# Chardonnay frozen crushed and de-stemmed grapes



## geek (Feb 23, 2015)

I have an opportunity to buy 3 pails (frozen solid) for a very attractive price.
I'm being told they were ordered by a customer in the fall, were crushed and de-stemmed but customer cancelled.

So they were packed in 3 buckets and are frozen solid, so assume wild yeast fermentation did not happen at all.

Price is really attractive, problem is they don't know the original brix but think it was in the low 20s; which I assume is good for a white.

As many of you know I don't have a press and do not intend on getting one soon.

So, what do you guys think?

Grapes were from Lanza (hint?  ) which I know are known for very good quality grapes.

A mash potato may be my only and painful option if I press at home 

Price being offered because I'm buying a 23l barrel and I could put into the barrel post ferment to leach out some of the oak, and then put my reds.
The thing is I think you guys do MLF on Chardonnay too, another variable I need to consider.

Ideas, thoughts please....


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## Boatboy24 (Feb 23, 2015)

Not sure what you're paying for the three pails, but I would imagine you'll get somewhere around 6-7 gallons, since you don't have a press. If the price for the three is anywhere near $100, I'd just go with a mid-high range kit. It'll be far easier and cleaner than dealing with frozen grapes. Yes, the Lanza name is tempting, but...


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## geek (Feb 23, 2015)

Jim, are you a mind reader price-wise? 
Yes, $100
Good point.

So 3 pails would yield only ~7gal?
I don't really know how many cases of grapes they were initially so fill 3 pails though, I will inquire but would think you can pack more than a case into a plastic bucket, don't remember.

You're right, if that will be around only 7gals then I may stick with a kit.


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## geek (Feb 23, 2015)

BTW - They sell their Lanza juice pails of Chardonnay for around $148.00


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## Boatboy24 (Feb 23, 2015)

I'm completely guesstimating on the final volume. But I assume these are 5 gallon buckets and am assuming 15 gallons of must would yield about half as much wine. Maybe you'd get more, but without a press, I'd be hesitant to go for it. Just my $0.02.


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## heatherd (Feb 23, 2015)

I would go for it if you like to drink chardonnay. What's the worst that could happen? 

You might be able to create the two-bucket press that either Seth or Jack posted fairly easily. But pressing by hand is what I do and it gets the job done so far.

My two cents. I assume you posted for vigorous debate and divergent points of view. 

Heather


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## geek (Feb 23, 2015)

Thanks.
Yeah, I think I will pass on this, better get a kit and no further trouble.


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## Wild Duk (Feb 23, 2015)

Who is it from? If your gonna pass, is the deal still available?


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## geek (Feb 24, 2015)

Wild Duk said:


> Who is it from? If your gonna pass, is the deal still available?



Where are you located?


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## seth8530 (Feb 24, 2015)

I would not pass on a deal like that very easily. Is wine about production? Or is it about getting in there and having a fun time with it? As was mentioned before, a bucket in bucket press is pretty easy to make. It might not be the easiest to use, but it would get the job done. 


The one thing that would concern me though is the fact that the white wine is coming in a frozen must form. Most whites are immediately pressed in order to avoid excess contact with the skins causing color and tannins from the skins making their way into the wine. But looking at the price, I would still be tempted to just go for it.


Keep in mind though, what you would want to do upon receiving the must would be to press as soon as it thawed and then get the must chilled and rack off of the sediment prior to fermentation. However, since it is coming in frozen must form, I am not sure if this conventional wisdom would still apply.


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## Wild Duk (Feb 24, 2015)

I live near Atlanta. Was this being picked up or shipped ?


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## geek (Feb 24, 2015)

pickup in CT.


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## geek (Feb 26, 2015)

I was doing some reading and it looks like the 'buttery' flavor in Chardonnay is mainly from the malo when the wine is put through MLF, and that you get this flavor much better this way when doing ML rather than a kit wine that never goes through MLF.

Thoughts?

I am re-considering this offer and may jump on it and take a chance.


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## Boatboy24 (Feb 27, 2015)

Shoebidoe and others have done sur lie aging and/or battonage on chardonnay kits and have achieve a similar effect. I'm sure going with fresh grapes and doing a MLF would do better, but I'm not sure how much.


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## geek (Mar 2, 2015)

Well...took the plunge and bought the 3 pails.
They're frozen solid and filled to the top.

Placed buckets close to pellet stove in the basement.


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## geek (Mar 2, 2015)

Opened buckets, tastes and smells good.


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## bakervinyard (Mar 2, 2015)

You know Geek, If you wanted to have some fun you could do 2 different styles of wine. Ferment 1/2 in one bucket and do MLF, the other halve you could not do Mlf. Maybe blend some together and see if it peaks your interest. bakervinyard


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## geek (Mar 2, 2015)

Thought about it but seems like MLF is always good doing on Chardonnay.

I am hoping these buckets thaw in 2 days as my new 23l vadai is prepped and filled with water, but they're really frozen solid....we will see....


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## Boatboy24 (Mar 2, 2015)

Put some towels around/under those buckets. You're going to have a lot of condensation.

Oh, and go pick up that press.


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## geek (Mar 2, 2015)

Boatboy24 said:


> Put some towels around/under those buckets. You're going to have a lot of condensation.
> 
> Oh, and go pick up that press.




I placed a big round cake hard plastic cover on the bottom, I got them at costco from the bakery folks. Works great to capture any spills and condensation.
The press....either tomorrow or Wednesday ....


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## seth8530 (Mar 3, 2015)

Well truly, MLF vs no MLF is really a stylistic choice. Ie, oaky buttery vs fresh and fruity... However, I would be tempted to do MLF on the whole batch since I am not sure if your skin contact is really going to be cohesive to the idea of a fresh and fruity white.


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## geek (Mar 3, 2015)

Grape must showing signs of thawing this morning, I think that I will try to get it all out from the 3 buckets and placed in a big plastic tub to help break it down more. Will probably add opti-white at that point and/or before pressing.

Barrel patiently waiting....


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## geek (Mar 3, 2015)

Emptied buckets into a plastic tub to help break down some ice clumps, it is all watery now....getting nervous as I could press tonight, it is ready to press.

Calibrated PH55 meter and the PH came up to *3.53*
Will try checking TA with it tomorrow when I press (could not pickup the press today due to snow/ice coming down around here 

Grape must temp is around 41F.....
Added less than 1/4 tsp of kmeta to each bucket once in the plastic tub and stirred well. Placed back into buckets and put lid on them.

Waiting game until tomorrow afternoon.. but getting nervous, hope I can sleep tonight.


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## seth8530 (Mar 3, 2015)

You are going to want to wait until the must is fully thawed and well mixed before you take any PH/TA or Brix readings.. and I did emphasize well mix and well thawed.


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## geek (Mar 10, 2015)

Thanks LeChat,

not sure who is the smart *** "not worth saying his name", but I care less....smart people share their knowledge in a positive way, smart asses not so much..

Oh, and the batch has been going great so far....I'm sure he will copy/paste these comments now..... 

IDC.


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## LeChat (Mar 10, 2015)

Oh, looks like I did not say anything since apparently my post is no longer there. 

It's just a big mystery...


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## geek (Mar 10, 2015)

Looks like a mod deleted it and edited mine.....


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## LeChat (Mar 10, 2015)

I am not sure why it was removed. If it was because of the direct link, a simple edit would have done the trick.

I guess it's better to cut off your hand when you have a splinter too because, you know, reasons!

As far as I am aware, the post I have made did not break any of the 15 forum rules.


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## A2 (Mar 11, 2015)

LeChat said:


> I am not sure why it was removed. If it was because of the direct link, a simple edit would have done the trick.
> 
> I guess it's better to cut off your hand when you have a splinter too because, you know, reasons!
> 
> As far as I am aware, the post I have made did not break any of the 15 forum rules.



Without the link there would have been no purpose for the post. 

If you ever take issue with our moderation or the actions we take please feel free to contact me directly.

Edit: Gene, if you're reading this lets start a dialogue. I tried posting to your site but it's still a comment in moderation.


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