# 4" end posts



## ThePlantGuy978 (Nov 13, 2013)

I have a dumb question. I just bought 14 new 4” round fence posts for my newly planted muscadine vines. As I said the posts are 4” in diameter but have 1 flat side. My question is: will the posts bow in the direction of the flat side or the round side? I want to set the posts so that they bow away from the vines. Tightening the wire instead of loosening the wire called several manufactures and they don’t have a clue.
Any comments would be greatly appreciated.

Hans


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## LoneTreeFarms (Nov 13, 2013)

they will not bow with straight or curved, the way that the post will bend or bow is directly related to how much post is burried and how much tension is on the wire between the posts. some of the setups that i've seen the post has a hole in it that the wire runs through where the wire is actually tied off to a angled brace post.


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## Rocky (Nov 13, 2013)

All things being equal, I would think the bow would be greater on the flat side because the structural integrity of the post has been partially removed. If it does not matter, I suggest putting the round side in the direction of the tension.


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## djrockinsteve (Nov 13, 2013)

You will need a wire and stake on opposite of tension site to prevent or reduce bowing. Drive a stake deep in ground 4 feet away from last post. Attach wire (9 or 11 gauge) to stake and post.


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## jamesngalveston (Nov 13, 2013)

it will bow to the flat side, unless the curved side is to the west.
wood bows with heat...the west sun is hotter then the east..
it will bow torwards the sun, does not matter what side, what size, are what type....it bows to heat.


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## ThePlantGuy978 (Nov 14, 2013)

Thanks for the info.
I did start putting them in yesterday with the flat side away from the vines, only have 10 more to go.
Hans


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## spaniel (Nov 22, 2013)

Running 10 vine rows, mature vines with full tension and fruit load, I've not seen any bowing of 4" SQUARE endposts. Round should be stronger. Remember most of the tension goes into the ground anchor.


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## grapeman (Nov 23, 2013)

I would not worry about the posts bowing, I would worry about them rotting off to quickly. Those sound like landscape timber and they are probably not treated very well. They are cheap, but only last about 5 years and then they rot off. I used some about 8 years ago and alternated with square 4x4's to see what was better- both about the same cost at the time. I should have boughten all 4x4's as they are still solid and I have had to replace a number of the landscape timbers. Those are meant for flowerbed borders, not end posts in a vineyard.


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## bigdrums2 (Nov 25, 2013)

I wouldn't use them in a big setting, but mine are fine for my ten rows. The ends were dipped in tar, set in concrete, sprayed with thompson's. No problems here in year 4.


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## ThePlantGuy978 (Nov 27, 2013)

grapeman said:


> I would not worry about the posts bowing, I would worry about them rotting off to quickly. Those sound like landscape timber and they are probably not treated very well. They are cheap, but only last about 5 years and then they rot off. I used some about 8 years ago and alternated with square 4x4's to see what was better- both about the same cost at the time. I should have boughten all 4x4's as they are still solid and I have had to replace a number of the landscape timbers. Those are meant for flowerbed borders, not end posts in a vineyard.



Thanks for the warning, but I found that out about 10 years ago when I used landscape timbers for end posts. Mine only lasted about 2 years when I had to replace them. The posts I have now are truly fence posts.

Thanks,

Hans


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## ThePlantGuy978 (Nov 27, 2013)

bigdrums2 said:


> I wouldn't use them in a big setting, but mine are fine for my ten rows. The ends were dipped in tar, set in concrete, sprayed with thompson's. No problems here in year 4.



Thanks for the info. My rows are VERY short, only 25', but I have 10 rows in this one location with only 2 muscadine vines planted per row. I know that there are planted too close for normal full production, but my main goal is to take cuttings for propagation. 
I have heard from several sources that wooden fence posts should not be set in concrete it speeds up their rotting away, but I guess dipping them in tar and using a sealer spray on them helps in the long run. 
Thanks,
Hans

www.MuscadinesAndMore.com


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## ThePlantGuy978 (Nov 27, 2013)

djrockinsteve said:


> You will need a wire and stake on opposite of tension site to prevent or reduce bowing. Drive a stake deep in ground 4 feet away from last post. Attach wire (9 or 11 gauge) to stake and post.



Do I really need a stake and wire at the end posts if my rows are only 25' long having only 2 muscadine vines per row?

Thanks,

Hans

www,MuscadinesAndMore.com


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## mgmarty (Dec 2, 2013)

the short answer, YES.


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## bigdrums2 (Dec 3, 2013)

ThePlantGuy978 said:


> Do I really need a stake and wire at the end posts if my rows are only 25' long having only 2 muscadine vines per row? Thanks, Hans www,MuscadinesAndMore.com



I think that if your posts are set in concrete and you brace the ends then you won't have a problem. You can see an example in the grape grower book. You can angle the brace in the inside towards the end post or do an h bracket brace, sealing that one in gravel or concrete. My rows are about 40 feet long and I did mine that way, no problems. However... My muscadines are not on that but a regular fence. My bunch grapes are on the trellis.


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