Sanitation practices

[wineview]

I am very conscious about the importance of working clean. At times I wonder if I am going overboard. For example, if you are making a yeast starter, do you sanitize the measuring spoon that touches the nutrient or sugar added to the starter? What about the measuring cup for the water or whisk to stir in the yeast and nutrients. I have, and am wondering if I really need to be that careful.
Love to hear your thoughts and methods.

 

[Ohio Bob]

I am very conscious about the importance of working clean. At times I wonder if I am going overboard. For example, if you are making a yeast starter, do you sanitize the measuring spoon that touches the nutrient or sugar added to the starter? What about the measuring cup for the water or whisk to stir in the yeast and nutrients. I have, and am wondering if I really need to be that careful.
Love to hear your thoughts and methods.

In my opinion, and in very simple terms, you can divide winemaking into pre-fermentation and post-fermentation. I boil my yeast starter solution with sugar in it, partly to sanitize but also get the sugar fully dissolved, then add nutrient. When the starter gets to 100F I add the yeast. None of the tools I use gets sanitized, just a rinse with clean water, if that.

Punch down tools get sanitized, partly because I still have the sanitizer solution available when sanitizing the fermentation bucket. After that solution gets old, I just rinse tools in water.

As the must gets closer to wine and not must anymore, it’s post-fermentation. Everything gets sanitized. Exceptions are the measuring spoons for tannins, Kmeta, oak cubes. Equipment like auto siphons, tubing, hydrometer, airlocks all get sanitized. My feeling is that the Kmeta and dissolved CO2 help keep any bacteria at bay.

 

[wineview]

I use Go Ferm. Doesn’t the boiling water kill the nutrients?

 

[Ohio Bob]

I don’t think boiling kills GoFerm, but the point is it’s not necessary to boil to sanitize, or sanitize at all pre-fermentation. As always, YMMV.

 

[Rice_Guy]

I am an example of a minimal approach. If I look at grandpa recipes from the 1930s or the New Settlement cook book 1905 they basically say mix things and natural yeast will take over. Looking at wine from a microbiology point of view it is a preservative system. The pH and high sugar are selective agents for yeast. In contrast a beer at pH 4.5 and 1.050 gravity is not as selective, therefore boiling is worth while.
When I look at factory rules, we use a lot of stainless with only cleaning it with soap water and a spray gun. If I look at micro lab rules, we will retort clean equipment for 15 minutes at 15 psig / 130C wrapped in aluminum foil to prevent accidental growth. ie your home treatment will not actually sterilize the tools you are using, if I culture the tool there is a good chance i will pick up some contaminating organisms.

GoFerm is a source of nitrogen compounds and vitamins. The nitrogen is stable at retort temperatures 130C, this is way above what you can do at home. I haven't seen anything about vitamin content at 100C for yeast culture. Using food as a comparison, there is some loss of vitamins with heating. Loss depends upon which vitamin you are interested in. ,,, OK would I worry about this, not really, ,,, the reason is that I have sterilized yeast selective media at 130C and we culture yeast. I would guess that vitamins aren't as limiting for culture as the nitrogen compounds.

All in all boiling doesn't hurt. It will activate spore forming bacteria, but the selective pressures of pH 3.5 will prevent growth, ,,, and if one boiled 10 minutes in acid water under pH 4.0 the tools and media will be commercially sterile.

 

[Ted Brumleve]

I help design distilleries until I retire in just ten more days. Some master distillers are absolutely fanatical about cleanliness; some not so much. This is a personal preference issue. But you cannot go overboard with sanitation awareness. Remember that 200 years ago, the folks in France knew nothing other than to clean everything as best as possible, and they made great wine from superior grapes. But I'm sure they made some bad batches too.

 

[Wineart]

In my opinion, and in very simple terms, you can divide winemaking into pre-fermentation and post-fermentation. I boil my yeast starter solution with sugar in it, partly to sanitize but also get the sugar fully dissolved, then add nutrient. When the starter gets to 100F I add the yeast. None of the tools I use gets sanitized, just a rinse with clean water, if that.

Punch down tools get sanitized, partly because I still have the sanitizer solution available when sanitizing the fermentation bucket. After that solution gets old, I just rinse tools in water.

As the must gets closer to wine and not must anymore, it’s post-fermentation. Everything gets sanitized. Exceptions are the measuring spoons for tannins, Kmeta, oak cubes. Equipment like auto siphons, tubing, hydrometer, airlocks all get sanitized. My feeling is that the Kmeta and dissolved CO2 help keep any bacteria at bay.

Couldn't agree more!