# 43rd Annual US Amateur Winemaking Competition



## acorad

*The 43rd Annual US Amateur Winemaking Competition *

will be held on

*November 19, 2016*

*Entries must be received between October 1 and November 11, 2016. *

*International entries may be received earlier.*

Please send entries c/o: The Home Beer, Wine and Cheesemaking Shop, in Woodland Hills, CA. 
(www.HomeBeerWineCheese.com)

Entry forms and rules are posted on the club website at: http://www.CellarmastersLA.org.

Cellarmasters has been sponsoring the US Amateur Winemaking Competition
since the club was founded in 1973.

The Competition is an all-volunteer endeavor and is the oldest home wine competition in the US.

Good luck to all!

Questions? 
Please email: [email protected]

Andy Coradeschi​


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## Boatboy24

Thanks Andy ( @acorad ). I think this might be the year I finally have something to enter. What are the entry fees and where can we find the form? All I saw on the website was the flyer with the dates.


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## JohnT

I moved this thread to the competitions folder.


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## ibglowin

I have entered that one the last two years. Its a good one for me as it's close (shipping wise) and they do a good job with notes.


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## acorad

Hi Jim, fees are $10/bottle. 

Sorry, I didn't realize I was getting word out before the website was updated with the competition information!

Our webmaster will get the info and forms up asap!

Best,

Andy


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## Boatboy24

Dang! This deadline snuck up on me. Wonder what it'll cost for me to ship tomorrow and get to LA by Friday.


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## ibglowin

The nice thing about this competition is that the entries get shipped to a business and not a residence so shipping is like 50% less for some reason. It's still pretty warm this week in LA.


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## Boatboy24

ibglowin said:


> The nice thing about this competition is that the entries get shipped to a business and not a residence so shipping is like 50% less for some reason. It's still pretty warm this week in LA.



I just paid $11.45 to ship 2 bottles to @JohnT . That's gonna be tough to beat.


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## ibglowin

Couldn't you have just driven them to his house for even cheaper? What is it 200 miles? 



Boatboy24 said:


> I just paid $11.45 to ship 2 bottles to @JohnT . That's gonna be tough to beat.


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## Kraffty

Thanks for the reminder, just shipped 3 bottles, $8.94, should be there tomorrow. 
Mike


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## cmsben61

They extended the date to 11/14 for entry


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## Kraffty

results are in! cellarmasters.org.
Two medals and an honorable mention.
How'd everyone else do?
Mike


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## Kraffty

Is Joe Pauline our "Joeswine" ? Coffee Port best of show award
Mike


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## Amanda660

Sent all ports - 3 medals and a BOC. Pretty awesome day


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## Boatboy24

Kraffty said:


> Is Joe Pauline our "Joeswine" ? Coffee Port best of show award
> Mike



That's our Joe. Looks like he took a handful of Silvers as well.

Congrats Joe. That wine continues to impress!


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## Boatboy24

Amanda660 said:


> Sent all ports - 3 medals and a BOC. Pretty awesome day



Congrats! Great showing!!


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## cmsben61

What does BOC mean?


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## Boatboy24

cmsben61 said:


> What does BOC mean?



Best of Class?


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## cmsben61

Thanks. I was wondering because I won a honorable mention and a BOC


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## Kraffty

caongrate to you! Good group we have here, I know there's more winners, Mike


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## cmsben61

Same to you Mike!
Ben


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## BernardSmith

Looks like I took a bronze for my date wine.


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## cmsben61

congratulations!


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## joeswine

yes that's me


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## Kraffty

Then Congratulations to you too Joe! Great job
Mike


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## joeswine

*cellar masters*

To all those who entered WHETHER YOU, win ,place or show , always remember your competing not against everyone else, but yourself, keep developing your skills ,never quit and always *''THINK OUT SIDE THE BOX''*


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## joeswine

How many of us entered?just interested and of those how many entered our contest?


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## BernardSmith

I entered both


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## cmsben61

I also entered both


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## Amanda660

I entered both.


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## joeswine

When you get your findings back ,we can either discuss them in a PM format or open,I was not on all the flights ,but on most,


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## Kraffty

Me too and won silver at both for my strawberry. Consistent judging. Mike


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## brewbush

Congrats!!!


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## barbiek

Joe when should we receive the results? Thanks


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## joeswine

As far as our contest goes Johnt is on vacation,when he returns he'll make that decision.to send metals and scores back in one movement.
..As far as cellar masters goes I would think sometime in December,there annual meeting is in January around the 16th.Im sending two more bottles of the Coffee Port out to them as they requested along with the process they then discuss with in there meeting's the winners,BOS and the merits of them .at least that's how they explained it to me.When you do get your awards from them post them proudly,for know matter where you scored you tried ,learn and always THINK OUTSIDE THE BOX.and thanks.


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## dcbrown73

Congrats to the winners. I hope to participate at some point soon.


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## Kraffty

I received my notes and ribbons over the weekend, I'm probably a day or two ahead of most of you being on the west coast. The notes on my 14 cabernet made me realize I need to invest is some additional testing equipment in order to improve. Notes also made me realize that judging can be subjective and vary quite a bit. My strawberry had scores of 19.5, 17, 18 and 13 (what the heck was he drinking?) and got a silver that could have been gold except for Mister 13.


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## joeswine

Sometimes judging doesn't seem consistent After 20 years of competition you grow to understand that so the difference is win ,place or show you win.to me sending out my product and seeing what the ribbon response is,meaning,lets say I send out a pino noir,t o three different contest over a shot span of time.Of the consensus is the wine is a silver and nothing more.But if it floats from top to bottom then the wine isn't of a constant value across the board and then it's the contest itself,does everyone win? That's why I do like smaller venues but tighter judging.Ex.This year at the Great white contest,very tight judging and if there was a question it was asked.However on larger contest your compare on a massive scale and sometimes the wine's tend to blend together,. Or yours is just that good and stands out to all the standards of the wine style and process.Competition is very subjective so I like the ribbon theory,( no matter were I send it it's a silver /then it's a silver).


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## ibglowin

I had one of those last year when I entered the same competition! Sent in three wines and 3 out of 4 judges scored all wines either gold or silver. One judge scored all 3 either bronze or just slightly less than......... 




Kraffty said:


> I received my notes and ribbons over the weekend, I'm probably a day or two ahead of most of you being on the west coast. The notes on my 14 cabernet made me realize I need to invest is some additional testing equipment in order to improve. Notes also made me realize that judging can be subjective and vary quite a bit. My strawberry had scores of 19.5, 17, 18 and 13 (what the heck was he drinking?) and got a silver that could have been gold except for Mister 13.


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## joeswine

Without destroying judges no matter what there knowledge of wine is ,is that sometimes amateur judges really don't know what the true characteristic of particular wine is,especiall trying to deseminate the northern varietalsost people I talk to haven't a clue what the term Foxy means,its all subjective but fun. I notice not one person ask about there scores with the great white contest and that would have been a good topic.


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## Kraffty

I do have a question for those "in the know". 20-18 was gold, 18-16 was silver and 16-14 was bronze. So how is a wine with a score of 18 judged either gold or silver? How is that decided?

Mike


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## BernardSmith

joeswine said:


> Without destroying judges no matter what there knowledge of wine is ,is that sometimes amateur judges really don't know what the true characteristic of particular wine is,especiall trying to deseminate the northern varietalsost people I talk to haven't a clue what the term Foxy means,its all subjective but fun. I notice not one person ask about there scores with the great white contest and that would have been a good topic.



Don't want to hijack this thread but is competition only about hitting the "true characteristic of a particular wine"... What if the wine being made has no "true characteristic" because too few people have ever tasted a wine made from this or that fruit or have ever tasted "enough" wines made under this or that name to be able to determine what the possible "characteristics" of the wine are and which of those are the most desirable? What should a t'ej taste like or for that matter what should a braggot or a bochet taste like that allows anyone to say that this or that bottle nails the character? What if it nails a very different character... but one the judge/s think is delightful? And if looking to see how closely to the "target" a wine comes is the work of a judge why are published "targets" so amorphous, (your point about a wine being "foxy" ) as to be less than helpful if you were aiming to score a bulls-eye?


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## ibglowin

Usually its:

*17 - 20 Wines of outstanding characteristics having no defects 
13 - 16 Standard wines with neither oustanding character or defect 
9 - 12 Wines of commercial acceptability with noticeable defects 
*


Kraffty said:


> I do have a question for those "in the know". 20-18 was gold, 18-16 was silver and 16-14 was bronze. So how is a wine with a score of 18 judged either gold or silver? How is that decided?
> 
> Mike


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## joeswine

*Kraffty*,just my op pion,20 to 18 ,18 to 16, and 16 to 14.usually its scored by total points not a single judgment.You got your overall scores dropped because one judge didn't like the style or taste of the wine. That through your total score into a tail spin, or maybe he or she didn't match up your work with what they understood to be that style of wine they imprinted on. Make sense? been their done that also I understand your question there's know sound answer. You live with the results.
*Benardsmith**,I can see what your getting at,, but understand this all wine contest have standards to which they go by and characteristics which are a key profiles by categories that is why you send them in that way..*so standards are set and profiles are given, now if you make a wine with a blend that doesn't have a true taste profile and enter it in a contest more than likely you'll not place yet alone win or show do to the simple fact that the taste profile isn't of a set norm. I have encountered that a lot with my tweaking of wines,Ex,what started out as a PINO nior now has blackberries in the mix someone who knows PINO my taste it and say (no that's not PINO). foxy is a characteristic give to most northern American vitals. If you know the profile of the varietal your working with whether it's, grapes, juice or kit, meaning if a judge knows this wine in front of them and the style they should understand the profile and the term ( foxy). We had 2 like that in our great white wine contest an you could taste the deference instantly and see the expressions on the peoples faces as they tasted them not sure what they were tasting but it was different. Remember my thinking send it to a few events and if the common consensus comes back a silver then it's a silver, the one positive feedback I get from contest is not the verbiage is the standings. I get the real findings from people around me being honest with me when I ask them "how did it taste?" really! and then I adjust, and then I question them .


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## acorad

Hi guys, I'm glad you all have received your medals and feedback from the judges! 

I've been reading the comments here and I have what I hope are some answers for your questions. 

I've been judging at the US Amateur for over 15 years now. One thing I am so pleased to see is that the overall quality of the wines that are submitted today are far, far, above those submitted 15 years ago. 

We are all continuing to improve, and that is fantastic!

Hopefully the comments from the judges, who in the US Amateur are almost always either home winemakers or spouses of home winemakers, are helpful in improving our winemaking skills.

Regarding judging, scores, and medals. We strive to ensure that all of the judges are as consistent as possible. However, the pesky truth is that judges are human and that means training judges is somewhat like training cats.  

In particular, we all have individual tastes and aromas that we are particularly sensitive to or insensitive to. 

For example, I have had very few wines with the classic "barnyard" brettanomyces infection, and therefor I still struggle with finding it in a wine. However, friends of mine who drink a lot of French wines can smell brett from across the room. On the other hand, for some reason, my wife and I (unfortunately for us) are finely attuned to corked wines and even the slightest amount of TCA ruins the entire bottle for us.

Those are just a couple examples, but judging wine in a competition where one of the main goals is to give feedback to help winemakers improve, requires that the judges focus on finding the problems, the "faults," in a wine. So a some judges will pick up faults that other judges on the same panel are not as attuned to, leading to some variance in scores. 

If there are noticeable faults in a wine, the faults should be discussed in the comment section by the judge. 

Also, our judges are put on panels according to their strengths. White wine drinkers judge white wines. Beer makers judge the beer-involved entries. Judges who are originally from the east coast and have a lot of experience with east coast varietals, judge them. Fruit winemakers judge the fruit wines. Etc., etc.

Additionally, all of the US Amateur judges go through multiple training sessions. And if a judge has been around for a number of years, as most of them have been, they've often been through dozens of training sessions. 

Lastly, as you can see on the judging forms, there are multiple judges on each panel and each judge initially scores the wine individually. Then the panel - as a whole - agrees on the final Medal award. 

So while I know the score and the medals are important to us all, hopefully the comments are the real "gold" and will give us all some guidance in how to continue to improve our craft. 

Anyway, I thank you all for participating, and I look forward to seeing how much better the homewines are 15 years from now!

Best,

Andy Coradeschi


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## cmsben61




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## BernardSmith

Got my medal and feedback yesterday. Nice details


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## Boatboy24

cmsben61 said:


> Best of class



Congrats! Well done!!

Was that a kit, bucket, grapes?


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## cmsben61

Boatboy24 said:


> Congrats! Well done!!
> 
> Was that a kit, bucket, grapes?



A WE selection kit


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## joeswine

I'm going to share with all of you my wins at Cellarmasters and a defeat, first I'll set the players. Then we can break down the judging in each individual win so that you can see what or what not they missed or how consistent they were and how the end results came to be..lets start with the Rojo Blanco, this was *made with my own fpac. about 13%abv*. The_ first picture is incorrect_ *the last is the ROJO BLANCO.*


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## Amanda660

Four dessert wine entries - 3 gold and 1 silver. Feeling rather good about my dessert wines (thanks Joe). Lesson learned would be to put a little more effort into naming - seriously "blend" was the best description I could come up with....Lordy. The score sheets are priceless - we'll done. Sorry didn't feel like dragging my butt downstairs to bring up bottles - long day.


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