubenville, OH which is only 39 mins from there. You aren't much further from what Map quest is telling me. I'll PM you as soon as I can find a weekend I'm not working.

Thanks for the hospitality offer.


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## ffemt128 (Oct 5, 2011)

mxsteve625 said:


> I may just do that Julie. They have moved me up to Jefferson County, Ohio and I may move accomadations up to Stubenville, OH which is only 39 mins from there. You aren't much further from what Map quest is telling me. I'll PM you as soon as I can find a weekend I'm not working.
> 
> Thanks for the hospitality offer.



Yep, Steubenville is just about 45 minutes from here as well. Just the opposite direction. I think a weekend lunch may be in order.


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## Julie (Oct 5, 2011)

mxsteve625 said:


> I may just do that Julie. They have moved me up to Jefferson County, Ohio and I may move accomadations up to Stubenville, OH which is only 39 mins from there. You aren't much further from what Map quest is telling me. I'll PM you as soon as I can find a weekend I'm not working.
> 
> Thanks for the hospitality offer.



Sounds like a plan.


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## sevenal (Oct 6, 2011)

*I like the wild yeast idea*

After talking to Sirs I too am attempting the wild yeast must.
I have just started 100# of red and bronze mixed.
It has made 18 gallons. I hop to get two 5 gallon secondary fermentation carboys out of it.
After 30 hours it has just started to take off.


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## pwrose (Oct 6, 2011)

I have noticed that using the wild yeast that it takes a little longer for an active fermentation. I also noticed that it is not as wild as a wine yeast is.
The two five gallon buckets of big reds gave me a total of 7 gallons after a hand press of the skins and pulp. I transfered it to a 5 gallon carboy and two 1 gallon jugs with airlocks. A quick check of the SG revealed a 1.066 which has dropped from 1.080 and 1.084. I mixed the two buckets together and the SG was the 1.066.
The one five gallon bucket of broze is still in the bucket and will be transfered to a carboy tomorrow.
The two five gallon buckets of nobels are still in the fridge and will hopefully make it until Saturday to get crushed and started.

I haven't had any fruit flys all year until I brought the grapes in and now they are out of control, lol. The wife is pissed, but I got the traps out and they are filling up fast.


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## Sirs (Oct 6, 2011)

we don't even mind the fruit flys as bad anymore its those damn stink bugs we can't stand they don't really bother you its just they are always there


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## ffemt128 (Oct 7, 2011)

pwrose said:


> I haven't had any fruit flys all year until I brought the grapes in and now they are out of control, lol. The wife is pissed, but I got the traps out and they are filling up fast.





I'll gladly deal with the fruit flys if Muscadine grapes come with them. I have them now in the cellar from the 8 buckets I've had down there starting in August. I'm sure after this weekend, I'll have even more.


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## pwrose (Oct 7, 2011)

Here is a link to my blog on this site. I know I have it set for no commits but you are welcome to make them here in this post.
The first 4 blogs are of the scuppernongs and big red muscadines. I am planning to start the Nobels tomorrow, as long as they are still good. I will post to my blog again once I get them going.
Enjoy

http://www.winemakingtalk.com/forum/blog.php?u=17686&blogcategoryid=1


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