# Alternatives for stabilizing



## jwilliamson1001 (Mar 12, 2014)

I have a question that I've searched for but haven't found here. Is there an alternative to using ka-meta or k-meta when stablizing? I'm just wondering


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## GreginND (Mar 12, 2014)

What do you mean by "stabilizing"?

Potassium metabisulfite keeps bacteria in check and helps limit oxidation. 

There are many other issues to contend with with regards to a wine being "stable". 

Stable from fermentation? Need to use potassium sorbate
Stable from protein haze? Need to use proper fining agents to remove undesirable proteins.
Stable from tartrate crystals? Need to chill the wine to around 25-30 degrees for a couple of weeks and then rack off of tartrate crystals.
Stable from MLF? Need proper sulfite and perhaps lysozyme.


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## cpfan (Mar 12, 2014)

jwilliamson1001 said:


> I have a question that I've searched for but haven't found here. Is there an alternative to using ka-meta or k-meta when stablizing? I'm just wondering


 K-meta is not a stabilizer. Potassium sorbate is the stabilizer.

Steve


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## BernardSmith (Mar 12, 2014)

I think the answer is YES, there are alternatives to the use of K-Meta and K-Sorb. (I think you need to use BOTH chemicals to stabilize. They are not an either/or) 
1. You don't stabilize - and you don't add any sweetener. There is no reason then to stabilize - although you might still want to add K-meta. This adds SO2 to the wine and SO2 is used to inhibit oxidation and spoilage. The amount of K-meta needed for that purpose depends on the acidity of your wine - the more acidic it is the less free SO2 you need. 
2. You don't stabilize and you add non fermentable sugars to sweeten (not all non fermentable sugars add pleasant flavors)
3. You don't stabilize but you pasteurize the wine and so kill the yeast and then you back sweeten. (pasteurization - obviously adds heat to your wine and this can damage the volatile flavor and aroma molecules. 
4. You don't stabilize but you filter out all yeast sized molecules and larger and then you back sweeten (filtering requires equipment and it can remove color and other molecules that would otherwise enhance your wine.

I am not suggesting that any of the alternatives are good options for you, but they are alternatives to using those chemicals.


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## jwilliamson1001 (Mar 12, 2014)

These answers are very enlightening. So it would be best to get both and used correctly i should be able to rack shortly after fermenting. The grape wine is only a week old. The mead is about 2 weeks old and still bubbling like a fishtank. I have time to order these items.  thank you everyone


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## Bibelljim (Mar 12, 2014)

*Study on Colloidal Silver*

Hi,

I heard that there was a study where people were using Colloidal Silver instead of sulfites with good results.

One of the reasons I started making wine was to minimize the sulfites, so this is interesting.


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## jwilliamson1001 (Mar 12, 2014)

Bibelljim said:


> Hi,
> 
> I heard that there was a study where people were using Colloidal Silver instead of sulfites with good results.
> 
> One of the reasons I started making wine was to minimize the sulfites, so this is interesting.



Interesting idea. I happen to make silver in almost 200ppm. Would be worth some mead to test maybe a cup?
If this really works i can post a tutorial on making the silver. Its quite simple and wine makers already have most of the tools.


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## Pumpkinman (Mar 12, 2014)

I would not use *Colloidal silver*, the following is from the *Mayo Clinic*:


> Colloidal silver isn't considered safe or effective for any of the health claims manufacturers make. Silver has no known purpose in the body. Nor is it an essential mineral, as some sellers of silver products claim.
> 
> Colloidal silver products are made of tiny silver particles suspended in a liquid — the same type of precious metal used in jewelry, dental fillings, silverware and other consumer goods. Colloidal silver products are usually marketed as dietary supplements that are taken by mouth. Colloidal silver products also come in forms to be injected or applied to the skin.
> 
> ...



Check out this video - [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ahihGKZC5Kk"]Click here[/ame]


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## BernardSmith (Mar 12, 2014)

jwilliamson1001 said:


> These answers are very enlightening. So it would be best to get both and used correctly i should be able to rack shortly after fermenting. The grape wine is only a week old. The mead is about 2 weeks old and still bubbling like a fishtank. I have time to order these items.  thank you everyone



Whoa Nelly! That's like the 16 year old auditioning to play King Lear. You don't need to think about stabilizing your wine until you are ready to bottle and you don't need to think about bottling until the wine has suitably aged. 
I have not made kit wines so I don't know what the instructions might be although I would say follow them closely , but if you are making wines that are not from kits then aging is counted in many, many months not weeks.

I would think that you would want to allow your mead to age a year or more before you bottle. That might mean racking the mead into a clean and sanitized carboy every two or three months into which you have added a solution of K-meta. That racking helps remove the CO2 gently and allows you to replenish the free SO2 that is lost. The aging allows all kinds of complex chemical processes involving tannins and acids and volatile flavor and aromatic molecules to take place and impact the entire batch. For example, an apple wine I made some time ago completely transformed itself after about 12 months and all the sharp notes and angles smoothed out and the apple flavors pushed themselves front and center in a way that they never did even a month earlier.

Bottom line... Patience is your best friend. Stabilization may be your best friend's acquaintance but instant gratification is for the 16 year old.
Oh.. And Hi Jwilliamson. Welcome to the forum.


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## Julie (Mar 12, 2014)

Pumpkinman said:


> I would not use *Colloidal silver*, the following is from the *Mayo Clinic*:
> 
> 
> Check out this video - Click here


 
Thanks, my step son was just going off on the great value colloidal silver is. I will be sending him this.


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## GreginND (Mar 12, 2014)

NO COLLOID SILVER! While silver may be a topical antibiotic, it is not the same when you ingest it.


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## seth8530 (Mar 12, 2014)

Pumpkinman said:


> I would not use *Colloidal silver*, the following is from the *Mayo Clinic*:
> 
> 
> Check out this video - Click here




I had heard that Colloidal Silver was not good for you, but I had no idea it could turn you blue...

@ original poster,

I am a fan of using meta and sorbate. It sounds like you got some batches underway and I believe that you are at the right place if you want some extra help in making sure they turn out. 

As stated earlier ,stabalyzation is something that is done in the late stages of wine making. However, post fermentation, I would recommend you treat your wine with kmeta.


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## jwilliamson1001 (Mar 12, 2014)

Silver is like anything else used for medication. Used in moderation its just fine, don't misuse or over use. But as for my original question, i simply wanted to learn more in any situation where i may need to compromise. And thank you all for the help  and thank you for the welcome as well.


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