# When do you pitch your MLB



## homer (Oct 27, 2015)

#1. At the start of fermentation ?
#2. Midway through fermentation ?
#3. After pressing ?
#4. After the first rack ?
#5. Do you vary with red or white? 
#6. What's your favorite MLB ?
Thanks. bk


----------



## stickman (Oct 27, 2015)

I make mostly red wine, usually a cabernet blend from frozen must. After pressing I rack at 24hrs, again after another 48hrs, then I add the ML culture and maintain near 70F. I've been using CH16 without any nutrients and have not had any issues. I follow the progress with chromatography and then rack and add sulfite once the malic is gone.


----------



## Boatboy24 (Oct 27, 2015)

I rack 24-72 hours after pressing (depending on what life is throwing at me), then pitch. I use VP41, hydrate with Acti-ML, and I add Opti-Malo to the wine for nutrient. Haven't done MLF on a white wine.


----------



## barbiek (Oct 27, 2015)

stickman said:


> I make mostly red wine, usually a cabernet blend from frozen must. After pressing I rack at 24hrs, again after another 48hrs, then I add the ML culture and maintain near 70F. I've been using CH16 without any nutrients and have not had any issues. I follow the progress with chromatography and then rack and add sulfite once the malic is gone.



How long did it take without any nutrients?


----------



## stickman (Oct 27, 2015)

The majority of the wines over the past 10 years have taken 4 to 5 weeks to complete, there was one that had an unusually low PH around 3.38 that took close to 3 months. Lack of nutrients could have played a role, but the low PH is a problem for the CH16, so the long duration in this case is not surprising.


----------



## FTC Wines (Oct 28, 2015)

I started a MLF 10 days ago on my fresh Cab grapes & on a Cab juice bucket. Used ch16, & some nutreints. All # were in range. I have no way other than visibly to determine when it's done. So at say 5 weeks can I just sulfite & make it done. Any harm? This is my first MLF. Roy


----------



## cmason1957 (Oct 28, 2015)

FTC Wines said:


> I started a MLF 10 days ago on my fresh Cab grapes & on a Cab juice bucket. Used ch16, & some nutreints. All # were in range. I have no way other than visibly to determine when it's done. So at say 5 weeks can I just sulfite & make it done. Any harm? This is my first MLF. Roy



Since you have no means of testing completion, I would wait much longer than 5 weeks. Some MLF completions can take up to our more than three months. The issue with just calling it done is it can start back up later when your sulfite levels drop, like a year or so after you bottle. I would at least get some of the test strips and test with those.


----------



## Steve_M (Oct 28, 2015)

2nd year making wine. Last year decided well after fermentation to add ML culture. Took 3 months to complete. This time pitcher right after racking 48 hours from pressing. I am now at the 5 week mark tested just about 10 days ago and only one of the five carboys are showing any sign of progress. Leaving it alone for another couple of weeks and will test again. 

Steve


----------



## stickman (Oct 28, 2015)

It is important to use some sort of method to determine the end of MLF, testing, visual, tasting etc. what ever works for you. As cmason indicated, if you kill too soon, malic is left available for bacterial activity later in the cellar or in bottle if you don't filter. If you kill too late, there may or may not be issues depending on other winemaking factors. The surviving bacteria after consuming the malic will adapt to consume other things, usually citric acid is next and then on to residual sugars, even a "dry" wine has some residual sugars. The volatile acidity will rise and the wine will sometimes get a bit harsh depending on the level. In traditional winemaking you just let it go, rack and sulfite periodically, and the wine eventually becomes stable and harmonious after a couple of years in barrel. In modern mass market winemaking, it is typical to kill the bacteria after the malic has been consumed, so the wine can be pushed to the market quickly without the extra volatile acidity.


----------



## NorCal (Oct 28, 2015)

#3; after pressing, let settle for 24/48 hours, transfer to the barrel, add nutrient and MLF.


----------



## homer (Oct 28, 2015)

#7. With the 66 gal packages of MLB how do you measure accurately, I had 5 carboys so I took a good guess on the package volume and split it into 3rd's, not very accurate. bk


----------



## FTC Wines (Oct 28, 2015)

Thanks all for the replies. I'll look into test strips. Homer I did the same, divided my ch16 into 1/8s, could have been 1/10s, good for 66 gals they say, so 1/10 is good for 6.6 gals. Crude but should work. Roy


----------



## Boatboy24 (Oct 28, 2015)

I just use the whole packet. It's a bit wasteful, I admit. But the data out there on storing and reusing MLB is inconsistent. So I just start with a fresh pack each time.


----------



## stickman (Oct 28, 2015)

I also use the whole 66 gallon culture, typically in a 30 to 45 gallon batch.


----------



## heatherd (Oct 30, 2015)

homer said:


> #1. At the start of fermentation ?
> #2. Midway through fermentation ?
> #3. After pressing ?
> #4. After the first rack ?
> ...



I add MLB at the start of fermentation. I use VP41. I'll add nutrients about halfway through. I don't do much in the way of stirring. I taste to see how things are going generally with the MLF, then use test strips as another way to check progress.


----------



## JohnT (Nov 3, 2015)

I go with #3 or #4. It is at that point that I do a re-adjustment of the PH and (most importantly) get a true sense of the final volume. MLB expensive and I want to get the exact amount that I need.


----------

