# How to make an f-pac



## Tom

*Attached is how to make a F-PAC

It you can't open this go to post #6 for the PDF version.* 

View attachment F-PAC.doc


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## jeepingchick

cool, thanks for the info!


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## mmadmikes1

Today I was looking at the bag of frozen strawberries in the freezer thinking I would rather eat them then make a flavor pak for the batch of strawberry wine I have going right now. So like a good procrastinator I went grocery shopping instead. While on cereal isle I spotted it smuckers strawberry pancake syrup. Now it does have pectin in it but I can handle that. Bought 2 bottles for $5.. Got home and put in pan, added a little water and pectic enzyme. warmed up a little. and let it set. Will add to wine tomorrow. O baby I hope this turns out good. They also have blackberry


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## Runningwolf

Tom, I am interested in saving your document but it would not open for me. Did anyone else have an issue with it?


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## mmadmikes1

How to make a F-PAC
=
Flavor Pac


Add 20-30% of #’s of fruit what was used in the primary (if you used 30# in recipe then you will need 6-9# more for the f-pac) in a large frying pan or pot. Simmer to extract all "flavor" and reduce the water from the fruit. Strain thru a kitchen strainer and add AFTER you rack and after the wine is DRY ( .990) You MUST have added k-meta and Sorbate before adding the f-pac. Once adding the f-pac you can add clearing agent. You will have to rack at least 2+ more times. Then
back sweeten to YOUR taste using simple syrup.

Tom

Home of the
MOON RIVER BREWERY
and
DELANCO VINEYARDS


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## ffemt128

Dan,

I printed it to a PDF, see if you can open this one. Maybe Tom or yourself can move to Tom's post. 

PDF995 is a great product for pdf conversions and it's only $21.00 I think. 

View attachment F-PAC.pdf


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## Tom

Thanks Doug. The 1st (Word) post was edited to look at #6 post if you couldnt open.


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## Runningwolf

Got it! Thanks


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## stdkls28

mmadmikes1 said:


> How to make a F-PAC
> =
> Flavor Pac
> 
> 
> Add 20-30% of #’s of fruit what was used in the primary (if you used 30# in recipe then you will need 6-9# more for the f-pac) in a large frying pan or pot. Simmer to extract all "flavor" and reduce the water from the fruit. Strain thru a kitchen strainer and add AFTER you rack and after the wine is DRY ( .990) You MUST have added k-meta and Sorbate before adding the f-pac. Once adding the f-pac you can add clearing agent. You will have to rack at least 2+ more times. Then
> back sweeten to YOUR taste using simple syrup.
> 
> Tom
> 
> Home of the
> MOON RIVER BREWERY
> and
> DELANCO VINEYARDS




I asked this in another thread but i figured it belonged here as well:

pertaining to the "clearing agent" above what additive is to be used? 

Also what would be a general guide for a racking schedule after adding F-PAC and how long should you wait before bottling?

Thanks!


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## Tom

stdkls28 said:


> I asked this in another thread but i figured it belonged here as well:
> 
> pertaining to the "clearing agent" above what additive is to be used?
> 
> Also what would be a general guide for a racking schedule after adding F-PAC and how long should you wait before bottling?
> 
> Thanks!


You 1st add f-pac before clearing.
After adding mix well. I wait 24 hours and add what you like. I use a variety of them it can be Isinglass, Sparkolloid or Super-Kleer (2-part). Wait at least 3-4 weeks so it can compact on the bottom (there will be alot of sediment in fruit wines). Then I rack every 3-4 weeks till clear. I also filter (polish) all my fruit wines.


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## stdkls28

Great and thank you for the information! Also i'm sry; i'll keep this question going in this thread from now on.

How long after you add the K-Meta/K-sorbate do you wait before adding the F-PAC?


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## Tom

Thats a great question.
Here is what I do.
Mix k-meta in some warm water and make sure all is dissolved, Add. MIX WELL do the same to Sorbate MIX WELL, add.
MIX both well with my degassing tool (wine should be degassed BEFORE adding above).
Reason is some got renewed fermentation because the chemicals were not either fully dissolved or not mixed well once added.
Wait 24 hours, add f-pac


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## stdkls28

Thank you; this will be a great help! especially sine my apricot is my first venture into wine making

and one more ?: How much K-sorbate\K-meta do you add per gallon?


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## Tom

Read the label (always go by the label as U may get different strengths).
for 6 gallons its 1/4tsp K-meta
1/2tsp per gal Sorbate


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## lhunkele

_"...MIX both well with my degassing tool..."_

Tom, can I ask what your degassing tool is?

Thank you,
Linda


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## Tom

lhunkele said:


> _"...MIX both well with my degassing tool..."_
> 
> Tom, can I ask what your degassing tool is?
> 
> Thank you,
> Linda


Like this without the stopper
http://www.finevinewines.com/ProdDetA.asp?PartNumber=15262
Or what I have
http://www.midwestsupplies.com/the-stainless-steel-mix-stir.html


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## lhunkele

Thanks Tom - looks like something my husband had in the garage. I think I'll probably want to get my own...


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## Tom

Either one works great !

Get the metal shaft one. You will find the cheaper (plastic) one can break along the shaft.


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## agdodge4x4

Why does one need an f-pak? Why not just use the right about of fruit to start with and simply add sugar back in?


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## Wade E

Sometime fermentation just burns off too much flavor and sometimes someone just follows a recipe on the internet and finds their wine very flavorless and even sometimes the flavor is hidden by too much abv. This is just a way to fix it.


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## Tom

Adding more fruit will also help add body. 
Take Strawberry, mostly water little flavor. So, adding a "flavor pac" will bring fruit forward flavor


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## ffemt128

Tom said:


> Adding more fruit will also help add body.
> Take Strawberry, mostly water little flavor. So, adding a "flavor pac" will bring fruit forward flavor




I like my Spiced Apple a little more fruit forward flavor as well, its almost like a spiced cider.


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## roadwarriorsvt

Lots of good info in this thread. Alot of questions I had have already been asked and good informative answers provided. Cool....


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## Flame145

mmadmikes1 said:


> Today I was looking at the bag of frozen strawberries in the freezer thinking I would rather eat them then make a flavor pak for the batch of strawberry wine I have going right now. So like a good procrastinator I went grocery shopping instead. While on cereal isle I spotted it smuckers strawberry pancake syrup. Now it does have pectin in it but I can handle that. Bought 2 bottles for $5.. Got home and put in pan, added a little water and pectic enzyme. warmed up a little. and let it set. Will add to wine tomorrow. O baby I hope this turns out good. They also have blackberry



How much syrup, water and pectin enzyme ???? How did it work out ???? Good. I only ask because I want to try making F-Pack with the blackberry syrup. Thanks. Flame


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## Tom

If you added Pectic to HOT water it died. Add PE to room temp. Add again and wait 48 hours. BTW add more as it will not hurt


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## chettd

*Sugar to taste?*

If I'm going to back sweeten at what point to I do that? I guess it would be before adding sulfates, but would that be before the f-pac?

My once seemingly disastrous wine that began about a month ago seems to be mellowing out a little. According to the recipe I should rack for the final time in about two weeks. I guess that will change after adding the f-pac as well.


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## Wade E

You need to both sulfite and sorbate before you can sweetenor it will start fermenting again.


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## joeswine

one of many ways to fix a wine thats gone wrong or to improve its flavor when it lost it.....tricks of the trade.......to add oak after fermentation,powder or chips////?????reinstate a concentrate ,or smooth the hot wine..........tricks of the craft.....hay tom.


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## Tom

U GOT DAT RITE JOE !


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## Krhamm

By adding the f-pac wouldn't that sweeten the wine back up enough already? I know the instructions on f-pac is to cook down the fuit/juice and then wait a few weeks to back sweeten. I would think adding f-pac would be the only thing needed to get the sweetness. I've never done one and planning to do so.


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## Runningwolf

Your flavor pack will add some sugar but not usually enough. This is a good reason to add the f pack after stabilizing and then sweeten later to taste.


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## Tom

Ditto!
Dan,
I taught you well


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## Runningwolf

Tom said:


> Ditto!
> Dan,
> I taught you well



Yes you did. Funny story, yesterday when we had our Western Pa get together my wife was reading tags on Steve's carboys and read banana soup was added. Of course the next question was "what the hell is that"? Steve and Julie proceeded to explain simmering sliced banana's with skins on. No way did she believe them. I did it while she wasn't home and when I told her I did the same thing she thought I was in on their plot to BS her. LOL


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## chettd

How much additional volume of liquid will this add to my carboy? Or I guess the more appropriate question is how much water in relationship to the amount of strawberries should be added?


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## Tom

chettd said:


> How much additional volume of liquid will this add to my carboy? Or I guess the more appropriate question is how much water in relationship to the amount of strawberries should be added?


Strawberry has 90% water. You will need to make alot. Once all mashed from simmering strain the pulp and toss. with whats left reduce 75% of the water till real thick, then add
I just did a blueberry f-pac tonight and did the same till I got thick syrup after straining


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## SarahRides

Wow! Thanks for the great info! Once strawberries are in season I'm going to give it a try to add different fruit flavors.


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## Chunnetter

Thats a great question.
Here is what I do.
Mix k-meta in some warm water and make sure all is dissolved, Add. MIX WELL do the same to Sorbate MIX WELL, add.


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## Truebrew

Thanks for all the great info on f-pacs. So far, I haven't added any but once I taste some of those wines that come out of the recommended aging process, I'm sure I'll understand which ones needed that f-pac the most!


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## bricklayer67

So when making an F-pac, can it be made with the fruit left over from the primary fermentation? Or does it have to be new fruit?


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## Tom

There will be nothing left from the primary. So, YES you need fresh/frozen fruit for the f-pac.


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## uwhinesomommywines

Okay, newbie here... I've got plum and peach wines in secondary right now. Hubby and I were talking about f-packs...not sure if we'll need to make them or not for a future racking, but reading up on how to make them "just in case". What is this "k-meta" I'm reading about?? We've got the potassium sorbate and I know that is to prevent refermentation, but I haven't heard of the k-meta?

What is it for and why do we need it??

Also, do you usually add the f-pack to the first racking coming out of secondary?...or do you usually wait until the wine is clear, then add it, then rack again until clear?

Thanks in advance for your help! (...and patience)


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## Rocky

uwhinesomommywines said:


> Okay, newbie here... I've got plum and peach wines in secondary right now. Hubby and I were talking about f-packs...not sure if we'll need to make them or not for a future racking, but reading up on how to make them "just in case". What is this "k-meta" I'm reading about?? We've got the potassium sorbate and I know that is to prevent refermentation, but I haven't heard of the k-meta?
> 
> What is it for and why do we need it??
> 
> Also, do you usually add the f-pack to the first racking coming out of secondary?...or do you usually wait until the wine is clear, then add it, then rack again until clear?
> 
> Thanks in advance for your help! (...and patience)



K-meta is Potassium Metabisulfite (K2S2O5) and is a wine preservative and sanitizer for wine making equipment and containers. Here is a glossary entry for K-meta from another site:

*Potassium Metabisulfite (K-Meta) *
Potassium metabisulfite is added to wine to inhibit bacteria and yeast growth, as well as slow down oxidation. It may leave an unpleasant aftertaste in wine if the dose is too high. This chemical is also used in a water solution as an antiseptic rinse to sanitize equipment. It is identical to, but better than, Sodium Metabisulfite, because it does not add sodium to one's diet. CAUTION: Some people, particularly asthmatics, can have a severe allergic reaction to this substance.
Use: For wine: 1/8 teaspoon (1 gram) of powder per gallon of wine provides 150 ppm free SO2. A little bit goes a long way, so be careful! Always test the free S02 content of your wine (using Titrets and Titret holder) to determine the proper amount to add. Generally speaking, the target free SO2 for red wines is 20-30 ppm and 25-40 ppm for white wines. The exact target depends upon the pH of the wine.
For sanitizing solution: Dissolve 2 oz. (3 tablespoons) Potassium Metabisulfite powder in one gallon of water to make a 1.25% solution.

Regarding f-packs, when you add them is variable. If you add them during fermentation, they will add body and taste and possibly more alcohol to the wine. If you add them after fermentation and stabilization, they will add body and taste and could add sweetness to the wine. It is a matter of preference and taste. I have added them during both periods. I also occasionally ferment to dry in the primary fermenter by snapping down the lid and adding an airlock when the SG gets to about 1.010-1.020.


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## Tom

F-pac = Flavor pac
That being said I add after wine is stabilized (adding k-meta and sorbate). Reason is you will cloud you wine so why clear and than add and start all over again.


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## Rocky

Good point Tom, I like to add the f-pack as early in the process as possible, but sometimes I don't realize I need or decide to use an f-pack until the wine is stabilized and cleared.


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## Tom

Then you didn't "taste" it soon enough...


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## Rocky

I probably tasted it all along the way. It is a multi-step process for me: Tasting, evaluating, developing alternatives, choosing an alternative, obtaining the materials and implementing. All this time, the clock is running on the wine and that determines the point of intersection of the two processes. If the wine has to clear again, so be it. I am retired and have lots of time.


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## joeswine

*To each their own*

IF I WERE A FPAC WHEN TO GO IN IM SO CONFUSSED

ACTUALLY THE CORRECT FPAC INTERACION IS AT THE END AFTER ALL IS SAID AND DONE,IF YOU WERE USING ZEST ,THEN IN THE SECONDARY AN THIRD STAGES, IF YOUR WERE ADDIND RASINS IN THE SECONDARY,IF YOU WERE ADDING GRAPE PACT IN THE PRIMARY BUT A FPAC IN THE FINAL STATEMENT YOUR ADDING TO A ALREADY FINISHED WINE OR A A FLAVOR ENHANCER OR BLENDED COMPONENT TO COMPLEMENT OR CREATE A NEW FLAVOR PROFILE...AT LEAST THATS MY THOUGHTS..AND IT ALL DEPENDS ON WHAT YOU THINK A FPAC IS?


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## PCharles

*Dilution effect of an F-pac*

Good day friends,

I'm wondering about the dilution effect of an f-pac on wine. If you start with 6 gallons and add 1 gallon of f-pack would not the fine alcohol be reduced from 12% to something like 10%? 

I realize one might fortify wine with brandy to compensate, but am interested in other strategies.

Thanks,

Paul


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## Sirs

to me a gallon of f-pac is a lot well to me to much, why would any wine need that much of an f-pac unless your doing a second run using just skins possibly? if nothing else keep reducing it down to maybe a quart then it won't make any real noticable difference in the ABV


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## ffemt128

PCharles said:


> Good day friends,
> 
> I'm wondering about the dilution effect of an f-pac on wine. If you start with 6 gallons and add 1 gallon of f-pack would not the fine alcohol be reduced from 12% to something like 10%?
> 
> I realize one might fortify wine with brandy to compensate, but am interested in other strategies.
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> Paul



If you are starting with a gallon of juice for an fpac, you would simmer this down to below 1/2 gallon probably closer to 1/3rd of a gallon so as not to dilute the wine as much but yet maximize your flavor addition.


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## PCharles

*Why a gallon*

Sirs, the gallon figure was used for example. Howerver, the procedure for an f-pac suggests keeping back 1/3 of the fruit. If I was using 5 gallons of fruit, 1/3 of that is 1.66 gallons. If this was simmered down, it's not hard to see how it would give you close to a gallon of juice right?


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## joeswine

*Fpac thoughts*

i AGREE WITH SIRS, WHY WOULD YOU NEED SO MUCH IN THE FIRST PLACE, THAT WOULD BE MY FIRST THOUGHTS,AND THEN AGAIN WHAT TYPE OF FPAC ARE WE TAKLKING ABOUT JUICE,FRUIT,OR ?

I READ THE ABOVE STATEMENT AND IT WASN'T CLEAR TO ME IF YOU WERE MAKING A FRUIT FPAC AND SAY USING BLACKBERRYS THEN 5-6 LBS.PER GAL. AND THEN THE FPAC ANOTHER 3TO 5LBS OF FRUIT COOKED DOWN SLITELY ,BUT i MAY HAVE NOT UNDERSTOOD THE QUESTION CLEARLY SORRY.


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## Tom

I been using fresh F-pacs and at most I add 1+ quarts. Remember f-pac is for adding flavor. Yes the alcohol will be reduced but.. SO WHAT! The purpose is making a better more flavorable fruit wine.


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## PCharles

*f-pac question*

The procedure for an f-pac suggests putting aside 30% of the fruit. If I add 6 gallons of fruit to a six gallon batch, I'd be setting aside 1.8 gallons of fruit. I figure that would be reduced by about 60% through processing and reduction. This would be about .7 gallons. Tom's comment about using 1+ quart would be less than that. I like the jelly suggestion made by another member. This would provide lots of flavor with very little volume.

My question originated from an experience I had with a blueberry wine that I made. I added about .5 gallons of 100% blueberry juice to 5.5 gallons of wine. I find that the punch of my strawberry wine is greater than that of the blueberry wine. I didn't add an f-pac to the strawberry wine. Looking back, the supposed 100% juice may not have been as it was stated. Perhaps it would have been better for me to have used frozen fruit that I rendered on my own. Next time I'll make my own f-pac material (or perhaps use the jam approach). I most certainly will concentrate the f-pac material with volume to wine at about 4-6% of total wine volume. This would reduce alcohol from 12% to 11.4%.


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## Tom

1st you do not add 6 gallons of fruit to make 6 gallons of wine. You add #'s of fruit. That being said if you used 30#'s of fruit for 6 gallons of WINE then you SIMMER 6#'s of fruit for a f-pac. No way will you add 1+gallons of juice.
Now if you are adding "juice" you need to simmer it down to remove the water. All you want is the thick syrup.


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## Sirs

to me if you add enough fruit/grapes and less water to begin with you shouldn't really need an F-pac I mean it isn't like all the flavor just evaporates, the flavor most of the time isn't gone it's the sweetness that's not there if you have the proper amount of sweetness then there should be plenty of flavor.All fruits/grapes don't have to be sweet to taste right and thats where the drier wines come into play


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## PCharles

*Simmer to syrup*

Ok, simmer to syrup. Doing that, dilution would be considerably less. I've only added an f-pac once. I didn't simmer to syrup, and the wine was diluted more than I would have liked. I usually ferment dry and leave it like that. I'm sure I'll try an f-pac again, but will not make the same error of not simmering to thick syrup.


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## Sirs

long as you simmer slowly with no high heat it should reduce down fairly easy, just keep a check that its not sticking or burning to the bottom


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## PCharles

*Burning Your Bottom*



Sirs said:


> long as you simmer slowly with no high heat it should reduce down fairly easy, just keep a check that its not sticking or burning to the bottom



Hey Sirs, I agree, 

That reminds me of another way to burn your bottom. Eating jalapeño and Habanero peppers will burn your bottom and set it on fire too. 

Sorry, sometimes I can't help myself.

Have a great day,

Paul


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## joeswine

*the body and structure of wine*

SIRS,if you are making grape wine then the fruit should be up front ,remember when good wines gone bad,grape wines should have the structure built in, in the begining no fpacs required unless you need to adjust a little wih flavor,and tannins,,fruit wines on the other hand can be adjusted at anytime,and the fpac should always be extra fruit prepared ahead or when needed ,With grape juice the body should be in the fruit ,if the fruit is quaility then the body will show up if the fruit is not so great or doesn't have enough acidy or sugar then the body of the wine from the beginning is not going to be there,remember the zest,and the concentrates,at times with juice wines they come into play nicely,.

I also talked about layering tannins into the wine which ever you chose to use cubes,spirels,chips and powdered,this inthemselves will deliver the tannic mouth feel to gain ground on body,layering them is the key,look once again at all the components coming with the high end kits ,there all designed to deliver a good tasteing product but more than that they build body and structure and that is just what there designed to do,the tannins from the oak,lend acity the smoothness of the powder delivers mouth feel,the balance of the sugar and all the combind elements are the structure and the body of wine.
always remember wine comes in 3 different styles (for a better word) thin is a body,med is a body and full ,wine can be broken down into its many facets....thats what the body and structure of wine will go into...sorry didn't mean to get on my soap box...tepe is right and knows fpacs very well......sirs did you get my pm?


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## PCharles

*f-pac for Scuppernog*

I'd like to add an f-pac to 5 gallons of scuppernog and would like to check on the process. The pH of the wine is 3.3 with an SG of 1.000. The wine is currently very clear. I degassed the wine with my vacume pump. There was very little gas... slow release of small bubbles. I just added a shade under 1/4 tsp of k-meta followed by 1.25 tsp of k-sorbate. I plan to let the wine sit for two weeks before adding my f-pac. 

Yesterday I was able to get out and pick another gallon of a mix of scuppernog and muscadine grapes. They were nice and ripe for sure. I have them in the freezer now. I would have picked another gallon, but was in a hurry. I expect to pick another gallon next week. It's my plan to crush these grapes and simmer them down. Strain out skins, seeds, ect, and continue to simmer to a syrup. I'll add this to my wine followed by additional pectin. I'll let this sit for a month or so. I expect I'll have to rack several times. In another month I figure I will be ready to add clearing agent. 

I may add a bit of sugar, add one last 1/4 tsp of k-meta, then bottle. 

Comments and suggestions are appreciated.

Thanks, Paul


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## mark54

When making a Fpack how much pectic enzym should I use? I'm making one for 3gal of peach and one for 3gal of blackberry. Thanks!


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## Sammyk

I saw a jam fruit pack mentioned but can not find anything in search. Does anyone know how to use jam to make an fpak?


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## Sammyk

bump for hopefully an answer


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## jamesngalveston

to the guy adding the strawberry syrup, how did that turn out.


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## Neeshac

Why not use a good quality extract and sugar to back sweeten and flavor?


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## Mary Hedenberg

If you make the fpak when you start your wine how do you store fpak while wine ferments?


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## joeswine

Have any of you read how to make a. Fpac.?


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## Mary Hedenberg

I read several different instructions to make but doesn't say how to store, most looked like they were making right before adding but I wanted to use leftover juice to make it ahead of time


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## Rocky

Mary, I have had success in making the FPACs and freezing them until ready to use. Thaw them completely before adding to wine. If you are using leftover juice, I suggest hitting it with Potassium Metabisulfite before freezing.


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## Mary Hedenberg

Was planning on stabilizing before adding. Thanks for the info will freeze.


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