# Heating cooling suggestions



## olusteebus (Jan 3, 2017)

I have a new to me workshop that I plan on making it a winery. It is about 250 square feet. I will insulate the ceiling. 

any suggestions would be appreciated.


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## Johnd (Jan 3, 2017)

olusteebus said:


> I have a new to me workshop that I plan on making it a winery. It is about 250 square feet. I will insulate the ceiling.
> 
> any suggestions would be appreciated.



Not sure why you'd insulate the ceiling but not the walls, but I don't know the configuration of your room, what the ambient temperature patterns are, or what temps you want to maintain. 

Lots of people here simply use a thru wall a/c unit with very good success, if you also need heating capability, you could secure one that heats as well as cools, and if it has a thermostat built in to the unit, even better. Pretty cost effective solution, depending upon what temps you are trying to maintain and what conditions you are trying to overcome...............


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## olusteebus (Jan 3, 2017)

I am hoping the walls are insulated. If not, I will have to take off the exterior siding which will be much easier as it is t1-11. I just want to maintain temperature conducive to wine making. I considered a wall unit that heats also but I wanted to know if there were other alternatives.

A ductless unit may be too costly. I will look into that.


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## Stressbaby (Jan 3, 2017)

Johnd said:


> Not sure why you'd insulate the ceiling but not the walls



I don't know about this building, but I know greenhouses. In a standalone greenhouse 60% of heat loss is straight up through the roof. Around 35% is walls, and the rest is perimeter/floor.


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## Johnd (Jan 3, 2017)

Stressbaby said:


> I don't know about this building, but I know greenhouses. In a standalone greenhouse 60% of heat loss is straight up through the roof. Around 35% is walls, and the rest is perimeter/floor.



Owning a commercial construction company, I know buildings, just not this one. That's part of the point, while I suspect it's not a greenhouse, we don't know if it's a stand alone building, an underground basement, a workshop surrounded by house on all sides, etc., what part of the world it is in, whether heating or cooling is the most predominant challenge, etc.. A wine room in Alaska will have very different challenges from one where I live near New Orleans. Heat loss is no challenge here, it's rarely even an issue, but cooling is of paramount importance, as are well insulated ceilings AND walls.....that's why I asked the questions, all of those things are important in the design of a temperature controlled space for wine................... A 250 sf space needs to have it's own unique challenges addressed.


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## olusteebus (Jan 3, 2017)

It is a stand alone building with about 1/4 of it a room that is finished, the rest is an unfinished garage. The finished room is about 250 square feet. Concrete floor with 8 foot ceilings. I am assuming the walls are insulated and if not, I will insulate them with rolls. The ceiling is not insulated but I will put that down. I don't know what roof trusses it has, likely 2x6, maybe 2 x8. Could be 2x4 but I will sister 2x6 onto them is so. 

It is in North Florida where it gets quite hot and freezes maybe three or four nights a year. 

Tin roof.

I have another question, can I put plywood over the rolled insulation.


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## Johnd (Jan 3, 2017)

olusteebus said:


> It is a stand alone building with about 1/4 of it a room that is finished, the rest is an unfinished garage. The finished room is about 250 square feet. Concrete floor with 8 foot ceilings. I am assuming the walls are insulated and if not, I will insulate them with rolls. The ceiling is not insulated but I will put that down. I don't know what roof trusses it has, likely 2x6, maybe 2 x8. Could be 2x4 but I will sister 2x6 onto them is so.
> 
> It is in North Florida where it gets quite hot and freezes maybe three or four nights a year.
> 
> ...



Since you are in Florida, with very similar temperature and humidity issues as where I live, and depending upon what temps you want to maintain, we may need to talk vapor barriers. 

Are you intending to just make this your winemaking space and maintaining temps in the 70 - 75 degree range, or are you wanting to make a wine storage area also where you can maintain 55-60 degrees?


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## olusteebus (Jan 4, 2017)

At some point I could probably do that with a small room, heavily insulated. but that would be much later. 

Could I do that with a wall unit AC

first I want to keep it between 68 and 72 and in the winter less than freezing unless I am fermenting. 

Later on I will build an ageing room.


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## ibglowin (Jan 4, 2017)

Since your in FL, insulate, insulate, insulate, eveywhere you can. Use vapor barriers where appropriate. I think you can get by with a properly sized window unit AC. Make sure it has a thermostat that will completely shut off the unit when the set temp is reached and not just cut off the compressor. They are readily available these days. Since you want as close to 55F in the Winter for storage/cellaring You should be able to get by with a small electric heater (with thermostat) in the Winter for the cold snaps.


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## Johnd (Jan 4, 2017)

olusteebus said:


> At some point I could probably do that with a small room, heavily insulated. but that would be much later.
> 
> Could I do that with a wall unit AC
> 
> ...



You could maintain 70-75 with a window unit and batt insulation in the walls and ceiling, maybe even a little bit cooler. 

Where we live, with high humidity much of the year, if you intend to do 55-60, the vapor barrier becomes paramount to prevent condensation and the resulting mold and mildew. An oversized ac unit may serve your needs, but could cause excessive humidity in the room, as opposed to a thru wall refrigeration system. 

Best bet, if you can swing the cost, and since you have to insulate the ceiling anyway, use closed cell spray foam insulation in the ceiling, walls too if you can. The closed cell foam is a vapor barrier and you'll be set for the future, whether you decide for room temp or storage temps. 

Mike's right, a little electric heater with t-stat would be fine for heat if your ac unit doesn't have it.


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