# It's Happening!!!



## Boatboy24 (Aug 13, 2019)

Got the email from Washington Winemakers that price list and order forms should be out in about a week. Current estimated delivery is Sept 28th, but they're saying the grapes are about a week behind last year. IIRC, I picked up my grapes that last weekend in September last year. Either way, I've got some bottling to do in the next few weeks.


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## jgmann67 (Aug 14, 2019)

I’m seeing a bottle swap in our future. [emoji1303]


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## mainshipfred (Aug 14, 2019)

I'm getting something from them but the way the Lanza PV and Washington State CF turned out last year, plus local grapes it will probably be a small order.


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## NorCal (Aug 14, 2019)

I’m seeing the same in Nor Cal Sierra Foothills, grapes are 1-2 weeks behind last year. Lots of rain in the winter and a somewhat cool summer (until now). Some nice cool nights, so hopefully there is some acid left in the berries this year.


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## mainshipfred (Aug 14, 2019)

NorCal said:


> I’m seeing the same in Nor Cal Sierra Foothills, grapes are 1-2 weeks behind last year. Lots of rain in the winter and a somewhat cool summer (until now). Some nice cool nights, so hopefully there is some acid left in the berries this year.



From the other thread and what I've been reading the ideal Viognier should be 23 brix and pH 3.3


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## NorCal (Aug 14, 2019)

Last year we were at 23.7, 3.5 pH. The higher pH is typical for us in the Sierra Foothills due to the warmer (than Napa) evenings.


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## mainshipfred (Aug 14, 2019)

NorCal said:


> Last year we were at 23.7, 3.5 pH. The higher pH is typical for us in the Sierra Foothills due to the warmer (than Napa) evenings.



I'd call that pretty dang close! Hope that what I get are within those parameters.


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## Boatboy24 (Aug 16, 2019)

mainshipfred said:


> I'm getting something from them but the way the Lanza PV and Washington State CF turned out last year, plus local grapes it will probably be a small order.



Are you getting WA grapes again, Fred?


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## mainshipfred (Aug 16, 2019)

Just spoke to him about that yesterday as well. He's only getting WA grapes, no Cali this year. I know he's getting Merlot, CF and CS but don't know what else. If by some chance he's getting PV I might get that from him and not Lanza.


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## Boatboy24 (Aug 16, 2019)

mainshipfred said:


> Just spoke to him about that yesterday as well. He's only getting WA grapes, no Cali this year. I know he's getting Merlot, CF and CS but don't know what else. If by some chance he's getting PV I might get that from him and not Lanza.



If there’s availability, I may do some of those again this year and just Touriga from WW.


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## mainshipfred (Aug 16, 2019)

Boatboy24 said:


> If there’s availability, I may do some of those again this year and just Touriga from WW.



I think it will be available at $2.00/lb. but you know when they were harvested and where they came from. 
If nothing else I'm doing the Touriga as well. I'm bottling it this weekend with 10% Tempranillo if you want a few bottles.


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## jgmann67 (Aug 22, 2019)

Any noise from WW yet on selection and price?


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## Boatboy24 (Aug 23, 2019)

jgmann67 said:


> Any noise from WW yet on selection and price?



I haven't received anything. My thinking is 'any day now'.


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## jgmann67 (Aug 26, 2019)

Boatboy24 said:


> I haven't received anything. My thinking is 'any day now'.



Not to sound too impatient, but...


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## Boatboy24 (Aug 26, 2019)

jgmann67 said:


> Not to sound too impatient, but...
> 
> View attachment 56139



Agreed!!!


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## jgmann67 (Aug 29, 2019)

First post on the group email... order forms will be out Friday night.


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## mainshipfred (Aug 29, 2019)

I have a commitment for local Petit Manseng, Viognier, Chambourcin, Norton and Tannat plus going to do another Washington State Cab Franc and a Lanza Petit Verdot. I think I can get a local CF and PV as well. Already made 12 gallons ea of S. African CS and Chilean Pinot Noir that I think will be very nice. Can't yet speak for the quality of the Virginia fruit except for Norton but I'm really becoming a believer in "you can't make good wine without good fruit". With the exception of the Touriga and possibly Petite Sirah the Lodi and South Central California fruit is just not cutting it.


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## franc1969 (Aug 30, 2019)

Washington Winemakers order form is out. Still working on some local-ish PA grapes, not sure about them my apple wine from last year was ok, so planning a batch of that, too.


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## Boatboy24 (Aug 31, 2019)

Already got my form filled out!


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## mainshipfred (Aug 31, 2019)

Boatboy24 said:


> Already got my form filled out!



Here's my initial thoughts but waiting to see what CFP and Gino's have since theirs are sourced a little further north. I know it's a longer drive and the price is higher but I'm on this quality fruit kick.


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## jgmann67 (Aug 31, 2019)

Struggling - Cab/Syrah or Cab/Zin/Syrah??


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## mainshipfred (Aug 31, 2019)

jgmann67 said:


> Struggling - Cab/Syrah or Cab/Zin/Syrah??



Cab/Touriga and Zin/Syrah


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## Boatboy24 (Aug 31, 2019)

Zin/Cab/Syrah/Petit Sirah

Touriga/Syrah/Tempranillo

We're not helping, are we?


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## Boatboy24 (Aug 31, 2019)

mainshipfred said:


> Cab/Touriga and Zin/Syrah



Fred: What yeast did you use on your Touriga last year?


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## mainshipfred (Aug 31, 2019)

Boatboy24 said:


> Fred: What yeast did you use on your Touriga last year?



D21, Syrah and 71B and you're right we are not helping him.


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## mainshipfred (Aug 31, 2019)

Boatboy24 said:


> Fred: What yeast did you use on your Touriga last year?


 If you want to stop over I'd like to give you a bottle of Touriga, Meritage, Cab Franc and PV. I'll be here at least till noon.


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## Boatboy24 (Aug 31, 2019)

Assuming you're gone by now and I need to have the kids at the pool in 30 minutes. I'll take a raincheck and will tour the cellar for some swappable material in the meantime.


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## mainshipfred (Aug 31, 2019)

Boatboy24 said:


> Assuming you're gone by now and I need to have the kids at the pool in 30 minutes. I'll take a raincheck and will tour the cellar for some swappable material in the meantime.


I'll be back a few times tomorrow and Monday punching down the peach.


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## Boatboy24 (Aug 31, 2019)

mainshipfred said:


> I'll be back a few times tomorrow and Monday punching down the peach.



Nice! Didn't realize you'd started it.


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## Boatboy24 (Sep 1, 2019)

Just got my order placed for all my yeasts, additives, etc. We're rolling now!

Since I'm basically doing two 'double' batches for reds this year, I'm going to still use 4 fermenters and I'll try using two different yeasts for each batch to up the complexity.


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## jgmann67 (Sep 8, 2019)

Same here. Ordered D254 yeast and CH16 MLB. 

Doing the Cab/Syrah field blend. 3 lugs each. 

Who else is going down to WW to pick up grapes on the 28th??


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## mainshipfred (Sep 8, 2019)

jgmann67 said:


> Same here. Ordered D254 yeast and CH16 MLB.
> 
> Doing the Cab/Syrah field blend. 3 lugs each.
> 
> Who else is going down to WW to pick up grapes on the 28th??



I'll be placing my order this week, besides the Touriga I'm not sure what else I will get.


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## Boatboy24 (Sep 8, 2019)

jgmann67 said:


> Who else is going down to WW to pick up grapes on the 28th??



Me!!


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## jgmann67 (Sep 8, 2019)

Boatboy24 said:


> Me!!



Try as I might, I don’t know how to post a gif.


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## Johnd (Sep 8, 2019)

Ordered two 80 g yeasts, D254 and BM 4x4, VP41 and associated rehydration / nutrient needs, new chems for testing pH/ TA / SO2. Ordered a 60 gallon barrel. Still haven’t decided on the grapes.........


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## Boatboy24 (Sep 8, 2019)

jgmann67 said:


> Try as I might, I don’t know how to post a gif.



On my Mac, I right click and select 'copy image'.


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## jgmann67 (Sep 9, 2019)

How's this?


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## Boatboy24 (Sep 9, 2019)

jgmann67 said:


> How's this?



Let's combine 'em:


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## jgmann67 (Sep 13, 2019)

Received my confirmation email for my grapes from Jim Gearing. 

He also emailed and reminded folks to get their stuff in the mail no later than Saturday or it won’t get to him on time.


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## Boatboy24 (Sep 13, 2019)

Got my confirmation yesterday. Locked and loaded!


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## jgmann67 (Sep 14, 2019)

On the 28th, I’m planning on getting there as early as possible to pick up my order. 

I’m also going to bring a half case of wines to swap.


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## mainshipfred (Sep 14, 2019)

I'll probably get there early as well and will have your bottles if you still want them, remind me what you wanted. I also will have 3 barrels for other members. @heatherd are you going? I can bring your bottles too.


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## jgmann67 (Sep 14, 2019)

mainshipfred said:


> I'll probably get there early as well and will have your bottles if you still want them, remind me what you wanted. I also will have 3 barrels for other members. @heatherd are you going? I can bring your bottles too.



I asked for 5 cases of the burgundy bottles. If you don’t have them, or have Bordeaux bottles instead, or a mix of both (really anything but funky colors or clear) - it’s all good. Thanks!


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## Boatboy24 (Sep 14, 2019)

I know last year, they gave us pick up times. I don't know how strict they are about that, but I'd like to get there earlier than later as well. And I'll certainly be bringing some wine to share. 

@ceeaton: Are we going to see you this year?

BTW: I was on the WW site the other night and there were a few pics of our motley crew from last year out there.


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## mainshipfred (Sep 14, 2019)

jgmann67 said:


> I asked for 5 cases of the burgundy bottles. If you don’t have them, or have Bordeaux bottles instead, or a mix of both (really anything but funky colors or clear) - it’s all good. Thanks!



I have both, just tell me what you want.


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## jgmann67 (Sep 14, 2019)

mainshipfred said:


> I have both, just tell me what you want.



Cool - 5 cases of Bordeaux then. I’ll need them for my Zin. Thanks!

@ceeaton - I got room if you want to ride down w me.


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## heatherd (Sep 15, 2019)

@mainshipfred I am planning on going! And I would like the bottles....


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## jgmann67 (Sep 17, 2019)

I’m planning to arrive as early as they’ll let me.


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## Boatboy24 (Sep 20, 2019)

jgmann67 said:


> On the 28th, I’m planning on getting there as early as possible to pick up my order.
> 
> I’m also going to bring a half case of wines to swap.



Jim: If you're willing to trade, I'd love to swap bottles of the kit Rose we both did earlier this year.

I may have the kiddos with me on this run. Dad isn't available and wifey has a training class for work.


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## jgmann67 (Sep 21, 2019)

Boatboy24 said:


> Jim: If you're willing to trade, I'd love to swap bottles of the kit Rose we both did earlier this year.
> 
> I may have the kiddos with me on this run. Dad isn't available and wifey has a training class for work.



I’ll bring one along for sure.


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## Boatboy24 (Sep 22, 2019)

Just got the pickup schedule and it looks like most of us have different times. I wonder if you'd be turned away if you showed up early.


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## jgmann67 (Sep 22, 2019)

I’m on pretty early, between 9 and 10. Perfect for me. Jim’s email said to hit him up if need an earlier time. 

Most everyone else here is later in the morning. Wish I could switch and make it easier. But with my daughter home, I can’t.


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## Boatboy24 (Sep 22, 2019)

jgmann67 said:


> I’m on pretty early, between 9 and 10. Perfect for me. Jim’s email said to hit him up if need an earlier time.
> 
> Most everyone else here is later in the morning. Wish I could switch and make it easier. But with my daughter home, I can’t.



I'm not exactly sure of my schedule that day, but if possible, I'll try to get in before my 10am time slot. You're crushing there, right Jim? So you'll be around for a bit?


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## jgmann67 (Sep 22, 2019)

Boatboy24 said:


> I'm not exactly sure of my schedule that day, but if possible, I'll try to get in before my 10am time slot. You're crushing there, right Jim? So you'll be around for a bit?



Yes, but not too long. Need to get back home, tuck in the grapes and get back to family.


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## jgmann67 (Sep 23, 2019)

Well, this development doesn’t help... delivery delayed a week. I’ll be out of town.


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## Boatboy24 (Sep 23, 2019)

jgmann67 said:


> Well, this development doesn’t help... delivery delayed a week. I’ll be out of town.



Ouch! It actually helps me.


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## mainshipfred (Sep 24, 2019)

jgmann67 said:


> Well, this development doesn’t help... delivery delayed a week. I’ll be out of town.



Ask Craig to get it for you, that's what winemaker friends are for.


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## mainshipfred (Sep 24, 2019)

I don't know if it helps or hurts me, it all depends on when my Norton, Cab Franc and Petit Verdot come in. It could be 7 batches going at the same time which will be 21 fermentors that I don't have.


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## jgmann67 (Oct 3, 2019)

So, Craig agreed to run down to pick up my grapes. Can I just say he’s such a righteous dude. (Points if you know the movie reference.)

Pick up and crush is 9-10 for mine. 

Fred - if you and Craig cross paths, he has $ for the bottles. Otherwise, another time. 

Jim - Rose is on the way. 

At crush, the must will be hit with Lallzyme EX and sit overnight until I get home. From there, we’ll kick off AF; and MLF 24 hours after that. 

Can’t wait to see the SG and Ph numbers.


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## mainshipfred (Oct 3, 2019)

jgmann67 said:


> So, Craig agreed to run down to pick up my grapes. Can I just say he’s such a righteous dude. (Points if you know the movie reference.)
> 
> Pick up and crush is 9-10 for mine.
> 
> ...



I'll be there early to make sure I don't miss anyone.


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## Johnd (Oct 3, 2019)

jgmann67 said:


> So, Craig agreed to run down to pick up my grapes. Can I just say he’s such a righteous dude. (Points if you know the movie reference.)
> 
> Pick up and crush is 9-10 for mine.
> 
> ...



That would be Ferris Bueller.

Sounds like you have a great plan, your must should be very ready for running numbers and adjusting by Sunday. Craig's definitely a righteous dude!!!


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## CDrew (Oct 3, 2019)

Johnd said:


> That would be Ferris Bueller.



I was thinking Bill and Ted's Excellent Adventure, but Ferris Bueller makes sense too. It's been awhile.


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## jgmann67 (Oct 3, 2019)

Johnd said:


> That would be Ferris Bueller.
> 
> Sounds like you have a great plan, your must should be very ready for running numbers and adjusting by Sunday. Craig's definitely a righteous dude!!!



Oh, he's very popular Ed. The sportos, the motorheads, geeks, sluts, bloods, waistoids, dweebies, dickheads - they all adore him. They think he's a righteous dude.


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## ceeaton (Oct 3, 2019)

Boatboy24 said:


> I'm not exactly sure of my schedule that day, but if possible, I'll try to get in before my 10am time slot. You're crushing there, right Jim? So you'll be around for a bit?


I'll hang. I saw on the schedule that a few in the 9-10 time slot have lots to crush, so I'll hold @jgmann67's grapes from crushing and help the other dudes/dudettes who have larger quantities, thereby making myself stay late enough to cross paths with you.


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## ceeaton (Oct 3, 2019)

mainshipfred said:


> I'll be there early to make sure I don't miss anyone.


I'll wait. If you can't get there before 11 or so, text me and I'll leave and spend @jgmann67's money on some girls on the way home...


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## ceeaton (Oct 3, 2019)

mainshipfred said:


> Ask Craig to get it for you, that's what winemaker friends are for.


I just saw this post...only my wife is allowed to offer my services, I make her pay dearly. Hummm, what can I extract from you, Fred?

Just kidding.


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## Boatboy24 (Oct 3, 2019)

My pickup isn't scheduled until 10, but I plan to be there by 9:30.


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## Boatboy24 (Oct 4, 2019)

Christmas Eve is here!!


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## ceeaton (Oct 4, 2019)

I'll bring a few wines if anyone is interested. A brunello, syrah, pinot noir, viognier, lanza zin, forza and valpolicella. All are 2+ yrs old.

Some of them are actually 4+ years old. I'm finding that my habit of procrastination + wine making are paying off.


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## mainshipfred (Oct 5, 2019)

I'll be there around 9 and will also have wine.


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## ceeaton (Oct 5, 2019)

I'll see you there, Fred. Will be leaving here in 15 minutes. I have some of @jgmann67's wines as well.


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## jgmann67 (Oct 5, 2019)

Have fun people. Wish I was there.


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## ceeaton (Oct 5, 2019)

I'm spent. Long day. Planning on splitting wood with my brother tomorrow afternoon. Here's wishing for rain!


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## jgmann67 (Oct 5, 2019)

ceeaton said:


> I'm spent. Long day. Planning on splitting wood with my brother tomorrow afternoon. Here's wishing for rain!



I haven’t seen my grapes yet (wife will send me pics). Thank you for picking my grapes up this year Craig. You’re a lifesaver.


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## ceeaton (Oct 5, 2019)

What flavor? I prefer the cherry ones...


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## jgmann67 (Oct 6, 2019)

I’m three hours from home. Itching to see this year’s harvest.

Anyone run numbers on their grapes yet?


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## Boatboy24 (Oct 6, 2019)

Zin: 25.8 Brix, 3.78 pH

Touriga: 24 Brix, 4.22 pH

Zin was 5 lugs, plus 1 lug of Petite Sirah. Touriga is 4 lugs, plus one each of Syrah and Tempranillo.


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## Johnd (Oct 6, 2019)

Boatboy24 said:


> Zin: 25.8 Brix, 3.78 pH
> 
> Touriga: 24 Brix, 4.22 pH
> 
> Zin was 5 lugs, plus 1 lug of Petite Sirah. Touriga is 4 lugs, plus one each of Syrah and Tempranillo.



Sweet BRIX numbers, should be nice, ripe fruit. Touriga pH 4.22...wow! Been noticing quite a few high pH’s that folks have posted, ordered an extra pound of tartaric this week and have it here on standby..just in case.


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## Boatboy24 (Oct 6, 2019)

Johnd said:


> Sweet BRIX numbers, should be nice, ripe fruit. Touriga pH 4.22...wow! Been noticing quite a few high pH’s that folks have posted, ordered an extra pound of tartaric this week and have it here on standby..just in case.



Brought the Touriga down to 3.78 and the Zin down to 3.7. D80 and D254 hydrating for the Touriga now. I'll use RP15 and BM4X4 on the Zinfandel.


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## Johnd (Oct 6, 2019)

Boatboy24 said:


> Brought the Touriga down to 3.78 and the Zin down to 3.7. D80 and D254 hydrating for the Touriga now. I'll use RP15 and BM4X4 on the Zinfandel.



Sounds like a good plan, enjoy the ride!!! My stuff doesn’t get picked til next week, getting a little anxious.


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## CDrew (Oct 6, 2019)

Johnd said:


> Sounds like a good plan, enjoy the ride!!! My stuff doesn’t get picked til next week, getting a little anxious.



I'm going to guess you're fine. It's warmed up here and it's dry and perfect. 86 daytime high, 54 evening low. Perfect grape weather. No rain predicted for at least a week either. It's also perfect temps for garage fermentation too!


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## jgmann67 (Oct 6, 2019)

Got home and moved the must down from the garage to the wine room with a little help from Mrs Mann. 

Pulled a sample of the 50/50 field blend of Cab and Syrah:

At 67* F. 

SG is an impressive 1.110. Converted, that’s 26 Brix. 

Too hot?? I’m thinking maybe, maybe not. 

If I ferment down to 0.995, that’s about 15% ABV. Where does one get dicidulated (Or however you spell it) water. Or will distilled water suffice?? And how much water to drop the Brix to 25?

Ph is a little high at 3.89 but not enough for me to want to monkey with it.


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## Johnd (Oct 6, 2019)

CDrew said:


> I'm going to guess you're fine. It's warmed up here and it's dry and perfect. 86 daytime high, 54 evening low. Perfect grape weather. No rain predicted for at least a week either. It's also perfect temps for garage fermentation too!



Glad the weather there is on track. No garage fermenting here, we’re still in summer, haven’t had any lows in the 60’s yet, highs still in the mid 90’s. Changes coming though, nights in the 60’s, highs in the 80’s this week. Hopefully it’ll be cool when the fruit gets here......


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## Boatboy24 (Oct 6, 2019)

jgmann67 said:


> Got home and moved the must down from the garage to the wine room with a little help from Mrs Mann.
> 
> Pulled a sample of the 50/50 field blend of Cab and Syrah:
> 
> ...



You have to mix your own acidulated water using tartaric acid. I might be tempted to bring that down to 25.5 Brix and bump up the acid a bit while you're doing it. I was jealously eyeing those Cab grapes yesterday. Every lug looked perfect. And the two or three grapes I ate tasted great.


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## jgmann67 (Oct 6, 2019)

Boatboy24 said:


> You have to mix your own acidulated water using tartaric acid. I might be tempted to bring that down to 25.5 Brix and bump up the acid a bit while you're doing it. I was jealously eyeing those Cab grapes yesterday. Every lug looked perfect. And the two or three grapes I ate tasted great.



They taste great. 

I am tempted to add water. 

I have tartaric acid around here somewhere. 

To drop my ph to 3.79, I want to add 25g to tartaric acid to how much distilled water (to drop the Brix to 25.5)? If my math is right, it’s just short of a gallon of distilled water.


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## jgmann67 (Oct 6, 2019)

Go figure. I added 3.1 L of distilled water with about 50g of tartaric acid (blended in to a gallon jug of water). 

Stirred in and waited a little bit and I got an SG of 1.100 and a ph of 3.7 and change.


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## jgmann67 (Oct 8, 2019)

Day 3. Kicked off the mlf last night. We’re three days in. Will check my Sg tomorrow and maybe add nutrient. 

The wine looks and smells excellent.


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## jgmann67 (Oct 9, 2019)

Silly question - what if I put too much FermaidK nutrient in my wine? I thought it was 1.5g per gallon, but it was just 1g/gallon.


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## CDrew (Oct 9, 2019)

It means it's going to go fast! Like pouring gas on a fire. I'd watch your temps carefully, but otherwise I bet you're fine.


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## jgmann67 (Oct 10, 2019)

Temp is a nice 81*. Cap is awesome. 

Will check again tonight.


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## stickman (Oct 11, 2019)

What's going on, no photos.......


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## jgmann67 (Oct 11, 2019)

stickman said:


> What's going on, no photos.......



You asked for it, you got it:


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## stickman (Oct 11, 2019)

@jgmann67 Yea thanks, I need this, I don't get my grapes until maybe December.


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## mainshipfred (Oct 11, 2019)

@jgmann67 you lazy dog, one fermenter? LOL, this is how I roll. 4 wines 10 fermenters. Left Grenache red and Rose, Middle Merlot, right Touriga and the barrel is getting neutralized with acidulated water for the Petit Manseng and Viognier and perhaps the peach.


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## jgmann67 (Oct 11, 2019)

mainshipfred said:


> @jgmann67 you lazy dog, one fermenter? LOL, this is how I roll. 4 wines 10 fermenters. Left Grenache red and Rose, Middle Merlot, right Touriga and the barrel is getting neutralized with acidulated water for the Petit Manseng and Viognier and perhaps the peach.



Dat's a lotta wine! 

Wish I could do more. Unfortunately, it's all my wallet can manage. 

I might eventually get to the point of quitting kits and just doing fall grapes. I could save up the rest of the year for a half ton of grapes in different varietals. Then again, I didn't check my lottery numbers from last night. =)


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## jgmann67 (Oct 12, 2019)

Last night’s measurements - SG down to 1.02; temp dropped two degrees to 79*. The cap was not as tall as it was... all good things. 

Looking like tomorrow or Monday morning for pressing.


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## jgmann67 (Oct 14, 2019)

It’s PRESS DAY!!!


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## jgmann67 (Oct 15, 2019)

Pressing took about 4 hours from prep until cleanup was done. I’ve got solo pressing down to a science this year. 

Some pics. 

.


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## Chuck E (Oct 15, 2019)

jgmann67 said:


> Go figure. I added 3.1 L of distilled water with about 50g of tartaric acid (blended in to a gallon jug of water).
> 
> Stirred in and waited a little bit and I got an SG of 1.100 and a ph of 3.7 and change.



That's practically perfect.


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## CDrew (Oct 15, 2019)

So close to 15 gallons of wine with a bucket press? Count me impressed.


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## jgmann67 (Oct 15, 2019)

CDrew said:


> So close to 15 gallons of wine with a bucket press? Count me impressed.



Thanks! All I did was sit on the press, shuffle the skins and sit some more. 

That's 2 6.4 gallon carboys and a 5 gal (that I could only get to about 4.1). All told, I was able to squeeze almost 17 gallons out of the skins with my bucket press. I got a gallon or two more than I thought I would. I will likely net 15 gallons at the next racking, though, with a little left over for topping up.


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## jgmann67 (Oct 15, 2019)

This is what settled to the bottom of the carboys this morning. These are “fine lees” in my mind.


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## mainshipfred (Oct 15, 2019)

looks like you had a very clean press.


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## jgmann67 (Oct 16, 2019)

mainshipfred said:


> looks like you had a very clean press.



I did. Very happy. The only issue I have right now is the 4.1 gallons of wine in a 5 gallon carboy. I’m not too concerned with oxidation. But the headspace eliminator isn’t going to cut it for the next two weeks while the wine finishes its MLF. Thinking of just putting an airlock on and letting it alone.


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## Johnd (Oct 16, 2019)

jgmann67 said:


> I did. Very happy. The only issue I have right now is the 4.1 gallons of wine in a 5 gallon carboy. I’m not too concerned with oxidation. But the headspace eliminator isn’t going to cut it for the next two weeks while the wine finishes its MLF. Thinking of just putting an airlock on and letting it alone.



You can’t rack down to 3 + 1 + 750ml?


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## jgmann67 (Oct 16, 2019)

Johnd said:


> You can’t rack down to 3 + 1 + 750ml?



I need another 3. The one I have is full of OVZ from last season.


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## Chuck E (Oct 16, 2019)

jgmann67 said:


> I need another 3.



LOL, it's always that way...


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## cmason1957 (Oct 16, 2019)

jgmann67 said:


> I need another 3. The one I have is full of OVZ from last season.



And that's how we end up owning 35 carboys. May I have another, please kind holder of the purse string???


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## CDrew (Oct 16, 2019)

Those 1 gallon jugs are super useful and hard to have too many for that last bit coming off the press! "Topping" wine for the next rack. I found a Carlo Rossi gallon jug in the backcountry in Death Valley NP, and yep brought it home and it has wine in it right now. My friends thought I was "recycling" , which I was, but not the way they they thought. I figure you need 3 for each 3 gallon carboy you have. That way, you can't be caught short.


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## cmason1957 (Oct 16, 2019)

CDrew said:


> Those 1 gallon jugs are super useful and hard to have too many for that last bit coming off the press! "Topping" wine for the next rack. I found a Carlo Rossi gallon jug in the backcountry in Death Valley NP, and yep brought it home and it has wine in it right now. My friends thought I was "recycling" , which I was, but not the way they they thought. I figure you need 3 for each 3 gallon carboy you have. That way, you can't be caught short.



And you need two 1/2 gallon jugs for each gallon that you have and 3 -750 ml bottles for each 1/2 gallon and 2 -375 Ml bottles for each 750 Ml bottle. I believe that right there is what you call an algebraic progression. Oh and don't forget 2 - 3 gallon carboys for each 6 gallon carboy. and don't even get me started on demijohns.


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## jgmann67 (Oct 16, 2019)

CDrew said:


> Those 1 gallon jugs are super useful and hard to have too many for that last bit coming off the press! "Topping" wine for the next rack. I found a Carlo Rossi gallon jug in the backcountry in Death Valley NP, and yep brought it home and it has wine in it right now. My friends thought I was "recycling" , which I was, but not the way they they thought. I figure you need 3 for each 3 gallon carboy you have. That way, you can't be caught short.



I have 2 one gallon jugs and the cheapest solution here might be for me to go get two more.


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## franc1969 (Oct 19, 2019)

4 gallon water carboys- PET container, only $4 at Wegmans, similar elsewhere. Not the thickest plastic as they are meant to be disposable, but useful if you don't have to move them much. They are an intermediate size, store anywhere, fit a standard 'universal' bung. And come with water. I don't feel bad about ditching them when the wine has settled and is racked to glass for long term. I have also used them as primary fermenters for wine that is then racked to a 3 gallon when done. Better for me than using a bucket or open fermenter.


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## jgmann67 (Oct 20, 2019)

I just picked up a 3 gal Italian glass carboy. Feel good about it too. 

View attachment 57105


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## jgmann67 (Oct 23, 2019)

jgmann67 said:


> I just picked up a 3 gal Italian glass carboy. Feel good about it too.
> 
> View attachment 57105



Pictures not showing on the app on my phone. Not sure why. 

Checked the wine last night, still tiny bubbles going in all four containers. Will leave it another week or so before I get antsy to do chromo testing.


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## jgmann67 (Nov 6, 2019)

Chromotography shows a complete MLF... I think. I’ll leave it another two weeks and see if that little notion of doubt goes away. 

My first chromo:





Thoughts?


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## Johnd (Nov 6, 2019)

jgmann67 said:


> Chromotography shows a complete MLF... I think. I’ll leave it another two weeks and see if that little notion of doubt goes away.
> 
> My first chromo:
> 
> ...



Looks good!! I agree with the notion of waiting a couple weeks to sulfite, but not to remove doubt, just the last straggling bit of malic......Congratulations!!!!!


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## ceeaton (Nov 6, 2019)

Johnd said:


> Looks good!! I agree with the notion of waiting a couple weeks to sulfite, but not to remove doubt, just the last straggling bit of malic......Congratulations!!!!!


Agreed. I believe the test will show malic acid above a certain threshold that is above zero. I believe @cmason1957 mentioned what it was a few years back in another thread.


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## cmason1957 (Nov 6, 2019)

ceeaton said:


> Agreed. I believe the test will show malic acid above a certain threshold that is above zero. I believe @cmason1957 mentioned what it was a few years back in another thread.



I probably did, this is from memory now and I might have lost those actual braincells, but 40 ppm is the number I recall and I seem to recall it takes under 20 ppm to be called enough. Please, if I have misremembered, be gentle.


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## jgmann67 (Nov 6, 2019)

This will be the second co-inoculation with no problem. I've also done two consecutive fermentations (doing the AF first, then the MLF) and one worked famously well, the other infamously bad. 

Co-inoculations are like illegal raves in the warehouse district... there's just so much going on in the wine, the ML bacteria has no other choice but to get up and dance.


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## ceeaton (Nov 6, 2019)

cmason1957 said:


> I probably did, this is from memory now and I might have lost those actual braincells, but 40 ppm is the number I recall and I seem to recall it takes under 20 ppm to be called enough. Please, if I have misremembered, be gentle.


I know I have lost some cells so that's why I deferred to your memory. Take heart, I believe you are close to 5 years older than I am, so I think your memory is doing better than mine!


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## Ajmassa (Nov 6, 2019)

ceeaton said:


> I know I have lost some cells so that's why I deferred to your memory. Take heart, I believe you are close to 5 years older than I am, so I think your memory is doing better than mine!



You OG’s should be ashamed of yourselves! I remember this well because I was doing my first MLFs and trying to understand what was what. (And showing off possibly the ugliest chroma test in the history of chromatography @ceeaton) 
I had those test strips @cmason1957 uses conflicting with chroma test results. And I dove into the numbers. 

Chromatography is sensitive to about 
100mg/L-200mg/L malic content. 

A typical ‘Post MLF’ malic acid target is under 30mg/L. 

The one thing I was never able to find is what a typical malic content is BEFORE mlf. The strips show up to 500. I can only assume that pre-mlf wines can range from a few hundred mg/L to a few thousand mg/L. But that’s just a guess.


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## stickman (Nov 6, 2019)

@Ajmassa Yep, there's a wide range for malic acid content, my 2016 Sangiovese initially had 3.6g/l malic acid. The 2017 Pinot Noir had 4.2g/l to start. The 2018 Red Mountain Cab was 1.2g/l. The 2018 Moon Mountain Cab was 2g/l. That's part of the reason it's difficult to predict how much the TA will drop due to ML completion.


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## Ajmassa (Nov 6, 2019)

stickman said:


> @Ajmassa Yep, there's a wide range for malic acid content, my 2016 Sangiovese initially had 3.6g/l malic acid. The 2017 Pinot Noir had 4.2g/l to start. The 2018 Red Mountain Cab was 1.2g/l. The 2018 Moon Mountain Cab was 2g/l. That's part of the reason it's difficult to predict how much the TA will drop due to ML completion.



Wow. Thanks for sharing this. I looked a couple different times before— but could never find anything. 

So Is Brehm giving you the g/L malic content too? Jesus. They don’t play games do they? 
Brix, ph, TA, YAN, malic—- what else you gettin? Don’t hold out on me!


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## stickman (Nov 6, 2019)

@Ajmassa not all, but most grapes will have a juice panel from a certified lab.


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## montanarick (Nov 7, 2019)

jgmann67 said:


> Chromotography shows a complete MLF... I think. I’ll leave it another two weeks and see if that little notion of doubt goes away.
> 
> My first chromo:
> 
> ...


looks good


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## CDrew (Nov 7, 2019)

That’s impressive. That much analysis would be $200 at the local lab. Although not so bad spread over many 50 pound pails. 



stickman said:


> @Ajmassa not all, but most grapes will have a juice panel from a certified lab.
> 
> View attachment 57453


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## jgmann67 (Nov 15, 2019)

Another test coming up this weekend. If we come up all clear, I’ll rack and dose with Kmeta.


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## jgmann67 (Nov 17, 2019)

Test #2 is underway. Chromatogram is drying now. Results tonight.


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## jgmann67 (Nov 18, 2019)

Chromo #1 from 2 weeks ago:




Chromo #2 from this weekend:




I did them in reverse order the second time around (so #1 on the first test is #4 on the second, etc.). 

Will let this sit another week or two, rack and dose. Looks done to me and it’s time to move on. Literally...

We sold our house and moving day is December 1st. But, I’m moving my wine and guns separately myself.


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## Chuck E (Nov 18, 2019)

jgmann67 said:


> Will let this sit another week or two, rack and dose. Looks done to me and it’s time to move on. Literally...
> 
> We sold our house and moving day is December 1st. But, I’m moving my wine and guns separately myself.



Congrats on the home sale!


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## mainshipfred (Nov 18, 2019)

Good luck with the move.


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## Boatboy24 (Nov 18, 2019)

Congrats! Good idea to move the wine and guns separately. Booz and firearms don't belong together.


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## jgmann67 (Nov 23, 2019)

Racked, dosed and getting ready for the move. Cab-Syrah... down to 15 gallons +/-.


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## jgmann67 (Nov 30, 2019)

Relocated all the wine and some equipment to the new house yesterday. Seven full carboys and about 275 bottles of wine. 

Will run the guns and the rest of the wine making equipment today.


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