Kennell Estates Vineyard & Winery

[grapeman]

fivebk how much farming experience do you have? We don't want to get you in over your head with fancy systems. If you are a novice a single canopy would work great. If however you are on extremely fertile soil(and it looks like you might be) and have farmed for years, then we might want to look at a split canopy system such as Al suggests.

 

[fivebk]

AL ,I do have a very fertile soil in this area, soil PH is perfect too. I had a local winery owner tell me to use a low wire cordon system for the vignole and brianna because of the mod vigor of these and being semi-upright in growth habit. I want to thank all for the info.

Appleman I think I will use the gripples.

Thanks again

BOB

 

[grapeman]

The Vignole is certainly semi-upright but I don't know about the Brianna- Al can tell you on that one. If it is a separate row, you could use VSP (Verticle Shoot Positioning ) on the Vignole and possibly the Brianna. The downside of it is it takes a LOT of wire and almost constant attention to keep it trained. That's the main reason why I suggest TWC. The Vignoles will grow straigt up into the air for the first few weeks and then as it blossoms and fruit sets and gets heavier, they trail down to the sides. It actually works quite well.


A word of warning for you on the Vignoles- they have extremely well filled and tight clusters. It will likely develop some botrytis. Just monitor it for smell when it does. Botricysed(sp) Vignole is actiually desired somewhat and makes a very nice wine. The Vignoles I made this last autumn had a bit of botytis in it and it is very good.

 

[fivebk]

Appleman I have lived on this location 3/4 of my life . My dad was a farmer / tractor mechanic. I farmed with my family untill I graduated high school,and then went to auto mechanic training . I became an ASE ceritfied master auto tech and worked within my profession untill I had a serious accident at work .I broke my back ,was paralized for a while ,and was put back together by some amazing doctors. I can get around quite nicely now but I have to do things at a much slower pace than normal.

Sorry for drifting off the subject. I do have a pretty good green thumb and can learn quickly.

BOB

 

[AlFulchino]

Bob

Rich is right and I am wrong about one thing for sure....too fancy of a canopy can make things somewhat harder early on until the whole project becomes second nature...there is a learning curve that can be directly associated with an effort curve and an ability to give to the project. the only person who can make the ultimate decision is you...only you know the time you can dedicate to this. And right now if you are like me, in the dea dof winter you can only guess at what you can give. I did learn it took a lot more time and effort than I understood going into my vineyard.

In terms of your vineyard I am looking at things in a results (amount of good crop) fashion to maximize your efforts and passion for this project.

The neat thing is that since your first year should be dedicated to root growth only, you can ascertain what the best route to choose is after assessing the real life year of experience that you will be accumulating this first year. This next growing season will steer you in what direction you wish. This year, after the initial planting ( the easy part) the rest of your vineyard year will be about timing:

when to weed and how often (dont underestimate hahaha
)
when to spray and how often(dontunderestimate hahaha)
double this in the second year

when and what to prune and how often(dont underestimate hahaha)
double this in the second year

so calculate the man hours as this all occurs and see how it fits in with all the rest of your life's duties.

Since you will be cutting back the growth to pencil thickness and best two buds ( and this could be anywhere from 12" -maybe 36" from the ground) after the first year anyway, then your upper trellis wires could all just be poly wire this first year and you may just make your trellis decision then for what works for you personally and that really matters because this is *your* vineyard and then bring in the 12.5 guage or whatever you choose for whatever you decide you can best manage!

 

[grapeman]

Hey Bob I know a Scottish gentleman who has had his back fused and can't bend at all. Because of this he uses a GDC to split his canopy and still keep the fruit high so he can pick without bending. We need to keep any limitations in mind here. What will you use to maintain the rows with, such as mowing and spraying. If you use a tractor what wheelspace and overall width do you have. If you go with GDC you need to subtract the width of top spreader bar from the row width. If it was 3 feet, you would only have 7 feet spacing- no problem for a lawn tractor but might be too tight for a full sized tractor.


I hope we aren't driving you crazy with all these questions, but we love to help out fellow growers

 

[AlFulchino]

the only pay we expect is pictures and lots of them...and maybe a bottle of your first born haahahahahaha....three years from now!!!!

 

[fivebk]

I have four vertabrea fused in my back and two 6 in titanium rods. I will be using a craftsman garden tractor to care for what I have (mowing sraying etc. ) so distance between rows won't be much of a concern.

 

[fivebk]

For all the info I am getting that sounds fair to me

 

[AlFulchino]

i want to see it in writing that i will get some wine!

 

[grapeman]

the only pay we expect is pictures and lots of them...and maybe a bottle of your first born haahahahahaha....three years from now!!!!

Better make that four years Al- 3 to get a decent crop and a year to make the wine and bottle it!


And Bob started out good with the pictures on the last page

If you are going to continue using the craftsman, we may be able to get you set up with Geneva Double Curtain to minimize bending and maximize air movement, light interception, etc.

 

[fivebk]

Sorry I have'nt replied for awhile. Been doing some research and looking online for some geneva trellis crossarms. I have not had much luck. You are looking at the most computer illiterate person on the face of this planet. I type with two fingers. I think that I will make my own crossarms out of metal. I have a welder and cutting torch in the shop. Will a one foot space from the post each way be sufficient. The less bending the better. Me and bending don't get along anymore. I should'nt even be doing some of this but if I did nothing I would go crazy. So I go at my own pace and things get done ( just a little slower than I would like).I bought a roll of trellis wire from a local vineyard. A 4000 ft. roll of 12.5 ga. for 80 dollars. Should be enough with plenty to spare.

 

[AlFulchino]

hi there...personally i think two feet apart will not be enough..i think four feet would be better for sun and air flow and fruit maturation....the second link below shows it pretty well


there is a decent diagram w measurements on your trellis system at this page


http://www.smallfruits.org/Muscadines/production/MuscadineGro/sec14.htm

and


http://www.wvu.edu/~Agexten/hortcult/fruits/grograps.htm

 

[grapeman]

Here is a link to some at Orchard Valley Supply. They are mainly for metal stakes, but could give you an idea how to build some.


http://www.orchardvalleysupply.com/ovsstore/pc/viewPrd.asp?idproduct=324&idcategory=12

 

[fivebk]

Thanks for the help

BOB

 

[fivebk]

Spring has Sprung!!!!

Yesterday my wife and I were able to get starting working on the vineyard grounds. We tilled the soil in preparation for receiving our new vines which we should get in the next week to ten days.

Here are some pictures!!

Tilling the vineyard grounds.

(I had an audience while working. Left to Right Mongo &
Tiger)

Ready for the vines to arrive.

 

[grapeman]

Good luck getting them in the ground. It can be a bit of work, but also a great source of pride and accomplishment. That is compunded when you finally get to make some wine from them.


Once you get them planted you will be well practiced. You can come on over and help me plant mine for the year.

 

[AlFulchino]

all you need now is a chair, a little bistro table, some wine and a fedora!

 

[fivebk]

My grape vines arrived last Wednesday. The weather was cooperating. I soaked the roots in water for 12 hours and Thursday I recuited my youngest daughter to help me plant these vines. Here are some pics.

Below - Daughter - Brittney lending a help hand (She wants wine in return for helping

)

Does this now mean I have a vineyard????????

 

[AlFulchino]

it does!


it also means you have just decided to allocate a good portion of the 168 hours allotted to you for each week!