# Red Star POF(-) yeasts?



## nateo (Apr 5, 2011)

I emailed Fermentis about this, but no one got back to me. Does anyone know which (if any) strains of Red Star yeast are POF(-)?


----------



## Torch404 (Apr 5, 2011)

What exactly does POF(-) mean. I'm not familiar with that term?


----------



## Sirs (Apr 5, 2011)

found this take this and a quarter and you got $.25 I'd say Redstar yeast don't produce this
The concentration of hydroxy-cinnamic and phenolic acids found in must in the form of esters with tartaric acid is significantly increased by the use of enzyme products with high cinnamyl esterase activity. 
During fermentation, hydroxy-cinnamic acids are transformed into vinyl-phenols by cinnamate decarboxylase. This enzyme is produced by some Saccharomyces cerevisiae strains known as POF(+) (Phenyl Off Flavors (+)) as well as by contaminating yeast. 
In red wine, Brettanomyces contamination leads to transforming vinyl-phenols into ethylphenols through the vinyl-phenol reductase action. In white wines, due to lower pH and higher SO2 content Brettanomyces is unlikely to develop.


----------



## nateo (Apr 6, 2011)

I was listening to an interview with Shea Comfort, who does (did?) yeast testing for Lallemand. He listed 6 strains that Lallemand produces that are POF(-). From what I gathered, phenyl off flavors are a big problem with malt-based fermentation, making POF(+) yeasts unsuitable. 

Red Star tends to be cheaper and more readily available, so I was hoping one of theirs would be POF(-) too.


----------



## cpfan (Apr 6, 2011)

What are you planning on making?

Steve


----------



## nateo (Apr 7, 2011)

I'll be making beer with them, which is why POF(-) is a big deal. If it were a fruit-based fermentation, it wouldn't be a problem at all. 

I may end up just doing some small test batches with different yeasts to see what happens. And yes, I know there are a million "beer" yeasts in the world, but Shea talked about interesting structure and flavors that wine yeasts produce that beer yeasts don't.


----------



## Wade E (Apr 7, 2011)

Why do you want to make beer with wine yeast? It will ferment way to dry and be most likley nasty!


----------



## cpfan (Apr 7, 2011)

For those interested in the use of wine yeasts in beer making, check out
http://www.danstaryeast.com/library/wine-yeasts

Unfortunately for nateo, the yeasts mentioned are from Lalvin (K1-V1116, 71B-1122, and EC-1118).

Nateo: are Anchor yeasts available to you? I saw this one, but did not check any others.
http://www.anchorwineyeast.com/ennt116.html

Steve


----------



## nateo (Apr 12, 2011)

Wade E - I got the idea from an interview with Shea Comfort, "yeast whisperer" and former Lallemand yeast tester. In addition to being a wine-making consultant, he is a homebrewer, and has made beer with GRE, BM45, L2226, 71B, EC-1118, and K1v1116 with good results, getting flavor/mouthfeel character that is absent in "beer" yeasts. 

He actually used a mixture of yeasts, because most of those wine yeasts ferment maltiotriose poorly, leaving the wort too sweet, not too dry. He recommended blending post-fermentation to get the desired flavor. 

I can't post a link, but if you look up The Sunday Session from 11-23-08 on thebrewingnetwork you can download the interview.


----------

