# Wanting To Try Mead



## Waldo

Come, let us reason together


And help Waldo fulfill his need


His Daughter has requested of him


That he try and make some Mead


The recipe from Fine Vine Wines


Needs some clarification


For Waldo to be able to make


The best Mead in the nation.


Is there anyone here that can help fulfill his need


Anyone at all, who has previously made some Mead


----------



## masta

Masta can help with your need


To make the fine drink you call mead


I have some knowledge in this task


And can help you get the drink ready for your glass


I believe the recipe you speak of has some flaws


pH of honey is low so no need to adjust acid at all


Honey needs to be treated with great care


As heating it will cause the fine aromas to fly into the air


So go ahead and post your questions on making mead 


I will do my best to fulfill your need


----------



## Waldo

ROFLMAO















What then O' Masta from the recipe


would you have me change for me


So that I might meet my need


To make mydaughter some lovely mead


I would be forever beholden to thee


If you could post me a good recipe


One easily followed 


By a "Newbie"


*Edited by: Waldo *


----------



## Waldo

Masta !!!! Masta !!!!! Do not forsake me in my hour of need.


I really must make my daughter some Mead.


And of your knowledge I am much in need.


----------



## Hippie

Woooooohoooooo! I love it!!!


----------



## masta

I am by no means an experienced mead maker and have only made 3 batches so far. This was my first mead and after lots of reading and research I made up this recipe. I would suggest getting a copy of the Complete Meadmaker by Ken Schramm to add to your collection of valuable wine, mead making resources.

Valley Brew’s Tupelo Vanilla Mead<?amespace prefix = o ns = "urnchemas-microsoft-comfficeffice" /><O></O>
<O></O>
<TABLE style="MARGIN: auto auto auto 4.65pt; WIDTH: 258pt; BORDER-COLLAPSE: collapse; mso-padding-alt: 0in 5.4pt 0in 5.4pt" cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 width=344 ="MsonormalTable"><T>
<T>
<TR style="HEIGHT: 12.75pt; mso-yfti-irow: 0">
<TD style="BORDER-RIGHT: #ece9d8; PADDING-RIGHT: 5.4pt; BORDER-TOP: #ece9d8; PADDING-LEFT: 5.4pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0in; BORDER-LEFT: #ece9d8; WIDTH: 258pt; PADDING-TOP: 0in; BORDER-BOTTOM: #ece9d8; HEIGHT: 12.75pt" vAlign=bottom noWrap width=344>
18 lbs <?amespace prefix = st1 ns = "urnchemas-microsoft-comfficearttags" /><ST1:CITY><ST1LACE>Tupelo</ST1LACE></ST1:CITY> Honey (not heated)<O></O></TD></TR>
<TR style="HEIGHT: 15pt; mso-yfti-irow: 1">
<TD style="BORDER-RIGHT: #ece9d8; PADDING-RIGHT: 5.4pt; BORDER-TOP: #ece9d8; PADDING-LEFT: 5.4pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0in; BORDER-LEFT: #ece9d8; WIDTH: 258pt; PADDING-TOP: 0in; BORDER-BOTTOM: #ece9d8; HEIGHT: 15pt" vAlign=bottom noWrap width=344>
2 tsp Yeast Nutrient<O></O>
2 tsp Yeast Energizer<O></O></TD></TR>
<TR style="HEIGHT: 15pt; mso-yfti-irow: 2">
<TD style="BORDER-RIGHT: #ece9d8; PADDING-RIGHT: 5.4pt; BORDER-TOP: #ece9d8; PADDING-LEFT: 5.4pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0in; BORDER-LEFT: #ece9d8; WIDTH: 258pt; PADDING-TOP: 0in; BORDER-BOTTOM: #ece9d8; HEIGHT: 15pt" vAlign=bottom noWrap width=344>
_6 oz chopped raisins<O></O>_
_10oz chopped dates<O></O>_</TD></TR>
<TR style="HEIGHT: 15pt; mso-yfti-irow: 3">
<TD style="BORDER-RIGHT: #ece9d8; PADDING-RIGHT: 5.4pt; BORDER-TOP: #ece9d8; PADDING-LEFT: 5.4pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0in; BORDER-LEFT: #ece9d8; WIDTH: 258pt; PADDING-TOP: 0in; BORDER-BOTTOM: #ece9d8; HEIGHT: 15pt" vAlign=bottom noWrap width=344>
10 grams Lalvin D-47 yeast<O></O></TD></TR>
<TR style="HEIGHT: 15pt; mso-yfti-irow: 4; mso-yfti-lastrow: yes">
<TD style="BORDER-RIGHT: #ece9d8; PADDING-RIGHT: 5.4pt; BORDER-TOP: #ece9d8; PADDING-LEFT: 5.4pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0in; BORDER-LEFT: #ece9d8; WIDTH: 258pt; PADDING-TOP: 0in; BORDER-BOTTOM: #ece9d8; HEIGHT: 15pt" vAlign=bottom noWrap width=344>
18Sweet Bourbon Vanilla Beans from <ST1:COUNTRY-REGIoN><ST1LACE>Uganda</ST1LACE></ST1:COUNTRY-REGIoN>
<ST1:COUNTRY-REGIoN><ST1LACE>Water to ~ 5 1/2 gals</ST1LACE></ST1:COUNTRY-REGIoN></TD></TR></T></T></TABLE>





Only warm the honey enough to get it out of the jars. I submerged them in hot water for 5-10 mins


Use dried fruit with no added sorbates


Mix honey,water,nutrient,energizer well in 6 gal carboy as primary


Re hydrated and then pitched yeast


Starting Specific Gravity was 1.112 @ 78 degrees (seems high but I wanted it to finish slightly sweet after yeast stopped at roughly 14% abv)


Stirred each day for 3 days and enjoyed the wonderful aromas


Removed airlock and had to put in blowoff tube since fermentation took off like a rocket and chunks of fruit was plugging it up!


Racked to secondary 5 gal carboy after 28 days and added vanilla beans that were sliced down the middle. Tasted and it is very harsh!


Racked again after 4 months and it is quite clear at this point. Added scraped seeds from another dozen vanilla beans to try and bringout thevanilla aroma and flavor. Specific gravity reading is 1.005 and taste has improved and is quite good. Amazing floral aromas from Tupelo Honey and clings to glass even after it is empty!


Plan to bottle soon and place away in cellar for aging at least one year.


From my research meads can not be rushed and need plenty of aging to become a great drink.


*Edited by: masta *


----------



## Hi In The Pines

ok, the young grasshopper here has a question. What is mead and how does it compare to beer?? i.e. taste and how its made? Thanks.


----------



## Hippie

Nothing is better than cold beer on a hot day.


----------



## Waldo

I Thank you Masta for meeting my need


of a recipe to make good mead.


Nothing I see is above my means


But I now must find me some vanilla beans


For I did a search in George's store


And if he had them, he has them no more.


I'll not worry nor will I fret


I know I can find em on the Internet.


The only thing I really fear


Is informing my daughter she must wait a year


to fulfill her passionate need


of having some of Daddy's Mead


----------



## masta

<DIV align=center>
<H3>Mead Styles</H3>
<UL>
<LI>*Mead* - made with honey, water and yeast optionally with flavoring ingredients 
<LI>*Hydromel* - the French name for mead 
<LI>*Sack mead* - a sweeter mead, with more honey 
<LI>*Melomel* - mead made with fruit or fruit juice 
<LI>*Metheglin* - mead made with spices and extracts 
<LI>*Morat* - mead made with mulberries 
<LI>*Pyment* - mead made with both honey and grapes 
<LI>*Hippocras* - honey, grapes, and spices 
<LI>*Cyser* - honey and apples or apple cider (apple juice in Europe) Can also be made with peach, cherry or pear cider 
<LI>*Braggot* - honey and malt, sort of a mead-beer 
<LI>*Oxymel* - mead mixed with wine vinegar 
<LI>*Rhodomel* - honey with attar, a rose petal distillate, or rose petals 
<LI>*Capsicumel* - honey with chile peppers 
<LI>*Omphacomel* - mead and verjuice, the juice of unripe grapes 
<LI>*T'ej* - T'ej is honey, water and hops. It is the national drink of Ethiopia, and has a unique taste </LI>[/list]


If you have never had mead I would suggest buying some and trying it first.


Mead is also called honey wine by some and it is much closer to wine than beer which is from malted barley,wheat or rice then fermented.


An excellent resource for learning about mead is:


http://www.gotmead.com/


A resource for learning about different types of honey and where you can purchase them:


http://www.honeylocator.com/


Waldo I bought my beans on ebay and the quality was good and the price was excellent:


http://stores.ebay.com/Vanilla-Cafe_W0QQssPageNameZviQ3asibQ 3astoreviewQQtZkm





Most folks can get local honey to make mead but sometimes you want a single source honey which can not be found locally. I have purchased some single source honey from folks in New Jersey and the product, price and customer service is excellent:


http://www.fruitwoodorchardshoney.com/index.html


----------



## masta

Here is a mead that many have made and it will be ready to drink fairly quickly....I hope to make some soon and try it:





*Joe Mattioli's Ancient Orange and Spice Mead

*It is so simple to make and you can make it without much equipment and with a multitude of variations. This could be a first Mead for the novice as it is almost fool proof. It is a bit unorthodox but it has never failed me or the friends I have shared it with. (snip)...it will be sweet, complex and tasty. 

1 gallon batch 


3 1/2 lbs Clover or your choice honey or blend (will finish sweet) 
1 Large orange (later cut in eights or smaller rind and all) 
1 small handful of raisins (25 if you count but more or less ok) 
1 stick of cinnamon 
1 whole clove ( or 2 if you like - these are potent critters) 
optional (a pinch of nutmeg and allspice )( very small ) 
1 teaspoon of Fleishmann’s bread yeast ( now don't get holy on me--- after all this is an ancient mead and that's all we had back then) 
Balance water to one gallon 

Process: 

Use a clean 1 gallon carboy 

Dissolve honey in some warm water and put in carboy 

Wash orange well to remove any pesticides and slice in eights --add orange (you can push em through opening big boy -- rinds included -- its ok for this mead -- take my word for it -- ignore the experts) 

Put in raisins, clove, cinnamon stick, any optional ingredients and fill to 3 inches from the top with cold water. ( need room for some foam -- you can top off with more water after the first few day frenzy) 

Shake the heck out of the jug with top on, of course. This is your sophisticated aeration process. 

When at room temperature in your kitchen, put in 1 teaspoon of bread yeast. ( No you don't have to rehydrate it first-- the ancients didn't even have that word in their vocabulary-- just put it in and give it a gentle swirl or not)(The yeast can fight for their own territory) 

Install water airlock. Put in dark place. It will start working immediately or in an hour. (Don't use grandma's bread yeast she bought years before she passed away in the 90's)( Wait 3 hours before you panic or call me) After major foaming stops in a few days add some water and then keep your hands off of it. (Don't shake it! Don't mess with them yeastees! Let them alone except its okay to open your cabinet to smell every once in a while. 

Racking --- Don't you dare 
additional feeding --- NO NO 
More stirring or shaking -- Your not listening, don't touch 

After 2 months and maybe a few days it will slow down to a stop and clear all by itself. (How about that) (You are not so important after all) Then you can put a hose in with a small cloth filter on the end into the clear part and siphon off the golden nectar. If you wait long enough even the oranges will sink to the bottom but I never waited that long. If it is clear it is ready. You don't need a cold basement. It does better in a kitchen in the dark. (Like in a cabinet) likes a little heat (70-80). If it didn't work out... you screwed up and didn't read my instructions (or used grandma's bread yeast she bought years before she passed away) . If it didn't work out then take up another hobby. Mead is not for you. It is too complicated. 
If you were successful, which I am 99% certain you will be, then enjoy your mead. When you get ready to make different mead you will probably have to unlearn some of these practices I have taught you, but hey--- This recipe and procedure works with these ingredients so don't knock it. It was your first mead. It was my tenth. Sometimes, even the experts can forget all they know and make good ancient mead.


----------



## masta

Batch #2 for me and it will also be bottled shortly and placed in the cellar for aging:


Valley Brew's Orange Blossom Cyser



<TABLE style="WIDTH: 289pt; BORDER-COLLAPSE: collapse" cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 width=385 border=0 xtr>
<COLGROUP>
<COL style="WIDTH: 289pt; mso-width-source: userset; mso-width-alt: 14080" width=385><T>
<T>
<TR style="HEIGHT: 15pt" height=20>
<TD style="BORDER-RIGHT: #ece9d8; BORDER-TOP: #ece9d8; BORDER-LEFT: #ece9d8; WIDTH: 289pt; BORDER-BOTTOM: #ece9d8; HEIGHT: 15pt" width=385 height=20 ="xl22">4 gals Natural Apple Juice (no sorbates)</TD></TR>
<TR style="HEIGHT: 12.75pt" height=17>
<TD style="BORDER-RIGHT: #ece9d8; BORDER-TOP: #ece9d8; BORDER-LEFT: #ece9d8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #ece9d8; HEIGHT: 12.75pt" height=17 ="xl22">14 lbs Orange Blossom Honey (not heated)</TD></TR>
<TR style="HEIGHT: 15pt" height=20>
<TD style="BORDER-RIGHT: #ece9d8; BORDER-TOP: #ece9d8; BORDER-LEFT: #ece9d8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #ece9d8; HEIGHT: 15pt" height=20 ="xl22">3 tabs Yeast Nutrient, 2 tsp Yeast Energizer</TD></TR>
<TR style="HEIGHT: 15pt" height=20>
<TD style="BORDER-RIGHT: #ece9d8; BORDER-TOP: #ece9d8; BORDER-LEFT: #ece9d8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #ece9d8; HEIGHT: 15pt" height=20 ="xl22">


7.5 oz California raisins, 5 oz California dates</TD></TR>
<TR style="HEIGHT: 15pt" height=20>
<TD style="BORDER-RIGHT: #ece9d8; BORDER-TOP: #ece9d8; BORDER-LEFT: #ece9d8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #ece9d8; HEIGHT: 15pt" height=20 ="xl22">5 oz Zante Currents, 3 oz dried cherries, 3 oz dried cranberries</TD></TR>
<TR style="HEIGHT: 15pt" height=20>
<TD style="BORDER-RIGHT: #ece9d8; BORDER-TOP: #ece9d8; BORDER-LEFT: #ece9d8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #ece9d8; HEIGHT: 15pt" height=20 ="xl23">


10 grams Lalvin D-47 yeast (rehydrated and pitched after 15 mins)


Honey was not heated just warmed up to get it out of the container. The fruit (no SO2) was chopped up very well and added after make up was complete and SG was taken.


Starting SG 1.128 @ 78 Degrees</TD></TR></T></TABLE>


----------



## rgecaprock

Thanks Masta,


I will also try one of your recipes...looks so simple, maybe this weekend....What is the alcohol outcome....?


I guess I should have Curtis bring a bottle home from Spec's(wine store where he works) and give it a try..never had it.


Ramona


----------



## masta

Based on the alcohol tolerance of the yeast used I believe the alcohol is roughly 14% on the two batches I posted here...it is quite hot to the taste now but I hope it will mellow with aging.


I know 4 months in the carboy made a world of difference in the taste from the initial racking to secondary.


One point to remember with making mead is that honey does not contain the nutrients like grapes do,so you must add enough for the yeast to do it's job. I used the dried fruits also for this reason as they add nutrients for the yeast and also another level of flavor I hope!


----------



## Waldo

Thanks Masta....I am going to give it a whirl and see what happens. May even come up with a gasoline alternative


----------



## Waldo

Startedmy Mead this morning. Decided to go with the "Plain Jane" Mead to get a feel/taste for unadulterated Mead. The SG was 1.095 at a temperature of 85 degrees, after I got all the ingrediants from the recipe mixed up. I will check it again in the morning and adjust if necessary before I pitch the yeast ( Red Star Cote des Blancs) "Which George sent to me at no chargewith an order I had already placed"


----------



## rgecaprock

Hi Waldo,


What time do you get up in the morning?


What kind of honey did you use? What container is that? Looks good, I think I'm really going to enjoy mine around Thanksgiving or Christmas. I only made one gallon as a test....will probably wish I made 6...... Did you start a label yet?


Ramona


----------



## Waldo

Hey Ramona. I am up every day between 2-2:30AM. Sometimes a little earlier but never later. The honey was acquired from a family friend who has been in the businessfor years. The container is a food storage container I picked up at Wal-Mart. It works great for fermenting small batches. I drilled a hole in the top to attach an airlock. As for the label, keeping in mind taht I am making this for my daughter, here are the two I have designed and cant decide which to use. I think I will go with the consenus of feedback from forum members.














Hopethe Meadturns out good!!


----------



## rgecaprock

Waldo,


I like the one with the honeycomb. Your daughter looks very pretty.


I'm sure she would like either one. What type of pollen is the honey from. I used Texas Cotton Blossom...had a very distinct fragrance because of the specific flowers.


My dad is a beekeeper and has been since I was a little girl in W.Va. he has about 18 hives.He ususally takes it to the flea market and sells it...I have pictures of us helping him process it. I will have to find those and post them. He makes wine too. I'll ask him to send me some honey......but he is a procrastinator so if I ask for it now I might get it for a Chrlistmas present. Here is one picture.






He has all kinds of fruit trees and grape vines in the fenced area....his orchard...





here we are making apple butter in a 100 year old copper pot. It was great!!!!





Cabin in WVA in winter. He has 3 ponds and raises rainbow and brown trout from eggs. He also built a weir(sp) where the trout can swim to and lay eggs themselves. I miss this place!! He taps maple trees too...


*Edited by: rgecaprock *


----------



## Waldo

I am sure it is a mixture of different pollens Ramona but it is primarily clover. Autrey has probably 125 hives currently. His honey is carried by most of the grocery stores in Malvern and he ships it all over the country. 


Very cool pics of the cabin and everything else. Ireally like the one making the apple butter Mmmmmmmm. Does your Dad still make it? What ever posessed you to leave that place


----------



## rgecaprock

Had to leave.....to make a living and as it turns out "this" is not "living"......lol.


----------



## Waldo

Pitched the yeast on 9/11 at 2:00 am and as of this evening, no sign of fermentation yet. I understand that it could take as much as 4 days for fermenting to begin with mead so will patiently wait and see what happens.


----------



## Hippie

Should have made a starter!


----------



## rgecaprock

Waldo,


What recipe did you use?


----------



## Waldo

Used the recipe here on Georges site


http://www.finevinewines.com/Honey_wine_sweet_Recipe.htm


Going to try a starter Hippie and see if I can ger her going


----------



## masta

I checked the recipe and didn't see any yeast nutrient...I would add 1/2 to 3/4 of a tsp and stir well when pitching the starter.


----------



## Waldo

Thanks All. I added the Nutrient, Stirred the stuffings out of it and pitched the starter. I also moved it from the cool dining room to the warmer wash room to see if that would help it along too. 


I will not get discouraged..I WILL MAKE MEAD!!













*Edited by: Waldo *


----------



## Hippie

Alright! A good attitude is very important! Good catch on the nutrient, Scott!


----------



## Waldo

Will I ever be able to meet the need


of making my daughter some lovely Mead?


You #*$%# betcha I will. I got home this evening and .....NOTHING !


No fermenting, no bubbling, just sitting there



it's arse off at me. OK Waldo, what's wrong here? I checkedthe SG and it is now at a whopping 1.100.



I know my initial reading was correct because I checked and double checked it. So now what?I stirred the mustandracked off half of what was in my fermenter into a gallon jug and added water until I got the SG down to 1.090. I then did the same to the other half remaining in my fermenter. I then began me two more starters. One with EC118 in about a half a cup of welches grape juiceand the other with another pack of the original Cote des Blancs in another jar with a half cup of the Welches. My plans now are to continue feeding the starters until tomorrow evening and if the Mead in my fermenter and Jug have not begun fermenting then I will add the starters to them and go from there. 


If no fermenting has begun by tomorrow evening should I go ahead and add more nutrient and energizer to both batches before I pitch the starters or do I need to be doing something totally different here?


----------



## masta

Whoa big fella….lets take a few steps back and look at the recipe. <?amespace prefix = o ns = "urnchemas-microsoft-comfficeffice" /><?:NAMESPACE PREFIX = O /><O></O>
<O></O>
*2 Campden, crush *I personally don’t think any sulfite is needed when making mead since honey is naturally antibiotic and therefore choose not to add any in the beginning. Having said that 2 campden tabs is twice as much as you should add to any must honey or grape. The standard is 1 tab per gallon which should yield 50 ppm. This amount of sulfite should not impede the starting of the yeast since most of today’s strains are tolerant of fairly high levels.<O></O>
<O></O>
*I rule this out as a problem.<O></O>*
*<O></O>*
*Honey, Tannin and water are ruled out and the SG of 1.100 is certainly not too high to prevent fermentation.<O></O>*
*<O></O>*
That leaves the acid additions which changes the pH of the must. My first guess is that the pH is too low which is lethal to the yeast. The correct range should be between 3.7 and 4.6. From all of my research I would suggest to never adjust the pH of honey when starting since the pH can vary and it always can be adjusted later on after fermentation if it is needed to balance the sweetness. <O></O>
<O></O>
Do you have a way to accurately measure the pH?<O></O>


----------



## Waldo

All I have Masta are the strips I got from George. I just checked it with them at it is around 3.4


----------



## masta

Ok....since the strips are not all that accurate I would say it could be even lower which most likely is the problem.


Now we have to raise the pH to at least 3.8 with some calcium carbonate. Go easy and only add 1/2 tsp at a time and stir then test.


http://www.finevinewines.com/ProdDetA.asp?PartNumber=7325A


----------



## Waldo

With a little over 1/2 tsp I am now at 3.8 with the strips


----------



## masta

I would let it rest~ 24 hrs and see if you have any signs of fermentation tomorrow night. Not sure if the yeast dies off or just becomes inactive due to the pH.


My guess is that you will still have enough viable yeast cells left after pitching 10 grams already that they will wake up and get to work.


PS: I feel somewhat responsible not catching the acid addition and lack of nutrient onthe recipe when you started it. I have already discussedwith George about replacing the mead recipes post on his site with better versions.


Not to worry my friend


masta will stick with you till the end


you will fulfill the longing need


to make your daughter a very nice mead*Edited by: masta *


----------



## Waldo

Will let it rest until tonight


And hope for a bubbling, foaming sight


That will continue on for days and nights


----------



## Waldo

Got home this evening and no activity at all in either container of the must. And, the starter pooped out. What is going on? I know my temps are within desired parameters. The SG is where it should be and the PH should be close. The only thing I can possibly think of is the yeast. I know it is fresh but it just kinda hit me..I have been taking it right out of the refrigrator and pitching it. Does this matter?


Other than that I am klueless


----------



## MedPretzel

I have no experience with mead, but maybe you're killing your yeast because of the low temps in the fridge....














I could be wrong, but check the temp scale for the particular yeast you are using. You might need to knit them some scarves and gloves.


----------



## Waldo

From a previous post by Masta:


Not to worry my friend


masta will stick with you till the end


you will fulfill the longing need


to make your daughter a very nice mead


And Scott is true to his word. Our game plan on the phone with Scott this evening was to once again make another starter. This time with 90 degree water only to begin with, ( AsScott explained, Ijust wanted torehydrate the yeast at this point) then,pitch both containers of my must into a larger primary fermenter, stir it good. Readjust the PH if necessary and then add a small ammount of the must to the new starter. After the starter got going good I would then add it to the primary and see what happened from there. I got my primary cleaned and sanitized. gotThe new starter going and when I took the towel off thatI had over the two containers of Must......


----------



## Waldo

Martina...I think I have read that it is best to store the yeast in the fridge but I am going to research it more now. Masta did not seem to think that the practice was a problem.


----------



## MedPretzel

Oh, I misunderstood -- I thought you put the *starter* in the fridge.... 





Sorry,





My bad!


----------



## Hippie

Yep, yeast should be stored in the fridge, and allowed to warm up before making the starter or pitching. I get it out of the fridge as soon as I begin starting a must so it is the same tempas the room when it is pitched. I also turn it over now and then as it lays on the counter and knead it a little. George and I were talking about this very thang just the other day. I have been meaning to bring it up on the forum for months, and keep forgetting. Sorry Waldo.


----------



## Waldo

Martina. I read on one site where they actually advocated putting the Mead in the frige or outdoors in the cold to fix a stuck fermentation.


http://www.gotmead.com/making-mead/problem-solving.shtml


*Stuck Fermentation* - Sometimes your mead will just stop fermenting. It happens.Your mead will bubble along merrily for a few weeks, then just stop. This is where a hydrometer comes in handy. Mead fermentation wants to go towards the zero mark (we'll be adding pages on measuring alcohol potential and on how to see when your mead is done soon). A carbonated mead is a sign of a secondary fermentation, and an invitation to bottle bombs. 


Perhaps your yeast is old, or the temperature is not right, or the nutrients have run out, or the yeast has just died. You can tell from taste if the mead is low-alcohol and overly sweet if this is the case. 
<UL>
<LI>If your yeast is old, set up a new starter with new yeast and pitch that into the batch. It should start bubbling up again in a day or so. 
<LI>If the temperature is too cold (&lt;40 d F), move the carboy, wrap it in an electric blanket, build a box with a light bulb in the bottom, or move to southern California. 
<LI>*If the mead has a decent alcohol content (around 8%), then try shocking it. Turn it out in the cold (or refridgerate it) and forget it for a while. When you bring it back in, it may start to re-ferment. (*You may also just fish out the ice, and then you have a fortified mead!) </LI>[/list]


----------



## Waldo

Thanks Hippie..I have now carved another notch in my stick of wine making skills. I was keeping it in the fridge but not letting it warm up. Just snatching it out, ripping er open and chunking it in.


----------



## masta

Interesting reading on the stuck fermentation Waldo...but I would be curious as to why chilling it and then warming it back up would help restart a stuck fermentation.







A active fermentation of honey stops for a reason and from my research, it most likely is a lack of nutrients (available nitrogen) or a drop of pH below the low threshold of a good environment. Honey is not stable like grape must is and yeast produce various organic acids themselves during the process of metabolizing the sugars which can cause the pH to drift low.


----------



## masta

So Waldo how is the mead doing? I am bummed since I ordered some honey and UPS managed to damage most of the shipment



but I hope to get the replacement next week and start a few new batches.


I will be bottling two of my meads tomorrow...the Tupelo Vanilla and Orange Blossom Cyser.


----------



## Waldo

I am keeping my fingers crossed Masta. The fermentation has slowed back down considerably but I am not sure that that is not normal with mead. From what I am reading and understanding, the fermentation is not as prominent as what we are accustomed to seeing. I am going to take another SG this morning. Give her another good stirring and add the extra 1/2 lb. of Honey we discussed.


----------



## Waldo

Added the additional 1/2 lb Honey to my Must yesterday. Stirred it in good, sang it a little lullaby and put the lid back on it. Also made another potential label for my daughters lovely mead.





Well, it will not post the picture Gerorge/Masta. It says that it is "Done but with errors" 


*Edited by: Waldo *


----------



## masta

Not sure why you couldn't post a picture...try again. Did you add the 1/4 tsp of nutrient with the honey?


----------



## Waldo

Just tried again and same error message. I e-mailed the picture to George.


I did add the nutrient


----------



## Waldo

Fermentation is going strong again. Checked the SG and it is at 1.020


----------



## Waldo

Checked SG this evening at it is at .095 so I racked it from fermnter into two one gallon carboys. Color is almost that of pink grapefruit and I had a taste of it and



. Put airlocks on themand put them in the corner to age for a while longer. Hopefully by next racking the boquet and taste will be greatly improved. 


Should I stabilize it or just let it rock along*Edited by: Waldo *


----------



## masta

Let them rest in the corner for the next few months and don't do anything with them. Don't expect the taste to improve for quite a while...like 6 months! Two of the batches I just bottled I started back in March and the other was started in January.


----------



## Waldo

They are now out of sight and out of mind...well..out of sight anyway


----------



## Waldo

Finally got my label for the Mead for my daughter to post









*Edited by: Waldo *


----------



## Hippie




----------



## Waldo

Armed with the knowledge I acquired withmy first batch of Mead I went ahead and started me another gallon batch last Sunday(while my first batch is aging) just tosee what the differences might be . I will say that this batch might not prove in the long run to be any better or worse than the first but it is definately getting off to a better start.











I would attribute the better success with fermentation on this batch with the making and nurturing of a good starterand adding it to my must instead of just pitching the yeast as I did with the first batch.





*Edited by: Waldo *


----------



## smurfe

masta said:


> Here is a mead that many have made and it will be ready to drink fairly quickly....I hope to make some soon and try it:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *Joe Mattioli's Ancient Orange and Spice Mead
> 
> *It is so simple to make and you can make it without much equipment and with a multitude of variations. This could be a first Mead for the novice as it is almost fool proof. It is a bit unorthodox but it has never failed me or the friends I have shared it with. (snip)...it will be sweet, complex and tasty.
> 
> 1 gallon batch
> 
> 
> 3 1/2 lbs Clover or your choice honey or blend (will finish sweet)
> 1 Large orange (later cut in eights or smaller rind and all)
> 1 small handful of raisins (25 if you count but more or less ok)
> 1 stick of cinnamon
> 1 whole clove ( or 2 if you like - these are potent critters)
> optional (a pinch of nutmeg and allspice )( very small )
> 1 teaspoon of Fleishmann’s bread yeast ( now don't get holy on me--- after all this is an ancient mead and that's all we had back then)
> Balance water to one gallon
> 
> Process:
> 
> Use a clean 1 gallon carboy
> 
> Dissolve honey in some warm water and put in carboy
> 
> Wash orange well to remove any pesticides and slice in eights --add orange (you can push em through opening big boy -- rinds included -- its ok for this mead -- take my word for it -- ignore the experts)
> 
> Put in raisins, clove, cinnamon stick, any optional ingredients and fill to 3 inches from the top with cold water. ( need room for some foam -- you can top off with more water after the first few day frenzy)
> 
> Shake the heck out of the jug with top on, of course. This is your sophisticated aeration process.
> 
> When at room temperature in your kitchen, put in 1 teaspoon of bread yeast. ( No you don't have to rehydrate it first-- the ancients didn't even have that word in their vocabulary-- just put it in and give it a gentle swirl or not)(The yeast can fight for their own territory)
> 
> Install water airlock. Put in dark place. It will start working immediately or in an hour. (Don't use grandma's bread yeast she bought years before she passed away in the 90's)( Wait 3 hours before you panic or call me) After major foaming stops in a few days add some water and then keep your hands off of it. (Don't shake it! Don't mess with them yeastees! Let them alone except its okay to open your cabinet to smell every once in a while.
> 
> Racking --- Don't you dare
> additional feeding --- NO NO
> More stirring or shaking -- Your not listening, don't touch
> 
> After 2 months and maybe a few days it will slow down to a stop and clear all by itself. (How about that) (You are not so important after all) Then you can put a hose in with a small cloth filter on the end into the clear part and siphon off the golden nectar. If you wait long enough even the oranges will sink to the bottom but I never waited that long. If it is clear it is ready. You don't need a cold basement. It does better in a kitchen in the dark. (Like in a cabinet) likes a little heat (70-80). If it didn't work out... you screwed up and didn't read my instructions (or used grandma's bread yeast she bought years before she passed away) . If it didn't work out then take up another hobby. Mead is not for you. It is too complicated.
> If you were successful, which I am 99% certain you will be, then enjoy your mead. When you get ready to make different mead you will probably have to unlearn some of these practices I have taught you, but hey--- This recipe and procedure works with these ingredients so don't knock it. It was your first mead. It was my tenth. Sometimes, even the experts can forget all they know and make good ancient mead.




This is an excellent recipe. I just bottled my first little batch last night and all I can say is WOW, what a treat. It by far exceeded my expectations. It was easy, cheap and fun to make. 


I just wish I had some 375 ml bottles as this is really sweet and will be drank in small doses. I got 4 750's out of my gallon batch. It was really fun to make something from scratch that turned out so good.


Smurfe


----------



## Waldo

Thanks Smurfe...I am going to give this one a try


----------



## Angell Wine

I'm going to try a pear-mead wine in abouta month. pears are in the freezer right now. my problem is finding a recipe. do I use a pear recipe andsubstitute honey for sugar or find a mead recipe and dump the pears in with the must?


----------



## masta

How much and what kind of pears do you have? I have plenty of links and will find a recipe for you to try.


----------



## Angell Wine

wild east pears:About 5 lbs: they fit in a 1 gal zip lock bag


----------



## Angell Wine

We where in a Field look for some cows that got loose the other day when i came across this pear tree ,so I pick some. Not has sweet as the store bought ones but good anuff for a country boy so hey lets make some wine out it. i really don't know what kind they are


----------



## masta

Ok...5 lbs of pears in 3 gals of Melomel (which is the correct term for mead with fruit)should give you a medium fruit character. You will need a 3 gal carboy and do you have access to any local honey? I would suggest a light honey such as clover or tupelo so the pear flavor doesn't get overpowered by a strong honey.


----------



## Angell Wine

got everything i need but tell me more about light honey. Could you water it down to get a good sg to start with. Wehave local honey producershere but like wine it changes year to year.


----------



## Waldo

My first two gallons of Mead ( the twin jugs on the left in picture)are clearing up nicely. I do not understand the color difference between them and the gallon I started recently which is the one on the far left. 


The other wines in the picture ( from right moving left) are a gallon of my Muscadine/Grape, Blueberry, Two Strawberry and then my 3 Meads


----------



## MedPretzel

It's hard to see the color difference in the meads from the picture, in my opinion.





Your wines look great, but you might want to rack the blueberry and the twin-meads? Looks like sediment is forming? Or does it look worse on the pic than it is in real life? (I know that sometimes sediment looks worse on pics than in real)





M.


----------



## Waldo

Try one more time Martina....Latest batch of Mead is jug on far left. Mead I was comparing them to are the two jugs next to it. I hope now that I have clarified that you can tell a difference in the color. 


I don't think the sediment inthe Meadis any problem as Masta told me when I racked them to put them aside and dont touch them for 6 months. I will be racking the Muscadine/Grape today.*Edited by: Waldo *


----------



## masta

Meads are looking good Waldo and how many times have you racked them...once from primary?


What type of honey did you use?


----------



## masta

Steve,


I suggested a lighter honey only because dark colored honey often has a very strong flavor profile such as buckwheat. Up here in the Northeast the honey darkens as the season progresses due to the pollen available to the bees.


I have had good luck using 3 lbs of honey per gallon with Lalvin D-47 yeast. This combo works well to leave some residual sweetness to the finished mead without having to back sweeten.


Adding fruit to the primary after fermentation slows and SG drops to 1.020 seems to be the preferred method to help maintain the fruit flavor.


----------



## Waldo

masta said:


> Meads are looking good Waldo and how many times have you racked them...once from primary?
> 
> 
> What type of honey did you use?




The two twins have been racked once from primary and were clover honey. 


The second batch as of Sunday was at 1.010 and has not been racked yet. It was a darker honey that the first batch but not sure what type.


----------



## Waldo

Second batch of Mead continues to clear and the taste was great when I racked it this morning. I now have my first batch of "Marbled" Mead


----------



## Hippie

Wow! Nice shootin marble!


----------



## Waldo

Now dammit Hippie you sposed to be looking at my Mead not dem marbles. They don't even have no taste


----------



## Hippie

Man, when I was a kid we always had pocketfuls of marbles and would have all day tournaments and always trading and coveting others' marbles.


----------



## Waldo

I remember those days well Hippie. The ole big boys we called "Log Rollers" Everyone always had their favorite "shooter" and what a coup it was to win someones favorite


----------



## RAMROD

Boy can I remember that!


----------



## Hippie




----------



## Waldo

Trying to recall all the different marble games. I kknow there was one where there was a series of holes in a straight line and you shot from hole to hole, trying to keep your opponets marble knocked away from the holes. The other was a big ring drawn in the dirt and any marbles you could knock out of the ring with your shooter was yours.That is if you were playing for keeps.


----------



## rgecaprock

Us girls just played with them because they were pretty!! We pretended that they were valuable jewels!


Ramona


----------



## Waldo

Some say I have "Lost My Marbles" but I think I still have a few left somewhere. Just can't remember where they are.


----------



## PolishWineP

Look in the carboy, Waldo! There's your lost marbles but you can't have them back until the mead is done!




Both the mead and the marbles look great!


----------



## Waldo

Lets see now, that would go something like:


"* I really Mead my marbles back"



*


----------



## Vaughn

(groaning loudly) 


Waldo, stick to poetry.






Is it my imagination, or is the alcohol from from honey less "harsh" than from cane sugar? I have made two blueberry batches. One, a wine, with 2 lbs. of cane sugar. The other, a melomel (blueberry mead), with 2 lbs. of honey. I believe I came up with a similar starting SG, and the alcohol is definitely there. But the wine batch with the cane sugar starts out with a strong alcohol taste and smell(like isopropyl) and then mellows out with age. The melomel was not like that. It was smooth from the very start.


----------



## masta

Very interesting Vaughn.......


----------



## Vaughn

masta said:


> Very interesting Vaughn.......




Are you saying it IS my imagination?


----------



## rgecaprock

Hi Vaughn,


I have noticed that too. I made the Ancient Orange Mead that Masta posted and although it was made with bread yeast it was certainly very smooth. I have some Earl Grey Mead that is still in the carboy clearing and it seems very smoothalso so far and I used wine yeast, Montrachet I think. But then if you taste a spoon of sugar(simple syrup)then a spoon of honey you definitly get a sence of silkyness from the honey that just isn't there with the sugar. Maybe it has to do with the flowers!!!






Ramona


----------



## masta

Vaughn said:


> masta said:
> 
> 
> 
> Very interesting Vaughn.......
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Are you saying it IS my imagination?
Click to expand...



No I am not saying that...lol. I would think it would be quite the opposite since mead typically needs to age quite a long time but that is what happens when you assume. I find it interesting you and Romona both found this to be true. Maybe this will help my apple cranberry wine since i added 2 lbs of honey to it...cool!


Thanks for sharing more facts to ponder when I lay awake at night thinking about empty carboys!


----------



## Vaughn

masta said:


> Thanks for sharing more facts to ponder when I lay awake at night thinking about empty carboys!




Sorry, I tend to wax philosophicalwhen my carboy is empty. 


(here I go) So, is there any difference in the type of alcohol produced by using different methods (i.e. different yeast, different sugars). It would seem that if the sugar used is slightly different chemically, then the alcohol produced would also be different.Maybe it is not the alcohol that makes the difference, but there definitely is a difference. 


I may just resort to honey for all my fruit wines.


----------



## Waldo

Im a gonna just sit back..sip me glass of Muscadine and just watch this one


----------



## peterCooper

Ethanol is C2H5OH. doesn't matter where it comes from.
Sugar is in the form Cn(H20)n with the simplest being glucose C6H12O6
So from 1 molecule of sugar we get 
- 2 lots of C2H5OH= C4H10O2H2 which means we've lost 2C and 4O, 
effectively 2 molecules of CO2

We can derive ethanol from other sugars (fructose, maltose) The alcohol 
is no different and the CO2 is no different but the left overs, ahh, that's 
where the fun begins, and I think that's what you're experience in terms 
of the smoothness. not a difference in alcohol but a difference in the 
remains.

Still if it tastes better using honey then go for it.


----------



## Vaughn

See, now, I knew there was a reasonable answer for this. And whatever these leftovers are eventually dissipate I presume or become other chemical compounds during the aging process?


Honey has more complex qualities than pure cane sugar does. Honey can be used in and of itself to make a wine (mead). If we tried to make a wine with just cane sugar, we would find the results less satisfying. Are there sugars that we can use to create fruit wines that more closely resemble the sugars found naturally in fruit?


----------



## masta

Here is a basic composition of honey:








Source: http://www.nhb.org/foodtech/tgloss.html*Edited by: masta *


----------



## peterCooper

Forgot to say...
Sucrose is a combination (chemically combined, not just sat next to) of 
glucose and fructose. 
Maltose is a combination of glucose and glucose chains.
Fructose is what you seem most prevalent in fruit. (Fruct means fruit)


----------



## masta

Thanks Professor...it is starting to make sense now and I can see I need to set up an experiment in the lab!


Thanks


----------



## Harry

Ok now that this is settled whats the difference in lite and dark honey? Here in Alvin Tx the honey is dark. I made a 3 gallon batch of spiced orange and its beginning to clear but not the same as the clover honey (store bought).


Harry


----------



## Vaughn

Peter and/or Masta,


So what is in cane sugar? Is it mostly sucros?


----------



## masta

White sugar is essentially pure sucrose and there is no difference between that derived from cane and that from beet. Different manufacturers produce crystals of different sizes however and this leads to some apparent differences. Smaller crystals dissolve more readily and might therefore appear to be sweeter because none is left at the bottom of the cup and they seem sweeter on the tongue if eaten alone. Similarly smaller crystals have more surfaces per spoonful and appear whiter than larger crystals. [Having said that, some white sugars are less white than others: it depends on how much processing the manufacturer applies.]


Source: http://www.sucrose.com/home.html*Edited by: masta *


----------



## masta

*Sweet..!!



*


*Relation of Color to Composition **1/
JONATHAN W. WHITE, JR.*
Eastern Regional Research Laboratory
Eastern Utilization Research and Development Division
Agricultural Research Service, United States Department of Agriculture
Philadelphia 18, Pennsylvania

*Number seven in a series of ten articles on the different honeys of America.*


Color of honey is its most quickly noted characteristic, and it has long been used to form quick opinions of its other characteristics. Many believe that the strength (or desirability?) of flavor can be inferred from its color. It is known that some analytical characteristics of honey vary with its color. Schuette and his colleagues at Wisconsin found that the darker honeys are richer in ash, potassium, sodium, magnesium, iron, copper, manganese, chlorine and sulfur. They also found that enzyme contents of dark honeys are higher than of light honeys.

*Honeys Grouped According to Color
*In our recently concluded analytical survey of American honey, we grouped all honey samples into 13 color groups, representing the light and dark halves of the seven USDA color classes for honey. As was done for the granulation data, described in the preceding article in this series, code numbers from 0 to 12 were assigned to the groups, ranging from "0" for the light part of water white to "12" for dark. All analyses were then grouped and averaged, to give the average analysis for all honeys falling in each of the color groups. These averages were examined for trends and statistical analysis was used to find out if the trends that appeared to be present were actually significant.


*Significant Differences Between Light and Dark Honeys
*When this was done, many of the compositional factors were found to change in a regular way when darker honeys were studied. As we progress from light to darker groups of honey samples, the following factors decrease, i.e. they are higher in light than in dark honey (all are listed in order of decreasing significance*2/*):


<TABLE cellSpacing=2 cellPadding=6 width="100%">
<T>
<TR>
<TD width="100%">Sucrose
Lactone/Acid Ratio
Dextrose
Active Acidity
Levulose
Granulating Tendency</TD></TR></T></TABLE>

These composition factors were found to be higher in darker honeys than in lighter:


<TABLE cellSpacing=2 cellPadding=6 width="100%">
<T>
<TR>
<TD width="100%">Total Acid
Free Acid
Nitrogen
Ash
Undetermined Material
Maltose</TD></TR></T></TABLE>

This is further substantiation of the fact that darker honeys are richer in minerals (ash) than lighter ones. They are also much higher in total acidity, but are lower in dextrose and levulose and have a lessened tendency to granulate.

*Color of Honey Over the United States
*Recently an exhibit was made up showing typical honey samples arranged with a map of the United States. It could be seen that honey of the East and South was darker and that as one went westward, honey lightened considerably. This is not a new observation, but it is of interest that when all of our honey samples were classified by state of origin and further by area of the United States, this was again shown. This may be seen by the following values. Here the code numbers for color were averaged. Whether this procedure would give the same value for color as would be obtained by blending the samples is debatable, but we feel that it gives a good approximation.

Thus, honey from the East and South in general is darker than the national average while that from the north central and intermountain area is lighter.


<TABLE cellSpacing=2 cellPadding=0 width="100%">
<T>
<TR>
<TD colSpan=3>
<HR align=left noShade SIZE=1>
</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD width="33%">



<CENTER>*Area*</CENTER></TD>
<TD width="22%">



<CENTER>*No. of Samples*</CENTER></TD>
<TD width="45%">



<CENTER>*Average Color*</CENTER></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD width="33%">North Atlantic States</TD>
<TD width="22%">



<CENTER>82</CENTER></TD>
<TD width="45%">Light half Ex. Light Amber</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD width="33%">East North Central</TD>
<TD width="22%">



<CENTER>47</CENTER></TD>
<TD width="45%">Light half White</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD width="33%">West North Central</TD>
<TD width="22%">



<CENTER>63</CENTER></TD>
<TD width="45%">Light half White</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD width="33%">South Atlantic</TD>
<TD width="22%">



<CENTER>86</CENTER></TD>
<TD width="45%">Dark half Ex. Light Amber</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD width="33%">South Central</TD>
<TD width="22%">



<CENTER>68</CENTER></TD>
<TD width="45%">Light half Ex. Light Amber</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD width="33%">Intermountain West</TD>
<TD width="22%">



<CENTER>52</CENTER></TD>
<TD width="45%">Light half Extra White</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD width="33%">West</TD>
<TD width="22%">



<CENTER>104</CENTER></TD>
<TD width="45%">Dark half White</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD width="33%">All samples</TD>
<TD width="22%">



<CENTER>502</CENTER></TD>
<TD width="45%">Dark half White</TD></TR></T></TABLE>


<HR align=left noShade SIZE=1>


*1/* This is one in a series of articles describing a large-scale study of the composition of honeys from over the United States. Complete data interpretation and conclusions will appear in a forthcoming Department of Agriculture publication.

*2/* All factors shown gave F values in the analysis of variance for regression exceeding the critical value for the 1% probability level.


----------



## masta

This link hasplenty of info and links on everything you need to know about Honey:


http://www.honey.com/index.html


----------



## masta

Plese review all information and there will be a test on Monday!!!


----------



## Harry

Many thanks Masta


That answered my question really good , I have a friend that clames my dark honey is better in his B-B-Q sauce than any he tried 


Harry


----------



## PolishWineP

Oh man! Now I have to study!




Will the test be available on line all day? I sure hope so!


This is great information, Scott! We are fortunate that we buy honey from the honey man in our neighborhood, and he has a couple of varieties. I think this is info suitable for printing and adding to our manual!



Thanks for all the great work!


----------



## Waldo

Well, I racked my Meads yesterday morning, They were actually tasting pretty danged good. I stabilized them with Campden and Sorbate, degassed them and now they are in a huge ice chest in my storage building with some other gallon batches to bulk age through the winter. The gallon carboy on the right is the Apple wine I made using the AppleCider I got fromWal-Mart


----------



## PolishWineP

Waldo, those sure look nice! What are the other 2 meads?


----------



## Waldo

Joes Ancient Martina....I kept them inside and hopefully might have a taste of them on New Years day. *Edited by: Waldo *


----------



## masta

I agree the mead looks great...nice job Waldo!


----------



## Waldo

Well, it was finally Mead bottling time today at The Cats Meow Winery. Not sure exactly how it should look but appeared to be quite clear to me. At least there was no further sediment in the jugs since my last racking in December.

















The mead was very smooth, retained the honey flavor and I even got to use my floor corker for the first time. 














I think I was punching the corks in a little too far but I guess that will not matter. Hope not anyway. Will have to play with the adjustment a little to get it right. Here is the label I designed for the Mead. I named itafter my Daughter who initiated this batch to begin with.








My daughter will finally fulfill her need, to try some of Daddys Mead.








Thank you Masta for all of your help in getting me going on my first attempt at Mead.


----------



## Harry

Waldo 


Man that mead looks really good. And your label is very Good.


Keep up the good work 


Harry


----------



## masta

Looking great Waldo and glad it worked out well...Sherrie should be pleased with her daddy's mead! I bottled 3 batches of mead myself yesterday but they all are young and need much more time in the cellar.


I would definitely adjust your corker so the top of the cork is almost even or slightly below the top of the bottle. The reason I say this is that some bottles have a short neck so you could lose some the sealing surface if the cork is down too low. Depending on what type of cork screw youuseyou also run the risk of pushing the cork into the bottle when trying to open.


----------



## Waldo

Thanks masta...Using nothing but Georges corks


----------

