critique/inputs for blackberry wine

[Turock]

Experience will definitely add to your knowledge base--we just want to be sure you have enough basic knowledge before you start in order to have success. Wish every new winemaker would do more "homework" like you are doing, before starting to ferment something. You will be a very good winemaker in the future.

 

[jdaker]

Having made blackberry it will not turn out that deep a colour, actually very pale considering.

Don't want to change the recipe but I would suggest a couple of litre cartons of red grape juice, in place of some of the water. Last I made I threw in a pound of blackcurrants as well.

As to clearing, get a 2 part clearing agent, they are much better then just about everything else.

 

[Turock]

Our blackberry is dark as night. Water dilution makes it light-colored. I wouldn't add grape juice to it--make a full-blown blackberry. It will taste exactly like the fruit. If you want to blend some with other wines before bottling, THAT would be better than adulterating the whole batch with another flavor.

 

[wineon4]

I have a passion for making fruit wines. I have a blackberry that is out of this world, just won Double Gold best of Show with it in a local comp. As Turroc said "high fruit". I use 12 pound per gallon I put my fruit in blender then right into the primary no fruit bags, tough job for the first rack but I think you get a better fruit flavor and the wine is a heavy bodied wine. Test your acid before adding any. I don't go by PH as much as I do with % I get my fruit wines around .65% up .80% depending on the planned sweetness of the finished wine. Higher sugar demands higher acid. Your recipe seems stable just watch the acid and as Julie said check your SG before determining the sugar amount, don't rush the finished wine.Good luck Kim

 

[Turock]

As I said before, blackberry is a "touchy" wine for a beginner to make. It takes special considerations for it to turn out correctly. Most of this is due to new winemakers not understanding how important acid adjustment PRE-FERMENT is. Blackberry is so acidic--if you don't adjust the acid at the outset, it's impossible to adjust it post ferment because you can't use that much potassium carbonate to move the PH many tenths. So you end up stuck with a very acidic wine that all you can do with it is to blend.

Blackberry should always have a malic metabolizing culture used on it or the resulting harshness, even with proper acid adjustment, can be rather unpleasant.

We use 10# per gallon, and wouldn't consider anything less than that.

 

[saramc]

Thanks Saramc, I learned a little bit about the uses of bentonite from your post. My only question is what exactly does bentonite have to do with heat stabilization?

Read up on how to heat stabilize...bentonite plays an important role in binding those proteins IF your wine is not stable in a hot environment.

 

[seth8530]

Ill give that a look when I get the chance.. Kinda busy/tired with my new job as of right now lol.

 

[jdaker]

12lb in a gallon should make a darker wine, but the original says 18lb in 3.5 gallon. Which in fractionally over 5lb a gallon, less then half.

That is about what I used in the last blackberry I made and as said it is not the deep colour that many expect. Starts out a reasonable colour but the fermentation removes a lot. The post was for information that the end result may not be a deep colour, although I think I read that they prefer a lighter end result, (could be wrong here?)

Owing to the loss/change of colour and flavor during the fermentation and having come upon a slightly different approach I am finding I have changed the method I now use on all the fruit wines I make.

 

[Turock]

But you see, that's the problem when following a recipe. That's why, once you have some experience, you go "off recipe." There's only a couple fruit wines that should be made with a standard recipe and water dilution. But most of them are FAR better when you up the poundage and eliminate the water.

 

[wineon4]

It is tough to totaly eliminate water but in most cases you can reduce it to very minimal amounts. I make a great Banana wine and as we know Bananas have next to no natural juice so water is a needed ingredient. For my Banana I take 80lb of Bananas and peel them, blend them in a blender using welches white niagara juice as the blending liquid. Add to the primary again a 10 gallon for 6 gallon of wine because Banana makes a massive fruit cap. Top to 6 gallon using 1/2 water and 1/2 white grape. As turock said increase the fruit,and fruit wines become award winning wines.

 

[spaniel]

But you see, that's the problem when following a recipe. That's why, once you have some experience, you go "off recipe." There's only a couple fruit wines that should be made with a standard recipe and water dilution. But most of them are FAR better when you up the poundage and eliminate the water.

I used to make 180 gallons of various fruit wines per year. The quotes post is dead on. The only exceptions that come to mind are red raspberry and perhaps gooseberry...things where you the acid will overpower the flavor if you get too much fruit in there.

 

[Turock]

From our experience, it isn't the acid because we always adjust the acid to an acceptable level on everything we make. It has to do with flavor. For some reason, lots of fruit for red raspberry, blueberry, black raspberry just doesn't have high flavor. These wines really need the standard recipe.

 

[vernsgal]

Well I just got back from holidaying,checked my post, and I have to say "WOW".(had some reading to catch up on )Unfortunately I'm still waiting for my PH meter to arrive by post (Canada Post, so hopefully some time this year,lol) I have everything else,including 35-38 lbs of frozen blackberries (will be trying for no water dilution,if not enough juice,it's back to the shop I go) Thank you everyone for all your help and input so far.
I do believe in wine making that reading is great for everyone, but reading "experienced knowledge" is the best!

 

[Turock]

Welcome back.

Let me give you a little heads up on using a large amount of frozen fruit. It can take a couple days for a large amount to thaw and warm to room temp so the yeast will take off. Be sure to use the right amount of sulfite on it and layering it in to the frozen fruit is a good idea. Toss a couple pints of water on it to be sure it's somewhat dissolved.

You don't want to get any biological growth going, or your ferment will become stuck because the growth overwhelms the yeast.

 

[vernsgal]

so how much sulfite is the right amount? I don't want to use too much/not enough.

 

[LoveTheWine]

Well I just got back from holidaying,checked my post, and I have to say "WOW".(had some reading to catch up on )Unfortunately I'm still waiting for my PH meter to arrive by post (Canada Post, so hopefully some time this year,lol) I have everything else,including 35-38 lbs of frozen blackberries (will be trying for no water dilution,if not enough juice,it's back to the shop I go) Thank you everyone for all your help and input so far.
I do believe in wine making that reading is great for everyone, but reading "experienced knowledge" is the best!

Where in B.C. are you from.
I'm located on the Island and have ordered a few things off Ebay from China.
It usually takes 3-4 weeks to arrive.

 

[vernsgal]

Right now I'm in Coquitlam. I too have ordered things from China but this is coming from Ontario so it could take longer.lol Actually the mail tracker shows it arriving on Thurs., so fingers crossed

 

[LoveTheWine]

Right now I'm in Coquitlam. I too have ordered things from China but this is coming from Ontario so it could take longer.lol Actually the mail tracker shows it arriving on Thurs., so fingers crossed

Sorry my mistake, I thought you ordered the meter from China.
On a different note, have you visited BosaGrape winery supplies in Burnaby?

http://ecom.bosagrape.com/home.php

I have ordered items from them in the past as they seem to have everything.
They carry Lalvin 71B-1122 yeast which is great for blackberry as it can reduce much of your Malic acid during fermentation resulting in a smoother wine.

 

[spaniel]

From our experience, it isn't the acid because we always adjust the acid to an acceptable level on everything we make. It has to do with flavor. For some reason, lots of fruit for red raspberry, blueberry, black raspberry just doesn't have high flavor. These wines really need the standard recipe.

Interesting, I've had the opposite experience. Those fruits develop plenty of flavor for me. Black raspberry is one of my favorites, I just bottled 6 gallons of black raspberry port. I put in no water; the flavor was amazing. IIRC we originally started at 10lb/gal and it was good even there.

Red raspberry, I experimented with one batch of no water added and it was too much flavor....specifically, too sharp. I'm guessing acid though I did not test it, but it certainly was not thin on flavor.

Blueberry I gave up (probably too) early as I could not get the chemistry right for good fermentation and had no equipment back then. But it had a ton of flavor.

When I think of thin flavor I think of peach, strawberry, and watermelon.

 

[dessertmaker]

I think what Turock was trying to say was that using large amounts of those specific fruits doesn't improve the flavor and that its better to stick with recipes that add water in those instances.