Started a FWK black current frutta a little over 4 weeks ago - moved from primary bucket to carboy at 1.020 and was at 1.008 when I left town 2 weeks ago. Still at 1.008 tonight. Is there significant difference between building a starter to try to complete fermentation, then stabilizing and backsweetening or going ahead and adding stabilizers now and adding conditioner to taste?
Black currant frutta stopped
- Thread starter JBP
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What was the OG and what yeast did you use?
Depending on the answers to those questions, I'd be tempted to make an overnight starter with EC-1118 and give it a few weeks.
Given my results with K&C reducing nose and introducing bitterness, I'd bulk age 6 months, then stabilize and add conditioner.
I made the Strawberry and Blackberry 2 years ago, both of which are aging well. I added the full 2 conditioner packs to each, and as a guy who much prefers dry wines, the Strawberry could use a bit more sugar. These kits are acidic, so they absorb a lot of sugar to balance it.
Depending on the answers to those questions, I'd be tempted to make an overnight starter with EC-1118 and give it a few weeks.
Given my results with K&C reducing nose and introducing bitterness, I'd bulk age 6 months, then stabilize and add conditioner.
I made the Strawberry and Blackberry 2 years ago, both of which are aging well. I added the full 2 conditioner packs to each, and as a guy who much prefers dry wines, the Strawberry could use a bit more sugar. These kits are acidic, so they absorb a lot of sugar to balance it.
Thanks for the quick response, Bryan.
OG was 1.085 and according to my notes, KV-1116 came with the kit. Not in any hurry, so can easily let it sit without intervention. Given your experience (and others) of these kits needing significant back-sweetening (this is my first Frutta kit), not sure how hard to push to get complete fermentation before stabilizing.
Will say that I have thoroughly enjoyed the "after-racking extra" with sparkling water...
OG was 1.085 and according to my notes, KV-1116 came with the kit. Not in any hurry, so can easily let it sit without intervention. Given your experience (and others) of these kits needing significant back-sweetening (this is my first Frutta kit), not sure how hard to push to get complete fermentation before stabilizing.
Will say that I have thoroughly enjoyed the "after-racking extra" with sparkling water...
Both of mine fermented to 0.996, so I'd expect yours to do the same.
An EC-1118 starter may reinvigorate it. Another thought is to rack off the current sediment -- racking can spur the yeast into activity.
An EC-1118 starter may reinvigorate it. Another thought is to rack off the current sediment -- racking can spur the yeast into activity.
Good suggestion - thanks.
Well, I am another month along on this kit. I have racked it once to try to kick it back off and added 2 strong yeast starters (EC1118) two weeks apart. And still it sits stubbornly at 1.005. Checked the pH, which is quite acidic at 2.8.
Quick review:
Frutta Black Currant kit - made to instructions, OG 1.085, initial yeast KV1116, racked to carboy at 1.020. Was at 1.008 after a month. With effort over the past month to encourage it to finish, it went to 1.005 and has stayed there for 3 weeks. Basement temp around 65, original fermentation was quite vigorous (typically of FWK kits) and I have double checked to be sure I hadn't accidentally added the finishing packet.
Thoughts? Put it in a corner and forget about it for 9 months? Add finishing packet and back sweeten, then wait to bottle (how long?)? Other?
Quick review:
Frutta Black Currant kit - made to instructions, OG 1.085, initial yeast KV1116, racked to carboy at 1.020. Was at 1.008 after a month. With effort over the past month to encourage it to finish, it went to 1.005 and has stayed there for 3 weeks. Basement temp around 65, original fermentation was quite vigorous (typically of FWK kits) and I have double checked to be sure I hadn't accidentally added the finishing packet.
Thoughts? Put it in a corner and forget about it for 9 months? Add finishing packet and back sweeten, then wait to bottle (how long?)? Other?
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In general, with that much time since starting the kit, most likely there is not much that can be done. A few thoughts that might help in the future. 1) Acidity. I find that even the best kits can have acidity issues. Some manufacturers adjust acidity and some do not. In short, I don't trust the kit out of the box and ALWAYS check acidity and adjust if necessary. 2) The final gravity number is exactly that, a "number". That number consists of tons of other things besides residual fermentable sugar. One of the other components that can raise final gravity is glycerine. Depending on many factors, glycerine can be generated that can significantly raises the gravity, especially when fermented on the cooler side. (ask me how I know, glycerine density is 1.26 g/cm*3). 3) Just making a strong "year starter" may not do the job. For example, if doing a deep dive into the Scott Labs recommended yeast starter for stuck ferments, the method begins with starting with GoFerm, adding/conditioning with the must and adding Fermaid O and letting this STARTER ferment down to 1.00 before adding to the main batch that is stuck. The interesting part of the Scott Labs recommendation is adding >more< Fermaid O to supplement what was already added. {This restart method may not help in your situation} My point to all of this is there is more to reaching the final gravity than than many consider. I suggest letting your wine bulk age, perhaps adjusting the pH up a bit, then bottle. All the best, Barry.
Thanks for the detailed reply!
Many sources equate SG and sugar, which is definitely isn't. Your description is excellent.
When I've mentioned that FG is a factor of many things, it never occurred to me that natural glycerin is among them. I've seen how much glycerin can raise SG, so it's likely a major contributor why one red will have a FG of 0.994 and another will be 0.998.
Right! Not all yeasts are the same and neither are "nutrients". For the benefit of JPB and others reading this thread, one of the characteristics of some yeasts is the production of Glycerol or Glycerine. That production (mouthfeel) is enhanced by organic nutrients. I stumbled on this PDF from Lallemand some time ago. After reading and considering the information carefully, it was one of those "A HA!" moments.
https://admin.lallemandwine.com/wp-...-Expert-120321-WE-Glycerol-and-WInemaking.pdf
