# Fermaid K added to late.



## TimK (Oct 24, 2016)

Let's just get to it. A couple of days ago, I added the Fermaid K to my Merlot grape must to late, at about 8 Brix. Not wise I now know, but after researching, all I found out is that it's not a good thing. (can be food for unwanted organisms). But the one thing I can't seem to find info on is "now what". What can I expect? What should I do now? Will there ever be a time when I am "out of the woods"? Does MLF (which I was planning on doing) help or hurt? The cap is still very thick and the must still seems active when I punch. And no weird smells have developed. Is it just a matter of being extra vigilant on cleaning, sanitizing, etc so no weird bacteria? Or is it now a roll of the dice and I have no control. I did all the usual in the beginning. Cleared the must of any wild yeast with meta after the crush. Enzymes, tannins, yeast, oak cubes. Fermaid O added at first sign of the cap. Punching 3 times a day cleaning/sanitizing punch tool each time. Etc. So any insight to what to do, or when to stop worrying would help. Lesson learned.


----------



## Johnd (Oct 24, 2016)

TimK said:


> Let's just get to it. A couple of days ago, I added the Fermaid K to my Merlot grape must to late, at about 8 Brix. Not wise I now know, but after researching, all I found out is that it's not a good thing. (can be food for unwanted organisms). But the one thing I can't seem to find info on is "now what". What can I expect? What should I do now? Will there ever be a time when I am "out of the woods"? Does MLF (which I was planning on doing) help or hurt? The cap is still very thick and the must still seems active when I punch. And no weird smells have developed. Is it just a matter of being extra vigilant on cleaning, sanitizing, etc so no weird bacteria? Or is it now a roll of the dice and I have no control. I did all the usual in the beginning. Cleared the must of any wild yeast with meta after the crush. Enzymes, tannins, yeast, oak cubes. Fermaid O added at first sign of the cap. Punching 3 times a day cleaning/sanitizing punch tool each time. Etc. So any insight to what to do, or when to stop worrying would help. Lesson learned.



Adding K at 8 Brix (or 1.0318 SG) shouldn't be a big deal, nor cause for too much worry. Your yeast will continue to utilize the nutrients until fermentation has ceased. It may leave some nutrients in there that your MLB can use. Stop worrying, you can't remove it. Be vigilant with your sanitizing and stay the course.


----------



## ceeaton (Oct 24, 2016)

I'd have to agree with @Johnd, you should be fine. Only thing I might think of doing different is using the K at cap formation and the O later on, as it is said O can be used by the yeast better than the K as fermentation comes to an end. Life has too many things to worry about, so remove wine making from that list. Go with the flow and fix it next time, if it even needs fixed.


----------



## TimK (Oct 24, 2016)

Thanks for the input. Didn't know what, if anything, to expect. 
ceeaton, I thought that it's better to use ferm O first and then ferm K second. Something about the DAP in the ferm K might hinder the yeast in the beginning. Thanks again.


----------



## Johnd (Oct 24, 2016)

@TimK

I believe that the theory is that the yeast have a harder time using the DAP later in the process, if I recall. Personally, I only use Fermaid K and still keep some DAP on hand as well, which I do use occasionally for really low YAN musts. You can read lots of differing thoughts on the topic, I've read to never add nutrients below 1.020, some use it after that.


----------



## ceeaton (Oct 24, 2016)

TimK said:


> ceeaton, I thought that it's better to use ferm O first and then ferm K second. Something about the DAP in the ferm K might hinder the yeast in the beginning.



You may be right on that one. I only use Fermaid O and I aim for onset of fermentation and 1/3 sugar depletion, but had heard that if I add it later it can still be used by the yeast, whereas the DAP in the Fermaid K might be left unused for nasties other than the yeast if added too late. I'd have to go look but I read that either on MoreWinemaking.com or Scotts Labs website.

From MoreWinemaking.com's red wine making online manual for Nutrients in general:

_However, yeast will utilize few nutrients after 10% alcohol. (a 15 ºBrix drop) Additions made after 10% alcohol may only serve to feed spoilage organisms._


----------



## TimK (Oct 24, 2016)

In my research I started to read more about the YAN in the musts which is new to me. I need to read up on that to get more knowledge on the things that can go bump in the wine. The DAP left over from the ferm K hopefully will not cause any problems as the morewine manual says it might. Gonna keep everything as clean as possible. Everything does seem ok still. Brix went down to 2 today from 8 Brix a couple of days ago. Moving right along. Thanks, I appreciate the input.


----------

