# "mlf"



## ThePlantGuy978 (Jan 3, 2013)

I am not exactly a newbe. I have successfully been making wine for 40+ years I have been using older wine making books to learn my hobby. None of my books ever mention “MLF”. This forum talks about it all of the time, but never explains what it is.
Can some one please enlighten me as to what they are talking about.

Hans


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## Deezil (Jan 3, 2013)

Malo-Lactic Fermentation

It's the introduction of a bacteria that converts malic acid within the wine into lactic acid, softening the wine & depending on the strain of MLF bacteria, can contribute different flavors or textures in wine.. Its mostly red wines that are MLF'd, but chardonnay can be sometimes too.

Its usually done just post-fermentation, before any additions of sulfites (because they'll stop it), but sometimes can be added during the tail end of alcoholic fermentation.

If you've racked a wine off of the sur less / fine lees, then a MLF-nutrient is often used to avoid any issues with the MLF conversion


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## Turock (Jan 3, 2013)

There are white papers written on MLF that you can find if you do a search. E C Kraus has a good explaination of it and how to do it for a first timer. We printed out these instructions on our first try with an MLF and it turned out perfect. I would suggest some study on it before you make your first attempt.


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## robie (Jan 3, 2013)

A MLF can happen spontaneously and it only happened that way up until the last century, when the bacteria was finally isolated and cultured.

If you have been making grape wine for 40 years, you more than likely have experienced an MLF without knowing it. It is more subtle than a full-on alcohol fermentation. Many times the only physical evidence of MLF is a ring of small bubbles around the neck of the carboy.


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## Rocky (Jan 3, 2013)

Hans, I have many of the same questions that you have about MLF. I do not add anything to my wines to stimulate MLF therefore if it happens, it happens, if not, it doesn't. 

We made wine 60 years ago by just crushing Zinfandel and Muscat grapes and co-fermenteing them in an open barrel. Yes, the Muscat skins too. We did not add yeast and only much later learned about _Sodium_ Metabisulfite, which we used to order and pay $5 for a very small tube. Our schedule was fairly much the same year to year. We would buy the grapes sometime during the second week of October, process them into an open barrel for 10-14 days, transfer the wine to barrels with open bung holes which we had to keep "topped off" and "de-fruit flied" until about the 2 week of December. At that point the barrel would be sealed with a bung and left until about Easter when the wine would be ready to drink. Aging was never an issue. No wine was more than 1 year old in our house, unless a bottle got lost behind the newer wine.

Time and age may have dulled my memory somewhat but I remember the wine was excellent just about every year. When I make wine now, I try to stay close to that MO. The only thing I add as a matter of course is Potassium Metabisulfite.


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## JohnT (Jan 3, 2013)

Back in the day, when no-one knew about mlf, winemakers from around the world were scratching their head trying to figure out why the french made such good wine. 

It was not until the late 60's / early 70's that a big part of the answer was discovered.. MLF. 

If you have not yet performed a MLF on any of your wines, I highly recomend that you do!


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## Runningwolf (Jan 3, 2013)

JohnT how would you feel about a milf with some Concord!


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## ThePlantGuy978 (Jan 3, 2013)

I can surely see that I am from the old school.
No I phone, no Tablet, no tablet. Jut a cell phone for emercency calls, less that 10 min./month.
I better catch up before I kick the bucket!!!

Hans


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## JohnT (Jan 4, 2013)

MLF is old school. 

The discovery was made by checking out the old barrels the French used for years and years. The bacteria tended to colonize in the barrel's wood. 

It did not take them too long to discover how to culture it. Much like yeast, mlb is a natural living organism. It is not really very high tech.


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## JohnT (Jan 4, 2013)

Runningwolf said:


> JohnT how would you feel about a milf with some Concord!


 
(LOL). 

*NAAAAH, just stir in some peanut butter and be done with it.... Tee Hee. *

Wolfie, 

Should I change my signature to the following????

Disclaimer: Comments concerning Welch's or Concord grapes is not intended to offend those that like and prefer these wines. Each has their own tastes and no taste is better than another (simply different). Some like it sweet, some do not. Some prefer white wine, some prefer red. Preferences in wine do not make one inferior. I, myself, hate concord wine and this has been an on-going joke for some time.


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## Runningwolf (Jan 4, 2013)

John I love it. You're the best!


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## wineon4 (Jan 10, 2013)

I have a winexpert merlot that just reached .0996 would an MLF do it justice or continue following the kit instructions? I have been thinking about ordering some MLF and try it. Would this be a good wine to start with?


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## robie (Jan 10, 2013)

wineon4 said:


> I have a winexpert merlot that just reached .0996 would an MLF do it justice or continue following the kit instructions? I have been thinking about ordering some MLF and try it. Would this be a good wine to start with?



Never do an MLF on a kit wine. They are balanced in such a way that MLF is not necessary. MLF just won't improve a kit wine.

If sorbate, which comes with all kits, ever gets into a wine that has had MLF, it will ruin the wine.. dead!!! (Unless you think crunching on a geranium plant sounds delicious) That's right, you get the same taste as eating a geranium.

Just never consider doing an MLF on any kit wine.


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## wineon4 (Jan 10, 2013)

robie said:


> Never do an MLF on a kit wine. They are balanced in such a way that MLF is not necessary. MLF just won't improve a kit wine.
> 
> If sorbate, which comes with all kits, ever gets into a wine that has had MLF, it will ruin the wine.. dead!!! (Unless you think crunching on a geranium plant sounds delicious) That's right, you get the same taste as eating a geranium.
> 
> Just never consider doing an MLF on any kit wine.



Ok sounds good, how about on 6 gal black current that I have going fron 2 - 96 oz cans of wine base. it is setting at around .0990


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## robie (Jan 10, 2013)

wineon4 said:


> Ok sounds good, how about on 6 gal black current that I have going fron 2 - 96 oz cans of wine base. it is setting at around .0990



Julie or one of the other people who have made a variety of fruit and cold-climate grape wines would do better at answering your question about black current.


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## RegionRat (Jan 10, 2013)

Rocky said:


> Hans, I have many of the same questions that you have about MLF. I do not add anything to my wines to stimulate MLF therefore if it happens, it happens, if not, it doesn't.
> 
> We made wine 60 years ago by just crushing Zinfandel and Muscat grapes and co-fermenteing them in an open barrel. Yes, the Muscat skins too. We did not add yeast and only much later learned about _Sodium_ Metabisulfite, which we used to order and pay $5 for a very small tube. Our schedule was fairly much the same year to year. We would buy the grapes sometime during the second week of October, process them into an open barrel for 10-14 days, transfer the wine to barrels with open bung holes which we had to keep "topped off" and "de-fruit flied" until about the 2 week of December. At that point the barrel would be sealed with a bung and left until about Easter when the wine would be ready to drink. Aging was never an issue. No wine was more than 1 year old in our house, unless a bottle got lost behind the newer wine.
> 
> Time and age may have dulled my memory somewhat but I remember the wine was excellent just about every year. When I make wine now, I try to stay close to that MO. The only thing I add as a matter of course is Potassium Metabisulfite.



As I was reading this it brought back memories of what my grandfather did when I was a very young kid back in the early 60's. He had 4 rows of something similar to Concord about 50 yards long. I dont remember each step that was done in what order but, it was such a pleasure to help my grandfather. After the wine was bottled it was stored in a converted coal room under the front stairs. every once in a while we would sneak a bottle. I never knew what the stuff on the bottom of the bottles was till I started reading this forum. It was ' wine dimonds,' lol.

Thanks for sparking those memories.

RR


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