glycerin in extract

[hounddawg]

sucks,,,, i bet that nitroglycerine would give it a good pop,,,,
Dawg

 

[Rice_Guy]

Question of the hour; I have a cyser done with crab apple, the tannin bite is dominating the afternotes as well as dehydrating the mouth. Bryan, You are using glycerin on a red, ,,, what does it do to the tannic flavor notes? Second what might gum arabic do to mellow out tannic flavors? Any other tools on high tannin?

Interesting. I found that 1 oz/gallon make a marked difference in last year's Merlot. I bottled 1 bottle without, the remainder of a carboy with. A month later we tasted both, and the mouth feel of the with-glyerine was clearly better, and the legs in the glass were thicker and heavier. I'm wondering what is different that we got different results.
When making liqueurs, I use 1 oz per liter, and that is a tremendous difference.

@hounddawg you are using crab apple, have you dealt with high tannin? I am wishing I had sampled you on some some Prairie Fire variety so you could rate the intensity.

 

[winemaker81]

what does it do to the tannic flavor notes?

Glycerin softened the wine overall, although the test wine was not highly tannic, so I can't say I noticed a difference in tannin.

Fining with egg whites is supposed to reduce tannins, although I've never had a wine tannic enough to do it myself. I've not used gum arabic.

 

[Scooter68]

By the way Glycerin will also add some sweetness as well. You can see this if you put just a drop on your finger and taste it. Go easy though Glycerin is also good for flushing out the ol digestive tract.

 

[Ty520]

aging on wood also adds glycerol, Chestnut and Ash having a relatively higher concentrations

 

[Raptor99]

aging on wood also adds glycerol, Chestnut having a realtively high concentration

Interesting. I did a search on oak and glycerol and I found this: Oak Sweeter than Sugar for Wine | Wine-Searcher News & Features. It would be helpful to have a list of different kinds of wood and roasting levels, and what they each contribute to the wine.

 

[Ty520]

I've started collecting samples and running bench tests to do just that:

my findings so far (not complete yet)...

Species & Tasting Notes:

• Acacia:
• Apple:
• Apricot:
• Birch (Yellow): Toffee, butterscotch, marshmallow, croissant, honey, light root beer, light wintergreen, woodsy (mostly aroma), moderate tannins
• Cherry: Light toffee, earthy, ripe cherry, grass, fried bread, light vanilla
• Chestnut: light vanilla, coffee, cinnamon, high glycerol
• Hickory: Honey, Smokey, tannin, apple sauce, cocoa, woodsy, coconut, hay
• Maple (hard): nutmeg, cinnamon, syrup, bread/bakery, cream, cocoa
• Maple (soft): Yellow cake, light smoke, banana, nut, toasted bread, orange
• Mulberry:
• Oak (American): Vanilla, woodsy, coconut, cinnamon, pepper, pastry, caramel, low tannin
• Oak (French): cinnamon, allspice, high tannin
• Oak (Hungarian): Subtle vanilla, chocolate, coffee, woodsy, coconut
• Oak (Oregon): Molasses, clove, stewed berry, smoke, BBQ (*Note: requires long seasoning to break down bitter, astringent tannins)
• Oak (red): Red berries, toasted marshmallow, peppery, resinous (*Note: requires long seasoning to break down bitter, astringent tannins)
• Oak (Spanish): Clove, cinnamon, pepper, dried fruit, nutty
• Pear: stewed fruit, grassy
• Sassafras: Vanilla, Sage, Wintergreen, Root Beer
• White Ash: Smokey, stewed fruit, marshmallow, grass, bread, light sweetness, high glycerols

Compound descriptions:

• Lactones: Woodsy, coconut
• Vanillin: vanilla
• Eugenol/Isoeugenol: Spice, clove (resulting from seasoning)
• Furfural: Results from heat during the toasting process, these compounds possess aromas of (in order of char level): caramel, butterscotch, faint almond, coffee, marshmallow, campfire
• Guaiacol/4--methulguaiacol: char, smoke (resulting from charring process)

Species

Lactones

Vanillins

Eugenols

Furfurals

Acacia
Apple
Apricot
Birch (yellow)	med	low	low	Med/Hi
Cherry	Med/Low	Med/Low	Med/Low	Med/Low
Chestnut		med/lo	med
Hickory	med/hi	low	low	med/lo
Maple - Hard	med/low	med	med/lo	med/low
Maple - Soft	med/low	med	low	med/hi
Mulberry
Oak-American	med	med/hi	med	med/hi
Oak-French	med/Low	Med/Low	Med	Med
Oak-Hungarian	Med/Hi	med
Oak-Oregon	Med/Hi	low	med/hi	med/hi
Oak-Red	Med/Hi	low	med/hi	med/low
Oak-Spanish	med		Med/Hi
Pear
Sassafras	lo	High	lo	lo
White Ash	med/hi	lo	lo	med/high

 

[hounddawg]

Question of the hour; I have a cyser done with crab apple, the tannin bite is dominating the afternotes as well as dehydrating the mouth. Bryan, You are using glycerin on a red, ,,, what does it do to the tannic flavor notes? Second what might gum arabic do to mellow out tannic flavors? Any other tools on high tannin?

@hounddawg you are using crab apple, have you dealt with high tannin? I am wishing I had sampled you on some some Prairie Fire variety so you could rate the intensity.

i use soe crabapple in most all my wines to add that pop at the end,
Dawg

 

[winemaker81]

In another thread I reported the results of a taste test of a wine 8 month after bottling, with and without glycerin. The with-glycerin is mellow although the oak is a bit aggressive. Everyone who has tasted it, likes it.

The without-glycerin is very harsh and unpleasant. The difference is startling in how the glycerin tamed the harsh flavors.