# Pepper wine thoughts, please!



## BigDaveK (Mar 19, 2022)

It's funny - this year "garden planning" immediately leads to "wine planning"! 

I was very happy with my ground cherry wine last year and will increase the number of plants. I'll be growing litchi tomatoes for the first time - not a litchi, not a tomato, but a fruit that can be used for mock cherry pies. Sounds interesting!

But I'm mostly a pepperhead. Most of my peppers are fermented or dehydrated and this year I hope to add a 3rd use. The Black Hungarian is interesting because at first it's very sweet then 2 seconds later the heat hits. Corbaci's are delicious and very sweet, zero heat. The Aleppo has great pepper flavor and a mild spicy heat. Those are my preliminary wine candidates. Oh, and I'll have to do one with trinidad scorpion for shitsNgiggles - possibly undrinkable but maybe a cooking wine....or stain remover....or critter repellent.

So I'm planning to hit the whole scale from super sweet to super hot. I found some old threads but I was wondering if the current crop of members have any experience, thoughts, or opinions. Right now I'm more interested in pure pepper wine, learning the flavor profile, possibly adding peppers to batches in the future. Yippee, another multi-year project!
Thanks in advance!


Funny side note - I did a google search for "cabbage wine recipe" and got ZERO results. Must be a reason for that.


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## FlamingoEmporium (Mar 19, 2022)

well kept Japanese Secret.









Get your daily dose of vegetables with cabbage wine from Yamanashi


Yamanashi Prefecture is known as Japan’s wine country. Within it, Narusawa Town at the base of Mt Fuji is famous for its abundant growth of cabbages. So, doesn’t it just make sense that the people of Narusawa would decide to make alcohol from their staple crop? Read on to discover…




japantoday.com





probably goes well with kielbasa

i would drink cabbage before peppers I think.


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## Rice_Guy (Mar 19, 2022)

We have had pepper wine at vinters club meetings. The basic wine was green bell peppers, some other variety of pepper and a few percentage of a hot pepper. ,,, Fermaid and acid were added since peppers are low on both.
Tasting; The aromatics were intense green pepper, color was straw. In fermentation the sugar level goes away so that is something that you need to adjust. The heat was adjusted at a level where it was drinkable but he had some left in the bottle by the end of the meeting, ,,, that noted if it is for you exclusively put the heat where you do in your home cooking.

There is a commercial variation which I have had which was served at the tasting room with tomato juice. That one probably was a white grape backbone with a few percentage pepper for target heat level.


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## VinesnBines (Mar 19, 2022)

I make a jalapeño wine. The first batch was best for cooking. The most recent was topped with a significant amount of Chardonnay and is a great sipper. Only need 8 to 16 peppers per gallon. I’ll post my recipe when I get home tomorrow.


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## BigDaveK (Mar 19, 2022)

FlamingoEmporium said:


> well kept Japanese Secret.
> 
> probably goes well with kielbasa
> 
> i would drink cabbage before peppers I think.



Fantastic! Thanks! Maybe I WILL try it. I think I would use red cabbage. Tastes sweeter to me. Made some sauerkraut with it a couple years ago and now it's my favorite.

Oh, and I have a boatload of kielbasa


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## BigDaveK (Mar 19, 2022)

VinesnBines said:


> I make a jalapeño wine. The first batch was best for cooking. The most recent was topped with a significant amount of Chardonnay and is a great sipper. Only need 8 to 16 peppers per gallon. I’ll post my recipe when I get home tomorrow.


Fantastic! I'd love to see your recipe!! That's months away, unfortunately. Just did the indoor seed thing last week.

Each year I plant about a dozen pepper varieties and each year there are fewer and fewer jalapenos. So many others WOW me.


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## winemanden (Mar 19, 2022)

One of the tricks from years ago was adding a few drops of tincture of capsicum to home made liqueurs to give the impression of higher alcohol.


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## CortneyD (Mar 19, 2022)

BigDaveK said:


> It's funny - this year "garden planning" immediately leads to "wine planning"!
> 
> I was very happy with my ground cherry wine last year and will increase the number of plants. I'll be growing litchi tomatoes for the first time - not a litchi, not a tomato, but a fruit that can be used for mock cherry pies. Sounds interesting!


Would you be willing to share that ground cherry recipe? They grow really well here but are such a pain to mess with for jams and jellies- but the flavor is amazing. I'd LOVE to try to make a batch of wine.

I grew a litchi tomato last year but it got neglected and I didn't get any fruit off it, be prepared though because they are THORNY! I'm going to try again this year!


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## VinesnBines (Mar 19, 2022)

I freeze my peppers so I have a supply for wine making. I hope my ground cherries do well too. I’d love the wine recipe.


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## VinesnBines (Mar 20, 2022)

Here is my recipe for one gallon
16 Jalapeno peppers - seeds removed and chopped
1 lb golden raisins 
12 ounces limeade frozen concentrate
1 1/2 to 2 lbs sugar - my last batch sg was 1.082
1 1/2 tsp acid blend
kmeta - either one campden or kmetta equiv.
3/4 to 1 tsp tsp yeast nutrient (Fermaid K after 1/3 sugar depleted)
1/2 tsp peptic enzyme
water to one gallon
EC 1118
I mixed everything except the peptic enzyme and yeast. After 12 hours I added the peptic enzyme ad 12 hours later pitched the yeast.

With my 2020 batch, I overshot the sg and had to add more water. The ferment was more like 3 gallons After racking the second time at the three month mark, I added 2 1/2 bottles of Chardonnay. I bottled after bulk aging one year. I like the milder blend with the Chardonnay. You need to figure out how hot you want the wine. I expect this would blend nicely with a tomato wine. I may play with that blend when I bottle my tomato wine.


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## BigDaveK (Mar 20, 2022)

CortneyD said:


> Would you be willing to share that ground cherry recipe? They grow really well here but are such a pain to mess with for jams and jellies- but the flavor is amazing. I'd LOVE to try to make a batch of wine.
> 
> I grew a litchi tomato last year but it got neglected and I didn't get any fruit off it, be prepared though because they are THORNY! I'm going to try again this year!


I'd be glad to, Cortney! I have a busy day ahead so it may not be until late or tomorrow AM. As I recall it's based on a recipe for gooseberry. They're kinda sorta close.

Yeah, the ground cherries are definitely a pain. Prepping them is certainly no fun. But this year I have skeeter pee - maybe that will help!!??

I'm excited about the litchi tomato. I've read they can become small trees so my plan is to pot at least one and over-winter in the house. And I'm very familiar with thorns. My gooseberries are deadly.


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## BigDaveK (Mar 20, 2022)

VinesnBines said:


> Here is my recipe for one gallon
> 16 Jalapeno peppers - seeds removed and chopped
> 1 lb golden raisins
> 12 ounces limeade frozen concentrate
> ...



Fantastic!! Thank you very much. Copied, printed, in the wine binder!!


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## BigDaveK (Mar 20, 2022)

VinesnBines said:


> I freeze my peppers so I have a supply for wine making. I hope my ground cherries do well too. I’d love the wine recipe.


I've never tried freezing peppers. Up to now I've been fermenting them. Many I'll eat like that, some I'll blend into a variety of hot sauces.

I also dehydrate a bunch and grind them just before use. The flavor of freshly ground pepper is outstanding!


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## BigDaveK (Mar 20, 2022)

I wasn't sure I'd get this out today. I'm one of those that doesn't like spring only because I have 3-4 weeks of grunt work around the property just to get ready for everything else. But here it is, @CortneyD and @VinesnBines, the ground cherry recipe. Personally, I freeze my fruit and ground cherries freeze very well!

The recipe and what I did:

2 1/2 pounds ground cherries (I used 3#, might increase 25-50% next time)
2 1/4 pound sugar or until SG 1.1
1 tsp nutrient
1 Campden tablet
1/2 tsp pectic enzyme
water to 1 gallon (I went to 1 1/4 ish)
yeast suggestion D47 (I used 71B because that's what I had.)

Age for 6 months or more after bottling.

I left out some of the details. Standard stuff - wait 24 hours to add yeast, regular racking regimen, blah blah blah. You know how to make wine.

Mine was in the basement, steady temp about 68 F, and finished around SG .992.

It was a test and my third batch of wine ever (after apple and pear). My goal this year is 3 gal but more would be fine by me!


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## CortneyD (Mar 21, 2022)

Thanks @BigDaveK !


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## VinesnBines (Mar 21, 2022)

Yes! Thanks! Now I need the darn things to produce enough for wine.


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## SeniorHobby (Mar 21, 2022)

BigDaveK said:


> I've never tried freezing peppers. Up to now I've been fermenting them. Many I'll eat like that, some I'll blend into a variety of hot sauces.
> 
> I also dehydrate a bunch and grind them just before use. The flavor of freshly ground pepper is outstanding!


Hi BigDaveK,
I clean the peppers, slice them, freeze them on cookie sheets till frozen, then use a spatula to peel them off, freeze them in baggies. I cut them up while still frozen and throw them into omelets or scrambled eggs. This past year was the first time I tried it, with hesitation. Now I plan on doing it every year! Works great!


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## BigDaveK (Mar 21, 2022)

VinesnBines said:


> Yes! Thanks! Now I need the darn things to produce enough for wine.


You're welcome! I'm so glad they freeze well. There's never enough ripe all at once but they sure do produce all season long. My seeds are in the mix. I'm doing six plants this year, doubling last year's three. Still time to bump it to nine plants. Hmm..


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## BigDaveK (Mar 21, 2022)

SeniorHobby said:


> Hi BigDaveK,
> I clean the peppers, slice them, freeze them on cookie sheets till frozen, then use a spatula to peel them off, freeze them in baggies. I cut them up while still frozen and throw them into omelets or scrambled eggs. This past year was the first time I tried it, with hesitation. Now I plan on doing it every year! Works great!


To be honest I never even thought about freezing them. I can see the advantages, for sure! I'll have to try it this year.


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## BigDaveK (Mar 21, 2022)

CortneyD said:


> Thanks @BigDaveK !


You're welcome!


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## FlamingoEmporium (Mar 21, 2022)

BigDaveK said:


> You're welcome! I'm so glad they freeze well. There's never enough ripe all at once but they sure do produce all season long. My seeds are in the mix. I'm doing six plants this year, doubling last year's three. Still time to bump it to nine plants. Hmm..


Put in 10 in case one or 2 don’t do well. 
my tomatoes are almost done for the season.


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## SeniorHobby (Mar 22, 2022)

BigDaveK said:


> To be honest I never even thought about freezing them. I can see the advantages, for sure! I'll have to try it this year.


I always thought they would be a soggy mess. When you freeze them separately, they are easy to cut up when still a little frozen and they taste great yet. I always plant about 10 pepper plants as it always seems like a couple might not make it; if they all do I used to give them away. Now I freeze them.


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## BigDaveK (Mar 22, 2022)

FlamingoEmporium said:


> Put in 10 in case one or 2 don’t do well.
> my tomatoes are almost done for the season.


I've been very fortunate over the years with a near 100% germination rate of all my seeds. However, after a little thought I've decided to go with a total of 9 plants. I ALWAYS plant an odd number. It's a good thing all my quirks are hard wired - I'd never be able to remember them all.


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## Khristyjeff (Mar 22, 2022)

BigDaveK said:


> I wasn't sure I'd get this out today. I'm one of those that doesn't like spring only because I have 3-4 weeks of grunt work around the property just to get ready for everything else. But here it is, @CortneyD and @VinesnBines, the ground cherry recipe. Personally, I freeze my fruit and ground cherries freeze very well!
> 
> The recipe and what I did:
> 
> ...


Thanks @BigDaveK -- were these the "Aunt Molly" variety of ground cherries? My Grandma used to grow some green ones for pies which were delicious, but "Aunt Molly" seems to be the only one I can find online.


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## BigDaveK (Mar 23, 2022)

Khristyjeff said:


> Thanks @BigDaveK -- were these the "Aunt Molly" variety of ground cherries? My Grandma used to grow some green ones for pies which were delicious, but "Aunt Molly" seems to be the only one I can find online.


Yes, Aunt Molly. I tasted them at a farmer's market about 5 years ago and started growing them the following year. There aren't many varieties, it seems. I buy my seeds from Baker Creek Heirloom at www.rareseeds.com. They have many unusual and hard to find seeds. I try to grow a couple unusual plants each year.


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## Jovimaple (Mar 23, 2022)

I don't know if they have these specifically (because I haven't looked!) but check out seedsavers.org for heirloom seeds. If you are a member, you get a bit of a discount. They are based in Iowa and in non-covid times I believe you could visit them.

I would love to propogate heirloom plants and either save my own seeds or even send some back to them, but I don't have the space in my suburban backyard to separate the different species of plants enough to ensure no cross pollination.


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## BigDaveK (Mar 23, 2022)

Jovimaple said:


> I don't know if they have these specifically (because I haven't looked!) but check out seedsavers.org for heirloom seeds. If you are a member, you get a bit of a discount. They are based in Iowa and in non-covid times I believe you could visit them.
> 
> I would love to propogate heirloom plants and either save my own seeds or even send some back to them, but I don't have the space in my suburban backyard to separate the different species of plants enough to ensure no cross pollination.


Yes, I'm familiar with them! Haven't purchased yet but maybe in the future.
I try to segregate my plants but I'd be shocked if there wasn't some cross-pollination. Those wonderful little pollinators will go wherever their little hearts desire.
I save pepper seeds and some flowers. That's easy. This year I'll try tomato - a bit more involved.
This is interesting: Last year I grew poppies for the first time to use the seeds in the kitchen. (Great success!) After they were planted I read that only opium poppies produce the edible seeds. Hmm.. I wonder how many poppies I would have to grow before the wrong people took interest?
One thing I'm excited about - this year I'm trying onions from seed for the first time. I've always been disappointed with onion sets.


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## ChuckD (Mar 23, 2022)

FlamingoEmporium said:


> Put in 10 in case one or 2 don’t do well.


This way lies great danger! 
This is SOP for me. I need 14 tomato plants so I plant three six pack trays (I don’t like empty cells). Because I don’t like empty cells, I put two seeds in every cell just to be sure. Of course both sprout and thrive so I need to pinch one plant off. However it would be a shame to waste a perfectly good plant so I carefully pull them out and pot them in a fresh pot. I now have 36 tomato plants. Repeat for peppers, broccoli, cabbage, etc. etc.

one might think I would learn but one would be wrong!


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## VinesnBines (Mar 23, 2022)

Tomato seeds are really rather easy to save. I have done it two ways. I have let the tomatoes rot and then wash the seeds. I have just as good luck with cleaning the seeds out of a ripe tomato onto a paper towel. I let the towel with the seeds dry and keep the folded paper towel in a plastic bag The seeds usually peel off the paper towel but if they stick, I just plant seed and bit of towel in the potting mix. A plus is you can write on the paper towel with a sharpie to ID the seeds.


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## BigDaveK (Mar 23, 2022)

ChuckD said:


> This way lies great danger!
> This is SOP for me. I need 14 tomato plants so I plant three six pack trays (I don’t like empty cells). Because I don’t like empty cells, I put two seeds in every cell just to be sure. Of course both sprout and thrive so I need to pinch one plant off. However it would be a shame to waste a perfectly good plant so I carefully pull them out and pot them in a fresh pot. I now have 36 tomato plants. Repeat for peppers, broccoli, cabbage, etc. etc.
> 
> one might think I would learn but one would be wrong!


I agree - empty cells are ABSOLUTELY forbidden. 

And I can't pinch off, either. I imagine pathetic little plant screams which cause the Garden Gods to be cross with me.


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## BigDaveK (Mar 23, 2022)

VinesnBines said:


> Tomato seeds are really rather easy to save. I have done it two ways. I have let the tomatoes rot and then wash the seeds. I have just as good luck with cleaning the seeds out of a ripe tomato onto a paper towel. I let the towel with the seeds dry and keep the folded paper towel in a plastic bag The seeds usually peel off the paper towel but if they stick, I just plant seed and bit of towel in the potting mix. A plus is you can write on the paper towel with a sharpie to ID the seeds.


Huh. I read in numerous books where you had to essentially ferment them for a couple days to get rid of the weird gelatinous coating. If you had luck with your method I'll try it. Simple is usually better. Thanks!


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## Ohio Bob (Mar 23, 2022)

VinesnBines said:


> Tomato seeds are really rather easy to save. I have done it two ways. I have let the tomatoes rot and then wash the seeds. I have just as good luck with cleaning the seeds out of a ripe tomato onto a paper towel. I let the towel with the seeds dry and keep the folded paper towel in a plastic bag The seeds usually peel off the paper towel but if they stick, I just plant seed and bit of towel in the potting mix. A plus is you can write on the paper towel with a sharpie to ID the seeds.


Place on wax paper to avoid sticking to paper towels. Use fingernails to scrape the dried seeds off the wax paper. Takes just a few minutes. Seeds for life!


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## SeniorHobby (Mar 23, 2022)

Ohio Bob said:


> Place on wax paper to avoid sticking to paper towels. Use fingernails to scrape the dried seeds off the wax paper. Takes just a few minutes. Seeds for life!


This is great, wine making advice and gardening advice all in one place! I have never tried planting tomato seeds before, I might just do that now! I have tried flower seeds. I tried saving the teeny tiny petunia seeds last year. I had all one color, deep purple. I had very good luck with the seeds sprouting and before you know it I had flowers... lavender, pink..? What? Anyway this year I gave my son who is a golf course superintendent a bunch of seeds. They are so tiny we just threw a bunch in each cell. They all took again! He said it looks like a lawn is growing! Now what to do? There will have to be some pinching or cutting back for sure!!


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## BigDaveK (Mar 24, 2022)

SeniorHobby said:


> This is great, wine making advice and gardening advice all in one place!


This will be my first year with skeeter pee. I'm guessing it would be prudent not to mingle those hobbies too much - like when I'm using the chainsaw. 

And BTW, my forsythia started to bloom. At least 1 more snow for Ohio. Hasn't failed yet!


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## VinesnBines (Mar 24, 2022)

BigDaveK said:


> Huh. I read in numerous books where you had to essentially ferment them for a couple days to get rid of the weird gelatinous coating. If you had luck with your method I'll try it. Simple is usually better. Thanks!


I heard that about fermenting or letting the tomato rot but with open pollenated seeds, it works not to make the mess of rotting seeds. If the seeds look mature, they usually germinate.



SeniorHobby said:


> I had all one color, deep purple. I had very good luck with the seeds sprouting and before you know it I had flowers... lavender, pink..? What?


Saved seeds, especially hybrids, can revert to the "wild" color or can be cross pollenated. One thing, don't try to save squash or pumpkin seed to get a true plant. You really have to segregate the bloom and hand pollenate or the pollinators will give you a Fraken-squash! Fun for sure and sometimes you luck out and get a true to breeding pumpkin but usually not. 

I've been able, by saving seed from the largest cheery tomatoes, to get bigger cherry tomatoes...just for fun! 



ChuckD said:


> This way lies great danger!
> This is SOP for me. I need 14 tomato plants so I plant three six pack trays (I don’t like empty cells). Because I don’t like empty cells, I put two seeds in every cell just to be sure. Of course both sprout and thrive so I need to pinch one plant off. However it would be a shame to waste a perfectly good plant so I carefully pull them out and pot them in a fresh pot. I now have 36 tomato plants. Repeat for peppers, broccoli, cabbage, etc. etc.
> 
> one might think I would learn but one would be wrong!



I plant my seed in a seed flat and transplant when I get at least 2 true leaves. I learned this method many years ago in horticulture classes. It is a space saver and the tomatoes and peppers do great. Some flowers don't like transplanting like zinnias and cosmos so they are better in cells or direct sow in the garden. My son managed though to start sunflowers in cells and transplanted successfully. His thumb is the greenest in the family. His grandfather would be so proud.


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## SeniorHobby (Mar 24, 2022)

VinesnBines said:


> I heard that about fermenting or letting the tomato rot but with open pollenated seeds, it works not to make the mess of rotting seeds. If the seeds look mature, they usually germinate.
> 
> 
> Saved seeds, especially hybrids, can revert to the "wild" color or can be cross pollenated. One thing, don't try to save squash or pumpkin seed to get a true plant. You really have to segregate the bloom and hand pollenate or the pollinators will give you a Fraken-squash! Fun for sure and sometimes you luck out and get a true to breeding pumpkin but usually not.
> ...


Looks like we have a lot of people who love to be busy. Gardening, winemaking, etc! Keeps us out of trouble...until we started using the fruits of our labors, mainly wine!!


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## FlamingoEmporium (Mar 25, 2022)

BigDaveK said:


> This will be my first year with skeeter pee. I'm guessing it would be prudent not to mingle those hobbies too much - like when I'm using the chainsaw.
> 
> And BTW, my forsythia started to bloom. At least 1 more snow for Ohio. Hasn't failed yet!


It’s ok to chainsaw in flip flops though right ?


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## BigDaveK (Mar 25, 2022)

FlamingoEmporium said:


> It’s ok to chainsaw in flip flops though right ?


The only reason I DON"T wear flip flops is because most of my property is sloped so I slide right out of the darn things!

And besides, when your number is called it won't matter what you're wearing.


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