# Oak Chips vs. Cubes



## Wiz

I just received an order from George and found that I had mis-ordered medium toast French oak chips where I wanted medium French oak cubes. He recommends 2 months for the cubes using 3 ounces. What would be the e


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## Wiz

*Oak*

Don't know what happened there but what would be the equivalent quantity of oak chips and what time period compared to cubes.

Mike


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## altavino

Oak chips are usually a preferment additive as opposed to cubes which are more fore bulk aging

The reason being is that chips give up their compounds much faster which allows colour fixing and Tannic binding to happen quickly during an active ferment .the live and active yeast also metabolizes some of the wood buffering the oak flavor . Which is why oak added during an active primary ferment doesn't give much taste to a wine. It's more of a structural addition .

All that said , if you want to use chips during aging , go easy as the flavor release will happen very quickly and if you use too much it can give the wine a harsh character.
So I'd recommend adding 1/3 as much with chips . And expect them to be used up in 3 weeks or so . You can always add more later


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## robie

As Altavino indicated, chips will give off all their oakiness quicker.
Best bet is to plan on the chips taking something like 4 to 6 weeks, but each person's preferred oak level can be very different. You can play around with amount of time, versus the amount of oak. Extraction is a bit slower during bulk aging than during fermentation.

You can leave the same weight of chips in for about 2 weeks, then give the wine a taste. Repeat tasting every week until oak flavor is where you want it. If it ends up just a little too oakie, it will back off some after a few months in the bottle.

In the end, you should go by your own taste and not any particular amount of oak/time. When it tastes right, remove the oak.


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## ibglowin

George ships to Costa Rica? Fantastic! 

Like said, chips will extract in a week or so. You will get a bunch of oak in a short amount of time. Go easy, you can always add more but taking it back out is.........


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## Wiz

Thank you for your replies as I am making 28 gallons of cabernet and don't want to over oak.

Mike


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## Runningwolf

Not to hijack this thread but what about spirals? I bought 4 med french spirals and instructions say to use two per 6 gallons. I plan on only using one per carboy after MLF on my Chilean reds. Any advise is appreciated.


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## Wade E

Dan, What kind as American Id go 1 as you stated but French or Hungarian Id go 2 but this also depends on what your making.


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## tonyt

Can't believe i'm offering advice to Dan but here goes. I use spirals often. If i have a kit with lots of oak I might only add one spiral. Often I will add one American (or Hungarian) and one French spiral. I always start tasting after 3weeks. I pull just past perfect. I use powder and chips in primary, cubes in secondary and clearing and spirals and staves in aging. If I pull a spiral or stave prior to 6 weeks I usually throw it into whatever I have fermenting just not to waste it.


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## Runningwolf

Ah Tony don't feel that way as we're all always learning something new. I currently have Chilean - Cab Franc
Chilean - Zinfandel, Carmenere, Malbec and Chardonnay going through MLF and once that is completed I'll be adding the med French spirals. I never used oak before and just starting to like bit of it. Just starting to like it and know these won't be ready for quite a while. Thats why I was going with one. Do you guys suggest I go with two of them post MLF?


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## shoebiedoo

Runningwolf said:


> Ah Tony don't feel that way as we're all always learning something new. I currently have Chilean - Cab Franc
> Chilean - Zinfandel, Carmenere, Malbec and Chardonnay going through MLF and once that is completed I'll be adding the med French spirals. I never used oak before and just starting to like bit of it. Just starting to like it and know these won't be ready for quite a while. Thats why I was going with one. Do you guys suggest I go with two of them post MLF?



Dan, What was the ph level of the malbec when you started? I'll be curious to see what it is when you're done


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## tonyt

Thanks Dan. Given you're not an oak monster like me I think one French is right on. Taste often.


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## Runningwolf

Thanks Tony. Steve I wrote all my info down and threw out the paper before transfering it to the carboy tag. I believe I have the info at work though and will be getting it.


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## Emerson

I am currently making my first batch. It is a Cellar craft Old vine Zinfandel. I added the oak chips to the primary bucket, but when I rack to secondary (or later) I would like to add oak cubes/spirals. Can I do this without adding too much oak?


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## ibglowin

I would recommend making as per directions until you get the wine perfectly clear and topped up. Let it sit for a month and taste it for oak levels which could still be difficult as the wine is very harsh at a young age and you may not be able to fully distinguish oak levels amongst the green tasting wine. If you really think it is lacking add an ounce of med toast French or Hungarian oak beans/cubes. Taste weekly with a good stir before hand to disperse the oak evenly in the wine. Remember you can always add more but you can't take it out once its in.

That particular kit is a good one but not an early drinker so be patient with it.


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## Emerson

Thanks ibglowin!


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