# Vintage 2019



## CDrew

I have no pictures to share, but 2019 got underway today with some California foothills Syrah, picked today about 7 am.

Anyway, we arrived at a friend's vineyard this am at about 0630. He has 2.5 acres of vines a mix of Grenache, Syrah and Sangiovese. I was there for the Syrah. I had help and in about an hour we picked 300 pounds roughly of the Syrah. It was not as nice as last year, Many more raisened clusters, some powdery mildew (rare in Northern California). In the end, we found enough to make 300 pounds and went for it. For $0.50 per pound and the crusher, I was ok with it.

Last year's Syrah from this same vineyard was great, and the 2018 vintage will get bottled in about 2 weeks. Preliminary tasting says it's excellent. But this year the same vines were obviously stressed in some way despite the heavy rain last spring, 

Some numbers: Brix 25-26, pH 3.7. I did not measure TA. But we crushed on site, and hauled it home in Brute trash cans. Roughly 30 gallons of must. Lallazyme EX-V added early and then yeast(Avante) added with GoFerm about 10 hours after the pick. Tomorrow morning I'll add Opti-red and some tannin for structure. 

This may be a challenging wine since the grapes were sub-optimal, but it's already looking like wine in the fermentor.


----------



## CDrew

Early morning here and the wine is already fermenting well, with good cap formation. So picking to cap in under 24 hours. Avante yeast seems strong and started fast. With the first punch down I added Fermaid O, Some Opti-red, and some fermentation tannin. I am planning 1 additional feeding of Fermaid at 18 Brix or so.

I don't know if it's the influence of the Lallzyme or not, but the color is already a great deep purple.

Planning 4x daily punchdowns to try and keep the heat down.

I was planning to press next weekend, but with this quick start, it may have to be sometime this week in the evening.


----------



## mainshipfred

Even though you didn't like the look of the grapes the number don't look bad.


----------



## CDrew

mainshipfred said:


> Even though you didn't like the look of the grapes the number don't look bad.



It looks and tastes fine now, so I'll stay optimistic! Like last year, the color is outstanding and beautiful. I will also say we were fairly selective about the grapes we actually took, so I hope that is enough to make up for any problems.


----------



## CDrew

Just a pic of the very robust fermentation. This is about 18 hours after pitching the Avante yeast and already the 3rd punch down. It's at the point where the whole garage smells like a winery. As a bonus, it's cooled off about 15 degrees here lessening the heat concern.

In case you're wondering, the 300 pounds of must is split into 2 cans to make it easier to move around and keep cool.


----------



## CDrew

Just an update. Fermentation has already peaked! Avante is a strong fast fermenter, and as @4score said, maybe too fast! And I'll likely be pressing in 2 days. I have to say that despite my initial misgivings, the wine looks and smells great. I was going to add CH16 MLB yesterday afternoon, but the LHBS was out, and so I drove down to Lodi Wine Labs for some this morning and added to the wine at 8 Brix.


----------



## Boatboy24

Moving along quickly, but it looks like you've already got great color extraction.


----------



## CDrew

Boatboy24 said:


> Moving along quickly, but it looks like you've already got great color extraction.





Yes-Quite happy with it. I think the EX-V really helped with the color extraction. Brix is down to 4!!! I think for all intents and purposes, fermentation will be basically finished tomorrow. I can't press until Thursday night though. This is becoming a replay of last year when the wine has finished fermentation and I don't have time to deal with it. 

I'm really hoping the quick fermentation keeps any problems at bay, given the problems during harvest.

I'm picking Zinfandel on Saturday, bottling some of 2018 on Sunday-makes for a busy time of year.


----------



## CDrew

FIst pic is the garage mess after press and clean up. I'm trying to dry everything since it's back in use Saturday,

Pressed the Syrah at 1 Brix today. It's still fermenting but it's close enough to done that it was time. It tastes great, despite the slight sweetness I can still detect. It's still fermenting like crazy in the carboys, so I likely could have waited another day.

Color and taste are right on. But the grapes were not that juicy and I got the 19 gallons you see here from almost 300 pounds of grapes. There were pressed to 1.5 bar on my bladder press.

I hope to rack off the gross lees in 3 days, and also hoping the fermentation will be DONE by then.

A buddy came by as I was finishing and pressed his 200 pounds of Syrah. The bladder press is quick. He wanted a 2 bar press, but I'm not sure that there is much wine left above 1.5 bar.

First wine of 2019 feels good. Looking forward to the Zinfandel pick on Saturday. I'm hoping for about the same amount.

Edit: I have a -5 to +5 hydrometer. It's very precise at the end of fermentation. Case in point-my buddy said he was coming by with +1 must after fermentation. It turns out, he was still at +5 and had very, very sweet wine. We pressed anyway, and he will let it finish up in Carboys. But given the lack of precision by normal and inexpensive hydrometers, the -5 to +5 are seriously helpful, and highly recommended.


----------



## CDrew

Today was great. We picked Primitivo starting at 8 am today. It was chilly and cold when we started but warmed up as the sun came up. Friends of ours have 2 acres of Primitivo (and a bit of Syrah) that was in nearly perfect condition for picking. Brix were 26-27, pH was 3.6. So we picked about 1000 pounds over a couple of hours. The grapes were then crushed and we sat down to a great lunch of pasta, smoked salmon, crudites and wine. There were 3 other couples there and we all brought the wine we made from the same property last year. My 2018 Primitivo was very well received. I was happy about that. Very happy also, to make this wine again!

Primitivo is slightly different from Zinfandel and ripens just a week or two earlier, but it can be sold as Zinfandel in California. To my tasting it's slightly less peppery than Zinfandel and more refined/restrained. I don't really know but the 2018 Primitivo is really good and will only get better over the next 1-3 years.

I brought home 30+ gallons of must. I am not adjusting it at all. Right now, the EX-V is working it's magic and before bed tonight I'll pitch the yeast. I'm a bit torn between the Avante or the RP15. Likely will do the RP15.

Big plans tomorrow. Racking the Syrah off the gross lees, and bottling 15 gallons of 2018 syrah. And looking at a property in Amador county.

The forum won't let me upload photos-photos too large. Working on it!


----------



## CDrew




----------



## CDrew

Racked the 2019 Syrah into an Intellitank and a few straggler gallons. It tastes like it will eventually be a very nice wine. All vessels labeled for safety. 

Also bottled the 2018 Syrah today and got 6 cases and a magnum. Plus 2 cases of the "Reserve". The Reserve came out of a 5 gallon carboy and got less oak, which honestly, I prefer.

And the 2019 Primitivo fermentation is going like crazy. I pitched 24 hours ago and the fermentation is extremely vigorous. I did end up using the Avante yeast again. For a home wine maker it is great. No issues, no H2S, average nutritional demands, heat tolerant, and high alcohol tolerant. I'm a big fan. I'm going to pitch the MLB tomorrow after work. Thinking my Brix will be about 15 by then since it's going so strong now.

Will edit with pics.



View attachment 56472


----------



## Craiger

I'm glad it's going well, and I'm particularly glad to hear the Avante is working good for you. I'm using it this year for the firs time. Several years ago it was a hassle to get rid of the H2S in my wine. I used Montrachet that year (never again), and every year I'm so nervous about getting the H2S again. So I was happy when I heard about Avante. Mine wine is fermenting with it right now. It seems like a strong ferment, and I definitely don't have any H2S present.


----------



## CDrew

2019 Primitivo racked from primary into secondary. I have 26 gallons total, but expect to lose 5 gallons or so racking down to the finished product. My goal is 15 gallons, plus a carboy. So maybe my 15 gallon Intellitank plus a 5/6 gallon carboy.

Brix was 1 when transferred and still fermenting in the carboys. I likely will wait 3 days to rack it off the lees to give the wine a chance to finish up.


----------



## mainshipfred

CDrew said:


> 2019 Primitivo racked from primary into secondary. I have 26 gallons total, but expect to lose 5 gallons or so racking down to the finished product. My goal is 15 gallons, plus a carboy. So maybe my 15 gallon Intellitank plus a 5/6 gallon carboy.
> 
> Brix was 1 when transferred and still fermenting in the carboys. I likely will wait 3 days to rack it off the lees to give the wine a chance to finish up.
> 
> View attachment 56658



The furniture dollies and milk crates make it look like my winery. They sure make life easier.


----------



## CDrew

mainshipfred said:


> The furniture dollies and milk crates make it look like my winery. They sure make life easier.



They do, and safer too. It's much easier to pick them up if needed and generally better. I HATE setting down glass carboys naked on concrete. The furniture dollies mean they can be anywhere for racking or dealing with them. I'm only in glass for a few days. Once it's time to rack again, it will be into Intellitanks (15 gallons) and the carboys mostly go away.

The wine is still fermenting now in the carboys. I want it to basically finish and then will rack again to a better resting place.


----------



## CDrew

So I am having wine with lunch today, which is unusual for me. Let me explain.

Today's goal was to rack the Primitivo picked last Saturday and pressed 2 days ago. It's still fermenting a bit which is interesting. I started with 25 gallons on the gross lees. 2x6.5 and 2x6 carboys and the goal was to vacuum rack into a 15 gallon Intellitank and a carboy, hoping for 20 gallons more or less. I try and make this rack pretty clean, meaning it tends to leave behind a bit of wine, but there's plenty so that's what I do.

So the initial 15 gallons went so smoothly, that I racked into a second Intellitank with the plan then to gravity rack down into a carboy. That let me use all sanitary fittings (love these things), and even the final downhill drain was just a matter of opening a valve and letting it flow in reverse into a clean and sanitized carboy. FInal result: 1x15 gallons and 1x6.5 gallons. Not a bad yield. But that's not all. The bottom of the intellitank had clean new wine in it, so I ran that downhill into a pitcher. There was more than I thought, and I'm having a glass of that with my wife for lunch. Still have a pitcher of new wine though, so I suppose that's a good problem to have. 

Anyway the tasting notes:
-Great color. Deep, dark purple red. Some clean yeast smell in the nose
-Firm tannin. a bit puckery but I'm sure that will fade
-In your face ripe fruit. It tastes like the grapes we picked.
-Decent acidity. That's sometimes an issue with these grapes, but this should be a great food wine in time.

Anyway, the preliminary tasting says good to go. 

Some pictures of the immediate aftermath:


----------



## Chuck E

CDrew said:


> They do, and safer too. It's much easier to pick them up if needed and generally better. I HATE setting down glass carboys naked on concrete. The furniture dollies mean they can be anywhere for racking or dealing with them. I'm only in glass for a few days. Once it's time to rack again, it will be into Intellitanks (15 gallons) and the carboys mostly go away.
> 
> The wine is still fermenting now in the carboys. I want it to basically finish and then will rack again to a better resting place.



Do you keep a spare Intellitank to rack into over your aging period?


----------



## CDrew

Chuck E said:


> Do you keep a spare Intellitank to rack into over your aging period?



Yes. I have 4 and one is always ready to go. Plus I can rack into kegs also which are 15.5 gallons


----------



## Chuck E

CDrew said:


> Yes. I have 4 and one is always ready to go. Plus I can rack into kegs also which are 15.5 gallons



I'm looking at moving into those. I have a lot of glass carboys, and 2 sixtel & 2 pony kegs. I love the sanitary fittings on the kegs and they're not so fragile.


----------



## CDrew

Chuck E said:


> I'm looking at moving into those. I have a lot of glass carboys, and 2 sixtel & 2 pony kegs. I love the sanitary fittings on the kegs and they're not so fragile.



And they are cheap, have handles and are easy to sanitize. And if I get back into brewing beer, I can cut one up and make a brew kettle with it! Yep, lots of good about beer kegs in winemaking. I'm surprised more people don't use them. I'm going to try and find a couple of used pony kegs (7.75 gal) to use in place of carboys. The fact that the Sanke fittings can be directly adapted to sanitary fittings is a big plus. Good luck and put up a pic of your set up with the kegs. If you have questions about what sanitary fittings to get, send me a PM. Here's on quick tip-The fittings you get from https://www.brewershardware.com/ are better quality than the ones you get from Amazon (which are OK too). Catylist Mfg also sells very helpful fittings for winemaking.


----------



## CDrew

Yesterday, I got the last grapes of 2019. 400 pounds of Mourvedre of which 100 pounds is an experimental saignee Rose'

https://www.winemakingtalk.com/threads/saignee-real-time-help.70162/

After pressing off the juice, the skins went back into the main fermentation, where I'm hoping to amp up the flavor even more.

Also doing a second experiment. 1/2 the Mourvedre is getting Avante yeast, and the other 1/2 was pitched with RP15. I had the RP15 in an refrigerated, unopened foil pack from last year, did a test run and when it had activity, I went ahead and pitched. Right now, I'm planning to combine at press, but I can already see that the Avante is off and running with good cap formation, and the RP15 is moving, but it's going to be slower. For yeast nutrients, I'm using all Fermaid K. I ran out of Fermaid O and the K will work fine so I'm using it up.

But just as a comment, the Avante has been a real winner this year. Not one issue, quick and solid ferments, no funky smells and dry in a week. Next year I'm going to try Brio or Bravo in something, likely at the end of the grape season when it's cooler. Avante is nice because not only is it H2S preventing, it also tolerates high temps and high alcohol. But as a home winemaker working alone most of the time, these H2S preventing yeast strains are a good insurance policy, and highly recommended.





12 hours since pitching yeast!


----------



## Ajmassa

Might name my next kid “Avante”. Love it. 

What’s up with RP15 though? I see you referenced it quite a bit - but don’t think I’ve seen it mentioned before on WMT.


----------



## CDrew

Ajmassa said:


> Might name my next kid “Avante”. Love it.
> 
> What’s up with RP15 though? I see you referenced it quite a bit - but don’t think I’ve seen it mentioned before on WMT.



Simple-it's like eating leftovers!

Last year I was looking to try something different and had purchased 80g of RP15 from more wine. But I then found that Lodi WIne Lab was willing to sell me a small amount (100 gm) of Avante yeast and so I went with that instead. THe RP15 has been taking up fridge space since and so since this was the end of this year I figured I'd try it and see how I like it. 

But I agree about the Avante. For garage based winemaking, it seems hard to beat.


----------



## Ajmassa

CDrew said:


> Simple-it's like eating leftovers!
> 
> Last year I was looking to try something different and had purchased 80g of RP15 from more wine. But I then found that Lodi WIne Lab was willing to sell me a small amount (100 gm) of Avante yeast and so I went with that instead. THe RP15 has been taking up fridge space since and so since this was the end of this year I figured I'd try it and see how I like it.
> 
> But I agree about the Avante. For garage based winemaking, it seems hard to beat.



Heard that! I always get more types and amounts than needed. Plus some ‘in case of emergency’ uvaFerm43 and ec1118. I’ve got quite the variety pack and will all get wasted unfortunately. 
RP-15 is new to me tho. Done think I’ve seen home winemakers using it before. When planning and investing good $$ and ya got one shot to do it right- it’s hard to not use a proven winner. Last years natural ferment was a fun change of pace tho.


----------



## sour_grapes

Ajmassa said:


> Heard that! I always get more types and amounts than needed. Plus some ‘in case of emergency’ uvaFerm43 and ec1118. I’ve got quite the variety pack and will all get wasted unfortunately.
> RP-15 is new to me tho. Done think I’ve seen home winemakers using it before. When planning and investing good $$ and ya got one shot to do it right- it’s hard to not use a proven winner. Last years natural ferment was a fun change of pace tho.



Rightly or wrongly, I think RP15 as one of the kinda standard, but not utterly common ones (like Rc212, EC1118, etc.). I have used it a few times. Worked just fine.


----------



## Ajmassa

Just Ive just been overlooking it subconsciously


----------



## Chuck E

Ajmassa said:


> Might name my next kid “Avante”. Love it.
> 
> What’s up with RP15 though? I see you referenced it quite a bit - but don’t think I’ve seen it mentioned before on WMT.



RP-15 AKA "Rock Pile." I've only used it once, but it was a solid performer.


----------



## CDrew

So the Rock Pile RP15 has finally taken off. It's lag time is 12 hours slower than Avante. But the RP15 now has a nice cap, is, fermenting vigorously and I'm good with it. Which just emphasizes how awesome the Avante is, which took off 12 hours earlier.

The Rock Pile is a part of Sonoma Valley that is just west of Dry Creek valley and it's known for rocky plantings of mostly Zinfandel. There is some Syrah there though, and that's where it was isolated. From Syrah! I may try it next year with the Syrah specifically, although a bunch of Dry Creek Wineries use it with Zinfandel to make signature Zinfandels from the AVA. So far it's a clean and nice fermentation.

Here is some verbiage copied off the internet:
Rockpile, RP15 Wine Yeast Isolated from spontaneous Rockpile Syrah fementations in collaboration with winemaker Jeff Cohn. Moderate speed fermenter with alcohol tolerances to 17%. Used in concentrated reds for a lush, balanced mouthfeel. Charaterized by red fruit and mineral notes. Low to moderate nitrogen demand. Used to make Syrah, Zinfandel and Petite Sirah and other Rhone varieties. (So hopefully good with Mourvedre, another Rhone varietal!)


----------



## Johnd

Jeff Cohn has some good wines, I have quite a few of his 2012 Petite Sirah wines in my cellar. Had no idea he worked with them on the RP, looks at this list of his highest rated wines..........


----------



## CDrew

You likely saw this interview, but it has some interesting things to say about yeast nutrients, re-inoculating etc:
https://winesvinesanalytics.com/columns/section/19/article/85794/Winemaker-Interview-Jeff-Cohn

From your list and the ratings, he clearly knows how to make wine!

I'll post back once the RP15 is done, with final impressions. So far, it is for sure less vigorous than Avante, but it's fermenting right along just as it should.


----------



## Boatboy24

sour_grapes said:


> Rightly or wrongly, I think RP15 as one of the kinda standard, but not utterly common ones (like Rc212, EC1118, etc.). I have used it a few times. Worked just fine.



Yep, I've used RP-15 several times - often in the mix for me. It's a nice yeast.


----------



## CDrew

Update:

THe 20ish gallons of Mourvedre with Avante yeast is going great guns and is at 2 Brix tonight. The must is warm to the touch. Maybe mid 80s. I didn't measure since it wasn't alarming. But considering it was pitched Saturday evening, and here we are Tuesday evening and nearly done, I'm pleased.

The 16ish gallons of Mourvedre with RP15 is also going full tilt and at 5 brix. It went from 18 to 5 in 24 hours. Despite the slower start it's going like crazy now. Warm ferment, I'm estimating 85F. Both fermentations have been getting 4X daily punch downs with lees stirring.

The Rose in the carboys is going really strong still. It's Mourvedre juice and fermenting at room temp with Avante yeast. I didn't measure the brix but it's still really fermenting. I'll likely combine to minimize head space tomorrow night. Hoping for 6 clean gallons.

So I think all is well. No bad smells, good progress by the hydromenter. I was going to press Saturday or Sunday, but it's looking like Thursday or Friday by the numbers. I want to press all of it at once, so even if the Avante ferment has to wait a day, I'm pressing when the RP15 ferment is at 0 or below.

Everything else being equal, I think the Fermaid K makes the fermentation go faster than Fermaid O. THis is just an impression, not science. And I'm not sure one is better than the other. As mentioned, this fermentation was all Fermaid K since I was out of Fermaid O which I used for the rest of the 2019 vintage.


----------



## CDrew

Did some racking of the Mourvedre today-it was time to get it off the gross lees. I am doing 2 parallel ferments, on with Avante yeast and one with RP15. I have kept these separate since even at press, I wasn't super happy with the RP15 half. So I wanted to update that today since I do in fact have an unexpected problem.

Avante Fermentation: I had a 6.5 and a 6 gallon carboy. Racked to a 6.5 and a 5 today. Taste and color great for new wine, all is well.

RP15 Fermentation: Even from the start, this wasn't quite right. It was slower to start, ended up being fairly vigorous and finished by day 5. At press, my initial impression was something wasn't quite right. Racking off the lees today confirmed that. The color just isn't dark. It looks very light. Initial nose was just OK so I splash racked under vacuum which improved the nose but not the color. So I'm keeping it separate. I was going to combine both into a keg for aging but based on my tasting today, the 2 sides are going to stay separate. Really odd the color isn't up to snuff. Anyone have any thoughts? 

These were identical as any two fermentations can be other than the yeast. Both were fed at cap formation and 18 Brix, both got MLB at cap formation, but got some optired as it kicked off. Then they were fermented in identical brutes side by side in the same garage. THe only difference was the yeast choice.

So, at least I'll have 11 gallons of good Mourvedre and 10 gallons I'm not sure about.

Now as I was finishing up, a friend called me that one of their 7 guys bailed and they had 200 pounds of Clarksburg Cabernet they have contracted for that they don't need now. . (Picking is tonight and pick up is tomorrow). Did I want it? At first I was like heck yes, half my Mourvedre is not that good, but then realized I was basically done and cleaned up for the year and so turned it down. Mixed feelings for sure, and if it had been 300 pounds, I likely would have jumped on it. What do you guys think? I'm going to go and help load trucks tomorrow with them anyway.


----------



## Chuck E

[QUOTE="CDrew, 

Now as I was finishing up, a friend called me that one of their 7 guys bailed and they had 200 pounds of Clarksburg Cabernet they have contracted for that they don't need now. . (Picking is tonight and pick up is tomorrow). Did I want it? At first I was like heck yes, half my Mourvedre is not that good, but then realized I was basically done and cleaned up for the year and so turned it down. Mixed feelings for sure, and if it had been 300 pounds, I likely would have jumped on it. What do you guys think? I'm going to go and help load trucks tomorrow with them anyway.[/QUOTE] 

I don't know... 10-12 gallons of good grapes fell from the sky. I am all cleaned up too, but I think I would've said, "Hell Yes!"


----------



## mainshipfred

Just shooting from the hip I'm going to guess the RP15 had a different effect on the skins and there are more particulates in that batch. I'll put 2 bits on the color will be the same once the wine settles a little.


----------



## Chuck E

[QUOTE="CDrew,

RP15 Fermentation: Even from the start, this wasn't quite right. It was slower to start, ended up being fairly vigorous and finished by day 5. At press, my initial impression was something wasn't quite right. Racking off the lees today confirmed that. The color just isn't dark. It looks very light. Initial nose was just OK so I splash racked under vacuum which improved the nose but not the color. So I'm keeping it separate. I was going to combine both into a keg for aging but based on my tasting today, the 2 sides are going to stay separate. Really odd the color isn't up to snuff. Anyone have any thoughts?

These were identical as any two fermentations can be other than the yeast. Both were fed at cap formation and 18 Brix, both got MLB at cap formation, but got some optired as it kicked off. Then they were fermented in identical brutes side by side in the same garage. THe only difference was the yeast choice.
[/QUOTE]

Same Lallzyme too? That's pretty weird. I had a good experience with RP, but only used it once. Nothing weird with the grapes before splitting into batches?


----------



## CDrew

Chuck E said:


> Same Lallzyme too? That's pretty weird. I had a good experience with RP, but only used it once. Nothing weird with the grapes before splitting into batches?



Same EX-V, weighed on same scale at 0.075 gm per gallon of must. I really don't blame the yeast, it was a year old, and I was using it up. Maybe that Brute got contaminated with something. I am going to play it out for awhile.



mainshipfred said:


> Just shooting from the hip I'm going to guess the RP15 had a different effect on the skins and there are more particulates in that batch. I'll put 2 bits on the color will be the same once the wine settles a little.



I hope you are right but it's a striking difference. It tastes Ok, but it's way too light. If it survives until next fall, I'll bottle it and just keep it for me when no one is looking. Lol.


----------



## CDrew

So as part of the wine making enterprise, my wife and one of her friends wanted to make grape jelly/jam this year from wine grapes. So we were up at a winery where we are wine club members in Amador county yesterday. Their back 25 acres of Zinfandel are being picked today and going to "The Prisoner" winery in Napa to be blended into another Zinfandel to pick up the ripe flavors of late season Amador. Pretty cool. But yesterday we picked (with the owner"s permission and assistance) about 25 pounds of these grapes for jelly production. I was jonesing to pick 500 pounds to make wine from these beautiful grapes but no. So after a day of hard labor, we have enough grape jelly of decades of PB&J. It's actually great. Tastes like the grapes. Very dark and intense Zinfandel flavor. Awesome.


----------



## Chuck E

CDrew said:


> Same EX-V, weighed on same scale at 0.075 gm per gallon of must. I really don't blame the yeast, it was a year old, and I was using it up. Maybe that Brute got contaminated with something. I am going to play it out for awhile.
> 
> I hope you are right but it's a striking difference. It tastes Ok, but it's way too light. If it survives until next fall, I'll bottle it and just keep it for me when no one is looking. Lol.



If you do your top off with the petit Syrah you could get some of the color back.


----------



## CDrew

Today I vacuum racked the Syrah into a 15.5 gallon Sanke keg, sulfited and added 2 winestix, a medium and medium+. I'm shooting on the low end on purpose, to avoid the overoaking of last year. The Syrah itself is excellent. It really tastes like it will be a very good wine in time. It's already good but lots expected tannin. Great color. Inky, dark, almost like a Petite Sirah.

Which means I have 1.5 gallons of Syrah left with no long term home. So here is the plan. I'll rack the Mourvedre in another few weeks. I have 11 gallons that is very nice and I trust. I'll add the syrah to that, and enough Primitivo to make up 15.5 gallons. I'm going to call it a PSM blend since I don't have any Grenache. It will be about 2/3 Mourvedre and 1/6 Syrah and 1/6 Primitivo. It should be good.

The Primitivo is going to sit another week or two. I have 23 gallons, so enough to fill a 15.5 keg, blend up the Mourvedre and still likely will have a 5 gallon carboy. That's about 50 gallons of wine, so already downsizing from last year when by accident I made 70 gallons even though aiming for 60.

I want everything put to bed by mid November so I can forget about wine making until spring (February).



And that leaves the 10 gallons of Mourvedre I don't trust or like the color of.



mainshipfred said:


> Just shooting from the hip I'm going to guess the RP15 had a different effect on the skins and there are more particulates in that batch. I'll put 2 bits on the color will be the same once the wine settles a little.



You know I checked today and it still doesn't look right. Thin, odd color kind of an oxidized purple. Tastes just ok. Funky smell is gone. When I rack in 2-3 weeks if it still seems suspect, and every indication says it will, I'm dumping it to avoid working on it over the next year. Harsh I know, but I'm not looking to make wine I don't want to drink.


----------



## Chuck E

CDrew said:


> And that leaves the 10 gallons of Mourvedre I don't trust or like the color of.
> 
> You know I checked today and it still doesn't look right. Thin, odd color kind of an oxidized purple. Tastes just ok. Funky smell is gone. When I rack in 2-3 weeks if it still seems suspect, and every indication says it will, I'm dumping it to avoid working on it over the next year. Harsh I know, but I'm not looking to make wine I don't want to drink.



You still have no idea of the cause?


----------



## mainshipfred

You know I checked today and it still doesn't look right. Thin, odd color kind of an oxidized purple. Tastes just ok. Funky smell is gone. When I rack in 2-3 weeks if it still seems suspect, and every indication says it will, I'm dumping it to avoid working on it over the next year. Harsh I know, but I'm not looking to make wine I don't want to drink.[/QUOTE]

So are you giving up on RP 15?


----------



## CDrew

mainshipfred said:


> So are you giving up on RP 15?



As in permanently? Likely not. There were other variables this year, like the yeast was a year old, grapes from a new source etc. But if and when I use it again, it will be in a small lot, like 5 gallons out of 20. I have this nagging feeling that maybe my year old RP15 was not really alive, and what I got was a natural fermentation. Don't know, it looked like it was working when hydrated, but not with the vigor of the Avante. It didn't smell bad while fermenting, just different, even my wife commented. There are still many other yeasts to try, though. Plus, I want to continue to use the Avante as a workhorse, but they have other red wine yeasts that sound interesting and are H2S preventing. I will likely go back and revisit D21 which was really great for me in 2018.


----------



## Johnd

mainshipfred said:


> You know I checked today and it still doesn't look right. Thin, odd color kind of an oxidized purple. Tastes just ok. Funky smell is gone. When I rack in 2-3 weeks if it still seems suspect, and every indication says it will, I'm dumping it to avoid working on it over the next year. Harsh I know, but I'm not looking to make wine I don't want to drink.




At least give it a chance before dumping. Many a below average wine has matured into a winner.


----------



## CDrew

Johnd said:


> At least give it a chance before dumping. Many a below average wine has matured into a winner.



I will, and I hate to dump it too. I did a taste tonight and it tastes fine. But the color is wrong. It's too dark for a Rose, and too light for a real wine. It's dirty purple. Strange for sure. Still not sure what I'll do.

But I did find out that in 3 days, I can get 300 pounds of Tempranillo with perfect numbers for $1.00 per pound. This is way more than usual, but we can pick it up already picked and crushed. It has likely a 75% chance of working out. I've never made a Tempranillo but it does make a nice food wine so I think I'm game. Will post up if it happens.


----------



## CDrew

Today was a big day in the garage winery. 35 gallons of wine were racked. First, the 11 good gallons of Mourvedre was racked into a 15 gallon Intellitank, and 2 gallons of Syrah ahd 2 gallons of Primitivo made up the balance. It was sulfited and put in the closet to age. I'll add oak at somepoint when I decide what I want to do. Likely Stavin cubes at the 25% level.

The "other" Mourvedre was not used and the plan is to discard about 10 gallons. It just isn't good and doesn't taste like it will ever be anything. So it's out.

Then, the Primitivo was racked into a stainless keg. I ended up with 15.5 gallons and a 5 gallon carboy, exactly. And a glass I will drink tonight. I cheated and tasted a bit, and it is dynamite. It's going to be fantastic in time. It's good now. A tiny bit of oak and this 20.5 gallons will not go to waste!

Clean up was a chore but I was done by 11am.

But that's not all..........!


----------



## CDrew

I mentioned the Tempranillo before. Today it happened! A buddy and I were each getting 300 pounds of Tempranillo here at the tail end of the season. Brix 25, pH 3.6, TA a bit lower than I would have expected at 4.2. Really nice fruit and we went to the winery to collect. But, we had to wait. They were still picking and when the grapes came in on a fork lift, there was almost 1000 pounds. Beautiful grapes. So we took the lot. They didn't even charge us. Crazy town. It's been sulfited, and EX-V added. I'll pitch the yeast before bed tonight but I'm not sure it's going to stay in the 44 gallon x2 fermentor that it's in.

So back in business for 2019! So in two years, anyone from the forum can stop by and I'll send you home with a bottle or two of wine. This is clearly more than I can ever use, but it's a good problem.


----------



## CDrew

Cleaned up and time for a glass of new wine. This is the 2019 Primitivo.


----------



## CDrew

So this Tempranillo after fermentation will go into anther Keg and what ever else I need. Kegs are light tight and so don't need to be in the dark. I have enough though that I may need to look for another on Craig's list which seems to have an inexhaustible supply.


----------



## GreenEnvy22

350lbs of muscat, 300 or so of Dornfelder, and 200lbs of riesling are all in progress from the last month. Still hoping to get 200lbs of syrah this week, and that will be it for grape wines. Have 50-60lbs of apples from our tree I plan on making into cider.
Then next batch of beer is getting started, a red rye, from grains.


----------



## Chuck E

CDrew said:


> I mentioned the Tempranillo before. Today it happened! A buddy and I were each getting 300 pounds of Tempranillo here at the tail end of the season. Brix 25, pH 3.6, TA a bit lower than I would have expected at 4.2. Really nice fruit and we went to the winery to collect. But, we had to wait. They were still picking and when the grapes came in on a fork lift, there was almost 1000 pounds. Beautiful grapes. So we took the lot. They didn't even charge us. Crazy town. It's been sulfited, and EX-V added. I'll pitch the yeast before bed tonight but I'm not sure it's going to stay in the 44 gallon x2 fermentor that it's in.
> 
> So back in business for 2019! So in two years, anyone from the forum can stop by and I'll send you home with a bottle or two of wine. This is clearly more than I can ever use, but it's a good problem.



What kind of sanitary fitting is on the Intellitank? Looks like a "T" and a 90 degree 1/2" tube barb... You use this for racking INTO the tank?


----------



## CDrew

Chuck E said:


> What kind of sanitary fitting is on the Intellitank? Looks like a "T" and a 90 degree 1/2" tube barb... You use this for racking INTO the tank?



There are a bunch of ways to set it up, but I'm using a "ported spout" so the spout has a side port and I apply vacuum there via a 1/2 hose barb. The 90 degree is the top of a 1/2 inch racking cane(also with sanitary fittings), because I was trying to rack to the bottom of the tank, so it would not stir as much oxygen into the wine. You can also apply pressure to the side port and with the racking cane push wine out of the tank. It's funny but that side port 3/4 sanitary fitting does not seem to be made in 3/8 hose barb, which for vacuum would be more convenient, so there's an adapter in the line to get to 1/2 inch. Sometimes I use a 3/4 to 1.5 adapter and then a 1.5 to 3/8 hose barb. I posted a picture of that earlier in the thread.

View attachment 56695


During yesterday's racking, I had a lot of fittings in use, and it seems like it takes 10 minutes to get ready for the job, and 2 minutes to do it. One thing I added to the racking cane on the input side after that picture, was a ball valve to shut off flow exactly when I wanted to. That isn't shown.

I use the same technique with different fittings to rack into and out of the kegs, I'll post pictures next time it's in use.

The sanitary fittings are great. I can't say enough good things. But if you go that route, get twice as many clamps and gaskets as you think you'll need. I think through what I'm going to do with them, then gather up the fittings and toss them in a small bucket of StarSan. Then as I need them, I pull out the fittings/gaskets and assemble. But that thinking ahead is almost the hardest part because there is nothing worse than being in the middle of something complicated and needing a piece you forgot to get earlier.

This goes through it pretty well:
https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0..._s_Manual.compressed.pdf?18171772484100971021


----------



## Chuck E

CDrew said:


> There are a bunch of ways to set it up, but I'm using a "ported spout" so the spout has a side port and I apply vacuum there via a 1/2 hose barb. The 90 degree is the top of a 1/2 inch racking cane(also with sanitary fittings), because I was trying to rack to the bottom of the tank, so it would not stir as much oxygen into the wine. You can also apply pressure to the side port and with the racking cane push wine out of the tank. It's funny but that side port 3/4 sanitary fitting does not seem to be made in 3/8 hose barb, which for vacuum would be more convenient, so there's an adapter in the line to get to 1/2 inch. Sometimes I use a 3/4 to 1.5 adapter and then a 1.5 to 3/8 hose barb. I posted a picture of that earlier in the thread.
> 
> View attachment 56695



Thank you for the picture. It truly is better than a thousand words.


----------



## CDrew

Chuck E said:


> Thank you for the picture. It truly is better than a thousand words.



Since you are using Sanke kegs, here is an equivlent system to vacuum into kegs. It uses an additional T fitting for a side port.

https://www.winemakingtalk.com/attachments/3f545342-9c86-4049-b3bd-e6475755b24b-jpeg.53206/


----------



## jburtner

Nice kit!

-johann


----------



## Chuck E

CDrew said:


> Since you are using Sanke kegs, here is an equivlent system to vacuum into kegs. It uses an additional T fitting for a side port.
> 
> https://www.winemakingtalk.com/attachments/3f545342-9c86-4049-b3bd-e6475755b24b-jpeg.53206/



Understood. Thank you for the pic.


----------



## buzi

Tell me you played the lotto too, you luck dog!


----------



## CDrew

I was a bit worried this morning when I checked on things and nothing was happening. The yeast was pitched at 9pm and at 0630 when I left for work, not only was it cold in the garage (37F) but nothing was happening in the fermenters. Nothing. I was scrolling through what I may have done wrong!

But, when I got home tonight after another 12 hours has gone by and it's considerably warmer (71F), all is well. Nice cap, vigorous fermentation, perfect. The cooler ferment may save me, because there isn't much room for the cap to form. I'm estimating 30 gallons of must, X2 in two 40 gallon fermenters. Anyway, I fed it with Fermaid K, added some FT Rouge. The color is already beautiful from the EX-V. I'm going to run a space heater in the garage tonight and try to hold 70F. We're going to get to the exothermic part of fermentation soon, so maybe no heat will be needed after tonight.

Happy with this one so far. But it's going to be a lot of wine, estimating 40 gallons in the end.

So I need to comment on the EX-V. It's been working 24 hours and the amount used is TINY. About 2.25 grams in each 30 gallons. But in 24 hours, the must is more liquified(you can feel it with the punch down tool), the color is amazing and it's instantly obvious that good things have happened.

Just after punch down:


----------



## Chuck E

CDrew said:


> So I need to comment on the EX-V. It's been working 24 hours and the amount used is TINY. About 2.25 grams in each 30 gallons. But in 24 hours, the must is more liquified(you can feel it with the punch down tool), the color is amazing and it's instantly obvious that good things have happened.]



Yes sir, I am sold on the EX-V! I probably used too much last month, but it will be a staple in my toolbox.


----------



## CDrew

Things went as planned overnight. It got down to 39F but with the space heater and the exothermic fermentation the wine is a nice 72F this am. It looks like it made an attempt to climb out (first pic) then after punch down. Headed to Lodi today to get some CH16 which I'll add this morning.


----------



## CDrew

The CH16 mlb is on board and the brix were already 18, so I gave it the second feeding of Fermaid K. It’s warmed up another couple of degrees. I might be through this pretty quick! Love this Avante yeast. Maybe pressing Monday or Tuesday. Since the weather is cooler it would be nice to let it go a few more days on the skins and the color is already super dark and nice. 

And if you’re following along, the suspect Mourvèdre went down the storm drain. 9 gallons. I tasted it again and nope. So out it went. Sniff.


----------



## CDrew

Brix at +1 today at 9am. So Friday afternoon it was +18, Sunday morning it's +1. Zooming through fermentation. The must is warm, despite the cool temps, 75-80F. It's still forming a nice cap, so I plan to punch down this evening before bed, and press the last wine of 2019 tomorrow morning. I'm going to shoot for early morning, and maybe by late in the afternoon, I can rack off the gross lees. I know that's quicker than desirable but it would fit my schedule better. I'll try and post some pics tomorrow. It looks like a lot of wine in the fermentor Brutes, estimating 60 gallons plus solids (and not much is solid after the EX-V and fermentation). Maybe 40-45 gallons? I guess I'll know after tomorrow.


----------



## Chuck E

CDrew said:


> Brix at +1 today at 9am. So Friday afternoon it was +18, Sunday morning it's +1. Zooming through fermentation. The must is warm, despite the cool temps, 75-80F. It's still forming a nice cap, so I plan to punch down this evening before bed, and press the last wine of 2019 tomorrow morning. I'm going to shoot for early morning, and maybe by late in the afternoon, I can rack off the gross lees. I know that's quicker than desirable but it would fit my schedule better. I'll try and post some pics tomorrow. It looks like a lot of wine in the fermentor Brutes, estimating 60 gallons plus solids (and not much is solid after the EX-V and fermentation). Maybe 40-45 gallons? I guess I'll know after tomorrow.



I swear I can almost smell this just from the pictures!


----------



## CDrew

I don't have to work until Tuesday so this morning I got up with the intent to press the Tempranillo. A neighbor came over and wanted to chat so it took a bit longer than it needed too, but still done and cleaned up before lunch.

I had 2 40 gallon fermenters with about 30 gallons of wine + solids. It took 4 press runs to do it all.

Net result: 43 gallons of wine split between 2 intellitanks (15 g each) and 2 6.5 g carboys. I am going to rack off the gross lees tonight. It's settling nicely and the rest of this week is going to be busy.

The new wine is really good. Maybe the best ever from Casa Cdrew. I'm very excited and 2 years from now it should be ready to drink!


----------



## CDrew

I think i could have actually yielded more wine since I limited my press to 1 bar. The reason for that, is I saw a video put up by Ridge (one of my favorites anyway!) about their press, and they feel that limiting the press to 1 bar avoids harsher elements in the wine. So this was a good time to try out that theory since there is plenty.

Last year I pressed everything to 2 bar, this year to 1.5, until today when I just went to 1 bar. I don't really know, but would love any advice. Other than the Ridge video, I could not find any actual science about press pressures. My press has an over pressure valve that opens at 2.5 bar, so that's my upper limit.


----------



## Ajmassa

Eh. Those bladders are gonna be gentler pressings regardless. I’m sure you’ll get advice, and that idea seems to be accepted as fact —in theory. But how hard do ya really need to push it for harsh tannins? Even with my ratchet press I couldn’t break a seed if I tried. 
The one time I rented a 90L bladder press I kept it to 1.5 and the cake was still very damp. Tho the Only reason I went light was because everything was new to me, and was respecting the unfamiliar equipment. 
Maybe next year push it hard but keep everything over 1.5 separate. That’ll surely give you some useful intel. 

Btw- lookin good over there bud! Up in wine country with all those toys and all that passion— how have you not popped your barrel cherry yet?!


----------



## mainshipfred

I'll have to ask my commercial friends how hard they press. All I can add is when there pressing cycle finishes the skins are almost powder. A little exaggeration of course but not by much. Their cycle presses 3 times and rotates twice.


----------



## CDrew

Ajmassa said:


> Maybe next year push it hard but keep everything over 1.5 separate. That’ll surely give you some useful intel.
> 
> Btw- lookin good over there bud! Up in wine country with all those toys and all that passion— how have you not popped your barrel cherry yet?!



One of my friends has gone to an all free run protocol. I think he's wasting wine but he makes nice wine.

Not going to do barrels. i just don't have the space until I buy a second property-and I'm only looking halfheartedly. The last thing I want is MORE problems. And a very well respected wine grower/maker that I know thinks I can get there with just oak parts. He is actually phasing out of barrels and into those big flex tank stacking cubes with staves or beans. We'll see. He's had great results and makes great wine. 

I can tell you what, today, I am sick of cleaning stuff. I did the press and clean up and then the "rack off the gross lees" and clean up. But everything is clean and most of it is put away so all good. Final tally is 39 gallons of Tempranillo. I would have been happy with half of that.

Next year i'll have to scale down. Maybe 2 wines and 600 pounds of grapes. 30-40 gallons. This year I'm in the 70 gallon range and that's too much. But I think in 2 years, I'm giving wine to everyone I know.


----------



## Ajmassa

Yea man being a one man band can be time consuming. The prep and cleanup can get overwhelming at times. 
I’m completely out of space now too. Zero wines from fall ‘17 and on have been bottled. Been putting off because got some blending to do on wines not quite ready yet. (Or started)

I layed low for 2019. And now eyeing up Spring like a junkie needing a fix! Chilean grapes have treated me very well in the past. 
And I’ve read a lot of winemakers doing similar with the oak. And all kinds of interesting options when using large flex tanks. Interested to know which direction you go with it.


----------



## CDrew

Ajmassa said:


> Yea man being a one man band can be time consuming. The prep and cleanup can get overwhelming at times.
> I’m completely out of space now too. Zero wines from fall ‘17 and on have been bottled. Been putting off because got some blending to do on wines not quite ready yet. (Or started)
> 
> I layed low for 2019. And now eyeing up Spring like a junkie needing a fix! Chilean grapes have treated me very well in the past.
> And I’ve read a lot of winemakers doing similar with the oak. And all kinds of interesting options when using large flex tanks. Interested to know which direction you go with it.



Ya- Get back on the horse quick. New Jersey is a long way from anywhere, but Chile for sure. Bottle those 2017's. Free up some creative space. I did a mass bottling event last month and it was kind of cleansing. A day of back breaking work but got back to zero. And it only took 1 day.

I actually like the clean up. You stay focused and methodical and you're done in a couple of hours. Everything today got washed with PBW, then rinsed and rinsed and rinsed. I not only cleaned up but put everything away in it's final resting place until next year. And I know I can pull it out next September and it will be perfectly clean and ready to go another year. The fermenters are all stored in the attic so no way to do more this year. And yes, there is still some haverst going on of late ripening varietals.

I'm using much less oak this year and aiming for subtle as opposed to bold. We'll see.


----------



## Ajmassa

You’ve got oak PTSD!


----------



## mainshipfred

This past spring was the 3rd time I used Chilean grapes and find the quality amazing. Especially amazing considering the time it took to get here.


----------



## Chuck E

CDrew said:


> One of my friends has gone to an all free run protocol. I think he's wasting wine but he makes nice wine.
> 
> Not going to do barrels. i just don't have the space until I buy a second property-and I'm only looking halfheartedly. The last thing I want is MORE problems. And a very well respected wine grower/maker that I know thinks I can get there with just oak parts. He is actually phasing out of barrels and into those big flex tank stacking cubes with staves or beans. We'll see. He's had great results and makes great wine..



We were in Asheville NC last week and went a few wineries. Two of the properties have gone to aging in those industrial liquid storage cubes. They had them stacked 4 high x 4 deep. The wine maker said they were easier to sanitize and he could get more storage per square foot. The wines we tried were pretty tasty too. They don't have the same cachet as barrels though...


----------



## CDrew

Chuck E said:


> We were in Asheville NC last week and went a few wineries. Two of the properties have gone to aging in those industrial liquid storage cubes. They had them stacked 4 high x 4 deep. The wine maker said they were easier to sanitize and he could get more storage per square foot. The wines we tried were pretty tasty too. They don't have the same cachet as barrels though...



"Barrel room" sounds better than "cube room" for sure. But poly cubes are likely the future as the price of barrels keeps going up and represents a lot of stranded cost for a winery. Likely the science will keep getting better and better and the secrets of micro-oxidation, and oak flavor extraction will be a known thing, so no downside.


----------



## porkchopmessiah

Btw any of you Jersey guys need a hand with your glut of unfinished wine projects let me know, anything I could learn first hand would be awsome..(no I dont mean on the drinking side either)


----------



## CDrew

It's pouring down rain here, but I'll share this this story here.

Around November 15 (15!!!) I was up in Amador at Morse wines and got to chatting with the owner. He still had 5+ Tons of the most beautiful Barbera you ever saw hanging on the vines. He said a picking crew had not shown up the past weekend when the pick was planned. He was able to recover some $$ from the picking contractor but all of the Barbera went to waste since the rains started 10 days later. So I'm sure he would have let me pick as much as I wanted. I didn't do it though, because of timing and my schedule and the amount of wine this year, but it goes to show you how late things can actually go. I am going to get some of these late ripening Barbera grapes next year I hope. But such a shame and a waste this year, especially if you've ever had his Barbera.

Otherwise, all the wine from this year is tucked away until after Christmas. I may pull the oak off the syrah and taste test in a couple of weeks. But I otherwise Iike this part of wine making where you ignore the wine, and it makes itself.

Will update when racking in late December or early January.


----------



## buzi

I hope you don't mind. I am moving in and we are buying lots of loto tickets. I know it a bit forward , but I think my wife will be fine with it...she really likes wine!

Just saying you have had an incredible run of luck lately!


----------



## CDrew

buzi said:


> I hope you don't mind. I am moving in and we are buying lots of loto tickets. I know it a bit forward , but I think my wife will be fine with it...she really likes wine!
> Just saying you have had an incredible run of luck lately!



Not that lucky-I had to dump out half my Mourvedre! But availability was good this year and I feel fortunate to have a bunch of wine aging in the "wine room" Which by the way is unheated but still averaging 62-63 degrees. I check the tanks and kegs every few days with a Laser thermometer and very steady temps, I just wish they were lower.

But, yes, that wasted Barbera bothered me. It's just such a waste of well tended grapes. I've been drinking that Barbera for years and really wish I could have made some. I mainly posted because of the late harvest date. We basically had no rain until about November 20 and prior to that the grapes were still in great shape.


----------



## CDrew

I have some lab values for the Tempranillo and I would appreciate some advice. The back story is that the TA was a bit light at harvest-in the 4-4.5 range and I did not make any adjustments. So I was working on oaking it today with Stavin cubes and took a sample for analysis to Lodi Wine Labs. Their turn around is 1 hour and I already have results. I would appreciate comments and advice. I normally do not adjust TA, but it's time to make a more measured approach to wine making.

Some things I found surprising-there is some residual sugar(normal, see edit below), there is a bit of Malic acid left (did not show on the chromatography), and the pH is higher than I would like. I will say the new wine tastes very good.

So all comments welcomed, especially if you have specific advice about Acid adjustment. I am considering adjusting the acid to the 6g/L range. I know that it would have been more optimal before fermentation but that didn't happen. I have close to 40 gallons of this wine, so I want to make it as well as I can.

This is also telling me I need more than a pH meter.

And in case you are interested, this analysis is $40 at Lodi Wine Labs with a 1 hour turn around. I thought that was quite reasonable. And they are very nice people to deal with as well. I thought just the numbers alone were quite instructive. Please help me make sense of the numbers and put it in perspective.


Client Sample ID: 2019 TEMPRANILLO
Analyte Result Units Method Date Analyzed
LWL Sample ID: AA92261

Alcohol 13.58 % FTIR* 12/18/2019

Free Sulfur Dioxide 35 mg/L FTIR* 12/18/2019

Total Sulfur Dioxide 71 mg/L FTIR* 12/18/2019

Molecular SO2 0.21 mg/L Calculation 12/18/2019

Residual Sugar 0.8 g/L FTIR* 12/18/2019

Malic Acid 0.3 g/L FTIR* 12/18/2019

pH 4.03 FTIR* 12/18/2019

Titratable Acidity 4.30 g/L FTIR* 12/18/2019

Volatile Acidity 0.43 g/L FTIR* 12/18/2019


Edit: After thinking about this overnight, I looked up in "Techniques in Home Winemaking" about the residual sugar. Dry wines are those less than 2g/L. I'm at 0.8 so well under that. He also mentions that the residual sugar is pentose that the yeast are unable to metabolize. Pretty cool!


----------



## Johnd

Instead of just going straight to 6.0, do your bench trials and let your taste buds decide when you’ve got the acidity right. Let the pH fall where it may. Nice that you have some room to move your TA up before getting into the 6.x’s. I’ve seen @NorCal say several times that on his high pH wines adjusted post fermentation that it’s very easy to make the wine taste bad. 

Very cool opportunity you have there to get such thorough testing results so quickly, and some measurements that are not normally part of my winemaking regimen.


----------



## CDrew

Johnd said:


> Very cool opportunity you have there to get such thorough testing results so quickly, and some measurements that are not normally part of my winemaking regimen.



Yes. Agreed. Lodi wine labs is a great resource and quite friendly to home wine makers even though their focus is commercial wineries. Bench trials are not easy with what I have. If I remove enough for a concentration gradient bench trial, I'll need to top with something else. Which will likely have to be 2018 wine, which is all in bottles. I am slowly moving toward a "topping keg" situation and may need to move forward on that project.

I think tomorrow, I'll do TA 5.0 and TA 6.0 trials. I am for sure not taking the wine above 6.0 TA.

Very conflicted as to what to get testing wise. For $1000 I'd be completely set, but at $40 per test for relatively complete testing I may just keep doing that. But knowing TA and SO2 at any given time would be invaluable.


----------



## mbleill

Just an observation on your sulphite levels. Your "Free SO2" and your "Molecular SO2" looks low for your existing pH. I would recommend using WineMaker's Sulfite Calculator utility to adjust your sulphites after you adjust your acid levels and measure your resulting pH level. If you do no acid adjustment, using your current lab numbers, you would need to adjust your Free SO2 level to by adding (30.9 g of KSO2) to achieve 152 mg/L and that would only provide only a .5 mg/L Molecular SO2 level. Here is the link: https://winemakermag.com/resource/1301-sulfite-calculator

Hopefully your bench trials and measured acid adjustment will correspondingly bring your pH down to a more stable level.

Cheers!


----------



## CDrew

I investigated this a bit today. I did trials at 5, 5.5 and 6 TA (all values calculated since I can't measure TA directly at home. I honestly don't think the taste changed that much but with all the new wine smells and tastes it's hard to say. It didn't get worse or sour. It's a bit of a balancing act and even with TA of 6, the pH was still >3.8. So I committed to the whole thing at TA of just under 6.0. The pH ranges from 3.83-3.85 as we sit tonight so the tartaric addition did not change the pH much at all. I'll remeasure that in a few weeks too since by all accounts, it will creep back up..

Funny-this wine is only 6 weeks old and during the tasting today it looks clear enough to bottle. As an aside, I think the use of EX-V enzyme helps the wine clear much more quickly after fermentation. This is just an observation and may not be real but it seems pretty consistent.

I'll be racking in a few weeks and will adjust sulfite levels then, figuring things will have a chance to equilibrate. I see another trip to Lodi in my near future!

Anyway, measuring, dissolving (painful, heat is your friend), keeping track, tasting took all day today. I need to go back to work to get some rest!

Next year, the must gets adjusted and then that's it. I think scientific winemaking is a UC Davis invention, and since I'm an alum, I feel good about that!

I did look at the Vinmetrica 300 with the goodies looks like $669 at MoreWine. That sound about right?


----------



## Chuck E

CDrew said:


> I investigated this a bit today. I did trials at 5, 5.5 and 6 TA (all values calculated since I can't measure TA directly at home. I honestly don't think the taste changed that much but with all the new wine smells and tastes it's hard to say. It didn't get worse or sour. It's a bit of a balancing act and even with TA of 6, the pH was still >3.8. So I committed to the whole thing at TA of just under 6.0. The pH ranges from 3.83-3.85 as we sit tonight so the tartaric addition did not change the pH much at all. I'll remeasure that in a few weeks too since by all accounts, it will creep back up..
> 
> Funny-this wine is only 6 weeks old and during the tasting today it looks clear enough to bottle. As an aside, I think the use of EX-V enzyme helps the wine clear much more quickly after fermentation. This is just an observation and may not be real but it seems pretty consistent.



My first go with EX-V cleared really fast too. So one more anecdote if you're collecting them. I am making EX-V a standard part of my winemaking procedure.


----------



## CDrew

Did some racking/sulfiting today and have a question. The wine seems about right for this stage of it's life. It's clean tasting, fruity, good and very clean off the sediment. I credit the Pecitnase Lallyzyme EX-V for that. But racked today off of 2 months of oak cubes at a 35% level of "new oak". Definitely less oaky than last year where it was basically 100% new oak based on MoreWine recs. Although the 2018 is definitely toning down the oak with just a few months of aging after bottling. I'm finally thinking that it will be good a year after bottling.

But the question is, I can really seal it up. The sanitary fittings allow a total airtight seal in both directions. It's been vacuum racked 3 times now and very little CO2 in solution. But I am thinking that I will seal it until bottling. any down side to this? I'm thinking topped up, minimal O2, well sulfited, and minimal CO2 still on board, I can seal it up and bottle next fall. Appreciate any thoughts.


----------



## Chuck E

CDrew said:


> Did some racking/sulfiting today and have a question. The wine seems about right for this stage of it's life. It's clean tasting, fruity, good and very clean off the sediment. I credit the Pecitnase Lallyzyme EX-V for that. But racked today off of 2 months of oak cubes at a 35% level of "new oak". Definitely less oaky than last year where it was basically 100% new oak based on MoreWine recs. Although the 2018 is definitely toning down the oak with just a few months of aging after bottling. I'm finally thinking that it will be good a year after bottling.
> 
> But the question is, I can really seal it up. The sanitary fittings allow a total airtight seal in both directions. It's been vacuum racked 3 times now and very little CO2 in solution. But I am thinking that I will seal it until bottling. any down side to this? I'm thinking topped up, minimal O2, well sulfited, and minimal CO2 still on board, I can seal it up and bottle next fall. Appreciate any thoughts.



Your wine is in the keg, I assume? I can't see a downside, but I've never done this either. I hope some more experienced wine makers weigh in.


----------



## CDrew

Just to keep a diary of what's complete this year:

2 days ago, I did the final rack of the Syrah, Tempranillo and Primitivo. They are aging now and I won't open again until it's time to bottle next fall. The wine is clear and clean tasting. I had about 3 gallons each left of Primitivo and Tempranillo and so blended them expediently in a 6 gallon carboy. I have to say that right now, that blend is tasty. A bit of an unusual combo but not going to go to waste. THe oak is much less prominent than last year. I went for 35% of "new oak" with the stavin beans at medium toast and am much happier, at least at this point in the process.

The Mourvedre Rose got racked too. It is just ever so slightly pink-I may add some red wine to make it pinker. Right now, it's almost a Blanc de Noir. I had posted earlier that it was slightly hazy-it is not noticeable in a glass. It's good though and after tasting graduated samples with my wife, I decided to add 1 gm of Tartaric acid per liter. I'll bottle that in a few months one way or the other. I think I can get by with a "polishing" filter and maybe not even that.

I'll take about a 6 month vacation from winemaking and let the wine do it's thing. Hoping to be entertained by all you guys doing spring grapes from distant lands!

Final tally for 2019--
4 varietals-Syrah, Primitivo, Mourvedre, Tempranillo
1 Rose
1 blend
91.5 gallons

Goal for next season-Move forward with reliable SO2 testing, (and maybe a 30 gallon FlexTank). I have the TA and pH thing covered, time to up the game.


----------



## mainshipfred

Sounds like a good year. I had the same issue with a Grenache Rose. Had to add some Petite Sirah to darken it a bit. Still very light though.


----------



## CDrew

mainshipfred said:


> Sounds like a good year. I had the same issue with a Grenache Rose. Had to add some Petite Sirah to darken it a bit. Still very light though.



Did that change the taste at all? I have some nice dark Petite Syrah from 2018 that I could blend but don't want to alter it that much. I could also use my 2019 Tempranillo/Primitivo blend which is pretty dark without as much tannin. I see bench trials at bottling time!

I think this year I went about 6 hours on the skins, may go a few more this next year.


----------



## mainshipfred

CDrew said:


> Did that change the taste at all? I have some nice dark Petite Syrah from 2018 that I could blend but don't want to alter it that much. I could also use my 2019 Tempranillo/Primitivo blend which is pretty dark without as much tannin. I see bench trials at bottling time!
> 
> I think this year I went about 6 hours on the skins, may go a few more this next year.



II went back and looked at my notes, it was a 2019 Chilean Pinot Noir I used. It's a darker Pinot and I didn't want to use too much for the same reason as you, I didn't want to change the taste. I think I used about 500ml in a 3.5 gallon batch and it is still a very light Rose.


----------



## CDrew

I've been busy and not keeping up with my own thread, but I have some raw data to report. I recently set up my "wine lab" so I can do pH titrations quickly with a pH meter. It's incomplete, but what I have so far. I'm leaving the first two alone, but will likely "tweak" the Tempranillo by 0.5 g/L. None of the pH measurements are text book perfect, but the wine tastes good uniformly.

I should add, no Tartaric was added to the Primitivo or Syrah, they are what they are. I did add 1g/l to the tempramillo, and it tasted good (I've convinced myself better) even though the Tartaric was added after fermentation.




And next purchase will be an SC-100A. Time to get that right.


----------



## CDrew

Regarding the 2019-the only update is I bottled the Tempranillo. 30 gallons. Ended up with 12 cases and some tasters. The clean up took awhile but I'm clearing space to bulk age the 2020. Drinking the young wine tonight, and I'm thinking in a year, this will be a regular on the rotation.

And with 12 cases, I already gave one away to the guy that has been 100% reliable helping me pick grapes.


----------



## CDrew

2019 update (I know it's 2020 but wine is a process, not an event). In prep for bottling, I racked 15 gallons each of Mourvedre, Primitivo and Syrah. So 45 gallons total. And I did a pressure rack with inert gas-so the gas was used to move the wine from one Intellitank(and a keg) to another. I could have used vacuum with the same set up. And some tasting notes.

Syrah-If you read this far, you know this(2019) was a difficult year in the vineyard. 2020 is/was far better. We had to search for good grapes. The 1 year old wine is HUGE. Lots of tannin, subtle oak(yeah!), extremely dark, but it's a monster. Maybe in a year or two it will settle down. I hope so. It's got good flavors but with a massive tannin hit at the end. I cut down my FT Rouge for 2020, I hope that helps. Maybe the EX-V was too much? Also, still has some residual CO2 effervescence. That was a bit of a surprise. I hope a vacuum rack prior to bottling in 3 days, takes care of that.

Mourvedre-Also if you read this far, you know I tossed 10 gallons of this that was fermented with RP15 that was just not good. The remaining 15 gallons (which has about 2 gallons of Primitivo and 1.5gallons of Syrah mixed in) is very good. Tastes like a Mourvedre. Not as dark as some of the ones I've had from California and Spain but similar to Chilean Mourvedre wines. Very subtle oak (a win!), moderate tannin, I think it's good in a year. It's actually pretty good now. This wine was definitely a problem child during fermentation, so happy I'll at least have a decent wine out of it. Actually 2 decent wines because the 2019 Mourvedre Rose is drinking pretty well now.

Primitivo-Dang, this is a good wine already. It's only 1 year old but already approachable. Could drink with dinner now. Wife likes it. So far, at 1 year, this is the best of the bunch. Definitely will be a mid week go-to after another year in the bottle. Interesting it's very well balanced tannin/acid/alcohol without being 1 dimensional. I have high hopes for this one. I'll drink and share. Just for reference, aged in a stainless steel 15.5 gallon keg for the full year.

Things I learned 2019:
-Have a light hand with the the oak, especially if using StaVin cubes. You can always come back with more later. I'm just going to recommend nothing more than Medium, and 25%-35% "new oak" equivalent according to the calculator on StaVin's website. Leave for 2 months not 3. Major improvement over 2018 when the M+ cubes had a campfire quality at 1 year, that is still present, though fading at 2 years. In truth, the 2018 Primitivo still has too much oak. Syrah and Petite sirah are just fine.

-It's ok to make tartaric/pH adjustments after fermentation. Do your major correction prior to fermentation, but it's OK to make small additional corrections midstream.

-Better grapes = better wine. Last year by far the best pick was the Primitivo. Great numbers out of the gate. Very well cared for in the vineyard too. 2020 if anything was even better in the same vineyard, so high hopes there too.

-Nice to have your own wine lab equipment. Good to know where you're headed. Especially helpful to be able to be able to measure pH and titrate TA. The free SO2 monitoring is good too.

-It's ok to minimize racking. I last racked these in February.

I'll update this with 6 month and 1 year tastings, but I plan to bottle later this week. Will also edit with pics.

Clean up!



-


----------



## Boatboy24

CDrew said:


> -It's ok to make tartaric/pH adjustments after fermentation. Do your major correction prior to fermentation, but it's OK to make small additional corrections midstream.



+1 to that. I've had wines that were good, but I felt there was something missing. Sometimes, even a very minuscule acid addition completely woke these wines up.


----------



## buzi

I am glad you posted. I am getting mouvedre this year and was thinking RP-15 since that is my go-to for petite sirah. I am going to have to rethink that now after our thread conversation last year. What yeast was the other 15 gallons fermented with? I have BM-45 and D-254 also on hand...


----------



## CDrew

buzi said:


> I am glad you posted. I am getting mouvedre this year and was thinking RP-15 since that is my go-to for petite sirah. I am going to have to rethink that now after our thread conversation last year. What yeast was the other 15 gallons fermented with? I have BM-45 and D-254 also on hand...



So I've become very fond of Avante yeast, which does not make H2S. It's a very versatile yeast as it tolerates high alcohol, high temperatures, and seems to power through any adversity. Seriously, read up on it but it's a great addition to what's available.

But there are many yeasts will do fine here. RP15 was not good for me, one time, but don't take that as anything more than 1 persons, one year experience. It's a fine choice for many.


----------



## Cynewulf

CDrew said:


> -It's ok to minimize racking. I last racked these in February.



This is on my mind as well. How many times did/will you rack and at what stages or indicators?


----------



## CDrew

Cynewulf said:


> This is on my mind as well. How many times did/will you rack and at what stages or indicators?



Warning: More laziness than expertise!

Sort of did the usual. Rack off the gross lees, then a month or two later when MLF has completed, Then in January or February to get it off the oak cubes. I just did a final racking just before bottling. The reason I didn't rack after February is that the wine was basically clear and good tasting then, and I did not see how it would benefit being racked 3 months later. I am no expert though, just being practical.


----------



## CDrew

I'll just mention that virtually all the 2019 is bottled. I have about 20 cases if you count the Rose. But I have 2 carboys left of mixed leftovers. Mostly primitivo and tempranillo with a chaser of maybe 1 gallon of syrah. All unoaked. It's very good, and I wish I had not been so lazy and done the oak thing months ago, but I was saving it as a "topping" wine which I now don't need. So I lightly oaked the carboys with Medium French cubes, added sulfite fizzy tablets for the first time since Feb, and will bottle 2 months from now. I'm thinking it's going to be good, but I don't know what call it, though I have a suspicion, that situations like this is where "Meritage" comes from.

BTW-just a comment about the Tablets. There was discussion on another thread. They are very easy to score and snap in half for a partial dose.


----------



## CDrew

CDrew said:


> Primitivo-Dang, this is a good wine already. It's only 1 year old but already approachable. Could drink with dinner now. Wife likes it. So far, at 1 year, this is the best of the bunch. Definitely will be a mid week go-to after another year in the bottle. Interesting it's very well balanced tannin/acid/alcohol without being 1 dimensional. I have high hopes for this one. I'll drink and share. Just for reference, aged in a stainless steel 15.5 gallon keg for the full year.



I'm tasting the 2019 Primitivo tonight. It's a huge win. A couple of months after bottling it's over the bottle shock and actually very, very good. Some of the best wine I've made. It's still on the young side but very good now. In a year, I'm expecting great. Anyway, very happy with this wine. If I can make wine this good every year, I'll be happy. I almost can't say how much I value one of our friends with this Primitivo vineyard. It's so consistently excellent. "The grapes make the wine" and there's no better example than this.


----------



## JohnT

In a year? the trick is to still have some in a year.


----------



## CDrew

JohnT said:


> In a year? the trick is to still have some in a year.



Yeah-that's the truth. However, I'm pretty disciplined about this and have 1 case set aside for the first year in the bottle and monthly tastings. So at 2 years old, I should still have 5 cases. Then if it's still as good, I'll drink and give away the rest away over the next year or three.


----------



## CDrew

In the wine closet, I still had a 6 gallon Mixed carboy of Primitivo, Tempranillo and a bit of Syrah. Plus a 3 gallon carboy of Primitivo. The expedient thing was to mix up a Meritage and bottle. So it's truly the leftovers. I netted almost 4 cases (2 bottles short).

Primitivo-----50%
Tempranillo--45%
Syrah---------5%

First pic is wine being vacuum racked into the Intellitank for bottling, and the second pic is the result.

Tasted a bit-it's a nice wine, but the tempranillo definitely lightened the body a bit. Nice acid punch from the Primitivo, so I think the Meritage is a winner in 2021 and 2022. This is very lightly oaked so the flavors are all from the grapes.


----------



## sour_grapes

CDrew said:


> In the wine closet, I still had a 6 gallon Mixed carboy of Primitivo, Tempranillo and a bit of Syrah. Plus a 3 gallon carboy of Primitivo. The expedient thing was to mix up a Meritage and bottle. So it's truly the leftovers. I netted almost 4 cases (2 bottles short).
> 
> Primitivo-----50%
> Tempranillo--45%
> Syrah---------5%
> 
> First pic is wine being vacuum racked into the Intellitank for bottling, and the second pic is the result.
> 
> Tasted a bit-it's a nice wine, but the tempranillo definitely lightened the body a bit. Nice acid punch from the Primitivo, so I think the Meritage is a winner in 2021 and 2022. This is very lightly oaked so the flavors are all from the grapes.



Sounds like a nice blend! But why are you calling it a Meritage? It has NONE of the grapes in a Meritage. (Meritage is a made-up, but trademarked wine industry name for a US-made blend of traditional Bordeaux varieties.)


----------



## CDrew

sour_grapes said:


> Sounds like a nice blend! But why are you calling it a Meritage? It has NONE of the grapes in a Meritage. (Meritage is a made-up, but trademarked wine industry name for a US-made blend of traditional Bordeaux varieties.)



I'm trying to call it something made up after just throwing all the left overs together. I could call it a blend, but it's what I had left, so, a meritage. LOL. It actually tastes good already. But it's 100% what I have left from 2019. So all the 2019 is in the bottle, to be tasted and consumed 2021+. Seriously. there's no pretense here. Just what's still there needing to be bottled. But it tastes better than you might expect.


----------



## sour_grapes

CDrew said:


> I could call it a blend, but it's what I had left, so, a meritage.



You're not thinking of a "melange," by any chance, are you?

Meritage is supposedly a portmanteau of "merit" and "heritage." Totally invented marketing term.


----------



## CDrew

CDrew said:


> Mourvedre-Also if you read this far, you know I tossed 10 gallons of this that was fermented with RP15 that was just not good. The remaining 15 gallons (which has about 2 gallons of Primitivo and 1.5gallons of Syrah mixed in) is very good. Tastes like a Mourvedre. Not as dark as some of the ones I've had from California and Spain but similar to Chilean Mourvedre wines. Very subtle oak (a win!), moderate tannin, I think it's good in a year. It's actually pretty good now. This wine was definitely a problem child during fermentation, so happy I'll at least have a decent wine out of it. Actually 2 decent wines because the 2019 Mourvedre Rose is drinking pretty well now.



I had not tasted this Mourvedre in several months. We are having it tonight with some pork chops. It's much better than I remembered. It won't get poured down the storm drain like the other 10 gallons. It's actually better than I expected. But this wine has had serious flaws. Not sure if it was me, or the grapes, but this wine just was not it. Glad that's it's getting better and pretty good now.


----------



## CDrew

And now drinking the Syrah from 2019. It's really good. Still young, in the sense it's still fruity, but the tannins are softer now and the wine itself is sound. I still have 4.5 cases. It should be good for years.

But, dang, the 2019 Mourvedra remains a disappointment. I have 4 more cases. I am considering just pouring it out, and using the bottles to finishing up the 2020 bottling.


----------



## buzi

CDrew said:


> And now drinking the Syrah from 2019. It's really good. Still young, in the sense it's still fruity, but the tannins are softer now and the wine itself is sound. I still have 4.5 cases. It should be good for years.
> 
> But, dang, the 2019 Mourvedra remains a disappointment. I have 4 more cases. I am considering just pouring it out, and using the bottles to finishing up the 2020 bottling.


----------



## buzi

How about we just have Mouvedre party at the Crew household?!? Just kidding. Mouvedre is a tough grape to vint. I haven't tasted my Mouvedre that I made in 2020 with avante. I am a bit scared to.


----------

