# Rattlesnake Hills Cab



## cgallamo (Jan 31, 2017)

Hi all,

I was wondering if anyone had tried the 2016 pails from Wine Grapes Direct? I'm thinking about giving the Cab a go.

Chris


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## Mismost (Jan 31, 2017)

No...but now I do have visions of rattlesnakes curled around grapevines. Thanks for that!


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## ibglowin (Jan 31, 2017)

Its a good AVA that is for sure.


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## cgallamo (Jan 31, 2017)

Well - I guess I'll be the gunea pig then - I went ahead and ordered. 

I'll update once I get it rolling.


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## ColemanM (Jan 31, 2017)

Sorry. Late to the thread. I have it sitting in glass going through mlf right now. Two buckets pressed with the blichman wineasy produced after gross lees 6.25 gallons. Could have gotten more with ratchet press I'm guessing. Worried about too much head space in carboy so have actually not tasted yet. I'll taste tomorrow and let you know what you're in for.


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## ibglowin (Feb 1, 2017)

Did you end up paying $155 a pail? Is that price with shipping?

I am coming up with $9 a bottle (finished wine) all said and done!


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## ColemanM (Feb 2, 2017)

Plus $30 per pail shipping. The cost of doing business in Minnesota [emoji33]


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## Boatboy24 (Feb 3, 2017)

Did you taste it? I'm dying to hear your thoughts.


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## AZMDTed (Feb 3, 2017)

Normally rattlesnakes don't bother me, but having lived in Arizona for 26 years there was always one myth that you'd hear occasionally. Now it's happened, thank goodness it was Texas. 

http://www.abc15.com/news/national/texas-family-finds-rattlesnake-in-toilet-more-underneath-home

Okay, back to wine.


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## ColemanM (Feb 3, 2017)

[emoji19] not sure what to say about that Ted.


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## ColemanM (Feb 3, 2017)

I'll taste it tomorrow. Life and cleaning and 6 year old birthday parties just keep popping up!! Promise. Though I may be three sheets to the wind by the time I get to it, but I will taste it!!


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## brewbush (Feb 4, 2017)

I am doing that one. I did 2 buckets of the cab and cofermented it with a merlot bucket. Just finished mlf and racked it over to a carboy. This one may be the best tasting red I have done so far!!


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## cgallamo (Feb 7, 2017)

Sounds great guys! I'm picking my two pails up Friday.


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## cgallamo (Feb 12, 2017)

I just heard from Andrew they are working on doing a bulk shipment to Atlanta and they are dropping prices and eliminating shipping. I'm thinking of doing a few more pails and blending. Any thoughts on a good blend for the Zin? Mouvedre, Durell Syrah?

I'll probably ferment separately and blend to taste...


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## Tnuscan (Feb 12, 2017)

cgallamo said:


> I just heard from Andrew they are working on doing a bulk shipment to Atlanta and they are dropping prices and eliminating shipping. I'm thinking of doing a few more pails (he said the Zin is now $90) and blending. Any thoughts on a good blend for the Zin? Mouvedre, Durell Syrah?
> 
> I'll probably ferment separately and blend to taste...



I would like info on when, where and how to get pails in Atlanta. Thanks! PM me if you wish.


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## ibglowin (Feb 12, 2017)

If they drop prices and or toss in free shipping I will snag several for sure! Keep us posted.


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## Johnd (Feb 12, 2017)

cgallamo said:


> I just heard from Andrew they are working on doing a bulk shipment to Atlanta and they are dropping prices and eliminating shipping. I'm thinking of doing a few more pails (he said the Zin is now $90) and blending. Any thoughts on a good blend for the Zin? Mouvedre, Durell Syrah?
> 
> I'll probably ferment separately and blend to taste...



I'm with @ibglowin If they're dropping their prices a bit and shipping is reasonable, I'll be all over 30 or 40 gallons of the Rattlesnake Cab. That'll be my spring fling for 2017. Keep us posted.


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## cgallamo (Feb 13, 2017)

Hi all,

I reached out to Andrew, and he is happy to take emails directly - [email protected]. For those of you in Atlanta you can get in on the bulk shipment.

Chris


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## cgallamo (Mar 24, 2017)

*pails in!*

Guys - got the pails yesterday. They are bathed in SO2 and still warming. Going to make a "Cab" and a "Zin". Here is the plan:

*Cab* - Two pails cab, one pail Merlot, one pail Mouvedre (rolling the dice that this combination turns out well. Mouvedre adds aromatics, gets me to the right brix, and moves me closer on acid levels.
Tested Numbers - Brix 24.8, PH 3.77, TA (estimate) .55
Running this one with Lallzyme EX, then adding tannins and oak, BDX yeast and fermaid K half at cap and half at 1/3 sugar depletion

*Zin*
Two pails Lodi Zin and 1/2 pail Mourvedre going to blend with Syrah/Mourvedre after ferment and tasting using Lallzyme EX-V on these - pulled 3/4 gallon juice for a rose and to bump up the flavors in the zin
Zin pails numbers - Brix 25.4, PH 3.51, TA (estimate) .5
planning to ferment on AMH to bring out the spice - but not sure I can get it dry (morewinemaking says AMH only good to %15 Rockpile to %16)
Syrah/Mourvedre numbers - Brix 23.5, PH 3.5, TA (estimate) 5.6
Planning to ferment on Rockpile 

I have two Vadai Hungarian Oak 50L barrels that each of these will go into after MLF.

So looking for your thoughts. I do not want to water down the Zin, so what should I do to get it dry? Blend with the Rockpile batch when it gets close to completion? Also should I add acid to the Zin batch to get the TA up or wait and test later?


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## Boatboy24 (Mar 24, 2017)

Your Zin numbers look just fine to me. Brix might be a tad high, but I wouldn't worry about it. I did a Lanza Zin last fall with starting Brix of 25.6, fermented with RP15 and it went to 0.996 with no issues. I imagine you'd be fine with AMH. Keep in mind it is slow. Worst case, if it gets stuck, you can throw some EC-1118 in there to finish it off. With proper temps and nutrient levels, I doubt that'll be necessary though.

Starting pH of 3.51 should get you around 3.6-ish after MLF. Not sure how you're estimating TA, but unless you're certain, stick w/ pH.


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## Boatboy24 (Mar 24, 2017)

Anyone doing a bulk order for DC? I noticed he has that listed. I'd only want two buckets, but would get in on a bulk order if one is being made. Looks like 20 bucket min.


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## cgallamo (Mar 24, 2017)

Boatboy24 said:


> Starting pH of 3.51 should get you around 3.6-ish after MLF. Not sure how you're estimating TA, but unless you're certain, stick w/ pH.



Thanks for the reply. I have some EC-1118 in the fridge - now that is my insurance policy. Great thought. 

I'm estimating TA by doing the math on what it is supposed to be from winegrapesdirect website. I like the idea of just managing the PH because I don't have a TA test.


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## heatherd (Mar 24, 2017)

Boatboy24 said:


> Anyone doing a bulk order for DC? I noticed he has that listed. I'd only want two buckets, but would get in on a bulk order if one is being made. Looks like 20 bucket min.



I would be in for 2-3 buckets in DC, if we got some more VA and MD makers involved.


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## Johnd (Mar 24, 2017)

Agree with Jim on the Zin Brix. Consider the EX-V for both batches, especially since a cab is a longer aging wine, and that's what it's for !!


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## cgallamo (Mar 25, 2017)

Ok now on day three. So used EX-V on both batches. Must was still cool around 55 degrees in the evening but I rehydrated and pitched yeast anyway.


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## cgallamo (Mar 25, 2017)

put a warming blanket on the Zin (AMH)


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## cgallamo (Mar 26, 2017)

Zin on AMH finally just starting. Stirred and tasted. Tastes like a bramble berry cobbler.


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## cgallamo (Mar 26, 2017)

Also should get 3 or 4 bottles of heavy Rose out of the deal (a few skins snuck into the batch). Just racked. This is the cellar at 55 degrees. These temps on yeasts should be take with a grain of salt. This one is only supposed to work to 64.


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## cgallamo (Apr 6, 2017)

Quick update - Last night Cab/Merlot was at .998, Zin at 1.022, Syrah at 1.008. I only wanted to do one pressing so they were all moved to glass. Have referred back to @Johnd "spaniards" and @stickman "Pinot Noir words of wisdom" several times as a frame of reference.

- Did the co-inoculation on 3/27 with the first addition of Fermaid K
- As must temps rose into the high 70s low 80s on 3/27 and 3/28, I noticed the a whiff of H2S
- I stepfed the 2nd half of Fermaid K and stirred up the lees off the bottom often
- This stirring lowered the must temperature back to mid to low 70s room temp 68-70
- H2S gone by 3/30 - no redulees or copper added

When should I run an MLF Chromo? Wait till fermentation is fully complete? 

Here are some photos. 
- Cab/Merlot carboys and its color (flavor is fruity, can taste acid in balance with soft tannins - not as big as hoped, but delicious for sure. Maybe some oak time will bring it along).
- Seconds going in the Brute
- And the beautiful pressing blocks stained burgundy


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## Johnd (Apr 6, 2017)

cgallamo said:


> When should I run an MLF Chromo? Wait till fermentation is fully complete?



Sounds like you've pressed and your wine is in carboys, I typically will rack off of the gross lees somewhere between days 2 and 3 to leave that sludge behind. After that point, wait maybe 2 weeks to do a chromo, I've had some close to finished at that point, but not all. Run a test every couple of weeks on each carboy, as they finish, give each finished carboy two more weeks (insurance) and then hit them with the appropriate dose of SO2. You can rack again at SO2 time if needed. From then on it's gravy, rack and maintain SO2 every 3 or so months and barrel age if you're doing that.


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## cgallamo (Apr 6, 2017)

Johnd said:


> Sounds like you've pressed and your wine is in carboys, I typically will rack off of the gross lees somewhere between days 2 and 3 to leave that sludge behind. After that point, wait maybe 2 weeks to do a chromo, I've had some close to finished at that point, but not all. Run a test every couple of weeks on each carboy, as they finish, give each finished carboy two more weeks (insurance) and then hit them with the appropriate dose of SO2. You can rack again at SO2 time if needed. From then on it's gravy, rack and maintain SO2 every 3 or so months and barrel age if you're doing that.



Cool thanks! Going into two 50L barrels. 

When do I clean the basement


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## Johnd (Apr 6, 2017)

cgallamo said:


> When do I clean the basement



If you're smart, as soon as Mrs. cgallamo says it's looking a little unkempt down there......


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## cgallamo (Apr 6, 2017)

Maybe I'll just order more pails to stave off the inevitable...


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## cgallamo (Apr 20, 2017)

Ok so ran the Chromo. The first is the Cabernet blend, 2nd is the Zin blend, third is my 2nds off the combined must (I did not add MLF culture a 2nd time), and the last one is a Merlot I did in the fall. I did not add MLF culture. So what was I drinking last night? You got it! - a very acidic homemade merlot.

Am I seeing that MLF is underway in the first three, and perhaps mostly done? Thanks!


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## stickman (Apr 20, 2017)

It looks like your Zin and 2nd is done, the Cab has a little malic left. The citric spots are visible just above the tartaric.


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## cgallamo (Apr 20, 2017)

stickman said:


> It looks like your Zin and 2nd is done, the Cab has a little malic left. The citric spots are visible just above the tartaric.



Citric acid is visible? I did not realize you saw that in this chart. Thanks!


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## stickman (Apr 20, 2017)

If you let the ML go long enough, the citric will be consumed also, the bacteria prefer malic, but will use citric once the malic is gone.


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## cgallamo (Apr 21, 2017)

Ok wrapping up this post for awhile unless issues arise. Cab blend tastes awesome. Got the spicey notes I was looking for in the Zin, but it is a little "thinner" tasting than the cab. Love the aromatics. Thanks to all, especially @JohnD, @stickman, and @Boatboy24!


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