Cellar Craft May be in over my head?!?

[Jaggz]

So when the wife and I decided that we wanted to try our hand at making some wine...we didn't know how quickly we'd jump right in. We visited George at FVW and we concluded that if we were going to make wine that we'd enjoy drinking, that we should make the best kit we could afford....time and money wise. Now, fast forward a few months....we have three kits going and one more to start soon. The problem....well, neither of us has ever tried a "kit" wine and now she's starting to worry about the wine that we are making and what it'll taste like.

So that got me thinking...is there a difference is store bought, $10/bottle wine versus a kit wine....such as the CC Showcase kits? We really enjoy the process but want to ensure that we'll enjoy these wines as well. I know that we perhaps bought a few kits that will take longer to age...so now we have 120 bottles worth of kit wine...150 or so bottles cleaned and ready to fill...a vacuum pump...a rack to hold 120 bottles...and alas - we've never even tried a kit wine

A couple photos from our sad little, under the stairs, wine closet. For what it is worth, here are the kits that we have started:

CC - Showcase Yakima Valley Syrah
CC - Showcase Amarone
CC - Showcase Yakima Valley Chardonnay
- next up -
CC - Showcase Yakima Valley Cabernet Shiraz

 

[TonyP]

Everything looks great. There's two aspects of making wine and, frankly, only one of them gets 90% of the attention:

• Picking a kit
• Making the wine

You've got good wines on your list so you should be fine. Spend time making certain you're selecting top shelf kits and you'll be very happy with the result. For me personally, I consider the wines I've made generally to be superior to a $10 bottle of wine. If you go toward lesser quality kits, you'll still end with a nice wine but it will be, well, lesser quality.

I say that from experience. I've made good quality wines, but decided to try a different wine kit brand. Now I have 30 bottles of not really great wine to drink. It's like having a favorite restaurant and trying the new place across the street. You say to yourself, "what am I doing here".

 

[Dino466]

I have made the Amanore CC Showcase - it is the best kit I have made so far. I make a lot of less expensive kits. But the CC Showcase was my first time trying an expensive kit - it is great - I bulk aged 9 months - it is in the bottle 2 months now - going to leave for another couple of months or so. Also made a KenRidge Showcase South African Chenin Blanc - it was the best white I have made - bulk aged it 3 months. I usually make a less expensive kit like Cheeky Monkey or Vinter's reserve then next a more expensive kit (so I drink the less expensive while the good stuff bulk ages) and do that every other month - now I have a good reserve of well aged wines and will switch to the "good stuff" more then the cheap stuff. Starting on Cellar Craft Winery Series now Super Tuscan (1 bottled after 9 months of bulk aging) and 1 on deck and En Primeur Chilean Camanere (aging 3 months now) and a RQ Pinot Gris on order. It is true the better the kit the better the wine - you do get what you paid for.

 

[Jaggz]

It is true the better the kit the better the wine - you do get what you paid for.

That's what we are hoping for - of course, I guess we won't know for some time still. How early or how soon would you guys begin to try these after bulk aging? My plan was to bulk age for approximately 8 months...then bottle. Mind you, I don't have a temperature controlled cellar so in the summer, temps will creep up to 77 or so. That'll speed things up too, right?

 

[grapeman]

Ask George or Joseph about trying a wine or two if you live close by. They usually have samples for people like you to try.

 

[SouthernChemist]

I don't think you will have to worry much about the taste of these wines once they've matured. I've only made the Yakima Chardonnay myself. At about one year old, it's already just as good if not better than commercial Chardonnay's I have had, and it's truly dry (some commercial Chard's are unofficially off-dry to make the flavor more appealing). I have seen more than one comment, however, that it will continue to improve over the next year. The two reds will probably continue to get better up to at least two years.

As long as you can store the bottles in a place where they won't face wild temperature swings, I think you will be okay. Just remember to make sure they are truly degassed before bottling!

 

[olusteebus]

I have not made a wine from a more expensive kit yet. I drink what is referred to as "value wine". $7 to $9 a bottle. I also often drink something called Winking Owl which is very cheap but I do enjoy it.

The wines I have made from kits are as good as those to me. They generally cost from $1.50 to 2.25 a bottle.

The thing is though, a more expensive kit, say $150, only costs 5 bucks a bottle and I suspect it is much better wine than say a "value wine". I just have not done that yet.

 

[jimmyjames23]

I have never used a kit. People keep pushing me to do so.
Guess I'm old skool with my grapes and juice buckets.

 

[Boatboy24]

I just hit my one year anniversary of winemaking this week and have had many of the same concerns over the past 12 months. I've made, or have started 13 batches of wine during that time, most of which were kits. My kits have ranged from the ultra cheap Vino Italiano kits ($45 on Amazon), to the higher end Winery Series and CC Showcase kits. The cheaper stuff is almost all in bottles now and considering I paid $2-3/bottle for those, I'm happy. Not my favorite wines, but better than the cost per bottle would imply. Last night, I opened a bottle of my CC Showcase Red Mountain Trio - a limited release kit from last year. I was really, really pleased. I only started it in August, but bottled over the Holidays, as it was already quite good. Now, it's even better. I'd put it up against many of the $18-$25 wines I've had. Admittedly, I did modify slightly by using some additional oak and adding some TanCor Grand Cru tannin. But you still can't beat it for the price.

You've got some nice kits there, and I'm sure they'll be quite enjoyable when they are ready. Just be patient. A little retrospect, if I may: I don't drink much white wine, but I wish I had done a couple white kits early on. My first was just started 6 weeks ago and is already excellent. The white wine kits will be ready to drink much earlier and can hold you over while your nice red kits get a little age on them.

 

[DoctorCAD]

I have never used a kit. People keep pushing me to do so.
Guess I'm old skool with my grapes and juice buckets.

Fine, if you got 'em. For those of us without grapes, kits are the perfect answer.

 

[jimmyjames23]

Without grapes?


The concept seems foreign to me. Lol.

 

[TonyP]

That's what we are hoping for - of course, I guess we won't know for some time still. How early or how soon would you guys begin to try these after bulk aging? My plan was to bulk age for approximately 8 months...then bottle. Mind you, I don't have a temperature controlled cellar so in the summer, temps will creep up to 77 or so. That'll speed things up too, right?

Now you've got me worried.

77F will speed up the process, absolutely. However, there's a reason wine competitions aren't based on who gets his wine aged first. Quickly aged wine is just not as good as wine allowed to age at its own pace.

Wine aging involves chemical reactions and interactions. When you speed the process, the sequence may not occur exactly as you desire and the result will be off. Beyond that, not all aging is positive and accelerating the process allows some of the bad stuff to occur.

Statistically, aging for 3 months at 77F, will be like aging for well over 2 years. Add to that late Spring and early Autumn and you may see where I'm going. My advice to you is to find a location where the wine can be somewhat temperature controlled.

 

[Jaggz]

Now you've got me worried.

77F will speed up the process, absolutely. However, there's a reason wine competitions aren't based on who gets his wine aged first. Quickly aged wine is just not as good as wine allowed to age at its own pace.

Wine aging involves chemical reactions and interactions. When you speed the process, the sequence may not occur exactly as you desire and the result will be off. Beyond that, not all aging is positive and accelerating the process allows some of the bad stuff to occur.

Statistically, aging for 3 months at 77F, will be like aging for well over 2 years. Add to that late Spring and early Autumn and you may see where I'm going. My advice to you is to find a location where the wine can be somewhat temperature controlled.

That's what I am worried about....being in Texas without a cellar, my options are quite limited. Even if I could store some where maybe I had an addition A/C unit available...with summer temps reaching 110 degrees and up - it just wouldn't be feasible for me to run an A/C unit 24/7. That 77 degrees is our inside temp during summer months...so I guess that is my temperature controlled setting. Surely I am not the only one in N. Texas facing this, right?!?

 

[TonyP]

This is a topic that's discussed here regularly, and folks just do the best they can. I do think 77F is warm for wine and will mean your wine will peak before some others. That's not a big issue as long as you recognize it and not wait several years before you start tasting.

 

[jimmyjames23]

Buy an old fridge. Set it to 55-65 degrees.

 

[Polarhug]

Most of the kit wines i've had are good or even better than store wines. The RJ Premier Amarone I would consider a $40-50 bottle of wine.

Also you can almost always make a cheaper kit better by augmenting and tweaking the process. Whether adding in additional fruit, fortifying with a high quality brandy (port), extending the aging, introducing MLF, Cold stabilizing, etc. So many options! Any time i've had a "bad" kit, its been my error in the making - or a friends error.

The main thing is to make it how YOU like it. Taste it, tweak it, make something you enjoy and THAT is the wine that is priceless!

 

[Jaggz]

So this has me somewhat stressed...seeing that I have four kits...and no way of keeping them aging over the summer in less than about 75 degree temps. Does this mean my wine will be crap?!? I was hoping to make something at least as good as the $10 range at the stores...preferably better.

 

[TonyP]

The sort of back-handed good news is that you'll be fine if only making a wine worth $10 is your goal. You'll probably surpass that by a considerable margin. The fact is you've selected goods kits, they look good, and you're well focused. Those conditions should generally lead to outstanding results, particularly for the Amarone. Unfortunately you're also hindered by some environmental impacts which could degrade your wine to a small extent.

I don't want to overstate the issue, warmer temperatures will 1) inhibit positive aging and 2) encourage some negative aging characteristics. That doesn't mean your wine won't be good, only that it may not reach its maximum potential. But they'll still be very good.

One last point, jimmyjames23 suggested getting a used refrigerator and I think that's a good idea as well. It certainly is cheaper than the analysis you'll need after worrying about your wine for a year.

 

[jimmyjames23]

One last point, jimmyjames23 suggested getting a used refrigerator and I think that's a good idea as well. It certainly is cheaper than the analysis you'll need after worrying about your wine for a year.

+1 for Jimmy James

 

[Abrnth3]

I like my Zinfandel, being in Illinois have been having to settle for kits or purees. This spring I will be trying my hand at growing sum Zinfadel grapes. Should make some good wine. you'll never be more pleased with the wine you make yourself.