# 2014 Elderberries



## ffemt128

Been seeing lots of big blooms of flowers in the past 2-3 weeks. Can't wait for August to roll around so I can start picking...


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## Runningwolf

Doug, I think you need to start your own. You always map out these great patches then the state comes along and either cuts or sprays them just as they come in season.


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## peaches9324

Doug their easy to grow just take a couple starts from them. I have simply clipped a branch from mine and stuck it in the dirt with some compost and its producing nicely!


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## Stressbaby

I planted 10 plants last year and I've already got fruit set!


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## garymc

After just that experience, I started planting my own. I finally found the right time of year to take the cuttings and put them in the ground, too. This year I clippped 12 sticks off a wild elderberry and stuck them in the ground. I put them at least 12 inches into the ground this time. Eleven of the 12 are leafed out and growing. I wish I remembered when I did that. Maybe it doesn't matter much. I think it was March. I've been layering my European plants. The European ones have been blooming for a couple of weeks and the local wild ones are just starting. 
I planted some at the ends of my trellis rows in the end braces. Here's a Black Lace elderberry next to my cattle panel arbor.


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## ffemt128

Runningwolf said:


> Doug, I think you need to start your own. You always map out these great patches then the state comes along and either cuts or sprays them just as they come in season.


 

My problem is lack of property to plant. I'll continue my hunt for berries. Last year picking was cut short due to a remodeling project. I only managed to get about 43 lbs of berries and I have 5 1/2 gallons that have been aging since October...Almost time to back sweeten some and bottle.


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## WVMountaineerJack

Spotted Drosophila is going to eat them all, better make some elderflower wine while you have the chance. WVMJ


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## ffemt128

All the bushes are looking good so far. Flowers are slowly starting to turn into berries.


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## Julie

this seems to be a good year for elderberries, the blossoms are very big and I am seeing them all over the place.


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## spunk

Hi guys newby I have a lot of ideas for wine elderberry is one I have a huge furnleaf elderberry, last year planted stakes of wild one one got one plant but it is fruiting this year, so I can use the blk lace elderberry? I wasnt sure if you could as to it being ornamental, the main reason I first bought it for ( before became interested in wine making)


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## Julie

spunk said:


> Hi guys newby I have a lot of ideas for wine elderberry is one I have a huge furnleaf elderberry, last year planted stakes of wild one one got one plant but it is fruiting this year, so I can use the blk lace elderberry? I wasnt sure if you could as to it being ornamental, the main reason I first bought it for ( before became interested in wine making)



I don't have any experience with black lace but from what I read you can make jellies out of it, it is not as flavorful. So I would say yes you can make wine from them as well.


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## WVMountaineerJack

I think the black lace is a Nigra not a North American Canadensis so your wild native ones might not pollinate it, there are other Nigras out there if you wanted more fruit from your black lace to help pollinate it. Good luck on your berries, we hope to get some this year, last year the flies got them first, WVMJ


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## peaches9324

was wanting to post a pic of my elderberry bushes because they were so beautiful in bloom and so many of the blooms but with procrastination being my middle name.. well that and by the time I get everything else done, it's raining or dark outside! Their turning to berries, it's on the top of my to do list tomorrow. Julie it's definitely a good year for elderberry! But also have more than usual beautiful birds of many kind! I got reflector tape up everywhere for a while the birds wouldn't go any where near the tape but I think they have gotten use to it


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## Julie

Kay, I hear ya on the birds. I have a very nice and large bush in my backyard but it is rare that I get much off of it. The birds are already picking at the berries as they ripen.


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## peaches9324

couple pics of my elderberry. the first pic is a young one - the results of a stick I stuck in the dirt couple years ago the second and third have been established for years


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## spunk

Wow thanks big.her is my black lace one and I have a wild one.I stuck in ground last spring. It has berries. I hoped the wild would be polinate by my blk lace. may have or not I read you need two different kinds. I also have a American cranberry Viburnum and a blk hawk Viburnum. Maybe I'll try those some year.


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## Stressbaby

spunk said:


> Wow thanks big.her is my black lace one and I have a wild one.I stuck in ground last spring. It has berries. I hoped the wild would be polinate by my blk lace. may have or not I read you need two different kinds. I also have a American cranberry Viburnum and a blk hawk Viburnum. Maybe I'll try those some year.



Spunk,
I have several viburnums including two large American cranberry bush and two large blackhaws. The blackhaws have never produced enough fruit but they are clones and there may not be a good pollinator nearby (viburnums can cross pollinate but only if blooming at the same time; viburnums have such vastly different bloom times that this is the limiting factor in whether you get pollination). The highbush cranberries fruit very well. Keller says they make one of the best no grape wines...not for me. I tried it once, kept it for over a year and the bitterness never abated. Horrible. Down the drain. YMMV.


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## spunk

My black haw fruits I taste last year kinda sweet not bad. Never tryed the american cranberry.i read to eat them it is best to use after they freeze. Late winter is when the birds seem to eat so that is when I would pick them to use if I have time.


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## ffemt128

Took a quick ride to check kut the bushes after work. Most are out of flowers and starting into berries. Looks promising this year. The one location where they usually cut is over grown with them now.


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## ffemt128

Elderberry bushes are looking promising this year.


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## Julie

ffemt128 said:


> Elderberry bushes are looking promising this year.



Yes they are. There seems to be a good crop this year, enough for me and the birds!


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## ffemt128

Elderberry bushes are starting to get big red berries on them...Should be ready to start picking in a couple weeks.


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## spunk

So are these ripe seem more red they do have red juice when squished


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## cmason1957

Are the birds eating them? If they are, then they are ready. They look really, really close.


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## Scott

Should get a little darker in color and be fairly easy to shake off the stems, heck a few of mine still have blooms and the rest are with a pretty small berries. As said by cmason the birds know when too!


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## ffemt128

I pick them when they are a deep purple to almost black in appearance. The really ripe ones will sink in water.


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## Julie

spunk said:


> So are these ripe seem more red they do have red juice when squished



No they have a couple more weeks to go, look Ffemt said, pick them when they are a deep purple.


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## WVMountaineerJack

Our elderberry picking page - http://wvmjack.com/Elderberries/ElderberriesHarvest.html


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## spunk

Thanks for all the great info. I will wait to pick then.


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## mikewatkins727

Been following this thread as I have elderberries also. Grabbed my refractometer and checked sugar content. Measured 10% sugar. Have/do any one check their elderberry sugar %? What should sugar % be for fermenting? Your thoughts please.


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## WVMountaineerJack

RIpe elderberries sink as the sugar in them make the berries heavier than water while the unripe ones float, you can use this to seperate out the unripe from ripe berries. I dont think I have ever had the ripe berries. I dont think berries every get sweeter than about 1.04-1.045 gravity, you have to pick them when most are ready, you will know you were to late when they fall off the stems as you try to pick them. WVMJ


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## ffemt128

WVMountaineerJack said:


> RIpe elderberries sink as the sugar in them make the berries heavier than water while the unripe ones float, you can use this to seperate out the unripe from ripe berries. I dont think I have ever had the ripe berries. I dont think berries every get sweeter than about 1.04-1.045 gravity, you have to pick them when most are ready, you will know you were to late when they fall off the stems as you try to pick them. WVMJ



Are you keeping the sinkers as well as the darker floaters? I could have alot more berries. I usually end up tossing a lb or so each picking. I usually go out every Saturday morning when they get ready...


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## WVMountaineerJack

The idea Fermcalc guy is that the ripe berries sink, you want to keep them and the unripe ones float and even some ripe ones with something wrong with them float so let them all go, you want quality. Also you still have to look thru the sinkers a little, sometimes a greenie will sink. Our elderberry site has some more vids on harvesting for fun. WVMJ

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BEfxhnDqGsQ[/ame]


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## ffemt128

Driving past the one batch this am, they are looking very dark in color now. May have to stop on the way home from work one day and start picking... My primary location is starting to get red now also. 2 weeks I'll definately be in picking season.. I can't wait...


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## ffemt128

Any luck at all I'll be making my first of many weekend picking runs next week.


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## ffemt128

I went and picked berries from one location today. I managed to get 58 lbs 3 oz of berries. Will hit same location next weekend in hopes of the same haul. I had about 1 1/2 cups of floaters which were tossed.


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## Julie

Well with all this talk about picking elderberries and mine still hS a couple weeks to go, I opened a bottle of Msy 2012, oh is this good.


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## ffemt128

Julie said:


> Well with all this talk about picking elderberries and mine still hS a couple weeks to go, I opened a bottle of Msy 2012, oh is this good.



I seriously considered opening either a 2011 or a 2010 elderberry as I was destemming the berries. Instead I had a bottle of 2013 Destiny that was already chilled from the weekend.


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## Stressbaby

I have been picking for a week or so and I seem to have a disproportionately high percentage of floaters. If I wait until they are black, I get fewer floaters but greater loss to birds.
How do you all time your picking?


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## ffemt128

Stressbaby said:


> I have been picking for a week or so and I seem to have a disproportionately high percentage of floaters. If I wait until they are black, I get fewer floaters but greater loss to birds.
> How do you all time your picking?


 

Most of the plants are within 5 miles of my house. Once they start getting ripe, I'll drive by them every 3-4 days. and then plan to plic every weekend until there is nothing worth picking. The batch yesterday, I drive by the area almost every day. Once they are ripe, I get quite obsessed with getting the berries.


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## Julie

I have them growing in my backyard but I can never get any, the birds nail everyone every year but the ones on our camp road are never touched by the birds for some reason. I can let them go until they are very ripe and then pick. The bushes are very big and I normally will get about 30 pounds of berries. I, also, get some from school property.

Stressbaby, maybe try and look around and see if there are other areas you can pick from.


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## ffemt128

Here's what I picked yesterday. There are 7 1/2 bags there .


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## Stressbaby

Thanks Julie. On a tip, I called a neighbor who generously took me to a source he knows and helped me pick. These look pretty good and haven't been eaten by the birds. I'm guessing I've got about 10# here. I just ran out of Wal-mart bags. Saturday I hope to come home with that much again.

Next question: I've used a fork to pull the berries off, but sometimes the 1/4" little stems come off with the berries. Do I need to worry about those?


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## WVMountaineerJack

Dont ever use a fork again! Check out our elderberry webpage we made to promote elderberries, lots of people contributed their ways of harvesting elderberries and sorting out the stems and unripe berries. A baking cooling rack is very easy to put over a bucket and scrape the berries off, then fill the bucket with cold water, the ripe berries are heavier than water because they are sweet and sink, the unripe are lighter than water and float off mostly. WVMJ


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## Julie

another method and this is one I like to use is freeze the berries first.


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## ffemt128

I take the following approach. I fill 2 buckets with cold water. Berries go from bag to bucket 1. From bucket 1 I hold cluster in one hand and fan my fingers through the berries. It's easier if they are wet as your hands dont get red and the water acts as a lube somewhat. Berries off the cluster into 2nd bucket. When bucket is full, I scoop with a strainer, rinse then into gallon ziplock bags. If the bag is completely full you will have between 5 1/2 - 6 lbs of berries in your bag. It may not be the fastest method, but it works for me without damaging the berries. Jack does have a great Elderberry Site. My 58 lbs took me about 3 1/2 hours to clean by myself and that was breaking for dinner and wine..

Based on what you picked there it looks like you should have about 15lbs depending on the floaters which get tossed for me.


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## Stressbaby

Thanks Jack, Julie, and Doug for your replies.


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## Stressbaby

12# 11oz. Going back Saturday for more.
What are the thoughts on the "second run dry rose" Keller describes here: https://winemakermag.com/841-elderberry-wine
Is three days enough time for the first batch before removing the skins?


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## Julie

I believe I posted a recipe on here about making elderberry and making a 2nd run. Yes three days is plenty of time. Well I just looked and no it is not posted. But I use at least 4 #'s per gallon, sg around 1.080, TA around .80% (taste to see if that is where you like it) pectic enzyme, yeast nutrient, strain berries after three days, give a slight press, then make another batch again but add 6 cans of Welch's white grape juice.


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## spunk

Wow that's a lot of berries well I'm done. My stake I planted was literally a stick in a pot last spring then transplanted that fall. I was happy iy produced. Not much I almost filled a pint jar. I have it in freezer sorted and waiting to do something with maybe add it to something else other fruit but I was still happy wasn't expecting anything this year also the black lace fruit doesn't seem to ripen it stays hard n green juice I am NOT going to use it I'll just enjoy it 4 beds work often in the spring


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## ffemt128

Riding home yesterday it would appear the birds are doing a pretty good number on the bushes by the roadway that I did not pick from over the weekend. It could be interesting to see what is left come Saturday or Sunday...


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## ffemt128

I made a trip down to pick this am. I managed to get 6 very full bags this am. Im guessing close to 40 lbs based on what I picked last Sunday. I may get one more round out of this location depending on the birds. Tomorrow I will hit my location I've picked from the past 3 years.


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## Julie

nice haul, Doug. I'm still waiting for ours to get ripe.


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## ffemt128

Thanks Julie. This fall I need to trim the original location back to get rid of the older non producing canes.


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## ffemt128

Since I'm working on the house the berries are resting in the refridgerator until I can clean them after dinner.


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## ffemt128

The total for today's harvest is 48lbs 1 oz...total for the season with the 2 lbs from last year 108.4 lbs.


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## Stressbaby

Nice!
We picked up another 26# yesterday bring us to around 40# for the year. I think we're done.


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## ffemt128

I just ran up and chdck the one location near my house. Birds got a fair amount of it and the remaining berries look to be drying up. Will pick at the same place I did yesterday next weekend if birds dont get to them first


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## ffemt128

I'm already looking up my old recipes for the Elderberry. Turns out the Gold Medal Elderberry was made with 7 lbs per gallon of berries but then blended with a 3 gallon batch made from about 35 lbs of skins. I have 108 lbs of berries. We'll see what I get in the way of straight juice and go from there. I will definately be making a 2nd's batch from the skins as I did 2 years ago. It was good for topping up and such. My 20 gallon brute arrived yesterday so I'll be making the juice batch as one large batch then separating after initial fermentation into carboys or maybe if I have enough put it in one of the Demi-Johns for extended aging...

I'll post up recipe once I get this started...


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## Stressbaby

What is the color/style of the second run batch using the skins? I did that last year to make what the recipe termed an "elderberry rose," but you used more than double the amount of skins in the second run.


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## ffemt128

Stressbaby said:


> What is the color/style of the second run batch using the skins? I did that last year to make what the recipe termed an "elderberry rose," but you used more than double the amount of skins in the second run.


 

When I made this 2 years ago using the skins, it was just as dark as the intial run. I usually steam my berries and didn't steam quite as long which left some juice to be extracted. I used approx 35 lbs of berries for a 3 gallon batch with 1 1/2 gallons of water and 3 cans of grape concentrate for acid and body.


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## Julie

went out on the quad today and checked on the elderberries, next week they will be ready to pick and that means the ones at camp should be ready the following week, which is also the weekend my daughter is getting married, hmmmmmm!


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## ffemt128

Julie said:


> went out on the quad today and checked on the elderberries, next week they will be ready to pick and that means the ones at camp should be ready the following week, which is also the weekend my daughter is getting married, hmmmmmm!



Tough dilemma, looks like you will be having someone pick in exchange for wine...lol


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## WVMountaineerJack

Just wear a purple dress to the wedding, that way you can pick early and not have to wast time changing! WVMJ


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## ffemt128

I keep looking at the berries in the freezer and hoping for some cooler days so I can start steaming.


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## Stressbaby

*Elderberry round 1*

I made what was supposed to be 3 gal batch...it may be more like 3.5 or 3.75.

I didn't steam, but I used this recipe, with a cold soak.

Then I pulled the skins/berries out at the start of fermentation day 4. I put those back in the freezer because I'm going to combine with those from another batch, then do a second run batch with a double dose of leftover skins/berries.


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## Julie

stressbaby, did you add the amount of sugar called for or did you add enough to give you the sg you were aiming for? I always make a second run from my elderberries but I make a niagara and add the elderberries to it. I have also done this with a cherry as well.


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## Stressbaby

Julie said:


> stressbaby, did you add the amount of sugar called for or did you add enough to give you the sg you were aiming for? I always make a second run from my elderberries but I make a niagara and add the elderberries to it. I have also done this with a cherry as well.



I added sugar to 1.088.

I was otherwise happy with the Keller second run recipe which uses bananas and Welch's white grape concentrate. However, this year I'll use with 2-3x the amount of skins that his recipe calls for.


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## ffemt128

I still have not done anything with the Elderberry. Once I start I'm thinking of going 6-7 lbs per gallon which will yield around 17 gallons of elderberry. I'll take the skins after steaming and make a 2nd's batch as I did 2 years ago. I'm guessing I should end with 20-22 gallons of elderberry after all is said and done. Unfortunately I won't get this started until after the holidays. Need to invest in a tank so I can free up some carboys...


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## ffemt128

I think I may start steaming next Wednesday...and get this batch started...


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## ffemt128

It's quite obvious I have not started steaming yet. I think this will now become an after Christmas task...I have 3 days off plus the weekend. Seems like a good time to steam 110lbs of berries.


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## Stressbaby

*Elderberry 2014*

Here are mine. I used 15-16# per 3 gal batch for the 2 first runs (center and right). One with acid blend, one with straight tartaric. I have oak cubes in now but to minimal effect so far. I combined the leftovers for a second run (left). 

Thoughts on finishing tannins in elderberry?


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## ffemt128

Looks good SB.. 5 lbs per gallon makes for good flavored Elderberry. I think my 2013 batch was at 6 1/2 lbs per gallon. I'm still waiting to steam my berries which will occur over Christmas break. Hoping for an 18 gallon batch from the juice then I'll do a seconds from the skins and likely combine after the fact which should give me a 24 gallon yield at least for the year.


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## WVMountaineerJack

??What is the point of steam juicing them if you recombine?? Curious and wished I had some elders to give it a try to! WVMJ



ffemt128 said:


> Looks good SB.. 5 lbs per gallon makes for good flavored Elderberry. I think my 2013 batch was at 6 1/2 lbs per gallon. I'm still waiting to steam my berries which will occur over Christmas break. Hoping for an 18 gallon batch from the juice then I'll do a seconds from the skins and likely combine after the fact which should give me a 24 gallon yield at least for the year.


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## jamesjr

About a month ago I found some wild elderberry and just cut some pieces stuck in dirt and they all have big roots already im going to transfer to big pots soon but any advice on keeping them alive to plane in spring? Or sooner? Any advice for growing elderberry would be great or is there a different thread?


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## spunk

Is it cold where you live now. Can you work the soil outside. I buy plants late in season off clearance rack I dig a hole in the ground and bury the pot and all in the ground. Dig the pot up spring and plant when it is warm enough out for the roots. You may loose it if you plant in the soil if it is cold out the new roots would probably not make it through the winter. Or keep in a pot in a shed or garage. Just depends on how cold it gets.


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## jamesjr

Oh sorry I forgot to say I am in central fl. It gets lower 40's maybe high 30's and do they like wet or well drained soil? Inky property gets pritty wet certain times of year and where I got them from was a thicket next to an orange grove its kinda swampy down there. Does anyone kno what kind of elderberry grows wild in fl? And does it make a good wine? Because I have like 30 sprouting plants if anyone wants any local to me ill give some away


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## ffemt128

WVMountaineerJack said:


> ??What is the point of steam juicing them if you recombine?? Curious and wished I had some elders to give it a try to! WVMJ


 

I generally use this as top up after the 2nds batch is complete, not immediately after steaming. 2 years ago I took about 35 lbs of skins and made a very full bodied 2nds batch. (3 gallons) I used this to top up with and needed a gallon to get from 5 to 6 with one carboy. Whatever I did it worked because it was the batch that won me a Gold Medal. The original batch was almost 9 lbs per gallon.


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## j_fleming

So I am totally new to elderberry wine making and have a quick question. All of the recipes that I have found call for x amount of pounds of elderberries. A friend of mine gave me some elderberry juice that she was going to use to make jelly and didn't really feel like it. It is just straight cooked down and juiced elderberry, nothing added to it. Is there any way to know how much juice to use per pound of elderberry that the recipe calls for? She gave me 4 quarts of juice.


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## Jerry1

Based on my experience with steaming I'd use those to attempt a 2 gallon batch of wine. Or, because they are cooked down some, you might want to think of them as an f-pac for a couple gallons of merlot. Think I'd really go for the 2 gallon batch of elderberry.


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## WVMountaineerJack

What is the specific gravity of the juice, if she just cooked them enough to juice them you might want to make just a gallon of really good rich elderberry wine say if the sg is around 1.04 which is about as ripe as most elderberries get. If she cooked it down though to concentrate the berries you might want to dilute to juice down to about 1.040 to get a feel for how much real juice you have to start with. When we steam juice our berries I tend not to dilute it, when we use fresh fruit we dilute them down some. The cooking does affect the taste a little so they are not as intense as the fresh berries. By taking the gravity readings you will have a reference point for future batches vs just taking a guessed at concentration and diluting it. This also makes an incredible mead and takes oak very well. WVMJ





j_fleming said:


> So I am totally new to elderberry wine making and have a quick question. All of the recipes that I have found call for x amount of pounds of elderberries. A friend of mine gave me some elderberry juice that she was going to use to make jelly and didn't really feel like it. It is just straight cooked down and juiced elderberry, nothing added to it. Is there any way to know how much juice to use per pound of elderberry that the recipe calls for? She gave me 4 quarts of juice.


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## Jerry1

Mountaineer, do you not keep track of how much juice you get from a pound of berries? I keep track of it so I know how much juice equals 15 lbs, etc. That way if the recipe calls for 30 lbs of berries I know how much juice to use. If I'm a little short of liquid I can either add more juice or add a little water. Recipes differ and they are in accordance with the writers taste. I find most recipes call for 5 lbs of blackberries per gallon and that's a little heavy for my taste. Four pounds suits my taste best.


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## WVMountaineerJack

Jelly makers boil and boil and boil their juice so this juice from a jelly maker could either be concentrated and just not made into jelly or it can be just straight uncooked juice, who knows, our posert is not very specific, easy way to tell is with the hydrometer. Yes we keep track of how many pounds of berries we start with and how much juice we get, and how much weight gets lost when we dry them and what equivalent weights are. But then we adjust the recipe for the juice we have, how it tastes etc vs just putting in a specific poundage. As an example, we put in the equivalent amount of dried elderberries to match fresh ones at 3lb/gal, then did more and a lot more dried elderberries. We found the equivalent to be too light, the lot more was to much, Goldilocks preferred the one in the middle, if we just went by poundage of raw fruit we would have missed a better wine made with more fruit. WVMJ


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## j_fleming

Thank you guys for the advice! I am not sure how much she cooked them down, but will be sure to check the SG before we start to have a better idea of what to do. They are sealed in the jars right now and I don't want to break the seals until we are ready to start (have pear and plum wine going right now). Just trying to get all of our ducks in a row before hand so I have an idea.


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## WVMountaineerJack

You could also add the elderberry juice to your plum and pear, it goes well with both. So if your juice is sealed in mason jars it means some cooking was done on it to at least heat it up enough to process and seal the bottle. You really cant go wrong diluting it to 1.040 and then adding sugar or honey, or even 1:1 or 1:2 parts juice to water (or cider even better). A typical elderberry recipe uses about 3 lb/gallon, not enough berries for people who really like elderberry. Did you check out our webpage devoted to making elderberry wine yet? WVMJ


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## spunk

Ok I want to know what you think
1 lbs bannans 
10 oz elderberries 
2 oz blackhaw berries
10 oz blackberries
All previously frozen
3lb honey
8 oz grape juice
1/2 tsp pectin
1 campton tab
1/2 tsp yeast nutrient 
Champagne yeast 
Boil bannans for 25 min last 15 of that add elderberries and blackhaw. Add that to the blk berries already in primary. Or could add blk berries to the boil. Could I leave out grape juice. I think I will oak it to.


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## spunk

Ok so I started this mead SG started at 1.09. I juiced the blk hawk berries first by cooking on stove. It seems to be coming along. I pulled the elderberries out on fourth day. I am trying a second run on them with more bannana water and a can of pears and a cup of grape juice. I added around a fourth cup of the original mead and yeast nutrient along with sugar to see if I could get this to start formenting. This morning it is formenting away. :thumbup:


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## Frognostic

I made elderberry wine in September 2013 but never got around to picking them last year, which I'm kicking myself about.


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## spunk

I racked it to secondary nice color.sg down to 1.00. Slow forment this morning.


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## ffemt128

Frognostic said:


> I made elderberry wine in September 2013 but never got around to picking them last year, which I'm kicking myself about.


 
I picked them last year, just haven't had time to start the batch. It will be about a 15 gallon batch made with 110 lbs of berries. I already can't wait to start picking in August this year..


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## jamesjr

Anybody familiar with the wild elderberry in Florida? Ive been looking around alot and just read it may be poisonous? I just planted a whole fence line full lol any help would be greatly appreciated.


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## WVMountaineerJack

The common sambucus canadensis is native to the east coast all the way down to Florida. You have to specifically identify your plant as to the species as there is also red edlerberry which is not so good for you. Locals call things different names so that is not really a reliable source sometimes, but there is no shortage of information at the USDA and extension services for plant ID. Find a reliable identification source for your plants. WVMJ



jamesjr said:


> Anybody familiar with the wild elderberry in Florida? Ive been looking around alot and just read it may be poisonous? I just planted a whole fence line full lol any help would be greatly appreciated.


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## jamesjr

Your the one ive been actually waiting to comment but here's a pic if that helps at all u seem to kno your elderberry


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## WVMountaineerJack

Sorry, I dont do plant IDs, its very easy to do your research on the USDA plant database, plenty of plant ID websites out there, unless I can see something in my own hands, I gave up trying to help people ID elders when some dumbasses made wine from pokeberries claiming to be elders, never heard back from them, guess those pokeberries are toxic after all WVMJ


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## jamesjr

Haha ok completely understandable ill do my research.


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## botigol

I have a whopping 11oz of elderberries that I harvested from my neighbors tree last year. They're frozen in a zip-loc for now. I was thinking to make one gallon of melomel with them, but would like your opinions on if I should even bother since it's such a small amount.

Thanks!


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## WVMountaineerJack

Go ahead, it will be a rose but probably turn out nice anyway and encourage you to take better care of your neigbhors bush! WVMJ


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## RegarRenill

Hey Jack, any advice for someone about to get his first elderberry bushes? I was planning on getting 2, a Nova and a York. I have two options, I can plant them at mom's mountain land along her tree line(about 17 miles from my house) or I can try them in my yard(about 30' long and 10' wide). Which do you reccomend?


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## botigol

WVMountaineerJack said:


> Go ahead, it will be a rose but probably turn out nice anyway and encourage you to take better care of your neigbhors bush! WVMJ



Thank-you sir!


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## WVMountaineerJack

How am I supposed to know really, dont even know what state you are in right? Probably put them where there is more sun and where they can be watered if they need it. Good luck with them. WVMJ



RegarRenill said:


> Hey Jack, any advice for someone about to get his first elderberry bushes? I was planning on getting 2, a Nova and a York. I have two options, I can plant them at mom's mountain land along her tree line(about 17 miles from my house) or I can try them in my yard(about 30' long and 10' wide). Which do you reccomend?


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## Frognostic

I think I read somewhere that all elderberries are toxic and require boiling for 30 minutes before use.

Someone got sick from drinking too much fresh pressed elderberry juice.


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## Julie

Frognostic said:


> I think I read somewhere that all elderberries are toxic and require boiling for 30 minutes before use.
> 
> Someone got sick from drinking too much fresh pressed elderberry juice.



Well I have been making elderberry wine for 9 years and I have never once boiled the berries.


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## RegarRenill

WVMountaineerJack said:


> How am I supposed to know really, dont even know what state you are in right? Probably put them where there is more sun and where they can be watered if they need it. Good luck with them. WVMJ




Oops, I forgot it's my HBT account that I have everything filled in, lol. I'm in Reading, PA, that's sorta SE PA. Hmm, well my house would definitely have sun, they'd be in a west-by sw exposure, gets sun most of the day. At my Mom's I'd have to check where I'd be able to plant them. Thanks for the advice, Jack.


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## WVMountaineerJack

Be on the lookout for spotted drosophila next year, they really like elderberries. WVMJ


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## Boyd

Frognostic said:


> I think I read somewhere that all elderberries are toxic and require boiling for 30 minutes before use.
> 
> Someone got sick from drinking too much fresh pressed elderberry juice.


 
Have made wine from raw juice, steamed juice, and boiled juice. No one ever got sick from the result.

My aunt makes elderberry jelly from boiled juice that she does not separate from the stems. Seems boiling them kills and poisions.

to the best of my knowledge the poison is in the wood.


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## quiltertoo

WVMountaineerJack said:


> Be on the lookout for spotted drosophila next year, they really like elderberries. WVMJ



I have several wild elderberry bushes on my property. I have never heard of spotted drosophila. Is this an insect or a disease? When do you see it? On the plant? On the berries? I would like to try a elderflower wine sometime but don't want to sacrifice the berries. I think I will have to take some cuttings and start some more plants.

Mary Lou


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## WVMountaineerJack

2 years ago some elderberry lovers from PA told everyone on here about seeing some little fruit flies on their bushes. Turns out they lay their eggs just as the fruit is getting ripe, we watched in disgust 2 years in a row now as the berries fall like rain when we show up to pick them. Needless to say was are refining our elderflower recipies. These flies are also hard on cherries and late ripening berries. WVMJ


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## quiltertoo

I live in Missouri. Has anyone here seen the dreaded drosophila? 

Mary Lou


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## Stressbaby

quiltertoo said:


> I live in Missouri. Has anyone here seen the dreaded drosophila?
> 
> Mary Lou



My sample size is not that big but I picked 40# from various locations last year and saw no sign of drosophila.

Now I hope I didn't jinx us.


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## quiltertoo

Keeping my fingers crossed. I made some elderberry dragons blood a couple of weeks ago from some berries I had in the freezer and I want to try regular elderberry wine this summer. I am definitely going to take some cuttings and try propagating some more plants. I am also ordering more blackberry plants this spring. The 60 degree temps this weekend really have me in the mood for some digging in the dirt.

Mary Lou


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## WVMountaineerJack

You guys picking and growing elderberries, this season try to dry some in a dehydrator, the taste of the dried ones is different than the taste of the fresh berries, kind of like raisans compared to grapes, you can then use them at the same ratio of dry to fresh or even a little more and it makes a very good mead or wine, plus a little oak. WVMJ


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## spunk

@WVMountaineer jack do you think trying same idea with sour cherries would be a good idea too? Drying them in a dehydrator?


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## WVMountaineerJack

I havent done it so can only say go for it, we sometimes add the dried cherries to port wines just to add some extra flavors. The dried elderberries you sometimes get at the store might have been dried for a long time, we vacum pack ours after they are dried and it keeps them fresh. WVMJ


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## spunk

I think i will if I get a lot of cherries this year. Some years I will get so many too many to use so i freeze and have dried. I will have to try wine this fall with dried. Dried nice because you can use them when them temp go down or when ever you want that year.


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## quiltertoo

I have never made wine from dried fruit. I do have a dehydrator so I could dry some elderberries. How many lbs. or oz. do you use per gall. of wine? Do you reconstitute them before making wine or just add them and water with the other ingredients.

Mary Lou


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## WVMountaineerJack

Well, we weighed them first and then dried them and weighed them and did an equivalent amount of elderberries vs the same amount of fresh berries and then one with a lot more dried elderberries. We found the equivalent one to be good while the one with way more a little bit to much so we found a sweet spot in the middle that we like. We take the elderberries and soak them in cold water overnight, a least a double volume of water to berries, then bring them to a boil the next morning and reduce to a simmer for about 20 minutes and then let it cool and dump in a fermentation bag. Got it all on our webpage, it also really takes oak well. Making this into a mead is our absolute favorite way to make elderberry. WVMJ



quiltertoo said:


> I have never made wine from dried fruit. I do have a dehydrator so I could dry some elderberries. How many lbs. or oz. do you use per gall. of wine? Do you reconstitute them before making wine or just add them and water with the other ingredients.
> 
> Mary Lou


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## quiltertoo

Thank you for your reply WVMJACK. Wow ! I just visited your website. It is definitely everything I ever wanted to know about elderberries. I really appreciate all the info you have posted.

Mary Lou


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## spunk

They are starting to get ripe already


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## montanaWineGuy

spunk said:


> They are starting to get ripe already



Mine are past their prime. Got these at their peak. Got lucky.


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## spunk

Question... on drying the elderberries how does everyone do it? Is in oven ok? I do have a dehydrater they so little they would fall through the rack. When you do are they real dry brittle or raisin like? Thanks


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## WVMountaineerJack

Excalibur sells a mesh sheet that we put ours on, I think the ones for making fruit rollups would also work. The sugars in them really show up when dried, they get a little sticky to the sheets, we just put the sheets into a container and brush off the berries, allow to cool to RT and then vacuum pack them. They do get crunchy, sub dried elderberries in some muffins for the blueberries, save some to drop into a good fruitcake recipe also! WVMJ


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## Julie

montanaWineGuy said:


> Mine are past their prime. Got these at their peak. Got lucky.






Are these wild elderberries? They look so different than the ones we have around here. The berries are more of a flat cluster and yours are more rounded.


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## spunk

Found me a mesh sheet works great did my fist batch. Im excited. So how much will i need to make a gal batch of mead or wine. Thanks!!


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## spunk

Can I make a secondary wine from the dryed berries when i pull them out from the forment i was thinking of making something with some dried figs


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## Stressbaby

Question for the group:

My 2014 elderberry looks like it is ready to bottle. However, I'm not sure about the taste. I made two batches more or less per this recipe. It uses a 3 day cold soak, then 3 days of fermentation before removing the skins/seeds. I made one 3 gal batch with straight tartaric, one 3 gal batch with acid blend. 

The color is great, deep, bordering on purple-blue; it is perfectly clear. But it has just a tiny trace of bitterness and a green peppery sort of taste. It is not that smooth. I did use oak cubes for a while and 1g tannin riche/3 gal, and while it is reasonably tannic, the oak doesn't really come through that much.

Is it just young? Or are more tweaks warranted? We're coming up on a year and I could use the carboy...

I will add that I made a rose as a second run and that tastes great. I also did a persimmon/elderberry based on this recipe less the plum juice and the chitosan, and it is pretty darn good as well.


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## spunk

I have 2 and 1/2 oz of dried elderberries im ready to use. I have rhubarb juice i canned and frozen pie cheeries. Any of these sound like a good mix for the elderberries. As its not enough to be by themselves. Was thinking about getting blk berries if none of what i have sounds good. I have some hops in freezer too.
.


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## spunk

I wonder if tpu grounded up some of these elderberries included it in with ground coffee and brewed it. I bet it would be tasty.


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## spunk

Does this sound like a good recipe


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## spunk

Started a recipe from mvmountaineer jack site. For the dried elderberry wine. Making one gal only had 3.5 oz so i also added half a container of frozen Welch's purple grape juice to it. Smell good will pitch the yeast tomorrow. I dont have oakmor i have oak chips not sure what kind. Will add some of those hope it turns out good. Plan to make second run adding canned pears i did with my last year batch and it was really good and gone.


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## WVMountaineerJack

Our absolute favorite elderberry is our dried elderberry meads, the fresh ones are great to but there is something that happens when you dry the berries that improves the flavors somehow. 

As for dried elderberries and cooking, you dont have to grind them up, just drop a few into your tea, put them in cookies, fruit type cakes and muffins, just substitute them for blueberries. that is just scratching the surface of what you can use them for!

WVMJ




spunk said:


> Started a recipe from mvmountaineer jack site. For the dried elderberry wine. Making one gal only had 3.5 oz so i also added half a container of frozen Welch's purple grape juice to it. Smell good will pitch the yeast tomorrow. I dont have oakmor i have oak chips not sure what kind. Will add some of those hope it turns out good. Plan to make second run adding canned pears i did with my last year batch and it was really good and gone.


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## spunk

WVMountaineerJack said:


> Our absolute favorite elderberry is our dried elderberry meads, the fresh ones are great to but there is something that happens when you dry the berries that improves the flavors somehow.
> 
> As for dried elderberries and cooking, you dont have to grind them up, just drop a few into your tea, put them in cookies, fruit type cakes and muffins, just substitute them for blueberries. that is just scratching the surface of what you can use them for!
> 
> WVMJ



I really like mead. Next I am going to make the mead. I have small bushes. I think im going to scope out areas this spring looking for blooms that I may be able to pick from later this year. I would like to try some with cooking too.


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## spunk

WVMountaineerJack said:


> Our absolute favorite elderberry is our dried elderberry meads, the fresh ones are great to but there is something that happens when you dry the berries that improves the flavors somehow.
> 
> As for dried elderberries and cooking, you dont have to grind them up, just drop a few into your tea, put them in cookies, fruit type cakes and muffins, just substitute them for blueberries. that is just scratching the surface of what you can use them for!
> 
> WVMJ



I really like mead. Next I am going to make the mead later this year I have small bushes. I think im going to scope out areas this spring looking for blooms that I may be able to pick from later this year. I would like to try some with cooking too.


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## spunk

Hey i found elderberrys out and about. But one bush different than any i have picked before berry larger and more oval than round. Is it still an elderberry and what kind.


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## Stressbaby

They look like elderberries to me. No idea what kind.

The genetic variation in elderberries is amazing. I have only about 14 bushes, but I have a couple with huge berries and one with berries so small when ripe they are barely worth picking. Most are black when ripe but there is one whose berries never turn black, just an iridescent purple. Some stems turn purple when the berries mature, others stay green forever. Some bushes more susceptible than others to Japanese beetles. Some plants have berries that are easy to strip, others have "weak" stems and are tough to strip.


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## Julie

I wont be making wine with those! I have a berry around here and that looks like it that looks like a larger elderberry. They grow in a smaller cluster. The birds will not touch them! And if the birds don't eat them, neither will it.


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## WVMountaineerJack

[BR]Link to Harvesting Elderberries and elderberry pics


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## spunk

I love you site. This,is the 1st year for me to pick wild elderberries interesting along the same close areas I found different berries one was tiny round berries not much left of them tells me the best. Another slightly oval a bit larger a lot on it another a mile away round again and bigger. Now I did the water method and froze what sank for wine or mead but I have quite a lot that didn't sink but looks pretty good. Can I use for something else like jelly or syrup? If yes I would probably go through it again some are not purple


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## WVMountaineerJack

They sink because the sugar in them is heavier than water, the ripest ones sink all the way, others sort of sink but can be floating off the bottom but not on top, we stir and let them settle a little, the ones that wont settle and are near the top are the ones we take out with a strainer, kind of like netting fish in a tank, its also hard to take elderberry pictures, they can look ripe and then yout ake a picture and see more red than purple! Have fun, if you get enough dry some and make a mead with them, its well worth the effort. WVMJ


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## spunk

OK thanks I'm going out again this week. See if I can get more. So should I pitch the ones that did not sink. I read a lot saying unripe berries are poison or am I being too paranoid. Thank you. I am having fun doing this a lot of work though.


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## WVMountaineerJack

The riper the better quality your wine will be, would you put unripe green raspberries or blackberries in your wine? WVMJ


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## spunk

No I would not thank you


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## spunk

Made the elderberry wine with dried elderberries last April. Bottled this week. Very good I Oaked it too. Drank the remainder that,couldn't be bottled. Yum.


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