# Turpentine Smell



## ffemt128 (Jan 6, 2013)

Pressed off some Concord grapes this evening for someone. The juice had a turpentine smell to it. I tasted it and it tasted fine. Grapes have been sitting on skins for a while and are fermented dry. As I said, the juice tasted fine. What can be done to correct the odor. I suggested splash racking several times. 

I personally would not hesitate to dring the wine after clearing and back sweetening.


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## Julie (Jan 6, 2013)

If it is tasting fine, then I would say it is fond. I would splash rack it and just keep an eye on it


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## Runningwolf (Jan 6, 2013)

Sounds like it might be H2S. You would have to do a copper test to check it. 

Hey Doug, put about 100 ml in two glasses. Put an old penny in one of them. Now swirl them around and cover them. In about 5 minutes smell both of them and see if the stink goes away. If it does thats your problem.


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## altavino (Jan 7, 2013)

Turpentines aromatic sharp sweet smell sounds like Volatile acidity VA (ethyl acetate) not H2s (eggs, cabbage, rubber, farts)
Since the wine is dry rack it and add 50 ppm (1/2 tsp per carboy) of kmeta (so2) mix the meta with a little water then add it to a carboy and rack the wine into the carboy.

This should knock down any bacteria and bind some of the odour compounds. And if it is h2s This is a good first step before treating with ascorbic acid, reduless or copper.

Some more history on the wine would help, Sitting on skins (was it punched down twice a day?) was it cofermented with mlf & yeast? So2 additions, nutrient regimen, was it racked off the gross lees? What yeast was used? What condition were the grapes in?


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## tingo (Jan 7, 2013)

Thats what i was thinking too, ethyl acetate. But alta is it possible for grapes to progress to that stage so noticeably in so little time? I mean alcohol, oxygen, damaged grapes, and possible low pH are all needed for a recipe like that. Whats your opinion on time needed for something like this alta?


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## JohnT (Jan 7, 2013)

Could it be mercaptans? To me this smells like "burnt rubber", but it might also smell like turpintine to some.


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## altavino (Jan 7, 2013)

tingo said:


> Thats what i was thinking too, ethyl acetate. But alta is it possible for grapes to progress to that stage so noticeably in so little time? I mean alcohol, oxygen, damaged grapes, and possible low pH are all needed for a recipe like that. Whats your opinion on time needed for something like this alta?




It can develop before the grapes even hit the crusher if there is any bird damage, mold . Also consider other issues like poor sanitatation of the crusher or fermenter or harvesting or punch down tools. 

And it is not uncommon to have it develop during primary, especially If so2 was not used at crush , it wasn't punched down enough, there were fruit flys, the yeast was wild or not given supplemental nutrients. 

I don't think this sounds like h2s but you could always treat for both , get the so2 up to at least 50 ppm , 65 if the smell is strong. If it still smells , Then fine the wine with reduless to Treat for h2s.


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## wineman2013 (Jan 11, 2013)

So 128 , what did you decide to do?

Did it help?


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## ffemt128 (Jan 12, 2013)

I'll have to check with the person and see. It wasnt my batch. I know it was given a heavy sulfite dosing but ther than that....?


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## Hokapsig (Jan 12, 2013)

I splash racked it and the odor seems to have dissipated. It's now in a carboy and I will take a sniff and let you know how it smells. During the splash racking, the concord smell was coming out and the turpentiney smell was going away.

The wine was made from concord grapes picked late in the season. The cap was pushed down daily (when I got home from work) and stirred into the juice. Sugar was added to the juice and skins and left to ferment. After fermentation, the must was sulfited (and due to travel, I wasn't able to push down for a week). I siphoned off the juice and place the skins in a bucket for Doug to press.


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## ffemt128 (Jan 12, 2013)

Glad to hear the concord smell is coming back. It didn't taste bad when we tried it so that was promising.


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## wineman2013 (Jan 13, 2013)

Skin exposure to air , either not punching down or in a bucket would be ideal conditions for acetic acid spoilage .

So2 will be your friend , I would use a little more than normal and limit further air exposure


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## Hokapsig (Jan 13, 2013)

Although I did have the juice and skins in a sealed bucket with lid, there was enough head space to allow the acetic acid spoilage to begin. I did sulfite it, but this is now a learning experience on dealing wth juice and skin caps.

The juice is now in a carboy with air lock. I will rack again to get some more of the solids out and be able to splash rack again. I'll toss some more K meta in too just in case. The more I splashed, the more the Concord smell came back. Enough smell to cause the wife to start complaining about the "grapey" smell in the basement....


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## wineman2013 (Jan 13, 2013)

I wouldn't splash rack it.
Air will only make it worse .
If its off the gross lees , I would just sulfite it to 70 ppm and leave it under airlock.

Splash racking will cause the free sulfite level to drop , and give th bacteria more of the o2 it needs to reproduce.
A one two punch for spoilage.


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