# A few questions!



## CK55 (Sep 11, 2018)

I'm buying some Sangiovese grapes tomorrow morning and will be going to get them, I'm wondering if you guys have any tips for Sangiovese. I have not worked with the grape before. I am thinking about going with either RC 212 or BM 4X4 yeast, what would you use, and any tips for oaking it? 

Grapes will be picked up from the Paso Robles area of California for reference and will be sitting at 25 Brix as they were tested today.

Thanks


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## Johnd (Sep 11, 2018)

CK55 said:


> I'm buying some Sangiovese grapes tomorrow morning and will be going to get them, I'm wondering if you guys have any tips for Sangiovese. I have not worked with the grape before. I am thinking about going with either RC 212 or BM 4X4 yeast, what would you use, and any tips for oaking it?
> 
> Grapes will be picked up from the Paso Robles area of California for reference and will be sitting at 25 Brix as they were tested today.
> 
> Thanks



I wouldn’t hesitate to use either yeast, but BM 4x4 would be my first choice. Oak / age in a barrel if you can, if not, the bigger the staves you use, the better, IMHO.


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## pgentile (Sep 11, 2018)

CK55 said:


> I'm buying some Sangiovese grapes tomorrow morning and will be going to get them, I'm wondering if you guys have any tips for Sangiovese. I have not worked with the grape before. I am thinking about going with either RC 212 or BM 4X4 yeast, what would you use, and any tips for oaking it?
> 
> Grapes will be picked up from the Paso Robles area of California for reference and will be sitting at 25 Brix as they were tested today.
> 
> Thanks



I'm currently doing a batch of brunello (supposedly old vine sangiovese) grapes. Crushed on Saturday pitched rc212, CH16 MLB yeaterday, coming along nicely, 23 brix at start. Will end up in new barrel at some point, but otherwise I would use med oak staves/spirals/chips. BM4x4 would be fine too.

What about MLF on yours?

i have Paso Robles zin coming in a few weeks.


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## CK55 (Sep 11, 2018)

pgentile said:


> I'm currently doing a batch of brunello (supposedly old vine sangiovese) grapes. Crushed on Saturday pitched rc212, CH16 MLB yeaterday, coming along nicely, 23 brix at start. Will end up in new barrel at some point, but otherwise I would use med oak staves/spirals/chips. BM4x4 would be fine too.
> 
> What about MLF on yours?
> 
> i have Paso Robles zin coming in a few weeks.


I have a tube of White Labs Malolactic bacteria culture. I purchased it already and will grab the yeast tommorrow on my way back. I have read that sangiovese is typically a wine drank when young, usually within the first 2 years. As to oaking it i was just going to use a stave/spiral since i dont have a barrel for it. I will just have to be careful to not overdo it.


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## pgentile (Sep 12, 2018)

CK55 said:


> I have a tube of White Labs Malolactic bacteria culture. I purchased it already and will grab the yeast tommorrow on my way back. I have read that sangiovese is typically a wine drank when young, usually within the first 2 years. As to oaking it i was just going to use a stave/spiral since i dont have a barrel for it. I will just have to be careful to not overdo it.



The first all grape batch I made was 4 or 5 years ago with inexpensive sangiovese. Did not oak it, would have to look up the yeast, but I still feel it was one of my best. No bottles survived beyond 18 months.

I have used White Labs malo with good results.


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## CK55 (Sep 12, 2018)

pgentile said:


> The first all grape batch I made was 4 or 5 years ago with inexpensive sangiovese. Did not oak it, would have to look up the yeast, but I still feel it was one of my best. No bottles survived beyond 18 months.
> 
> I have used White Labs malo with good results.


Ive made wine several times, but not with this grape, and since grapes can take wildly different approaches depending on varietal I wanted to ask and see what you guys had to say.


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## Donz (Sep 12, 2018)

CK55 said:


> I have a tube of White Labs Malolactic bacteria culture. I purchased it already and will grab the yeast tommorrow on my way back. I have read that sangiovese is typically a wine drank when young, usually within the first 2 years. As to oaking it i was just going to use a stave/spiral since i dont have a barrel for it. I will just have to be careful to not overdo it.



Actually Sangiovese ages very well. Brunello wines are aged 5 years before release. 2 years on oak minimum.


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## Farmside (Sep 12, 2018)

I have a real nob question, being a newbie here, but once your wine has stopped fermenting and has been racked into a clean carboy to clear, why not just cap it over installing an airlock/bung? For info I am disabled with weight restrictions so using 1 gallon carboys. I’m not even sure if larger ones are threaded for caps (that might be the answer)


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## GreenEnvy22 (Sep 12, 2018)

Farmside said:


> I have a real nob question, being a newbie here, but once your wine has stopped fermenting and has been racked into a clean carboy to clear, why not just cap it over installing an airlock/bung? For info I am disabled with weight restrictions so using 1 gallon carboys. I’m not even sure if larger ones are threaded for caps (that might be the answer)



Your wine still will have some carbon dioxide in it after fermentation, so it needs to be able to vent that. If it's a solid lid your wine won't degas at best, and at worst could shatter the carboy or pop the lid off if small amounts of co2 are still being produced. Changes in temperature also will affect the volume so it needs to be able to adjust. That second one isn't as important in 1 gallon containers as larger ones, but still matters. You can get 1-way silicon bungs that will let co2 vent but not let air back in.


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## CK55 (Sep 12, 2018)

Donz said:


> Actually Sangiovese ages very well. Brunello wines are aged 5 years before release. 2 years on oak minimum.


Brunello is actually a special clone of sangiovese. But yeah.bog standard sangio is recommended to.be drank young.


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## Farmside (Sep 12, 2018)

GreenEnvy22 said:


> Your wine still will have some carbon dioxide in it after fermentation, so it needs to be able to vent that. If it's a solid lid your wine won't degas at best, and at worst could shatter the carboy or pop the lid off if small amounts of co2 are still being produced. Changes in temperature also will affect the volume so it needs to be able to adjust. That second one isn't as important in 1 gallon containers as larger ones, but still matters. You can get 1-way silicon bungs that will let co2 vent but not let air back in.


Thanks! I kind of thought there was a logical answer and had already ordered in a screw-on cap that has a formed hole for an airlock. Changed it on a gallon of peach wine that was just racked, sure enough I heard gas release while removing the cap I had on it. Sure looked as though the fermentation was over ...... so far I’m liking this hobby. Keeps the brain busy figuring it out, even more fun drinking your results.


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## Donz (Sep 12, 2018)

Donz said:


> Actually Sangiovese ages very well. Brunello wines are aged 5 years before release. 2 years on oak minimum.






CK55 said:


> Brunello is actually a special clone of sangiovese. But yeah.bog standard sangio is recommended to.be drank young.



Real Brunello is 100% Sangiovese grown in Montalcino only. I just spent 10 days there.


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## jgareri (Sep 12, 2018)

Donz said:


> Real Brunello is 100% Sangiovese grown in Montalcino only. I just spent 10 days there.


Correct. It's full name is Brunello Di montalcino. Same kind of concept as Champagne


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## CK55 (Sep 12, 2018)

Brix went up to about 26 so i got good grapes, went and picked them and got home and crushed them and added sulphites to them to kill anything off. And will go ahead and add my yeast tommorrow I picked up BM4x4 as it is a better sangiovese yeast.


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## CK55 (Sep 12, 2018)

Donz said:


> Real Brunello is 100% Sangiovese grown in Montalcino only. I just spent 10 days there.


Again its a specific clone of sangiovese. its unique solely to that area and tastes different.


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## CK55 (Sep 13, 2018)

Its happily fermenting away.


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## pgentile (Sep 14, 2018)

Donz said:


> Real Brunello is 100% Sangiovese grown in Montalcino only. I just spent 10 days there.



That is correct but I don't think the growers and marketers of California grapes care especially Regina/Pia. They are calling their supposed old vine sangio Brunello, They sell both sangio and brunello in their standard tier grapes and their premium. Maybe the Brunello vines were cloned/propagated directly from Montalcino, but they are still just sangiovese grapes.


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## Donz (Sep 14, 2018)

pgentile said:


> That is correct but I don't think the growers and marketers of California grapes care especially Regina/Pia. They are calling their supposed old vine sangio Brunello, They sell both sangio and brunello in their standard tier grapes and their premium. Maybe the Brunello vines were cloned/propagated directly from Montalcino, but they are still just sangiovese grapes.



Guess that is called good marketing lol.


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## Ajmassa (Sep 14, 2018)

I’ve heard many people struggle with the white labs viles of liquid malo. Just don’t take it for granted. Do all the necessary steps to ease that MLf along. 

Also, the Sangiovese grapes, continuing what we spoke about in PM, how was the color? After all the talk about being much lighter than anticipated, did that hold true? Or did they come on a little darker? 
And you still got plans to blend in some Malbec or something?


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## CK55 (Sep 14, 2018)

Ajmassa5983 said:


> I’ve heard many people struggle with the white labs viles of liquid malo. Just don’t take it for granted. Do all the necessary steps to ease that MLf along.
> 
> Also, the Sangiovese grapes, continuing what we spoke about in PM, how was the color? After all the talk about being much lighter than anticipated, did that hold true? Or did they come on a little darker?
> And you still got plans to blend in some Malbec or something?


As of now it's a fairly light color and doesn't seem to be getting darker as it ferments. I can tell you I'm 99% sure it will be a pale red wine that you can easily see through. I won't be blending anything as I wasn't able to get any other grapes. My vines are not old enough to produce. And the criolla is taking it's time.


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## Ajmassa (Sep 15, 2018)

That’s cool. No rules about when to blend. Plus more control when blending finished wines —-*at least thats what they say. 
I’ve yet to blend finished wines other than polishing off a couple diff bottles into one glass!
I’m still a couple years away from my massive blending party. With multiple varietals-vintages-countries of finished wine. In 2020 all are invited! 

Regarding the oak- that’s personal preference. Lately I’ve been steering away from American. Was using spirals and staves. Trying Hungarian and French now -jumping head first into the barrel world. 
My 2017 Sangiovese from grapes will be the popping the Frenchies cherry. W/o experience I could easily jack the wine up in an American I think. And the Euros give a little more wriggle room for time and extraction.


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## CK55 (Sep 15, 2018)

Ajmassa5983 said:


> That’s cool. No rules about when to blend. Plus more control when blending finished wines —-*at least thats what they say.
> I’ve yet to blend finished wines other than polishing off a couple diff bottles into one glass!
> I’m still a couple years away from my massive blending party. With multiple varietals-vintages-countries of finished wine. In 2020 all are invited!
> 
> ...


My sangio is fermenting well, i cant wait in about 3-4 more days to press it and then get it into secondary. At which point ill pitch the malolactic.


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## porkchopmessiah (Sep 16, 2018)

CK55 said:


> My sangio is fermenting well, i cant wait in about 3-4 more days to press it and then get it into secondary. At which point ill pitch the malolactic.


Hey...I'm just starting 6 gallon of sangiovese from a bucket of mosto bello...would you mind sharing you measurements of ph, TA, and so before you pitched yeast....I got a high ph ..over 4 and TA of .37 and was wondering if that's because the nature of just buying juice...should I adjust to ph of 3.6 or so before pitching?
I have redstar premier rouge as my yeast...any thoughts or advice much appreciated...I'm a bit of a noob, and have only done peach and strawberry thus far


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## CK55 (Sep 16, 2018)

pH was about 3.6 I didn't measure TA . I would use BM 4x4 yeast as it's actually isolated from sangio fermentations in italy. So it's ideal. You can use that yeast. But I don't know of it will be ideal. Make sure you do malolactic towards the end of primary. As it will help with sharpness of sangio.


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