Cherry wine question..

[Kivanc]

Hi all,

Last Sunday I've tried to make a wine from 7 kilograms of cherry:
4.53 kgs of sugar
1 tsp of yeast energizer
1 tsp of yeast nutrient
3/4 tsps of pectic enzyme
5 tsps of acid blend

At first, I washed the fermentation vessel with potassium bisulfite. After 24 hours I sprinkled the yeast. I'm in the 4th day now but I don't see any vigorous activity. I just see foamings within the must when I stir. I might say that the cellar is a bit cold.

Does the fermentation is stucked?

I want to make yeast starter but I don't exactly know how.

Any help would be appreciated...

 

[Runningwolf]

Why do you think you need to see vigorous fermentation? Not all fermentations do that. Did you take a hydrometer reading before fermentation and take one now to see if it moved at all? My guess is that you are fine but without using your hydrometer you won't know.

 

[Kivanc]

Why do you think you need to see vigorous fermentation? Not all fermentations do that. Did you take a hydrometer reading before fermentation and take one now to see if it moved at all? My guess is that you are fine but without using your hydrometer you won't know.

Because most of the times I witnessed vigorous fermentation with grapes and oranges. I didn't take a hydrometer reading But I hear some noises in the vessel.

 

[Kivanc]

Here's the photo of my cherry must Runningwolf.
I've placed the must to a warmer place two days ago. I stirred the must but it is still so sweet.

Tomorrow, it will be the 7th day of fermentation. Should I let the must stay in the first fermentation for a while?

 

[cintipam]

Hi Kivanc

OK, you already know you should have taken the starting gravity at the beginning, but you didn't. Since you seem concerned that fermentation is stalled then at least use your hydrometer now to take a reading. Wait about 2 days then take a reading again. I'm betting you will see a drop in the reading, and that means your must is still fermenting. Rule is unless you get the same reading THREE DAYS in a row, then it is still possibly fermenting. So get your hydrometer out and get a reading. Without that info no one can really help you. Altho you said it tastes really sweet, so I'm betting you got maybe a week more fermentation to go since the fermentation seems on the slow side. That is not a bad thing, keeps delicate aromas and flavors from burning off. Just means the primary fermentation will take longer.

Pam in cinti

 

[cintipam]

Kivanc, I admit I am not up on the metric or imperial system, so I googled it and read that 1 KG is approx 2.2 pounds. Looking at your recipe that means you used approx 15 1/2 pounds of cherries and approx 10 pounds of sugar. I'm just approximating here. Did you add any water at all? How many gallons are you hoping to make? I'm probably off, but I'm feeling that is too much sugar to add for that amount of cherries. Are they sweet cherries or tart pie cherries?

See why everybody is asking for that hydrometer reading?

Pam in cinti

 

[Kivanc]

I used table (sweet) cherries. I didn't add water. Today, I got rid of the pulps; poured the must into a new vessel. I plunged the hydrometer and I found that the specific gravity is still higher than 1.130. So I've added 3 tsps of wine yeast and stirred once again.. I left the hydrometer inside the vessel.

The wine yeast that I use is 7 years old; I keep it in cupboard along with the other wine equipments in cool.

 

[cintipam]

Hi Kivanc

thanks for the reading, and the additional information. Wait a couple days then take a new reading. But I'm betting your yeast is too old. It is best to keep your yeast in a refrigerator along with your potassium sorbate. (Actually, I keep the sorbate in the freezer as I use it so rarely and the freezer keeps it fresh longer.) If you are able to get more yeast that would be my recommendation at this point.

If your reading does drop lower in a few days there is a great possibility that wild yeast is fermenting your must. No way to know if it will have good or bad results.

If the reading does drop, then that means that your original reading would have been far higher than 1.090. If you taste any alcohol or fizziness from fermentation at all there is the possibility that the ferment did begin, but there was too much sugar for your yeast to process so after doing what it could it died.

Can you estimate how many gallons of must you had when you had all the pulp in one container? I'm not able to do the math to determine how high your original SG would have been based on amount of sugar alone, but maybe one of our math guys can.

Pam in cinti

 

[Kivanc]

Thank you...

I had approximately 3 gallons of must when I had all the pulp in one container. The must got alcoholic smell though the SG is higher than 1.130 (it hasn't dropped). I'm going to wait a few days. Today, I just ordered a dried wine yeast called BIOFERM CHAMP 7gr. It will arrive in a week.

 

[Kivanc]

My cherry must is so sweet and syrupy and the hydrometer hasn't submerged at all.

What should I do now?

Should I add more water to get rid of that syrupy taste and that sweetness?

How could I make a yeast starter to activate the yeast in the must?

Should I wait for the new yeast (BIOFERM CHAMP 7gr) to add it into the must?

 

[hounddawg]

sweet cherries are kinda tough because they are sweet to began with, if you can get your hands on a few pounds of blackberries you'll greatly reduce your sweet tasting factor, I do make sweet cherries now an then but I always mix in the ferment barrel some black berry and a little bit of crab apples, I only try making country wines, meaning no grapes, but by adding blackberry or other low sugar fruit or berry and a touch of crab apple I guess a acid blend would replace the crab apples I got my first batch of apple/pear aging now with acid blend my very frist attempt at using acid blend, my crab apple has come down with cedar rust fungus, still waiting on some organic--- anti-fungicide,, just as a starting point I use 3 lbs crab apples to 40 lbs fruit, so very little crab apple,, as well a touch of lemon juice or lime juice but again very little, I have a decent PH meter but have never used it, I use a wine thief to taste small samples, but I like the old ways many on here can tell you how to make it great but I don't have that much new type knowledge yet, but i'm learning,, best of luck to you.
Dawg::

My cherry must is so sweet and syrupy and the hydrometer hasn't submerged at all.

What should I do now?

Should I add more water to get rid of that syrupy taste and that sweetness?

How could I make a yeast starter to activate the yeast?

Should I wait for the new yeast (BIOFERM CHAMP 7gr) to add it into the must?

 

[Kivanc]

Thanks for the reply. Unfortunately, I got rid off all the pulps. I guess I will add acid blend and add the new yeast when I'll get home though E. C. Kraus says "if too much sugar still appears to be the only problem, you can try adding 3 or 4 packs of yeast to the batch to get your wine going again."

I hope everything will turn out ok.. This issue bothers me so much.

 

[cintipam]

Hi Kivanc

I'm troubled by "the hydrometer isn't submerged at all". You really need to get a reading. the best way would be to get a tall thin tube of glass or clear plastic and put your must in that at least half full. Then put your hydrometer in that to help it stand up so you can read the results. If the hydrometer stands on the bottom, you need to add more must until the hydrometer floats and you get a reading. This video should help.

[ame]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GTvmYaQq6Mc[/ame]

If you are calling it syrupy the sugar level is probably way too high for any yeast to handle, which would mean adding water would be the only way to get a fermentation started. BUT that will dilute the flavor, and should be a last resort. It would be possible to also add low sugar flavor via concentrated cherry juice like from a health food store. I've done this successfully.

If you have to wait a week for new yeast, and there is that much sugar in your must, it should be refrigerated during the waiting time to reduce the possibility of spoilage. I would even throw some potassium metabisulfite in the must to help it stay safe (about 1/4 tsp of the powder or maybe 4 crushed campden tablets).

If nothing else you have learned the true importance of getting SG readings. Most wines go for initial SG of 1.080-1.090. Much higher than that and you got problems. Yeast can't handle the toxic environment. And about the suggestion to use 3 packs would just mean you would kill 3 packs of yeast instead of one. You can do a lot of extra work trying fixes that are expensive and mostly don't work anyway. This wine might turn out to be a costly lesson for you.

By the way, your yeast should have an expiration date on it. If you keep it in the fridge it will last a little longer, but even very fresh yeast is only good for about 3 years tops if refrigerated.

Don't let this stop you. Just learn from it.

Pam in cinti

 

[Kivanc]

Hi cintipam,

Thank you for the video; its very informative!!! and thank you very much for your detailed explanation. I have learned a lot..

My former yeast hasn't got expiration date on it.

Fortunately, the new yeast arrived on 7th of June and I sprinkled almost a pack (3 spoons). After a short time, it did show some activity. Thus, the fermentation has reached its peak and it has been fermenting since then; it is full of foam and it has got strong smell of wine

Thanks all..

 

[Kivanc]

Five days have passed since I added the yeast (Bioferm Rouge 7gr) and the fermentation is on its way sparkling... The reading has moved to 1.125 (excuse me, the SG was higher than 1.130). It seems that the primary fermentation will last until next Tuesday. I guess that my must will stay in the primary fermentation for one more week.

 

[Kivanc]

Yesterday I took a specific gravity reading. It has dropped around 1.110. The fermentation is very active. I didn't use the whole pack. Do I use the rest of the pack?

I need your insight...

 

[cintipam]

Hi Kivanc

glad to see you got the hydrometer figured out. This way we know for sure that the yeast is working. Now however we need to talk about yeast. Each yeast is different, and has a different tolerance to alcohol before giving up and dying. Since you are 1.110 right now (and that is actually higher SG than most of us start at) we know you already have some alcohol in your must. I do not think there is any yeast out there that will be able to exist and function long enough to take your wine to dry. At this point you need to wait and see, being sure to stir your must at least once a day, twice would be better. Keep it happy as long as you can, and when you get the same hydrometer reading 3 days in a row then the yeast is done. At that point if is still too sweet for you there are a couple options.

If you want to try to take it down just a little bit more you can try making a extra big yeast starter with your remaining yeast and hope that does enough for you to enjoy the taste. Somewhere on this site is a good lesson on how to make a yeast starter, and tho I did search I couldn't find it Hope someone else will point that out for you.

If it is too sweet but not syrupy sweet you can find some sort of concentrate that is very low in sugar (I buy tart cherry concentrate at health food stores) you can add that concentrate plus some water to reduce the SG as much as possible without diluting so much that it loses flavor, then try yeast one more time using a yeast starter to help give the yeast a good head start.

If it still tastes so syrupy sweet you know a little fix just won't be good enough you have a few options.

1. Add it to carbonated softdrinks to make a wine cooler.

2 Make another batch of wine very very dry and use this first wine to backsweeten to the point you find acceptable.

3 Mix with icecream to make a very adult shake.

The biggest thing you did wrong was add way way way too much sugar in the beginning. Use the hydrometer to get reading up to 1.090 generally, and that should be the starting point.

Study info about yeasts too. Some yeasts are capable of dealing with a lot more sugar than most. Champagne yeast (Lalvin EC1118 easiest to find and I consider the best) will work up to 18% alcohol. Most only work up to 12-14%.

Pam in cinti