# Adding tannin powder



## fuse (Jan 29, 2015)

Just had a bottle of a 2006 Malbec from Bordeaux. Such firm tannins!
Just wondering what the thinking is about adding tannin powder to wines?
I make a carboy of concord wine every year from grapes in the backyard (yes, it is slightly musky). The tannin is there, but not mouth-drying like the Bordeaux. Would the addition of more tannin help?
Thanks!


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## sour_grapes (Jan 29, 2015)

fuse said:


> The tannin is there, but not mouth-drying like the Bordeaux. Would the addition of more tannin help?
> Thanks!



In short: yes. Here is a good thread about adding tannins:
http://www.winemakingtalk.com/forum/f86/tannins-know-when-why-add-them-42039/

Not sure you are going to match a Cahors with a Concord, but it couldn't hurt to try!


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## fuse (Jan 29, 2015)

Thanks Mr. Grapes. That helped a lot.
Now to figure out which kind and brand of tannin to add!
I'd like to try adding it to the kits I have going as well. Two cheapos: Grand Cru International Italy Sangiovese Style (why the added "Style"?!?) and a Cellar Masters Cab Sauv Style with added elderberries. Don't think I'd like a finishing tannin like Tannin Riche, because I find the kits already have a sweet enough taste. I'm after mouth-puckering but smooth.
Any recommendations appreciated.


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## joeswine (Jan 29, 2015)

*Balancing to order*

the concord really doesn't warrant tannins ,it's not in it's taste profile, usually fully rounded and semi-sweet with that familiar Welches taste. ON the other hand the *SANGIOVESE *loves a balance between_ oak_ and_ tannins_ to bring out the richness and depth of this style wine, any tannins will do don't go nuts trying to figure out what's the best their all pretty much the same  in the end the key is BALANCE.


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## Deezil (Jan 29, 2015)

With Concord grapes, you'll only be able to get 'so close'..

And realize you were drinking a wine that's 8-9 years old, made with grapes that are superior to Concord, and it probably spent a decent amount of time in an oak barrel or two. That's a pretty high benchmark to reach.

But with that in mind, you might look into FT Rouge to add at the beginning of fermentation and Uva'Tan for a bulk aging addition. I've never made Concord wine myself, but you may want to consider a longer pre-fermentation maceration, fermenting at a warmer temp than normal, and incorporating some oak in there one way or another. There's no real way to cheat the micro-oxygenation that comes with a barrel, and the reactions that that has with the tannins and anthocyanins, but at least with additional tannins you can create more complex interactions between the two, which will help to stabilize the tannins better for the longer term. 

I can't really agree that all tannins are created equal, but the overall finished balance is definitely key.


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## DoctorCAD (Jan 29, 2015)

What Joe said...some wines just dont take to tannins.


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## LeChat (Jan 30, 2015)

joeswine said:


> the concord really doesn't warrant tannins ,it's not in it's taste profile, usually fully rounded and semi-sweet with that familiar Welches taste. ON the other hand the *SANGIOVESE *loves a balance between_ oak_ and_ tannins_ to bring out the richness and depth of this style wine, any tannins will do don't go nuts trying to figure out what's the best their all pretty much the same  in the end the key is BALANCE.



Sorry Joe, I have to disagree.

Tannins are not "all pretty much the same". This is like saying that a Concord is pretty much the same as a Sangiovese. Just no.

Fuse, my opinion is that you get to choose the wine that you want to make. If you want a concord that has a similar profile as a Bordeaux, GO FOR IT!

For a red, I would suggest using a mix of fermentation tannin and cellaring tannin. I have had good luck with Tannin FT Rouge and Tannin Complex, respectively.


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## Turock (Feb 6, 2015)

Yes, it's always wise to add some tannin to concord because this grape is very low on tannin. We make lots of concord and always use tannin. Tannin also has the nice affect of giving color stability to wine so that you don't have plating of color in the bottle. Don't go crazy with tannin, but a moderate dose is good for concord.

I agree--tannins are not all the same. Especially tannin from oaking is not the same as fermentation tannins.

Look at products such as Tannin Riche and Tannin Riche Extra which give vanilla or coconut characters. Vanilla is really excellent on concord.


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