Having issues on my whites. All of them.

[tmmii]

Couple years in the making. All has been with Luva Bella juice. Several batches of moscato, reisling, Chardonnay, Sauvignon blanc, and vigonier. I do not think this is an issue with the juice supplier with it being multiple batches/years.

I my first thoughts are starsan is throwing off the acidity or could I have some type of infection in my 5 year old siphon?

I don't remember when I switched from meta water to starsan, so I can't use that process of elimination.

My process is generally-
Leave in buckets, ferment to 1.020, rack to secondary. Rack and so2 a couple weeks later. I have been overly afraid of degassing so I have generally racked about once a month and bottled at 6 months. If it went sweet I would at sorbate and sugar as needed.

My last batch I spent time playing with the Chardonnay with racking and mlf (and it has the same bad issues listed below) the other three buckets were racked out of the buckets at .990 or so and didn't touch them until last week (came out of buckets 4/24). The reisling and moscato smelt and tasted great. A little settlement was disturbed so I just racked and figured let it sit for a bit more (well minus a few glasses, I love a good dry reisling).


What I'm getting- smell- not aeromtic at all. Doesn't smell flowery or light. The taste is sour to bitter, even on moscato that has been back sweetened. I have the ph test strips, showing at 4.0 but I know they aren't that accurate. It's not an oxidation issue, they stay topped up.

I guess ask away with what I have left out and I will answer or try to do it.

 

[Julie]

Are these Chilean? I quite buying Chilean whites, they just have an off taste not sour or bitter thou. Are you adding any tannins?

 

[tmmii]

No added tannins. Most have been Chilean but some Californian.

 

[Turock]

Are you using any nutrient? The buckets from Luva Bella already have the yeast in them, but you have to remember to add nutrient to them. Lack of nutrient will give off-aromas. We always test the PH on bucket juice and if it's out of line, adjust it before the ferment gets too far along. A PH of 4.0 is way too high for Chard. The low-range test papers are better to use, but you really should own a PH meter. They are reasonably priced today.

We never degas our wines. You should be bulk aging wines for at least a year so you get better flavor development. In that time frame, the wine will degas on its own.

 

[tmmii]

Yes to nutrient, half when I get them the other half after a few days when sg is around 1.040-50. What ph should it be and is there a way to save them now or too late?

 

[grapeman]

Try and find out which yeast they add to these. They may add the same to all of them and if it isn't a good match it could leave a bit of an undesirable taste. I find with aromatic whites I use several different yeast strains to get the character I want from the grape.

 

[Julie]

Try and find out which yeast they add to these. They may add the same to all of them and if it isn't a good match it could leave a bit of an undesirable taste. I find with aromatic whites I use several different yeast strains to get the character I want from the grape.

Luva uses Lavlin 1118

 

[Turock]

If it's tasting sour, that makes me question the PH. At a PH of 4.0, it should taste like dishwater. I'll bet the PH isn't that high.

I think the PH should be around 3.2---and if you get it adjusted better, you're actually adjusting the TA which SHOULD help it to taste better. I really don't care for the buckets of white juice. All bucket juice is thin-tasting, but the whites can really suffer from it. I only had very excellent Chard one time---a Calif bucket back in 1997. A couple years ago I got a bucket of Calif Chard and it was unremarkable.

I recommend you buy a PH meter and test that Chard to find out where the PH is at.

 

[cintipam]

Julie, my local Brew shop said that the reds get 1118, and the whites get 1116. I was picking up Luva Bella buckets at the time. Can't swear he was correct, but wanted to throw it into the discussion.

Pam in cinti

 

[grapeman]

I was figuring it was either 1118 or 1116. Those are both fast acting yeast and tend to blow off most of the esters, leaving other less desirable qualities. I prefer either Cotes des blancs or D-47 as they will accentuate the fruit and leave the esters alone. Lots of others tout there also. The problem is that they have already been treated with those yeasts they use.
It is true that the pH may be off also. Getting a good accurate reading could be helpful.

 

[ffemt128]

I've had the same issues with Luva Bella whites, just an off aroma. I know most of their whites have also been very low in acid. Quit buying whites from them 2 years ago. I've had wine from other wine makers who asked about the odor and the first question I asked was where they got it.

 

[JohnT]

Sour usually means low PH.. I would at least take a titration test. I like a TA of around .65gpl for my whites...

It is more likely that your wine has not been infected, rather, it has fully fermented. Sugar is the best way to "hide" the sourness of wine. If your wine has fermented fully, and the sugar in the wine has been consumed, it might seem as if the wine may have turned "sour". If this is the case then you have plenty of options to choose from (Back Sweeten, chemical adjustments, etc)