# Questions on Fermentation "Crust" at Top



## vinividivici (Feb 3, 2011)

I've got a SunCal Zin kit going since last Friday. Very vigorous fermentation, basement smells like a winery! Very pleased so far. But...

Two questions:

1) There is a thick head of foam that is also somewhat crusty:







This is my first time making wine. Will this collapse and sink to the bottom as sediment or do I have to carefully remove it before racking? I've done homebrewing before and the process is different.

2) The kit instructions say to rack "when fermentation slows down". It's definitely slowed as there are a couple of open areas in the foam that bubble once every couple of seconds. Should I rack now and take the second S.G. reading?

Thanks,

Bob


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## AlFulchino (Feb 3, 2011)

punch it down more often...it is vigorous and getting dry to air exposure.....just sink it back in more often an dthat wil eliminate the crust....i would do that a bit before rackin just to insure you have gotten everything out of the solids that you could


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## vinividivici (Feb 3, 2011)

AlFulchino said:


> punch it down more often...it is vigorous and getting dry to air exposure.....just sink it back in more often an dthat wil eliminate the crust....i would do that a bit before rackin just to insure you have gotten everything out of the solids that you could


Thanks, Al. I wish the darn kit instructions mentioned that! It didn't say anything about punching down the head. I'll do that and check on the fermentation rate in a couple of days. I assume I could use a sanitized potato masher to do that?

Hope to get up to your vineyard this summer.

Bob


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## winemaker_3352 (Feb 3, 2011)

I agree - punch down the cap and when the time comes - rack off the sediment - sometimes there is still some foam/crusties on top - just leave that behind when racking.


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## vinividivici (Feb 3, 2011)

Guys, 

Your replies triggered another question: how often do you punch down the head (don't know proper term)? Every couple of days or when it gets thick? I hate tampering with the batch, afraid it will introduce nasties into it.


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## Flem (Feb 3, 2011)

I do it every day.


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## winemaker_3352 (Feb 3, 2011)

I do mine twice a day.


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## mxsteve625 (Feb 3, 2011)

Punch down the cap at least 2 times a day. More will not hurt. I have had some that I have punched down four times a day. Just don't let it dry out.


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## mxsteve625 (Feb 3, 2011)

See this link in the Tutorial Section:

http://www.winemakingtalk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=10512


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## vinividivici (Feb 3, 2011)

It makes sense, but now I'm confused after reading the tutorial on punching down the cap. Was it referring to fruit wine batches only or does this apply to doing kits with wine concentrates? If you have no grape skins or fruit fermenting, should I still punch down the cap?


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## AlFulchino (Feb 3, 2011)

punch it down...this will also help give the remaining yeast some o2 to do their thing


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## mxsteve625 (Feb 3, 2011)

vinividivici said:


> It makes sense, but now I'm confused after reading the tutorial on punching down the cap. Was it referring to fruit wine batches only or does this apply to doing kits with wine concentrates? If you have no grape skins or fruit fermenting, should I still punch down the cap?



There is nothing to punch down if using a concentrate or a kit with juice only. You only need to punch down when using fruit and grapes in the primary fermentor.


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## vinividivici (Feb 3, 2011)

mxsteve625 said:


> There is nothing to punch down if using a concentrate or a kit with juice only. You only need to punch down when using fruit and grapes in the primary fermentor.



Steve,

Did you see my picture on the first page of this thread? The "cap" was pretty thick, even though it was a juice kit. 

I'm wondering if the other replies noticed that I was using a juice kit?

Thanks,

Bob


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## AlFulchino (Feb 3, 2011)

kits can still make a crusty cap...your picture demonstrated it...sediment proves it as well....the crusty cap is just sediment carried to the top during fermentation and exposed to drying air

punch it down


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## robie (Feb 3, 2011)

Fruit wines and grape wines both get caps.
You should punch down the cap at least once a day, twice is better, depending on how rapidly it reforms. 

Until the SG gets to about 1.005 (approx), for a red, I check twice a day. If there is a cap, I stir it down. When it is time to go into secondary at approx 1.005 (see your own kit instructions), I stop stirring and rack to secondary.


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## mxsteve625 (Feb 3, 2011)

vinividivici said:


> Steve,
> 
> Did you see my picture on the first page of this thread? The "cap" was pretty thick, even though it was a juice kit.
> 
> ...



I did see it and it has bits of fruit in it. What I was talking about are the kits which have 100% juice that don't need punching. I don't think you are using a 100% juice kit. I have only done 100% juice, Grape and fruit wines. I may be wrong so I'll stop posting for now and see what comes up.


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## vinividivici (Feb 3, 2011)

mxsteve625 said:


> I did see it and it has bits of fruit in it. What I was talking about are the kits which have 100% juice that don't need punching. I don't think you are using a 100% juice kit. I have only done 100% juice, Grape and fruit wines. I may be wrong so I'll stop posting for now and see what comes up.



I know, it sure looked like fruit. But the kit was 100% juice and I didn't notice any bits or pieces when I poured the juice into the bucket. When I punched it down, what looked like bits of fruit seemed to be just bubbles and nothing else.

I didn't mean to prolong this thread, but needed to know if punching down any kind of cap when using 100% juice was necessary. Al seems to have answered that.

It's good info, though, for when I do a kit with a grape bag. Part of my learning progression for when I use all grapes from my vines in a couple of years.

I appreciate all the replies!

Bob

Added: I did punch it down and gently mixed the must.


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## Fzee2 (Oct 22, 2018)

Keep on “Punching” dude! From the vine or a kit!


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## Johnd (Oct 22, 2018)

Fzee2 said:


> Keep on “Punching” dude! From the vine or a kit!



The posts you are responding to are from February of 2011, the wine is long since completed and probably consumed, so don't expect to get a response from any of the posters...................


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## Fzee2 (Oct 22, 2018)

I’m happy that you did! Thanks!


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## Johnd (Oct 22, 2018)

Fzee2 said:


> I’m happy that you did! Thanks!



No problem, we all do it sometime or another when reading through different threads. At least your advice was spot-on!!


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## sour_grapes (Oct 22, 2018)

I must admit I enjoy seeing all of those avatars that antedate me!


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