# PH Meter VS Titration Kit



## JohnT (Sep 1, 2010)

OK, 

A lot written about PH meters. I am trying to find out if there is any real benefit to a PH meter over the use of a titration kit (other than better accuracy). Lets assume that the titration kit has not been sitting on the shelf (the chems are relatively new). 

Please let me know your point of view. I have a PH meter still in the box and I have been going with Titration kits because they seem simplier to use and have no need to be calibrated. 

Since the "Target Area" for titration on Reds is .60 through .65, I am wondering how accurate do you need to be. 

Any input would be much appreciated!

thanks 

johnT.


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## winemaker_3352 (Sep 1, 2010)

I have never used a ph meter - but i have the acid test kit and it seems to work for me.

The chardonel grapes i have had an acid reading from the winery of .80 - i used the acid test kit at home and got the exact same reading.


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## jet (Sep 1, 2010)

pH and TA (total acid) are separate entities and should both be measured. AFAIK, pH represents the overall strength of the acids, while TA shows their quantity.


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## BobF (Sep 1, 2010)

jet said:


> pH and TA (total acid) are separate entities and should both be measured. AFAIK, pH represents the overall strength of the acids, while TA shows their quantity.


 
Exactly right. Check out:
http://www.winemakingtalk.com/forum/showpost.php?p=25651&postcount=1


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## Luc (Sep 1, 2010)

If you add 1 gram tartaric acid to a wine the wine will be less acidic as when you add 1 gram citric acid to that wine.
So the same weight gives you a different acidity.

Now the weight is measured by a titration kit.
The strength is measured by PH.

So if you look at fruit tables and you will see that fruit A has a TA of let us say 5 which consists mainly of tartaric acid (grapes), and fruit B has also a TA of 5 but being mostly malic acid (think apples) the apples will taste much more acidic as the grapes.

So generally speaking PH is more important as TA.

However. Having said this, and knowing this I have never used a PH meter myself. I move along with the titration kit, intuition and taste.

Luc


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## grapeman (Sep 1, 2010)

For quick simple tests either the Accuvin or kit will give accurate enough results. If you have high acidity you would be better off with the pH meter since the kits generally only go up to about 1.0 or 10g/L. I just got done running 25 samples for TA, pH, brix and weight this afternoon. I cheat and use a Hanna mitnititrator. It gives a digital readout in about 30 seconds to two minutes depending on acid content.


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## JohnT (Sep 2, 2010)

OK, 


Thanks for the input folks. I do have some follow up questions... 

1) In reading other threads, It looks like a PH in the range of 3.3 to 3.5 is a good target for red wines? Correct? 

2) Have you ever had the case where the Titration was acceptable, but the PH was not. What do you do in this case? Adjusting to the PH results will effect the titration. 

3) When adjusting PH, what acid do you use? It is my understanding that tartaric acid is preferred, but if you plan on using MLB, perhaps adjusting with malic acid would be better? 

4) Since differect acids have different strengths (hydrogen) then is there some sort of chart that determines how much of a certain acid will adjust how much PH?

Thanks in advance for your input!

johnT.


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## jet (Sep 2, 2010)

Regarding #2, I've read about it, but have never seen it.


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