# Oak?!



## jamesbsmith (Jul 25, 2014)

I love the idea of oaking up a red wine with smoked chips.

I made a plum wine, which I was planning on coming out as a red, and I added 7g of smoked oak "chips" (although they were more like a dust?). The wine didn't actually come out like a red, and much more like a rose. 

Unfortunately, the chips ruined the wine (I know this as I made a gallon with and without, with the gallon without chips being great)!

I am wondering whether this may be down to the wine being a rose (and not suiting the smoked oak), maybe due to 7g being too much to use, or maybe due to the chips, which were more like dust, being the wrong product!

Any thoughts / experience would be very much welcomed!


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## JohnT (Jul 25, 2014)

I am not too sure on what you mean by "smoked chips". Most oak is toasted. 

I recommend that you try it again, only this time use either toasted oak cubes or toasted oak beans. 

The level of toast also matters... 

a light toast yields a more raw wood flavor. A medium toast yields some raw wood and also nice toasty vanillas. A dark toast will yields flavors of light smokiness, vanillas, and chocolate.

Check under the articles section of this forum. I posted an article about oak a number of years ago.


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## Runningwolf (Jul 25, 2014)

Whether you used chips or dust, it doesn't matter if it was one week or ten weeks. They both give up 90% of what the have in flavor after about 5 days and the dust even quicker. I usually use about 16 grams per gallon. I always add it though during primary fermentation. If I need more I use spirals or stix which take a lot longer. Adding chips after fermentation does leave a strong bitter like taste that will go away and smooth out in time.


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## jamesbsmith (Jul 26, 2014)

Thank you guys!!!

In my local homebrew shop you can buy unsmoked (intended for white wines), or smoked (intended for reds). The oak beans / cubes / strips / spirals sound good, as probably easier to control then chips / dust. Wow, 16g / gallon is a vast amount, well if using the chips I used! The 7g / gallon I used wrecked my wine, but I am sure there are many types of oak chips, hence probably why its hard to find a recommended dose to use, as I guess it varies on product! Thanks again!


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## whynot (Sep 15, 2014)

I highly recommend the spirals, I use them in most of mine, put them in at the start, so by the 6 week point the wine is done and oaked.. of course you can wait until it's ready and oak them.. 

it's possible, since you only did 1 gal, you "over oaked" the wine... smaller amounts of wine require less oaking, it's the same as a 5G vs. 50G barrel... it takes less time to absorb the flavor with less surface area... 

I stopped using the dust/chips, I started using the old cubes in kits I got with Rum ...


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## kevinlfifer (Sep 16, 2014)

I scored 1"x1" strips of white oak from a local saw mill. (same mill that milled the ash I am using to build a wine cellar with 500+ bottle capacity) That will be another post. I toasted 1/2"x1"x8" 400 F for 45 min or so. Whole house smelled great. Like Vanilla/carmel. I am using it in all my reds in primary now. I used it in a single batch of Malbec in the spring and it turned out great. I entered that in Joe's big and bold contest.

I left the sticks in the Malbec for a month.

I think a plum wine would not pair well with oak, but if it did the light toast or "raw" oak would be better suited.


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## Elmer (Sep 16, 2014)

I age all my reds in 3 oz (per 6 gallon) of Medium toast Hungarian cubes. 

I add about 1 oz to my Berry wines.

I have even started dropping 1/2 dozen cubes into my Decanter, to spice up a bottle of Black Velvet!


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## jamesbsmith (Oct 5, 2014)

Hi Guys,

These are really good oak tips! I bought myself a nice plank of American oak last week, I now need to find someone with a circular saw to slice it up for me! I can probably take it back to where I got it from. I am sure they would do it. Cant wait to oak my rich reds up. Do you think roasting is necessary, as Im sure that barrels would not be roasted? Do you just put it into the oven for 45 mins? I think the method of strips sounds more like maturing in barrels than putting in saw dust for a day


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## sour_grapes (Oct 5, 2014)

jamesbsmith said:


> I bought myself a nice plank of American oak last week, I now need to find someone with a circular saw to slice it up for me! I can probably take it back to where I got it from. I am sure they would do it. Cant wait to oak my rich reds up. Do you think roasting is necessary, as Im sure that barrels would not be roasted? Do you just put it into the oven for 45 mins? I think the method of strips sounds more like maturing in barrels than putting in saw dust for a day



Have you seen this sticky: The Oak Thread? May want to read it over.

When you say "American Oak," what species is it? You only will want to use White Oak.

And yes, they DO toast oak for barrels.


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## jamesbsmith (Oct 6, 2014)

Cheers mate - thats a great link!

When you toast your strips, do you do that in the oven for 45 mins?


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## kevinlfifer (Oct 8, 2014)

James B Smith
Make sure it is white oak. Red oak does not work!! I read somewhere in the forum that red oak gives the flavor of "cat urine"

I toast 45 min for medium, 60 min +/- for dark (When there is any smoke, it's done, some trimming required) 30 min for light.

I used raw oak in my chardonnay


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## jamesbsmith (Oct 9, 2014)

Hi Kevin,

Thanks for that. What temperature is that at please, 200'Cish maybe?

Also, an obvious question maybe, but will red oak be much redder in colour? The plank I have is quite pale (I hope this means it is white)?!


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