I have begun the journey...

[gorillla68]

Hello all! Quick bio... Im in Southern California and bought a property with four Cabernet Sauvignon vines. Im at approx 1000' elevation... warm days and cool breezy nights. The previous owner had more but the vines died off. In the last month I have expanded to 21 vines total now... 15 cabs, 3 merlot, 1 catawba, 1 flame, 1 midgley (the last three were given to me). Im quite excited to see what I can do with all these. The four cab vines were growing wild and I was able to harvest 10 pounds total. I did test for brix at time of picking FWIW and got 20. No other testing was done.

So I made a 5 gallon batch yesterday and honestly Im just guessing at it all first time around (I have made beer many times in the past). I would appreciate any input that might help this first batch turn out decent (as can be expected)...

- 1 can Alexanders Sun Country Pinot Noir concentrate
- water to bring it up to 2.5 gal
- 1 gallon welchs grape juice
- 1 gallon welchs red blend grape juice
- 10 pounds of my crushed cab grapes/juice
- 3 cups sugar

I know the welchs will turn people off but hey I just wanted to get to 5 gallons and at the time it made sense. It doesnt seem to make sense now. Im right around 5 gallons anyhow. Ive also added:

- 3 campden tablets
- 2 tsp acid blend

Unfortunately I have no way of testing pH or testing titratable acidity. Next batch I do (a kit or shipped grapes) I'll have everything ready to go. Until then Im working this first batch and with everything added above these are my readings:

- OG measures 1.080
- Brix is at 20.5

Tonight or tomorrow morning I'll be adding in the yeast nutrient and the yeast (4244 wyeast - Italian Red).

Okay... so what have I done wrong and what can I do to make sure this doesnt turn out too too bad. I am worried about the acidity level since I have no way of testing. The concentrate needed some amount of acid blend, but the grape juice has acid in it also. I really hope the 2 tsp of the acid blend Ive added is not overboard.

Heres to the start of my journey and glad to meet everyone!

 

[CDrew]

Why did you add the campden tablets up front?

Not really going to comment on your choices. THe important thing, is that you're making wine. This will let you get your procedures down and ready for next fall. After this trial balloon you'll know about sterilization, siphoning, transfers, bottling and the like. I don't know if what you're making will be good wine but it will be a fermented beverage and you're preparing yourself for the real thing. That's really low brix though. And don't use acid blend. Use tartaric acid.

I'd start looking around for a source of grapes for next fall. Lot's of vineyards down there in So Cal, and many are decent. I've had good wines from Temecula and from around Santa Barbara.

 

[gorillla68]

I added the campden tabs now because I didnt want any odd yeast from my grapes, plus the Sun Country concentrate said to add some, plus the "From Vines to Wines" book also recommended it right off the bat.

EDIT: also, do you mean low brix at harvest time? Or right now?

 

[CDrew]

Generally, if the grapes are in good shape, no initial sulfite is needed, and may be detrimental later, but you're still likely fine.

And I'd get "Campden tablets" off the list now. Instead of Sodium Metabisulfite, use whatever form of Potassium metabisulfite you like. Campden tablets are super old school stuff and not needed.

I recently read From Vines to Wines and it's decent book, but very dated in it's approach. Better (much better) is "Techniques in Home Winemaking" by Daniel Pambianchi.

But this free practical source is great and highly recommended:
https://morewinemaking.com/web_files/intranet.morebeer.com/files/wredw.pdf

Good luck, if you have grape growing property you have a good thing. Keep posting.

 

[bshef]

I added the campden tabs now because I didnt want any odd yeast from my grapes, plus the Sun Country concentrate said to add some, plus the "From Vines to Wines" book also recommended it right off the bat.

EDIT: also, do you mean low brix at harvest time? Or right now?[/QUOTE

You were right to sulfate at the start to kill the wild yeasts. The quality of the grapes does not affect wild yeast spores.

 

[gorillla68]

Quoting from the internets... "What’s The Difference Between Sodium and Potassium Metabisulfite? = Both of these additives do the exact same thing. The only difference between sodium metabisulfite and potassium metabisulfite is that they will leave a residual trace of either sodium or potassium."

I'm basically adding metabisulfite since I added my own grapes to this batch. Had I done a wine kit maybe I wouldnt need it at all? The MoreWine! Red wine making guide also recommends to add it at the start as well (page 8, section 2.2).

 

[bshef]

I don’t know that my earlier message came through correctly. You are entirely right. You need sulfite at the start of any fermentation with fresh or frozen fruit (grapes). With juice that may have been pasteurized or preserved in some manner(kit) you don’t need to worry about wild yeast. EVERY RESOURCE will tell you the same. Word of warning; take everything on this forum as a suggestion with a grain of salt then research with proper resources. Wine making is not hard but you can get mired down and obsessed with minutiae. Enjoy yourself.

 

[mainshipfred]

I have to agree with @CDrew on the sulfite issue. Good grapes do not require any sulfites at crush and you have to be particularly careful if you plan on doing MLF.

 

[NorCal]

With freshly picked grapes that are in real good shape, I’ve been less aggressive on the upfront SO2, but I’ve never skipped it. You are not only killing wild yeast, but also bacteria. Like the bacteria from that bird whose excrement landed on a cluster.

The commercial yeasts can tolerate a moderate level of SO2 and I’ve never had a batch not complete mlf, but you cannot overdue it with the upfront SO2 (50 ppm is recommended).

 

[bshef]

Well said.

 

[gorillla68]

Thank you everyone! I do appreciate everyones input because we all have different experiences. I only had 10 pounds of grapes so I didnt want to add five metabisulfite tablets (one for each gallon) so I ended up doing three so hopefully its enough but not too much.

This originally started out as a Sun Country concentrate that I planned to add my grapes knowing I wouldnt be harvesting much, then I got some hair-brained idea to top it off with grape juice. I'm kind of worried its going to come out horrible.

Anyhow, I added some sugar last night to reach 22 brix and 1.090 OG approx and have added the yeast (4244 wyeast - Italian Red).

- how bad is this wine going to be considering my grape juice addition?
- I have not tested pH or acidity levels yet. Is it too late to order the kit and test at any point in the future?

I do plan to add oak cubes and treat this whole batch as if it were an impressive red blend so any tips out there that this wine could benefit from I would surely be thankful.

 

[gorillla68]

I don’t know that my earlier message came through correctly. You are entirely right. You need sulfite at the start of any fermentation with fresh or frozen fruit (grapes). With juice that may have been pasteurized or preserved in some manner(kit) you don’t need to worry about wild yeast. EVERY RESOURCE will tell you the same. Word of warning; take everything on this forum as a suggestion with a grain of salt then research with proper resources. Wine making is not hard but you can get mired down and obsessed with minutiae. Enjoy yourself.

bshef, I have no way to reply to you except for here so thanks for the info and I agree with you. (thumbs up!)

 

[CDrew]

I would estimate I start with sulfite about half the time. But if the grapes are fresh and nice, you can skip it and thus have less total sulfite at the end. As someone else mentioned this makes it theoretically easier to do MLF.

Regarding what form of sulfite to use, the Sodium metabisulfite is said to possibly flavor the wine more than Potassium metabisulfite. (I've not tested this personally). And the Campden tablets have to be crushed before use. You'll probably want bulk KMBS to make sterilizing solutions anyway, so you may as well just buy and stock 1 thing.

Regarding how it will taste-none of us can tell you. It's yours, and since you made it it will likely taste great to you! But good for using a low risk "batch" as a learning experience. By next fall, you'll have all your ducks in a row and be ready when the grapes come in.

 

[gorillla68]

Yes I hope I have everything all figured out by then! Got a lot of work ahead of me just working the small vineyard and getting it into shape.

 

[gorillla68]

Update... pH test is right between 3.2 and 3.6... leaning towards the 3.6... so maybe I'm at 3.5? I will get my acid tester tomorrow or Friday.. better late then never I guess.

I've added...

- 3oz bag of Tuscan oak blend cubes
- 1 cup dried currants
- 1/2 cup dried cherries
- 1/2 cup dried cranberries
- 2 tsp tannin

I've punched everything down and it's bubbling like crazy.

 

[gorillla68]

NOVEMBER 29, 2019

- pH remains 3.5
- OG currently 1.020

I bought an inexpensive "BSG acid test kit" where I add some provided solutions to my wine in a beaker and make an assumption based on color change. Doesnt seem entirely accurate to me as its all guess work. One test I got a 0.60 another test I got a 0.70. Can anyone recommend a decent affordable acidity testing kit?

So I tasted a little of my wine... pretty good actually. Right now it reminds me of a strong hard apple cider. When does it go from tasting like a hard cider to tasting more like wine? Color looks nice, maybe Im overly critical but it seems like it has a slight welchs grape color to it.