# Separating skins for transfer?



## Ajmassa (May 18, 2017)

I just had a heck of time going from primary to press to glass. Smaller batches are not of concern I suppose, but getting the skins to the press and separated from the wine was daunting. 
Is it better to just dump it all at once into the press, or to strain out scooping the skins first?
I ended up doing both and killed myself. Scooping out the skins on the surface then into the press. Then Maneuvering my racking cane inside a strainer on the surface of the wine using the AIO with one hand, the other on the vacuum release. Strainer would get clogged easily and had to stop and start many times. Got about half transferred via AIO and Finally just dumped the rest into the press. 
Seemed to me like the best way would be to dump the whole batch through the press, but I don't know. Searching online just raised more questions because everyone seems to do it differently.


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## CryptoStorm (May 18, 2017)

What did you start with? 

Are you talking about pressing it right after crushing?

Has it been fermenting with the skins?


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## Ajmassa (May 18, 2017)

No, pressing after AF. Skins in the fermenter. I'm just talking about the proper way to go from brute to press, and then press to glass. 

Are you just putting everything through the press, letting as much wine freely run through before actually pressing? 
OR
Are you siphoning with a strainer type system leaving behind all the skins at bottom of vessel to then dump into press ??


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## CryptoStorm (May 18, 2017)

I stop punching the skins down so that they all float to the top and slide the siphon down the edge to suck the juice off the bottom.

If you need to you could slide panty hose over your siphon cane to keep it from plugging..

I've never really had an issue though..


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## Boatboy24 (May 18, 2017)

I ferment in 20gal Brutes. My 'press' is really two phases, sometimes happening simultaneously. I have a section of PVC with a cap on one end. In that PVC, I drilled a 'gajillion' holes. I don't punch down the cap prior to pressing. Rather, I insert my PVC 'strainer' through the cap and all the way into the brute, capped end down. The open end sticks up above the must. Into that, I insert a racking cane with my AI1 attached. Then I rack out the 'free run' juice and when that's done, I transfer the remaining skins and juice into the press using a strainer. The pressed juice is drained into a bucket below through a fine mesh strainer to catch any seeds or other small particles that might find their way through the press. Once all that is done (or sometimes while it's going on), I rack from bucket to carboy using the AI1.


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## Ajmassa (May 18, 2017)

That's a great idea about leaving the cap floating. Though I also had a significant amount of seeds and sludge on the bottom too. And I also usually use a muslin bag around the racking cane. But this time it wasn't allowing enough of vacuum for the AIO (1st time attempting the AIO with skins). In hindsight I may have been better off just using an auto siphon for this stage. 
So do you not recommend dumping the whole shabang into the press at all?

YES Boatboy, I now remember seeing the thread where you and a couple others were trading similar techniques. I will definitely go back and check that out again. That's basically exactly what I needed yesterday. 
This was my plan with this batch anyway. A test run with grapes to figure what works, what didn't work, and what I'll need to make my wine in the fall go as smooth as possible.


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## CryptoStorm (May 18, 2017)

I've seen several big bulky strainer type devices.. I've just never had an issue with letting the cap float at the end..

You could run it all through the press I guess.. It just seems like an easy way to make a big mess to me..


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## Johnd (May 18, 2017)

What @boatboy24 said, don't punch down, and rack through some sort of strainer, I also use the "gajillion" hole pipe. Dump the skins in the press after that, press away!


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## mainshipfred (May 18, 2017)

Brother, I finally did something right. I made this to hold oak chips and found it works perfectly for racking with skins


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## jburtner (May 18, 2017)

mainshipfred said:


> Brother, I finally did something right. I made this to hold oak chips and found it works perfectly for racking with skins



You need a couple more holes for a "gajillion"

Cheers!
-johann


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## dcbrown73 (May 18, 2017)

I haven't tired this, but I suppose you could also skim the cap off with a strainer prior to starting the pump. That way even less trouble once the volume reaches the point that the cap is at the bottom of the brute.


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## mainshipfred (May 18, 2017)

mainshipfred said:


> Brother, I finally did something right. I made this to hold oak chips and found it works perfectly for racking with skins



Bubble buster!


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## Kraffty (May 18, 2017)

Here I thought I was the only one using the Gazillion Hole Pipe method. I do however wrap the pipe in a couple of layers made up of strainer bags and can syphon the 33 gal brute down to about 18" of skins and seeds before pressing. This year I bought a pump but plan to still use the Pipe and strainers.
Mike


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## Ajmassa (May 18, 2017)

Well I'm sold. And another item on my summer to-do list preparing for fall. I think I already have everything so this one should only cost some time. 
Maybe I'll jazz it up with a 1x6 with a hole across the rim and a clamp to make it hands free. 
Does a nice thick cap hold it upright in place?


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## ceeaton (May 18, 2017)

mainshipfred said:


> Brother, I finally did something right. I made this to hold oak chips and found it works perfectly for racking with skins



When you do an all skins batch, you may find that a 4 or 6 inch diameter pipe with holes works better. You'd be amazed how clogged up it gets and you'll have to repeatedly start and stop your vacuum pump. Here's an image of one that @jgmann67 created for me, it's made from 4" diameter sewer pipe, not pre-used.

I put a brewers bag around the outside to keep the skins from going through the holes.


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## Boatboy24 (May 18, 2017)

I should have added that I use a paint strainer bag on the outside of my pipe. It is 4" PVC.


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## CryptoStorm (May 18, 2017)

I'm going to Wack the bees nest and say that PVC technically isn't food grade.. technically not even good for drinking water..


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## Johnd (May 18, 2017)

Here's my gajillion hole racker:


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## vacuumpumpman (May 18, 2017)

I posted this back in 2013 on my facebook page - 
Here is a nice setup that can be used to make your first run easier.
It uses a plastic pipe with holes in it and a filter bag around it - drop it in your primary and let your Allinone pull from the middle of the tube. That way it is removing alot of your 1st run without having to lift and make a mess of things.
next I will post how to press using the same tube and filter bag with the Allinone....


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## richmke (May 19, 2017)

CryptoStorm said:


> I'm going to Wack the bees nest and say that PVC technically isn't food grade.. technically not even good for drinking water..



You could make it out of a fermentation pail.


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## mainshipfred (May 19, 2017)

Johnd said:


> Here's my gajillion hole racker:



That is truely a gajillion holer.


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## Ajmassa (May 19, 2017)

richmke said:


> You could make it out of a fermentation pail.




Yup. I wish I'd thought at the time to use my pail I recently turned into the "basket" for my DIY press.


Sure felt like a gajillion when drilling! Still plan to make a new one out of 3" pvc. This 5.3 gallon pale won't be deep enough for bigger batches.


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## Boatboy24 (May 19, 2017)

CryptoStorm said:


> I'm going to Wack the bees nest and say that PVC technically isn't food grade.. technically not even good for drinking water..



Forgive my ignorance (and the thread jack) - I'm asking because I truly don't know. Why do so many houses have PVC pipes? Mine are technically CPVC, but I was under the impression that both PVC and CPVC are used for plumbing.


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## mainshipfred (May 19, 2017)

Boatboy24 said:


> Forgive my ignorance (and the thread jack) - I'm asking because I truly don't know. Why do so many houses have PVC pipes? Mine are technically CPVC, but I was under the impression that both PVC and CPVC are used for plumbing.



CPVC is for water and PVC for drain lines. But the short time the wine is in contact with the PVC I don't really thing it would hurt anything.


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## mainshipfred (May 19, 2017)

Ajmassa5983 said:


> Yup. I wish I'd thought at the time to use my pail I recently turned into the "basket" for my DIY press.
> View attachment 36295
> 
> Sure felt like a gajillion when drilling! Still plan to make a new one out of 3" pvc. This 5.3 gallon pale won't be deep enough for bigger batches.



I started one as well. I think it will be perfect for one lug of grapes.


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## mainshipfred (May 19, 2017)

Boatboy24 said:


> Forgive my ignorance (and the thread jack) - I'm asking because I truly don't know. Why do so many houses have PVC pipes? Mine are technically CPVC, but I was under the impression that both PVC and CPVC are used for plumbing.



Also I just thought about this. Well pipe is PVC and water could sit in it for hours especially overnight and it doesn't seem to be a concern.


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## mainshipfred (May 19, 2017)

I had to use this on a project to vent underground gases but it is really made as a water well filter screen. Has slots rather then holes. Had some left over and now wished I had saved it.

http://atlanticscreen.thomasnet.com/viewitems/well-plastic-ss-screens-dewatering/pvc-well-screen?


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## CryptoStorm (May 19, 2017)

PVC is rated for service but not distribution. CPVC is rated for distribution because the C in CPVC stands for chlorinated.

My main concern is that you are basically dipping pvc in acid..

You could use a PET bottle (pop bottle)..

Or you could pick up a short length of stainless tube for pretty cheap.


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## Johnd (May 19, 2017)

Both pvc and cpvc are used for water. The "C" in CPVC pipe does indeed stand for chlorinated, the addition to the formula allows the pipe more flexibility, as well as the ability to handle hot water. There are millions of miles of pvc water piping in the US. I am totally unconcerned about dunking my pipe in wine for a few minutes.


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## CryptoStorm (May 19, 2017)

Pour some wine on some galvanized steel and you might have different thoughts..


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## Johnd (May 19, 2017)

CryptoStorm said:


> Pour some wine on some galvanized steel and you might have different thoughts..



What does that even mean? Galvanized steel and water pipe are two totally different products.


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## CryptoStorm (May 19, 2017)

PVC contains heavy metals and toxins. You are dunking it in an acidic solvent.


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## Ajmassa (May 19, 2017)

CryptoStorm said:


> Pour some wine on some galvanized steel and you might have different thoughts..




That's relevant to me Please elaborate if you don't mind. You've got me freaking out right now. The picture I posted above showing my "press basket" also shows my tray I used for pressing. GALVANIZED FREAKING STEEL.


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## mainshipfred (May 19, 2017)

Boatboy24 said:


> Forgive my ignorance (and the thread jack) - I'm asking because I truly don't know. Why do so many houses have PVC pipes? Mine are technically CPVC, but I was under the impression that both PVC and CPVC are used for plumbing.



Jim, I'm going to have to call you a trouble maker for asking this question. Play nice boys.


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## JohnT (May 19, 2017)

Ajmassa5983 said:


> That's relevant to me Please elaborate if you don't mind. You've got me freaking out right now. The picture I posted above showing my "press basket" also shows my tray I used for pressing. GALVANIZED FREAKING STEEL.


 
Relax.. Calm down... take a deep breath! 

You did NOT poison your wine. I have been using it for a good 20 years and, as far as I can tell, I am still alive..

Nor do I think that you did much harm using galvanized steel. I would not recommend its use, and would advise you to swap it out for something more "food safe", but I do not think that you did your wine much harm. Do not think that you need to toss your wine out! You should be perfectly fine!


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## JohnT (May 19, 2017)

Getting back to the OP, Here is what I use.. 

step/pic 1: Skim off the cap into the press. I got these BIG strainers (from a restaurant supply shop) and they work great. I skim the cap off BEFORE I pump out the free run juice in order to save me the back pain from having to scoop the skins off the bottom. Much easier this way.

Step/pc 2: Pump free run juice to tank/secondary. Note that I use PVC. 

Step/pic3: press through a strainer and into the tank.


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## sour_grapes (May 19, 2017)

Well, you _do_ need some dietary zinc, after all! 
https://medlineplus.gov/ency/article/002416.htm


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## mainshipfred (May 19, 2017)

sour_grapes said:


> Well, you _do_ need some dietary zinc, after all!
> https://medlineplus.gov/ency/article/002416.htm



Just in case you don't know why this was posted. Galvanize is a zinc coating.


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## Ajmassa (May 19, 2017)

It would take a heck of a lot for me to toss a batch. I'm about to bottle a bad oxidized bacteria ridden batch that's taken 10 months to bring back. (I also used this intense troubleshoot as a learning tool)
I'm also a commercial GC and work with galvanized fasteners and clips often. And I didn't put too much thought into my "press system" since I knew it was just going to be a one time use, picking up an actual wood press before fall. 
I knew all the plastics were legit. And then checked the tray and saw it was galvanized. Without a second thought I figured, "great it's galvanized. Good to go". Instinctually making sure the METAL had protection, not the WINE! 
I feel 90% of my winemaking knowledge comes from doing something incorrectly, and then troubleshooting said problem.


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## mainshipfred (May 19, 2017)

I feel 90% of my winemaking knowledge comes from doing something incorrectly, and then troubleshooting said problem.[/QUOTE]

Boy, am I with you on this one.


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## CryptoStorm (May 19, 2017)

I used to use 20gal LDPE brutes,but a couple years ago I went to 20gal HDPE open head drums with locking collars. 

Definitely if I was using 55 Gallon barrels I would probably do the same as johnT.


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## sour_grapes (May 19, 2017)

Ajmassa5983 said:


> Without a second thought I figured, "great it's galvanized. Good to go". Instinctually making sure the METAL had protection, not the WINE!




Love it!! That is perfect.


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## Johnd (May 19, 2017)

JohnT said:


> Getting back to the OP, Here is what I use..
> 
> step/pic 1: Skim off the cap into the press. I got these BIG strainers (from a restaurant supply shop) and they work great. I skim the cap off BEFORE I pump out the free run juice in order to save me the back pain from having to scoop the skins off the bottom. Much easier this way.
> 
> ...



That's a lot of pvc in your process, surely you don't want to be ingesting all of the toxins, so just send your wine to me, I'll pay the shipping, store it in a safe place (55F and 70%RH), and dispose of it properly over time, LOL!!!!!!


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## CryptoStorm (May 19, 2017)

You don't have to be childish. Use whatever you want. 

It's not that difficult or any more expensive to spec out use the correct materials.


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## Johnd (May 19, 2017)

CryptoStorm said:


> It's not that difficult or any more expensive to spec out use the correct materials.



Rest assured that neither difficulty nor expense are an issue for me. Until I see empirical scientific evidence that wine passing briefly through PVC is contaminated, my opinion will continue to differ from yours about what are "correct" materials for a specific application. I hope you can respect our difference of opinion.


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## CryptoStorm (May 19, 2017)

The pipes in flint Michigan were fine until they changed the water to a source with a lower pH.. just sayin


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## Ajmassa (Aug 14, 2017)

Getting my ducks in a row for fall. Went ahead and made one of these PVC strainers for transferring a primary full of skins, seeds, lees etc. I swear I started with the best intentions and wanted it all nice and uniform but got a little carried away with the "gajillion" holes- almost finished. 

Also got my new fermenter delivered from Amazon for a great price. But Needless to say I'm not loving the "USDA Condemned" written across the sides of the can, but whatcha gonna do? I checked before and after the order and is certified to NSF standards This was a very insightful thread for me and I really did learn a bunch (and pictured always help too). Hopefully other people can benefit as well.


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## ibglowin (Aug 14, 2017)

Do you understand the last sentence in Spanish? Why would you think this is food grade in any way shape or form? 




Ajmassa5983 said:


> Also got my new fermenter delivered from Amazon for a great price. But Needless to say I'm not loving the "USDA Condemned" written across the sides of the can, but whatcha gonna do? I checked before and after the order and is certified to NSF standards This was a very insightful thread for me and I really did learn a bunch (and pictured always help too). Hopefully other people can benefit as well.View attachment 38431


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## Ajmassa (Aug 14, 2017)

From this in the description of the listing. 



And this website after I received it 
http://www.rubbermaidcommercial.com/rcp/

Maybe I'm wrong. But I was led to believe it is food safe. "Condemned" poultry and beef containers but still in compliance with NSF standards. No?

Website copy and paste didn't work I don't think. Here's another screenshot. I thought I was in the clear


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## ibglowin (Aug 14, 2017)

What markings if any are on the can?

Amazon can make mistakes quite often when one description for an item gets carried over to another "similar" type item. 



Ajmassa5983 said:


> From this in the description of the listing. View attachment 38432
> 
> 
> 
> ...


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## Ajmassa (Aug 14, 2017)

Feeling confident from the listing description I placed the order. Only After opening the box I found out I was "condemned". 
Immediately looked around for a comforting marking. Only markings on bottom were 2 different series of numbers in the shape of a square or triangle maybe. I forget. I left the can at the shop. But no "NSF". 
That's when I started googling and found different sites stating it was nsf #2 & 21. Here's another site of the same exact can but 32 gal. 

http://www.hantover.com/cgi/hnt.wsc/product.htm?p-item-num=27540&p-callprog=cust-search

**EDIT Update. Saw this thread referenced and re-reading I figured I'd update. When I first checked the trashcan it was at night after a long day of work. Somehow missed this. But all was well and good regarding the plastic.


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## vacuumpumpman (Aug 15, 2017)

Yes I have posted several years ago on to get a first run using a tube and a filter screen 

https://www.facebook.com/5415599092...1559909222725/572469162798466/?type=3&theater


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## balatonwine (Aug 15, 2017)

Many items sold on Amazon are by affiliates who write their own copy for their product. You can not assume it meets your needs and requirements.



Ajmassa5983 said:


> Maybe I'm wrong. But I was led to believe it is food safe. "Condemned" poultry and beef containers but still in compliance with NSF standards.



That container is only NSF #2 and #21. "Food safe" has a lot of levels, and #2 is the most basic one for incidental or casual contact with food during food processing (like counters or sinks) and #21 is specifically only for storing garbage (i.e. condemned poultry and beef), not food.

From : http://www.nsf.org/services/by-type/standards-publications/food-equipment-standards/

NSF/ANSI 2 establishes minimum food protection and sanitation requirements for the materials, design, fabrication, construction and performance of food handling and processing equipment (such as bakery, cafeteria, kitchen and pantry units) and other food handling and processing equipment (such as tables and components, counters, hoods, shelves and sinks).

NSF/ANSI 21 establishes minimum sanitation requirements for the materials, design and construction of new thermoplastic refuse containers intended for indoor and outdoor refuse storage.

Ideally, you should use a product that has the NSF 51 standard.


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## mainshipfred (Aug 15, 2017)

Ajmassa5983 said:


> Getting my ducks in a row for fall. Went ahead and made one of these PVC strainers for transferring a primary full of skins, seeds, lees etc. I swear I started with the best intentions and wanted it all nice and uniform but got a little carried away with the "gajillion" holes- almost finished.
> 
> Uniform or not it will be functional. That what counts most.


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## ibglowin (Aug 15, 2017)

I am going to go out on a limb here and try and help you connect some dots. If the manufacturer of this Brute "knock off" trash can went through the expense to print right on the can in ginormous letters, in Spanish, the language that ~90% of the workers in a food plant or restaurant kitchen speak that the can is not safe for the storage or consumption of food (I do believe grapes qualify as food) so that they don't accidentally get the entire plant or restaurant shut down by a health inspector. 

This trash can is more than likely not food grade........



Ajmassa5983 said:


> Feeling confident from the listing description I placed the order. Only After opening the box I found out I was "condemned".
> Immediately looked around for a comforting marking. Only markings on bottom were 2 different series of numbers in the shape of a square or triangle maybe. I forget. I left the can at the shop. But no "NSF".
> That's when I started googling and found different sites stating it was nsf #2 & 21. Here's another site of the same exact can but 32 gal.
> 
> http://www.hantover.com/cgi/hnt.wsc/product.htm?p-item-num=27540&p-callprog=cust-search


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## ibglowin (Aug 15, 2017)

OMG, is that a roll cart trash bin? 

There is no way in He!! that is food grade @JohnT !!!!!!










JohnT said:


> Getting back to the OP, Here is what I use..
> 
> step/pic 1: Skim off the cap into the press. I got these BIG strainers (from a restaurant supply shop) and they work great. I skim the cap off BEFORE I pump out the free run juice in order to save me the back pain from having to scoop the skins off the bottom. Much easier this way.
> 
> ...


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## Ajmassa (Aug 15, 2017)

mainshipfred said:


> Uniform or not it will be functional. That what counts most.




Agreed. But If given the chance again I would have kept it more professional looking. PVC caps are all dome shaped now at depot, but I found a thin plastic cap that should work well. Plan to wrap in mesh bag as suggested too. 

And Steve, a while back you posted your strainer in this thread as well. 

As far as the knockoff brute, I feel like I should have learned my lesson by now but I guess I haven't. Trying to save a few bucks often ends up not being worth it. $38 for 44 gal was saving 20-30 bucks. The listing had no mention or pics of "usda condemned" or anything FWIW. I saw "safe for food storage" as I posted in the picture, and now I'm extremely annoyed with the company. 
I really don't know how much you can and can't get away with in terms of food safe plastic. Is it really that risky to use it? And @ibglowin, are you messing with JohnT or is that a real comment?
I'm just asking out of curiosity. I'm not playing games and will be picking up another legit brute


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## ibglowin (Aug 15, 2017)

Real comment. No way that is any way food grade if that is a roll cart trash can.

We each have to make are own decisions in life as to the risk we are willing to accept. I have 35 years now experience in analytical chemistry. First 5 years I worked for Shell Research in Houston, TX doing analytical chemistry trouble shooting on plastics of all types via optical spectroscopy methods. I learned quite a bit about all the various types of plastics, additives, plasticizers, reasons for additives, slip agents, mold release agents. These things won't kill you overnight but they were not meant to be ingested either. Something that is not made to be in contact with food has a completely different (cheaper ) manufacturing process than something that is made to be in contact with food.

As winemakers you should never forget that you are working with not only an acidic liquid but at the end of the process a 12-14% ethanol solvent. The combination of low pH and a solvent in contact with plastics will have consequences over time if that plastic was not intended to be in contact with that type of liquid.

So while PVC pipe may work well with water, pH ~7 unless that pipe was formulated to be in contact with a low pH acidic solvent (wine) you run the risk of it stripping off those slip/release agents, plasticizers etc that they were not meant to come into contact with or soaked in.

Many of these additives are low level carcinogens. When I was working with these things I was in a OSHA regulated carcinogen monitoring plan where I had my blood monitored once a year for them.

Use caution, do your homework and for your own safety and peace of mind use the right materials in everything you do be it your job or this crazy hobby we all somehow found ourself getting into.



Ajmassa5983 said:


> And @ibglowin, are you messing with JohnT or is that a real comment? I'm just asking out of curiosity. I'm not playing games and will be picking up another legit brute


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## Kraffty (Aug 15, 2017)

Maybe you can return it for the confusing language and product description.
Mike


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## Boatboy24 (Aug 15, 2017)

Ajmassa5983 said:


> $38 for 44 gal was saving 20-30 bucks.



Only a few dollars more than $38. 

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00RD9F9OI/?tag=skimlinks_replacement-20


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## Boatboy24 (Aug 15, 2017)

@ibglowin: do you have a recommendation to replace a 4" piece of PVC with 'a gajillion' holes in it? I've got to admit, its highly effective.


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## cmason1957 (Aug 15, 2017)

Boatboy24 said:


> Only a few dollars more than $38.
> 
> https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00RD9F9OI/?tag=skimlinks_replacement-20



And you can walk into just about any Home Depot or Lowes, probably Menards, if you prefer and pick those up any time you want to, no need to even wait for prime shipping.


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## Kraffty (Aug 15, 2017)

I just bought a couple of 10 gallon brutes to match my 32 gallons from U-line. They were a couple of bucks less than HomeDepot pricing but they do charge a little bit of shipping.
Mike


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## Boatboy24 (Aug 15, 2017)

cmason1957 said:


> And you can walk into just about any Home Depot or Lowes, probably Menards, if you prefer and pick those up any time you want to, no need to even wait for prime shipping.



And it looks like HD has the same pricing as Amazon.


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## Ajmassa (Aug 15, 2017)

Boatboy24 said:


> @ibglowin: do you have a recommendation to replace a 4" piece of PVC with 'a gajillion' holes in it? I've got to admit, its highly effective.



I'm ok with the PVC since it's not in contact for too long and it seems ok judging from earlier posts in this thread. I also saw many standard brutes only rated NSF 2 and 21 as well. 


But I'm pretty sure 100% of the time when a can is NSF certified or compliant it is ALWAYS marked on it. This can has none. Along with that wonderful "USDA Condemned No Para Consumo Humano". So it's a question mark to even be bare minimum food safe, and arguable at that. 
I bought my 32gal from Depot but since I have time I was being picky. I wanted a light color with smooth sides. I know it doesn't matter, but it's just what I wanted. 
Spent a good portion of the workday researching trashcans, NSF guidelines, and grades of food safe plastics. smh. I'm wishing upon that star Mike posted yesterday for an extra 8 hours a day to devote to this hobby that keeps pulling me in deeper and deeper.


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## ibglowin (Aug 15, 2017)

@Ajmassa5983 Is there a reason you want the bigger Brutes (32 or 44) gallon instead of an easier to handle 20G that makes enough wine in the end to fill a 6G carboy with about a gallon extra for topping off down the road? I may have missed it if it was mentioned in another post. I was curious.


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## Ajmassa (Aug 15, 2017)

ibglowin said:


> @Ajmassa5983 Is there a reason you want the bigger Brutes (32 or 44) gallon instead of an easier to handle 20G that makes enough wine in the end to fill a 6G carboy with about a gallon extra for topping off down the road? I may have missed it if it was mentioned in another post. I was curious.




You bet there is! I'm dusting off the old demijohns that have been empty for a couple years for an all grape batch. Planning 252 lbs of grapes to have 54L finished product. 
Wanted to fill the demi and whatever leftover for topping. Rounding up slightly, I've found whatever volume of wine I plan on yielding is very close to the volume the skins take up. So for ~15 gal wine=15 gal skins. My 32 is a little tight and bumping up to 44 gal.


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## ibglowin (Aug 15, 2017)

So for the life of me I can't figure out why anyone needs this contraption! LOL

I am a firm believer in the KISS method and I just don't see where you need this for any reason. I use a 2 gallon bucket (food grade Midwest Supplies or similar). Scoop out a gallon or so of the cap out of a 20G Brute which has 10G of must, and then dump it in a gallon at a time right into the top of the press. The press has no paint strainer bag, nothing but wooden slats. Scoop a gallon, dump, rinse, repeat until you can pick up the Brute by hand and then dump the rest into the Press. Let it drain into the catch pan and then into your waiting bucket. I use a 6 gallon (food grade) bucket that a Mosti Mondial AJ kit came in with a nice snap-on lid. I get almost 6 gallons of free run. Then a gallon of press run that goes into separate gallon glass jug. 

If a few skins or a few seeds get through the slats, no worries. This is step one in the clearing process. Those will float to the top and you can scoop them out in the next day easily with a spoon or similar. Once the 6 gallon bucket is full I use a racking cane to transfer that into a carboy via gravity feed. Sometimes the cane can get plugged with skins but if it does pull it out whack it against the side to clean and restart the flow. 

I can do an entire press and transfer from Brute to carboy in 30-40 mins all by myself. I use the Harbor Freight dollies to move the Brutes and full carboys around from the winery to the outside patio and then back into the winery.

This simple set up works quite well for me. YMMV



Boatboy24 said:


> @ibglowin: do you have a recommendation to replace a 4" piece of PVC with 'a gajillion' holes in it? I've got to admit, its highly effective.


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## ibglowin (Aug 15, 2017)

Ahh. Got it!



Ajmassa5983 said:


> You bet there is! I'm dusting off the old demijohns that have been empty for a couple years for an all grape batch. Planning 252 lbs of grapes to have 54L finished product.
> Wanted to fill the demi and whatever leftover for topping. Rounding up slightly, I've found whatever volume of wine I plan on yielding is very close to the volume the skins take up. So for ~15 gal wine=15 gal skins. My 32 is a little tight and bumping up to 44 gal.


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## Ajmassa (Aug 15, 2017)

If you read my original 2 posts starting this thread I was asking 2 specific questions. 
The first was essentially describing the same system that you do, and asking if that is ok. 
The 2nd was asking if there was some other system I was unaware of to be able to pump without picking up solids. 

I was originally inclined to put everything through the press and let the free run pass through because that was how my family did it years ago. But I've also learned that many of their practices are huge no-no's and I had many bad habits. 
That is how this whole thread started. 

Also, thank you for unknowingly answering my original question 70 posts ago.


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## geek (Aug 15, 2017)

ibglowin said:


> So for the life of me I can't figure out why anyone needs this contraption! LOL
> 
> I am a firm believer in the KISS method and I just don't see where you need this for any reason. I use a 2 gallon bucket (food grade Midwest Supplies or similar). Scoop out a gallon or so of the cap out of a 20G Brute which has 10G of must, and then dump it in a gallon at a time right into the top of the press. The press has no paint strainer bag, nothing but wooden slats. Scoop a gallon, dump, rinse, repeat until you can pick up the Brute by hand and then dump the rest into the Press. Let it drain into the catch pan and then into your waiting bucket. I use a 6 gallon (food grade) bucket that a Mosti Mondial AJ kit came in with a nice snap-on lid. I get almost 6 gallons of free run. Then a gallon of press run that goes into separate gallon glass jug.
> 
> ...



I pretty much do the same, everything goes into the press with no bags except for the bunch of seeds on the bottom (some do get transferred but scooped out later). When done I let it sit for a day or so, and then one final racking so I can start MLF.


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## ibglowin (Aug 15, 2017)

Sorry I know I was late to the party on this thread. Somehow I missed it...... 

As for old timer no no's they mostly didn't use sulfites, control headspace, oxidation, look at pH's, TA things back then they really couldn't do as the tools were out of reach or didn't exist even.





Ajmassa5983 said:


> If you read my original 2 posts starting this thread I was asking 2 specific questions.
> The first was essentially describing the same system that you do, and asking if that is ok.
> The 2nd was asking if there was some other system I was unaware of to be able to pump without picking up solids.
> 
> ...


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## Ajmassa (Aug 15, 2017)

ibglowin said:


> Sorry I know I was late to the party on this thread. Somehow I missed it......
> 
> As for old timer no no's they mostly didn't use sulfites, control headspace, oxidation, look at pH's, TA things back then they really couldn't do as the tools were out of reach or didn't exist even.




I didn't think you would have seen it- this thread was from back in May. 

You couldn't be more correct about old style. 

Only differences in how we pressed were: 
-didn't separate the free run 
-didn't siphon to glass~just poured through an old metal funnel w/ a built in screen and cheesecloth 

I still like the pvc pipe strainer idea too tho. It's very clever. And good to have options. My dad just saw it and asked what it was. He was pretty impressed at the idea. Mainly because he thinks the vacuum pump is cool as hell and likes using it now. 

Thanks for all your posts and help today. Much appreciated


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## Boatboy24 (Aug 15, 2017)

Aj,

I did as you for my first couple presses. Everything went through the press. 

Now, I use the PVC 'filter'. It slips right through the cap and I can begin pulling the free run out by vacuum. When that starts getting close to done, then its time to start scooping the cap into the press. Pressing goes pretty quickly - probably on the same schedule as @ibglowin . Using this method, I get 3 lugs into my press fairly easily. Couldn't do 4, but 3 is not an issue. Not faster, probably not better - just different. For me, it's a little less sloppy. YMMV


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## jgmann67 (Aug 20, 2017)

I have some left over pvc pipe (made two last season) if anyone wants a strainer for themselves.


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