# Homemade Oak Chips?



## CheerfulHeart (Nov 30, 2014)

I live on a farm and have a small grove of oak trees. I would like to use chips from these trees to oak some of my wines someday. Has anyone here tried making homemade oak chips? I am thinking about soaking the wood in sanitizer then using a power washer to rinse it before I turn the wood into chips. Does this sound feasible?


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## sour_grapes (Nov 30, 2014)

First of all, which species of oak?


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## WVMountaineerJack (Nov 30, 2014)

Powerwashing would remove the sanitizer that has soaked into the wood? Maybe some homework is needed. The oak has to be dried before you can begin to use it. Does soaking wood in sanitizer really sound like a good idea? All oak is not equal. You could probably get enough chips for aging wine with a hatchet, you could then dry the chips and toast them in your oven. Maybe drop some in a finished bottle of wine first and see what kind of flavor profile you get? WVMJ



CheerfulHeart said:


> I live on a farm and have a small grove of oak trees. I would like to use chips from these trees to oak some of my wines someday. Has anyone here tried making homemade oak chips? I am thinking about soaking the wood in sanitizer then using a power washer to rinse it before I turn the wood into chips. Does this sound feasible?


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## Tenbears (Nov 30, 2014)

Local Oak can be used for Oaking wine with good results. But you must take some things into consideration. First the location of the trees. I never select oak from lowland areas or within 200 yards of a water course. If you happen to live in West Virginia down stream from Monsanto or Westvaco. I would not take trees closer than 1/2 mile from a major water course. Ridge top oak is great. select wood from the trunk about 1/2 way up. cut it from the center. This will be old oak, depending on the tree it could be hundreds of years. Trees grow from the outside so the center wood will be uncontaminated by twentieth Century technology. Dry the oak at temperatures of 160F will remove moisture while keeping the natural enhancements of the oak. Light toasting can be done in the oven at 300F and darker toasting can be done By placing the oak in a clean paint can which can be bought new from most paint stores. place the oak in the can. seal, and punch a few holes in the lid. place the can in the hot coals of a fire. Check frequently and remove when desired toasting is achieved.


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## Floandgary (Nov 30, 2014)

RED OAK,,, RED OAK,,, RED OAK... Not WHITE OAK. White Oak carries too much bitterness to be of any benefit to wine. Also you can cut the dried oak into various size sticks,, cubes,, or spirals. Toasting helps bring sugars to the surface

http://www.brickpackaging.com/ Might be able to glean some info from this site!


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## CheerfulHeart (Nov 30, 2014)

I appreciate the good advice offered. The oak trees are mainly of the live variety, with a few white for good measure. I will avoid the white oak. I live in the Sierra Nevada mountains about 2 miles from the nearest major water course. I realize now that my preoccupation with sanitizing my winemaking things may have been a tad overzealous. The toasting methods sound fairly easy. My plan is to oak the wine lightly.


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## sour_grapes (Nov 30, 2014)

Floandgary said:


> RED OAK,,, RED OAK,,, RED OAK... Not WHITE OAK. White Oak carries too much bitterness to be of any benefit to wine. Also you can cut the dried oak into various size sticks,, cubes,, or spirals. Toasting helps bring sugars to the surface
> 
> http://www.brickpackaging.com/ Might be able to glean some info from this site!



I am no expert, but my understanding is that FloandGary have it exactly backwards. White Oak (Quercus alba) is the preferred species in North America: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oak_(wine)#Oak_types_and_sources


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## sour_grapes (Nov 30, 2014)

Oh, and others have told me not to use red oak:



WI_Wino said:


> Nope, the stuff you buy at LHBS is white oak. I have heard that red oak imparts a cat urine taste/smell (no joke).


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## Enologo (Nov 30, 2014)

*May Sound Crazy*

This may sound crazy but has anyone ever tried or heard of repurposing left over oak flooring for oaking the wine??


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## Sage (Nov 30, 2014)

Enologo said:


> This may sound crazy but has anyone ever tried or heard of repurposing left over oak flooring for oaking the wine??



Just think about what might have been carried in on peoples shoes (think farmer or dog kennel) and you will pass on that idea!!


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## Runningwolf (Nov 30, 2014)

Tenbears, you offer lots of great information. Have you made some of your own. I found it very interesting and it makes sense to me. Did you find a good source on the internet for making oak chips or sticks?

WHITE American Oak ONLY!!

There are many types of oak trees in America but the species used for oaking wine is American White Oak (Quecus alba). Quercus alba grows throughout the Eastern US and is commonly found in Missouri. American cooperages predominantly produce barrels for the Bourbon industry. Because of the demand, whisky makers like Scotland’s ‘The Macallan’ own forests in the United States. American oak tends to be in less demand for wine barrel use.

Where American Oak Shines

American oak imparts a lot of flavor. Wine experts often describe the American oak flavors as dill, coconut and vanilla. One thing is for sure, it adds ruggedness to clean fruit-forward new world wines. Examples of American wine producers who’ve championed the use of American oak include Silver Oak and 5 Star Cellars.
American oak wine barrel grain size

American White Oak grain sizes tend to have looser grains than both French and Eastern European Oak (Quercus robur)

Cost American Oak barrels cost a minimum of $360-$500 a barrel depending on quality.

Red oak is also said to give wine the taste of cat pee.

http://winefolly.com/review/oaking-wine/

http://blog.eckraus.com/blog/wine-making-tricks-and-tips/making-your-own-toasted-oak

[ame]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JaftDC2Aj6A[/ame]


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## Sage (Nov 30, 2014)

> "Red oak is also said to give wine the taste of cat pee."
> 
> THAT was a dedicated wine taster to try both so he could get a comparison!!


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## GreginND (Nov 30, 2014)

Enologo said:


> This may sound crazy but has anyone ever tried or heard of repurposing left over oak flooring for oaking the wine??



I would be very worried about the varnishes, polishes, and other sundry products that are great on the floor, but not so great in your glass.


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## Tenbears (Nov 30, 2014)

Runningwolf said:


> Tenbears, you offer lots of great information. Have you made some of your own. I found it very interesting and it makes sense to me. Did you find a good source on the internet for making oak chips or sticks?
> 
> WHITE American Oak ONLY!!
> 
> ...



I have and do indeed harvest and process my own oak. and have for many years.

My experiences come not from the internet, but from many years of trial and error, I grew up dirt floor poor as a result anything I needed, or wanted I had to make, scavenge, or invent. The habit has stayed with me throughout my entire life. I derive a great sense of satisfaction in the knowledge I did it myself. Naturally I have to accept some degree of imperfection until I refine things. But in an imperfect world, the concept of perfection is over rated.

Most are correct white oak is by far superior. However red oak can deliver some pleasing results if well toasted, and not overused. Chestnut oak also delivers great results in meads made from darker honey. Water oak yields little as an agent for whine or mead as it imparts little to the beverage. Pin oak is of no use, no matter how you dry, toast, roast cut, or otherwise manipulate it. That is the oak that imparts the cat pee smell and flavor. 

Now I am not proposing that processing ones own oak is ideal for everyone, or even economical, but under the right circumstances it can be. It certainly is rewarding and fun.


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## Tenbears (Nov 30, 2014)

GreginND said:


> I would be very worried about the varnishes, polishes, and other sundry products that are great on the floor, but not so great in your glass.



I get the feeling the OP was referring to the left over ends and small pieces from new oak floor installation. before it is sealed, stained, or varnished. In any case it too would be oak of undetermined quality, and origin.


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## CheerfulHeart (Nov 30, 2014)

Oops...scratch the Live Oak. I will use the White Oak instead.


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## spunk (Nov 30, 2014)

Hey guys would the same rule apply to using the different type of leaves for making oak leave wine and mead?


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## Enologo (Dec 1, 2014)

Tenbears said:


> I get the feeling the OP was referring to the left over ends and small pieces from new oak floor installation. before it is sealed, stained, or varnished. In any case it too would be oak of undetermined quality, and origin.



Yes definately was referring to material that was never installed. Like I said probably a crazy idea. Like you Tenbears I usually make or invent anything I need so of course I hate to see anything go to waste.


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## richmke (Dec 1, 2014)

Enologo said:


> Yes definately was referring to material that was never installed.



I would still be concerned about what they did to the oak. While they may have not applied the finishing coat, who knows what they did to the wood to prepare it for taking the stain and years of pounding.


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## berrycrush (Dec 1, 2014)

Tenbears said:


> Local Oak can be used for Oaking wine with good results. But you must take some things into consideration. First the location of the trees. I never select oak from lowland areas or within 200 yards of a water course. If you happen to live in West Virginia down stream from Monsanto or Westvaco. I would not take trees closer than 1/2 mile from a major water course. Ridge top oak is great. select wood from the trunk about 1/2 way up. cut it from the center. This will be old oak, depending on the tree it could be hundreds of years. Trees grow from the outside so the center wood will be uncontaminated by twentieth Century technology. Dry the oak at temperatures of 160F will remove moisture while keeping the natural enhancements of the oak. Light toasting can be done in the oven at 300F and darker toasting can be done By placing the oak in a clean paint can which can be bought new from most paint stores. place the oak in the can. seal, and punch a few holes in the lid. place the can in the hot coals of a fire. Check frequently and remove when desired toasting is achieved.



How do you deal with the heavy smoke from the oven and sometimes fire?


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## Tenbears (Dec 1, 2014)

berrycrush said:


> How do you deal with the heavy smoke from the oven and sometimes fire?



I take it you have never used lightly toasted oak. Lightly toasted is not much more than kiln dries. There is no smoke, and no fire In fact wood requires temperatures greater than 662F to ignite.


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## Floandgary (Dec 4, 2014)

OMG!!! 10,000,000 pardons for my grand foopah. Had my brain somewhere else when I submitted that.  White oak for sure. Or maybe it was just a test to see if anyone was watching! Yeah,, that's the ticket!


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## DaveMcC (Dec 27, 2021)

I know this posting is old, but if anyone comes across it researching toasting oak for winemaking, this is absolutely incorrect. Red oak is NOT used in barrel (or oak additives) for wine. Too many off flavors and chemistry not conducible to good wine flavors. White oak IS the preferred north American species to use and the one used exclusively by N. American cooperages.


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## winemaker81 (Dec 28, 2021)

It's an interesting read. Another problem is using oak products not processed for winemaking, especially flooring products. It's not possible to know what building products are treated with, which could be poisonous.

An old saying is, "the longest distance between two points is a shortcut". When looking at "cheaper" solutions, it's best to think it through and look for the potential pitfalls.


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## jburtner (Dec 28, 2021)

I bought a whiskey 1/2 barrel planter from HD - Broke it up and cut the staves/head down to roughly finger sized removing the outer layers of wood and char in the process - exposing fresh oak. Then toast some up in the oven for a couple hours @ 350, 375, 400*F... Smells great and no smoke... Drop one or two into a carboy for a couple months... The barrel only cost like $35 @ HD and there's enough oak (white oak & barrel quality) to last me for years..

Cheers!
-johann


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