# Has anyone successfully made Skeeter Pee without yeast energiser?



## Shayne Edwards (Apr 29, 2018)

My first batch was a bit of a failure, producing an off smell but I'm getting ready to go round again. My concern is that I seem unable to purchase yeast energiser in Australia, will the recipe work without it?? Thanks in advance for your advice.


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## meadmaker1 (Apr 29, 2018)

Theres a lot of discussion about substitute methods all over the web. 
Bananas add potassium and other minerals.
Boiled bread yeast brings nitrogen
And ive not seen it said but a crushed milti-vitamin should do the rest.
Were do you get yeast , they cant get you ferm aid k. Ferm aid O. ?


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## Shayne Edwards (Apr 29, 2018)

Not sure about the ferm aid brand product, at this point the three local home brew shops didn't seem aware of energiser as a product and internet searching Australian sources is yet to locate a supplier. I believe I can source from US ebay but postage is a killer. Thanks for the alternative advice may have to go that route.


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## Shayne Edwards (Apr 29, 2018)

mead maker 1 you are a champion, searching under product name has found a supplier for fermaid. Hopefully problem solved.


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## NorCal (Apr 30, 2018)

Yea, energizer = nutrient


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## Shayne Edwards (Apr 30, 2018)

Thanks Norcal, I've been reading through the forum and other places as much as time will allow. I've ended up thinking that yeast nutrient provides all the goodies that yeast need to keep doing what they do producing the alcohol and that yeast energiser is like a little blue pill or Barry White music, if you will, to help the yeast to go forth and be bountiful. Have I got that messed up? Also if energizer = nutrient why does the skeeter pee recipe call for both? Just a bit confused.


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## cmason1957 (Apr 30, 2018)

Energizer does not equal nutrient. Nutrient is like vitamins for the yeast. Energizer is more like candy. At least that is how one LHBS explained it to me. Why does the recipe call for both.? Who knows, that recipe is somewhat old and certainly predates the fermaid type of nutrient, which is all I ever add to skeeter pee.


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## kevinlfifer (Apr 30, 2018)

I never use the energizer, only the nutrient (food grade Urea)
I have never had a problem


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## Johnd (Apr 30, 2018)

kevinlfifer said:


> I never use the energizer, only the nutrient (food grade Urea)
> I have never had a problem



Somehow, "food grade" and "urea" just don't go together.................


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## Shayne Edwards (May 1, 2018)

cmason1957 said:


> Energizer does not equal nutrient. Nutrient is like vitamins for the yeast. Energizer is more like candy. At least that is how one LHBS explained it to me. Why does the recipe call for both.? Who knows, that recipe is somewhat old and certainly predates the fermaid type of nutrient, which is all I ever add to skeeter pee.


 Hopefully problem solved found a place down south, Winequip which stocks Fermaid A (which they tell me takes the place of energiser and nutrient) and also EC1118 yeast. Going to have another try at making the skeeter pee and if it doesn’t turn out this time I will know for sure that I need a new hobby. Thanks for everyone’s advice, very helpful mob round these parts!!


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## Johnd (May 1, 2018)

Shayne Edwards said:


> Hopefully problem solved found a place down south, Winequip which stocks Fermaid A (which they tell me takes the place of energiser and nutrient) and also EC1118 yeast. Going to have another try at making the skeeter pee and if it doesn’t turn out this time I will know for sure that I need a new hobby. Thanks for everyone’s advice, very helpful mob round these parts!!



One of the reasons that the SP seems to be hard to get started, is all of the lemon juice, which lowers the pH to a point where it's hard for the yeast to get a foothold. Try holding off on the lemon juice until you get a good, strong fermentation going, and then add it slowly over a couple days time, gradually acclimating your yeast to it..................


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## Shayne Edwards (May 14, 2018)

Fermaid® AT is a blended complex yeast nutrient developed for low to moderate YAN conditions, which supplies a well balanced mix of inorganic nitrogen (diammonium phosphate , DAP), organic nitrogen (wine-yeast derived) and the vitamin thiamine. • The nitrogen content of Fermaid ® AT is composed of inorganic (NH4+) and organic nitrogen (amino acids and peptides). • The NH4+ component is involved in biomass production of yeast cells. Reaching critical biomass is essential for successful fermentation. • Organic nitrogen is assimilated more gradually than inorganic nitrogen. Different amino acids are taken up at different rates. Once inside the cell the alpha amino acids are integrated directly into proteins, degraded into ammonium (NH4+), or used to produce fruit driven esters. • The addition of thiamine to this complex nutrient allows for an improvement in the assimilation of both nitrogen sources and reduces the risk of off flavour production. This preparation is designed to assist wine yeast in the latter half of alcoholic fermentation (AF). The DAP component will help build biomass in low to moderate YAN conditions, promoting a strong culture. Near the end of fermentation when the alcohol concentration has resulted in an inhibition of nitrogen transport across the membrane, the organic nitrogen component of Fermaid® AT (assimilated early AF) can be used by the yeast cells. This results in a healthier yeast cell at the end of fermentation and a reduction in the ‘tailing off’ effect of fermentation rate. When Fermaid® AT is used in place of a DAP-only nutrient strategy, significant improvements in the sensory profiles of the wines are also evident. Fruit driven esters and a reduction in sulphidic characters can be achieved.
KEY NOTES ON NUTRIENT DOSING FOR EFFICIENT ALCOHOLIC FERMENTATION Initial YAN is an indicator of the nutritional composition of the must, but other factors need to be taken into consideration that also dictate the quantity of nutrient that is needed to ensure complete fermentation. Factors affecting nitrogen utilization and requirements • pH: Active transport systems are affected at low pH. High pH optimum for ammonium transport. • Ethanol toxicity: Active transport process such as amino acid accumulation is inhibited in the presence of alcohol. • Temperature: the rate of accumulation of amino acids is reduced at low temperatures. • Plasma membrane composition: low sterols will reduce the efficiency of nitrogen transport. • Yeast strain: different yeast strains have different nitrogen requirements and rates of assimilation; refer to the datasheet for the yeast to be used. • Wild yeast: will provide competition for nitrogen sources. • Yeast Dose rate: The use of DAP-only can lead to a yeast biomass higher than required, hence leading to a higher nitrogen demand than initially anticipated. • Maximum Dose for New Zealand produced wine destined for EU is 40g/hL
FERMAID® AT COMPLEX YEAST NUTRIENT
Ver 2.0 / 09.2017

LALLEMAND OENOLOGY
LALLEMAND AUSTRALIA Tel: +61 (0)8 8276 1200 | Email: [email protected] | www.lallemandwine.com
NUTRIENTS / PROTECTORS
The information herein is true and accurate to the best of our knowledge; however, this data sheet is not to be considered as a guarantee, expressed or implied, or as a condition of sale of this product.
GUIDELINES FOR USE Re-suspend Fermaid® AT in 10x its weight in water. Ensure it is well dispersed with no lumps, then add immediately to the tank. Dose Rate of Fermaid ®AT – Refer to table below. Fermaid AT is recommended for low YAN conditions. A 20g/hL dose of Fermaid AT provides 24mg/L of actual YAN. For moderate to high YANs Lallemand recommends to use the product Fermaid O. A 20g/hL dose of Fermaid O will give 8.6mg/L of actual YAN.
Circumstances such as fruit quality, variety, winemaking practice, must parameters, yeast nutrient demand and cellar conditions are infinitely variable and impact on yeast performance.
Juice/Must YAN Yeast Rehydration Start AF 1/3rd AF >200 mg/L Go-Ferm® Protect Evolution 30g/hL Fermaid®O 20g/hL 125-200 mg/L Go-Ferm® Protect Evolution 30g/hL Fermaid®O 20g/hL Fermaid®O 20g/hL 70 - 125 mg/L Go-Ferm® Protect Evolution 30g/hL Fermaid®O 40g/hL Fermaid®AT 20g/hL <70 mg/L Go-Ferm® Protect Evolution 30g/hL Fermaid®AT 30g/hL Fermaid®AT 30g/hL
PACKAGING AND STORAGE


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## Shayne Edwards (May 14, 2018)

Apparently you cannot buy Fermaid K in Australia due to food safety laws, you can however get it's replacement Fermaid A. I will have another go at the Skeeter Pee but I am still a little confused around dosage rates. I think some more research is in order before I pull the trigger this time.


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