# Six Gallons Walmart Apple Juice - Suggestions?



## beggarsu (Apr 14, 2014)

I bought six gallons Walmart apple juice says on label "low acid".

(12 times 1.89 litre jugs = 22.68 - six gallons (22.71 litres). Amazing how exact that works out!

I bought the 12 plastic bottles $2 dollars each plus recycling and other fees - $2.32 times 12 = $27.87
Which is expensive compared to Skeeter Pee or Dragon's Blood. 

Cheaper than a kit, but I'm doing this to experiment with home recipes. 


Recipe suggestions ie other ingredients? 

I am thinking cinimmon? 
Some kind of spice? 
Add a pound of raisons for body?
???
...
Should I do anything to add acid? I don't have a tester and it's very difficult to get one at present. So the tester has to be human taste.
Maybe add another fruit or fuit concentrate to up the acid or is "low acid" of apple juice a good taste for wine?


I could go for a lower ABV cooler (6-7) or a high ABV wine (11-12). Does this type of cooler taste good with seven-up or some type of soda when you serve it?

I was thinking about carbonation - I read one person said they made low ABV and carbonated. Do people carbonate in wine corked bottles? - in that case I wonder how long the carbonation would last and if aging a carbonated wine (lying on it's side) is practical?


thanks for any suggestions.


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## djrockinsteve (Apr 14, 2014)

I made an apple wine from WalMart apple juice. Musselman's to be exact. It's a shame, it was cheaper than me pressing bought cider apples.

I would suggest simmer it down to half volume to intensify the flavor. Most likely need to add a little acid, without a test it's hard to say. You can add cinnamon after it has cleared and age it a few months. I did mine a year. Turned out very well. I used 1 cinnamon stick per gallon.

You can add some pear juice for a little but still great flavor. A cup of washed raisins will help to add body.

Start out about 1.080 if you can so you don't over power the flavor. Back sweeten to taste.

If you do a secondary fermentation you will need champagne bottles because wine bottles will explode under pressure.


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## sour_grapes (Apr 14, 2014)

beggarsu said:


> (12 times 1.89 litre jugs = 22.68 - six gallons (22.71 litres). Amazing how exact that works out!



Geee, now I wonder why your Walmart would sell jugs in that nice, round quantity of 1.89 liters... Hmmmm, let me think.... Nope, can't think of why they would have chosen that number.


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## byathread (Apr 15, 2014)

I've turned out several good ciders (and cysers) over the years with store bought juice. You can add a few cans of (preservative-free) apple juice concentrate to up the flavor (and potential ABV). I personally enjoy dry ciders and often added "tannin galalcool" (now called "tannin ft blanc soft" - avail from morewinemaking) to help achieve a nicer mouthfeel, then carbonated in beer bottles, or stabilized/kegged if doing any back-sweetening.

Alternatively, you could make a sweet and spicy cyser by adding 2.5 lbs of honey/gallon plus raisins, cinnamon, ginger, allspice, a couple cloves. Or search the forums for Apfelwein recipe.

I guess the question is WHAT do you like to drink, and WHEN do you plan to drink it?


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## byathread (Apr 15, 2014)

sour_grapes said:


> Geee, now I wonder why your Walmart would sell jugs in that nice, round quantity of 1.89 liters... Hmmmm, let me think.... Nope, can't think of why they would have chosen that number.



Hmmm, let's just call it FATE!


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## beggarsu (Apr 23, 2014)

OK 1.89 litres is 1/2 a US gallon so it makes the jugs interchangeable on the US and Canadian markets in Walmart stores just with different labels. 



Thanks for the responses.

However, the responses are discouraging - It seems to be that I might have to buy many more expensive ingredients to make this work. But I will try to work with what I have since I already got the juice. 

The cost thereof for supermarket ingredients becomes a little pointless if the expense skyrockets. - I might as well buy kits or try some different ingredients. The trouble is supermarket ingredients were meant to be eaten (so there is a premium for freshness) and are only available in small amounts at premium prices. 
Unless perhaps at box stores - unfortunately I'm not near one by a hundred miles.
And paying premium for freshness is pointless since the "eating freshness" value is gone by processing them. 
eg I saw strawberries on for $4 for 2 pounds but then looked at the recipes here and the amount of #'s in those recipes make the cost of fresh strawberries for a 6 gallon batch astronomical maybe $200 -250 so scratch that idea! 
.. 
Thus maybe best is buy concentrates, frozen or jams for fruits.

I like to try to beat the pricing system, not have it beat me.



Doubling the Walmart's Apple juice (by boiling to half) would bring the price of that basic ingredient alone to $60 for which I could buy a first level premium wine kit. Actually get them on sale about $53 sometimes basic price range 60 to 160 - I think my brew store has Spagnols 3-4 grades of wine kits going up in cost $60 to $140-$160.


Honey at 2.5 pounds per gallon at $10 per pound (I think ) brings the cost of adding "taste" to $150 on top of basic ingredients - seems a little expensive.

====>


I've already bought the juice so I'll go ahead with the following plan of which I've just finished buying the ingredients:

12 jugs apple juice = 6 gallons ($27.72 include of bottle charges)
8 cans minute maid orange (I think it's an orange mix) (70 cents * 8 ) = $5.60 
Sultana Raisins - I bought 1000 gms about 2.2 pounds for $7.60 (inexpensive!) but I think I will use only 1 or 2 cups.
Bananas - I bought 4 pounds at 1.50 per kilo = $3 (again inexpensive)


EDIT - yes the Minute Maid "orange" is probably not pure- it lists various fruits on the small print :
Concentrated Fruit Juices : orange, pineapple, grape and pear ( I think that's a good mix to add to the apple ) 
as well as citric acid and ascorbic acid so that should help balance or add acid.
Zero percent sodium - so no trouble with the ferment
and also says "fruit beverage" in small print on front.

--

I hope the orange will boost he flavour so there is something to taste and maybe it will help the acid balance., 
I have no idea of the use of raisins nor know how much is necessary so I'll just add 1 or 2 cups

Same for the bananas - they are cheap I could add as much as I want to but I've read that Banana wine lacks taste - not sure - so I'm adding a few pounds here just to add some kind of helpful basic thing to the wine body or tannin?
I used some before with raspberry wine (from my home grown raspberries) I know how to prepare them and I know they froth up like crazy.

.. 
Maybe the "low acid" on the label means the acid is actually within the wine range - I guess if I had done this for years I would know that just by taste - maybe one day I will get to that point.
Well I've made enough wine for summer after this batch - I think what I've got to do now is try to understand recipe tastes.
I plan to make many small batches of one and two gallons as I need to test out flavours, flavour strengths and the effects of various ingredients.


I have on the plan:
2 gallons of ginger wine (very inspired for this from a video on youtube) - looks easy to make.
2 gallons of Tea wine - Dragon Spice Chai which I have already bought (36 teabags) - looks promising.
2 gallons of pure banana - I want to test what this ingredient by itself tastes like.


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## beggarsu (Apr 23, 2014)

byathread said:


> I've turned out several good ciders (and cysers) over the years with store bought juice. You can add a few cans of (preservative-free) apple juice concentrate to up the flavor (and potential ABV). I personally enjoy dry ciders and often added "tannin galalcool" (now called "tannin ft blanc soft" - avail from morewinemaking) to help achieve a nicer mouthfeel, then carbonated in beer bottles, or stabilized/kegged if doing any back-sweetening.
> 
> Alternatively, you could make a sweet and spicy cyser by adding 2.5 lbs of honey/gallon plus raisins, cinnamon, ginger, allspice, a couple cloves. Or search the forums for Apfelwein recipe.
> 
> I guess the question is WHAT do you like to drink, and WHEN do you plan to drink it?



Thanks for the suggestions, 

I just wanted some easy summer fruit wine and am experimenting with store bought ingredients. My wines from home fruits made last year turned out very light and easy to drink. Differnt from red wines which seem more heavy though I like them too. 
I like spicy foods , I like spiced rum so I will like to experiment with different spices.
So I am just trying out this idea with store bought juice to see what can be done with it and how I might tweak it. If it's not a very good taste,sufficient strength or too expensive I will try some other fruit. 


I don't hold with all this long term aging stuff - I think the ROI (return on Investment) in taste is not much and probably over hyped, far too gourmet and beyond my tongue tasting capabilities. Bottle in 4-5 weeks and drink some immediately and the rest wait minimum one month is fine with me.
All my wines from last year got really smooth after 2-4 months so that's satisfactory for me though of course some last longer and I will save a few bottles for the long term.

I decided against carbonation - I will need special bottles as was pointed out and I think I prefer a carbonating machine rather than sugar carbonating so I might try that some day. I just made some Root Beer through sugar carbonation (haven't tried it yet) but I think the process would be better to do it with a machine. That way it's easy to back-sweeten and then machine carbonate.

Honey at 2.5 pounds per gallon at $10 per pound (I think ) brings the cost of adding "taste" to $150 on top of basic ingredients - seems a little expensive.


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## byathread (Apr 23, 2014)

So you like to drink CHEAP and FAST! Fair enough.
In that case, I'd recommend simply adding a few cans of preservative-free apple juice concentrate (probably avail from Walmart for $2/ea) or just some sugar. I find lower alcohol (5-7%) still (uncarbonated) ciders to be kind of thin tasting, but YMMV. Also, you should be able to (clean/sanitize and) reuse any (non-screw lid) beer bottles for FREE. Caps are a couple pennies each, a hand capper will run you about $15 but will last a lifetime. But maybe you're at the stage where you just want to recycle (free) plastic pop bottles, which would work too if you WANT to carbonate your cider.

Also, I'm not sure if by "carbonating machine" you mean those seltzer machines that add CO2 to bottles by means of CO2 cartridges that you must constantly replace or a kegging system with tank and kegs but either of those will set you back much more than beer bottles and caps (especially since you don't have to buy bottles).

I do disagree that aging wines/ciders/meads (and even beers) is over-hyped. You will see DRAMATIC improvements in months and years. Typically, the higher the alcohol the longer until you see dramatic improvements (1 year plus for wine/mead, 3-6 months for cider/beer). Its worth testing for yourself by saving a few bottles of each of your brews and try one at 6 months / 9 / 12 / 18. It doesn't cost anything to set aside a few bottles in a relatively dark/cool space for a little time.

Its not hard to make decent brews from store bought ingredients for cheap. You just have to discover what you really enjoy drinking and go from there. And to really improve your wine/cider making try splitting batches and testing out different ingredients/methods.

Lastly, if you enjoy beer, it is awfully cheap and simple to buy some malt extract and hops and produce a decent quick drinking beverage. An entry level beer might run you $20 or less for 5 gallons. But I wouldn't recommend flat beer! 

Living on the cheap breeds creativity! Good luck!


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## beggarsu (Apr 23, 2014)

byathread said:


> So you like to drink CHEAP and FAST! Fair enough.
> In that case, I'd recommend simply adding a few cans of preservative-free apple juice concentrate (probably avail from Walmart for $2/ea) or just some sugar.



Thanks 
Actually it might sound like I said that but neither of those things fit me.

As for prices I outlined it's not how much money I spend it's how I spend my money. I detailed that quite a bit.

As for when to drink it is not that I want to drink it fast but that I consider it is ready to drink in a short time.


I've given the recipe I am about to use - all of the inredients have been bought. I will add sugar to 11-12 %
I pay 70 cents a can for concentrated juice - usually I could do better that that but I didn't want to wait.


I don't care so much how dramatic wine changes over time - that is not my goal though I don't turn it down if it just happens. Even if it turns to ambrosia after three years I consider that to be a limited Return On Investment (ROI) - that doesn't happen for nothing - that means sitting any number of carboys, maybe 10-30, in an air con room waiting for three years - that is the investment . I don't consider that worth it. Right now I just want a standard drinkable wine and it's already excellent. In June various batches start going over the one year storage but that hasn't been my concern. If it happens in a bottle it happens but I'm never gonna keep it in a carboy for longer than 5 weeks when I'm certain it's drinkable.


If the cost of any supermarket ingredients would exceed the cost of a perfect wine kit from the store then it's just not sensible to do the supermarket ingredients (for instance that strawbery sale was in fact not a sale in terms of winemaking.). I'd just buy wine kits. The supermarket ingredients are not sold for the purpose of winemaking - therfore if you buy some of them it's a premium and not feasablibe however some other kinds of ingredients make it very feasible and interesing experimentation. 

Yes those are some intereting options on carbonation. The root beer will be ready in two weeks and that's my first experiment with fermenting carbonation. Yeah That's right I could go with carbonating 7 percent fruit wines in beer bottles. I was thinking to try a beer kit from the brew store anyway. The capper costs $50 bucks here and there is not much other options - the capital is 120 clicks away. Stuff turns up at thrift stores, Restore and garage sales which are very plentiful here -practially giveaway - I gues that's why I'm waiting a bit before I do retail- becuase also here are lots of winmakers around and this is a almost like retirement city where the peopel are dying all the tiem (from old age) and there is so much stuff going away cheap all the time - more "stuff" than anybody wnats really.

And thinkig abut that I guess I should stock up on some beer bottles from the recyling - I already got 35 dof the 500 ml beer bottle wire-sealers self -sealing which I used for coffee port style but I think that was a one off - nobody seems else around here sees to have seen them before!


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## BernardSmith (Apr 23, 2014)

In my opinion , you really want to measure the specific gravity of the juice - or at the very least calculate from the caloric value how much fermentable sugar is in the juice (1 oz of sugar = about 100 calories, and 1 lb of sugar in a gallon of water will raise the gravity of the water to about .040 (so if the caloric value of 1 gallon was about 1600 calories then the gravity is about 1.040). If the gravity is about 1.040 then you can expect the cider to ferment to about 5.8% (compare that to beer). 

If the acid level is so low that it makes the cider a little bland you can always add lemon juice before you bottle. Before you bottle you might add about 1 oz of table sugar to each gallon. After two or three weeks this will carbonate the cider. It isn't beer and so there will be very little protein to help form a head but the effervescence will improve the taste. If you intend to prime the cider with sugar I would buy champagne corks and the wire nets that you can use to make sure that the caps won't pop because of the gas pressure or of course you can use beer bottles and caps. 

Hard cider from apple juice is drinkable after a month but improves if you can wait. It doesn't need any additives - unless that is something you want. I have experimented with added hops (dry hopping) and that has been interesting - and quite delicious. 

One way of increasing the taste and the potential alcohol level is by freezing the juice (realize of course that frozen juice expands in the bottle) and then allowing the frozen juice to thaw. You collect the first third or so of the thawing liquid and that liquid will contain about twice the amount of sugars from the apple juice - so concentrating the flavors and the potential alcohol content (the specific gravity might be as high as 1.090 or 11.5 % ABV, but that is without the addition of table sugar so all the sugar is apple flavored). The downside is that if you bought 6 gallons you are likely to collect about 3 or 4 gallons of juice.


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## cimbaliw (Apr 23, 2014)

I hate to over simplify things but I'd pour the 6 gallons of juice into a fermentation bucket and add 5c sugar (dextrose or white sugar), 2T malic acid and 2tsp tannin. I'd stick with EC-1118 yeast. Check SG and add sugar up to 1.010 or close. when the SG drops to around 0.992 or less; transfer to carboy, degas, sulphite and sorbate. Target sweeten to 1.005. 

At this point, you will have a good base. Consider six separate 1 gal batches with ginger, basil, clove, cinnamon, fresh lemon juice and plain. 

This will not be your last batch of apfelwein. It's a splendid, inexpensive proving ground for tweaks. Look around this and other forums there are many helpful threads out there.


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## beggarsu (Apr 27, 2014)

Thanks for the all the replies and advices:

I've gone with the plan for the ingredients I've already bought as I previously posted:



> 12 jugs apple juice = 6 gallons ($27.72 include of bottle charges)
> 8 cans minute maid orange (I think it's an orange mix) (70 cents * 8 ) = $5.60
> Sultana Raisins - I bought 1000 gms about 2.2 pounds for $7.60 (inexpensive!) but I think I will use only 1 or 2 cups.
> Bananas - I bought 4 pounds at 1.50 per kilo = $3 (again inexpensive)



Yes, since I have lots of one gallon jugs I may separate to try doing different recipes or do a 5 gal + one gallon.

Interesting - 6 gallons of Walmart Apple Juice came up short on the primary pail line - about 300-400 ml short as I calculate when I then added the concentrated Orange Punch.

Also this time in using the banana I have not yet got that tremendous foam - actually none (there is vigorous ferment activity though) I did not use the stuff from boiling the skins - I taste tested it and deemed it too bitter - I wasn't sure - didn't want to spoil the apple-orange taste. But I did simmer the pulp juice down to 220 ml after boil extraction and put the pulp in a muslin bag in the must


Previously when I used 3 lbs banana as an extra in a batch I got huge amounts of foam. hmm did I over boil the banana extract or was the foam before from the skins extract? 
Maybe it will yet foam or maybe the action of apple juice has a different effect on the banana?

It's "sparkling" vigorously just no foam like previous with banana



S.G was 1.095
S.G of Apple Juice alone was 1.042

With yeast starter and juices total volume was about 25.14 litres. So I got some reserve.

Total volume of 8 cans frozen minute maid was 2.4 litres (added direct after defrosting - no water added).

I used 2 cups of sultana raisins. I got lots more but I don't really know how much is necessary for 25 litres to get that "mouthfeel" - I know they act as a yeast nutrient.

13 and 1/4 cups of sugar maybe I lost count.
Pectic enzyme 3 and 1/8 tsp
tannin 1 and 3/8 tsp
bentonite 3 and 1/8 tsp

yeast starter with EC-1118. I started it about 5- 6 hours previous to use, added must to the starter about 1 hour before use. That's all that was needed - (I see advice around about making it saying prepare 1-2 days in advance adding must after 1 day and waiting another day but I didn't need that for this as is no problem to ferment - even just a short time is all that is needed)



yeast energizer 1 tsp (not really needed right now)


yeast nutrient s/b 2 adn 1/2 tsp total but i used 2 tsp to start - I add it day by day depending as needed.

simple enough - eventually I'll find out if that has a good enough or strong enough taste.


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## beggarsu (May 1, 2014)

5 day Mark SG is .995 that's 13.59 ABV. 
..


Probably go down to about 12.2 -12.5 ABV after back sweeten - will determine final ABV by *Beggarsu's ABV Back sweeten Calculation * not by SG.

It went like a rocket , I periodically fed it yeast nutrient and watched it react each time.


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## mamnancy (May 16, 2014)

I have to restart fermentation of concord wine. how much lemon juice per gal of wine as a yeast nutrient do I use.l I don't have any commercial nutrient left


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## beggarsu (May 16, 2014)

mamnancy said:


> I have to restart fermentation of concord wine. how much lemon juice per gal of wine as a yeast nutrient do I use.l I don't have any commercial nutrient left


Hi

Lemon juice is not a yeast nutrient - perhaps the opposite - it's very acidic.


I've heard raisins act as a yeast nutrient as well as add a mouth-feel to the taste of some. 

This is the wrong thread for you - probably better you post a separate thread and get some of the experts weigh in.


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## beggarsu (May 22, 2014)

Been filtered and back sweetened waiting to bottle. Have about 6.8 gallons in (19.4 litre, 3 litre and 4 litre jugs and pop bottle) -  yeah I know ...



ABV by SG before backsweeten was 13.59 percent (1.095 <--> .995)
ABV after backsweeten by calculation formula = 12.96 %.

Used 1240 ml sugar in the form of simple syrup to 25872 ml wine (was supposed to be 26172 but lost about 300 ml in a spill).

Notice my base calculation is the sugar volume used to make the simple syrup ( 2 parts sugar to 1 part water) as i find sometimes the vol of the resultant SS is variable.

Final sweet ratio = .479282 or 4.79 percent. I now mark the percent (which is standardized by my own method) on the label as a means of keeping track of and comparing sweetness level in my wine making from now on.


Or think of it as 181 ml per gal = 76 percent cup sugar per gallon, close to a standard 3/4 cup sugar per gallon (4.68749 my current magic ratio) as is popular by some others. I'll try this ration for this round of wine making- then I'll be able to see what I like per wine type. 

I used to use the store bought brand conditioner 500 ml for 6 gallons - it was OK had no way to calculate the real sugar content.


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## beggarsu (May 25, 2014)

Done! bottled 36 bottles - with 2 cases (boxes of 12) packed into cool storage right now - tasted about 350 ml - is very good tasting and quite drinkable even now - the orange really comes through (used 8 cans) - which makes a good case for making an entire batch solely from minute maid frozen juice concentrate - any flavour or fruit.

I left this as one batch instead of experimenting with partitions (thanks for the advice though) - I recently started making small batches for experimentation ie got _ginger with brown sugar_ and _red dragon spice chai_ 11 and 12 litre batches brewing right now.

Thanks all for the responses - now's the easy part.


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